Conference terri::cars_uk

    
    I was stuck behind a learner in the rush hour this morning.
    
    Now that's what I call offensive! :^)
    
    Mark

    Well, what a subject !
    
    I am sure a lot of replies to other topics could be 'moved' to this title...
    
    How about 'driving (and racing) kit cars', 'chip programming',
    'defensive ? driving', 'Nicked on the M4', '***unleaded*** bad eggs' ?
    
    J.R.

�	As How to spin your car in a spectacular way
    
    For anyone who would like to try this, but haven't yet,
    
    now is the time to try !!!
    
    All that snow, just turn the wheel and welly it.
    
    One question, with the rule 'Mirror, Signal, Maneuvre',
    what signal should be used ?
    
    J.R. (hand over your eyes, perhaps ?)

�with clear roads. I overtook and as I did the driver shook its fist and
�mouthed F*** off. So I gently came to stop in front of the said car and 
    
    Reminds me, someone in a multi-storey car park dawdling through,
    they decided to stop in the middle of the 'lane', obviously waiting
    for people to unload shopping and drive away.  I was behind this guy,
    actually trying to leave the car park.  I got impatient as other person
    did not indicate or make any attempt to leave room for me (or others)
    to drive by his stationary car - so, I hit the horn to get his
    attention, so I could indicate what I wanted him to do (move).
    
    His reply 'F** Off' !
    
    What should I then have done ?  (Besides wait for the next 10 minutes)
    
    J.R.

    
    Derek,
    
    Are 5a and 5b mutually exclusive?
    
    John,
    
    Surely the answer was to push him slowly over the edge of the parapet?
    
    Mark

�Delta Mph
    
    Eh ?  What you mean like 'n' mph
    
    In my Delta it would be 'n' kph...
    
    
�3) As you emerge on straight move out and floor it ( make sure its clear
�enough to just to move out)
�4) As you move out see if the straight is clear and long enough
    
    Depending on the severity of the bend, plus whether it is left- or
    right- hand bend (and also left- or right- hooker vehicle), you can
    often see up the following straight before you even pull out.
    This way, you can get out even sooner.
    
    In my car (LHD), this is sometimes the only chance I get to see
    up short straights, without requiring that I stick the nose of
    the car out far enough - not something I like doing.
    
    J.R.

    I hate people sitting right on my tail, and not making any attempt to
    overtake, or pull back to match my speed.
    
    Rather than stab the brakes or flip the rear fog-lights I pull the
    handbrake on.
    
    This has the effect of slowing me down rapidly while not
    showing any lights.
    
    Result is bozo behind finds he's suddenly getting extremely close  for
    no apparent reason and generally over reacts by braking hard and locking
    his brakes.
    
    AmS
    

    
>>
If you enjoy a real good ear bending from your passenger repeated application
of 5a and 5b together does the trick. 
>>
    and people think I take my life in my hands riding a 500cc motorbike......
    
    
    

    What can you do about
    	a) bloke behind who insists on driving 10m behind you on at night
    with full beams on ?
    	b) bloke in front who drives in clear weather with his rear
    fog-lamps on ?
    
    In these times of high-tech and space program offspins is there
    something like reflective tape which absords and magnifies the light
    shone on it ? Can it be fitted to the rear of a Golf ?
    
    What's the penalty for having strobe flashlights facing backwards ?
    
    Why don't these people look at their dashboard indicators ?
    
    AmS

    On the M3 last night there was a guy who had his fog lights on for
    no reason. I saw at least 2 cars overtake and then pull in front
    of him giving a few bursts of their own fog lights to make him aware.
    It didn't make a blind (no pun intended) bit of difference. I did
    the same but I don't know if got the message.
    
    - Roy

    RE: .14
    
    Smithy (can i call you Smithy? ;-)),
    
    Just one thing, i notice you have said "HIM"... did you have anyone
    particular in mind? ;-)
    
�    What can you do about
�    	a) bloke behind who insists on driving 10m behind you on at night
�    with full beams on ?
    
	The usual of course... flash your fog lights a couple of times,
    look around a couple of times... if this doesn't get throught his/her
    (dont want to be sexist ;-)) thick brain, then slow right over indicate
    to pull in, let him/her pass, move up behind them and WHACK on your
    full beams... is that offensive enough?
    
�    	b) bloke in front who drives in clear weather with his rear
�    fog-lamps on ?
    
