Conference vmszoo::rc

    I have a Webber .61 ABC in one of my choppers.  The main disadvantage
    that I can see is that when the weather is cold, (50 deg. F or less)
    it becomes very hard to turn the engine over.  I understand that
    this is normal for ABC engines.  If you are planning to use this
    engine in the cold weather, it is worth checking into.
    

		________
	 /	  __|__  
	=========[_____\>
	/	__|___|__/  BREAK A BLADE,
			    Ken    	

    Ken,
    
    'splain to me howcum' you, Kay and others call this brand of engines
    Webber, Weber, etc.?  Unless youse' guys is running a new brand that's
    escaped my notice entirely, the engine you refer to is the "WEBRA"
    brand, manufactured in Germany.  Have I missed something??  

      |
      | |      00	 Adios,      Al
    |_|_|      ( >o
      |    Z__(O_\_	(The Desert Rat)

    I just finished my Goldberg cub. It's and excellent kit as are all
    Goldberg kits. I put a Enya 90-4stroke in it. It's alot more power
    than I need to fly it scale like. I just cut back the throttle and
    it sails like the real thing! When I do attach the floats the extra
    power will be a great advantage. One thing I didn't like was the flimsy
    plastic cowl they give you. I called FIBERGLASS MASTERS and got a glass
    one for $11.00. It fit perfect! The cub flies pretty well. Mine is
    heavy cause of the 4-stroke and 12 oz. fuel tank but the CG is right
    there! It comes down alot faster than a smaller high wing when you
    go dead stick but the large wing area lets you grease it in without
    too much trouble. All in all, I recommend GOLDBERG kits very highly,
    especially the CUB!! You'll be surprised how fast it goes together.
    
    Good luck,
    
      		Tom
                   

    Ref -.2
    Al,
    I got carried away and spelled Webra the way we pronounce it
    in New England.  (Not Boston). :*). 

		________
	 /	  __|__  
	=========[_____\>
	/	__|___|__/  BREAK A BLADE,
			    Ken    	

785.
        I have been flying a CG Cub for about a year or so.  It's
        taken some good beatings and  held up real well (see note
        239.171)  .   The kit is  real  strong  (the  ply  really
        helps).  As Tom stated, the  plastic cowl has a lot to be
        desired.  I'm on my third one now and its on its way out! 

        I covered mine with fabric  for the texture effect of the
        full size, then covered it with clear dope, and a coat of
        paint.   If you take this approach,  be  careful  of  the
        paint you use.  I was given wrong  advice  (not  by  this
        notes    file    by   the  way...),  and  the  paint  was
        incompatible.   It  looked  great  freshly  done, and now
        looks like it has a skin problem.

        I considered mounting the  engine inverted so it would be
        fully enclosed in the cowl.   Im now glad it didnt.  I've
        seen too many others fighting with their inverted engines.
        I run a 45 (sch ported) mounted  sideways,  and it always
        starts on the first or second time.   It  also has enough
        power to get me off the ground in a  10 foot roll at full
        power.    I usually take off at 1/2 throttle for  a  more
        realistic take off.

        I've strayed from the plans very little,  and it balanced
        out real nice.  For one, I changed  to  a  16oz fuel tank
        for  longer  flight times.  I can keep it  up  for  30-45
        minutes depending on throttle setting.  I've never lasted
        that long, and  usually  ended  up landing with somewhere
        around a 1/2 tank left.
        
        I also  added a bombay door on the bottom of the fuse.  I
        re-used the cut  outs that you pop out of the fuse bottom
        as the door.   I  added  hinges  to it, mounted it to the
        fuse,  built a box on  the  inside  floor  of  the  radio
        compartment over the cut out, and  hooked  up  a servo to
        it.   Works  like a charm with little effort to build it.
        The box basically  sits right  under the CG point, so the
        added weight is taken  with  stride  without changing the
        CG.

        I bought a second wing kit for it assuming that sooner or
        later I would need it.  It sat  around  for a while, so I
        finally decided to build it as a clipped version, and add
        flaps to it.  With the regular wing and properly  set  up
        it floats  quite  a  bit.  The clipped wing gives me more
        maneuverability, and its  much  easier to land it (dosent
        seem to just float..on....by...........).
        
