Conference terri::cars_uk

    Cross posted without permission from RACERS :-
    
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Note 943.6                          Indy 1993                            6 of 14
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Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: [email protected] (Bob Kehoe)
Subject: '93 Indycar TV schedule
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 01:03:06 GMT
 
* All times listed are Eastern
** Air dates and times subject to change
 
March 21 - Australia - ABC - 2-4pm
April 4 - Phoenix - ABC - 4-6pm
April 18 - Long Beach - ABC - 4-6pm
May 15/16 - Indy Qualifying - ABC/ESPN - (no time)
May 22/23 - Indy Qualifying - ABC/ESPN - (no time)
May 30 - Indy - ABC - 11am-3:30pm
June 6 - Milwaukee - ABC - 1-3pm
June 13 - Belle Isle - ABC - 3-5:30pm
June 27 - Portland - ESPN - 4-6:30pm
July 11 - Cleveland - ABC - 1:30-3:30pm
July 18 - Toronto - ABC - 4-6pm
August 1 - Michigan - ABC - 2-5pm
August 8 - Loudon - ESPN - 3:30-5:30pm
August 22 - Road America - ESPN - 2-4:30pm
August 30 - Vancouver, BC - ESPN - 9-11pm
September 12 - Mid-Ohio - ESPN - 1-3:30pm
September 20 - Nazareth - ESPN - 9-11pm
October 3 - Laguna Seca - ESPN - 9-11pm
================================================================================
    
    
    I believe the ITV will be showing the races (I don't think any will be
    live).
    
    Shaun.

    
    
    Screensport have signed an exclusive contract for the Indy series
    and will show all the races live.
    
    I don't know if ITV will be showing highlights....
    

From what I remember, .2 is right. Screensport has an exclusive live deal
for the Indy series, but I think the Indianapolis 500 isn't a "part" of
the series, and I think ITV havebought the live rights for that. Screensport
have already advertised the opening race live from Australia.

Whether this will change with the merger of Eurosport and Screensport
remains to be seen....

Peter.

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Note 943.6                          Indy 1993                            6 of 12
WFOV12::DOBOSZ_M                                     26 lines   4-JAN-1993 16:03
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Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport
From: [email protected] (Bob Kehoe)
Subject: '93 Indycar TV schedule
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1992 01:03:06 GMT
 
* All times listed are Eastern
** Air dates and times subject to change
 
March 21 - Australia - ABC - 2-4pm
April 4 - Phoenix - ABC - 4-6pm
April 18 - Long Beach - ABC - 4-6pm
May 15/16 - Indy Qualifying - ABC/ESPN - (no time)
May 22/23 - Indy Qualifying - ABC/ESPN - (no time)
May 30 - Indy - ABC - 11am-3:30pm
June 6 - Milwaukee - ABC - 1-3pm
June 13 - Belle Isle - ABC - 3-5:30pm
June 27 - Portland - ESPN - 4-6:30pm
July 11 - Cleveland - ABC - 1:30-3:30pm
July 18 - Toronto - ABC - 4-6pm
August 1 - Michigan - ABC - 2-5pm
August 8 - Loudon - ESPN - 3:30-5:30pm
August 22 - Road America - ESPN - 2-4:30pm
August 30 - Vancouver, BC - ESPN - 9-11pm
September 12 - Mid-Ohio - ESPN - 1-3:30pm
September 20 - Nazareth - ESPN - 9-11pm
October 3 - Laguna Seca - ESPN - 9-11pm

RE: .3

>>Whether this will change with the merger of Eurosport and Screensport
>>remains to be seen....

Peter, do you have any details on this? 

-Steve, who gets Eurosport piped in, but not ScreenSport.

Screensport used to be owned by WHSTV (A W H Smith subsiduary,) but was flogged
off a couple of years ago to its management. It did a tie up with ESPN, the
US based sports channel.

When Sky pulled out of Eurosport a couple of years back, it was rescued by
TF1 (or some other French station). [Hence the french accents on the link ups!]

Now, the French are going to set up a channel with more of a French slant,
and are also talking about splitting into more regional channells, with
seperate feeds for the cable and satellite bits.

From what I remember of the IHT printing, satellite viewers should end up
with more choice, but cable viewers may be worse off. One example was that
a major US or European event might be displaced on the local cable feed
by a French 2nd division football game, as it had more local interest.

The merger is supposed to happen on March 1st, so we should find out soon.

Peter.

    Re .2 �Screensport have signed an exclusive contract
    
    Is Screensport free or do you have to pay monthly to receive it ?
    
    Roy
    
    

    Roy
    
    Screensport is still free at the moment, it's only skysport that you
    need to subscribe to.
    
    Sharon

It looks as if Screensport will "go away" after its "merger" with Eurosport.

It looks as if the middle of march will see these two channels coming 
together, and quite possibly one of the transponders on Astra will be
sold on to a German channell (similar to what happened with Lifestyle).

I notice both channels are still advertising their "exclusive" Indy/F1
race coverage, though, so it could easily change.

Peter.

And yes, at the moment, they are both free.

    I read the excellent article in the Sunday Times supplement about Nigel
    Mansell and it mentioned that ITV would be covering the indy car racing
    and that he would be presenting it.
     
    This ties in with an earlier note that said ITV would be showing
    highlights. However, I can't see anything in this weekends TV guide
    that shows any coverage apart from satellite.
    
    Does  anyone know more about this ?
    
    Roy

    It's on either Tue or Wed next week at about 12:30 (pass midnight)
    
    Last week at the same time there was a preview of the season explaining
    the rules & regs, differences in Indy from F1 etc.
    
    Ian.

    Watched the Surfers Paradise race last night on Eurosport/ESPN. Easy
    win for Nigel who started from pole position.
    
    1. Mansell
    2. Fittipaldi
    3. Gordon
    
    I was a bit disappointed by the circuit which looks like Macau. A
    couple of long straights joined by fairly slow corners and chicanes.
    Boring circuit. Everyone were using very little ailerons/wings to
    preserve top speed causing the cars to jump on slow speed bumps like
    F3's.
    
    Waiting for a real road circuit.

    
    	Mansell seemed somewhat 'overjoyed'(as he should be !!).
    
    The commentary shown in the UK (Eurosport) seemed rather disapointing.
    Everytime we returned after a commercial break it seemed that the lead
    had changed hands again. Mansell seemed to make his 3 ? pit stops
    earlier than everyone else and as a result 'appeared' to run out of
    fuel on the slowing down lap (he stopped out on the circuit, then did
    the now familiar limp to the course vehicle. In fact it was good to see
    that he enjoyed himself. Nothing changes though ...
    
    	He limped heavily from the car at the end -
    	He launched his gloves into the crowd -
    	The car ran perfectly except for -
    		clutch problems,  fuel problems , and Mansells 'cramp'
                
    
    Nice one Nige. 
    
    (There's a shorter highlights program scheduled for today (Eurosport
    4pm - UK) .I'll try and get it taped and then I may be able to
    understand the real issues of the race.
    
    Rob
    

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Note 943.23                         Indy 1993                           23 of 23
WFOV12::DOBOSZ_M                                    104 lines  21-MAR-1993 21:42
                            -< very impressive... >-
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From: [email protected] (JOE WALSH)
Subject: Mansell wins IndyCar debut
Date: Sun, 21 Mar 93 10:47:21 PST
 
	SURFERS PARADISE, Australia (UPI) -- Nigel Mansell, the reigning
Formula One champion making his IndyCar debut, sputtered across the
finish line with just enough fuel to win the Australian Grand Prix
Sunday in record-setting fashion.
	Finishing 5.1 seconds ahead of defending champion Emerson Fittipaldi,
Mansell drove a Lola T93-06 Ford Cosworth for the Newman-Haas team
throguh the streets of the resort area of Surfers Paradise. Fittipaldi,
in a Penske-Chevy, finished about a half-second ahead of Robbie Gordon
in third place.
	``The last 25 laps were very tough,'' Mansell said. ``My right foot
was getting cramps and I was having to pay attention to the fuel. I was
having to manage the car more than I've ever done before,'' he said.
	After Mansell crossed the line, his car ran out of fuel and came to a
stop in front of a large group of cheering supporters waving British
Union Jack flags, and, limping from his car, threw his gloves and fire-
proof balaclava to the fans.
	``I was very concerned about fuel,'' Mansell said. ``On the last lap
coming through the fast chicane, the car started to cough and splutter.
I just kept it in fourth gear around all the second-gear turns and
literally just limped home.
	The Englishman quit Formula One last year after the breakdown of
contract negotiations with the Williams team. He became the second
person to win his IndyCar debut, and the first to win on a road circuit.
The late Graham Hill won the Indianapolis 500 in 1966 in his only race
on the circuit.
	There were no full-course yellow flags during the 181.7-mile (292-
kilometer)race, which Mansell won in one hour, 52 minutes and 2.886
seconds at a race record average speed of 97.284 mph (156.563 km-h).
	Mansell Saturday had become the first rookie to claim pole position
on a road circuit in his first race.
	``We got some close driving and tactics, and everything was clean and
fair,'' he said. ``I enjoyed it. I can't remember the last time I
enjoyed racing like that, It was very, very good.''
	His inexperience with a rolling start showed up at the start when the
Penske cars of Fittipaldi and Paul Tracey, starting second and third,
outgunned him into the first corner.
	Gordon squeezed by on the back straight, knocking Mansell back to
fourth after the first lap.
	``I broke coming out of the corner (behind the pace car) and they
just got the jump on me, and that was it, the race was on,'' Mansell
said.
	He sat in fourth for five laps, then moved to third when Tracy pulled
into the pits with electrical problems. He passed Gordon under brakes on
lap seven to move into second place then began his chase of Fittipaldi,
passing the Brazilian in a late braking maneuver with all wheels locked
on lap 15.
	However, he was black-flagged for passing Fittipaldi under a yellow
flag and was given a stop-and-go penalty, which he served on lap 19 when
the team called him in for a regular pit stop to change tires and add
fuel.
	Fittipaldi took over the lead but relinquished it to Mansell when he
made a scheduled pit stop on lap 21.
	Mansell brushed the wall on lap 29, damaging a tire, and pitted for a
new set on lap 30 when the Brazilian again took over the lead, which he
held until his second pit stop on lap 44.
	Mansell again inherited the lead, having passed Gordon into second
place the previous lap, and began to increase his lead to 30 seconds by
lap 53 when he pitted for a ``splash and go'' refuelling stop which gave
him just enough fuel to make the finish after 65 laps.
	Mansell's teammate, Mario Andretti, finished fourth, with Arie
Luyendyk fifth and defending Indy Car champion Bobby Rahal sixth in his
new RH001 car.
	``It's a good start for the season considering the trouble we had
during practice and qualifying,'' Rahal said. ``The car actually worked
pretty well in the race ... we know we have some work to do, both in the
chassis and the engine, but I feel good about our potential.''
	Mansell scored 20 points for winning plus one point for his pole
position, and missed by one lap an additional point for most laps led,
which went to Fittipaldi.

From: [email protected] (Joe Murphy)
Subject: Indycar Australia Final Qualifying
Date: Sat, 20 Mar 1993 20:03:20 GMT
 
  1  5  Nigel Mansell          Lola T93/Ford XB              98.555 102.095*
  2  4  Emerson Fittipaldi     Penske Chevy 93/Chevy V8/C    98.882 101.758
  3 12  Paul Tracy             Penske Chevy 93/Chevy V8/C    99.171 101.461
  4 14  Robby Gordon           Lola T92/Ford XB              99.435 101.192
  5 10  Arie Luyendyk          Lola T93/Ford XB              99.635 100.989
  6  6  Mario Andretti         Lola T93/Ford XB              99.739 100.883
  7  2  Scott Goodyear         Lola T93/Chevy V8/C          100.127 100.492
  8  9  Raul Boesel            Lola T93/Ford XB             100.488 100.131
  9 18  Jimmy Vasser           Lola T92/Chevy V8/A          100.645  99.975
 10 22  Scott Brayton          Lola T93/Ford XB             100.980  99.643
 11 25  Mark Smith             Penske 92/Chevy V8/B         100.992  99.631
 12  8  Teo Fabi               Lola T93/Chevy V8/C          101.066  99.558
 13  1  Bobby Rahal            R/H-001/Chevy V8/C           101.096  99.529
 14  3  Al Unser Jr.           Lola T93/Chevy V8/C          101.180  99.446
 15 40  Roberto Guerrero       Lola T93/Chevy V8/C          101.481  99.151
 16 69  Eddie Cheever          Penske 92/Chevy V8/B         101.848  98.797
 17 19  Robbie Buhl            Lola T92/Chevy V8/A          103.311  97.395
 18 16  Stefan Johansson       Penske 93/Chevy V8/C         103.908  96.835
 19 42  Andrea Chiesa          Lola T91/Cosworth DFS        103.985  96.782
 20 90  Gary Brabham           Lola T92/Chevy V8/A          104.351  96.424
 21  7  Danny Sullivan         Lola T93/Chevy V8/C          104.958  95.866
 22 39  Ross Bentely           Lola T92/Chevy V8/A          105.213  95.634
 23 50  Andrea Montermini      Lola T92/Chevy V8/A          106.224  94.724
 24 15  Hiro Matsushita        Lola T93/Ford XB             106.342  94.619
 25 20  Buddy Lazier           Lola T91/Chevy V8/A          106.970  94.063
 26 30  Marco Greco            Lola T92/Chevy V8/A          108.068  93.108
    

re .12 (I think) - I agree the Eurosport coverage was very poor indeed.

Last season, Screensport was using the ESPN feed direct, with the American
commentators, but the Eurosport common tatie had no idea what was going on.
He seemed to be reading from a script.

The coverage was cut to pieces, and didn't include any pit lane stuff,interveiws
or close ups. The black flag for Mansell mentioned in .-1 was never mentioned
at all! 

I hope it gets better with the live coverage of the U.S. races...

Peter.

    Also the Eurosport guy, on a number of occasions, started to say
    something get side tracked and didn't return to the original subject.
    Like the one about Nigel having car number 5!

I watched the race yesterday on AMerican TV and was impressed by Nigel's 
performance. He has a fine car, just as Michael Andretti had last year, and he 
made the most of it. The thing that impressed me most was his smoothness. When he 
was chasing Emerson Fittipaldi down, passed and led, it was interesting to compare 
the styles - Emmo is quite smooth, but Nigel seems even smoother. He would use the 
curbs less and did not appear to "twitch" as much as Emmo. He showed that he 
understands "car management" with the best and it was an impressive performance. 
He's sure to win a few more as the season progresses. It will be interesting to 
see him of the 1-mile Phoenix oval in two weeks. He's sure to be fast and Mario 
will help him get the car right. In traffic he'll have a bit to learn but he's 
smart - and a racer.

One last comment: the TV guys said that there were more - some 800 total - 
accrediated jounalists at Surfer's Paradise, more than any other Indycar event 
save the Indy 500. Nige has certainly raised the interest level in Indycars and 
that alone may be worth his salary. I'd say he's earned his keep.

Paul 

                <<< Note 2009.17 by DVOPAS::WADERS::malkoski >>>
                             -< Nige in Australia >-

I watched the race yesterday on AMerican TV and was impressed by Nigel's 
performance. He has a fine car, just as Michael Andretti had last year, and he 
made the most of it. The thing that impressed me most was his smoothness. When 
he was chasing Emerson Fittipaldi down, passed and led, it was interesting to 
compare the styles - Emmo is quite smooth, but Nigel seems even smoother. He 
would use the curbs less and did not appear to "twitch" as much as Emmo. He 
showed that he understands "car management" with the best and it was an 
impressive performance. He's sure to win a few more as the season progresses. 
It will be interesting to see him of the 1-mile Phoenix oval in two weeks. 
He's sure to be fast and Mario will help him get the car right. In traffic 
he'll have a bit to learn but he's smart - and a racer.

One last comment: the TV guys said that there were more - some 800 total - 
accrediated jounalists at Surfer's Paradise, more than any other Indycar event 
save the Indy 500. Nige has certainly raised the interest level in Indycars and 
that alone may be worth his salary. I'd say he's earned his keep.

Paul 

    Nice move [.18] & an interesting note [.17], Paul.
    
    I'd love to be able to see the whole of the race but, alas, highlights
    are all I'll be watching until Eurosport get their act together. Paul,
    in your opinion, what (if any) team orders are there regarding Mansell
    overtaking Andretti & v.v. ?
    
    Mike

In the opening laps, after Mansell dropped back a few places Mario
was right on his tail for a for corners.  Nigel did a little darting
across the straight to prevent Mario from tucking under him while
braking for the next turn.  It didn't look like Mario got along side
or anything, Nigel just did a little weaving to keep Mario behind
him.

Seeing that, there are two things to conclude - 

1) no team orders about passing each other 
2) team orders to allow passing, but Nigel ignored them

I would think that the most important team orders for early on in a race
would be for them *not* to take each other out in a corner.  

Dave 

    Can only figure that my Mac/Notes software stuck the second entry
    online. Hmmmm?
    
    I don't believe that teams operate the same in Indycars as they do in
    F1. While Nige and Mario are on the same team, the team does not score
    points the way, say, Williams, scores points. In other words, there is
    no team championship. Thus you will often see team members racing each
    other for position. If Mario could have gotten by Nige, I'd bet he
    would have tried. Nige did a masterful job controlling Mario while he
    pulled himself together and consolidated his place. Shortly after,
    there was no contest. Nige pulled away. He looked so smooth.
    
    The Penske cars certainly looked quick as well, and I wonder how much
    fuel mileage considerations may have played in Emmo's race management.
    Emmo said after the race that he was frustrated by the fact that all
    the computer read outs said he did not have the fuel to make the race
    if he continued to run as hard as he was. That was true late in the
    race, but I don't know if it affected his early race strategy. Most of
    the teams running the Chevy C were concerned about fuel consumption.
    Early in the race, however, when Nige can up to Emmo to challenge for
    the lead, Nige looked smoother. And I always thought that Emmo was a
    pretty smooth driver!
    
    All in all a pretty entertaining race. Low attrition, and position
    racing, a good crowd and a beautiful day. WHat more could you ask for?
    
    Paul
     

RE: .17

IndyCars hold about 30 gallons of fuel and CART gives them enough fuel to last 
the race distance plus the parade laps, if they are burning 1.8 miles to the 
gallon.  If you work the math through, this puts the "windows" for the two pit 
stops at about laps 22-25 and somewhere around lap 40 or so.

When Mansell made that magnificent pass on Emmo to take the lead on lap 15 (the 
one where he was smoking all 4 tyres and was almost locked up), he 
unfortunately did so at a corner that was under a yellow flag.  Nigel was 
black-flagged for a stop-and-go penalty, and reported to his pit on lap 19.  
This was close enough to the normal pit stop window that the team did a normal 
fuel-and-tyres pit stop on the car.  Perfectly legal--as a CART official 
explained in the American coverage, the officials assess the penalty by calling 
the car to the pits and requiring it to stop before proceeding.  If the team 
decides to service the car at the same time, that's their business.

It was lucky for Nigel that the infraction occurred as close to a normal pit 
stop at it did.  Even so, it did put his normal pit stop schedule out of whack, 
so that the team had to go with a fuel-and-go (no tyre change) on the last 
stop.  Also, Nigel left about 2 gallons of fuel (nearly a lap's worth) in the 
hose.  Fortunately for Nige, Team Penske was also in fuel trouble--the new 
Chevy C engine was only getting 1.9 miles/gallon, not 1.8, so they didn't have 
enough fuel to last out the race, either.  Emmo had to turn down the turbo 
boost, slow down, and short-shift to conserve fuel so that he'd finish the 
race.  There was thus no way he could mount a challenge to Nige in the last 
laps, and it was all he could do to hold off Robby Gordon.  I thought Nigel 
managed his own fuel crisis very well.  Carl Haas almost swallowed his cigar a 
couple of years ago when both Andrettis lost a promising race finish by running 
out of fuel on the last lap.

About the only IndyCar quirk that Nigel didn't have to contend with in this 
race was a full-course yellow and the subsequent restart.  It was refreshing to 
see an IndyCar race run under the green flag throughout.  I hope this is a sign 
of good things to come--IMO, CART has used full-course yellows overzealously on 
road courses and street circuits in the past.

--PSW

>>    All in all a pretty entertaining race. Low attrition, and position
>>    racing, a good crowd and a beautiful day. WHat more could you ask for?
    
    A good commentator ?
    
    I've never heard anyone a dull as the character who was commentating on
    Screen Sport.  It makes you really appreciate Muddle Walkem.
    
    Shaun.
    

re .23;

Screensport "merged" with Eurosport, in much the same way as BSB merged
with Sky.

We now suffer all the times in CET, with French commentators often speaking
bad (and heavily accented) English.

I can't wait to see what they do with the Baseball (if of course they
still show it!)

Peter.

    Briefly, is Eurosport now a subscription channel ?. The reason I ask is
    because it is not yet available on Cable.

    Changing track, for those interested, there are articles in this month's 
    New Scientist that include analyses on how top class racing drivers 
    'corner' most effectively; how only a few learn to take the optimum 
    route through corners (of any comparable track); and how banked corners 
    invariably cause inexperienced drivers to misjudge the turn-in angle. 
    There is a lot of emphasis on CART racing, and a very interesting 
    article on the safety measures (or lack of them...) that prevail at Oval
    circuits.  
    
    Mike
        

    re:.24 Screensport
    
    A pity about them going, the new owners (bought the company about
    18months ago) decided that there wasn't enough space for two channels,
    also they couldn't afford some of the better programs and Sky had
    better funding. If the quality of the service on Feb 26th was a little 
    lacking it's because the leaving do started at lunchtime, noone was
    really interested in working. 200 people lost their jobs that day, very
    sad.
    
    Nigel (ex Screensport)

    
    Meridian is showing highlights of the race at half past midnight
    
    
    POL.

Re: .25

>    Briefly, is Eurosport now a subscription channel ?. The reason I ask is
>    because it is not yet available on Cable.

No, it's not - but for how long I don't know.

�    Meridian is showing highlights of the race at half past midnight
    
    I take that to be ITV, Meridian - as I had seen adverts for
    ITV (Carlton) stating that they would be covering it too.
    
    Same time, 12:30 am, half-past midnight tonight.
    
    J.R.

    
    ITV ( I believe all regions) are screening highlights of this seasons
    Indy season. This program is scheduled weekly.. for example last night
    it concentrated on the highlights from Surfers Paradise, next Tuesday
    it is meant to be concentrating on Mansells view of the race plus a
    preview of the next race. This I presume will be the format for the
    rest of the season..ie  highlights, Mansells review, Preview.
    
    Rob
    

    Well I stayed up last night to watch this. BTW it was a Carlton
    production for ITV.
    
    I thought the TV coverage was terrible with most of the pictures either
    blurred of out of focus. The editing required to get the action into
    half and hour (more like 20 mins after Ad's etc) destroyed any sense of
    excitement.
    
    Nicky Horne provided addtional voice overs to mention the black flag
    situation, (why didn't the original comentators mention this, or was
    that edited out as well) which again spoilt things.
    
    There was no post race interviews or analysis. Apparently we have to
    wait until next week for that.
    
    All in all I was very disapointed and the exciting race I had read and
    heard about bore no resemblence to the one on TV last night.
    
    Makes you realise how good the BBC coverage and presentation is.
    
    Ian.