	Keep flashing him until he/she realises, or overtake then slow down
    and WHACK on your fog lights.
     
�    What's the penalty for having strobe flashlights facing backwards ?
    
    	Hey! You knew i was going to get the strobes put on the jeep, don't
    tell me the legal implications... i can't plead ignorance then! ;-)
    
�    Why don't these people look at their dashboard indicators ?
    
    	What indicators? ;-)
    
    
    Until we meet again...
    
    				Lewis.

    
    Tony, better than space age tape. Buy a cheapo camera flash unit or an
    old Boots disc camera. Keep it on the passenger seat of your car. Next
    time an a$$hole upsets you, turn the flash on, let it charge up. Point
    it at him/her ( just for Lewis ;-) ) and press the test switch. Could
    be great fun for annoying the driver who just cut you up and braked
    hard to avoid being pictured on a Geneva speed box ...
    
    Alternatively buy a car that chucks out tons of thick smelly smoke from
    the exhaust ( like one with a Katalysor ;-) ) and noone's even going to
    consider sitting that close behind you.
    
    
    			Nik

 My favourite when someone is too close behind is to hit the middle pedal with
the left foot. I generally find that this makes people drop back, and in many
cases they drop a long way back. Of course if they don't drop back it depends
on what mood I am in, and what car.

 		 Alan
		~~~~~~

    RE -.1
    
�Of course if they don't drop back it depends on what mood I am in, 
    and what car.
    
    
    I hate to see your REAR-END ;-)
    
    
    					Lewis.

Ah, finally a topic for me! I've actually mellowed since -

- I spun my 914 on a windy mountain road with no guardrails. The car 
came to rest about two feet from the edge facing backwards and 
blocking the opposite lane. (That's still the only time I've spun a car 
on the street.)

- I got fed up with all the tourists in Arizona driving motorhomes 
through a beautiful mountain pass at 20 mile per hour on a Saturday 
afternoon. So I began passing them, very quickly, five and six at a
time, around blind turns. 

- I was coming back from watching my first F1 race at Watkins Glen. 
There was a Ferrari 330GT, then a late 70's Shelby Mustang then me in a 
Plymouth (it was free). Going around turns, I'd watch the Ferrari go 
through the turn, no problem, the Mustang would go into the turn and 
jump halfway into the next lane when it hit a bump. The Plymouth would
jump entirely into the next lane! This went on for 15-20 minutes. It 
was Ok, there was never anybody in the other lane.

About the question of what to do about the person behind annoying you 
with his lights? I was behind a car who was shining his high beams on 
a truck in front of him. The truck driver had a movable spotlight on
the cab (not sure if that's even legal) which he turned on and shined
in the face of the driver. The car swerved a bit and then dropped way
back and turned off the high beams.

re: .3, .17

Hi Derek,

Is this a normal occurrence that people shake their fists or flash and hoot at
you when you overtake? What do you do to annoy people *that* much (I wonder how
close to their tail you sit while waiting for a chance to overtake)?

Colin.

    
    The problem with all driving, and especially overtaking is that it is a
    matter of judgement - based on :-
    
    1 - conditions known to both drivers, such as road surface, weather...
    2 - things which may not be known about the 'other' car, such as equipment
    level (eg of particular significance at the moment, snow tyres), mods
    which alter performance/handling
    3 - experience/ability of drivers, knowledge of the cars limits,
    experience of driving in particular conditions (eg snow driving), and
    knowledge of that particular road 
    4 - perception of risk
    5 - acceptance of risk
    6 - personality of the drivers
    
    This all results in the fact that some people will consider 'dangerous'
    a manoever done by another person, or that overtaking is somehow a
    challenge to someones position, rather than a desire to travel faster
    than them. Equally, there are methods of overtaking which are
    _apparently_ more 'aggressive', (such as those described by Derek....)
    which will result in more people deciding that in their judgement the
    overtaking driver is in the wrong, and behaving dangerously. 

     Hi,
     This now rears new light on an old question!
     
     Why do cars have rear facing spotlights on their rears?  I have seen these 
     particularly on old escorts and minis.
     
     Is this something to do with pretentions to rally?  Or are they a wild 
     means of avenging the offensive driver behind?
     

    
    High power reversing lights I think! 
    
    Mark

 They generally are reversing lights, and are generally the boy racers, who are
trying to pretend that it is a racing/rally car. Although I beleive that the
maximum legal power for a reversing light is around 21W, which doesnt really
illuminate the road/whatever behind you very well.

		 Alan
		~~~~~~

    
    <<< Note 1358.26 by SUBURB::SCREENER "Robert Screene, UK Finance EUC" >>>
                          -< Rear Facing Spotlights >-
    
    
    The lights on the back of my Landy are just that - rear facing spotlights!
    
