Conference hbahba::cam_sports

    I shall be the first.  I bow to Mr. West and will surely treat him
    to a wing ding or 2.
    
    On another note college hoop is where I really can pick them stay
    tuned for my Big East lock of the week, or my ACC Action Reverse
    special, or my Big MONDAY Super Parlay.   8*)
    
    Jimbo

    
    Thanks Jimbo the wing/dings were great....made me go back for more...
    
    I'm sure we'll do it again, How about a bucket on the Super Bowl??
    
    westy

    Paging Mr. Chappy, paging Mr. Chappy...Your table is ready !!!!
    
    Cowboys made it to the SB.
    
    John "D Cowboys" R.

    Day 3 of the Chappy watch....
    
    REK

Chappy I am very disappointed in you and also concerned about whether
you will fulfill the terms of our p-name "dicussions" when the Mets finish
1993 with a better record than the Yankees. If you can't note in the Crow
note once what does that say about your monthlong commitment come September?

The Crazy Met

    
    There is no better note to start payibng my p-name debt than this one.
    I was sooooo wrong in picking Buffalo that I probably don't even
    deserve to have my Crow cooked; however that could lead to disease and
    not allow me to fully pay my debt.
    
    Actually the real pain will be reading the notes from those Dallas
    fans, uggghhhh!
    
    p-name returns to normal on Sunday February 6th, 1993 around 10PM.
    Count on it!
    
    Oh yeah Lakers beat the Celtics in Boston today so not everything went
    wrong.
    
    Mets in '93
    The Crazy Met
    
    

      Sure is quite in here.  I thought I saw predictions in the NFL note. 
    I think some people picked un-luckalo....
    
      At least TCM bellied up!

    Well, I'll bellie up for a plate of Buffalo crow wings....
    
    REK

    
    Hey, it's not fair comparing everyone to TCC.  He's had a lot of
    practice in here lately.  8^)
    
    brews

And Brews obviously never wants my help again :-)
Brews, its been a bad enough weekend without your inane drivel :-)

The Crazy Met

    
    
    Move over TCLB (lover). Is crowfeet better than wings?

    Well no one gives a better Kiss of Death than me!!! 8*)
    
    I've been eating crow all day and Mr. West will be enjoying some
    wing dings in the near future. 
    
    Jimbo

    I picked Baffle-O too.
    
    Over in CAFEIN::POOL92, I managed to go 0-fer the postseason, not
    picking a single game right thruout the playoffs and Super Bowl.
    
    JaKe
    

re: .13

JaKe, think of it this way, getting them all wrong requires as
much talent as getting them all right.

The Crazy Met

    TCM,
    
    Only when you're trying to pick em that way.
    
    I was trying to pick winners and got all losers instead.
    
    
    JaKe
    

One time I was in a "fun and amusement only" football pool, and convinced 
my then girl friend, now wife, to play one week.  Knowing nothing about 
football, she decided to that the smartest thing she could do was pick exactly
opposite from me.

Wouldn't you know it, she won...

Bob,

did you end up in last place that week?

The Crazy Met

�Bob,

�did you end up in last place that week?

�The Crazy Met

Wail lets think about that one...

If the opposite of my picks got the most right, then my picks were at least 
close to having the most wrong.

    Happiness is knowing that all the anti-Dallas fans, especially Chapped
    Lips, are dining on crow.
    
    John "D Cowboys" R.

    
    I wasn't the person who said that Jimmy Johnson would be back in college
    by 1992, but I did say earlier this year that he had yet to prove that 
    he could coach a team through the highest levels of the NFL playoffs 
    with his approach, and that I had my doubts.  No longer.  As I said
    after the NFC championship, I've gained respect for Johnson as a coach.
    I still think he's a jerk who will remain hateable as long as the Cowboys
    continue to be incredibly successful (I mean the guy *admitted* that he 
    dumped his wife after he came to the NFL because he didn't need the
    distraction, but needed her while he was in college because it was
    part of the job), but that'll just be part of the fun...
    
    glenn
    

    Well I done et my crow, feathas and all. Burp.  
    
    And JJ was always a great pro coach, especially in college. You never
    saw any holdouts on Miami's teams didya??  JJ knew how to take care
    of them. 8^)
    
    MikeL
    

    .20
    
    Did JJ really say that about his wife ?  As a Cowboys fan I think that
    saying something like that is despicable and embarrassing.  I trust
    that JJ would have more tact in the future.
    
    John "D Cowboys" R.

    
    I saw a similar quote from JJ.
    
    Brews, who wishes John R was in here for another reason   8^)

re: .18

I figure you were close to last, but you didn't have to
be all the way at the bottom

re: .19

Don't hold your breath to see Chappy in this note. He already didn't show
up here about a week ago for something else. Chappy gives New Yorkers
a bad name by being a Yankee fan. He gives Yankee fans a bad name by not
being man enough to face being wrong.

The Crazy Met

    Brews,
    
    Entering your name in this note, without publicly acknowledging
    Dallas's victory, is a very sly way of admitting that you were wrong 
    about the Cowboys. Please tell us us who the new NFL champions are, 
    and what team you had picked to win ?
    
    John "D Cowboys" R.

re: .25

Brews used to be a mod, yeah thats it :-)

The Crazy Met

    
    As a now retired noter said "Make no predictions, eat no crow"
    
    WHo I picked and who I wanted to win were entirely different.
    
    Brews, still trying to figger out what I did to get kicked out of
    moderatordom

    
    
        Yo TCM or TCC or whatever Bandwagon your on now see .11 I already
    chomped mine down. Mets Sip. You know it I know it Live with it. 
    
                           Try getting your facts straight before you make
    another Ass of yourself OK YOSEFF!
    
    Chappy

Chappy,

Anyone who believes that the Yankees will have a better season than the Mets in 
1993 clearly ignores facts, or maybe has a few screws loose - take your pick.

The Crazy Met

    	Both the Mets and Yankees will stink in '93.  Wade Boggs in
    close proximity to 42nd Street is a public relations disaster waiting
    to happen and the Mets defense is on a par with Sadaam Hussein's
    
    				/Don

    
    
          Well Yoseff I'm glad you admitted you were wrong about me eating
    Crow in .11... NOT!!!!!    But I'm use to you not EVER admitting you 
    were wrong. Well I just heard that the Mets Signed Paul Gibson so I
    guess that means a parade in Flushing in October right? 
    
        i won't get upset though cuz I know your just an uninformed
    Eddie Murray worshiper.
    
    Chappy

You wanted an admission after that note! Anyways yup Chappy actually did
get into the Crow note in .11.

>  But I'm use to you not EVER admitting you  were wrong.

For someone who claims to adhere to the facts you are woefully uninformed.
As an example please see 32.41 and 32.42 where I admit to having made an error.
There are other examples in this notesfile, that one simply comes to mind since
it is recent. So get YOUR facts straight before you go and make an Ass of
yourself.