    
    
    .....Long live Murray Walker ;-)
    

re.31:

I agree with Ian, very disappointing, I'm glad I recorded it and watched this
morning over breakfast.

Dave.

    If you're in the Meridian area... tough luck (in general that is...
    nothing particular to do with the programme mentioned in previous
    notes) !
    
    
    Er, but to be serious... The Indy programme thing is repeated Saturday 
    afternoons (handy if you haven't got a vcr and can't be bothered
    staying up; I myself have a vcr, but it only seems to work on "American
    Gladiators".)
    
    Reargards,
    
    Stephen

    Well, I caught it by accident -- having had our node changed (ouch!)
    and all the turmoil that can bring, I missed all the previous
    notes pointing to the ITV showing of "Nigel Mansell's IndyCar
    Season", or something like that. Made in association with the 
    outfit that have their logo on his crash helmet.
    
    Is it his company? He seems to be a pretty smart operator, as well
    as mean racing driver.
    
    In the past, the only IndyCar stuff I have seen has been -- to my
    eyes -- rather dissapointing oval 'races'. Therefore, the Surfers
    Paradise Mansell triumph was a pleasant suprise.
    
    At least we saw some racing, some overtaking. The lead changing hands.
    Nobody seemed to be taking anybody else out, etc.
    
    Mansell, although happier than we've ever seen him before, still
    manages to moan about something, doesn't he. The archetypal
    whinging pom?
    
    Anyway, no wonder the F1 powers-that-be are seeking to change
    things for their branch of the sport. InyCar -- spearheaded
    by Sir Nigel (only a matter of time, now) -- could threaten to
    sweep it away...
    
    
    terry B

> still manages to moan about something, doesn't he.

I must have missed that, could you remind me?

Dave.

    
    Seems like a few letters regarding Eurosports Indy coverage arrived at
    the offices of Autosport.  Even the guy that did the commentary, Brian
    Sims (I thought he knew about Indy cars ???) has got a letter published
    stating at the end that ' Things can only improve !'
    
    They can't get worse !!!!
    
    Rob

    RE:-2
    
    The CEEFAX (BBC tv teletext system) report, Mansell mentioned his foot,
    the car, the fuel, etc., etc.,
    
    I suppose my problem with our Nige is his lack of modesty. To be fair
    to him, he his a very competitive personality and, rather than say
    things like "the team prepared the car well and made good use of the
    time penalty I incurred", he will nearly always reveal a problem he had
    to contend with during the race. This then, of course, makes his
    victory -- against the odds -- seem all the more impressive.
    
    If you delve into previous conferences that pertain to F1, you will see
    that people grow tired of his 'moaning'.
    
    However. Excellent drive. Excellent victory. And on balance, I wouldn't
    have him any other way. (ooh-er)
    
    Terry B.
    
    

	I wouldn't have him any other way either, from the 20 minutes
	of badly cut, out of focus racing I video taped it looked as
	if it would have been good to watch live.  However, I wonder
	how he'll do in oval circuits?  After all, the race was 
	rather in the format (apart from some puzzling rules) of
	an F1 race.

	Dave

    In the preview program 2 Tuesdays ago, one of the experienced oval
    drivers said that Mansell drove the ovals like a pro. The program also
    mentioned how he had broken the lap record during testing by .2 seconds
    on 'hard' tyres. The previous record had apparently been set on 'soft'
    tyres.
    
    As a non Mansell fan I was quite impressed by the performance last week
    and the compliments heaped on him by the established Indy drivers.
    
    Come on lets show these Yanks how it should be done :-)
    
    Ian.
     

    One item that no one has commented on is the fact that Nigel had to
    deal with a manual gearbox for the first time in a race since 198x? 
    How many years has hee been using the semi-automatic boxes?  From the
    in-car shots you could hear his dowshifts into the turns and his
    sequence of downshifts sounded pretty good.  Granted, I'm sure he
    hasn't forgotten how to drive a manual tranny car, but re-applying that
    technique to racing after so many years away from it might be difficult
    for some.
    
    Dave

	A dumb question: is Mansell's car a turbo?  He did after
	all learn F1 in a turbo (at least his wheel smoking late
	braking)...

	Dave

    Mansell's Lola is lightly turbo-charged 2.65 litre Cosworth unit that
    puts out around 700bhp - which is roughly the same as an F1 [3.5 litre]
    engine; the torque curve is broader & flatter . Indy cars are on
    average 500kg heavier than their F1 equivalents, making them less
    accelerative. 

    Mike.

RE: .40

Short-track oval racing is a different kettle of fish than road racing.  Sheer 
speed is not the most important factor.  The whole track is only 1 mile long, 
so after a few laps the cars get spaced out more or less evenly across the 
entire course.  Just about the whole race is spent in traffic.  There isn't any 
passing under braking (the usual way on a road course) because there isn't any 
braking.  Gettng a proper line into and out of the corners is the key, and you 
have to be careful because it's very easy to pass somebody only to get passed 
back 1/2 lap later.  There's also the strategy of timing of pit stops and also 
there's invariably at least 1 full-course yellow in an oval race (necessary for 
safety reasons--if some car drops debris or fluid on the track, it has to be 
cleaned up, and it can't be unless they bring the pace car out).  One aspect of 
IndyCar racing that Mansell hasn't yet had to deal with is a full-course yellow 
and the subsequent rolling restart.

I'm sure Nige will do well on ovals--a top-rank racer will do well in any form 
of racing.  I don't expect him to have as easy a time of it at Phoenix as he 
did at Surfer's Paradise.

--PSW

    .43�    average 500kg heavier than their F1 equivalents, making them less
    
    Mike, you mean 500lbs (250kg in fact). Minimum weight in Indycar is
    750kg vs 500 in F1 (+ 5kg for the videocamera and transmitter). This is
    50% more than F1.
    
    In addition to weight, Indycar does not allow all the aerodynamics
    tricks that F1s have, nor the carbon disc brakes. Indycars have lower 
    cornering speeds and longer braking distances. They're much faster in
    straights (or ovals). 

    Sorry, yes I did mean 500lbs. Regarding cornering speeds, I would have
    thought that despite their weight & modestly dimensioned tyres,
    Indycars would have comparable cornering speeds [to F1 cars] by virtue
    of their venturi tunnels. Rumour has it that venturis and/or stepped
    undertrays will be brought back into F1 - a precursor to Oval racing ?

    Mike
    

RE: .45

Regarding aerodynamics, the situation is opposite of what you describe.  
IndyCars are allowed (within limits) venturi tunnels under the chassis, and 
other things that are banned in F1.  The lower cornering speeds are almost 
entirely due to the extra weight--they are 50% heavier than a F1 car, with 
engines of about the same power.

--PSW

But surely on the ovals (even the 1 mile ones) the
indycars corner at higher speeds? Given average speeds
of over 170mph, they must be cornering faster than
most things in F1?

From the photos they look to carry a lot more wing and 
then they do not have a flat underbody rule like in F1,
they must  get a hell of a lot of downforce to stick to
the ground at Indianapolis doing 225+. 

Just thinking

Terry

    re .48
    
    Banking
    
    Dave

RE: .48

Yes, on ovals, they turn at much higher speeds than F1.  There is actually less 
stress on equipment and drivers, though, because the G-forces involved are 
lower (no massive deceleration then acceleration as in F1) even though the 
actual cornering speed is higher.  As .-1 mentions, banking is very important 
on the ovals.  The cars run with extremely little wing at Indy and Michegan, so 
there's as little drag as possible, allowing as high a speed as possible.  
Banking makes up for most of the loss of downforce.

--PSW

    This brings up the question....just what is the top speeds seen at
    Indy on the fastest sections of track. Is this faster then say the old
    Mulsanne straight at Le Mans, before they slowed it down? 

    
    I seem to recall top speeds on the Mulsanne of around 240mph in the
    last few years before the chicanes were added. That would have to put
    it about on a par with Indy speeds....
    
    Terry
    

    Okay, so what do we know about Ph�nix ?
    
    More so, who'll be the drivers to watch: who are the oval-meisters
    as-it-were ?. 
    
    Failing that, any good stories from 'pit-lane & paddock' a la Eoin
    (pronounced Moanin) Young ?.
    
    Mike (basically throw any scraps of info my way)

Phoenix International Raceway is a high-banked, 1-mile long oval track.  The 
race will be for 200 laps.  This is the fastest of the short ovals on the 
IndyCar championship circuit.  We can expect lap speeds in excess of 180mph. 
Drivers who I would expect to do particularly well here are Bobby Rahal (if he 
gets the car dialed in properly), Emmo, Mario, and Scott Goodyear.

--PSW

    I would also bet money on Paul Tracey doing quite well, as long as he
    keeps his patience about him.

    Don't think I remember seeing Paul.
    I can only recall Scott, Virgil, Alan, Gordon and John.  :-) :-) :-)
    
    F.A.B.
    
    
    (Oh sorry I thought we were discussing Thunderbirds)

    
    From what I _saw_ (Eurosport - 'nuff said) of the Surfers' Paradise race,
    this young upstart Robby Gordon looks a bit F.A.B.. In fact he looks a
    bit Blood.D.Quick. 
    
    M  

An hour after I'd been reading Andretti's comments about his teammate's
apptitude on the Phoenix oval and that he was going to be pretty damn quick in
the race, Nigel has a BIG off in practice. He lost consiousness for about 5
minutes, and suffered a bruised shoulder and neck. 

He is spending the night in hospital and will miss the race. It sounds as though
he is a very lucky man as the car is totalled and the concrete wall is looking
pretty sick.

Scott Goodyear is on pole, with Andretti next. The race is live on Sky.

    During recent testings, a lot of drivers have come unstuck at Phoenix -
    including Andretti.  
    
    M

    
    
    Before anything is said about the race, a word about the commentary on
    Eurosport.. 5000 % improvement on Surfers Paradise, (but still room for
    improvement). The fact that it was shown live, was a big help because
    at least the commentators sounded a bit excited at times.
    
    
    Just a thought...
    
    
    I wonder what Nigel Mansells Indy Review TV Programme will feature over
    the next couple of weeks ??
    
    
    

    
    
    	Can anybody enter a race report for those of us who havent got
    a sattelite dish.
    Thanks.
    
    
    Nick.

    .58�the race, Nigel has a BIG off in practice. He lost consiousness for about 5
    .58�minutes, and suffered a bruised shoulder and neck. 
    .58�He is spending the night in hospital and will miss the race. It sounds as though
    .58�he is a very lucky man as the car is totalled and the concrete wall is looking
    
    Any news ?

               <<< OASS::$7$DUA2:[NOTES$LIBRARY]RACERS.NOTE;1 >>>
                             -< Racers and Racing >-
================================================================================
Note 943.37                         Indy 1993                           37 of 37
DVOPAS::WADERS::malkoski                             18 lines   5-APR-1993 09:23
                                 -< Phoenix  >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Interesting race, yesterday at Phoenix. Looks like the wall in turn 1 collected a 
number of good racers. Mansell hit there on Saturday and left himself with a 
concussion. So that folks didn't get the idea that Nige was a wuss, young Paul 
Tracy hit there on Sunday while enjoying a 2-lap lead more than 3/4 thru the race. 
Then old Emmo broke something (it appearded) on the restart and crashed out while 
enjoying a 1-lap lead. That left Mario to collect his first win in a very long 
time. He was smiling.

All in all aninteresting race. Tracy was clearly hooked up and had the field 
covered. He was able to pass on the high side groove whenever he pleased. No one 
challenged him. While Mario was fast, Tracy was REALLY fast. Still, you have to 
finish, and Mario did just that.

Both the Galles drivers had poor weekends. It would appear that they are way 
behind in testing - must be because they got there cars so late. On the other 
hand, Scott Goodyear was quick, a clear product of early testing.

Paul
    

    RE: Mansells Indy TV Prog:
    
    This week: Nigels Bedside Manners
    
    Next Week: Doctors, Nurses and Dolphins, Again -- The Life of a
               World Champion.
    
    
    Can't wait.
    
    
    Terry B.

During The IndyCar broadcast here in the US, an interview of Mansell was 
shown.  It was taped in his hospital room.  Nigel looked fine, and made all 
sorts of noise about how he felt the rules were too strict if he couldn't 
race.  In other words, he's got nothing worse than a case of racing 
rheumatism.

From: [email protected] (UPI)
Subject: Mario Andretti wins at Phoenix
Date: Sun, 4 Apr 93 15:16:01 PDT
 
	PHOENIX (UPI) -- Mario Andretti broke a five-year victory drought
Sunday by winning the Valvoline 200 at Phoenix International Raceway.
	Driving a Lola-Ford Cosworth, he recorded his 52nd career victory and
his first since 1988 at Cleveland. Andretti, 53, won in an unofficial
speed of 123.847 miles per hour.
	Emerson Fittipaldi, driving a Penske Chevrolet, was leading late in
the race when his car was involved in a crash. Teammate Paul Tracy was
knocked out of the race minutes earlier when he was holding the lead.
	A total of 12 cars were knocked out of the race, including that of
pole-sitter Scott Goodyear.
	Raul Boesel was second in his Lola-Ford Cosworth. Jimmy Vasser was
third, Al Unser Jr. was fourth and Teo Fabi was fifth. Vaaser, Unser and
Fabi all drove Lola Chevrolets.
	Nigel Mansell, who made a successful transition from Formula One to
IndyCar last week by winning his debut race in Australia, crashed during
qualifying Saturday.
	Last year's Formula One world champion had just set a lap record of
172.014 on the one-mile track but soon after lost control of his Lola
Ford. He suffered a mild concussion but no serious injuries and was
disappointed to miss the race.
	The Valvoline 200 is the second of 16 races that make up the PPG
IndyCar World Series.

Race report (from memory--may contain some inaccuracies):

Mario Andretti took off past Scott Goodyear (who was on pole) for an early 
lead, but soon dropped back several positions (setup problems on the car).  
Paul Tracy, Emmo, Scott Goodyear, Roberto Guerrero, and Robbie Gordon were at 
the front in the early going.  Tracy made an awesome charge, passed Emmo for 
the lead, and then proceeded to put all but the second place car (Scott 
Goodyear) a lap down.  The Penskes of Tracy and Fittipaldi were running 1-2 
during the last 1/2 of the race, but then Tracy lost it at the end of a turn 
trying to pass another car (Jimmy Vasser?), spun, and crashed into the wall 
right near the same spot where Mansell had his crash in practice.  This was a 
case of inexperience on Tracy's part--the car he was trying to pass was already 
several laps down, was clearly slower, and there was no need to attempt the 
pass at such a tricky place.  That left Emmo in the lead.  However, on the 
first lap after the restart, a universal joint let go in the right rear of the 
car, sending Emmo across the track and into the wall.  Mario inherited the lead 
and brought home the win without further incident.

Robbie Gordon and Paul Tracy both had good drives, until their mistakes put 
them off.  Especially Tracy, who dominated most of the afternoon.  He certainly 
knows how to get into the lead.  All he needs to learn now is how to pace 
himself towards the end of the race.

--PSW

    The qualifying times and speeds of the first four qualifiers
    (fastest of two laps in single car qualifying) at Phoenix were:
    
    Scott Goodyear		20.833sec	172.804mph
    Mario Andretti		20.895		172.294
    Emerson Fittipaldi		20.919		172.093
    Roberto Guerrero		20.973		171.647
    
    Nigel's 172.014mph (20.929sec) would have put him on the outside of
    the second row if he had given himself the chance to try to reproduce
    it in qualifying.  
    
    The ESPN Speedweek broadcast said that Nigel had been trading fast
    laps with Scott Goodyear throughout practice before he became
    unstuck in Turn 1.  Perhaps Nigel got a little too caught up in 
    trying to establish himself as the top "bullring" driver.  He has a
    great deal to learn about racing on a 1-mile oval and now has to
    wait until Milwaukee to do it.  The one positive aspect about his
    crash is that now that Nigel has experienced how easily an Indy
    car can get unstuck at speed and has had a good taste of an oval wall,   
    he might take a more measured approach at Indy next month.  
    
    Bjorn     	
         

Tracy was clearly the class of the field, having lapped everyone by 1/3
distance and, just as it was all getting boring, he gets the red mist and
does something stupid. Shame for him, but lesson learned, and made a better
spectacle...

Mansell looked fine, talked about how he'd raced and won after "my good
friend Aryton Senna had had a coming together with me" last year, but
the "American way of doing things" required him to miss the race. Mmmmm,
I didn't think he had received concussion last year. Concussion can be
a very dangerous thing. Down here, rugby players who have had it 3 times
in a season (altogether more of an occupational hazard than with the prima
donnas of motor racing) are required to skip the rest of the season to avoid
permanent brain damage.

-Dave.

    I noticed (eyes like a hawk - me) that once Tracy & Fittipaldi and the
    others had lost it on the corner, they both slammed on the brakes when
    the car had rotated about 150� thus lessening, considerably, the impact
    against the wall. I didn't see Mansell's crash, but am wondering
    whether or not he braked. I heard he tried to 'save it' with
    opposite-lock. Is that the key to Indy driving: knowing when to save
    (i.e. when the angle is too obtuse); knowing when to let it go & pile
    on the anchors ?. 

    Cheers

    Mike

    p.s. At What speed (roughly) did Tracy & co. hit the wall as opposed to
    Mansell's ? 

    ESPN's Speedweek showed some amateur video (through the chain-link but
    otherwise good) of Mansell's crash.  It looked very much like Tracy's
    crash.  There were four black streaks all the way to wall;  it's
    difficult to say whether of not he had the brakes one (the team
    probably knows from their telemetry).  The video didn't frame Mansell
    tightly enough to tell if he applied opposite lock, and I wasn't able
    to view it frame-for-frame because my VCR wasn't on.  It would have
    been natural for Mansell to have applied opposite lock (like Piquet at
    Indy last year).  I've seen very few instances where someone has saved
    an Indy car when it stepped out of line on an oval (and none that I can
    remember specifically).  One of the major keys to success and survival
    on an oval is to not overdrive the car.  Mario Andretti made a comment
    many years ago: "If you try to lap Indianapolis at 201mph in a car that
    can do 200mph, you WILL crash."  
    
    Bjorn.

    .70�    crash.  There were four black streaks all the way to wall;  it's
    
    That indicates that he was braking (with 4 wheels locked) which is the
    natural thing to do when spinning. At least that's what all racing
    schools teach and what most sensible drivers do when car is no more
    under their control.
    
    .70�    tightly enough to tell if he applied opposite lock, and I wasn't able
    
    With all wheels locked, opposite lock does not help anything.
    
    .70�    been natural for Mansell to have applied opposite lock (like Piquet at
    .70�    Indy last year).  I've seen very few instances where someone has saved
    
    Piquet suffered a major suspension failure, which is a totally
    different topic ...

    Patrick,
    
    >    That indicates that he was braking (with 4 wheels locked) which is
    >    the natural thing to do when spinning.
    
    There is no doubt in my mind that Mansell applied the brakes at some
    time in his spin and that he kept them applied until he hit the wall.
    However, with the car rotating as Mansell's was, it would be difficult to 
    tell without a very thorough examination of the skid marks, video, 
    telemetry, etc., when he actually did apply them.  The initial skid 
    marks from the rear tires were undoubtedly the result of braking
    traction as the car oversteered and not from the brakes
    being applied.  Remember also that Mansell's car was aligned in the
    direction of travel only instantaneously (with steering lock applied,
    this situation would not coincide for the front and rear tires) during 
    his spin and that the tires would leave skid marks whenever the slip angles
    were much larger than ideal.   
    
    >    At least that's what all racing schools teach and what most 
    >    sensible drivers do when car is no more under their control.
    
    That's what I was taught at Skip Barber, too.  In fact, at Barber's
    schools the instructors question the student and examine the skid marks
    after a spin to determine when the brakes were applied.  In most
    situations, they are more concerned about how a student handles a loss
    of control than the actual loss of control itself.  
    
    >    With all wheels locked, opposite lock does not help anything.
    
    Actually, changing the lock on the front wheels changes the shape of
    the tire contact patch relative to (and the friction force in) the 
    direction of travel and does influence the path and the rate of rotation
    of the spin. 
    
    >    Piquet suffered a major suspension failure, which is a totally
    >    different topic ...
    
    All assessments that I have read and heard here in the U.S. concluded
    that mechanical failure was not a factor in Piquet's crash.  The
    consensus is that Piquet was frustrated when yet another flag 
    (yellow lights, really) came out when he was on a flyer, stayed on the 
    throttle through turn 3 and halfway through turn 4 and then suddenly 
    backed out of the throttle in the middle of turn 4.  Result - instant 
    oversteer, etc.
    
    Bjorn.
     

    What interests me is the fact that Tracy & co. hit the wall at a much
    lesser velocity [than Mansell], indicating that they have a knack for
    mitigating the impact. It is seemingly this type of contingency 
    manoeuvre, more so than a driver's ability not to come unstuck, that 
    determines the career length of an oval racer i.e. being prepared 
    for the worst and having a plan when the worst happens. 
    
    Mike

RE: .69, etc. (Mansell's crash)

There was a quote from an experienced IndyCar driver (it was either Rick Mears 
or Mario Andretti; can't remember which) in last week's issue of AutoWeek, 
discussing Mansell's crash.  He said that the trick for saving an IndyCar once 
the back end comes loose on an oval is to turn into the spin, which is the 
exact opposite of what a road course driver's instincts will tell him to do. 
This is what is at the root of Mansell's crash--he applied road course 
correction procedures instead of the correct approach for an oval.

--PSW

    re: .74
    
    In his Autoweek Phoenix report David Phillips wrote:
    
    >Mansell learned the hard way what every driver making the transition
    >from road racing to oval track racing must learn, one way or the other. 
    >One tries to correct a slide on an oval at his own peril.
    
    >"Coming from a racing background, your instinct is to try to correct a
    >slide," said Fittipaldi.  "People tell you, turn with the slide, turn
    >with the slide, but when you start sliding it is an emergency and it
    >is hard to overcome your instincts."
    
    >"That's the negative side of ovals," said Mario.  "The slightest
    >mistake can be costly, and there's no sand pit to receive you...It's 
    >very easy for an accomplished driver to come to an oval, go quickly
    >right away and say, 'What's the big deal?'  And it's not a big deal
    >until you go over the limit and you try to catch it.  But then you come
    >back and you settle down."
    
    Bjorn

...and Mansell will be back and still fast. I doubt that a little crunch like
that will bother a man who has broken his back and neck racing.

Dave.

��    He said that the trick for saving an IndyCar once the back end comes 
��    loose on an oval is to turn into the spin
    
    Sure, but since oval drivers are frequently correcting over-steer -
    therefore, to a degree, turning against the spin - how are they to
    decide, in that _split_ second, whether the car is about to go AWOL or
    merely needs corrected ?. 
    
    M     

    .72�    All assessments that I have read and heard here in the U.S. concluded
    .72�    that mechanical failure was not a factor in Piquet's crash.  The
    
    I've watched a very detailed and slow motion of his crash where one
    clearly sees that one rear wheel (can't remember which side) is in a
    strange position and that the car is now running more on its bottom
    than on its wheels. I also saw several very detailed pictures showing
    this. Both the movie and the pictures were taken while the car is in
    the corner and staring to move off line towards the wall.

    .74�discussing Mansell's crash.  He said that the trick for saving an IndyCar once 
    .74�the back end comes loose on an oval is to turn into the spin, which is the 
    
    That's what seems reasonable. Certainly requires a lot of practicing. I
    think all drivers would 'automatically' apply opposite lock.
    
