Conference terri::cars_uk

    Has anyone mentioned the Azur blue Ford Escort RS turbo used in the
    programme Cats Eyes?? I beleive this car was produced by Ford as a one
    off for the programme.
    
    				Ian.

       A convoy of famous TV and film vehicles is currently touring Britain.
       The cars include the Lotus 7 from 'The Prisoner', the Reliant Van
       from 'Only Fools and Horses', the Spyker from 'Genevieve', and
       James Herriot's Morris 8 from 'All Creatures Great and Small' (I
       hope they've cleaned it!).

       They were in the west country yesterday. A friend of mine, who
       drives a 1955 Citroen Big 15, was filmed by a local TV crew who
       thought it was Maigret's car!

       The cars are due at the AA building in Basingstoke at 1:00 O'clock
       on Wednesday. The tour is for charity and is apparantly sponsored by
       Shell and 'You' magazine. Does anyone have any more details?

       Ian.

	A quick question, what is the registration number of number 6's 7?

    Err... wasn't it KAR 120C  ??/ or something similar?
    
    Mikef

I think that was the actual car on the Caterham stand at Sandown.
Anyone confirm / deny?

Scott

    The number plate is famous for its TV role. The original car has long
    since gone (involved in an accident in Australia as far as I remember).
    
    There is further discussion in note 7 (appropriately) in the Prisoner
    conference. (OPG::THE_PRISONER)  <KP7> to add.
    
    Ian.

	Yes, it was at Sandown and that was why I was asking.  In fact, I
	video'd it so that I wouldn't forget...

    Could anyone confirm that it is not the original car used in The
    Prisoner?  I checked out the Pris conf, but it didn't mention the car
    being destroyed?
    
    Mikef

    the car at sandown is not the car used in  any filming for the Prisoner
    it is a current limited edition model by Caterham.
    the original car was a LOTUS 7, however Caterham built a replica 
    for the last episode of the prisoner (the name's on the tip of my
    tongue). the car at the show does however carry the reg. no. KAR 120C
    
    
    
    ...art
    
    ...if only i had a spare �19,000   :-(

And other than a little plaque engraved with Patrick McGoohan's signature,
what makes the limited edition Caterham different from other 7s?

Scott

(The colour doesn't count, as loadsa 7s are painted like that!)

    so, two cars were used, one a copy of the other, and neither one is in
    this show thingy???  I'll toddle up there at one tomorrow anyways I
    think.
    
    Mikef

    Are the cars going to be there today?
    
    Mikef

    Apparently, at the end of the first series, the Lotus was sold to a guy
    in Australia, who then promply wrote it off in an accident. So another
    identical one was purchased/made for the rest of the programs.( still
    with reg no. KAR 120C I think.)
    
    Carl

    There was only one series of the Prisoner (17 episodes I think).  Must
    have been for the last episode (Fallout)where he is driving it thru
    London at the end.
    
    Mikef

    yep! the episode that contained the caterham built 7 was fallout
    
    i've read that mcgoohan built the 7 originally used
    
    ...art

In the program, McGoohan's character is supposed to have built the car himself.
But I don't think in reality McGoohan did build it.

Scott

       Well after all that, the Lotus didn't show! But it was still an
       entertaining way to spend a lunch hour.

       For those interested, here are some of the vehicles taking part in
       "The Great British Film Rally". A "*" denotes the ones at the AA
       building yesterday (or at least the ones I identified).

     * 1912 NAGK4 Race About.		Those Magnificent Men in Their
       					Flying Machines.
       1926 Clyno Royal			Chariots of Fire, Grey Granite.
     * 1930 Chevrolet			Poirot.
       1931 Chrysler CD Straight 8	The Untouchables.
     * 1935 Morris 8 Tourer		All Creatures Great and Small.
       1947 Rover			 "      "       "    "    "
       Lotus 7				See -.1,2,3
     * 1964 Volvo P1800			The Saint.
       1966 Lotus Elan			The Avengers.
     * 1973 Reliant Van.		Only Fools and Horses.
     * Chitty Chitty Bang Bang.		Guess!
   *** Three Mini Coopers		Three Guesses!
       Bedford Truck			Dad's Army.
       Model T Ford WHO 1		Doctor Who.
       1935 Harley Davidson		Steve McQueen films.
    *  1936 Railton Tourer 		Poirot, The Charmer.
       FAB 1				Thunderbirds.
    *  Range Rover			Emmerdale Farm.

       			Guest Appearances.

    *  1929 Hispano Suiza		She Fell Among Theives.
       Batmobile			Batman.
       1904 Spyker			Genevieve.
    *  Model T Ford.			Laurel & Hardy films.
       Mirov				Russian Sportscar from the
       					Norwich Union TV ads.
    *  1956 Aston Martin DB2		Hitchcock's "The Birds"


       The whole thing is moving northwards, arriving at Edinburgh on
       Saturday 25 August. I have the complete schedule if anyone wants
       to know where they'll be at a particular time.

       Ian.

       P.S. If anyone spots the Doctor Who car on the road, I should be
       interested to know if it really does have the registration "WHO 1"

I take it the minis have been repaired since being chucked over the edge of
a cliff ;-)

Although it *looked* like the pristine coopers that went rolling down the
mountainside, I hope it was really only a scrap car.  It was, wasn't it?