        I havent flown off water, but I have put the floats on it
        for flying off the snow.  You would them up the same way
        (covered in another note).
        
        To sum it up,  I've  got  another  one on the bench being
        built right now.  First  time  I've  ever bought the same
        kit twice..
        
        Steve
    

    I also have a CG Cub. I have a HP 40R in it and find thats plenty
    of power. I run it with a REV-UP 10X6W. I think its a great flying plane.
    
    A .60 will be to much power for it. I can take off in less than
    10ft at full power. I usually flying arround at 1/2 throttle or
    less. 
    
    As far as building, make sure you apoxy the firewall real good.
    I got smacked into the ground by a gust on a landing approach
    and looseened the front in the process. I'll second the statements
    about the cowl flimsyness although I haven't had an trouble with
    it. I spent a whole evening covering the cowl with Black BAron film
    (just for the hell of it) to match the rest of the plane. doing
    the compound curves on the nose wsa a bitch but also fun !!

    My only complaint with the plane has to do with the landing gear
    decoration. They kept coming off if the landing was anyinthg but
    greased. So I took 'em off permanently until the situtation improves.
    
    I also did not bother with the wing struts. They are non functional
    and just one more thing to go wrong.
    
    Have fun & keep us posted.
    
    md
        

  I have actually managed to get some building time on my Cub (I know..why
don't I spend that time trying to get the Kadet off the ground?!!?) and
have gotten quite a bit of scrap plywood out of the deal.  The die cutting
is fantastic and the sections that are removed from the fuse sides to reduce
weight are way to big to just throw away!  
  I have completed the tail sections (just a little sanding left to do) and 
just started on the fuse.  Right now I am very impressed with the quality of
the instructions, wood, die cutting, and hardware package.
  From the previous replies, it would seem that an OS .40 should be sufficient
to power this full wing version. That's good as I can't spend a lot of money
on an engine right now (not that the plane will be ready to fly anytime soon).

   Jim

RE -.1

	Come on Dan, if I can't spend the money for a bigger engine for 
the Cub, where do you expect me to get money for floats?  I guess I can
 send a letter to Santa.........


   Jim

    I too am building a CG Cub. So far I really like it. The instructions
    and kit quality are great! I did have a couple of questions though.
    
    1. The landing gear mount is done in such a way that there is no
       mechanical strength holding it in against landing shock, just
       glue. I used epoxy but I wonder if this is enough? Should I also
       use glass cloth and resin on top to provide some mechanical
       strength? A rough picture of how it works follows
                        
                      |  Landing gear plate  |
                      |  __________________  | <- Fuse side
                      +----              ----+

    
    2. Also, as mentioned previously, the mounting for the landing gear
       fairings leaves a little to be desired. I think the idea was
       to mount them in such a way that they would not interfere with
       landing gear flex in case of a hard landing, and to allow the
       gear to be easily removed. My question is this: Could I epoxy
       the fairings to the landing gear wire and then cover the works
       with glass cloth and resin, getting a somewhat more aerodynamic
       fairing in the bargain? The fairings would stay in place in flight,
       the gear can still flex independantly of the fuse, and the whole
       works is easily removed if necessary.

    Thanks,
    Randy

re .10

  Randy, I've flown my cub for over a year, and never had a problem with
  the gear mounts. They worked out real strong, and have taken a beating.
  I just finished building the mounts in my new cub, and decided that there
  was no need to change it.
        
  I agree with the farings ordeal. They look great on the bench, but dont
  seem to manage the stress on the flight line. I just left mine off for
  flying, and let them decorate the shelves in the workshop. You idea sounds
  reasonable, and I might give it a try  myself. In any case, I will be
  looking at alternatives, and I'll let you know what I find.
  
  BTW, I managed to rekit my first cub last weekend, as well as my SS40.
  It was a bad weekend. I've got the NEW cub ready to cover, and I am doing
  this one in yellow. A second one (just bought a few weeks ago) is also in
  progress (crash two = build 3), and will be red and white starburst, smoke
  system, clipped wing, flaps, etc..
  