    At Winfield I remember a fellow student (a US national BTW) crashed in
    a fast corner because he had either lifted or braked. The car
    immediately headed for the inside (guard rail). The school manager gave
    him his money back and the guy left. 
    
    Crashing on the inside happened at a much lower speed than if for some
    reason (violent understeer, ...) he had crashed into the outside rail.  

RE: .77

That's what separates the oval racing experts from the novices.

--PSW

From what I can understand from this string is that the oval racing experts are
the ones who never hit the wall because they don't drive near the limit. They
just wait for the fast guys to hit the wall to get their victories. That's not
the kind of racing I enjoy.

Dave.

    ...Mario being a case in point. Not to detract from his win.
    
    Mike.

RE: .81

That's not the case at all.  The successful oval track racers are just like the 
successful road track racers, in that they drive at or near the limit, but they 
avoid driving over the limit and thereby losing control of the car and 
crashing.  Consider Paul Tracy in the Phoenix race.  Except for that one stupid 
mistake of trying to pass a backmarker where one couldn't make a pass, which 
cost him the race, Tracy was showing exactly how it's done on ovals.  He was 
driving at the limit, had several lines he could take and could almost pass 
anybody, anywhere, at will. It reminded me of Bobby Rahal's magnificent drive 
in the New England 200 oval race last year.

Mansell's difficulty came about because the definition of the limit, and how a 
driver detects when he's at it or about to exceed it, is different on an 
oval from what it is in road racing.

--PSW

Qualifying for Long Beach.

Mansell has pole, followed by Scott Goodyear, Fittipaldi, and Mario Andretti.

In all 12 cars were under Michael Andretti's pole time of last year.

With the way Tracey went at Phoenix until his mistake (he had 2 laps on the
field), him sharing front row with Mansell should make for an interesting
first couple of laps.

After setting fastest lap, Mansell was complaining of "extreme pain" from
his back...

-Dave.

Race is live on Espn/Sky.

    Patrick,
    
    I popped my tape of the 1992 Indy 500 broadcast into the VCR and
    examined the footage of Piquet's crash (both the in-corner view and the
    head-on view from the straight).  I played it back and forth at regular
    speed, 1/5 speed, and frame by frame over and over.  I could not detect
    anything abnormal.  There are certain distortions that occur in any
    video where there is relative motion between the camera and the object
    viewed due to frame rate limitations.  Depending on the conditions
    under which the still photos were taken (shutter speed, pan rate,
    etc.), they might provide a more accurate view of the car; I have not
    seen any such photos (I would guess that "Open Wheel" magazine might
    have run them.) If the geometry looked only slightly awry, it could
    simply be the due to the oval track alignment set-up.  Generally, for
    an oval track the camber on all four wheels are set up to lean in,
    i.e., the right side wheels have negative camber and the left side
    wheels have positive camber.  There are also subtle toe-in differences. 
    I would also expect that the wheels would go through alignment changes
    as the car lost most of it's downforce after the rear wheels broke
    traction.  In any case, since Piquet is entered for this year's race
    (in a Menard 93 Lola-Buick), we'll get updated information on his crash
    during the month of broadcasts from Indy.
    
    Bjorn.  

    Re: .81 and .83
    
    .83 explains it well. (And yes, Rahal was magnificent in the New
    England 200 last year.  Michael's charges with full fuel loads and
    initially cold tires were also spectacular.)
    
    The really great oval racers can drive at the very delicate limit on an
    oval track and very rarely step over the limit.  Consider Rick Mears,
    the recently retired "Ovalmeister".  In his career at the Brickyard (6
    pole positions, 4 wins) he only spun or crashed once (in the late '70s)
    due to driver error and was consistently the person that set the pace.  
    He was revered by his fellow competitors.
    
    One of the major differences between oval track and road racing is that
    because the corners are all left handers and are taken in a
    relatively narrow speed range, the chassis setup can be optimized to a
    much greater degree.  The oval track set-up (re: .85) is very
    unsymmetrical and the right turn characteristics are vastly different
    from the left turn characteristics; this probably contributes to the
    difficulty in "catching" an Indy car on an oval.  This optimization
    also puts the car on more of a "knife edge" in terms of handling. 
    Also, because the car is so optimized, it can go off very easily due
    to changing track conditions (especially while waiting qualify), fuel 
    load, and tires (slightly wrong stagger, for example).  One of the great
    challenges for a driver on an oval is to work the car at the limit
    until the set-up is perfect;  a car can't be "horsed" around an
    oval like it can be around a road circuit.
    
    Bjorn (hoping to see Nigel at NHIS).
    
   

    
    	There's an article in the New Scientist which, if I recall
    correctly, suggests that Mansell's crash may have been due to a
    combination of his not being familiar with banked corners, which give a
    misleading impression of the forces on the car and his being used to
    going into corners fast, braking late & then turning.  They suggest
    that the two combined were the cause, with the banking giving him a
    feel that he was further from the limit than he really was and pointing
    out that the accident happened going into the corner rather than
    further round, as is apparently more normal.

    
    Results of Long Beach anyone...?

	That's all I know...

     Tracey won, and Mansell came third after crashing with Little Al.
    
    S.

    
    
    Long Beach...
    
    	1st 	Tracey
    	2nd	Rahal
    	3rd 	Mansell
    	4th	Fabi (I think)
    
    In brief ...
    
    Tracey had the edge from the start grabbing the lead and pulling away
    from Mansell. After pit stops /yellows etc...
    
    	'Little Al' attempting to pass Mansell for 2nd collided with the
    rear end.. Unser was out with a damaged front wheel, Mansell seemed to
    be OK..In the last twenty laps Mansell seemed to drop down as if in
    trouble ( I think he dropped to 6th at some point). However he kept
    going and Mario Andretti stopped while in 2nd, Scott Goodyear and also
    Boesel ( I think) all dropped out which left Mansell in a good 3rd
    position at the end.
    
    I believe his car was OK but it seems he was suffering from a lot of
    back pain a s a result of his Phoenix Shunt.
    
    Mansell now leads the championship...
    
    
    Eurosport coverage.......
    
    			Bad again I'm afraid.  Too much talking by the
    studio commentators leaving the viewer to try and determine race
    positions etc..
    
    At one stage Eurosport took an ADVERT break and then returned to ICE
    HOCKEY! coverage for about 10 minutes before returning to the race ?????
    
    Talk about frustrating !
    
    (PS. Tracey got the jump on Mansell at the rolling start which was
    actually  a few laps into the race...The first few laps were run under
    yellows because Johansson hit the wall (hardish) before the race had
    even started.. He was not amused !
    
    Rob

    Re: Mansel dropping to 6th.  It was all due to the engine, it
    supposedly dropped a valve or was not operating on all cylinders, not
    sure if it was because of accident with Jr. or not.  He was told to
    just bring it home for the points, fortunatley just about everybody in
    front of him dropped out in the last few laps so that he could finish
    in 3rd.
    regards,
    JP

    Tracy was the class of the field, again, and deserved his first
    Indy car win.  He suffered one shredded and one flat tire due to 
    debris and got out of sequence on his pit stops.  Fittipaldi 
    had a malfunctioning wastegate early on; the crew replaced it, 
    and he continued at respectable speed but several laps down.  
    Both Andretti's and Boesel's cars quit late in the going.  
    Goodyear hit the wall coming out of the hairpin and retired.  All 
    that allowed Nigel to move from 6th to a very useful 3rd at the 
    finish.  Nigel's engine started going off at about three quarter 
    distance when he was in 3rd.  There was a lot of speculation by the 
    ABC commentators about how competitive Nigel would be and whether he would
    last the distance due to his Phoenix injuries; they needn't have
    worried about how tough Nigel is.  Rahal drove a very professional 
    race to 2nd.  
    
    Nigel's coming together with Little Al was partly due to Mansell not 
    being familiar with CART racing etiquette.  There is 
    more parallel running and less chopping in CART road racing than in F1;  
    this is probably a legacy of racing on concrete lined ovals where 
    there is quite a bit of parallel running in the corners and 
    "racing room" is, usually, given.  Nigel had been doing a good job 
    of blocking the faster Little Al for a number of laps.  Just
    prior to the contact, Little Al's overtaking attempt in the right
    hander (#1) at the end of the straight had put Nigel a little off line for
    the subsequent left (#2).  Little Al saw a gap on the right and went for
    it.  He got his front wheels even with Nigel's rear wheels exiting #2 as 
    Nigel continued to move right and squeezed Little Al into the concrete 
    barrier.  Mansell bounced into the air and slowed slightly but suffered
    no permanent damage.  Little Al passed going into the following right 
    hander but pulled off after the corner with a broken right front 
    suspension.  It was Little Al's first DNF in 23 races.
    
    Bjorn. 

Tracey showed that he is developing some maturity to go with his speed. Roger
Peneske must be pleased to see the investment he made in this guy 3 years ago
starting to pay off. Especially after the disaster at Phoenix.

Tidy and smooth race by Mansell I thought. 3rd was as good as he could expect 
on the day. He actually led the race on 3 occasions, but the vagaries of 
pace car laps and pending pit stops put Tracey firmly in the lead for the final
portions of the race. Mansell probably believes in Santa now seeing as how 3
other runners (including Mario Andretti) pulled out in the final 5 laps while
in positions ahead of him.

Shame for Johansson, he'd qualified very well before being shunted at the start.

re: the start. If that had happened in F1, heads would have rolled...

Rahal seems to have discovered some speed and his strong 2nd would have helped
his team's motivation no end. Slowed dramatically in the last lap, I'm not sure
why.

-Dave.

RE: .93

Alas, I didn't get to see much of the race because the New Hampshire ABC 
station had transmitter problems throughout most of the race.  We missed the 
first 30 minutes, got a few minutes around when Tracy's tire went down (he did 
a magnificent job bringing that car back to the pits), got to see a good battle 
between Rahal, Fabi, and Gordon.  Then the coverage went back out for a while, 
but it was back on for the Mansell/Unser collision, the yellow period, and the 
round of pit stops.  We got to see Mansell's engine go sour, then it was out 
again and didn't come back on until the race was over.  Sigh.

Even Bobby Unser, who is Little Al's uncle and part of the ABC broadcast team, 
thought the Unser/Mansell collision was Little Al's fault.  According to Bobby, 
Al was in Mansell's blind spot when he darted to the outside.  Mansell, not 
seeing him, took his normal line into the next corner, which left Al squeezed 
against the wall.  Likely it would not have happened if the two drivers knew 
each other's style better (either Al wouldn't have attempted the maneuver, or 
Mansell would have known he'd be there and taken a wider line), but executing a 
pass safely is the responsibility of the overtaking car, not the leading car. 
Little Al doesn't make mistakes like this very often.

It was Bobby Unser's opinion, listening to the engine noise, that Mansell's 
engine was down one cylinder and had probably dropped a valve.

What was it that put Goodyear, Andretti, and Boesel out?  The station was on 
the fritz for that part of the coverage.

--PSW

    Funny to here how Little Al, after all his description of the accident,
    threw the blame on Mansell.  This is why I've liked Michael Andretti
    so much more as he less likely to do this.  
    
    Odd thing is that the commentator on ABC noted that Little Al did the 
    same thing during last years race.
    
    I'm must be getting old, Paul Tracy looks like he's 18 years old...
    Wonderful job by PAul and a much deserved win.
    
    Dale
    

    Due to forgetfullness, I've yet to see a race from this series on an
    oval, but, so far INDYcar racing seems quite exciting, colourful and
    spectacular. 
    
    I know that the ITV 'Mansell's IndyCar Series' series is a very edited
    highlights of the race, but some of the racing we see is just not seen
    in F1 any more.
    
    And the ESPN guys seem to do a good job as well.
    
    Good stuff.
    
    
    Terry B.

re: .-1 Haven't you been watching F1 this year?

re: Phoenix:

BTW Autosport quotes Rick Mears (with some great enhanced photos of the
accident):

"Rick Mears, retired four-time Indy 500 winner commented: 'If you jerk the
wheel like he was doing instead of being smooth, you're going to lose
control without any warning and have a big accident. If you're smooth and
you're a little slower in the way you turn into the corner, you'll actually
go faster'.

    There was a list of 1993 Indy entries in the paper the other day. Lo
    and behold, I see an entry for Nelson Piquet! Did I miss something
    here? I knew he was seen at races, but has he driven at all since his
    accident last year? Is this a gesture of some kind?
    
    At any rate it should be interesting with or without Nelson. It appears
    that the Galles boys have begun to figure out the '93 Lola package. I
    expect Al, jr to be fast. I'm not so sure about Sullivan. Nigel and
    Mario will be quick. I think Nige will just have to be a bit more
    patient than he was at Phoenix. Scott Goodyear will be quick as well.
    Their early season testing has really paid off. And Tracy and
    Fittipaldi should be quick.
    
    I'll go way out on the early limb and pick Tracy for the quickest
    pracice time. I believe he and Mario will set the pace. If he gets a
    break, Tracy will get the pole - but remember that Indy qualifying is
    not like any other. But he'll be near the top of the field when the
    qualifying is done. Here's my pick for the front row - Tracy, Goodyear,
    Andretti.
    
    Paul
    

I read somewhere (probably on the Internet) that Nelson was spending a lot 
of time racing karts to keep himself sharp and that he has been 
participating in the rookie qualifications again.

Nelson is quoted as saying he is looking forward to Indy, and that his mental
attitude is fine...

-Dave.

    I heard Piquet's team of last year are "entering" him in this year's
    i500 to avoid being sued by him !. It seems to be some sort of legal
    ploy by the team and not a genuine race entry. Piquet says he'll still
    sue. I still don't know the ins & outs of it all, but it's messy.

    Mike.

RE: .99

Nelson Piquet apparently has recovered enough to make a second try at Indy.  
He's been driving go-karts several times a week while recovering.  Team Menard 
(the same team he was with last year) have signed him on again and registered a 
car for him.  Gary Bettenhausen shook the car down during practice last week, 
and it's all set for Piquet's use in rookie orientation.

--PSW

RE: .102

I don't believe that rumor.

Nelson Piquet did sue Team Menard over last year's outing at Indy.  There was a 
disagreement between Piquet and Menard over the amount of money Piquet should 
have been paid--Menard contended that they didn't owe Piquet the full amount in 
their contract because he didn't actually participate in qualifying or the 
race.  That suit has been settled out of court.  I doubt Menard's entry for 
Piquet is merely a legal ploy--Menard and their sponsors will likely get a lot 
of extra publicity because of the media attention focused on Piquet.

--PSW

    
    I'm lagging behind a bit lately... thanks for the update. I did think
    it would have been in very bad taste, had it been the case.

    Looking forward to seeing two ex-Williams teammates & F1 champions at
    the brickyard. No, make that _anxious_. I'm not an oval fan. 

    M

    I would not be surprised by the Menard team adding Nelson just for the
    publicity. If he makes qualifying, he'll get an awful amount of
    attention. I can only assume he is in good health and is physically
    ready to race since the docs won't let him in at Indy if he wasn't.
    Heck, this IS a good story. I thought he would never sit in a race car
    again after the injuries he received. I hope he does well.
    
    Paul
    

From: [email protected] (UPI)
Subject: Mansell to have back surgery, will miss Indy rookie orientation
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 93 3:28:51 PDT
 
	LINCOLNSHIRE, Ill. (UPI) -- World driving champion Nigel Mansell is
scheduled to undergo back surgery Wednesday and will be unable to
participate in this weekend's Indianapolis 500 rookie orientation
program.
	Mansell, the 1992 Formula One world champion, who switched to Indy
Car racing this year, said he still plans to compete in the Indy 500 on
May 30. Mansell said he is still optimistic he can begin practice at the
Indianapolis Motor Sppedway in the week before pole qualifying.
	Mansell, who will have the surgery at Morton Plant Hospital near his
home in Clearwater, Fla., suffered the back injury in a practice
accident at Phoenix International Speedway on April 3. He was knocked
unconcious in that accident and was hospitalized overnight with a
concussion. He returned to competition two weeks later in Long Beach,
Calif., started from the pole position and finished third.
	``I have been in considerable discomfort since Phoenix,'' Mansell
said. ``I am relieved that my latest set of X-rays have identified the
exact problem and we are going to correct it properly.''
	The surgery will be performed by Dr. George Morris and Dr. Terry
Trammell, an orthopedic surgeon from Indianapolis who has performed
numerous successful surgeries on race drivers.
	Trammell explained that Mansell's injury involves soft tissues in the
lower back, not muscle or bone.

    
    
    Piquet fastest during Rookie orientation for Indy 500
    
    Mansell not present due to recovering from Back surgery. He is hoped to
    be present within the next few days..
    
    Some rumours that he will not take part in Indy 500 and that Michael
    Andretti will take his seat as a 1 off ???
    
    Rob

    > Piquet fastest during Rookie orientation for Indy 500
    
    Not a big deal since the rookie orientation program has very controlled
    lapping with a 212 mph max. lap speed limit.  Piquet had already done
    222mph laps before the orientation weekend.  See RACERS note 943.76
    
    Bjorn

RE: .108

Mario Andretti, on hearing rumors of Michael's leaving F1, said he doubted very 
much that he'd leave F1 unless he thought he had accomplished what he set out 
to do there.

Mansell got a waiver from USAC to skip the normal rookie orientation weekend 
and instead do the orientation program after the track has opened for general 
practice.  The orientation program consists of doing a certain number of laps 
within a limited speed range.  I think the first set of laps are at 180 mph, 
then 200 mph, then 210+ mph.  The only problem with Mansell doing this program 
during open practice is that there will be other cars working on qualifying 
setup blasting by at 220+ mph.  I doubt that Mansell will have any trouble 
completing the rookie orientation program on his first day on the track.

--PSW

Here's a little snippet from Mondays Guardian...

  "(Michael) Andretti confirmed that he will be available, if asked,
   to qualify the Newman/Haas Lola Ford at Indeanapolis next Saturday
   in the event of Nigel Mansell finding that the after-effects of his back
   operation make it impossible to handle the G-forces at the famous
   American oval track."



Terry B.

    
    Mansell passed his 'rookie' tests at Indy. He then did a 222.xxx mph
    lap to clock fourth fastest for the day.
    
    Sky TV last night showed a scene from Indy which had someone handling
    an "Ayrton Senna lookalike helmet". More attempts at rumour spreading ?
    
    Emmo Fittipaldi stated - " I am sure that Ayrton will be here one day"
    
    I read that as - Ayrton will do the 500 at some time in the future and
    not this year.
    
    Rob

re.112:

One things certain, Prost never will.

Dave.

    Indy pole day (15 may) results
    
    1 Luyendik
    2 Andretti	all around 223mph average
    3 Goodyear
      
    Nigel Mansell managed 8th (220mph). Nelson Piquet slightly slower
    (217mph).
    
    Young frenchman Stephan Gregoire (F3 driver) managed to qualify.

Here's the provisional grid for the Indy 500, as of the end of the second day 
of time trials.  Stephan Gregoire turned in the best performance among this 
year's rookie drivers.  Very impressive.

Seven grid positions remain to be filled during this coming weekend's time 
trials.

                          STARTING    AVERAGE
CAR#   DRIVER             POSITION      SPEED     CHASSIS/ENGINE
------------------------ Day One Qualifiers ------------------------
10   Arie Luyendyk           1         223.967      93 Lola/Ford
6    Mario Andretti          2         223.414      93 Lola/Ford 
9    Raul Boesel             3         222.379      93 Lola/Ford
2    Scott Goodyear          4         222.344      93 Lola/Ford 
3    Al Unser Jr.            5         221.773      93 Lola/Ch-C
16   Stefan Johansson        6         220.824      93 Penske/Ch-C
12   Paul Tracy              7         220.298      93 Penske/Ch-C
5    Nigel Mansell           8         220.255      93 Lola/Ford
4T   Emerson Fittipaldi      9         220.150      93 Penske/Ch-C
40   Roberto Guerrero       10         219.645      93 Lola/Ch-C
22   Scott Brayton          11         219.637      93 Lola/Ford
7    Danny Sullivan         12         219.428      93 Lola/Ch-C
77   Nelson Piquet          13         217.949      93 Lola/Menard
11   Kevin Cogan            14         217.230      93 Lola/Ch-C
45   Scott Pruett           15         216.794      91 Lola/Ch-A
------------------------ Day Two Qualifiers -------------------------
36   Stephan Gregoire       16         220.851      92 Lola/Buick
21   Jeff Andretti          17         220.572      92 Lola/Buick
8    Teo Fabi               18         220.514      93 Lola/Ch-C
51   Gary Bettenhausen      19         220.380      93 Lola/Menard
18   Jimmy Vasser           20         218.967      92 Lola/Ford
91   Stan Fox               21         218.765      92 Lola/Buick
90   Lyn St. James          22         218.042      93 Lola/Ford
76   Tony Bettenhausen      23         218.034      93 Penske/Ch-C
80   Al Unser Sr.           24         217.453      93 Lola/Ch-C
1    Bobby Rahal            25         217.140      92 RH/Ch-C
25   Mark Smith             26         214.356      92 Penske/Ch-B

Spots left to fill: 7
Fastest speed:  Arie Luyendyk     223.967
Slowest speed:  Mark Smith        214.356
Fastest rookie: Stephan Gregoire  220.851

    After the first qualifying weekend, the overall speeds are down from
    last year's record. I suspect that the new car rules (smaller wings,
    etc.) have had an effect. But how about the rule prohibiting racing
    below the white line? That certainly reduces the width of the racing
    surface and, I would guess, the ability to carry speed thru the
    corners. Any comments?
    
    Paul
    

The consensus among the drivers and teams is that cars are losing about 4 mph 
due to the smaller wings and the prohibition of splitters on the diffusers, and 
another 4 mph or so due to the removal of the skirt below the white line.  The 
effect of the aerodynamic changes on the cars is mitigated somewhat by the fact 
that most teams are using the Buick, Menard, Ford, Chevy B, and Chevy C 
engines, all of which have lower profiles than the older Chevy A and Cosworth 
DFS.  The lower profile reduces aerodynamic drag and partly compensates for the 
aerodynamic changes.  The teams hardest hit by the aerodynamic changes are 
those running older cars with the larger-profile Chevy A engines.  This is 
Eddie Cheever's problem (he's running a '92 Penske with Chevy A power).

On the other hand, the ideal line around the track never used the apron.  
Roberto Guererro's record-setting qualifying run last year was remarkable in 
that he didn't even get close to either the apron or the walls.

--PSW

    Interesting. I had not been aware that Roberto's run was so tidy.
    
    Help refresh my fading memory. If a car makes the field on the first
    weekend of qualifying, can he be bumped? For example, was it Smith that
    went 214.xxx? That doesn't seem like a quick time, and there could be a
    number of folks quicker this weekend. Can they bump, or are they only
    going for the last 7 spots?
    
    Paul
     

Yes, Roberto's run last year was among the cleanest I've ever seen.  
Unbelievable consistency over the 4 laps, and feet away from the apron and the 
wall.  It's a pity that he fell victim to the cool temperatures and spun out on 
the warmup lap.  They had that car really dialed in.