    They are normally used when setting up the tent or cooking, when it is 
    dark, on race weekends  :-)                               

Imagine a lorry up front is doing the legal
speed limit or less for the road you are on.  YOu know
its a long way till the dual carrage way, so you wait
for the places to overtake and everybody in front moves 
round the lorry right?

WRONG!

A couple of doozos sit on the tail of the lorry and then
then on the tail of the car in front. And the traffic is
quiet bunched up all the way back to you.

Action, at the next `safe' place overtake go as far down
the line of traffic as you can and indicate to pull over
into that gap between those tailgating vehicals which is
smaller than the length of your car, indicate and then
move over.

Seems to wind people up that one.


Middle lane driving:

This is a game the kids call cow boys and indians and 
they offen demand that I initate it when they spot a
blatent middle lane driver on the m-way.

Calmly over take the car, with out using the brakes, back
off the power and indicate, pull across in front of the 
offending driver into the inside lane. Slow down till 
you are behind the car again, calmly signal and pull
out, over take, slow down indicate etc etc. LEGALLY going
round and round the car till he gets the message or you
run out of road.

The kids embellise this manover with red indian noises and 
gesters


Persistant middle lane drivers:

Over take, pull level and mouth for other driver to "move
over"
Respond to obsenitys by indicating left and moving over.
Watch other drivers eyes bulge out.


Tailgaters (friendly mood)

Take power off, drop back
Power on, moving back to safe distance
Repeat till point taken.


Oncoming traffic flashing offensivly when you are over
taking:

Complete manourve and then move back to other side of
road with full beams on.  Move back over in good time.


:J

re   by indicating left and moving over.
Watch other drivers eyes bulge out.

Best performed in a large, old Landrover.


Simon.


;-)

    
�    Oncoming traffic flashing offensivly when you are over
�    taking:

�    Complete manourve and then move back to other side of
�    road with full beams on.  Move back over in good time.

    
    Yup - this one's a cracker. 
    

    

    
    Scenario:-
    
    
    Up hill approach into roundabout, intended victim to close behind
    and desperately  looking for  a gap  that even  Mr Senna,  would think
    twice about.
    
    
    Set the victims expectations:-
    
    Sit  in queue to roundabout and ensure that you make a big show
    of trying to pull the handbrake lever off of its mountings.
    
    Rev the engine furiously for each hill start and always roll backwards
    as much as possible. 
    
    Stall engine at random.
    
    Each  time the queue is  about to move adjust  your hair (to cover
    those unsightly  lobotomy  scars).  Wait  ten  seconds,  jump  visibly
    as  the realisation  of  a  50yd  gap  dawns,  stall,  roll backwards, 
    wave into rearview mirror, overrev, stall, kagaroo up to cars ahead.
    
    Now for the payoff:-
    
    From the victims perspective:-
    
    You  approach the  roundabout  where it is  quite possible to  merge
    into intermittent  traffic flow. As  you approach the  roudabout you
    start to brake  come to a near stop, instatantly you  then accelerate off
    with the brakes still on.
    
    
    How?
    
    Automatic- (reasonably effective)
    
    Easy use left foot on brakes.
    
    
    Manual-(  Much more effective, as  the previous rolling back  on
    	      the hill covinces the chap behind that you can't use a clutch.)
    
    Use ball of right foot on brake and outerside of foot on the
    accelerator.At  first practice on the level,  its quite easy to
    just  slip from brake onto the throttle but with practice,  you will 
    learn to use  both pedals with the one foot.
    
    After doing this for over ten years now the I do not use the handbrake
    at all for  hillstarts,  on even  the steepest  of hills.  There are
    other advantages  for  performance  driving if  you get  enough control
    of the balance  brake-throttle to manage a hill start you have developed
    all the control to "heel & toe" very effectively.
    