Yankees sip.

The Crazy Met

    
    
          Sorry So you did admit you were wrong twice. Now if you could
    just admit the other 999 times we'd all be happy.. :-)

Apology accepted.

The Crazy Met

po' po' Tommy, doesn't get the point at all.  :-)

Accepting apologies and making up are 2 very different things. Lets not
get carried away with our interpretations.

The Crazy Met

    How's about TCM and Chappy handle this offline.

there 'ya go again spoilin' everyones fun.

The Crazy Met

    
    >>were wrong. Well I just heard that the Mets Signed Paul Gibson so I
    >>guess that means a parade in Flushing in October right? 
    
    Nah, they'll be "flushing" their plans fer a parade long before
    October(along with the Pirates).
    
    
    JaKe                      

    
> Anyone who believes that the Yankees will have a better season than the Mets in 
> 1993 clearly ignores facts, or maybe has a few screws loose - take your pick.
    
    You mean like they did in 1992, with breathin room to spare?
    
    glenn
    

    re: .40
    
    You would probably best be served by staying out of civil wars. :-)
    btw no pun intended.
    
    The Crazy Met
    

    
    
        Yeah like in 1992....:-)
    
    
    
    
    chappy

    Yes waiter, I'll take seat over near that little disgustinNew Yuck fan.
    I know he's been here a while.  It makes him feel at home.  I'll take
    mine medium-rare with a side of Iron City.
    
    
    billl
    

    I compliment the gentleman (hah!) from Pittsburgh on his promptness
    and eloquence.
    
    The Crazy Met
    

    I'd like my obligatory serving, smothered in Jeffrey Dahmer BBQ sause,
    please.
    
    
    JaKe
    

    I'm here... I predicted the Cavs would show up and win beat Chicago.
    They didn't.  yum...

 "Curses!! Foiled Again!" Smother my bird in Acorn sause from the mighty Oak.
 Cause Charles done schooled Grandmama in bangin'....

 mike

Where is MikeH???

The Crazy Met

    Avoiding the Crown note...

	Well, I didn't do any LDUC'ing during the regular season but a
	bet is a bet. Heavy sigh...

	Congratulations to the Chicago Bulls 3peat world champions. They
	have proven conclusively that Chicago has the best basketball
	team and (this is the part that's gonna taste like @#$%^&*!!!)
	*FANS* on the face of the planet.

	(Quick somebody pass me a beer, doesn't matter what kind. Even
	yuppie bubble water has gotta taste better than this. Yechhh,
	gag, retch........... ;-)

    Unlike some in here, I work and go to school fulltime.  Now that I'm
    back...
    
    I'll take a Chicago pizza with mine.  Congrats to Da Bulls, your
    experience saved you.

�    Unlike some in here, I work and go to school fulltime.  Now that I'm
�    back...
    
    Yabbut, you were "back" for a few hours before this was posted and you
    made comments to the effect that you didn't think you deserved to be
    seated in the Crow Cafe.

see 36.1194 - time stamp is 10:34,  about 4.5 hours before
you got into note 50.

The Crazy Met

    So what do the Suns have to be ashamed of?

    C'mon, Mike.  Be a man.  You've been crowing about the Suns all year
    and predicted they'd win it all.  The Suns might not have much to be
    ashamed of -- they did give a gutsy performance to keep from being
    swept, but I would think you might after all those predictions.

MikeH the Crow Cafe has nothing to do with whether or not the Suns have anything
to be ashamed of.  It has everything to do with your posting in January that
the Suns will with the 1993 NBA title, and continuing with that boast for
the next 5.5 months.

The Crazy Met

notes collision.

The Crazy Met

    The only thing Id be ashemed of if I was a suns fan would be barkley.
    I think his taunting of Pippen thruout the game was uncalled for, he
    was in his face on too many occasions, it really changed how I feel
    about him.  Phoenix has alot of talant, but is marjle the first option
    on offense, he seems to pull the trigger a  little too quick.  I think
    they should adopt more of a Chicago style of offense, work inside to 
    barkley, attract the boulble team and then kick out for the 3 pt
    attempt.  I know they won a few games on the 3pointers but they could
    play a more consistant game with a more controlled offense down low.
    
    They need to make some moves during the offseason if they want to
    return next year.  Should be intresting..
    								MairB

   
>    So what do the Suns have to be ashamed of?


 Barkley and fans who feel Barkley is one of their all-time players. KJ's
 goatee and haircut. Marjele's commercial and nickname. But most of all
 loosing three home games out of three in the finals........

 if Barkley were a man he would have talked to NBC, Mike. KJ did the
 dirty work but had the results been different I have hard time picturing
 Barkley let anyone on his team do the talkin'....

 mike

    It seems to me that I already accepted my crow.  

Mike you did post in this note; but your excuse for being so late was
school/work/etc. All very good excuses, except you posted earlier today
which made those excuses pretty lame.

The Crazy met

>Mike you did post in this note; but your excuse for being so late was
>school/work/etc. All very good excuses, except you posted earlier today
>which made those excuses pretty lame.
    
    Not quite.  I check in from home from 7-8am before going to school. 
    I'm in the office at 11am.

    He's got one for every occasion.

I don't call what you posted eating crow....

A crow post example is...

 Give me a big heaping helping of that crow done to crispy perfection Chicago
style. If the suns had a way to stop Jordan or could figure out how to win
just once on their home court they might have made a series of it. Despite all
the praise I've been heaping on the Suns all season Chicago is the better team
and deserved to win.  Pour me some suds and I'll have a side order of polish
sausage to go with my crow. The Bulls would have won even if Ditka was
coaching them.


Your crow post was like a broncos fan saying if the super bowl was played in
denver they might have won it..

Saying the bulls won because they were more "experienced" is just another lame
excuse...

Belly up to the table and take your crow like a real man....

Metz

    Metz, maybe you should do a global substitution on that reply for
    Chicago->Phoenix and Phoenix->Seattle.
    
>the praise I've been heaping on the Suns all season Chicago is the better team
>and deserved to win.  Pour me some suds and I'll have a side order of polish
    
    But I seriously don't believe Chicago was the better team or that they
    deserved to win.  The play on the court proved that there isn't much
    separating these 2 teams and experience is the only difference.  What I
    posted is sufficient to me and that's all that counts as far as I'm
    concerned.  If you don't like it, deal with it.
    
    BTW - do fans and easterners out there still subscribe to the notion
    that the Eastern Conference final was "the championship"?  Or did
    Phoenix gain a measure of respect for the West?  Or did they just gain
    a measure of respect for themselves?  No baiting, I'm honestly curious.
    
    Mike

    Phoneix has a good team, but I still think the Easter Conference finals
    was the true championship.  I think the nerves got to the Bulls and it
    almost cost them a couple of games.   I still believe if the Knicks
    play the Suns in a best of 7, the Knicks win.