  How do you plan on covering yours? One the last one I used koverall and
  dope, then painted it white and added the red startburst pattern. A slow
  process over monokote, but it looks alot better. I am covering my current
  one with Permagloss yellow. So far it seems to work out alright. I like
  it better than monokote since it has the fabric texture to it. I'll give
  more details on it when I get around to covering the main structures with
  it. I'll be covering the second one with koverall and the same red and white
  paint scheme as the first.
   
        sf
        
  

    Steve(?),
    
    I haven't decided on a color scheme for mine yet. I definitely want
    to use the fabric textured iron on coverings though. Are these plastic
    with an embossed texture or are they really cloth? I'll be painting
    it whatever I use. I'd like a color scheme thats a little different,
    but something that might have been or was used on the real thing.
    I've considered the L4 scheme, but thats a little drab for me. If
    you know of any interesting variations please let me know.
    
    A covering related question. The instructions say to cover the fin and
    stab prior to installation which makes sense, but what do you do with
    the joint between the front of the fin and the rear of the fuse? I'd
    like to make it disappear, but don't have a good idea of how to do it. 

    Thanks for the info on the LG. I think I'll just put a good layer
    of slow epoxy over the whole area and let it go at that. I'm also
    going to epoxy the fairings on as I described and see what happens.
    I'll let you know how it works out.
    
    Randy

>  It was a bad weekend. I've got the NEW cub ready to cover, and I am doing
>  this one in yellow. A second one (just bought a few weeks ago) is also in
>  progress (crash two = build 3), and will be red and white starburst, smoke
>  system, clipped wing, flaps, etc..

This is probably a dumb question - especially coming from a guy that does
not have a Cub (tho I wish I had one).

I thought clipped wing Cubs didn't have flaps.  I don't know of any flaps
on Cubs until the PA-18 Super Cub. 

Do you know of any with flaps?
Also even more naive than that - Could people actually buy a Clipped wing
Cub or did every body clip their own wings OR is Hazel Sig Hester's Clipped
wing Cub the only one?  The only one I've ever seen a picture of has 
been Hazel's.

Bye          --+--
Kay R. Fisher  |
---------------O---------------
================================================================================

    
    
    Randy, I dont know off the top of my head, but I believe that the
    covering is cloth, covered with a colored plastic flim. I'll look
    more closley at it when I get home tonite.
        
    On my last cub, I covered the tail as directed, and mounted it on the
    fuse. I filled in any space with wood putty, and sanded smooth. Then
    when it came time to cover the fuse, I ran the covering right to the
    front of the fin, split it into two pieces, and continued on down the
    side of the fin and stab. This left the seams on edges (between the fin
    and fillet, and the stab and fillet). Looking back, since I used cloth
    covering and dope, I could have just ended at the front of the fin, and
    sanded the covering till smooth, then painted. It would have never
    shown. I havent figured out how I want to to it this time, since I wont
    be painting the first one, and the seams will be more likely to show.
    Any ingenius ideas will be passed on...
    
    
    Kay, I added the flaps my self. I'm not building the first on to even
    stand-way-off scale, so I decided to play a little (I'm saving the
    'scale building' time for my shrike twin).  Besides, what else
    was I going to do with the extra channels? One for flaps and one
    for smoke..
    
    The CG Cub plans allow you to build a clipped wing version as an
    option. Both the instructions and plans are marked clearly. Leave out
    a few ribs, cut the spars, and youre all done. I believe that the new
    Radio Control Buyers Guide has a picture of a CG Clipped version. Dont
    take this as gospel, but I thought I remembered seeing one...
    
    Steve
    
    

    Well, I picked up a roll of Super Coverite in Piper yellow yesterday
    and proceded to cover the horizontal stab. This stuff is wonderful,
    much easier to use than Monokote! I do have a question though. Is all
    Super Coverite transparent or did I just make a dumb mistake? 
    
    I don't have a problem with painting the Coverite, I just want to make
    sure its necessary. Any recommendations on a good Piper yellow paint? 
     
     Thanks,
     
     Randy 

    Hmmm, so many choices!!!  I am going to be building a cub this winter 
    as a float plane (although it will also have wheels setup).  I have
    3 engines that could go into it (it was a *bad* year for my planes!),
    a ST 40, an OS-40fsr, and an OS-50fsr...  I am currently leaning
    towards the ST 40, with clipped wings..  But, before doing so, I will
    ask a couple of questions...
    