What about the three sports cars trashed by the Mafia guys?  What were they?
(Haven't seen the film since I've been old enough to identify them...)  Again,
did they really smash up three pristine cars?  I hope not.

Scott

PS The film's the "Italian Job" in case anyone doesn't know (unlikely...)

    The Who car was there yesterday.  Unfortunately, it does not have the
    Registration plate WHO 1 - apparently its illegal for the road, or
    something.  It did have the name Bessie painted on the side tho, and it
    was a kind of pale colour, not bright yellow.  
    
    It was the original one that Pertwee used in the earlier seventies.  A
    replacement was bought, which was rebuilt into something called a
    roadster??  This was WHO 7.  WHO 7 was used in later episodes, and
    showed in one of last seasons stories - you can see the difference if
    you compare it to the original Pertwee one.  
    
    I was a bit dissapointed that it did not look as it did in the TV, bt
    it gets used for various other things apparently.  Never mind, I got to
    sit in it, which kind of made my day.
    
    NO Batmobile!!  Worth catching the guy with the exploding car tho.
    
    Mikef

    RE: .64
    
    On the news recently they said that FAB 1 had been damaged when
    the transporter it was on stopped suddenly and FAB 1 didn't 8-)
    
    Trev

    
    Talking of FAB 1 has anyone seen the commercial for some insurance
    company which has Lady Penelope causing havoc in her car because it's
    Parker's day off?
    
    Brilliant I thought!
    
    Mark
    
    PS I think a Jaguar E-Type and an Aston were amongst the cars trashed
    by the Mafia in the Italian Job. If they really did smash good cars
    that must have increased the cost of the film even more in recent 
    years! :^)

    re: .65
    
    The three cars trashed were, 2 E-types, and an Aston Martin DB6
    (but was it a Volante ?)
    
    If you watch closely you can see that the cars just 'shells' without
    engines, and minimal running gear. Same also applies to the Maserati
    (?) trashed at the beginning of the film.
    
    At the time of release the blurb said that something in the order
    of 14 Mini's (but not all Coopers) were trashed during the making
    of the film.
    
    AMS

    
    I agree with Derick, Maserati is spelt Lambourghini .....
    
     

Apparently, one of the cameras packed up whilst they were trashing the
Aston - they had to find another one and start all over again.

    Re the insurance ad rat-hole....
    I creased up with laughter at seeing this, what a hell of a take-off,
    wonder how they resurected all the models for it!.
    
    Re the 'italian job' mini's: they were on the news 'tother night, no
    they're not originals, they were unable to locate them (if they still
    existed), so they're replica's.
    
    Richard
    P.S. for those who haven't seen the advert, see below...
    
    You see Lady penelope get into the car, shot switches to outside to see
    her crash out through the garage door, career down the drive, crash
    through the gates, across the road and demolish a mini.
    
    She reverses, drives down the road, she forces some freight lorry off
    the road into an industrial type installation that explodes.
    
    Shot switches to parker, in thunderbird 2 with grabs, picking her up,
    in the nick of time you think, until he swings her up away from the
    road and swings the suspended car through a church steeple!
    
    Moral: sometimes you wish you were covered by mumble.. insurance!
    

Although I haven't seen the ad, I think it's probably all original footage
suitable edited (like the video for some current awful "pop" song).

The "FAB1" in this famous-cars-round-Britain trip: is it a real, full size,
working car?  Is it a six-wheel pink Roller?  Does it have real machine guns
behind the headlights?

Scott

    Re -.1. 
    
    The Thunderbirds Ad (for Swinton insurance) is all new. Gerry Anderson
    does a lot of ads these days. The Royal Bank of Scotland ones are his.
    There is also an equally good Swinton ad with the Flinstones.
    
    FAB 1 is a full size car.
    
    Ian.

In that case, are the puppets new too?  I saw an interview with GA a couple of
years ago, at which time he said most of the puppets had been lost.  He had one
of the three Parker puppets, but it was in a pretty poor state...

So FAB1 is a real car, but is it a pink six-wheel Rolls Royce?  If not what
car is it?

Scott

    The french Channel 5 just showed half a dozen films in the Agatha
    Christie "Miss Marple" series. Some interesting cars appear :
    
    - choice of post war RR and Bentleys
    - Jaguar XK120 drophead (FAN2266)
    - choice of MG TC and TD
    - Morgan (with TR3/4 instruments)
    
    There's also a franco-italian film (starring Alain Delon and Lea
    Massari) called "Le Professeur" (the teacher ?) with
    
    - red Lamborghini Miura (mmmmm ... my favourite)
    - light blue Ferrari 330 GTC
    - black Citroen Traction Avant 11              

    
    I fancy the yellow Porsche 911 Turbo featured in 'Return to Eden'.
    You remember ? The one with the saucy number plate "4 PLAY" 8-0
    

    	Re .77
    
       FAB 1 is described in the Brochure as a "Rolls Royce lookalike"

       The original full sized FAB 1 was based on a lorry chassis. I
       don't know whether this is the original, or modern copy.

       It might be worth checking out note 68 of ZENDIA::TV - I remember
       asking about the car there once.

       Ian.