>Your crow post was like a broncos fan saying if the super bowl was played in
>denver they might have won it..

	But, but, it's twue!  It's twue! <sniff>

Claybone

 in a word Mike... NOPE

    A lack of experience?  Is that what they're calling that last-minute
    gag job in Phoenix?  Like I said, I gained a measure of respect for the
    Suns for their overall play in the last two games, but I don't think
    experience had much to do with the shoddy play in that 4th quarter by
    both teams.  Did Frank Johnson and Dan Majerle miss those wide-open
    15-foot bunny jump shots because they're not experienced?  Or was it
    because, as Paul Westphal unintentionally foretold just a minute
    before, they were wearing tightly-fitting rhinestone-studded dog collars 
    around their necks?  Well, at least one good thing came of the totally 
    deflating ending to Game 6.  Dan Majerle can put his arms down now. 
    He's earned that right.
    
    glenn
    

    Yes Phoenix just might be the best team in the west, but better then
    the east, Im not convinced.  Game 3 The bulls played horrible, they
    missed 75 shots, 75SHOTS and only had 9 free throw attempts, plus
    they still needed majerle to hit 6 3ptr's to get the win.  Do you 
    honestly feel that this was a true WIN by Phoenix, they allowed
    Chicago 130 shot attempts, 130, great defense.  The bulls just couldnt
    hit anything in game 3.  Game 5 on the other hand was a True Win by
    phoenix, although if not for the bulls wearing blindfolds in game 3
    there would have not been a game 5.  But Phoenix actually showed me
    that they were a decent team in game 5, backs against the wall down
    3-1, playing on the road, shot over 50% from the field and over 80%
    from the free throw line, outrebounded chicago at both ends.  That
    was a great win....
    
    							MairB

    and the Suns could've swept in Chicago and won game 2 here.

>     cause of a lack of respect for the West. This series should have been
>     over in five. 
    
    but it wasn't
    
    >And don't worry about the baiting. Losers can't bait only winner.
    
    which reminds me, how did YOUR team do this year?

    Tommy, you're obfuscating again.  Who was your team and did they make
    it to the finals?

Mikey, Mikey, Mikey a loss by a team does not require a meal in
the Crow Cafe; a loss after confidently predicting a win, especially 
for a few months does deserve one. So who Tommy's team is is irrelevant
and it is you who is obfuscating, weavin' and bobbin' and refusing
to accept reality.

The Crazy Met

Suck it up Mike,

Admit that the Suns were defeated by a better team. Admit that after your
crowing all season long that the east is still a considerable margin better
than the west. Sure, you can console yourself that the Suns didn't get swept,
nor did they fold like a cheap table after being down 2-0 but they lost. They
failed to win a single game on their home court, they showed serious lack of
height and lack of defense. 

Those are the facts...

My opinion is that the Bulls of the 1st quarter of game 1 are truly the chicago
bulls that won the east and mentally let down after going through the suns like
a hot knife through butter. They played down to the level of their competition
for the rest of the series. Somewhere deep in the recesses of their collective
basketball mind they knew that if they wanted to they could turn it on and blow
out the suns if it ever came down to that. 

Admit defeat without the excuses...admit that the bulls are the superior
team...take your crow like a man after predicting a suns championship for 6
months...

Metz

    BZZZZZT joself there Mistah,
    Ya done predicted a champeenship for your heroes and they didn't come
    through, no matter anyone's opinion on who is mo' worthu, etc. etc.
    etc..
    
    Now git yo' cojones up to the bar and belly up like a real main.
    
    
    MikeL
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    

    MikeL, don't hold your breath for it. Tommy got it just about
    right in .50; MikeH did show up in this note but his reply lacks the
    right spirit of humiliation that this note requires.
    
    The Crazy Met
    

I saw in yesterday's USA Today Danny Ainge whining that the
Suns were the better team.  Reminded me of JIm Kelly after 
the Super Bowl loss to the Giants.  Ol Jim was whining about
how the BIlls were superior.  Of course, the Bills have gone
on to be superior to two more teams since then.

So, the conclusion is - if the Suns are the better team, then
it simply means they pulled a monumental choke job.

JD

>    MikeL, don't hold your breath for it. Tommy got it just about
>    right in .50; MikeH did show up in this note but his reply lacks the
>    right spirit of humiliation that this note requires.
    
>    The Crazy Met

     While I agree that the Suns were beaten by a better team, it looks
     like people are looking for Mike H. to acknowledge that the following
     is true, which it clearly wasn't (anyone who watched the series would
     know it wasn't true) :
         

>     <<< Note 50.83 by DECWET::METZGER "PBS = Profitable Barney Station" >>>
>                 -< Chez doesn't deliver the promised land... >-


> Suck it up Mike,
> 
> Admit that the Suns were defeated by a better team. Admit that after your
> crowing all season long that the east is still a considerable margin better
> than the west. Sure, you can console yourself that the Suns didn't get swept,
> nor did they fold like a cheap table after being down 2-0 but they lost. They
> failed to win a single game on their home court, they showed serious lack of
> height and lack of defense. 

  I'm an eastern conference fan, and there was nothing in the regular season
  or post-season that convinces me that the east is still considerably better
  than the west.  The Suns were, to me, just as competitive against the Bulls
  as the Knicks were.  Except for game one, the Suns surprised me with very
  good defense, especially when KJ was playing Jordan and not Majerle.  You
  don't get 3 24-second violations against the Bulls in one quarter without
  playing good defense; it wasn't just that the Bulls were playing poorly, but
  the Suns were playing very good defense.  Some of the other eastern conference
  fans seem to be somewaht (very?) blind in this area.  And, in addition to
  an apparent ability to play defense when required, they are far superior
  offensively to the Knicks, the east's 2nd best team.

> Those are the facts...

  No, those are a very biased/warped view of the events that happened this
  year.

>My opinion is that the Bulls of the 1st quarter of game 1 are truly the chicago
>bulls that won the east and mentally let down after going through the suns like
>a hot knife through butter. They played down to the level of their competition
>for the rest of the series. Somewhere deep in the recesses of their collective
>basketball mind they knew that if they wanted to they could turn it on and blow
>out the suns if it ever came down to that. 

  That's an interesting opinion, but one that even the Bulls deny to be true.
  It could be that after having a very draining series against Seattle, the
  Suns had a tough time preparing physically and mentally for the opener
  against Chicago just a couple of days later.  Frankly, it seemed more to me
  that the Suns moved their game up a notch to match Chicago's defensive
  intensity rather than Chicago slipping a notch.  Deep in the recesses of your
  collective not-so-basketball minds you anti-Suns must know that even if they
  wanted to the Bulls were NOT able to turn it on and blow out the Suns by the
  end of the Series.  Phil Jackson acknowledged as much in his post-game 6
  interview when he said they just couldn't seem to put Phoenix away.