    
    
    
    Roy

picture the scene...

dec park II car park late last night,
I was sitting alone in my car, waiting for a few minutes, just to allow the 
engine to warm up...

along comes the driver of the (newish) Cavalier parked next to me...

clunk, click, starts the engine with a VROOooom,
Zooms off in reverse,
Slams on the brakes, locking up all fours (no ABS I thought to myself  ;-)
slaps it into first and wheelspins frantically off over the speed bump, and into 
the horizon goes Macho-man...


I was singularly unimpressed even tho' it was Valentine evening and was destined
to spend it alone...


...art

	Re. last.

	Sounds offensive to the car .....

    .35,
    
    Maybe no-one sent him a Valentine ? ;-)
    

    
    Oddly, the ABS systems I know get confused when you're going backwards
    (or spinning....)
    
    Bill.

            <<< Note 1358.38 by FORTY2::BETTS "X.500 Development" >>>

    
>    Oddly, the ABS systems I know get confused when you're going backwards
>    (or spinning....)
    
The ABS on my Citroen BX seems to work correctly when 
going backwards

    My Carlton's ABS works backwards, too.
    
    Steve

    I can just see lots of ABS-equipped readers of this conference
    screaming round the place in reverse, desperately trying to lock the
    wheels...
    
    
    Ian.

    
    
    I know one who wasn't in reverse but going backwards quite rapidly...
    

    going back to points .26-30 I had a 100 watt Cibie on the back of a
    rally mini..  It wans't being pretentious(!!) just very useful for
    reversing out of ditches!!  On the road, if anyone got too close or 
    had main beams on I'd just flick the switch!! Usually did the trick!
    
    	Jon.

    ... and totally illegal.
    
    Yopu flash that at me and I'll ram you, claiming I was dazzled by your
    illegal light (-:
    
    JK

�    illegal light (-:
    
    Won't be easy determining the wattage of the smashed bulb...

 Unless it is written on the remaining metal bit !!!

 I used to think that it was illegal to show a white light at the rear except 
when reversing, but just thought about the rear numberplate lights !!! Anyone
know what the law says about rear facing white lights ???