    The following note was coppied from the Air_cooled conference regarding
    the cars used for the filming of Disney's "HERBIE"  films
    
               <<< IOSG::LIB0:[NOTES$LIBRARY]AIR_COOLED.NOTE;1 >>>
                            -< Air-Cooled Motoring >-
================================================================================
Note 52.1                        ** Herbie ** ??                          1 of 3
COOKIE::JANORDBY "The government got in again"       44 lines  26-OCT-1989 17:00
                                   -< exit >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    
    They had at least 8 different cars for the different stunts. 
    
    The original was a stock '60/'61, lots of mix and match. It seems like 
    even back then, they just went and found a beat up old bug and painted
    it with a broom and rolled it out of the garage. The front seats in the
    original on the driver's side was modified (with a saw) to lay all the
    way back and a couple of holes drilled in the body so that rods could 
    work the hood and deck lids with apparently nobody in the car. There
    was a camera mounted right on the trunk lid so that the driver could
    tell where he was going.
    
    The 'backwards car was the same general vintage, though hard to really
    tell. It was picked up off the body and turned 180 degrees so that the
    chassis really was going forward. This one had so many holes in it from
    gadget hookups, it looked like swiss cheese. We actually got this one
    on local TV going about 45 miles an hour backwards down the busiest
    road in town!
    
    Both of these had stock single porters, neither of which were in very
    good shape when we got them. Both were restored (cherry, I must say)
    for a museum in California who takes them on a traveling car show with
    him to malls and the like.
    
    We still have the floater, but it is really trashed. It was filled with 
    styrofoam up to the windows, the fenders, the trunk and engine
    compartments. The sunroof in this one was cut out with a hacksaw! It is
    set on a plywood chassis and the tires were full of cement for ballast.
    Have you ever seen a bug rusting out in the quarter panels all the way
    up to the windows. I don't know if there is a way to salvage this one,
    even if it was a Herbie.
    
    The engine setup in the backwards car was rather interesting. The trunk
    lid wouldn't quite close with the generator in stock position.... so we
    rigged an assembly under the cylinders on the right side, about 90
    degrees clockwise from the stock position. We then hooked up a couple
    of squirrel cage fans to provide some minimum cooling for the short
    trips around the parking lot, etc. The exhaust was custom built to exit
    just inside the 'front' wheel wells and so was invisible.
    

    Jamey

    
    
    
    Re .- a few,
    
    The Dr Who car, Bessie, was originally a Siva Edwardian, although the
    same model was later called the Roadster.   Siva ?  Three men and a dog
    in a barn in Bryanston, Dorset, who made them by hand, to order, or
    they'd sell you  kits.   GRP body panels and as much wood and brass as
    you wanted, on a VW floor pan.
    
    Apparently, Pertwee saw one, bought one, and had it written into the
    script.
    
    I borrowed one of Bessie's  relatives for a charity stunt some years
    ago, and it was _fun_ !   Absolutely no weight, on top of a 1600 VW....
    the best bit was sitting at traffic lights, with the engine rattling
    and banging way in authentic "old" style, scarf and goggles, flying
    helmet, the whole bit, with the good lady in her posh Edwardian frock,
    and watching all the other drivers go all misty-eyed, turn to their
    kids and say, "Ah, they don't build them like that any more, my boy....."
    Then they'd  courteously give way to this 'venerable antique' (no, the car!)
    giving us plenty of time to manouevre.  I'd nod, wave
    grandly........then kick the fly-off handbrake and floor the pedal.  
    I just _wish_ I could have seen their faces when
    we laid rubber up the road.......
    
    
    Ah, those were the days.......
    
    
    Ian
                                                                 

                 -< Showing to-day between Abingdon and Oxford >-

    re.81  Ta...I'm trying to put together ahistory of 'Bessie', do you
    know anymore?  I'm trying to find which cars were used, and when.
    stuff like that.
    
    Mikef

     Re .66
>    The Who car was there yesterday.  Unfortunately, it does not have the
>    Registration plate WHO 1 - apparently its illegal for the road, or
>    something.

       The registration belongs to an old guy who lives just down the road
       from me. It's on a Honda.  See note 24.1193 +

       Ian.
    

    Ta...Where is that?  Be real interesting to know how he came about it. 
    WHO 1 was the reg used in the JP episodes.  Maybe this chap is a fan
    and bought the reg.  Shame its only on a honda tho!!  Flag him down and
    interrogate him!!
    
    Mikef

    Any idea where they are showing this weekend, Saturday 18th, Sunday
    19th??

       SATURDAY 18 AUGUST.

       Woburn Abbey for the arrival of The DeHavilland Moth Club's
       annual two-day gathering of Gypsy Moth and Tiger Moth
       bi-planes.


       SUNDAY 19 AUGUST.

       Silverstone Race Circuit.
       Chatsworth House.


       Ian.

This may be completely wrong but I seem to remember reading that the reg. WHO 1 
was never owned by Pertwee or the BBC.  If they had to shoot any shots which 
were close enough to be able to read the plate on public roads, they just 
briefly swapped to WHO 1 and then put the real plate back on afterwards.

Jon

    Well...maybe COMICS::WEGG could stop this chap next time he sees him,
    and solve the mystery for us!!  Sounds a bit naughty of the Beeb, you
    often saw bess speeding along public roads...
    
    Mikef

       OK. Next time I see the guy, I'll ask him.

       Ian.

    
    Where will they be 1st/2nd September....if they are still touring ?
    