Regarding the baroque process of Indy 500 qualifying, it works like this:

A qualifying run consists of up to 2 warm-up laps, then 4 timed laps.  The 
average miles/hour over the 4 timed laps is the car's (CARS qualify at Indy, 
not DRIVERS) qualifying time.  Each car gets 3 attempts to qualify.  If you 
abort an attempt (called "waving off" because it's signaled to the officials by 
a team member waving a yellow flag) during the warm-up laps, the attempt 
doesn't count at all.  If you wave off after taking the green flag for the 
first timed lap, the aborted attempt counts towards the 3 attempts.  Once you 
take the checkered flag at the end of the 4th timed lap, that's it--the car is 
provisionally qualified with that time and you get no further attempts.  This 
becomes important because of bumping, which I'll discuss below.

There are four qualifying sessions (called the "time trials").  Sessions 1 and 
2 were held last weekend; sessions 3 and 4 are this weekend.  The grid order is 
determined by sorting the qualified cars first by the day on which they 
qualified--all day 1 qualifiers before day 2, day 2 before day 3, and day 3 
before day 4.  Then, within each day, by highest qualifying speed.  Pole 
position is thus usually the fastest day 1 qualifier.  The only way that will 
not be true is if all of the day 1 qualifiers are bumped from the field.

The night before each qualifying session, a lottery is held to determine the 
order in which cars will make qualifying attempts.  All cars that wish to 
qualify the next day participate in the lottery.  On the qualifying day, when 
the car's sequence in the lottery comes up, the team can either make a 
qualifying attempt or step out of line.  If they don't make it all the way 
through the lottery ordering on day 1, the remaining cars get their shot on day 
2, but they're still grouped with the day 1 qualifiers.  Thus, every car gets a 
shot at qualifying for pole.

The Indy 500 grid is 33 cars.  Once the grid is full, a car can only qualify if 
it is faster than the slowest car that's already qualified (regardless of where 
this car may be on the grid).  The 33rd fastest car is "on the bubble" and in 
danger of being bumped.  If a car qualifies faster than the 33rd fastest car, 
that car is bumped from the grid and the new qualifier is qualified instead.  
Note that the rule on ordering still applies--the new car will take up its 
proper position with the other cars on the day that it qualified.  Once a car 
is bumped, it cannot attempt to qualify again.  The driver of that car can 
attempt to qualify another car if he or she wishes.  That's why you'll see 
teams enter more than one car per driver.

So, to use the example from .118, Smith went 214.xxx mph and is the slowest of 
the day-1 qualifiers.  There are faster qualifiers from day 2, but they line up 
behind Smith because drivers are ranked by day first and then by speed within 
each day.  There are still 7 open spots on the grid.  The first 7 cars to 
qualify this Saturday will line up, in order of speed, in these last 7 
positions (behind the day-2 qualifiers).  Let's suppose they all post speeds 
better than Smith.  Smith's car is now on the bubble.  Now let's say Brian 
Bonner qualifies a car with a speed better than Smith's.  Smith's is the 
slowest car on the grid, so he's bumped.  The cars behind Smith all move up by 
1 position, and Bonner's car assumes the correct position amongst the other 7 
day-3 qualifiers, based on the speed of the qualifying run.

Smith is now out of luck with that car.  If he can find another, as yet 
unqualified car, he can try to qualify it.

Day 4 of qualifying is known as "bubble day" because by then the grid is 
usually full and there's lots of bumping going on as the drivers with slow 
times vie for the last few positions on the grid.

There's one other rule that affects the order of the grid.  A team can switch 
drivers on a qualified car, but the car moves to the very back of the grid if 
they do so.  This happened last year.  Scott Goodyear qualified his primary 
car with a mediocre speed.  The team later found better speed with the backup 
car, so they had Mike Groff qualify it on Bubble Day.  They then withdrew the 
primary car and had Scott Goodyear drive the car that Groff qualified.  
Goodyear thus started from the very back of the grid.  It turned out to be a 
wise choice, as Goodyear went from 33rd to 2nd and missed winning the race by 
only a few hundredths of a second, in the closest Indy finish ever.

Note that it's theoretically possible for the pole-sitter to be bumped from the 
grid.  If, after the grid is filled, 34 cars were to qualify with times better 
than Arie Luyendyk's, then he'll be bumped off pole and the new pole-sitter 
will be the fastest day-2 qualifier (assuming any of them are left after 
bumping), or the fastest day-3 qualifier (if all the day-2 guys got bumped).

--PSW

re.119:

I think we shold sell the Indy organisers some consultancy on simplifying their
processes.

Dave ;-)

re .119; that's a very good explanation - I hadn't understood that process.

re .120; I disagree - given our procedures, I think we should buy some
consultancy from Indy !!

Peter.

    Whew! I knew the trial system at Indy was "different" but this?!?!?
    
    Yes, I agree that we should use Indy's consultants. If they had use DPM
    to create the "Qualifying Process", it would have been much more
    confused.
    
    Paul
    

If you think Indy qualifying is bad, you should see how NASCAR determines the 
grid for the Daytona 500 stock car race.  First they hold time trials over a 
weekend and determine a provisional grid order.  This determines who's in the 
race, but, except for the pole-sitter, it doesn't finally establish their grid 
order.  That's done by holding two 125-mile races called the "twin 125s".  The 
first 125 consists of positions 1, 3, 5, etc. and the second of positions 2, 4, 
6, etc. as determined by the time trials.  The finishing order in the Twin 125s 
determines the order in the final grid (except for the pole-sitter, who was 
decided by the time trials).  The really weird thing about this arrangement is 
that the pole sitter must race in the Twin 125s.  This means that if he smashes 
his car, he'll have to use a backup car in the race, and that means starting at 
the back of the grid.  So for the pole sitter, the Twin 125s are just a 
survival game--his goal is merely to finish the race intact.

--PSW

  <<< Note 2009.123 by ADSERV::PW::WINALSKI "Careful with that AXP, Eugene" >>>

If you think Indy qualifying is bad, you should see how NASCAR determines the 
grid for the Daytona 500 stock car race.  First they hold time trials over a 
weekend and determine a provisional grid order.  This determines who's in the 
race, but, except for the pole-sitter, it doesn't finally establish their grid 
order.  That's done by holding two 125-mile races called the "twin 125s".  The 
first 125 consists of positions 1, 3, 5, etc. and the second of positions 2, 4, 
6, etc. as determined by the time trials.  The finishing order in the Twin 125s 
determines the order in the final grid (except for the pole-sitter, who was 
decided by the time trials).  The really weird thing about this arrangement is 
that the pole sitter must race in the Twin 125s.  This means that if he smashes 
his car, he'll have to use a backup car in the race, and that means starting at 
the back of the grid.  So for the pole sitter, the Twin 125s are just a 
survival game--his goal is merely to finish the race intact.

--PSW


Minor correction -- The first row(2 positions) is determined by the qualifying
runs.  The remaining spots(except provisionals) are determined by the twin
125s.

John

    Sky Sports clearly have exclusive rights to showing the race live on
    Sunday but I had hoped that some other channels would be showing the
    highlights (Eurosport, ITV ?).
    
    I've had a quick look through the TV Times for next week and can't 
    find anything except ITV's half hour slot "Nigel Mansell's Indycar" 
    on Tuesday night and even the write up for that made no mention of the 
    Indy 500 race.
    
    Royston

As I'm away for the weekend, does anyone know what time the race starts,
as opposed to the coverage, which starts at 5:00pm UK time? Does the
race really start at midday in the U.S.?

I've only got a 4 hour tape, and I don't want to miss the last two laps
if there are delays!

Peter.

Yes, the race starts at 12:00 PM, US Eastern Standard Time (which is 5 hours 
behind GMT).

A 4-hour tape ought to cover you for the whole race.  Even last year's 
caution-ridden race didn't last as long as 4 hours.

--PSW

>Yes, the race starts at 12:00 PM, US Eastern Standard Time (which is 5 hours 
>behind GMT).

Your sure? Someone told me (here in ZKO) that the race started at 1pm.

Colin.

ABC TV coverage of the Indy 500 runs 11:00 AM - 3:30 PM.  That's 1 hour before 
the race starts at noon.

--PSW

  Indianapolis doesn't switch to Daylight Savings Time right?  So, if 'we'
  are on EDT then Indy is on EST, which makes our 12:00 p.m. their 1:00
  p.m. - Or did I get that totally backwards??
  
  Dave

No, Indianapolis doesn't switch to Daylight Savings Time, which means
they're one hour BEHIND the East Coast.

And anyway, my tickets say "11:00 EST".

Boy, I like the sound of that..."my tickets"!

Kate

    That was one of the best races I've ever witnessed. I was completely
    and utterly overwhelmed by the sheer speeds involved. I had never
    witnessed an Indy 500 prior to yesterday's, so I don't know how it
    rates with the cognoscenti, but my adrenalin gland was working
    overtime. The way in which the cars slew past the wall-mounted 
    cameras was almost evil. It was like Neo-Gladiators - an exact 
    paradigm of danger. 

    As a Mansell fan (or should that be someone who's not a
    journalist/has-been/wanted-to-have-been...;-) the excitement/dread was
    even more intense: Mansell having never raced on an Oval, and having
    crashed during practice at Phoenix. 

    I must admit I was lured into believing (slightly) that Mansell would 
    wrestle the car around the track, but as Bobby Unser pointed out,
    Mansell and Al Unser Jnr looked the smoothest drivers on the track.
    Mansell stayed out of trouble early on while Raul Boesel set the
    pace. The other main players were Mario Andretti, Emmo Fittipaldi, Arie
    Luyendyk - whom Mansell passed...on the outside, prompting Bobby Unser
    to comment that "Obviously nobody had told Mansell you cannot pass on 
    the outside at Indy" - and Al Unser Jnr and a few others. 

    The lead changed hands about fourteen times and Mansell lead three 
    times, about 30 laps in all. He was leading 15 laps from the finish
    when yet another yellow flag was shown. Fittipaldi & Luyendyk got the 
    jump on Mansell by predicting the green flag, and Mansell remained in
    third place until the finish, `kissing' the wall with his front wheel
    as he exited a turn. A precautionary yellow flag was brought out for
    the incident, but Mansell's Lola seemed undamaged other than slight
    mis-alignment. 

    Emmo won, Luyendyk came second and Mansell was third. Piquet retired
    early citing lack of engine power as the trouble. Eight others did not
    finish. A fabulous race.

    Mike

    re .-1
    
    	Agree... a great race. Not many accidents (compared to last year)
    	still plenty of passing even with a narrower track. A bit of 
    	inexperience by Mansell on the last yellow , but the way Fittipaldi
    	finished the last 10 laps I dont think Mansell would have held him
    	off even if he hadn't got the jump on the yellow.
    
    	Brilliant driving by Mansell to deliberately clip the wall and
    	bring out another yellow to give him another chance with 7 laps 
    	left ;-)
    
    	I reckon we could see Mansell at Indy for many years to come.. He 
    	seemed to enjoy himself.
    
    Rob

    Great race. Andretti certainly proved he can still be competitive.
    Mansell showed that he can learn as fast(er) than most. Arie was quick
    and effective. But Emo... He dialed that beast in, and was surprisingly
    quick at the end when it really counted. He did a typical Penske move.
    He managed to hang around on the lead lap and be in the right place
    during the last 30-50 laps. I was surprised that he could pull away
    from Nige, Mario and Arie at the end, especially when they all had Ford
    power. But the Penske was certainly working and he managed fastest lap
    of the race (about lap 188) at nearly 215.
    
    Nige was very good. Smooth all day and I though he had a real chance at
    a win, especially late in the going. That wall banging was something! I
    don't know that it deserved a "yellow" but my goodness!
    
    It was one of the most competitive races I've ever seen at Indy and one
    of the most enjoyable. With so much passing and so many lead changes,
    the win was in doubt right up to the last lap. Frankly, it is always
    amazing to me to see these folks run flat out at the very edge for
    these "final sprints" where a mistake will cost big time. But they all
    block everything from their minds and just go for the win. Incredible.
    And enjoyable.
    
    There should be some good racing next Sunday at the 1-mile oval at
    Milwaukee.
    
    Paul

    Could someone explain the comments on Monday's International Herald
    Tribune front page about Mansell's team 'reversing' his car into the
    pits ?

>    Could someone explain the comments on Monday's International Herald
>    Tribune front page about Mansell's team 'reversing' his car into the
>    pits ?
    
    I believe he overshot his pit and guess that Indy cars don't have
    reverse.  He was very critical of himself for this basic error.

    .136�    I believe he overshot his pit and guess that Indy cars don't have
    .136�    reverse.  He was very critical of himself for this basic error.
    
    Thanks for the prompt response Clive. The IHT printed that he had been
    disqualified for this. Any truth ?

  From what I saw and heard, he overshot his pits and his pit crew pushed
  him back.  This was legal and proper.  I have not heard anything about
  Nigel being dq'd from the race.
  
  Dave

    RE: .134
    
    >>Nige was very good. Smooth all day and I though he had a real chance at
    >>a win, especially late in the going. That wall banging was something! I
    >>don't know that it deserved a "yellow" but my goodness!
    
    It's been said that the yellow is sometimes used to pull the field back
    together again and set things up for a more closer race! Therefore
    even a minor looking incident can be used as an excuse to bring out the
    flag. Basically it's so you don't end up with an F1 situation of
    someone "miles" down the road ahead of the field. They don't want the
    american public getting bored when they don't get their "head of the
    field" 10 second fix of action every minute or so! :-) 
    
    Dave

    Thanks to Canal Plus - French pay TV channel - I was able to see my
    first ever Indy 500 from start to finish live on Sunday. What a show
    and what a race! Fabulous TV coverage, superb racing and suspense that
    lasted right up to the final lap.
    
    I managed to overcome all my old world prejudice about pom pom girls
    and yellow flags and really enjoyed a great spectacle. Is it always
    that good?
    
    With a little more Indycar race craft and experience, I think that Fat
    Nige may even have won it. The way that Fittipaldi and Luyendyk
    overtook him at the last but one restart made him look like a real
    beginner. Those closing laps were tremendous. The first five cars all
    within a couple of seconds...
    
    What happened to Andretti? At one point he was blackflagged, but then
    the penalty appeared to be withdrawn. Any ideas? Fittipaldi was
    sensational in the last ten laps. When I think that, as a starstruck
    teenager, I watched this same man win F1 Grands Prix in a Lotus 72 20
    (TWENTY!!) years ago! He has lost none of his class. He always was a
    master tactician, and he still is.
    
    As a seasoned Grand Prix goer, I still have trouble accepting the
    yellow flag rule. At one point, Mansell pulled out a healthy lead, only
    to see it vanish because someone else hit the wall. I just suppose that
    the rules are different, and that's that.
    
    Anyway, a great race.
    
    Salut,         
    Ed

	Ed, whilst I appreciate your wit and wisdom, do stop calling Mansell
	"fat Nige".  
	
	Thanks

	Thin Dave

    No wait. These subtly derogatory digs serve as reminders, to some, to 
    ignore the note in its entirety. How else is one able to sort the wheat 
    from the chaff, as it were ?
              
    Nosey Al  ;-) 

>    No wait. These subtly derogatory digs serve as reminders, to some, to 
                    ||||||
    
    Not so subtle.     

    
    Great race, bloody awful coverage by SKY. Now I don't have Sky so I
    went to a friends and I saw more adverts than I see on ITV in a week
    crammed into 3 hours, what a yawn. Every time a yellow flag was shown
    they'd cut away for ten minutes of adverts and since most of the place
    changing seems to be made under these you miss all the interesting
    bits!!
    
    Did anyone get any stats about passing, it seemed to me that 'fat
    nige'/'our Nige' did most of this on the track and lost the places
    under the flags, was this the case? Shame he lost it 16 from the end
    but he did miss the jump and did seem a bit slower at that stage so 
    no real gripes.
    
    Another point was that the start before that Nige got a flyer of a
    re-start passing about 5 people in a lap, brilliant. I'll have to get
    across there next year to cut out the middle man, i.e SKY....
    
    
    							G.P
     

RE: Nigel Mansell's muffed pit stop

Nigel overshot his pit and had to be rolled back into it by the pit workers. 
This is the way it has to be done.  USAC has the same rule as F1 regarding 
reversing in pit lane.  It isn't allowed.

There was some talk about disqualifying Mansell.  USAC has a rule that if a car 
hits the wall, that car must pit at the next available opportunity to be 
inspected for damage.  Nigel did not do this after he touched the wall, 
bringing out the last caution.  USAC didn't display the black flag to bring him 
in, either.  Raul Boesel's team protested this (and several other USAC 
decisions) afterwards, but the protests were denied, and Mansell was not 
disqualified.


RE: .144

Good observation about Your Nige (or is he ours now?) getting the short end of 
the stick on most of the caution periods.  He didn't have too much luck in 
getting pit stops timed so that they occurred under cautions.  Most of his 
position improvement was done the hard way--passing under green flag 
conditions.  Nige got an excellent restart during which he caught Mario 
napping.  As he said in the interview after the race, that sort of makes up for 
the next one, where he wasn't aggressive enough and got snookered on the 
restart.

RE: .140 (Mario's black flag)

This one was controversial.  For safety reasons, they close the entrance to pit 
lane when the yellow flag is first displayed and then open it up again when the 
pace car is in place.  This is to prevent everybody from diving all at once 
into the pits while still at racing speed.  Mario was already on the entry road 
to pit lane when the yellow came out, and he got onto pit lane before the "no 
pit" board was displayed at the entrance.  What his team should have done is to 
wave him through and back out onto the track, but they didn't--they let him 
pit, and so he was assessed a stop-and-go penalty.  He was black-flagged and 
served the penalty while the yellow flag was still in effect.

Newman-Haas and Mario protested this on the grounds that they didn't know pit 
lane was closed (but they could all see the caution, so the stewards didn't buy 
that argument).  Raul Boesel's team protested on the grounds that the penalty 
should have been served under green-flag conditions.

RE: .139 (yellow flags)

Full-course yellows at Indy are NOT brought out just to bunch up the drivers 
and make the race more exciting.  With the high speeds that they run at Indy, 
it's purely a matter of safety to impose a full-course caution whenever there's 
a stalled car or debris on the track.  Even fluid on the track can cause a car 
to spin out of control, with potentially fatal results.  You can't clear an 
oval track of crunched cars or debris without a full-course caution.  You may 
have noticed that when Lyn St. James stalled and got her car onto the pit entry 
road, they still called a caution.  That is because in 1971, there was a 
fatality when a car that lost control in the turns hit the wall and rebounded 
into a car that had been parked earlier on the infield apron, well off the 
racing line.  USAC doesn't take chances when there's contact with the wall or a 
stalled car, and their cautious attitude is justified.

Mind you, road courses are a different matter, and the CART officials quite 
often bring out a full-course yellow when a local yellow would suffice, in my 
opinion.

--PSW

    RE: .145
    
    I didn't see all of the race plus I had to watch a somewhat scrambled
    picture on Canal+ and had the sound from Sky Sports - it pleased the
    wife/kids no end tying up the 2 teles! Anyway I was making a general
    observation about "US" style racing which wasn't specific about USAC
    and CART. 
    
    What's the difference between USAC and CART?
    
    Dave

    > and I saw more adverts than I see on ITV in a week
    
    That's 'cos Sky got the feed from America, so they broke when the
    American channel did.
    
    Greg

    Re. Andretti.
    
    Does that mean that penalties can be served under yellow flag
    conditions as well? This seems very odd, as a ten-second penalty served
    when cars are at low speeds would have a significantly reduced effect.
    
    Salut,
    Edward

    Yes ten second penalties can even be served during a regular pit stop,
    and was done quite efectively a few races back.  Sorry can't remember
    who it was but it really worked to his advantage.

    
    	Didn't Mansell serve a ten second penalty in Ausralia and use it
    	as a pit stop for tyres and fuel?
    
    	Tony

    re: the last few
    
    There are a number of sanctioning groups in the U.S., including but not
    limited to: SCCA (Sports Car Club of America, amateur and some
    professional, e.g., TransAm,  road racing), IMSA (International Motor Sports
    Association, professional, e.g., GTP, GTS, Firehawk, road racing,
    NASCAR (National Association for Stock Car Auto Racing [?]), CART
    (Champioship Auto Racing Teams), and USAC (United States Auto Club,
    e.g., Indy, sprint and midget cars, stock cars)
    
    From the mid-50s to sometime around 1980, USAC sanctioned Champ Car (as
    Indy cars were called) racing.  When CART was formed, Indianapolis
    maintained control of its own race by continuing to have USAC sanction
    the 500.  As a result the rules for the Indy 500 and the rest of the
    races on the IndyCar circuit differ slightly.  For example, stock block
    based motors (e.g., Buick)  are allowed more boost at Indy (they are
    also allowed more displaceent than pure racing engines under both sets
    of rules).
    
    With respect to Mario's yellow flag stop-and-go penalty: during the
    broadcast the announcers said that the Chief Steward, Tom Binford,
    believed in having the "punishment fit the crime", and, therefore,
    allowed Andretti to serve the stop-and-go under the yellow.  That
    effectively put Mario at the back of the queue when he got back on the
    track and negated his advantage of having been first into the pits when the
    yellow came out.  Through the years, the interpretation of the rules
    has been controversial a number of times.  The one I remember the most
    vividly was 1963 when Parnelli Jones was allowed to continue on in the
    lead (dripping oil on the track) while "rookie" Jim Clark in his Lotus
    29-Ford waited for Parnelli to be black flagged.  Later in the year at
    Trenton, with Clark leading and dripping oil, Clark was black flagged.   
    
    It was Mansell who served his penalty for passing Fittipaldi under a
    yellow in Australia while completing a pit stop for fuel and tires. 
    Well timed.
    
    Bjorn. 

RE: penalties

I read recently (in AutoWeek, I think) that the CART officials have ammended 
the rules on stop-and-go and time penalties such that you can no longer service 
the car while the penalty is being served.  The service on Mansell's car in the 
Surfer's Paradise race was perfectly legal, but that loophole has now been 
closed.


RE: CART vs. USAC

Originally, the American Automobile Association (AAA, the US equivalent to the 
AA in Britain) sanction the Indianapolis 500 and the other Championship Car 
races.  Some time in the 1950s, the AAA dropped out of motor sports sanctioning 
and the United States Automobile Club (USAC) took over as the IndyCar 
sanctioning body.  They also sanction a lot of other forms of motor racing in 
the US, most notably sprint cars.  Then, awhile back (1980-ish?), several of 
the major teams in IndyCar racing had a major argument with USAC over what they 
saw as arbitrary, capricious, and detrimental rules changes.  They formed their 
own sanctioning body, Championship Automobile Racing Teams (CART), and ran 
their own championship racing series.  This situation is very much like the 
FISA vs. FOCA dispute in F1 in the early 1970s.  In this case, CART won.  All 
of the IndyCar races switched over to being CART-sanctioned instead of 
USAC-sanctioned.  The one exception is the Indianapolis 500 itself, which is 
now the only IndyCar championship event still sanctioned by USAC.  Although it 
is USAC-sanctioned, the Indy 500 counts towards the CART PPG IndyCar 
Championship (PPG is a manufacturer of automitive paints and the main sponsor 
for the series championship, in case you were wondering).