> Admit defeat without the excuses...admit that the bulls are the superior
> team...take your crow like a man after predicting a suns championship for 6
> months...

> Metz

  This I will agree with.  The Bulls are the superior team (but not by as much
  as some people are making it out to be).  After predicting a championship
  for 6 months, it ought to be a simple request for crow without embellishment.
  However, the request to acknowledge the rest of this hogwash has to be a
  joke, or the request of a completely unobjective viewer.

>      The Suns lose the series at home in Game 6 and Mike Heiser declares the 
>      Suns to be the better team.

       Actually, he said he didn't think Chicago was a better team.  He said
       he didn't think that there was much difference between them, and that
       their experience saved them.

       I read that as saying that Chicago and Phoenix are close to the same
       as far as talent level goes, and that they had an edge in experience
       that made them a slightly better, championship-level team.  I'm not
       sure I'd agree with his assessment of the difference, but there really
       wasn't that much of a difference this year between Chicago and Phoenix
       is either the regular season or the final series.
      
       Frankly, I think that Phoenix had much tougher 1st-round, 2nd-round,
       and conference finals opponents than Chicago, and it helped wear them
       down in preparation for the first game in Phoenix, the only game where
       it appeared (to me) that Chicago played much better than Phoenix.

re -1

You think Seattle was tougher than the Knicks?  TheLakers
shouldn't have been tough - the Suns LET them be tough.  The Suns
should have swept the Lakers with ease.

JD

    Rick, how much is Mike paying you anyway?
    
�but there really
�       wasn't that much of a difference this year between Chicago and Phoenix
�       is either the regular season or the final series.
    
    Phoenix finished with the best record in the NBA, Chicago finished with
    the second best record in the East (3rd or 4th best overall).  Chicago
    won the final series 4-2.  You're right, not much difference there.
    
�       Frankly, I think that Phoenix had much tougher 1st-round, 2nd-round,
�       and conference finals opponents than Chicago, 
    
    Yeah, right.  A number 1 seed has a tougher road to the finals than a
    #2 seed.  Add in the fact that the Suns first round opponent was a sub
    .500 Laker team and the Bulls conference final opponent was the Knicks
    who held the 2nd best regular season record in the NBA.

 Sorry Rollie but I think Metz is closer to the truth than you are. If the
 refs call the end of game 3 properly it's a Sweep. 

 This hogwash about a tough road is a cop out period. 3 weeks ago when they
 were struggling against the Lakers we heard that this how championship teams
 are built. The struggle is supposed to make them tougher I was led to believe
 by some folks in here...

 TO not even win 1 game at home in the finals????

 mike

    >> Actually, he said he didn't think Chicago was a better team.  He said
    >> he didn't think that there was much difference between them, and that
    >> their experience saved them.

    >> I read that as saying that Chicago and Phoenix are close to the same
     
       Rick this is *exactly* what he said:
     
      "Hopefully they'll learn from this as the Pistons did their first losing
       trip to the Finals.  I still think they're better than the Bulls..."
                            ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^    
    
     I don't read that as being "close". Sour grapes, pal that's all that
     is.          
    

    
    Wasn't Danny Ainge supposed to provide Phoenix with all this veteran
    leadership and *experience*?  Or was he just signing on as Designated
    Team Whiner?  He was pretty much invisible as far as I could see, so I
    can't respect such an opinion coming from *him* especially.
    
    >   Frankly, I think that Phoenix had much tougher 1st-round, 2nd-round,
    >   and conference finals opponents than Chicago, and it helped wear them
    >   down in preparation for the first game in Phoenix, the only game where
    >   it appeared (to me) that Chicago played much better than Phoenix.

    Add me to the list of those who strongly disagree.  Chicago took no
    prisoners in their early rounds, while Phoenix fooled around.  As I
    pointed out earlier, Chicago was 15-4 overall in the playoffs, while
    Phoenix was 13-11.  Huge difference, in spite of the fact that Chicago
    had to go through the Knicks.  Phoenix's ability to narrowly escape
    those early rounds (and it doesn't get any narrower than being down 
    2-0 to the Lakers or 4 points behind with a minute to go in the 5th 
    game) overshadowed how sporadic their play was.  The *loss* in the 
    Finals actually helped their reputation more than the victories in the
    early rounds.  You want respect and full credit you gotta come to play
    *every day*, not just look to a quarter or two and say how good your
    defense was.  Champions show up for every game.
    
    glenn
    

Exactly Glenn -

ONe needs to look no further than the Lakers/Sun and Bulls/Hawks
to see the huge difference.  The Bulls did what they were expected
to do.  Sweep.  Easily.  The Suns were expected to have an easy
time over a sub .500 Laker team.  Instead, they almost lost it all.

JD

    
    While were dengirating the Suns playoff opponents, let's take a look at
    the one supposedly tough match the Bulls had in reaching the finals. 
    Face it folks, once the Knicks series got back to Chicago, the Knicks
    foded up like a tent.  After game three, most people knew the Bulls
    were about to win the next three.
    
    The big difference I see between the Suns and Bulls is Michael.  It's
    not just his talent, but the Russell-like ability to take over a team,
    and will it to win.  
    
    brews

Not quite. Game 5 was a tough win for the Bulls and the Knicks kept
coming at 'em in game 6.

The Crazy Met

    > After game three, most people knew the Bulls
    > were about to win the next three.
      
    I didn't know that, though I thought it was a slim possibility.  Game
    5 was there for the taking for the Knicks.  They gave it away at the
    foul line, which Chicago had nothing to do with.  I liked Chicago's
    chances in 7, but it's a testimony to their overall strength that no
    one really counted not having home-court advantage in either of the
    *last two* series heavily against them.  Would anyone have thought as
    much for this "best team" Phoenix, which basically just shut down and
    conceded the last two games in Seattle?  That's what I mean about
    coming to play every game, and not knowing which Suns team it is that
    Mike H. refers to as the "better" team. 
    
    glenn
    

	No, I'm not nuts.  I still say that in games 2-6 of the finals,
	there was very little difference between Chicago and Phoenix.
	Anyone who makes the claim that a single call in a series makes
	the difference between a big difference and a little difference
	doesn't have much credability with me.  If anything, in games 2-6
	the only really impressive team performance was Phoenix in game 5.

	As far as the rest goes, all I was trying to say was that Chicago's
	big win in game one of the series has additional factors that should
	be considered besides the fact that Chicago was far superior to the
	Suns.  Phoenix did have a tougher road to the finals than Chicago,
	and had more pressure on them in their series than Chicago did.  [Not
	saying they didn't create the pressure, just saying it was there.]
	So, it isn't far fetched to suggest that they had a letdown and came
	in flat during the first half of the first game.  I believe that to
	be a far more reasonable, and factual, explanation of what happened
	in this series than saying Chicago could have blown Phoenix out any
	time they wanted, and they knew it.