       They are still touring, but I seem to have lost the brochure
       (dammit!). If I find it, I'll post the details.

       FAB 1 is now back on the tour. Apparantly it was damaged at the
       start when the transporter carrying it braked sharply.

       Ian.

    In case anyone is interested a number of film and TV cars are (were)
    produced by a small company within 15 miles of Reading.
    
    That includes Chitty-Chitty-Bang-Bang which the locals still remember
    going out on test drives past the pub!
    
    Where? The Old Vicarage, South Stoke (nr. Goring on Thames)
    
    JK

    Re -1 
    
    A friend of mine now owns Chitty. Originally Dick Van Dyke thought he
    was going to be given the car after filming was complete, but the film 
    company offered to sell it to him. He turned down the chance, and so
    my friend was able to buy it.           
    
    Ken

    Could someone please tell me the make and model of the car that
    the brother/brother-in-law or whatever of the Michael Palin character in
    GBH was driving ?
    
    I'm guessing it was a convertable Karmann Ghia.
    
    Rich
    

>>    I'm guessing it was a convertable Karmann Ghia.

Its definately a Porsche - 365 Speedster perhaps?


...art

>>Its definately a Porsche - 365 Speedster perhaps?
    
    Yep,   but was it a real one or one of those Beetle based kits ?
    
    Stevie   (a Beetle owner)
    

Its a Beetle based kit car.

	How can I tell ?

		1. Rear lamp cluster is wrong - what you didn't notice.
		2. It `R' (1977) Reg. The 356 was long since dead by then :-(

	Rik

    Kindly videoed for me last week (?)...

	"The Persuaders"

    Great extended race at the beginning of the first episode, Roger Moore in
    the Aston DBS and Tony Curtis in some ratty little Fiat... alright, it was 
    a Ferrari Dino. :-)

    Anyone else watch it and suspect something amiss with the Aston's rear 
    suspension ?

    
    I saw it. I didn't think of anything askew in the Aston, but my main
    thought while watching it was that there was no way that they'd be able
    to have titles showing our two 'heroes' racing on public roads these
    days!
    
    Mark

    	I watched it too. Now you mention it, the Aston did appear to be a
    	little low at the back. The Persuaders used to be one of my
    	favourite programmes, not least because of the cars.
    
    	Ian.

    I watched it and it was as good as I remember it was when I was a kid. 
    Funny thing, after seeing Curtis' Dino.  On Sunday morning whilst
    getting into my car I saw a 'J' (old 'J') reg Dino go past in
    immaculate 'nick.  The Persuaders on the night before must have
    encouraged the owner to take it for a spin.....
    
    
    Nev.

    Yeh, I was in the UK this weekend, and saw the Persuaders, ahhh,
    nostalgia. Didn't it look dated! It's a shame I can't see any more....
    
    Laurie.

    I think it was just one episode, part of a series on old programs through 
    the years, this week "The Persuaders", next week "On The Buses" or somesuch.
    

    	"The Persuaders" is available on video, in fact it was the video
    	version they showed on Saturday.
    
    	Ian.

    
    A thought. Would a heavy Aston be able to keep up with an agile
    Dino (or any Ferrari) unless in a straight line.
    
    JN.

    I was asked the same thing at the time. I would have thought that given the
    long sweeping bends at the beginning, the Aston would have it (just) but 
    once the two of them got up into the hills, the Ferrari would be that much
    more agile.

    Either way, I doubt if either would "bobble" about at the lights like they
    were portrayed as doing. :-)

    
    Interesting question?
    
    Assuming the DBS was only a 6, I reckon the Ferrari would have outrun
    it everywhere. It would have been tighter (probably with the edge going
    to the Aston) on fast bends and straights, if it'd been a DBS V8.
    
    Mark

� Assuming the DBS was only a 6...

    Why so ?

    Only the very early ones were sixes, then came the V8 fuel injection cars
    and then the V8 carb model.

    If it were a V8 injection, it should go quite well enough to keep up with
    a Dino.

    
    I assumed it was a 6 as it was obviously (judging by the grill) a
    pretty early version of the model which became the V8. I thought that
    most DBS' were 6s, but it's not a model I know a lot about. It just
    looked very much like a 6 cylinder car I used to see around a lot.
    
    No doubt a _real_ Aston buff could tell us if the V8 existed in a road
    car in 1970.
    
    I certainly don't know for certain when the V8 made it's way into the
    DBS.
    
    Mark

    The DBS used in the Persuaders was a straight V6 with bodywork made to
    look like a V8.
    
    The V8 wasn't around as a road car in 1970.
    
    Info from my boyfriend who used to work for Hexagon Garage (Aston
    Martin dealers) in Highgate in the early 70's - he actually sold on the
    Aston Martin DBS from the Persuaders after the series finished.
    
    He's a bit hazy on the dates, so couldn't get any more info on when the
    V6 changed to the V8.
    
    Sue
    
    

    re-1
    
    It was a Straight 6 not a V6.
    
    Grant

� The V8 wasn't around as a road car in 1970.

    Er... I think you'll find that it was.  Just.

    Thanks for the info though...

Ross

    Glan you said that. It was worrying me how they'd "made it look like a
    V8" when the V8 "wasn't around then"!
    
    JK

    
    Maybe AM liked it so much they copied it?
    