		 Alan	
		~~~~~~

re .46;

You must not show any white lights at the rear of a vehicle;
number plate lights should illuminate the plate, without shining backwards.

A friend of mine was done a few years back for this.

Peter.

    The rules are:
    
    o  No red lights at front.
    
    o  Red lights at rear, except reversing lights, numberplate lights, and
       direction indicators.
    
    It appears that the numberplate light can be as bright as you want,
    except that it has to fit in with the general rule that it must not
    dazzle other road users.
    
    The reversing light should have a maximum power of 24 watts unless of
    'an approved type', and there should be no more than two of them.
    
    Mat.
    *:o)
    

    re .48
    Reversing lights also have to have a switch via the gearbox that only
    allows them to be switched on after selecting reverse (or switched on
    by selecting reverse,) or have a switch with indication that the
    reversing light is on for the driver.

�    by selecting reverse,) or have a switch with indication that the
�    reversing light is on for the driver.
    
    As do main beam and fog lamps (have an indication) but this does
    not stop people from ignoring the 'indication'...  (another rathole)
    
    J.R.

    RE: (another rathole) (fog lights)
    
    I am fed up with following people who switch their rear fog lights on
    at seeing the mearest wisp of mist and leaving them on.
    
    Their are only about 2 days a year that I consider it necessary to put
    the rear fogs on because of fog. They are used mainly to flash people
    (who have their rear fogs on unnecessarily IMO) after I have overtaken
    them. I think that the rear fog switch should have a very bright very
    large indicator light.
    
    - Roy                 

    Re .51
    
    Not as bad as those folk who on mornings like this morning put 
    sidelights on only, giving .02 candlepower lighting both ends, 
    thus making themselves virtually invisible to other traffic.
    
    Worst of all are those that think any lights at all are only for
    cissies, and should only be used for flashing people they have put at
    hazard by remaining invisible.
    
    Steve

    More on [today's] rathole
    
    Previous replies seem to cover similar thoughts to my own.
    
    BUT, I think that rear fog lights are useful on more than two days
    per year.  I put mine on when it is foggy (not misty) if there are
    no other cars behind me.  If someone then catches me up, I turn
    them off.  Similar statement covers use of front fog lamps (but they
    are not so useful).
    
    Other use is to 'indicate' to people that they are not using their
    own [fog | driving | main-beam] lamps as 'I would want them to' (where
    I want them to do what the law and the conditions dictate - as far as
    I understand them).
    
    J.R.
    
    (I have stated this before, but have you noticed how the homofocal
     headlamps on BMW's are less visible in fog, due to smaller frontal
     area - even though the light is actually brighter)

    Well I wasnt to know why people flash me (with their lights) for no
    apparent reason.
    
    I am talking after dark, with my car properly lit (no fog lamps on
    etc).
    
    Are my head lamps wonky ?? the garage say not.  Do I look offensive
    (possible but it is after dark).
    
    To the best of my knowledge, I am not driving offensively when people
    flash at me.
    
    Regards
    
    Bruce
    
    PS:  dont suppose they are flashing me to warn me about the smell from
    my car do you !!

Re: .55

Do you have either a Vauxhall or a BMW ?

If so, you will probably find that they think you haven't dipped your 
headlights.

A flick of full beam will show them different !

Re: .56 

> -< Bruce it's the bad egg smell their on about :-) >-

As this is the n00th time I've seen this bad spelling....I've picked on you :-)

"their" in the context you are using it is an abreviation of "they are" and is
spelt they're...

their   = personal plural
there   = place, positional
they're = abbreviation of they are

OK ?

    
    What are .55 & .57 on about? I've just re-read the notes and it doesn't
    make sense to me (Still suffering from ski-lag?)
    
    Mark

    
>    What are .55 & .57 on about? I've just re-read the notes and it doesn't

Well Mark,  occasionally when one is driving along at night, dutifully driving
on dipped headlights...when the car coming towards you, decides, in his/her 
infinite wisdom, that you are blinding him/her with full beam, flashes his/her 
headlights at you....you then disabuse this notion by flicking your full beam 
back at them....

Now, are you sufficiently confused enough ?

Vauxhalls and BMW's both seem to have more lateral glare on the peripheral of 
the dipped beam...this confuses some drivers...

:-)

    Thanks,
    
    I got lost around the fact that it was significant that BMWs and
    Vauxhalls were involved. I've not especially noticed this to be the
    case, it's usually heavily loaded vehicles or just badly adjusted
    lights.
    
    Mark
    
    PS Do BMWs have an adjustment for the beam when loaded? Maybe people
    don't adjust their Vauxhall's beam level to match the load?
    

    
    some of the newer cars (BMWs certainly) have "homofocal" lenses
    (spelling?) in their headlamps. This seems to be totally responsible
    for the dazzle conditions. It is also responsible for the fact that the
    headlamps are useless in sub-perfect conditions and hence BMW drivers
    permanently use their fog lamps...
    