	So far as the previous rounds go, all I was trying to say was that
	I thought these series could have contributed to a game 1 letdown.
	Yes, I think the Lakers are better than the Hawks (I live in Atlanta,
	these Hawks just plain stink), and with KJ missing game 1 of that
	series and coming off a sprained knee(?) injury that kept him out
	of the previous games, and ineffective game 2 was not a surprise.
	[Phoenix should have won anyways, but it did make the Lakers even a
	little tougher.]  San Antonio or Cleveland, that's a toos-up in my
	eyes.  And while NY won the Eastern division title, I think Seattle
	is a better team.  NY had a slightly better record because they play
	more soft touches in the east than Seattle got to play.  {I concede
	that Seattle is much less consistent than the Knicks, but they have
	more talent and are a bigger threat to the great teams than New York.
	Eastern fans may not agree, but I just don't think the Knicks are at,
	or even near, the talent level required to win a title.  JMHO which
	you are free to disagree with.}  Frankly, I think a Knicks-Phoenix
	or Knicks-Seattle series would have gone to the Western Conference
	winner.  Be that as it may, Phoenix did have a tougher series with
	Seattle than the Bulls did with NY, and this may have contributed to
	a game 1 Suns letdown, the only game which Phoenix was not playing at
	the same level as the Bulls.

	Besides, which one of you is really claiming that the Bulls were far
	superior in the finals to Phoenix, and in what area of play did you
	think they were far superior ?

>       Rick this is *exactly* what he said:
>     
>      "Hopefully they'll learn from this as the Pistons did their first losing
>       trip to the Finals.  I still think they're better than the Bulls..."
>                            ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^    
    
	That may be, but I couldn't find it expressed in the crow note, and
	I wasn't going to hunt through everything he has written everywhere
	to find out what he had said.    

MikeH may be brazen, but even he didn't put that kind of statement in
the Crow Cafe.

The Crazy Met

I live in Seattle, I watched the Sonics play all season long and I think that
the Knicks would have taken the Sonics in a game series. The knicks have a
couple of decent outside shooters and would have forced the Sonics to spread
the defense so they couldn't collapse on ewing. The reason the Sonics kept the
suns series close was because they had no center to worry about and could
collapse on Barkley and still stay spread. 

The fact that Phoenix can't play defense alleviated the Sonics season long
inability to string together a consistant offense. The knicks can play defense
and can score. With Home court advantage the Knicks would have beaten the
Sonics in 5. Without they would have won in 6, IMHO.

If Phil Jackson had a brain in his head and had pulled Pippen when he was so
cramped up he couldn't move in game 3 this could very easily have been a Bull
sweep.

Does anyone honestly think that the Bulls were ever really worried about losing
the series to the Suns? I don't, despite what platitiudes they might have
spouted to the media.

The bulls are the superior team and I think the Knicks could have easily taken
the Suns...They would have intimidated the heck out of them from minute 1.

No eastern bias from this west coast viewer...

Metz

    Now Ive heard it all, New York had a better record then seattle do to
    what ???????? Weaker teams in the WHAT... EAST.... Are we talking about
    the same west with the Dallas Mavaricks those lucky 2 digit winning
    teams by the seat of there pants.  The west had the 2 worse teams in
    the NBA, and 3 of the worse 4.  The reason the west had bloated records
    were do to there high number of cellar dwellars.  Denver, Minny, Dallas
    and Sacramento were knocked out of the playoffs I think around Xmas
    time :-), these teams showed nothing and there records especially there
    Conference records show proof of that.  They were easy W all year for
    the upper West teams.  The east had 10 Teams (did det hit .500) with a
    winning record...
    
    The west sips, see last 5 Champs and look at cellar dwellars for past
    few years.  Seattle is a great team, but better then the Knicks, I dont
    think so.  As for the Knicks VS Suns or Seattle, again well just never
    know and its you HO against MHO, but the Knicks would have manhandle
    either of them.  The knicks were the biggest chokers of the year.  The
    had Chicago back peddeling down 0-2 and let there level of intensity
    drop.  In a seven game series it takes more then luck to win, the only
    thing that stinks is seeing that the bulls only one 4-2 and won a few
    close games people are actually question how much better then Phoenix
    they are.  Well Phoenix couldnt beat the bulls at home even once, thats
    a pretty good indication...
    
    Next Year's West could go to Seattle, Phoenix, Portland maybe even utah
    or Houston.  But they still have the celler dwellers to help push there
    records up (Inflated)...
    								MaB

>The fact that Phoenix can't play defense alleviated the Sonics season long
    
    This ain't no fact.  After seeing what they did to the Bulls in Q4 of 
    game 6, there's no way an objective viewer can state this as a fact.
    They're not defensive oriented like the Knicks, but there team defense
    is decent, though sporadic.
    
>inability to string together a consistant offense. The knicks can play defense
>and can score. With Home court advantage the Knicks would have beaten the
    
    Again, the Knicks can't score.  They're lack of a 2nd go-to guy and
    poor FT shooting was their undoing.  Ewing couldn't do it alone.

>If Phil Jackson had a brain in his head and had pulled Pippen when he was so
>cramped up he couldn't move in game 3 this could very easily have been a Bull
>sweep.
    
    And it just as easily could've gone 7 games.  There's a counter for
    every argument like this.

>The bulls are the superior team and I think the Knicks could have easily taken
>the Suns...They would have intimidated the heck out of them from minute 1.

    Knicks don't have any finals experience either and the Suns proved they
    can't be intimidated.  The Bulls tried that in game 4, remember?  The
    Knicks tried that during the season and got their clocks cleaned by
    Phoenix.

You didn't see anything resembling intimidation in the finals. I'm talking
real-man intimidation..I'm talking McHale slamming Rambis to the floor, I'm
talking a shove in the back into the basket standard, I'm talking goon ball
like the Pistons used to play..that is intimidation...trying to compare what
the Bulls and Suns played like this year with real mano-a-mano intimidation is
like trying to call an Isiah-magic peck equal to the Bergman-Bogart smooch in
casablanca...

Metz

    They can based on what happened vs. the Sonics... NOT the Bulls...
    

    The Knicks didn't do that to the Bulls because they knew they didn't
    have a prayer with that method.  Neither would they do that vs. Phoenix
    after they tried it once.  NY doesn't have the bench to afford that
    style against real basketball teams.

There 'ya go again Mikey with revisionist history. I seem to recall that
KJ instigated the fight, no defense of Anthony so don't go usin'
him.  That game was a real test for Phoenix once the Knicks lost
most of their  guards.

The Crazy Met

The knicks used that method last year with the Bulls and had great success. You
don't need a deep bench for this style. You just use the bench guys as the
intimidators. Who cares if the 11th man picks up a foul. Even if you intimidate
with your starters it doesn't mean you need to be deep. One well placed foul
can do much to intimidate the opposition. All you have to do is get them
thinking..Look how much thought KJ was giving to being fouled as he drove the
lane..enough to gripe about it to the media....maybe enough to throw him off
his game for a while? who knows but it has been proven effective before...