    Mark

    No, it's a bit like the Dalton Bond Aston Martin. That was a V8 made to look
    like a Vantage. Perhaps it was easier to get one of the straight six cars,
    that had been around since '67, which were probably quite cheap given the
    power to weight ratio, and were probably somewhat less desireable than the
    new(ish) V8 - which Aston could probably sell as fast as they could make.

    
    .116 should've had a smiley.
    
    If the Dalton Bond Aston was a V8 made to look like a Vantage, what was
    a Vantage? :^)
    
    Mark

� If the Dalton Bond Aston was a V8 made to look like a Vantage, what was
� a Vantage? :^)
  

    Huh ?  :-)

    It's a more expensive Aston with a tad more go than the V8, but just a tad
    you understand.

    
    Ah, I see a V8 made to look like a Vantage, which was made not to go
    like a V8!.
    
    Mark

    
    Would I be right in saying that the straight 6 used wire wheels, and
    the alloys were introduced on the DBS V8?

	[Apologies to our American noters who didn't 
	see last night's Poirot on ITV last night]

	What was the HE car that Poirot's right hand
	man (Hastings) was buying in last nights easy to solve
	mystery?  My guess is Fiat, I think that the grill
	was too deep and pointed at the bottom to be Alfa
	Romeo.  Plus how did they show damage to it without
	damaging it?

	Dave

    The Cook Report was a good watch last night all about 'ringing' cars.
    
    I didn't think the test where they emulated a side impact accident was
    very relevent as I think a standard Accord would suffer similar damage
    as it has no side impact protection. What was amazing was the photo of
    the Renault 5 turbo wreckage where it had split in half on impact.
    
    The crooked rally driver got his come uppance but what about the youth
    that had a way with adjectives and a baseball bat ? no mention was made
    about the police being involved and him being arrested. He was the sort
    of character that should be locked up.
    
    Royston
    
    (Not really film or TV cars but to save writing a new note...)

I thought the most striking part of the programme was the statistics - over
200,000 'ringed" cars on the market every year!

Dave.

    What about the guy who had spent half the last 30 years in prison, but
    had still traded over �8m worth of stolen cars.  He said he had stopped
    now as the penalties were being increased.  
    
    I would have thought he could have retired about 29 years ago!
    
    I also agree with the earlier note about the apparent lack of police
    follow-up on the budding Babe Ruth.   It was interesting to see that he
    ran past Mr Cook a number of times to attack the cameramen, neighbours,
    and any and all but Mr Cook himself.  
    
    	- Chris -

    Watch out for 'A to B: Tales of modern motoring' on friday (BBC2 9.30pm
    I think).
    
    This week its about company car drivers.
    
    Last week was about lady drivers and their 'relationship' with their
    cars. It was a real insight. It surprised me how obsessed they all
    seemed to be with other drivers looking at them.
    
    What do other folks think of this series ?
    
    Royston
                               

I liked it, but I prefered "Sign of the time" done by the
same people.

    �I liked it
    
    So you do like some things then Ian :-)

re .126

Sorry Royston, no time to watch. Far too busy looking at ladies driving cars. 

Andrew

Yes Royston. I like my Calibra - hate the Probe...

        On the subject of cars on film, has anyone seen a video called Police
    Stop !

    It's a video complied of police incar and motorway camera footage. It
    is full of mostly gross stupidity and diabolical driving. I thought I'd
    seen most things , but this video opens a few new avenues. It includes
    footage of people reversing , and making a real bodge of it, along
    motorway hard shoulder because they missed the turnoff, chases , and
    people who obviously left the brain at home. Interesting watching, make
    you wonder what planet some people ar on.

    They reviewed this on the Big Breakfast a couple of weeks ago.  The
    interview was excellent, there was this policeman trying to be all
    serious saying it is an educational video which is intended to help
    people with their driving.  Then Gaby picked up the video and asked if
    they weren't just out to make money with and jumping on the commercial
    bandwagon and then read out the advertising blurb which went something
    like, "Thrills, spills and action...".  Even the policeman had to
    laugh :-)
    
    tp

    The most amazing story I heard about Police Stop! was the MR2 car
    chase.
    
    Apparently at the end it crashes and several people were hurt. These
    folks new the police had it on video but the police would not release
    it for the court case. They had no idea that the footage later became
    available commercially. They were understandably distressed when this
    came to light.
    
    Royston

On Radio 4 this morning it was stressed that the police make no money from 
this video. Concern was expressed that people(?) might try and copy these 
antics.

Andrew

    I've seen it and it certainly has made me think about my driving
    habits. Why on earth don't I use the hard shoulder more often - far
    less traffic. 
    
    Rupert 8^)

    
    The video wasn't made by the police. It was made by a company (Labyrinth
    Media) who obtained the video clips from police around the country.
    
    The police don't get any money at all from sales of the video, it all
    goes to the company who produced the video. The guy on the Big
    Breakfast was from Labyrinth not the police, and he started out by
    trying to pretend that it's an 'educational' video, but it quickly
    became apparant that it's a money making video after all!
    
    It's quite an eye-opener, with incidents ranging from thieves making a
    get-away, through to people reversing down motorways and slip-roads,
    and film of a *big* motor-way pile up which makes you shudder to watch!
    