There are minor rules differences between CART and USAC.  The most notable is 
that USAC allows about 10 inches more turbo boost for engines derived from 
pushrod stock-blocks, such as the Buick/Menard.  The Buick thus gets a power 
advantage at the Indy 500, which is why you see a lot of them there.  The 
bugaboo of the Buick engine has always been reliability.  Most of them blow up 
before the end of the 500 mile race.  Al Unser's 3rd place finish in a Menard 
Lola/Buick last year is the best finish the engine has ever had.  The CART 
rules don't give the Buick a power advantage and so outside of Indy, nearly 
everybody runs the Ford (Cosworth) or Chevy (Ilmor) engines.

--PSW

--PSW

    
    re 147 - Are you sure it was the American TV feed that SKY used? The
    reason I ask is that at some points the American Voice coverage that
    was used didn't tie in with the TV picturtes we were getting. Almost as
    if SKY could pick the pictures they wanted. Still the whole thing ended
    up looking a little tacky and very frustrating to any race fan.
    
    						G.P
    

    re: -2
    
    I don't think PPG Championship points are earned/awarded for the Indy.
    Money yes, but points, I don't believe so

Mansell said that his championship lead had increased to 8 points.

PPG Championship points most definitely ARE awarded for the Indy 500.

--PSW

    
    Spoiler follows :-
    
    
    
    Well, another myth exploded as Mansell wins comfortably on the short
    oval at his first attempt (and only second oval race). Good to see Raul
    Boesel doing so well as well, him being a Jaguar world champion and
    all.
    
    Mark

Could someone please post a championship points table?

Cheers,
Dave.

               <<< OASS::$7$DUA2:[NOTES$LIBRARY]RACERS.NOTE;1 >>>
                             -< Racers and Racing >-
================================================================================
Note 943.134                        Indy 1993                         134 of 134
WFOV12::DOBOSZ_M                                     61 lines   7-JUN-1993 09:02
                      -< IndyCar points after Milwaukee >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "DAVID REININGER" <[email protected]>
 
MARLBORO RACING NEWS -- THE OFFICIAL INDYCAR NEWS SERVICE
=========================================================
 
         1993 PPG INDY CAR WORLD SERIES DRIVER PERFORMANCE CHART
               FOLLOWING THE EVENT OF SUNDAY JUNE 6, 1993
 
                                       RUN
                                        AT TOP TMS LAPS LAPS   MILES
 RANK DRIVER                   PTS STS FIN FIN LED LED  COMP   COMP    
                                                       ( 770)(1248.625)
 ---- ------------------------ --- --- --- --- --- ---- ----  -------- 
   1 NIGEL MANSELL             70   4   4   1  10  109  570  1048.625 
   2 RAUL BOESEL               52   5   4   2   4  103  765  1240.060 
   3 EMERSON FITTIPALDI        51   5   4   1   5   59  738  1214.855 
   4 MARIO ANDRETTI            43   5   4   1   8  111  735  1207.135 
   5 ARIE LUYENDYK             37   5   4   2   3   14  698  1175.445 
   6 BOBBY RAHAL               36   4   3   2   0    0  432   608.830 
   7 TEO FABI                  34   5   5   4   0    0  760  1236.830 
   8 AL UNSER Jr.              27   5   4   4   1   17  710  1152.560 
   9 PAUL TRACY                22   5   1   1   6  287  531   787.800 
  10 JIMMY VASSER              19   5   3   3   0    0  639   978.780 
  11 ROBBY GORDON              17   4   2   3   3    7  557   921.175 
  12 ROBERTO GUERRERO          16   5   2   5   0    0  638   974.815 
  13 SCOTT BRAYTON             16   5   3   6   0    0  513   934.295 
  14 SCOTT PRUETT              12   2   2   7   0    0  297   357.770 
  15 EDDIE CHEEVER             10   4   3   7   0    0  402   873.150 
  16 SCOTT GOODYEAR            10   5   2   7   4   40  590  1060.905 
  17 ROBBIE BUHL                8   4   2   6   0    0  419   507.285 
  18 MARK SMITH                 7   3   3   9   0    0  345   495.520 
  19 DANNY SULLIVAN             5   5   3   8   0    0  422   639.060 
  20 DAVID KUDRAVE              5   2   1   8   0    0  283   283.000 
  21 HIRO MATSUSHITA            5   5   5  10   0    0  740  1208.765 
  22 JOHN ANDRETTI              3   1   1  10   1    2  200   500.000 
  23 STEFAN JOHANSSON           3   4   2  11   0    0  356   767.585 
  24 WILLY T. RIBBS             2   2   2  11   0    0  387   678.000 
  25 MARCO GRECO                2   3   1  11   0    0  220   263.520 
  26 ROSS BENTLEY               1   4   4  12   0    0  530   690.110 
  27 AL UNSER                   1   1   1  12   2   15  199   497.500 
  28 OLIVIER GROUILLARD         1   1   1  12   0    0  191   191.000 
  29 LYN ST. JAMES              0   3   2  13   0    0  451   769.820 
  30 KEVIN COGAN                0   1   1  14   1    4  198   495.000 
  31 GARY BRABHAM               0   1   1  14   0    0   62   173.290 
  32 BUDDY LAZIER               0   4   2  15   0    0  453   568.925 
  33 DAVY JONES                 0   1   1  15   0    0  197   492.500 
  34 GARY BETTENHAUSEN          0   1   1  17   0    0  197   492.500 
  35 STEPHEN GREGOIRE           0   1   1  19   1    1  195   487.500 
  36 MIKE GROFF                 0   1   0  19   1    1  156   156.000 
  37 TONY BETTENHAUSEN          0   1   1  20   0    0  195   487.500 
  38 JEFF WOOD                  0   1   1  20   0    0   88   139.920 
  39 ADRIAN FERNANDEZ           0   2   0  21   0    0  160   172.390 
  40 DIDIER THEYS               0   1   1  22   0    0  193   482.500 
  41 DOMINIC DOBSON             0   1   1  23   0    0  193   482.500 
  42 JIM CRAWFORD               0   1   1  24   0    0  192   480.000 
  43 ANDREA MONTERMINI          0   1   0  25   0    0    9    25.155 
  44 GEOFF BRABHAM              0   1   0  26   0    0  174   435.000 
  45 ANDREA CHIESA              0   1   0  26   0    0    2     5.590 
  46 JEFF ANDRETTI              0   1   0  29   0    0  124   310.000 
  47 STAN FOX                   0   1   0  31   0    0   64   160.000 
  48 NELSON PIQUET              0   1   0  32   0    0   40   100.000 

    Nigel Mansell drove a very mature and well-paced race to win at
    Milwaukee.  In many ways his performance was Prost-like.  Goodyear, 
    Tracy, and Gordon were all consistently faster but DNFd.  Nigel worked
    his way to the front and was ahead when in counted.  Well done.  If
    Nigel had driven with this kind of maturity in F1, Prost, Piquet and
    Senna might only be two-time champions.  Perhaps it's that Nigel is in 
    a totally different environment and is taking advice for the first time 
    in many years.  It bodes well for his being in the Newman-Haas Lola at 
    NHIS in August.  
    
    From the in-car camera it is obvious that Nigel took Rick Mears' advice 
    from Phoenix.  He was turning into 1 and 3 smoothly and under power.  
    On the several laps where he was looking for a way past Mario, it was Mario
    who was driving a Nigel-at-Phoenix, non-oval type line (trying to drive
    around a severe handling problem that necessitating changing the rear
    shocks and springs, etc.)
    
    Bjorn.    

    re .159
    
    Nice table, thanks very much.
    
    Could someone also post the scoring system. Do just the the top 6
    accumulate points as in F1 or are points awarded for fastest laps etc.
    
    Cheers, Paul

    CART Scoring is as follows:
    
    1  - 20 points
    2  - 16
    3  - 14
    4  - 12
    5  - 10
    6  -  8
    7  -  6
    8  -  5
    9  -  4
   10  -  3
   11  -  2
   12  -  1
    
    Pole Position         - 1 point
    Most Laps Led in Race - 1 point

RE: .160

I agree with your assessment.  An excellent race on Mansell's part.  New 
Hampshire International Speedway has a bit of banking in the corners, but it 
has longer straights (and therefore tighter corners) than Milwaukee.  Lap 
speeds are about 20 mph higher than at Milwaukee.  Last year, several of the 
IndyCar drivers said that NHIS drives more like a road course than the other 
1-mile ovals that they race on.  This should work to Mansell's advantage.

I was also impressed at how well Rahal did, given the little time he's had to 
play with the '93 Lola chassis.

--PSW

    So what's this about a truck being on the track causing Mansell to
    crash ?!

I only caught it in passing, as I haven't watch my video yet - I watched
Cheers instead!

But he was third in a train of cars, travelling through a right/left
combination - someone had hit the tyre wall on the first corner,
so the three cars had to go off the racing line to avoid it.

To me, it seemed as if Nigel just couldn't get round properly; he stayed
off line, and just kissed the wall quite heavily.

It definately wasn't a case of omigod, there's a truck in front of me;
more likely a case of "gosh, the cars understeering too much...."

Peter.

Mansell was third in a train going through a right/left combo, as .-1 
describes.  A safety truck was at the entry to the combo, travelling on the 
left, so everybody had to stay right to avoid it.  At the next corner was a car 
in the tyre barrier, which is what the safety truck was heading for.  Everybody 
had to slow down and stay to the right to avoid it.  Mansell simply got too far 
off the racing line, with too much speed, and he didn't quite make it around 
the second corner.  Once his car got off the racing line into the marbles, it 
understeered and he slid sideways to the right and into the wall.

It looked like a rare lapse of judgement on Mansell's part.  It wasn't 
"omigosh, there's a truck in front of me".  He was well past the truck when the 
incident occurred.  But it looked like the truck might have distracted him 
enough that he didn't notice until too late how much the drivers in front of 
him had slowed and how far to the right they were.  A "rookie mistake", if you 
will.

--PSW

I thought Mansells drive was VERY reminescent of Senna -- the Brazillian
is a master at making his slower car just a bit too wide for the faster
car behind to get past. 

And just to prove he was taking a leaf out of his good friend Ayrtons
book, Nigel drove into a wall not far from the finish a la Senna at
Monaco a few years back!

Still, I am finding this series very entertaining. Thrilling, colourful
and not at all predictable.

Terry B.

re.: .166

>>Mansell was third in a train going through a right/left combo, as .-1 
                    ^^^^^^^^^^

    I thought he drove a Lola...or is this another bizarre measure to 
    prevent the leader from running away with the championship ?

    Mike.  

    There is a rumour floating out there that says that Players Ltd will
    participate in 2 races this year and possible enter a car for next
    season, with a possible French/Monaco resident in the drivers seat!
    
    Sounds interesting for sure.
    regards,
    JP

    For the interest of those of you who watch Eurosport (if that's the one
    that doesn't carry ESPN) Indy racing, I was talking to Ben Edwards, who
    does the commentary, yesterday (I know him because my brother sponsored
    him in his FF and FVL days). What happens is that hs sits in a studio
    in Paris getting the same pictures that the punters see, and no
    commentary or backup info of any sort. So he has to think and talk fast
    and he just hopes that what he says appears to come from the correct
    orifice. He is interested in constructive comment and criticism from
    the punters, so I'll pass on anything relevant that I see in here.

    Tell him to get a proper job ;-)

    Believe me, he'd rather be racing!

 >>       There is a rumour floating out there that says that Players Ltd will
 >>       participate in 2 races this year and possible enter a car for next
 >>       season, with a possible French/Monaco resident in the drivers seat!
    
    If you're referring to Senna, he's moved his European pied � terre to
    Portugual. Mind you, that still leaves quite a few current and former
    F1 drivers enjoying one another's company in the Principality.
    
    Salut,
    Edward

    Actually I am referring to Jacques Villeneuve.  He is rumoured to be in
    the seat for possibly the end of this year and all of next.  By Jacques
    I mean Gilles son not brother.
    JP

From: "DAVID REININGER" <[email protected]>
Subject: Portland Friday AM Practice
 
MARLBORO RACING NEWS -- THE OFFICIAL INDYCAR NEWS SERVICE
=========================================================
 
 Budweiser/G.I. Joe's 200
 Portland, Oregon
 Friday, June 25, 1993
 
 
 POS NO  DRIVER                     TIME      SPEED  
 ----------------------------------------------------
  1  4  EMERSON FITTIPALDI          61.539   114.075 
  2 16  STEFAN JOHANSSON            61.966   113.288 
  3 12  PAUL TRACY                  61.983   113.258 
  4 14  ROBBY GORDON                62.263   112.748 
  5  5  NIGEL MANSELL               62.285   112.709 
  6  6  MARIO ANDRETTI              62.405   112.491 
  7  5X NIGEL MANSELL               62.429   112.447 
  8 25  MARK SMITH                  62.589   112.159 
  9  1  BOBBY RAHAL                 62.819   111.750 
 10 10X ARIE LUYENDYK               62.842   111.709 
 11  7  DANNY SULLIVAN              62.857   111.682 
 12  2  SCOTT GOODYEAR              62.930   111.553 
 13 18  JIMMY VASSER                62.943   111.529 
 14  8  TEO FABI                    63.152   111.160 
 15  9  RAUL BOESEL                 63.172   111.126 
 16 75  WILLY T. RIBBS              63.268   110.957 
 17  3  AL UNSER JR.                63.324   110.859 
 18 99  BRIAN TILL                  63.493   110.564 
 19 10  ARIE LUYENDYK               63.877   109.899 
 20 26  MIKE GROFF                  63.996   109.694 
 21 40  ROBERTO GUERRERO            64.187   109.368 
 22 50  DAVE KUDRAVE                64.187   109.368 
 23 22  SCOTT BRAYTON               64.198   109.349 
 24 15X HIRO MATSUSHITA             64.208   109.333 
 25 39  ROSS BENTLEY                65.265   107.561 
 26 11  KEVIN COGAN                 65.431   107.288 
 27 29  OLIVIER GROUILLARD          65.529   107.128 
 28 30  MARCO GRECO                 65.539   107.112 
 29 90  LYN ST. JAMES               66.377   105.760 
 30 15  HIRO MATSUSHITA             67.317   104.282 
 31 19  JOHNNY UNSER                68.436   102.578 
 32 22X SCOTT BRAYTON               NO TIME  NO SPEED
 33 42  JEFF WOOD                   NO TIME  NO SPEED
 
 Track Length: 1.95 Miles

From: "DAVID REININGER" <[email protected]>
Subject: Portland Friday Qualifying
 
MARLBORO RACING NEWS -- THE OFFICIAL INDYCAR NEWS SERVICE
=========================================================
 
 Budweiser/G.I. Joe's 200
 Portland, Oregon
 Friday, June 25, 1993
 
 Qualifying Times
 
 
 POS NO  DRIVER                    TIME       SPEED 
 -- --- ------------------  -      ------    -------
  1  4  EMERSON FITTIPALDI         61.007    115.069
  2  5  NIGEL MANSELL              61.183    114.739
  3 12  PAUL TRACY                 61.575    114.008
  4 14  ROBBY GORDON               62.246    112.778
  5 16  STEFAN JOHANSSON           62.285    112.708
  6  6  MARIO ANDRETTI             62.351    112.589
  7  8  TEO FABI                   62.490    112.338
  8  9  RAUL BOESEL                62.496    112.328
  9  3  AL UNSER JR.               62.498    112.323
 10 25  MARK SMITH                 62.724    111.919
 11  2  SCOTT GOODYEAR             62.892    111.619
 12  1  BOBBY RAHAL                62.909    111.590
 13  7  DANNY SULLIVAN             62.920    111.571
 14 75  WILLY T. RIBBS             63.203    111.071
 15 10  ARIE LUYENDYK              63.231    111.021
 16 40  ROBERTO GUERRERO           63.419    110.693
 17 18  JIMMY VASSER               63.628    110.328
 18 22  SCOTT BRAYTON              63.673    110.250
 19 50  DAVE KUDRAVE               63.812    110.011
 20 26  MIKE GROFF                 64.066    109.574
 21 99  BRIAN TILL                 64.079    109.551
 22 29  OLIVIER GROUILLARD         64.109    109.500
 23 15  HIRO MATSUSHITA            64.468    108.891
 24 11  KEVIN COGAN                65.045    107.926
 25 30  MARCO GRECO                65.116    107.807
 26 39  ROSS BENTLEY               65.555    107.086
 27 90  LYN ST. JAMES              65.847    106.610
 28 19  JOHNNY UNSER               67.565    103.900
 29 42  JEFF WOOD                  NO TIME   NO SPEED
 
 Track Length: 1.95 Miles

From: [email protected] (BILL STEWART)
Subject: Mansell captures pole at Portland 200
 
	PORTLAND, Ore. (UPI) -- Nigel Mansell saved his best for last
Saturday, capturing the pole position for Sunday's Portland 200 on the
final lap of qualifying.
	``I think it's a bit of luck,'' said Mansell, who turned in a top
speed of 115.266 miles per hour on the 1.95-mile road course to edge out
Emerson Fittipaldi for the pole.
	``For me the session was slower,'' Mansell said. ``My car was sliding
a lot more (than yesterday).''
	``You have a lot of racing here between our practice and qualifying
and, for me, the track didn't have as much grip as it did this morning.''
	It marked Mansell's fourth pole of the season. The other three --
Australia, Long Beach and Detroit -- also came on road courses, Mansell's
strong suit from his experience in Formula 1 racing, where all the races
are run on road courses. Mansell was the 1992 Formula 1 champion.
	By winning the pole, Mansell also extended his narrow points lead
over Raul Boesel in the battle for the Indy Car championship. Mansell
added one point Saturday, giving him 72 for the season. Boesel has 68
but starts in the 11th position on Sunday and may have trouble catching
Mansell.
	Mansell seemed more worried about a clean start than he most of his
competitors. Two weeks ago in Detroit, Fittipaldi was black-flagged for
passing Mansell just as the race started.
	Mansell said he had a long talk with CART officials earlier this week
and received a guarantee that the same thing will happen if another
driver tries to get a head start again this week.
	``The briefing tomorrow will probably be very exciting for some of us
and less exciting for others,'' Mansell said. ``I think every driver
will be told that they'll be black-flagged if they overtake me before
the start-finish line.''
	It should make an interesting start, especially since Fittipaldi will
be sitting next to Mansell in the front row.
	``I was very disappointed about what happened at Detroit,''
Fittipaldi said. ``Nigel would not accept it if I was more than a half-
car ahead.''
	``(The officials) made the wrong decision in my opinion. I had a good
start, but Nigel was too slow.''
	However, Mansell certainly wasn't too slow Saturday.
	``I feel my car is fine, but I wasn't fast enough to catch Nigel
today,'' Fittipaldi said.
	Local favorite Mark Smith, who lives in nearby McMinnville, couldn't
ask for much more from his car. The 26-year-old boyish-looking rookie
qualified 6th in his 1992 Penske-Chevy.
	Smith admitted that knowing the track so well helped him to his best
qualifying position of the season, but he said he doesn't ``have a
snowball's chance in hell'' to win Sunday's race.
	The reason, Smith said, is because he has a year-old car while the
top drivers are in new cars.
 
                           Portland 200
                        Qualifying Results
                      At Portland, Ore., June 26
                              ------
	1. Nigel Mansell, Lola-Ford Cosworth, 115.266 mph.
	2. Emerson Fittipaldi, Penske-Chevrolet, 115.069.
	3. Stefan Johansson, Penske-Chevrolet, 114.241.
	4. Paul Tracy, Penske-Chevrolet, 114.008.
	5. Mario Andretti, Lola-Ford Cosworth, 113.379.
	6. Mark Smith, Penske-Chevrolet, 112.973.
	7. Teo Fabi, Lola-Chevrolet, 112.924.
	8. Danny Sullivan, Lola-Chevrolet, 112.791.
	9. Al Unser Jr., Lola-Chevrolet, 112.783.
	10. Robby Gordon, Lola-Ford Cosworth, 112.778.
	11. Raul Boesel, Lola-Ford Cosworth, 112.485.
	12. Mike Groff, Lola-Chevrolet, 112.232.
	13. Willy T. Ribbs, Lola-Ford Cosworth, 111.873.
	14. Arie Luyendyk, Lola-Ford Cosworth, 111.865.
	15. Bobby Rahal, Lola-Chevrolet, 111.777.
	16. Scott Goodyear, Lola-Ford Cosworth, 111.619.
	17. Roberto Guerrero, Lola-Chevrolet, 111.359.
	18. Brian Till, Penske-Chevrolet, 110.734.
	19. Scott Brayton, Lola-Ford Cosworth, 110.606.
	20. Hiro Matsushita, Lola-Ford Cosworth, 110.514.
	21. Olivier Grouillard, Lola-Chevrolet, 110.429.
	22. Jimmy Vasser, Lola-Ford Cosworth, 110.328.
	23. David Kudrave, Lola-Chevrolet, 110.011.
	24. Kevin Cogan, Lola-Chevrolet, 108.642.
	25. Lyn St. James, Lola-Ford Cosworth, 108.120.
	26. Ross Bentley, Lola-Chevrolet, 107.978.
	27. Marco Greco, Lola-Buick, 107.807.
	28. Johnny Unser, Lola-Chevrolet, 105.026.
	29. Jeff Wood, Lola-Ford Cosworth, 105.026.

From: [email protected] (BILL STEWART)
Subject: Fittipaldi wins Portland 200
 
	PORTLAND, Ore. (UPI) -- Emerson Fittipaldi proved he's a man for all
seasons Sunday when he outran the field in both the sun and the rain to
win the Portland 200.
	Fittipaldi trailed only once in the final 75 laps, most of which were
run on a wet track.
	The Brazilian his took his first lead on lap 27 of the 102-lap event
when pole sitter Nigel Mansell slid off the course. That dropped Mansell
to fourth and Fittipaldi soon opened a six-second lead on his closest
competitor, Paul Tracy.
	Then, for the first time in the 10-year history of the race, it began
to rain. It started with a sprinkle on lap 42 and turned to a steady
drizzle four laps later.
	Most of the drivers pitted immediately to change from racing slicks
to rain tires. But Mansell decided to stay with his slicks and managed
to hold the lead for four laps.
	However, the entire field slowly began to gain on Mansell before he
pitted on lap 53 to make a late change to rain tires.
	Fittipaldi took the lead for good, and at one point held as much as a
70-second lead over Mansell and Tracy.
	By the time the rain stopped on lap 70, Fittipaldi was threatening to
lap everybody on the 1.95-mile road course. But Scott Brayton
inadvertently turned it into a race again when he stalled on the back
stretch on lap 92. That brought out a yellow flag for four laps and set
up a trophy dash to the finish.
	However, the second-place Mansell found himself several cars behind
Fittipaldi when racing resumed with six laps remaining. Still, Mansell
managed to pass all but three of the slower cars before coming back to
the start-finish line again.
	That was all the cushion Fittipaldi needed, though, as he coasted
across the finish line 4.4 seconds ahead of Mansell.
	Tracy wound up third and was the only other car on the lead lap at
the finish. Fourth place went to Bobby Rahal, Al Unser Jr. finished
fifth and Mario Andretti wound up sixth.
	With his second-place finish, Mansell extended his lead for the
overall season championship. Mansell has 87 points. Raul Boesel, who
finished seventh Sunday, is second in the points race with 74.
Fittipaldi is third with 72.
	There were two big disappointments in the race Sunday. One was Stefan
Johannson, who qualified in the No. 3 position, but finished 26th. He
completed just 37 laps before his transmission gave out.
	The other was local favorite Mark Smith of McMinnville, who qualified
No. 6, but was the first driver out of the race. He ran just six laps
before his transmission failed.
 