    /. Ian .\

    Hi
    
    Well my car (the bad egg smelling one)  is a Toyota.  But it does have
    yellow fog lamps (another note) and white head lamps.
    
    Regards
    
    Bruce

    The fact that (the use of) yellow foglamps is illegal is news to me.
    (Nothing illegal about manufacturers fitting them, just using them).
    
    Also, whilst I agree with the regulation that rear fogs should only be
    used when the visibility is down to 100mtrs (yds whatever), I'm
    surprised that it applies to the use front fogs (makes sense though if
    you think about it). I think that using front fogs with sidelights is a
    sensible idea if you want to _be_ seen in poor light conditions,
    however as I'm now aware of the regulations I'll have to readjust my
    thinking.
    
    - Roy (I can't imagine Mere Plod pulling you over for either of these
    "offences" though)

    I was irritated by a VOLVO driver last night!.
    Going down the A4 from Theale towards Thatcham, youy come to a dual
    carriageway. I pass the car in front and further ahead is this volvo
    estate, nothing on the inside lane either ahead or behind it.
    
    As I aproach I flash my lights several times, 'it' just ignores me. OK
    thinks I, 'it's' going to turn right further up and is too lazy to pull
    over. so I move to the inside, and carefully pass.
    
    IT starts honking like mad, and tries to speed up to beat me (no way,
    I've got 16 thingy's). I am now well ahead of it, still in the inside
    lane, have to move out to pass another car, move back in, end of dual
    carriageway.
    
    I'm amazed!, it carries on in the outside lane right to the end, forces
    it's way into the inside lane, and carries on.
    
    The wally was going straight on all the time and obviously didn't
    intend to be passed by ANYONE!!! 
    
    Richard

    This happens to me often on the A12 , mostly in the Essex section,
    starting just north of Chelmsford, and continuing on to the M25, where
    I enter "Centre Lane Owner's Club" territory. This Monday morning,
    before 6:15 am, traffic fairly busy but not outrageous, we came up
    behind a column of traffic in the outside lane doing 55-60 mph. We
    drove for a couple of hundred metres with the right-hand indicator
    flashing, no avail; flashed lights a couple of times; driver in front
    still refuses to pull over. So, I went past on the inside. I counted
    the cars filing along the outside lane... 32!!!!!! And what was at the
    front being overtaken? Nothing!
    
    Four things puzzle me about this:
    
    1) What on earth possesses people to follow sheep-like in the outside
       lane at 55-60mph when the limit is 70, and the inside lane is clear?
    2) Why doesn't driver of car no2 in the file, flash the lead vehicle
       and get him/her to pull over?
    3) When requested by a following vehicle, why do these people refuse to
       pull over and let you pass?
    4) Everyone, but everyone whom I speak to about this, says that along
       with fog-lights left on, and centre lane hogging, this drives them
       wild, and they never do it. So *WHO* the hell *ARE* these people?
    
    Laurie.

    
    
    
    Laurie,
    
    I think the problem is that few people like overtaking on the inside 
    (I VERY rarely do, having lost an insurance claim on this matter. I
     wasn't actually overtaking on the inside, but just the suggestion was
     enough for me to loose my NCB!) and hence when some moron in the 'fast
    lane' decides 55 mph is fast enough you inevitably get a tail back.
    
    Car 2 may well be flashing like mad, but to some people this is like a 
    red rag to a bull. I once encountered a retard on the M3 who slammed 
    his brakes on when I eventually flashed him. Definitely a case for 
    conscription to the Iraqi army!
    
    So who are these people? They're just ordinary drivers who are cursing
    all the drivers in front of them for not overtaking, but are
    perpetuating the problem. The trouble is what do you do? sit there and
    fume or break the law and carry out the dangerous manouevre of
    overtaking on the inside?
    
    Mark
    

    Re .66 .70
    
    I think Mark has summed this up quite well.
    
�    all the drivers in front of them for not overtaking, but are
�    perpetuating the problem. The trouble is what do you do? sit there and
�    fume or break the law and carry out the dangerous manouevre of
�    overtaking on the inside?
    
    As you said, it depends on the interaction between Drivers 1 and 2,
    then on following drivers perpetuating the problem.
    
    If you had a Blue Light, perhaps some of these bu**ers would pull over.
    So, what is worse from a legal point of view :-
    
    	Overtaking on the inside (definitely dangerous, but sometimes the
    	only solution {apart from 'waiting forever'}.
    or
    	'Impersonating a Police Office' (or more like 'impersonating a
    	driver in a Police Car').
    
    At least the latter option is not likely to affect your licence (is it ?).
    
    J.R.

    A friend of mine was pulled over by an unmarked Police car after
    undertaking on a motorway.
    
    The men in blue didn't complain too much about the undertaking - they
    were more concerned that he was driving too close to the
    outside-lane-hog and flashing a lot.  They just gave him a warning for
    being too aggressive.
    
    Rob

    I thought that the one time when you could "undertake" other cars
    was in queues of traffic....I'd count 32 cars in the right-hand
    lane as a queue !!
    