    Steve.
         

    
    re a couple back

    The MR2 chase is quite some of the worst driving on the tape. The
    driver makes very good use of the hard shoulder and other cars as
    brakes. The chase on video is a couple of minutes . It finishes with a
    head on crash. I think it was an armed robber trying to 'have it away
    on his toes'. He gets 8 years I think , a ban for x years and a re-test.
    If Video is available in cases of disgusting exhibitions of driving ,
    it should be a available as evidence in court . That way maybe people 
    who deserve a hammering will get it, if the judge/magistrate or jury
    see what a complete idiot they have been. 

    There is a bit on the video that was used in court, a section of film
    where 2 vehicles were tail gateing along a motorway . Both the drivers
    were friends ,so it was simply playing at 70. The video was used and
    they were both banned for a year for dicking around.  
                                   

    If you do have a copy of this video, be careful to keep it out of reach
    of your children. 
    
    Recent evidence has come to light linking exposure to bad driving
    videos with aggressive driving in children when they reach adulthood.
    
    Huw.

    I've just bought a videotape called "Inoubliable Berlinette" on Alpine
    A110 (Unforgettable berlinetta). In 52 minutes they show some history
    of Alpine. Lots of interviews of Jean Redele, Bernard Darniche,
    Jean-Luc Therier, ... and some views of the 1970 world championship
    rallies. The best moment is about 5 minutes of Darniche driving a
    Group4 1800cc A110 on a twisty circuit with views from outside and from
    inside ... Unbelievable and certain unforgettable.

Patrick

Have you a source for this video, a member of our motor racing club has one and
I'm sure he would be interested.

Mike

    Something else to check out.

    Tonight on Meridian (maybe other regions?) at 11.40pm there is a
    new programme called 'The Motor Show' and by the sound of it has a
    similar format to Top Gear. 

    Did you see those company car drivers on Friday ? What a very sad
    bunch of guys.

    Royston

    Having been doing a lot of milage for the past 3 years, I have been
    working hard at justifying a Car Allowance.  Finally I got one, and
    actually got my car a month ago.  I got a Cavalier - not very exciting,
    but comfy and very nice compared to what I'd been used to, so I was in
    many ways grateful for it.
    
    But after seeing 'From A to B' last friday night, I was almost
    embarrased to drive to work this morning in it.  Were these people for
    real?  Do people really think and behave like that?   Am I alone in
    not being a company car driver like that?
    
    And I will never - ever - hang anything up in the back of my car again. 
    Yuk!
    
    Mikef
      

    
    I watched 'A to B' in complete disbelief! What a bunch of idiots!
    
    Some quotes (from memory):-
    
    "The only thing I don't like about the car is that it hasn't got CDi on
    the boot, so if someone is behind me, they can't tell I'm driving a
    CDi"
    
    - a guy talking about his Astra CDi saloon.
    
    "The 'i' on the back of the car stands for important."
    
    - someone speaking about why they wouldn't want a non fuel-injected
    engine in their car.
    
    "I someone comes up behind me in a Cavalier, I check if they've got
    front fog-lamps. If they haven't, then they're not coming past me. If
    they have, and they've got headlight wash/wipe, then they're probably a
    GSi or a CDi, so I'll let them past. No-one comes past me in a base
    level car."
    
    - guy talking about his rules of the road. He was driving a Cavailier
    1.8i GLS I think.
    
    Hopefully they had to interview a *lot* of company car drivers before
    they could find enough idiots to fill this program, but then again...
    8-]
    
    Steve.
    

    Although I saw a few traits of myself in the prog, I also found it
    intensely embarrassing, and my wife got hugely wound up by the lack of
    women (unless they were specifically trying to only show utter prats).
    The co car drivers shown were all very much "reps" ie - 50,000 a year,
    live in the car, low base, high commission types. Without wishing to
    seem arrogant, they probably sell consumer products rather than high
    value capital stuff.
    
    However, in my former company we had a restrictive scheme and I
    recognised many of the behaviours - talking fleet into accepting that
    as small luxury car A was the same price as standard larger car B it
    was OK etc.
    
    What was rather worrying was the huge stupidity of some of the
    attitudes. The prat going on about "if the car closing behind has a red
    stripe or headlamp washers it must be an SRi so I'll pull over, if it
    hasn't I'll race it" was truely dangerous. And as for an XR2i
    portraying seniority ........!!!!!
    
    I have enjoyed the series upto Friday, but found something very sad in
    this one (other than a few insights into myself!). Like the man crying
    about getting a Maestro, or not wanting a prospective new boss to see
    his old car, or grading people by what hanger they use!
    
    Ho hum, back to posing in the Beemer, with no coat hanging up - EVER!
    
    Paul

    I was wondering how they put these programmes togother and think that
    maybe they video a lot of drivers and show the ones that have the most
    interesting/bizarre/idiotic views.
    
    When they started saying about the make of hanger they use to hang up
    their jackets, well...
    
    The case of the guy with the Maestro was very sad (he confessed to
    actually crying) but he never explained why he had to have it. Surely 
    he would know what car he is entitled to with his job.
    
    The percieved 'pecking' order was really childish. 
    
    It would have been interesting to hear from a lady company car driver
    but lady drivers had monopoly of the last programme and besides their
    views would probably be far too sensible :-)
    
    Royston (With an i on the back, Cavalier)
                                         ^

	I just thought to myself, no wonder the accident rate is so high if
these characters portrayed were typical.