                          Portland 200
                   At Portland, Ore., June 27
                          Final Results
        1, Emerson Fittipaldi, Brazil, 102 laps, 96.312 average speed.
	2, Nigel Mansell, Clearwater, Fla., 102, 96.225. 
	3, Paul Tracy, Canada, 102, 96.179. 
	4, Bobby Rahal, Dublin, Ohio, 101, 95.243. 
	5, Al Unser Jr., Albuquerque, N.M., 101, 95.189.
        6, Mario Andretti, Nazareth, Pa., 101, 94.867. 
	7, Raul Boesel, Brazil, 100, 94.420. 
	8, Robby Gordon, Orange, Calif., 100, 94.416.
	9, Mike Groff, Los Angeles, Calif., 100, 94.114. 
	10, Arie Luyendyk, Holland, 99, 93.368.
        11, Jimmy Vasser, Discovery Bay, Calif., 99, 92.602. 
	12, Scott Goodyear, Canada, 98, no time. 
	13, Olivier Grouillard, France, 98, 91.947. 
	14, Danny Sullivan, Aspen, Colo., 97, 91.257. 
	15, Ross Bentley, Canada, 97, 90.746.
        16, Willy T. Ribbs, San Jose, Calif., 95, 89.304. 
	17, Scott Brayton, Coldwater, Mich., 95, 89.229. 
	18, Johnny Unser, Ketchum, Idaho, 93, 87.216. 
	19, Marco Greco, Brazil, 93, 87.048. 
	20, Lyn St. James, Dayton Beach, Fla., 92, 86.168.
        21, Hiro Matsushita, San Clemente, Calif., 87, off course.
	22, Brian Till, Columbus, Ohio, 70, off course. 
	23, David Kudrave, Los Angeles, Calif., 64, transmission. 
	24, Robert Guerrero, San Juan Capistrano, Calif., 47, crash. 
	25, Teo Fabi, Italy, 44, engine.
        26, Stefan Johansson, Monaco, 37, transmission. 
	27, Kevin Cogan, Palos Verdes, Calif., 21, engine. 
	28, Jeff Wood, Wichita, Kan., 13, suspension. 
	29, Mark Smith, McMinnville, Ore. 6, transmission.

    
    Anyone know who won Yesterday ?
    
    
    Thanks.
    Garry
    

    1	Paul Tracey
    2	Emerson Fittipaldi
    3	Nigel Mansell
    4	Raul Boesel (I Think)
    
    Paul

Subject: Tracy wins Cleveland Grand Prix
Date: Sun, 11 Jul 93 15:38:05 PDT
 
                     United Press International
	CLEVELAND (UPI) -- After Paul Tracy won the pole for the Budweiser
Grand Prix of Cleveland, IndyCar officials closely inspected the Penske
chassis, removing what they claimed was a traction control device to the
rear wheels.
	The Penske team denied using traction control, but in Sunday's race
Tracy had total control of the outcome, leading 69 of 85 laps to win the
second race of his IndyCar career at Burke Lakefront Airport on the
shores of Lake Erie in front of 60,000 fans.
	The 24-year-old Toronto native also won the race from the pole, which
included a $100,000 bonus from Marlboro. Tracy's win was also the 75th
IndyCar victory for team owner Roger Penske.
	With Tracy winning the race by 18.090 seconds, the real race was
staged between his teammate, Emerson Fittipaldi, and Nigel Mansell, who
was driving with a wrist that was injured when the British driver fell
in Saturday's post-qualifying press conference.
	Fittipaldi won the battle, finishing second with Mansell third.
Stefan Johansson was fourth and Mario Andretti fifth.
	``You never expect to run away with a race,'' Tracy said. ``We
gradually built a lead, and that really helped us win the race. Pit
stops were the key for us today. After the first stop, we jumped ahead
by about 10 seconds.
	``It's tough to be too far ahead because it's difficult to see what
everyone else is doing, and also to keep your concentration at the level
it needs to be. You have to be real careful in traffic.
	``You can make one mistake and you can lose the lead and be right
back in traffic. You have to be consistent.''
	The only mistake Tracy made came at the start, when the boost level
of his turbocharger was down one-tenth of an inch, which caused the pop-
off valve to blow. Tracy did not have time to reach over and adjust the
boost, and Mansell was able to drive past Tracy and take the lead in the
first turn.
	``The pop-off valve blew so I didn't have full power at the start,''
Tracy said. ``That allowed Nigel to go by me.''
	Mansell took the opportunity to capitalize on Tracy's underpowered
vehicle by speeding past him to take the lead for the first 14 laps.
	``Paul and I discussed the start and we talked a lot about it at the
driver's meeting,'' Mansell said. ``Paul went wide and I elected to go
inside and got the lead.
	``It was a shame that Bobby Rahal and some others got into it behind
us on that first turn.''
	With Mansell taking the lead from Tracy at the start, six cars were
involved in a crash in the first turn which involved defending PPG Indy
Car World Series champion Bobby Rahal, Roberto Guerrero, Raul Boesel,
Willy T. Ribbs, Scott Goodyear and Arie Luyendyk. Everyone was able to
continue except for Rahal and Guerrero.
	``I had a good start on the outside, I was following Danny Sullivan
and I passed a bunch of guys,'' Rahal said. ``Then, somebody hit me from
behind. I started to slide and then gain control, but somebody hit me
again.
	``Finally, Guerrero hit me in the side. It doesn't give our
championship hopes a very good shot. We had a good car today and, with a
good start, we could have run close to the front.''
	Tracy regained the lead from Mansell when he passed him in the rear
straight of the 2.369-mile, 10-turn road course between turns two and
three. He would lead 59 of the next 61 laps to easily win the second
race of his career.
 
                Budweiser Grand Prix of Cleveland
                   At Cleveland, Ohio, July 11
        1, Paul Tracy, 1993 PenskePC93-Chevrolet C, 85. 
	2, Emerson Fittipaldi, PenskePC93- Chevrolet C, 85. 
	3, Nigel Mansell, '93 Lola-Ford, 85. 
	4, Stefan Johansson, '93 PenskePC93-Chevrolet C, 84. 
	5, Mario Andretti, '93 Lola-Ford, 84. 
	6, Robby Gordon, '93 Lola-Ford, 84.
        7, Raul Boesel, '93 Lola-Ford, 84. 
	8, Teo Fabi, '93 Lola-Chevy C, 84. 
	9, Brian Till, '92 PenskePC92-Chevrolet B, 83. 
	10, Arie Luyendyk, '93 Lola-Ford, 83. 
	11, Olivier Grouillard, '92 Lola-Chevrolet A, 82.
	12, Hiro Matsushita, '93 Lola-Ford, 81.
        13, Kevin Cogan, '93 Lola-Chevrolet C, 81. 
	14, Danny Sullivan, '93 Lola-Chevrolet 80. 
	15, Mark Smith, '92 PenskePC92-Chevrolet B, 79. 
	16, Ross Bentley, '92 Lola-Chevrolet A, 79. 
	17, Jeff Wood, '91 Lola-Cosworth, 76. 
	18, Scott Brayton, '93 Lola-Chevrolet C, 74.
        19, Al Unser, Jr., '93 Lola-Chevrolet C, 73. 
	20, Scott Goodyear, '93 Lola-Ford, 67. 
	21, Buddy Lazier, '91 Lola-Chevrolet A, 61. 
	22, Marco Greco, '92 Lola-Chevrolet A, 50. 
	23, Lyn St. James, '93 Lola-Chevrolet 48. 
	24, Robbie Buhl, '92 Lola-Chevrolet A, 39.
        25, Christian Danner, '92 Lola-Chevrolet A, 35. 
	26, Brian Bonner, '91 Lola-Chevrolet A, 17. 
	27, Willy T. Ribbs, '92 Lola-Ford, 12. 
	28, Bobby Rahal, '93 Lola-Chevrolet, 0. 
	29, Roberto Guerrero, '93 Lola-Chevrolet C, 0.

        Time of Race: 1 hour, 34 minutes, 27.254 seconds. Average Speed:
127.913. Margin of Victory: 18.090 seconds. Lead Changes: 6 among 2
drivers. Caution Periods: 1 for 4 laps.

    Tracy was the class of the field once again.  He was pushing (put
    wheels off at track out a couple of times with no damage and little loss
    of time) but under control and simply motored off.  The dice between
    Emmo and Nigel that lasted for about ten laps near the end was some of
    the most sustained, toughest, and fairest racing I've seen.  It
    epitomized what two experienced, professional drivers can do:  passing
    and re-passing, side-by side through corners on several occasions, all 
    without contact.
    
    Bjorn.

    Toronto was another Penske 1-2, but the competition was closer than at
    Cleveland (see RACERS 943.157-160 for details.)  The field was tightly
    bunched after qualifying with Emmo on the pole at 58.256 seconds and
    the next twelve cars within O.965 seconds.  Nigel had a bad weekend
    with a crash on Friday in the T car and another on Saturday in the race
    car; the T car had to be rebuilt for qualifying.  He qualified 9th,
    0.576 seconds behind Emmo and 0.389 seconds ahead of Mario.  Nigel
    fell back early in the race, moved up through attrition, and eventually 
    retired with low boost due to a suspected cracked header (undetected 
    crash damage?).  Next up are the 2-mile, 230+ mph banked oval at
    Michigan and the 1-mile, 170+ mph lightly banked oval at NHIS.
    
    Bjorn.  

The diagnosis on Mansell's car is a problem with the turbocharger wastegate, 
which caused the engine to gradually lose boost over the race.  Eventually the 
wastegate assembly caught fire and forced his retirement.

--PSW

    Thanks for the clarification on Nigel's engine problem.  Emmo had a
    wastegate problem at Long Beach, I believe.  They took one from the
    spare car, and he continued on to try to pick up points.  He finished
    out of the points in 13th, 3 laps down.
    
    Bjorn.

    
    Can anyone post the new points table as it stands now.
    
    
    Nick.

PPG IndyCar World Championship standings after Toronto:

Points	Driver

105	Fittipaldi
102	Mansell
 86	Boesel
 83	Tracy
 80	Mario Andretti
 70	Rahal
 55	Al Unser, Jr
 43	Luyendyk
 43	Gordon
 40	Sullivan
 39	Fabi
 23	Vasser
 19	Guerrero
 18	Goodyear
 16	Brayton
 15	Johansson
 12	Montermini
 12	Pruett
 10	Cheever
  8	Buhl
  7	Smith
  6	Fernandez
  6	Groff
  6	Matsushita
  5	Kudrave
  4	Till
  3	John Andretti
  3	Ribbs
  3	Grouillard
  2	Greco
  1	Bentley
  1     Al Unser, Sr.
  1	Gachot

From: [email protected] (Jay Smith)

                       PPG IndyCar World Series Standings
 
                        |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  | N|  |  |  |  |  |
                        |  |  |  | I|  |  |  |  |  |  | E| R|  |  |  |  |
                        |  |  |  | N|  |  |  |  |  |  | W| O|  |  |  | L|
                        |  |  | L| D|  |  |  |  |  |  |  | A|  |  |  | A|
                        | A|  | O| I| M|  |  | C|  |  | H| D| V|  |  | G|
                        | U|  | N| A| I|  | P| L|  | M| A|  | A| M| N| U|
                        | S| P| G| N| L| D| O| E| T| I| M| A| N| I| A| N|
                        | T| H|  | A| W| E| R| V| O| C| P| M| C| D| Z| A|
                        | R| O| B| P| A| T| T| E| R| H| S| E| O|  | A|  |  T
                        | A| E| E| O| U| R| L| L| O| I| H| R| U| O| R| S|  O
                        | L| N| A| L| K| O| A| A| N| G| I| I| V| H| E| E|  T
                        | I| I| C| I| E| I| N| N| T| A| R| C| E| I| T| C|  A
Driver                  | A| X| H| S| E| T| D| D| O| N| E| A| R| O| H| A|  L
------------------------|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|---
 1. Emerson Fittipaldi  |17|  |  |20|14|  |21|16|17|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |105
 2. Nigel Mansell       |21|  |15|14|20| 1|17|14|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |102
 3. Raul Boesel         | 5|16| 1|12|18|16| 6| 6| 6|  |  |  |  |  |  |  | 86
 4. Paul Tracy          |  | 1|21|  |  | 4|14|22|21|  |  |  |  |  |  |  | 83
 5. Mario Andretti      |12|20|  |11|  |14| 8|10| 5|  |  |  |  |  |  |  | 80
 6. Bobby Rahal         | 8|  |16|  |12|10|12|  |12|  |  |  |  |  |  |  | 70
 7. Al Unser, Jr.       |  |12|  | 5|10| 8|10|  |10|  |  |  |  |  |  |  | 55
 8= Robby Gordon        |14|  |  |  | 3| 5| 5| 8| 8|  |  |  |  |  |  |  | 43
 8= Arie Luyendyk       |10| 8| 2|17|  |  | 3| 3|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  | 43
10. Danny Sullivan      |  |  | 5|  |  |21|  |  |14|  |  |  |  |  |  |  | 40
11. Teo Fabi            | 4|10|12| 4| 4|  |  | 5|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  | 39
12. Jimmy Vasser        |  |14|  |  | 5|  | 2|  | 2|  |  |  |  |  |  |  | 23
13. Roberto Guerrero    |  |  |10|  | 6|  |  |  | 3|  |  |  |  |  |  |  | 19
14. Scott Goodyear      | 3| 1|  | 6|  | 3| 1|  | 4|  |  |  |  |  |  |  | 18
15. Scott Brayton       |  |  |  | 8| 8|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  | 16
16. Stefan Johansson    | 1|  |  | 2|  |  |12|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  | 15
17= Andrea Montermini   |  |  |  |  |  |12|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  | 12
17= Scott Pruett        |  | 6| 6|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  | 12
19. Eddie Cheever       | 6|  | 4|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  | 10
20. Robbie Buhl         |  |  | 8|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  8
21. Mark Smith          |  | 4| 3|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  7
22= Adrian Fernandez    |  |  |  |  |  | 6|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  6
22= Mike Groff          |  |  |  |  |  | 2| 4|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  6
22= Hiro Matsushita     | 2| 3|  |  |  |  |  | 1|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  6
25. Dave Kudrave        |  | 5|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  5
26. Brian Till          |  |  |  |  |  |  |  | 4|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  4
27= John Andretti       |  |  |  | 3|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  3
27= Olivier Grouillard  |  |  |  |  | 1|  |  | 2|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  3
27= Willy T. Ribbs      |  |  |  |  | 2| 1|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  3
30. Marco Greco         |  | 2|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  2
31= Ross Bentley        |  | 1|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  1
31= Bertrand Gachot     |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  | 1|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  1
31= Al Unser            |  |  |  | 1|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  1

    
    Anybody catch the result from the weekend?
    
    POL
    

    Mansell won it, dunno about the other placings. At one point Mansell
    had lapped the entire field!
    
    Dave.
    

    
    1. Mansell
    2. Andretti
    3. Lyndyk (sp)
    4. Bosel
    
    Mansell lead something like 221 laps of 250 . At the end the only 
    cars on the lead lap were mansell and andretti. At one point I think
    the least number on laps down was 2. Fittapaldi had lots of trouble,
    loads of tyre changes, Johanssan kissed the wall.
    
    Garry

    	Mansell finished 9 seconds ahead of Mario. Mansell had to be
    	helped out of the car. Mario looked like he could go again.
    	Of course, Mansell has done just two 500-milers while Mario
    	has done a few more.
    
    	Scott

re -1

The report in todays Times said that Nigel was suffering from a headache
and had soluable asprin in his drinking water. Perhaps this accounts for
having to be helped out of his car. The Times article did not say why
Nigel had a headache.

	Dave

I think most people would have a headache if they drove at speeds averaging
210mph with a maximum of 250mph for nearly 3 hours, over what appeared to be
off-road conditions !

In his first drive around the circuit at speed last Thursay, after 7 laps
he pitted the car, ran down the pit lane, and then and had a very animated
conversation with the head marshall about the condition of the surface.  He
later said that he was shaken around so much that he had blurred vision !

A lot of drivers passed comment on the executive suite that had recently been
built between turns 1 and 2.  They indicated that the money should have gone
resurfacing the racetrack.  The last time it had been resufaced was in 1985
and that each year the reace track is covered with 5 feet of snow.  This
weathers the surface through freeze/thaw and causes a lot of damage.  The
drivers were reportedly in agreement that it would take a lot for them to
return next year unless the track was resurfaced.

It was an excellent race ( for Mansell anyway :-) ) and an awesome display
of what he can do on the day.  At one point I thought he was overstretching
himself by going too fast for too long but I was proved wrong when Mario
caught him up.  It turned out to be an exciting finish with Mario and Nigel
fighting their way through the traffic.  Racing 4 cars abreast on the turns
was quite a sight !


Steven

    I was watching the race on Eurosport (shame I came across it � way
    through) anyway at one point the commentators got onto the subject of
    Micheal Andretti and the American commentator said that he drives
    untidy and in Indy car racing you can get away with it but with F1 you
    can't! 
    
    There was also a comment about Nigels car holding out but they were not
    sure about him! Headaches were mentioned and there were some comments
    about (and you could see for yourself from the forward onboard camera)
    his head bouncing around. 
    
    In the end was he the only driver below the 32 second lap?
    
    Dave

Michigan International Speedway always has been a bumpy track, compared to 
Indianapolis (the other high-speed oval that IndyCars race on), because of the 
much colder weather.  The place could stand repaving.

Mansell's headache problems were due to the high speed buffeting combined with 
the heat.  I've noticed that even Brits who are not involved in strenuous 
exercise take a few years to fully acclimatize themselves to US summers, which 
are much hotter and more humid than what you get in the UK.  Conditions must be 
absolutely stifling having to wear a full nomex suit in a race car for 500 
miles.  Give Mansell a few years and he'll be used to Michigan.

The Newman/Haas team was the class of the field at the Michigan 500.  In 
qualifying, Mario was on pole with a new course record and Nigel was right next 
to him.  Everybody else was over 5 mph slower.

In the early part of the race, Mario got off to a great start and left 
everybody else behind.  Mansell was out-dragged at the start by Boesel and 
Luyendyk, but he re-passed in the first few laps and then set after Mario.  
After a small fight, he got past Mario, and that more or less was that.  
Mansell had tremendous luck with the pit stops.  Two times, he had just gone 
into the pits and then a full-course yellow was thrown, which is the best thing 
that can happen, because they close pit lane for one lap until the pace car 
picks up the field.  With this bit of luck, Mansell ended up putting the entire 
field except for Mario permanently a lap down.  Towards the very end of the 
race, he had put Mario down a lap, as well, but Mario fought back and unlapped 
himself.  Nigel drove the last 1/2 lap VERY conservatively, which is how Mario 
was able to close up to 9 seconds back.  Until the last half of the last lap, 
he'd been more like 20 seconds back.

It was a staggering performance.  Mansell had a dominant car and he and the 
Newman/Haas team seized the opportunity with both hands, didn't make any 
mistakes, and had the luck go their way.

--PSW

I don't believe a word of it! Everyone knows Mansell wrecks cars, how could he
drive one over such a great distance, faster than anyone else, and keep it
together. Must have been someone else with a Mansell mask on and a false limp.

Dave.

    RE: .196
    
>>It was a staggering performance.  Mansell had a dominant car and he and the 
>>Newman/Haas team seized the opportunity with both hands, didn't make any 
>>mistakes, and had the luck go their way.
    
    Did you see the expression on Paul Newmans face when Nige crossed the
    line, to put it mildly he was a happy man.
    
    Dave

No question that the Lola Fords were the class of the field. The Penskes weren't 
in it at all. In fact, Fitti hasn't had such a poor qualifying in years. Hmmmm? 
Why? They've been good at the short ovals and great on the road courses.

Mansell showed how fast he learns. He was barely slower than Mario in qualifying, 
and he cut a bunch of quick race laps. Very impressive. The in-car cameras really 
demo'd how much wind buffetting there is. Combined with the roughness of the 
track, it must have been brutal. Ol' Nige looked like he'd been through hell at 
the end. Mario just smiled.

Paul

	>> Ol' Nige looked like he'd been through hell at the end. 

Ol' Nige always looks that way - if for no other reason than it makes his
whining look more convincing.

	>> Mario just smiled.

Mario always smiles when he finishes in the podium - except if he had to contend
with passing Al Unser Jr. for the position.

			-- Carlos.

    The paper mention Nige being physically sick during the race

    	For those of you who live in the New England area of the US and read
    this conference, Nigel Mansell and/or his car will be at the Londonderry 
    K-Mart from 12:30 PM this afternoon till sometime Thursday afternoon. 
    Their phone number is (603) 434-8533
    
    	Emmo/Tracey/Buhel/Bossel/Arie will be at the Granite Street Bar and 
    Grill in Manchester NH this Thursday starting around 6:15 PM till 9:00 PM.
    Penske will bring their $1.2 million dollar simulator, it will be there 
    from Thursday till Saturday.

    PS - The possibility of Nige coming to K-Mart
         in little old Londonderry NH, who would have 
         thought it possible a year ago...
    
    								-mike-

RE: .199

The performance of the Lola/Fords is even more surprising when you consider 
that Roger Penske owns Michigan International Speedway and tests extensively on 
this track.  If there was anywhere where the Penskes should have had the 
advantage, you'd have thought it was at MIS.

--PSW

    re: the last few
    
    I agree that Nigel did a great job on Sunday.  He had the horse and he
    rode it very well.  That he was a lot more tired than Mario after the
    race had more to do with the level of tension he must have felt
    throughout the race than with his fitness level compared to Mario.  How
    many IndyCar 500 mile races has Mario run over the years at Indy,
    Ontario, Pocono, and Michigan - somewhere between 50 and 75?  Mario
    simply has a much higher comfort level at these speeds than Nigel.  The
    Fords dominated the Chevy-powered cars at this high speed track.  In
    qualifying (and the early part of the race) only Tracy was even close. 
    However, the Ford's significant power advantage at the top end seems to
    be equalized by the Chevy's better midrange power at the slower tracks. 
    The rest of the year should be more competitive.
    
    I was at NHIS on Monday for a Porsche Club driver's school (no, I can't
    afford a Porsche, but they let me run my BMW 1600).  The groove (about
    ten feet wide) had been repaved at both ends of the oval.  We were
    using the south end oval turn as part of the 1.75 mile road course but
    were banned from the new pavement by a row of densely spaced cones
    (we pit-ed out on the apron.)  Reducing the width of the track made the
    turn a little slower but it was fun to work the higher groove.  I'm
    hoping that the new pavement will hold up this weekend so that we can
    have a good race on Sunday.
    
    Bjorn.      

"Attention K-Mart Shoppers..."

I wonder what sort of Blue Light Specials Nigel will find intesting?

Paul

>    rode it very well.  That he was a lot more tired than Mario after the
>    race had more to do with the level of tension he must have felt
>    throughout the race than with his fitness level compared to Mario.  How
>    many IndyCar 500 mile races has Mario run over the years at Indy,

Nige has always looked tired at the end of races. 

    Since the new K-Mart store is only about a mile from my house in
    Londonderry NH...I went over about 9:30 PM (they close at 10 PM)
    and there only a few cars in the lot when I pulled up.
    
    I walked to the stores entrance thinking this is so strange only a year
    ago this store didn't even exist it was an empty field, and Nigel was
    very much involved in F1. Now a year later I'm walking into a K-Mart in
    little old Londonderry NH - looking for Nigel Mansell's Indy car? Yeah
    right...
    