Either way you didn't see it in the love fest finals this year, nor last year
against another cream puff western opponent....

Metz

Mind blank..was it Bergman or Bacall in Casablanca? 

    Well here I am back after spending some time with wife and 4yr son Phil
    in White Mtns where you can see stars at night.  I was disappointed in
    Suns loss as I decided to root them in and nearly pulled it off. 
    However despite rooting interest I cannot in any way say better team
    lost as I might have said with Celtics (and may have been wrong in 88).
    
    1st question:	What in the world was Frank Johnson doing with ball
    in hand at critical moment in #6
    
    2nd question:	What is Dan Majerle's problem - can't get
    			restaurant help and takes problems on the court.
    
    And finally.  Way back in game 1 I made observation "Suns are playing
    as though they are !OVER! Confident".  Well, crazy as it seems they 
    did seem to play that way and carelessness at end of #6 killed'em.
    
    Mike, you sure are a fan but I hope you Suns fans get critical about
    some of careless play of Suns.  Perhaps, they will contend again - I
    hope they learn from experience like detroit and bulls
    
    Bill

>There 'ya go again Mikey with revisionist history. I seem to recall that
>KJ instigated the fight, no defense of Anthony so don't go usin'
    
So the *entire* bench clearing mess was caused by KJ.  That one single pick
caused the 2nd largest bench clearing brawl in NBA history.  Yea, and the
LA riots were just the result of a single jury decision.  They had nothing to
do with built up tensions.

There were two (2) bench clearing incidents.  The first came when Rivers got
into KJs face.  It was very clear at that point (in fact it was clear before
that point) the game was out of hand.  In fact, I think it had escalated to
the point that players wanted revenge more than the wanted to win the game -
I'm sure it was that way for KJ (and he got both didn't he - a little revenge
and a victory).  The next bench clearing was inevitable, and it happened about
30 seconds later.  That's the one everybody sees on TV or remembers from the
game.

You could see this incident coming from miles away.  What did the refs do
about it - nothing.  Let the player's decide the game - and they did.  Now
everybody is PO'ed about how it got decided.  That incident was just waiting
to happen.  Riley "We want to be the most disliked team in basketball" meets
Kevin "I've spent my life being thrown to the floor without a call" Johnson
and KJ decides enough is enough.  If refs won't stand up for me, maybe I'll
have to do it myself. I can play "tough defense" too.  In fact, I might need
to to win a championship this year.  Suddenly,  Riley doesn't like other teams
playing "tough defense" - well tough $*it.  

The Suns watched a close game slip away in NY this year by NY getting away
with crap (remember Barkley being suspended against Cleveland).  When the refs
let it happen in Phoenix, they nipped it in the bud.  Nothing like a little
bud nippen.  But, all-in-all it was the refs that let the game get out of hand.

    	Metz, Bergman in Casablanca and Bacall in "You know how to whistle
    don't you?  Just put your two lips together and blow".  And blow is an
    appropriate term since we're discussing the Knickerbockers and Suns.
    
    				/Don

>    	Metz, Bergman in Casablanca and Bacall in "You know how to whistle
>    don't you?  Just put your two lips together and blow".  And blow is an
>    appropriate term since we're discussing the Knickerbockers and Suns.
    

Yep, it t'was Bergman in "Casablanca", playing good-woman/bad-woman.

If you watch it, keep an eye on her when she has her hat on, and when
she doesn't.  Also, take a look at the lighting.  Those are the two
most illustrative aspects of good-woman/bad-woman.

And I've always wondered what she would have done had Rick been on the
plane out with Victor.....




	"Of all the gin joints, in all the towns, in all the world, she walks
	into mine"

					-- Rick Blaine

    Phoenix Nuns(tm) - above the refs... coming soon to a court near you...
    

Mike -

KJ's shot was a wimpy cheap shot - and he wasn't even man enough
to stand his ground afterwards, as he went running for the Suns
bench, no doubt hoping his mama's dress could hide him.   If that
one incident is your proof that the choking Suns couldn't be 
intimidated, then that's purty funny.   KJ got the elbow up, blatant
cheap shot.  

This finals didn't have any true intimidation.  Neither did any of
the other Suns series - unless KJ cheap shot of Divac counts.  

The Suns were toyed with.  And while you crow about the great
Q4 defense - remember the Suns only scored 19 points that quarter -
a quarter where they had the Bulls on the rope, at home, in front
of screaming fans - and they didn't have the cajones to put them
away.  

JD

    Remember (see 36.263)... I delivered the shot and then went towards the
    locker room?   The playoff intimidation was FJ ripping Pippen's jersey
    and then apologizing.
    
    Thank the Eastern conference for what Mike calls "Thugball", but the
    east (Central conference) has the last 5 trophies...
    
    
>    Show me where I'm wrong
    
    4<- ---------------------------------------------------------------- 5->
                                       |
                       3               |
             1                       *3|          *2a 
     ---------|                        |                 |-------
*4         *1 |                        |           2a    |                *5
     ---------|                        |                 |--------
                                       |              2 *2
                                       |
         -----------------------------------------------------------------
    
>    1) Approximate area where Rivers fouled KJ. (Hasn't been on the
>    highlights here, but I'll believe you).
    
    In the lane.
    
>    2) Where KJ fouled Rivers, Rivers went to the ground
    
    Closer the the free throw line.
    
>    2a) Where Starks took the shot from.  Not a direct path for KJ to
>    go through Rivers to get to him, but KJ did have a message to deliver.
    
    Left side of key.  You can see where KJ does a hard bank right right
    after going by Rivers' pick.
    
>    3) Where Rivers caught KJ
    
    halfcourt, left of the logo in the center.  They worked their way down
    to the 3pt line on the right side (Knicks' side) with the Greg Anthony
    punk move and Riley falling on top of both while trying to separate
    them.
    
>    4) Suns Locker room
>    5) Knicks Locker room
    
    tunnels leading to the rooms are directly off the goal supports at the
    end of the lane.
    
>    Seems to me that KJ hit Rivers, went over to Starks and headed to the
>    locker room since the half ended.  Rivers went out of his way to catch
>    him, but I don't see how it's "wrong" to say KJ didn't hit him and then
>    headed for the locker room...
    
    No, but it's wrong to say KJ hit him and ran to the locker room like it
    was some sort of cheap-shot-chicken-sh*t move.  This is what I thought 
    you were getting at.  The CSCS move (tm) is more like blindsiding 
    someone ala Greg Anthony.
    
    Mike

    

    Re:118 ok, where did I put those kim-wipes...
    
    The Branch Sunsian... classic!!!!!
    
    REK

    All this from a guy who condemned NY faux fans, yet was rooting for the
    Knicks, despite saying he hated them in his intro.  Looks like his teams 
    didn't fare very well at all either.  Obviously he doesn't have a right
    to rag on me.
    