	One guy seemed to spend all his driving time scratching his right ear,
another one seemed to spend a lot of time facing hard left - heaven only knows
what he was looking at!

	Several of them mentioned the importance of having an "i" on the back of
the car, none seemed as if they would know what to do if they had a Turbo
charged engine under the bonnet, it might not have an "i" then - what would they
say then?

	The programme didn't bring out anything about "no badges on the rear"
means base model only - especially on BMWs!  I was surprised about that
ommission.

				Malcolm.

    re-1
    
    There was a guy with a Mercedes (200 ?), who removed the badge from the
    rear so that people wouldn't know it was the base model.  
    
    I noticed that in one scene a police car pulled alongside and had a
    look in at what was going on.  And the number of people who drive
    without using seat belts!
    
    Mikef

    �The programme didn't bring out anything about "no badges on the rear"
    �means base model only - especially on BMWs!
    
    One of the guys  said that he removed the model number from the back
    of his BM or was it the Merc because he had a base model. This isn't
    necessarily the reason though as on these cars there is a 'no badge
    option'. I understand in Europe it is quite trendy to have de-badged
    cars, even top of the range.
    
    The fixation about the need for 'i' on the back was brought out by a
    number of drivers. It is obviously a 'thing' in the sales rep community.
    
    Royston                                                                 

    Ref - no belts
    
    There was a piece in the Radio Times or one of the Sunday mags about
    how they filmed it and many of the side and head on shots were filmed
    while the car was being towed (often on trailers) - hence no belts. 
    I wish they had insisted tho' as it gives a bad impression 
    
    I've also just seen the "book of the show" and the gent with the CDi
    Astra is "national business development manager for a large jam and
    preserves company"
    
    Paul

    The engine in my car is fuel injected but I'm quite glad I don't have
    an 'i' on the back after seeing the programme, especially if people
    know its a company car. However, I don't suppose I would have gone to
    time & effort of actually removing it if there was one.
    
    Why wasn't there mounting holes left exposed on that Merc where the
    badge came off, are they glued on?
    
    Andy
    
    

I often think it's a bit tedious that my car has `214SLi 16v' stuck on
the back of it, if nothing else it's a bit of a mouthful, besides, boasting
all those features does look a little silly on a 1.4 litre engine.

Still, it doesn't bother me so much that I intend to do anything about
it (and risk upsetting the leasing company) so I guess I can live with
it.

Chris.

    But Chris, they are there because the marketing boys at Rover realise
    the importance of "i" and 16v as status symbols. At least among the
    important 'rep' sector.
    
    Royston

Well I thought it was really too close to the mark for comfort. OK I don't 
rant about having an i on the badge but the general tone and content seemed 
not unheard of. Most of us get emotive about our cars. I know of Digits who 
have specified unbadged when they have had to move down an engine option. I 
know of Digits who would not take a job where they could not have another 
Volvo. The guy with the XR2i instead of a dull saloon sounded just like those 
Digits who choose Alfa-Romeos or MR2s.

I would accept that most of the sample was from lowish down the rep scale but 
what was being said sounded very familiar. I know I say those things - but 
using my own turn of phrase.

Why, I was racing a metro away from the lights only yesterday, until my wife 
told me that Saab drivers don't do that kind of thing - they know the Saab 
will win so why bother?

Andrew

I thought the saddest part of the programme was the guy who
thought that driving a Cavalier 2.0i told people you had
made it and that he'd sweat blood to get a Mazda 626. He
also said his dream car was a Calibra.

The guy with the Maestro mad me laugh, but then if someone 
told me I had a new car waiting for me, the first thing I'd
do is ask what it was!



	Ian

    .148�    option'. I understand in Europe it is quite trendy to have de-badged
    .148�    cars, even top of the range.
    
    In Germany BMW and MERCEDES take orders specifying 'No Model Number' as
    an extra.

    I removed the `2.0i' part from my Cavalier when I had one, leaving just
    the `L'. I thought it would make it less nick-able. I also refused to
    accept an XR2i as a take-over car.
    
    Phil Gill.

    To be fair to the young guy in the XR2i, he much preferred the option
    of getting this 'sporty' car than the run of the mill cavalier L and
    good luck to him. I think his manager or fleet manager are crazy to let
    him have it as its a very nickable 'mota' though.
    
    I was also struck by the number of guys who appeared to change their
    companies car policy very easily. Already mentioned was here is the guy
    with the xr2i. There was also the guy who had the BMW when he should
    have had a Merc, the guy who had the rushed to see his fleet manager to
    get an Astra CDi (saloon) after having an orgasm from seeing an advert 
    for one.
    
    This discussion must be getting to me. This morning I found myself
    looking at cars to see if there was an "i" on the back !
    
    Royston

Was that an i for Important or Idiot?

    
    ..Ignorant ?? (of what the i meant)  %^)
    
    

    ... or Innocent

	How about an eye on the back?


			  i   i
		     i		   i
		  i	     i	       i
		i	   i o i	  i
		   i	     i		i
		      i		    i
			  i    i


				Malcolm.