    But as I opened the door to walk in....there it stood...the red 5 Lola
    with Nigel's name on the cockpit! It looked so strange sitting there
    surrounded by all the products sold by K-Mart.
    
    So for 15 minutes I walked around, looked under, and around Nigel's
    car. People walked past, but really didn't seem to care or realize just
    who's car it was...
    
    What a difference a year can make...
    
    								-mike-
    
    PS - I will be cross-posting this note in the racers 
         conference.

It's only a model..... (or at least 'only' the show car.)  Still wish I could
see it in person too.

Dave

    re: .206
    
    If Nigel stays in IndyCars (we on this side of the Atlantic can at least
    hope that he does), I'm sure we'll find him less "bushed" the next time
    around at Michigan.
    
    Bjorn.

    ...but you can bet his detractors will be no less zealous.
    
    Mike

I get real hacked off with the detractors. Sure "our Nige" ain't Mr personality
and is portrayed as a whinger. I'm not one of his fanatical supporters but I
also know damn well that he is doing something that very very few of us could
come even close to. The British really are an impossible race. If you win then
you get attacked, if you lose you are a hero (if you are British). Every race
driver has their individual failings, AJF was as grizzly as they come, Reutemann
was ever so communicative wasn't he, Senna single minded, Prost has had his fair
share of "spoiled brat" incidents in his time, Hunt and Piquet both have stories
concerning fists, John Young Stewart was considered a real trouble maker in his
time but drivers don't killed so often these days do they, I could go on and on,
there are plenty of not so famous drivers (personal experience of marshalling)
who would put all the above into the realm of angel, believe me.

Why not appreciate all of them for what they are when they are in the car.
Racers. If they ain't RACERS they aren't worth the mention. Mansell IS a racer,
as is Andretti (both of them) MA probably does need time to ajust to precision
driving as stated earlier, who knows, all I remember were the years in Indycar
where he was a racer.

    I agree people should lay off the personality critiques.  

    However once Prost (aka Nosy Al) *gets* a personality then - for me 
    anyway - it'll be open season on him ;-)
             
    Mike

    Re last few
    
    I agree, love him or hate him, if Mansell wins the CART championship
    first time, and back-to-back with his world championship then that will
    be a BRILLIANT performance. In fact he's already done enough to be
    pretty impressive. He took a big risk of his career going down the
    tubes (imagine the glee from his detractors if he'd performed like
    Andretti jnr has in F1) and it paid off.

    250 times around in an oval, I'm not suprised he had a headache. Pit
    stops must help break the boardom for the drivers, as the pace car does
    for the fans. 
    
    
    Robert.

    re: .213
    
    I agree Nigel, Nigel has been very impressive this year.  I'm looking
    forward to Sunday.
    
    re: .214
    
    "Pit stops must help break the boardom for the drivers, as the pace car
    does for the fans."
    
    Trust me, the drivers aren't bored (did Nigel look bored after the
    race?) and neither are the fans.
    
    Bjorn.

Raul Boesel was fastest in Friday practice at New Hampshire.  There is the 
threat of rain on Saturday washing out the qualifying session, meaning that 
Friday's practice times will be used to form the grid, as happened last year 
when Saturday was rained out.  Therefore, all the teams treated the Friday 
practice sessions like qualifying sessions.  Boesel lapped the 1.06 miles in 
under 23 seconds, for a 167.1 mph lap speed.  Mansell was second fastest at 
167.9 mph.  Fittipaldi 3rd with 166.6 mph.

--PSW

�practice sessions like qualifying sessions.  Boesel lapped the 1.06 miles in 
�under 23 seconds, for a 167.1 mph lap speed.  Mansell was second fastest at
�167.9 mph.              ^^^^^                             ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
 ^^^^^
    ???
    
    Did Mansell take the scenic route ?. I know he takes a high line - as
    he laps the rest of them - but surely the distance isn't that much
    greater ;-)
    
    Mike

Mansell is on the pole for the race...

Peter.

    Today's race was truly an oustanding performance by Nigel in the
    context of a great race with Tracy and Emmo.  Watching it on tape delay
    after coming home from the track confirmed my first-hand
    impressions.  Nigel showed all of his good qualities in this race.  He
    was quick, smooth, decisive in traffic, persistent, and used his
    new-found patience to finally block in Tracy to set up the final pass
    (Stefan Johansson was the backmarker this time just like in Hungary 
    several years ago.)  Nigel's performance this weekend in both
    qualifying (outqualifying Mario for the first time on an oval) and
    the race, arguably his best of the year, establishes him as a fully 
    accomplished oval driver, a level he's reached faster than any F1 
    driver since Jim Clark.
    
    Bjorn.   

    What an amazing last few laps. I was gobstruck when Nige managed to get
    past after the first failed attempt. Mind you from an in car shot a few 
    laps previous he was lucky he didn't loose the rear end of his car when
    another got mighty close, but backed off just in time.
    
    I was surprised that the stands looked far from full!?
    
    Previously I thought it was boring watching cars going round and round on 
    an oval but now following a particular driver this has changed. The
    commentators said something about blocking that is starting to be used
    more...
    
    When's the next race? I only caught the tail end of a conversation on
    Eurosport when they were talking about most of the remaining races
    would normally suit Nige as they are street/racing circuits? Can
    someone fill me in with when and where they are and circuit type...
    
    Also what happened between Mario and ? From the hand actions and facial
    expressions etc., when the 2 drivers were talking later, it looked like
    Mario was almost apologetic. Mind you the commentator said that Mario
    is someone who generally doesn't apologetize even if he was in the
    wrong!
    
    Now for the Murray Walker kiss of death! Has any driver won the F1/Indy
    championships in successive years (or visa versa)?
    
    Dave

    Best Indy Oval race I have seen, but then the circuit was slower and
    hence the passing was more frantic! But (fellow noters beware....change
    of character coming)
    
    great drive by "Their Nige" good tactics, good in traffic (one move
    reminded me of his pass on Senna in Hungary when he was at Ferrari),
    and not all exhausted at the end! One other thought struck me, it was
    nice to see him celebrate with his kids at the end, like at a UK Club
    type meeting, F1 could do with getting back to this a bit.
    
    However, lets see him win the title, and then get back to the real
    quality, F1, and show Prost he's really No3 behind Senna and Mansell.
    
    Paul

    
    Another "dizzying" victory for Mansell.  
    
    I watched it live on Eurosport and enjoyed it, especially the last few
    laps, that was racing !
    
    Robert.

    
    Has Bernie Ecclestone got access to Paul's account?
    
    Great race, brilliantly judged win by Mansell, forget F1 - I want to
    see RACING!!!!!!
    
    Mark

    Still here Mark? Does Bob Palmer know this?
    
    Last night was a good comparison with the first few laps at Silverstone
    and the Senna charge at Hockenheim. Its all racing - but the quality
    goes deeper in F1.
    
    Paul

Anyone know if Eurosport will repeat the New Hampshire race? I was driving
back from the Mother-in-laws! AAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHH!

M

    I believe it's repeated this afternoon (during Office hours!)

    Mansell going into Cart has definately raised the caliber of racing
    and I agree...  yesterday's race was excellent... far better than any
    F1 race in the past couple seasons...   and on an oval yet!
    
    F1 had better stand up and take notice else all its drivers will soon be
    racing in America.
    
    
    I usually tape each race and then tape over it at the next one, but
    this one I'll keep. 
    
    
    Happy 40th birthday Mr. Mansell!
    
    
    Dale

Anyone got this on tape or an idea if Eurosport will rerun it other than whilst
I'm sitting here typing this? I'm in Warrington on 851-1458 if someone can
oblige.

    Wow!!!
    
    What a race...what can you say. The previous notes described the race
    very well, but you really had to be there.
    
    To have thousands of people singing happy birthday to Nigel, the
    weather turned out to be great...and of course that battle between
    Nigel, Tracey, and Emmo right to the end!
    
    New England was treated to a very good automobile race!
   
    I was very glad to be there.
    
    PS - Cross-posted in RACERS conference.
    								-mike-

at 5:00 pm today for one hour. I don't think they show them again, but
I'll check the listings just in case.

Peter.

RE: .220

I was at the New England 200.  The main grandstand was sold out, but there
were still some empty seats in the grandstands at turns 1 and 4.  Things looked 
quite a bit emptier on TV than they actually were because a lot of people were 
watching the race standing along the fence by the track, instead of in their 
assigned seats.  There's no question, though, that there were fewer people here 
than last month, when the NASCAR Winston Cup 300 mile race was held.  That 
isn't too surprising--stock car racing is more popular than IndyCar in the US.

The next race is at the Road America facility in Elkhart Lake, Wisconsin.  It's 
a road course.  It will be held in 2 weeks, on 22 August.  After that come 
these races (this is the correct order, but I don't know the dates):

	Vancouver, British Columbia (temporary street circuit)
	Mid Ohio, Ohio (permanent road course)
	Nazareth, Pennsylvania (1-mile oval)
	Laguna Seca, California (permanent road course)

The incident with Mario happened leaving turn 4.  Scott Goodyear and Mario 
Andretti were both running in a lot of traffic.  Scott and Mario were both 
taking higher than usual lines through turn 4.  It looked like Scott got a 
little too high while traveling a little too fast and went into the wall along 
the start/finish straight.  Mario was committed to a line coming out of the 
corner, and being in traffic anyway, had little choice but to collect him.  
Mario's car suffered some right side damage.  Scott's car had the suspension 
badly bent on the right side, with the wheels pointing every which way, and lot 
a wheel on the left where Mario hit him.  Fortunately, both drivers escaped 
without injury.

--PSW

Anyone know if the race broadcast will be repeated in the US?  I was flying back
from Toronto.  AAAAAAARRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGHHHHHHH!!!

				-- Carlos.

    Fans, forget about the repeats - you'll be able to see Nige win again 
    in 2 weeks. 'til then, lets all just try and get some sleep.
    
    M.

    In case you weren't aware, my local ITV station showed highlights of
    the Sunday race just after midnight last night. I may be worth checking
    the schedules to see if your local ITV station does the same. BTW it
    was Yorkshire TV.
    
    Now I have to admit that the thought of cars going round in
    circles/ovals didn't really appeal to me but I thought I'd watch
    because Nige won.
    
    Boy, what a race! I am now a convert.  ROll on the next race.
    
    malcolm

    >>  Boy, what a race! I am now a convert.  ROll on the next race.
    
    All the more reason to get Satellite, Malcolm.
    
    ;^)

    re .-1
    
    I had meant to add to my previous note -
    
    "So if I bring a couple of four packs, can I watch it at your house
    Greg??'
    
     8^))
    
    malcolm

    >> "So if I bring a couple of four packs,
    
    Sound's like a good deal. What would you drink though?
    
    Greg

    re -1
    
    8^)

Date: 10 Aug 93 00:07:49 GMT
Organization: Microsoft Corp.
Lines: 32

This is from the teams press release after yesterdays IndyCar race at Loudon,
New Hampshire (VIA CIS):


NIGEL MANSELL - "It was just a beautiful race.  Fantastic.  And Paul [Tracy]
is correct - I actually did learn how to race on a mile-oval more today than I
did in Milwaukee.
     "You couldn't have asked for a better race.  Whoever won didn't matter -
the race was fantastic.
     "...I've got no problem here today admitting that I learned some moves I
didn't even know about today.
     "This is pure racing at its best.  I've been in some races in the past.
Wheel-to-wheel at 200 mph with Ayrton Senna, and I'll tell you it doesn't even
come close to what we've done today, I don't think.  You see, what you have is
traffic, and racing through traffic.  And you have to have discipline out
there.
     "This is pure racing right here.  You can race in a different way on
ovals which you can't do on road courses.  You can take different lines, go
side-by-side.  It's the most thoroughbred racing I've ever done in my life -
on short mile-ovals."
                                  -- Todd Goyer, Ford-Cosworth PR



I thought it was great when the two of them were on the cool off lap waving
at each other, jumping around like little kids.

					-Hans

    but then every racer who had a competitive race feels really up, up
    and for at least 2 hours the last one was the best. 
    
    Heck, why do i bother? If you've raced you already know and if haven't
    you'll never understand.

While watching the race last night I heard that Nigel threw up inside his helmet
20 laps before the end of the race at Milwaukee last week !

    There is a picture of him in Autosport mag' and you can clearly
    make out the diced carrots on his racing suit.
    
    The man's a hero.
    
    Mike.

    Now: Breakfast.

    That reminds me, drivers are going to have to be REALLY careful about
    throwing up and sweating pints next year in F1. The danger is they
    might start the race legal at the weighbridge but end up underweight.
    Maybe old Ken Tyrrell will reintroduce the water-ballast ploy except
    this time the driver will be stuffed to the gills before weighing time
    and then "dispose" of the excess before the race. Of course I've got
    immense faith in the rule-makers to make all of this watertight....

    Did he have time to tear off his helmet before barfing? If not, then
    surely the car's weight would have remained the same...
    
    I remember JYS suffering the same misfortune at Monaco in 1971. He also
    won the race. Maybe high-speed chundering is the quickest way onto the
    winner's rostrom. I'm hardly surprised that Nigel felt not very well at
    all on a 1-mile oval with a 23 second lap!!
    
    Not much to do with Indycar, but apparently the plans to run an F1 GP
    in Washington next year have been shelved. Something to do with the
    national parks authority not liking the idea of smelly noisy cars
    thundering round one of the local beauty spots. There must be a circuit
    somewhere in the US capable of receiving the F1 circus.
    
    Edward

    Don't knock these guys. I ONLY do sprints and hillclimbs but on a
    really hot day in a saloon, with race suit, balaclava, helmet, gloves,
    shoes it makes the head very difficult to deal with. I haven't yet been
    ill, but did come close to passing out at the end of one run, it isn't
    all fun.
    
    Mansell still has a long way to go to get to Mr Hunt's standard, he
    threw up in practically every race. Heat and adrenalin do nasty things
    to the mind and body.
    
    Mike

I don't know about the rest of you, but I have a fun time collecting things. I 
have a lot of books, magazines, programs and the like on racing.

But I received a catalog the other day from some folks called SPEEDGEAR. Never 
heard of them before but the catalog contained Williams and Benetton F1 
paraphanalia - shirts, posters, models, you know. And the same sort of thing from 
Newman-Haas. Except that they had goodies like the rear wing from Michael or 
Mario's Indycar (the Indy 500 variant) for only $3,800. Or the nose cone from the 
same car for $7,600. For those less well to do, the had a wheel (front or rear) 
for just $150. For the really flush - Michaels 1992 Lola, with engine for a mere 
$180,000. Any takers???

Paul
 

RE: .246

Chundering into your helmet sure gives you an incentive to drive as fast as 
possible to get the race over as soon as possible....

--PSW

Count on it!! Even the thought of it makes you go faster!

According to AutoWeek, the IndyCar board of directors have rejected the
proposal to hold an end-of-season exhibition race at Brands Hatch.  Although 
several of the IndyCar teams like the idea, CART have decided to honor their 
agreement with FISA to restrict future races outside of North America to ovals.

--PSW

    
    
    What happened yesterday ?
    

    Tracey
    Mansell     @27secs
    Boesel (sp) 1 Lap
    
    Tracey led from start to finish according to Ceefax.

    ::RACERS says Rahal took third, Boesel fourth.
    
    Mansell has 31 points lead (160) from Fittipaldi (129).
    
    M.

    Tracey drove an excellent race considering he had a huge off in Friday
    practice. According to Penske telemetry the impact was 44g! Tracey had
    ligament damage to his ankles and drove heavily taped.
    
    He led for all bar a lap during the first pit stops, with Mansell in
    second all the time bar a similar period. There was some pretty good
    racing further down the field, with Gordon, Rahal, Luyendyke, Cheever
    and Goodyear all scrapping away. Fittipaldi came 4th and would have
    been higher but for a stop go for speeding in the pit lane.
    
    Great circuit, a bit narrow for current F1's and far too much concrete
    rather than Armco and gravel. But with improvement it would be much
    better than Phoenix! Interesting comment by the ESPN team was that the
    Indy guys want the "unloved Armco" replaced by MORE concrete!
    
    Paul

    As the circuit (race distance) is known to be very unforgiving to the
    cars which drink more fuel Tracey played "fuel consumption" tactics
    with Mansell. Nige didn't take the bait and ran at his own speed to
    secure the points and not have the pleasure of running out of fuel on
    the last lap or so [Is this what happened to Andretti?].
    
    There was one amazing lap towards the end when something like 7 cars
    had problems/crashed/stopped.
    
    Compared with the last Oval race I found that at times I was flicking
    to other channels because it wasn't so exciting (similiar to F1 at
    times).

As Dave says in .256; it was a tactical race.

Even the commentators were saying things like "This is the only race for 
position on the track", as a lot of the cars were circulating at their
own speeds, with very little real racing and overtaking.

I think it was about lap 45 (5 fom the end) when the excitement really
happened, and then it settled down again. A bit of a disappointment after
the previous two races.

What a shame that Eurosport saved some money, and didn't sign up for the
after race ESPN interview rights, as the Paris commentator was trying to
summarise what Tracey and Mansell were saying...

Peter.

    I agree the race was a bit dull but there were few great moments. Just
    after the start when Tracey put a wheel on the dirt and got the car
    sideway, held it, losing little time to Mansell. Robby Gordon made
    brave attempt to get by Mario but ran wide. 
    
    Towards the end Cheever's lunge at Scott Goodyear was disgraceful...
    wonder if Wally Dallenbach and the CART officials had a word with him.
    
    The Eurosport commentary was wierd. Some of the time we had Paul Page
    and Derek Daly (ex Indycar, ex Williams, ex March etc), then some times
    the second string ESPN commentary and the just top it all when the post
    race interviews are being done, the Eurosport commentator and Robin
    Herd were doing a voice over. 
    
    After watching the real ESPN coverage on Screensport and SkySport in
    past years where the ESPN commentary of Paul Page and Derek Daly (Dr
    Jerry Punch or Jan Beekus in the pits) was brillant, including the race
    interviews etc... why can't Eurosport lets us listen to the real ESPN
    team all the time. On Sunday during the race Paul Page did a link to Jan
    Beekus in the pits to explain some technical matter. What do Eurosport
    do. They give us pictures out on the track, when we should be seeing
    the technical matter being explained.....
    
    Finally, Autosport carried a story last week saying a deal had been
    done to run Al. Jnr. in a third Penske next year!    
                     

RE: .258

The usual ESPN IndyCar broadcasting team is Paul Page and Derek Daly in the 
booth with Jan Beekuis and Gary Gerrold in pit lane.

Road America is an interesting circuit for the IndyCars because of its length: 
4 miles.  That narrows the windows for fuel stops considerably:  if you miss 
the window for your fuel stop, it's 4 miles of driving before you get another 
chance.  The problem here isn't fuel consumption, but rather, making sure that 
the car picks up every last bit of fuel from the fuel cells before the next 
stop is made.  If you aren't picking up all the fuel, you will need 3 stops 
rather than 2.

Initially, the Penske and Newman/Haas teams were playing some strategy games 
surrounding fuel stops.  Penske had Tracy running flat-out at the front as a 
rabbit, the idean being to intice Mansell into matching that pace, so he used 
up fuel faster and would have to pit earlier, possibly incurring the need for a 
3rd splash-and-go stop late in the race.  Meanwhile, Fittipaldi would be 
running at a more conservative pace, using less fuel and thus being ready to 
take advantage of an extra stop by Mansell, or to really stand on it in the 
latter half of the race.  The early caution period threw all this strategizing 
out the window--it pushed everybody's second pit stop far enough along in the 
race that nobody would need a third stop.

Fittipaldi and Cheever made good runs up through the field early on, but kind 
of got bogged down later.  Raul Boesel looked set for a solid third but the car 
had trouble very late in the race.


Regarding the Road America track, you can see why F1 won't run there:  all 
those trees, the cliffs, no rumble strips on the sides of some of the curves, 
just sand and gravel, and all that armco.  Armco is going out of fashion--there 
have been too many accidents made worse by the car actually going between the 
rows of metal.  F1 has been moving towards using gravel pits instead.  IndyCar 
opts for concrete with tire barriers in front of it.  In any event, Road 
America would need a LOT of work to come up to current F1 standards, which is a 
pity, because it's a great track, and if the work were done, technically it'd 
be a great place for a USGP.  The other problem is that it's way out in the 
sticks in Wisconsin.

--PSW

    <<< Note 2009.259 by GEMGRP::PW::Winalski "Careful with that AXP,Eugene!" >>
    
    Armco barriers, or more precisely badly mounted armco barriers, have
    been responsible for some of the most horrific accidents in the history
    of the sport. Roger Williamson, Fran�ois Cevert, and Gerry Birrel all died
    as a direct result of incorrectly installed barriers.
    
    If the barriers are correctly mounted, they seem to do the job.
    
    Edward
    

    Ref Armco...
    
    F1 makes extensive use of Armco, behind large gravel traps, and often
    shielded by tyres barriers. However, a key factor intrack inspections
    in the installation as Ed mentioned. It was interesting watching the
    slo-mo of Martini's shunt in Hungary with the initial impact in the
    tyres and then the deformation of the Amrco absorbing the impact.
    
    Paul

From: [email protected] (UPI)
Subject: Tracy sets track record in IndyCar qualifying
 
	VANCOUVER, British Columbia (UPI) -- Paul Tracy ran a track record
109.046 mph (175.488 kph) under hot and sunny weather Friday to produce
the fastest time during the first day of qualifying for the $1 million
Molson Indy Vancouver Indycar race.
	The starting grid will not be set until after the second qualifying
session is held Saturday.
	Stefan Johansson averaged 108.427 mph (174.492 kph) to finish second
while Tracy's teammate, Emerson Fittipaldi, sat in third place with a
108.349 (174.366 kph).
	Indycar season points leader Nigel Mansell struggled on his
qualifying runs and ended the day with an average speed of 107.736 (173.
380 kph), ninth best in the 26-car field.
	Tracy, winner of last week's Elkhart Lake race and a total of four
races this year, said it was early to say who will have the pole
position for Sunday's race.
	``We were pleased with today's results but it's only the first day of
qualifying so we'll see what happens tomorrow,'' said the 24-year-old
Canadian, who has won three of the last five races.
	Both he and Fittipaldi needed excellent results this weekend if they
were to catch Mansell, the series points leader.
	``Mansell struggled today but qualifying isn't over yet,'' Tracy
said. ``But we need a good result this weekend if we're to gain ground
on him.''
	With four races to go, Mansell leads the standings with 160 points
and four wins as he takes aim to be the first driver to win Formula One
and Indycar season titles in consecutive years.
	Fittipaldi is second with 129 points and is followed by Tracy in
third place with 122 points. A win on Sunday will be worth 20 points.
	The starting grid for Sunday's 168.1-mile (270.5-km), 102-lap race
will be set Saturday after the second round of qualifying.
	The 1.648-mile (2.652-km) Molson Indy Vancouver race course features
10 corners on a temporary street course around the streets of Pacific
Place, set in downtown Vancouver. 
	It was expected that more than 160,000 spectators will watch the race
action over the three-day event, with approximately 70,000 attending on
Sunday's final day.
 
                       $1M Molson IndyCar
             At Vancouver, British Columbia, Aug. 27
                           Qualifying
        (Including driver, make of car and engine, and qualifying speed.)