================================================================================
Note 3.41                         Introductions                        41 of 119
MSBCS::BRYDIE "Nixon in '96!"                        10 lines  12-JAN-1993 14:17
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

   Tommy Brydie 

   Ayuh: Boston teams, UMass, Warren Moon, Muhammad Ali, Pernell Whitaker,
         FSU football, LA Raiders, long walks on the beach, snuggling, etc.

 A-nope: New York teams and most of their fans, Mike Lupica, the Herald, that
         clothes note over in RAD_RAD (just bustin' Karen), people who frown,
         world hunger, etc.

I seem to recall that the line about how to whistle was Mae West to
Cary Grant.

The Crazy Met

>I seem to recall that the line about how to whistle was Mae West to
>Cary Grant.
>
>The Crazy Met


Not.  It was Bacall to Bogie.  (Unless it was used earlier and then reused).


'Saw

Tommy -

That's okay, I remember when Mike was a Celtics fan, called the
West weak, and never complained about east coast bias.

JD

>     Yes, I rooted for the Knicks. I liked their style and I especially
>    like local guy Pat Ewing. In general, I don't like New York teams
>    or their fans because as a native Bostonian they are our natural
>    rivals. My rooting for the Knicks doesn't even begin to approach
>    the flippin' and a floppin' like a boated bluefish that Mikey did
>    on the Suns this post-season. 


 JD says it's the Bullets.....

    
    Mae West, now there's a classic.
    Her best line " My right leg is Xmas, my left leg in New Years.
                    Why don't you come see me between the holidays."
    
    Ba-doom!
    
    MikeL
    

Mike C. -

Hey, I just go by where I grew up.  But we always played Bullets
vs. Knicks, then Lakers vs. Knicks, then Celtics vs. Knicks.

I guess the Reed vs. Unseld, Frazier vs. Monroe rivalries were
more natural.  And the 3 finals in 4 years were against the Lakers.

I thought the Celts real rivals were the Lakers, anyhow.

JD

naw actally it the 76 ers' then Fakers....

mike

    Actually,
    
    Twas the Syracuse Nats, San Loooey Hawks, Cinci Royals, Lakers,
    (late 50's,oily 60's), THEN the Warriors(Philthy), 76ers(ex-gNats),
    afore the Knickabockas.
    
    HTH,
    MikeL
    
    

>That's okay, I remember when Mike was a Celtics fan, called the
>West weak, and never complained about east coast bias.
    
    JD, are you doing shrooms(tm) again?  I never said the West was weak.

>     Yes, I rooted for the Knicks. I liked their style and I especially
>     like local guy Pat Ewing. In general, I don't like New York teams
>     or their fans because as a native Bostonian they are our natural
    
    First you say you *HATE* NY teams, then you root for them.  Sounds like
    a flippin' and a floppin' boated bluefish to me.

Mikey -

FIrsted, I ain't going through the archives of sports.  But oh
do I remember back when the Bird Celtics were playing the Lakers,
and oh, MIkey, you were on that bandwagon.  But then again, that's
back when you were a Celtics fain cuz they were winning.  Now
you are a Suns fain cuz they are winning...

JD

fandom like politics makes strange bedfellows. The only team I can think
of that I have never rooted for in at least one game is the Celtics. But
you better believe that if the Knicks and XXX were tied for the best
record with one game left and the Knicks would lose a tie breaker and
team XXX was playing the Celtics I would root for the Celtics to win
that game.

HtH, Tommy

The Crazy Met

    Jd, Tommy, the archives are online.

      I there a moderator in the house?

>     Mike, let me break it down so even a Branch Sunsian like yourself can
>     understand. Patrick Ewing is from Boston. I root for Bostonians. Got
>     it? Furthermore on my chart of most disliked teams the Suns are now at
    
    I thought he was originally from Jamaica and only attended Cambridge
    R&L after moving here.  A faux fan following a faux Bostonian.  Makes sense.
    
    And while you're searching through the archives, you'll notice the fact
    that I've been supporting the Suns since I moved here.  Knowing JD as
    we do, it's understanding when the facts are beyond him.  They're too
    inconvenient to his little world.

    
    girls, girls, girls......
    
    Ya know about a million 'trons have passeed between y'all about this
    and it's really an attempt to clarify "Wardlevaning".......
    
    Dis ain't new!
    
    I remain,
    glad there's some life in here finally!
    Kev
    

    I've been vocal about both for years.  You can't prove your views.

Oh, why bother.  Mikey has shown his true colors.

Its obvious. He never said the Suns were the best.  He never
overhyped them all year.  He never denigrated the Lakers, or
western style hoops back when he was a Celtics fan.  He's been
a die hard Suns fan for years, and has over hyped them for years.

He's never been wrong. 

JD

    
    
    
         Chomp Chomp Chomp..... I predicted the Lakers to beat em.
    
    Chappy

    
    
    Chomp Chomp Chomp......  I predicted the Spurs to beat em.....
    
    
    Chappy

    
    
    Chomp Chomp Chomp........ I predicted the Sonics.......
    
    
    Chappy

    
    
       But I also picked the BULLS to Beat em.....:-)
    
    
    Chappy

no news there, Kev :-)

The Crazy Met

    You're a big man, Chappy.  Coming in here and alone like that when you
    know there were others that should've went with you.
    
    I predicted the Suns would take it all.
    
    CHOMP!  CHOMP! CHOMP!  

    
    > You're a big man, Chappy.  Coming in here and alone like that when you
    > know there were others that should've went with you.
    
    Baloney.  I said that the Suns would beat the Lakers after they fell
    behind 2-0, that they would win the West, and that they would lose to
    the superior Bulls in anywhere from 4-6 games.  Others expressed
    similar sentiments.  Suck it up, Mike.
    
    glenn
    

    C'mon Mike.  Be a man.  Stop the "he did it first, he shoulda been
    there before me" stuff.  It ain't pretty.

    A small portion of crow for me. I was positive the Braves would win by
    8-9 games after they took the division lead from the Giants. Well the
    Braves did win, but by 1 game on the last day of the season.
    
    pass the mustard.
    
    The Crazy Met
    

Mikey, Mikey, Mikey

Here I go and put an entry in a crow note for something I said in ::baseball
once or twice. When I blow it big time, as in the SB, I crow appropriately
as in .7. How you can possibly compare eating crow after making a statement
in another conference, and saying it once or twice, with the way you went
wishy-washy after boasting and gloating for a whole season is beyond my
comprehension. I am sure that Brews will show us all that folks in Arizona
understand how to eat Crow when the Cardinals are officially eliminated from
getting into the NFL playoffs.