    1 - Has anyone run a clipped wing cub with floats??  How was the 
    performance??  
    
    2 - Has anyone run a cub off of water with a .40??  How was the
    takeoff performance??   Which .40 did you use??
    
    The more I think about it, the more I think that the OS-40fsr is the
    better engine for it...  But then I bet that the .50fsr with clipped
    wings would make for a seriously fun ship...  Maybe that is the way to
    go...
    
    comments welcome
    jeff
    

    Re: .-1, Jeff,
    
    Go for the .50!  The key to successful/trouble free operation from the
    water is _power_.  Once airborne, you can always throttle back.
						 __
				|      |        / |\	   	       
      	         \|/		|______|__(o/--/  | \	   	       
      | |        00	       <|  ~~~  ____ 04 ---- | --------------------
    |_|_|        (O>o		|\)____/___|\_____|_/	   Adios amigos, Al
      |     \__(O_\_	        |	  |___/	 o	   (The Desert Rat)

Jeff,

I ran my Cub with full wing on a Fox .50. This plane, while a great flyer and
lots of fun is also a TANK. Give it lots of go for quick take-offs and that
little extra to get out of trouble. You can always throttle back for realistic
flying. I usually did full power take-offs in 10 - 20 feet (at 7200') and
throttled back to about 1/4 -  1/3 once up to altitude. 

Randy

P.S. I use the past tense as my Cub is currently awaiting repair in my basement.

    Wow, the fuse of this plane builds quick!!  1 night!!
    
    Does anyone have any color pictures of Cubs on floats??  I am going
    with the standard Cub yellow, but I don't know what color to finish the
    floats...
    
    Thanks!
    jeff
    

    In Jan   "RCM" their is a picture of a yellow cub on floats, I think
    it is an add for SIG  or someone selling a SIG Cub. If I find the page
    and all , I'll drop a line. ;8^).
    
    Bob in Phila.

    Well, I am in the process of covering the cub...  I am using Yellow
    Super Coverite (which turns out to be more transparent than I would have
    liked...)  As mentioned earlier, I am using an OS .50 FSR with a Tatone
    "Pitts" muffler.  The thing is feeling very heavy though...  I weighed
    it with my fish scale and it is currently at 7lbs!  (no fuel, but with
    radio.  No covering on fuse yet..)
    
    Did any of you previous cub owners weigh your plane??  How much did
    they come out to??  Mine just "feels" heavier than it should be...
    
    thanks!
    jeff
    
    
    

    Hi Jeff,
    
    	I have an anniversary cub that is just about complete. All that's
    left is to cover the wing. Unfortunately I havn't weighed it yet, but
    according to the documentation, they are supposed to come out between
    7 and 7 1/2 pounds. So, I'd say your right where you should be. I'll
    weigh mine tonight and let you know what it comes out to. 
    
    Mine will have an OS 45 FSR, 10oz fuel tank, seperate aileron servo's,
    flap servo, and pitts mufler.
    
    Steve

    Jeff,
    
    	I weighed the cub last night and according to my highly
    accurate "bathroom scale" it currently sits at between 6 1/2 and
    6 3/4 pounds. Keep in mind that I have the clipped wing version and
    the wing still needs to be covered. I'd say your just about on the
    money weight wise.
    
    Steve

        I'm thinking about buying an Fox .60/RC Eagle 4 for my cub.  I am 
    wondering if that is too much of an engine for the plane?  
    
    
    Hogie
    

    Hogie,
    
    	There are many people in here that won't have anything good to
    say about the Fox engine. I'm one of them. Stick with the OS, Enya,
    Super Tigre brands.
    
    	I have a Goldberg Anniversary cub. It's flying with an OS45FSR.
    I fly it between 1/4 and 1/2 throttle. A 60 size engine is WAY too
    much. 
    
    Steve
    
    BTW.....the Cub weighs 7 pounds.