    Paul.

    I think it's actually "slow moving queue"......
    
    You could try the line: "well officer, to me 70mph is slow..."
    
    JK

    
    
    Sorry if this suggestion isn't offensive or dangerous enough, but
    you might try moving to the nearside lane and then using your main
    beam - not just a flash but for a good couple of seconds.
    
    After all, the idea isn't to annoy the guy infront of you in the queue
    (he's just waiting to pass, like you are) but to signal to the chap
    at the head of the queue.
    
    Generally, where just one or two cars are impeding your progress, it
    can be better to apply some phsychological pressure. If you use your
    headlights when behind a car, its generally perceived as impatient and
    brash. If you pull to the near side lane, then use the headlights, the
    impression is more likely to be positive - look at the way lorries and
    coaches flash their lights to say "you're ok to pull in now".
    
    Bill.

    I find that using my right hand indicator when behind a driver who
    hasn't moved over is more effective than mainbeam.  I believe the
    reason is that mainbeam looks quite aggressive to the driver infront,
    whereas an indicator is more polite.  I certainly find this technique
    usually has the desired result.

RE:             <<< Note 1358.77 by WOTVAX::MEAKINS "Clive Meakins" >>>
�                             -< Try your indicator >-
� 
�     I find that using my right hand indicator when behind a driver who
�     hasn't moved over is more effective than mainbeam.  I believe the
�     reason is that mainbeam looks quite aggressive to the driver infront,
�     whereas an indicator is more polite.  I certainly find this technique
�     usually has the desired result.

    Well, I too prefer this approach, but it simply doesn't work (and nor
    does flashing) if there is a whole stream of cars in front. For one or
    two, I agree, it often does work, and I only flash the lights as a
    last resort. However, many of these people have absolutely no intention
    of pulling over.
    
    Laurie.

    I had a ``friend'' who had a 12 volt laser attached to his rear view
    mirror - this didn't blind but people sure got out of the way.
    
    As good as a 20mm cannon ?
    
    Is this legal ?
    
    Is it aggressive enough ?
                                          

Lasers, even the < 5mW one I have can and will 'blind'. Even if the blindness
lasts for only a couple of seconds.

Simon

    (This *is* the offensive driving note isn't it?)
    
    I used to ride shotgun for a chap who had a simple solution to the
    offside lane traffic queue. He overtook with two wheels on the central
    reservation (or even four sometimes). The resultant showers of stones
    and debris meant everyone moved back at least one lane.
    
    Then the authorities started putting up crash barriers on all the
    motorways. This chap felt it was a personal vendetta........
    
    JK

    
    If you have a motorcyclist behind you, who is just coming up to
    overtake, _please_ don't choose that moment to wash your windscreen!
    
    I got 'washed' twice on my way home last night...
    
    I don't know if this is the right note - but  I find it 'offensive' :-)

    At last a cure for tail-gaters !
    
    Mis-aligned rear window washer jet - filled with brake fuid.
    
    They'll never guess. :-}
    
    AmS

    How to be offensive:
    
    1. Be a motor-cycle dispatch rider (enough, surely?)
    
    2. Show how clever you are by waiting well in front of the stop line
       and in between lanes at a red light.
    
    2. From the right, try to cut up a motorist who is keeping to the correct
       lane on the Robin Hood roundabout, and who therefore squeezes you
       out.
    
    3. Kick the car with your boot as you pass on the left (down the middle
       white line, of course).

In my youth when some of us played at road_race_drivers on back roads of
northern New England, we often came upon a slow poke who was blocking us.

At night a trick that worked was to flash the high beams and weave back and
forth behind the slow poke, lane to lane, as if drunk. Worked a treat.
Even had some folks so shook up they pulled over and stopped!
     

    A story which I heard, and I suspect is totally false, was of some
    Mini-maniac who fitted a barrage of massive Cibie Oscars to his bonnet.
    He then came up close behind the guy that was blocking him, and
    switched them on.
    
    This apparently had the effect of frying the paint on the victim's
    bootlid.
    
    Steve

Warning longish note - but it is worth reading.

         <<< HYDRA::DISK$USERPACK02:[NOTES$LIBRARY]DAVE_BARRY.NOTE;1 >>>
                       -<  Dave Barry - Noted humorist  >-
================================================================================
Note 35.0                        Lousy Drivers                        No replies
DUNE::SMITH                                         143 lines  24-DEC-1983 12:26
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------





                    Lousy Drivers I Have Known 
                          By Dave Barry 


Despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary, most people think 
they drive well.  As Exhibit A, I cite my good friend, whom I 
will call Fred.  (That's not his real name; his real name is 
Joseph.) Fred is intelligent: he has never, to my knowledge, 
owned a leisure suit.  If you asked him, he would undoubtedly 
tell you he is an above-average driver.  He would not tell you 