Patrick

Should that have been Inoccenti? (apologies for the mis-spelling)

Mike

    could that have been "immature"?
    
    brian
    
    

    Chaps,
    
    For those of you with french TV there is a fascinating programme on TF1
    tonight at around 22:40 (but check)
    
    It's about a mountain pass in the Andes where the locals make little
    bogies (engineless go-carts) from bits of wood and roller bearings and
    they hitch a tow up the mountain by holding onto the lorries going up.
    They then freewheel back down at breakneck (literally) speed overtaking
    the lorries on blind corners. Needless to say the life expectancy is
    not long!
    
    They scrape a living by collecting tips from drivers by helping change
    punctured tyres, collecting anything that drops off the back and general
    scavenging.
    
    It's much better than I've described it and will leave a lasting
    impression on anyone who sees it.
    
    Peter 
    
    

    Saw Inside Story last night about the police investigating and
    repossessing stolen cars that had been 'ringed'.
    
    Its a great shame they didn't spend more time saying how you can avoid
    buying a ringed car.
    
    Mind you that Granada looked very dodgy. It was '92 model on an F
    plate. I'm sure the buyer was in the know or should have been concerned
    that it was too good to be true.
    
    It was heart breaking that these people had to just let there cars be
    driven away with virtually zero chance of seeing them again. Even the
    people who had the cars stolen lost out because of insurance payouts
    of less than the cost of the vehicle (in one case a women had the car
    stolen after one week and got a payout of less than 2 grand from what 
    she paid).
    
    There must be something more that can be done to prevent this.
    
    It left me fuming and I for one will be very diligent when buying
    a used car in the future. 
    
    Royston
           

    Roy,
    
    Buy 2nd hand cars from Auction. The only risk is mechanical.  The
    auction house is liable if the car you buy is stolen or has outstanding
    HP.  
    
    Huw.

    The stroy of the guy going through the floor was amazing.
    
    Then the stuff they found in that shed(?) thing, all the dashboards and
    speedo's.  The guy was identifying all the stuff, 92 BX dashbaorad,
    Vauxhall speedo, he went on to say it was 4 door, I was amazed he can
    tell a 4 door car from the speedo !, only then did they show the 4
    doors and the boot lid of a carlton coming out !
    
    Then they had the Carlton owner on at the end, "The insurance fell
    through, the premuim was lost in the post" sounds a bit dodgy to me !!
    
    Dave D.

    Does anyone out there know what Anneka Rice drives around in. It looks
    as if it should be Range Rover based, and perhaps come from the Jago
    stable?
    
    Andy (not that I watch Challenge Anneka of course...)

Looking for your next company car then, Andy?

Chris.

    It's a kit based, as you say, on the Range Rover - the Dakar 4x4.
    
    It's more or less just a body swap (a bit more to it than that, yes,
    but not a complicated piece of kit). The 4x4 kits go for something
    around �5000 if I remember rightly, complete. There are starter kits
    which give you just the body, etc....
    
    Alternatively there's a natty Cortina-based model, considerably cheaper
    to put on the road, bot obviosuly only 2-wheel drive and less able off
    the road - the Rotrax.

    Heres a quick TV car question.
    
    To settle an argument in the office - what was the make and model of
    Jim Rockford's car in the Rockford Files ?
    
    I've got an idea, what do you think.
    
    Thanks
    
    Royston

    Was it a GMC ?
    
    Dan$used to have a toy of one that looked similar, and THAT was a GMC
    somethingorother.

    Wasn't it a rather beat up, brown Pontiac Trans Am !
    
    Rgds
    Chris
    

    I think you are both right (Isn't a trans am a GMC car ?).
    
    The concensus here was that it was a gold coloured Trans Am.
    
    Were there different types of Trams Am in the Seventies ?
    
    I seem to recall a black Trans Am Firebird in 'Smokey and the Bandit'
    
    Royston

    From a North American..... :-)
    
    The Pontiac division of GM makes both the Firebird and the Trans-Am. 
    The Trans-Am is a Firebird with all the goodies like spoilers and such. 
    You could get a Firebird with the same performance as the Trans-Am but
    without the "good" looks.....
    
    As to Rockford's car.....it was a Firebird, gold in colour.
    
    Brian
    

    Brian, thanks for clarifying that. That answers it nicely.

Brings back memorys....My brother had a red Firebird (with the firebird logo
on the bonnet).  6.6 litres, that was an engine!


..Craig

    Anyone see the thing on BBC 2 last night, around 10:10pm I think, about
    the original Mk.1 Golf GTi.
    
    It's a series going on about modern classics, I think.
    
    Next week it's the Fiat 500 :-).
    
    It's quite good. Sort of a top gear affair, but concentrating on one
    car and lots of views from owners/clubs/the designers, etc.
    
    The only downside is Quentin Wilson hosts it. Or at least he did last
    night.
    
    Cheers,
    Dan

    Yup. Good programme but Quentin is a complete arse....
    How can they let someone who doesn't appreciate classics host this
    prog. Could do it better myself....
    			vic.
    Ps I have a 1968 Triumph Spitfire, a 1980 Triumph Dolomite Sprint and
    a 1983 Saab 900 Turbo wouldn't swap any for a new motor... unless it
    was a Porsche 911 turbo of the new ilk.

    It's the second series of "The Car's The Star", and is again presented
    by Dracula.
    
    Phil Gill.

I think Quentin Wilson's a decent enough sort of presenter, even if
he does have more than a passing resemblance to a vampire.

Chris.