A .60 is more than enough and Fox motors run extra strong. I fly mine here in
Colorado Springs (7200' base alt.) on a Fox .50. Take off runs in mild winds
are 20 to 30 feet. With the .60 it'll probably take of without a roll. For true
Cub style flying the .60 is way too much. You'll either do most of your flying
between idle and 1/4 throttle or you won't be flying it like a Cub. On the other
hand having the extra power can come in real handy some times and you CAN always
throttle back when you want to fly slow. So I guess my advice is to go for it -
just learn to use the throttle.

Enjoy,

Randy

    One of the problems that people seem to have with Fox engines is the
    carb. Since this combo would depend on the carb so much, it's probably
    not a good idea. The extra power WOULD allow you to due towing and
    carry extra weight but the engine might be too finicky if you got one
    of the bad carbs. Fox engines have plenty of power but iffy carbs.
    Find yourself a nice 40 sized plane to put the Fox in line an
    UltraSport 40 (after learning to fly on a reasonably powered trainer)
    
    Come on Hogie, get a glider done and come get some sticktime at lunch
    in Acton!

I'd say that putting a Fox into a basic trainer will bring on a
crash course in engines...not what you want.  But I have a Fox
.36 in my PT40, and I've bought a .74 for the Robin (not run
yet), so I must see some good in their engines.  Randy posted
some other notes in the engines topic on setting up the Fox's
carb.  Basically, you set it slightly lean, quite the opposite of
the way you'd set an OS carb.  Once you find the "groove" the
engine runs like a charm.  But here I must admit that I've just
put the engine back into the PT and am having some re-learning
curve problems.  They're different.

    There have been several notes which state that the cowling in the CG
    kit is very weak and several people have ordered a replacement cowl
    from Fiverglas Technologies.
    
    Questions:
    
    1. Can one use 2 layers of fiberglas on the inside of the CG
       cowl to reinforce it (will fiberglas/epoxy stick to plastic?).
    
    2. Can the CG cowl be used as a mold to make your own fiberglas cowl?
    
    Just wondering!
    
    Regards,
    

    I am not familiar with the plane or cowl but can just recall what I did
    with some weak cowls. I, in the past, have added a couple of layers of
    skinning glass cloth on the inside. In other cases I have put tows of
    carbon fiber in critical places. Seems to work for me. I have added the
    above to plactic cowls etc. 
    
    Eric.

>    Questions:
>    
>    1. Can one use 2 layers of fiberglas on the inside of the CG
>       cowl to reinforce it (will fiberglas/epoxy stick to plastic?).
>    
>    2. Can the CG cowl be used as a mold to make your own fiberglas cowl?

My Sig clipped wing Cub came with a two piece plastic cowl which turned
our real nice.  The directions suggested scuffing the inside and lining
with fiberglass which I did.  I have already flipped it on its nose
in the tar and grass several times and it hasn't de-laminated yet.  

But you know it isn't wonderful when you drill holes it tends to de-laminate
around the stress created by the drill.  A drop of CA seals it up again.

Ultimately we both will probably have to get an all glass cowl but for now
I am perfectly willing to use up the free one that came with the kit first.

P.S.  Flew it yesterday - tested the nose once also!

Bye          --+--
Kay R. Fisher  |
---------------O---------------
################################################################################

    Eric/Kay, thanks for your replys.
    
    Question for Eric - what is "skinning cloth"?
    
    Quesion for Kay - did you cut our the prop shaft area and the engine
    area before you used the 2 layers of fiberglass?
    
    Regards,
    
    Ollie

>    Quesion for Kay - did you cut our the prop shaft area and the engine
>    area before you used the 2 layers of fiberglass?

Wow that was quick.

No - I cut it out after with my trusty battery powered Dremel Mini whatever.

Bye          --+--
Kay R. Fisher  |
---------------O---------------
################################################################################

    >> Question for Eric - what is "skinning cloth"?
    
    Maybe I should have said 0.6oz glass cloth !
    
    Alt-E.
    

    That's what I was going to say!.
    
    Het Alt-E,
    	       we gotta teach these guys to use our correct handles,
    right Eric?!  :-)
    
    Regards,
    
    E x E or EVL-1 or EVL-2 or E squared or E2 or Evil Eric or just Evil
    for short.
               

    We could always have the E note ! 
    
    Alt-E !
    
    

ExE is always a "topic" in the Greater Maynard group 8^)