        1, Paul Tracy, Penske/Chevy V8, 109.046 mph. 
	2, Stefan Johansson, Penske PC22/Chevy V8, 108.427. 
	3, Emerson Fittipaldi, Penske/Chevy V8, 108.349. 
	4, Scott Goodyear, Lola T9300/Ford Cosworth, 108.317.
	5, Raul Boesel, Lola T9300/Ford Cosworth, 108.271. 
	6, Al Unser, Jr, Lola T9300/Chevy V8, 108.084. 
	7, Teo Fabi, Lola T9300/Chevy V8, 108.050. 
	8, Bobby Rahal, Lola T9300/Chevy V8, 107.907. 
	9, Nigel Mansell, Lola T9300/Ford Cosworth, 107.736. 
	10, Mario Andretti, Lola T9300/Ford Cosworth, 107.736.
        11, Danny Sullivan, Lola T9300/Chevy V8, 107.552. 
	12, Andrea Montermini, Lola T9200/Chevy V8, 107.474. 
	13, Scott Brayton, Lola T9300/Ford Cosworth, 107.369. 
	14, Robby Gordon, Lola T9300/Ford Cosworth, 107.144. 
	15, Arie Luyendyk, Lola T9300/Ford Cosworth, 106.700. 
	16, Willy T. Ribbs, Lola T9300/Ford Cosworth, 106.261. 
	17, Jimmy Vasser, Lola T9200/Ford Cosworth, 106.237. 
	18, Mark Smith, Penske PC21/Chevy V8, 105. 605. 
	19, Roberto Guerrero, Lola T9300/Chevy V8, 105.591. 
	20, Ross Bentley, Lola T9200/Chevy V8, 103.180. 
        21, Dominic Dobson, Galmer G92/Chevy V8, 102.694. 
	22, Hiro Matsushita, Lola T9300/Ford Cosworth, 100.335. 
	23, Olivier Grouillard, Lola T9200/Chevy V8, 99.738. 
	24, Jeff Wood, Lola T9100/Cosworth DFS, 99.694. 
	25, Marco Greco, Lola T9200/Chevy V8, 98.703. 
	26, Johnny Unser, Lola T9200/Chevy V8, 93.979.

    Great race but an awful track. Nice to see Little Al on the way back.
    Rahal was outfoxed by Al on the last stop but finished a strong second.
    Hard luck to Tracy, only for the problems with the electrics he might
    have won. Mansell had a subdued race finishing only 6th but increased
    his c'ship lead.   
    
    With Al Jnr and Rahal back on form, the last couple of races could be
    anyones...... 
                     

    
    
    A long day in front of the TV yesterday, all the brownie points used
    up.
    
    F1 Grand Prix - good finish to the race
    
    British Touring cars - the best racing on TV
    
    British F3  - Not a bad race.
    
    Indy cars  - I was getting tired, good result for Mansell. 
    
    
             

 
GUGELMIN SIGNS WITH SIMON
Ex-Formula One driver Mauricio Gugelmin who found himself without
a ride this year has signed a deal to race one of Dick Simon's
cars in the final three rounds of the PPG Indycar World Series.
He will race for Simon at Mid-Ohio, Nazereth - his first attempt
at an oval and Laguna Seca.
 

    ]According to CEEFAX Carl Haas is confident Mansell will sign a three
    year $15m dollar deal to stay with Newman-Haas.
    
    Gabriel

    The Indycar C'ship moves to Mid-Ohio this weekend, one of the better road
    courses in America. Will Nige clinch the title this weekend??????????
    
    Gabriel

    
    Ummm, sorry for dumb question. 
    
    Is Nigel clinching the championship on this race a mathematical 
    possibility?
    
    Cheers
    
    Nigel (but not Mansell)
    

    
    If our nige gets 12 points or more than Emo, and I think the 4 behind emo,
    this weekend he's got the championship. Not sure of the points table but 
    I think Emo is 35 points behind. I would say that Emo is in with a chance 
    and the rest a mathmatical one. But adding more points this weekend it
    put the championship further away from the field, by adding 12 I think
    it puts the Nigel out of reach leaving no one with a mathmatical
    chance.
    
    Garry  
    
     

    Mansell needs 12 more points at Mid-Ohio than Emmo,Tracy,Boesel,Rahal
    and Andretti to clinch the title. Possible but not as easy as I
    thought. However a good finish will make it next to impossible for
    anyone to beat him considering his form in testing at Nazareth and
    Laguna Seca, where he has been on or under lap record pace.
      
    Gabriel

Subject: Indy car; Mid Ohio practice

1. Tracy      1.09.095           117.23mph
2. Boesel     1.09.369                    
3. Mansell    1.09.770
4. Johansson  1.10.153
5. Till       1.10.465
6. Luyendyk   1.10.603
7. Fabi       1.10.734
8. Unser      1.10.824
9. Fittipaldi 1.10.882
10. Sullivan  1.10.893
11. Andretti  1.10.918
12. Vasser    1.10.966
13. Rahal     1.10.922
....
17. Cheever   1.11.286

From: [email protected] (BRUCE MARTIN)
Subject: Tracy has provisional pole; Mansell goes airborne
 
	LEXINGTON, Ohio (UPI) -- Nigel Mansell discovered Friday during
qualifying for the Pioneer Electronics 200 IndyCar race that his
Texaco/Havoline Lola-Ford would make a good airplane if it gets the
proper wind current under it.
	Mansell got into turn one too fast and the car went up in the air
before landing on all four wheels. The flight did little damage to the
car, except for a minor fluid leak, and Mansell was able to finish with
the third-fastest speed in the provisional qualification session.
Mansell drove to a fast lap at 117.443 miles an hour (189 km per hour)
around the 2.25-mile (3.62-km), 13-turn Mid-Ohio Sports Car Course.
	Canada's Paul Tracy was the quickest at 118.085 miles an hour (190.
034 km per hour), which exceeded the previous track record of 117.790
(189.559) set by Michael Andretti last year. Tracy's Marlboro Team
Penske teammate, Emerson Fittipaldi, went 117.617 mph (189.281 kph).
	But Mansell's near mishap in the first turn of his first qualifying
lap provided the highlight of the day.
	``It was very exciting,'' said Mansell, the reigning Formula One
champion who is closing in on the PPG Indy Car World Series title in his
rookie season. ``I found out one thing, the car is very stable when it
is airborne. The Lola chassis goes airborne real well, but it doesn't
land very good. I scored a one out of 10 on the landing.''
	Mansell's ride was similar to several that Tracy has made in his
brief IndyCar career. But the young Canadian has the top speed in
qualifications, and if he is able to retain that position in Saturday's
final round, he will win his fourth pole of the season.
	``This morning, we struggled with the setup,'' Tracy said. ``I went
out in both cars and got it fairly well sorted out, and then was able to
run fairly quick at the end of the morning session. We made some changes
between practice and qualifying. The car is working very well and I was
able to use just one set of tires for qualifying, so we are looking good
for Saturday.''
	If Mansell scores 12 points more than Fittipaldi, his nearest
challenger, he will win the PPG Indy Car championship. That puts all the
pressure on the Brazilian, who is a two-time Formula One champion.
	``The pressure is on,'' Fittipaldi said. ``In the last five races,
Nigel has improved a lot. Going into the Michigan, I was leading the
championship. Now, five races later, he's a long way ahead in points.
	``With three races to go there is nothing left. I have to go banzai.''
	Tracy, who is third in the points -- 46 behind Mansell, is in a
desperate position if he wants to win the championship.
	``I think for both Emerson and myself, we both have to win races and
see how Nigel does,'' Tracy said. ``And Nigel has to falter or have
something happen or bad luck. So that's my mindset.''
	But Mansell is not ready to celebrate the championship, which is so
close, but has not yet been clinched.
	``There are 66 points left in the three races and it's a question of
reliability,'' Mansell said. ``Not only do we have to run well, we have
to finish.''
 
                      Pioneer Electronics 200
                      PPG Indy Car World Series
                     At Lexington, Ohio, Sept. 10
                      Provisional Qualifying

	1, Paul Tracy, 1993 PenskePC93/Chevrolet C, 500, 118.085 mph (190.034
kph-track record). 
	2, Emerson Fittipaldi, '93 PenskePC93/Chevrolet C, 117.617 (189.281). 
	3, Nigel Mansell, '93 Lola/Ford, 117.448 (189.009).
	4, Raul Boesel, '93 Lola/Ford, 116.987 (188.267). 
	5, Teo Fabi, '93 Lola/Chevrolet C, 116.601 (187.645). 
	6, Jimmy Vasser, '92 Lola/Ford, 116.477 (187.446). 
	7, Stefan Johansson, '93 PenskePC93/Chevrolet C, 116.459 (187.417). 
	8, Scott Goodyear, '93 Lola/Ford, 116.152 (186.923). 
	9, Bobby Rahal, '93 Lola/Chevrolet C, 116.116 (186.865). 
	10, Danny Sullivan, '93 Lola/Chevrolet C, 116.068 (186.788).
	11, Al Unser, Jr., '93 Lola/Chevrolet C, 115.942 (186.585). 
	12, Mario Andretti, '93 Lola/Ford, 115.846 (186.430). 
	13, Arie Luyendyk, '93 Lola/Ford, 115.546 (185.948). 
	14, Robby Gordon, '93 Lola/Ford, 115.438 (185.774). 
	15, Scott Brayton, '93 Lola/Ford, 115.156 (185.320). 
	16, Mike Groff, '93 Rahal/Hogan, 115.036 (185.127). 
	17, Brian Till, '92 PenskePC92/Chevrolet B, 114.959 (185.003). 
	18, Eddie Cheever, '93 Lola/Chevrolet C, 114.277 (183.905). 
	19, Willy T. Ribbs, '93 Lola/Ford, 114.266 (183.888). 
	20, Mauricio Gugelmin, '93 Lola/Ford, 114.149 (183.699).

From: [email protected] (BRUCE MARTIN)
Subject: Mansell wins sixth pole of season
 
	LEXINGTON, Ohio (UPI) -- Nigel Mansell took another major step toward
clinching the PPG Indy Car World Series title by winning the pole on
Saturday for Sunday's Pioneer Electronics 200 at the Mid-Ohio Sports Car
Course.
	Mansell drove his Lola-Ford to the pole with a record speed of 118.
372 miles an hour around the 2.25-mile, 23-turn road course located
between Cleveland and Columbus, Ohio. It was Mansell's sixth pole of the
season, which clinches the most poles for any IndyCar driver this
season. Canadian's Paul Tracy and Scott Goodyear have two poles each.
	Mansell's pole puts the reigning Formula One champion from Great
Britain in a position to clinch the series championship in his rookie
season if he finishes 11 points ahead of Brazil's Emerson Fittipaldi,
who will start third. The pole was worth one point toward the
championship.
	``I just hung it all out there on that qualifying lap,'' Mansell
said, ``It was a very interesting qualifying session.''
	In the final minutes of qualifications, Fittipaldi briefly had the
pole at 118.113 mph before his Marlboro Penske teammate Paul Tracy
surged past him at 118.138. But near the end of the session, Mansell
drove a wild lap, driving over the curb in several corners, to win the
pole.
	``If I can use that curb in the race, it makes the track a little
wider,'' Mansell said. ``If I have to touch the curb it the race to run
fast, I will touch it.''
	Mansell will start alongside Tracy in the front row followed by
Fittipaldi, Brazil's Raul Boesel and Canada's Scott Goodyear.
	By scoring one additional point with the pole, Mansell now has 169
points for a 34-point lead over Fittipaldi. But Fittipaldi, a two-time
Formula One champion and two-time winner of the Indianapolis 500, sees
his shot at a second IndyCar title rapidly slipping away.
	``More important than Nigel getting the point is that it's difficult
to pass him in the race,'' Fittipaldi said. ``He will be very tough to
pass.
	``I don't think the extra point he earned is as critical as where he
starts in the race.''
	If Fittipaldi falls out of the points position, which are the first
12 spots, and Mansell wins the race, the championship would be decided
with two races remaining. Otherwise, Mansell is still in a good position
to clinch the title in next Sunday's Bosch Spark Plug Grand Prix at
Nazareth, Pa. or the Oct. 3 Toyota Monterey Grand Prix at Monterey,
Calif.
	``Even at this point, I'm pleased at what we've done already, but
things haven't been easy this year,'' said Mansell, who has been plagued
with various injuries to his back and wrist. ``I feel stronger today
than I have in recent races.''
	Tracy's best lap came to a premature end when his Penske-Chevrolet C
ran out of fuel on the lap. After he came into the pits for refueling,
the checkered flag flew, ending the practice session.
	``The car stumbled twice on that lap, and by the time I got back out,
it was too late,'' Tracy said.
 
                      PPG Indy Car World Series
                     At Lexington, Ohio, Sept. 11
                        Qualifying Results
	1, Nigel Mansell, 1993 Lola-Ford, 118.372 mph (190.496 kph). 
	2, Paul Tracy, '93 PenskePC93/Chevrolet C, 118.138 (190.119). 
	3, Emerson Fittipaldi, '93 PenskePC93/Chevrolet C, 118.113 (190.079). 
	4, Raul Boesel, '93 Lola-Ford, 117.209 (188.624). 
	5, Scott Goodyear, '93 Lola-Ford, 117.117 (188.476). 
	6, Al Unser, Jr., '92 Lola-Chevrolet C, 117.177 (188.572). 
	7, Teo Fabi, '93 Lola-Chevrolet, 116.601 (187.645). 
	8, Arie Luyendyk, '92 Lola-Ford, 116.582 (187.615). 
	9, Jimmy Vasser, '92 Lola-Ford, 116.477 (187.446). 
	10, Mario Andretti, '92 Lola-Ford, 116.464 (187.425).
	11, Stefan Johansson, '93 PenskePC93-Chevrolet C, 116.459 (187.417).
	12, Mauricio Gugelmin, '93 Lola-Ford, 116.403 (187.327). 
	13, Mark Smith, '92 PenskePC92/Chevrolet B, 116.390 (187.306). 
	14, Bobby Rahal, '92 Lola-Chevrolet C, 116.274 (187.119). 
	15, Robby Gordon, '93 Lola-Ford, 116.084 (186.813). 
	16, Danny Sullivan, '93 Lola-Chevrolet C, 116.068 (186.788). 
	17, Mike Groff, '93 Lola-Chevrolet C, 115.918 (186.546). 
	18, Scott Brayton, '93 Lola-Ford, 115.458 (185.806). 
	19, Brian Till, '92 PenskePC92-Chevrolet B, 115.142 (185.298). 
	20, Scott Pruett, '92 Lola-Chevrolet A, 114.494 (184.255).

An interesting race.  Mansell bent a front steering arm in a first corner 
altercation with Paul Tracy.  Mansell claims it was Tracy's fault and I agree. 
Mansell was taking the normal line through that corner when Tracy chopped down, 
briefly touching wheels with Mansell.  With the bent steering arm, Mansell was 
moving slowly down the center of the track and got caught up in the mid-field 
traffic, where he was clipped by Arie Luyendyk, losing half his front wing.  
Mansell limped back to the pits and the damage was repaired, but he fell 2 laps 
down in the process.  He made a magnificent charge, unlapping himself once in 
the process, and finished in the last points-paying position (12th).

In the early going, Tracy was pulling away at the rate of 1 second/lap, then he 
threw away his magnificent lead with an unnecessarily aggressive attempt to 
pass a backmarker.  The backmarker was slower than Tracy anticipated, forcing 
him to stand on the brakes and spin off to avoid a collision.  Unfortunately, 
the Paul Tracy who threw away the Phoenix race is back.

Emmo inherited the lead, staved off challenges by Goodyear and Unser, Jr., and 
brought home the win.

Robby Gordon had a fine run, letting the race come to him.

Mauricio Gugelmin qualified well and ran a good race in 10th place until his 
gearbox broke.  Not a bad first outing for jumping into the car with very 
little practice time.  Until the mechanical failure, he was really showing up 
Olivier "you'll see me on the podium this year" Grouillard.

--PSW

    Anyone know what Mansell or Emmo has to do, to win the C'ship?
    
    Gabriel

Mansell is 14 points up on Emmo right now with 2 races left.  Each race has a
max of 22 points (20 for win, 1 for pole, 1 for most laps lead).  So, for
Mansell to clinch it at Nazareth, he has to score 8 points more than Emmo.  That
meand if Nige wins, Emmo has to finish around 6th or so to stay in the chase.

Dave

    Dave,
    
    Thanks. Do you know how the points go from 1st (20) to 12th (1)?
    
    Gabriel
    

    Re a few back - re the Eurosport coverage, I asked Ben Edwards why he
    talked over the interviews and it turns out that Euro simply don't get
    anything other than the race commentary. So when there's an interview,
    or during a US ad break the line goes quiet and he has to busk it.
    Basically he just sits in front of a monitor in Paris and sees what we
    see. 

    re:.278
    
    When Screensport and SkySport showed IndyCar they didn't have this
    problem, although they probably had more ads. During the Mid-Ohio again
    Paul Page would do a link to pits, all we got was track shots, a pause,
    then a change of commentary. Eurosport need to get there act together.
    
    Gabriel
    

    re: .277
    
    See .162
    

    re .279
    I think you'll find that it's the difference between ESPN and ABC.
    Sky used to take ABC's coverage, Eurosport is a subsid of ESPN or
    something like that. Could someone ask him why no NASCAR? Somebody said
    because there was no demand. EVERY car nut who I spoke to who had a
    dish went bananas when that got taken off the air. We have missed some
    really good RACING this year. I for one can't wait for a move to the
    US.

    In addition to the news about MA leaving F1...you should also know that 
    there is a very hot rumor that Chevy has quit IndyCar! 
    
    This has been discussed on the Internet by more then a few people, so
    at this time the rumor appears to be true.
    
    MA quits F1 and Chevy quits Indycar all in the same day...
    
    								-mike-

Chevrolet quitting IndyCar merely means that they're no longer paying to have 
their nameplate attached to the Ilmor IndyCar engine.  Ilmor are talking to at 
least two other car companies about putting their name on the engine.  This is 
no big deal.

--PSW

Congratulations to "their Nige" winning the 1993 IndyCar championship with
style.

Mansell started in pole position (there was no practice 'cos of rain - so the
drivers start in their championship position), but was beaten into the first
corner by both Penskes. Later on Boesel also took him, leaving him in fourth
place.

Mansell took the first 40 laps to 'dial-in' - learn the track, and then in the
space of 8 laps went from fourth to first. He maintained a lead of 5-10 seconds
over the second placed man (Scott Goodyear) until the end. It was Mansell's
fourth successive win on an oval.

With Emerson finishing fifth, Nigel now has a 25 point lead - and there are
only 22 points on offer for the final race in California.

-Steve

    RE: .285
    
>>Mansell started in pole position (there was no practice 'cos of rain - so the
>>drivers start in their championship position), but was beaten into the first
>>corner by both Penskes. Later on Boesel also took him, leaving him in fourth
>>place.
    
    To me it looked mighty close that Nige wasn't the first car to cross
    the line! Shame I didn't tape the race so I could check it out more
    closely...
    
    Is Nige the first Rooky (sp?) to win the Indy Car Championship?

    No , I believe not. I think Jim Clark won as a rookie . The First that
    Nigel has managed is, to win the F1 world championship back to back with 
    the indy car championship.
    
    	Garry

    
    Jim Clark never won the Indy Car CHAMPIONSHIP.
    
    I believe Mansell must be the second man to do this, as everyone was a
    rookie the first year it was held! :^)
    
    Mark

    Excellent performance by Mansell this year. I thought he'd be a front
    runner the first year, but I didn't expect him to be that good that
    soon.
    
    Re -.2, yes he's the first rookie winner (with Mark's proviso!) and the
    second Brit to win the Indy-car championship (or it's equivalent
    predecessor). I'll let Dave "Trivia Durden tell you who the previous
    one was....

    .289�    Excellent performance by Mansell this year. I thought he'd be a front
    
    Truly impressive ! The Newman-Haas team is certainly a good one, but
    Mansell's performance is extraordinary.

    Re -.2
    
    That was meant to be - Dave "trivia" Burden, which was obviously the
    only reason he hasn't told us the name yet.
    
    

Hey, with that intro how could I resist?  :-)

You have to go back a bit to find another British driver who won the 'IndyCar'
championship.  In fact the 'IndyCar' champ didn't exist.  How about the AAA
(American Automobile Association) champion in *1916*, yes ninteen sixteen.  A
certain Dario Resta won it....

Dave

ps - I have to give credit to UPI, I found in on one of their feeds.

One interesting thing about the Nazareth race is that it was run entirely under 
the green flag, not counting lap 1, where the starter waved off the start 
(quite rightly so) and so the lap was technically run under yellow.  When was 
the last time that an IndyCar oval race was run without any caution periods?  
This is the first time it's ever happened in the years I've been watching 
IndyCars.

--PSW

Mansell crashed twice in uncharacteristically stupid fashion, too, attempting 
impossible passes on back-markers.  The first time, he tried to dive inside 
Scott Sharp, but way too late, and when Sharp was forced to take his line into 
the corner, Mansell's right front tire ran up and over Sharp's left rear, 
knocking the rear wing off Sharp's car and launching the front of Mansell's car 
off the ground!  Fortunately, this happened at the slowest corner on the 
circuit, so both cars were able to continue.  It's also a good thing that 
IndyCars have limited ground effects--that wing loss would have caused an 
instant spin on a F1 car, slow corner or no.  Later in the race, Mansell played 
bumper-cars again, this time with Mark Smith.  The steering wheel of Mansell's 
car was wrenched in his hands and he re-bruised that injury to his right wrist. 
It was painful enough that Mansell drove straight to the pits and retired from 
the race.

Paul Tracy passed Emmo at the start and lead the race (which was mercifully 
free of full-course cautions) from start to finish, bar a few laps during the 
first set of fuel stops.  Tracy's race was not incident-free, however, as with 
25 laps to go, his glove acidentally hit the release for his belt harness and 
he had to drive the end of the race without being buckled in!  Emmo was 
second.  He almost caught Tracy when Tracy was held up trying to pass a train 
of cars dicing for position behind Hiro Matsushita, but then Emmo spun 
trying to pass Matsushita to keep in touch with Tracy, slid across the sand 
pit backwards into a tire barrier, but somehow kept it running and drove 
back on course to finish 2nd.  Arie Luyendyk drove to a well-deserved 3rd 
place.  Scott Goodyear was 4th, Al Unser, Jr. 5th.

--PSW

Interesting (possibly biased) observation from French commentator at Laguna
Seca.

He reckoned that a lot of T-shirts were being sold. Mansell was the most
popular buy, followed by:



Jean Alesi!

An to think that in Europe we're always being told that the US is parochial,
and there is little interest in F1...

-Steve

    Obviously you have never been to the Montreal GP.  There are litterally
    thousands that come up from the US.  As far away as the Virginias,
    Kansas, Washington DC, etc.  And believe it or not next to the Ferrari
    souvenirs, Nigell was the next most popular as well.
    regards,
    JP

It was announced that Al Unser jr will drive a third Penske next year, along with 
Fittipaldi and Tracy. So it looks like Penske is set. The silly season is just 
getting started. Looks like it'll be fun watching where everyone goes - same as in 
F1.

Paul

Anybody heard about an entry in the Indycar series called the
Ruger Special?