about the time we were in New York's Chinatown during some sort 
of festival and the streets were crowded and he drove his Toyota 
Corolla at fairly high speed for an entire block on the sidewalk 
without seeming to have even the vaguest idea why he was able to 
pass all the other cars so easily or why the pedestrians seemed 
so concerned all of a sudden.  I believe he thought they were 
yelling at us as part of some ancient Chinese custom. 

"Aha," you will say: "He was drunk."  The tragedy is that he was 
not drunk, just as he was not drunk when de drove from Exit 6 to 
Exit 9 on the New Jersey Turnpike, a distance of at least 30 
miles, at 55 mile an hour but in second gear, and then glanced 
down and realized, seemingly for the first time, that his car, 
which he had driven for at least two years, had two more gears, 
and decided, more less for the hell of it, to shift into one of 
them, which I'm sure is the only thing that kept the engine from 
exploding and killing us all. 

Exhibit B is a former newspaper colleague, who believes, in fact 
insists, that he is a good driver. (Actually, I haven't seen him 
in several years, so it's possible he has driven off a bridge and 
no longer insists anything.)  I could give you many anecdotes to 
show what a truly crapola driver he is, but I think the most 
revealing one occurred when he was not even at the wheel.  Once, 
after a bad winter storm had coated all the cars in the newspaper 
parking lot with ice, he announced that the best way to remove 
ice from a car window is to hit it with a hammer.  When we 
pointed out that this might break the windows, he smiled a 
condescending smile, the smile of a person who is thinking: 
"These utter morons still cling to the outmoded belief, 
conclusively disproved by Modern Science, that if you hit a car 
window with a hammer, you will break it."  He went to his 
brand-new Fiat, took a ball-peen hammer from the trunk, broke one 
window, then, as a small group of us enlightened 
clingers-to-out-moded-beliefs looked on breathlessly, broke 
another window.  Here is a man who could not competently remove 
ice from his car windows, yet firmly believed he was more 
qualified than most to actually drive on the public streets. 

I do not mean to belabor these people.  I mention them only to 
show that if you asked every driver in the United States to 
assess his or her driving ability, all but six would tell you 
they were above average.  This means either that all those 
reports of people crashing into things are an elaborate media 
hoax or most of us overrate ourselves. 

No doubt you are nodding knowingly and saying "By golly, Dave 
Barry is, as usual in his column, which I urge all my friends to 
read, hitting the nail right on the head.  Most drivers overrate 
themselves, the fools."  But that's just my point: Maybe you are 
a lousy driver.  Somebody has to be.  And don't tell me you've 
never had an accident.  Lousy drivers don't so much have 
accidents as cause them.  My mother never has accidents, but is 
responsible for more property damage than Tropical Storm Agnes. 

I think the problem is that we don't test prospective drivers 
will enough.  Most drivers' test ask questions like: "How far 
before an intersection should you be signaling?"  This is 
silly; anyone can honestly answer question about what he should 
do; the real question is what he will do.  The question should 
be: "Once you get out of this room, do you plan to signal any of 
your driving intentions ever again?"  Most licensed drivers, 
under oath, would have to answer "no", which means they would not 
be licensed drivers, which would be good. 

Here are some questions I think we should ask: 

1. What is the left lane of a multiple highway for? 

A. Cars that do not plan to exit for a good while. 

B. Cars that are going the speed limit, which the government 
feels, in the interest of National Security, should be 55 miles 
per hour, and by gosh the government ought to know about these 
things, so nobody has the right to pass cars going this speed, so 
they should be allowed to be in the left lane all the way to 
Idaho if they feel like it. 

C. Passing. 

(While we're on the subject: I see no reason why it should not be 
legal to fire warning bursts from bumper-mounted machine guns at 
people who fail to get out of the left lane.) 

2. Before you pull away from the curb you should... 

A. Turn on the radio. 

B. Put on your turn signal, thereby giving yourself the 
right-of-way over every other vehicle in the United States, which 
means you can just pull the heck out whenever you're ready. 

C. Look to see if anyone is coming. 

3. You are definitely too drunk to drive when... 

A. You arrange to sneak off to a motel with an inanimate object. 

B. Little tongues of flame shoot out your nostrils. 

C. You believe you are not too drunk to drive. 

(The best answer to question 3 is "C."  The surest proof you 
can't drive is that you think you can drive.  People are always 
claiming they can drink and drive.  They can, of course; the 
problem is that they drive like brain-damaged Visigoths.  The 
only person I know who comes close to being able to drink and 
drive well is my friend Randall.  For years he had me convinced 
he really could do both.  I held that opinion right up until the 
Corvette he was driving us home in landed some 80 or 90 feet from 
the railroad tracks that launched us.) 

	Seen on the back of a dustcart I was following this morning:

			" HOW'S MY DRIVING? 
				B1026
			    0800 nnn nnn "

	Great idea, but I suspect it won't catch on.

	Ian.

    Yes, I've seen quite a few of them around, too.