The Crazy Met

    As promised, I will gladly eat crow on the Phillies series prediction.
    The Blue Jays proved to be the superior team, top to bottom.  At the
    same time I don't think Phillies' fans can be terribly disappointed in
    their team's account of itself.  Frustrated, yes, because they were so
    close, two reasonably easy save situations from winning it all.  At the
    same time there were too many good stories, like those of Schilling and
    Dykstra and the Game 6 comeback, to look at it only as a lost affair
    (after all, had the Phils won those two games, Jays' fans would be
    lamenting even greater missed opportunity-- that's just the way the
    great game of baseball is when it's back-and-forth, pitch-to-pitch 
    like this Series was over its last three games).
    
    So, in the last three years, baseball has given us *five* verifiably
    great series-- Minnesota-Atlanta, Atlanta-Pittsburgh (twice), 
    Toronto-Atlanta, and Toronto-Philadelphia.  I won't even count the
    Philly-Atlanta series as in that class, although it was very 
    interesting.  From the 1993 Fall Classic, the names of Carter ("not 
    since Mazeroski"-- the highest standard of all for a single WS event), 
    Dykstra (the man is gawd, Mets' fans), and especially Molitor have been 
    registered for the ages.  Once again, the things that make baseball 
    "boring" to the casual viewer, the time between pitches and the 
    intervening stillness, the lengthy at-bats of a great mano-a-mano 
    pitcher-batter duel, were what made the tension so great but more
    importantly so prolonged.  Finally, when Carter hit it out and gave us 
    another great Carlton Fisk enactment of his joy, all I could do was 
    smile.  That was a tremendous moment, and with the possible exception 
    of Molitor, it couldn't have happened to a more deserving and 
    appropriate figure than Joe Carter...
    
    glenn
      

    It just overwhelms me that those entries qualify as "crow" notes and
    mine didn't.

Mikey,

'ya still don't get it. It is all relative. Doing an analysis like Glenn did
is one thing. Boasting all season long like you did is a far different thing.
The "crowing" should match the "boasting".

The Crazy Met

                                                               
    > It just overwhelms me that those entries qualify as "crow" notes and
    > mine didn't.
    
    Maybe 'cuz there's no "whining sore loser" aspect to these; none of
    this we were the better team and the other team was saved by its
    experience garbage...
    
    glenn
     

If only you'd listened to me...

8-) 8-)

Mike

(Sorry. I can't help it. I'm an appalling winner.)

>(Sorry. I can't help it. I'm an appalling winner.)

A veritable legend in your own mind...  King of the virtual victory...


8^)

re: last

I consider every conversation that I manage to escape without landing myself in
the cack a victory. 8-)

Mike

    Tommy, step up to the bar and eat your crow like a real main.

    I didn't see any whining and excuse making while Tommy downed his bird.

    I try to read into press reports, odds makers, Eddie A and come to a
    conclusion.  However, in addition I now see, one needs to observe that
    which one wants to "opine".  I had only a few glimpses of Bowe -
    Holyfield I.
    
    So Mike Fowler of the Isles, Horse on me and others.  Hopefully, I can
    watch the fight on hbo this week and get a good luck at these heavies.
    
    I usually preach the message "don't listen to media people" and I've
    apparently gotten hoisted by meown petard.  The press was about 98%
    convinced that Bowe would win.
    
    Of course there was an upset wind in the air all this weekend until it
    gusted up against the windproof pats, the ultimate immovable object.
    The gods would have a better chance hitting 1 irons vs Ben Hogan than
    inspiring these Patriots.

    Ah take it that Mssr Brydie is still dining in his sumptuous, monstah
    fowl dish thisd AM, and ain't had time to fill us in the
    elegance of his morning cuisine.
    
    MikeL
    

> UCLA didn't have their starting QB. They are a passing team, Mr. William-
> Perry-is-a-near-allstar, so it's not just a minor loss.
    
    I would expect such a well-balanced and powerful team as your #5 in the
    country up against an *unranked* oppenent to do better than put up 3 points 
    for itself and 6 for the other team regardless of which single individual 
    player might be missing.  Hell, that highly flawed Ohio State team 
    (underachieving greatly at 9-0-1) has two QBs and uses them both.  Depth 
    is part of the game.  A running game comes in handy every once in a while, 
    too (a lesson both FSU and UCLA learned so painfully this weekend).
    
    Let's face up to the truth here: the Pac-10 is dead.  Even UCLA has now
    lost to Cal and ASU in the conference.  Arizona coughed it up against 
    Cal this weekend, too.  While you were chuckling over the very remote 
    possibility that the Big-10 would send a 7-4 Illinois team to the Rose, 
    we are now guaranteed a Pac-10 team that's no better than 8-3, and 
    possibly even 7-4 if USC defeats UCLA.  A major upset in the Rose is
    the only thing that could salvage even the smallest amount of pride for
    the conference, and even then it probably shouldn't merit a Top 10
    finish for any of the teams.  None of them have gotten the job done...
    
    glenn
       

    I'll have some corned beef and potatos with my ND crow.  I knew it
    would be close, but thought FSU would prevail.
    
    Now Tommy, you can do better on that ASU crow.  Especially after
    making fun of the prediction McKay and myself made.

    The day started off with a heaping $1000 (monopoly money) of 
    Irish stew but ended up a bit better as UCLA showed they really
    are a 2 man team running miinus a cylinder!!!!
    
    Mike you'll be happy to know that there are 5 or 6 people on the
    East Coast who jumped on your bandwagon 8*)
    
    Jimbo

>    Mike you'll be happy to know that there are 5 or 6 people on the
>    East Coast who jumped on your bandwagon 8*)
    
    Well the Droods are the hottest thing going in the PAC.  Too bad we
    couldn't start the season over.  At least we have a bowl to look
    forward to for the first time in 6 years.

I am a_infidel and a_unaccurate prognosticator of THE GAME, circa 1993.

I have sinned, through my fault, through my fault, through my most
grevious fault.

And stupid to boot: you never predict the team that you want to win.

TTom

    I sent mail to Mike picking FSU.  If that means I need to be here, so
    be it... 

    Nay Nay gentlemen
    
    Crow cafe dining is restricted to those who unabashedly, without
    reservation, emotionally put all their aigs behind THEIR team.
    Only one person, Mssr Brydie, falls into that category in this match
    and he has mainfully yet grudgingly "crowed" up. All y'all who merely
    threw out predictions yet are not dye-in-the-wool Seminoles fans
    need not do so.
    
    MikeL
    

Consider my note as the intital deposit on a Crow Equity Fund.

You know, eat a little each week and pretty soon there's a whole lot to
be sorry about.

TTom

    Never mind then...

    Thanks MikeL, I wouldn't want to be lumped in with a whiner like
    Brydie.

    -1, yea he is a whiner ain't he...
    
    Well I can soitanly say that I did not enjoy my morning breakfast
    of carrion with a side dish of bitter pill washed down by castor
    oil. I was so looking forward to dine on bald eagle.
    
    MikeL
    

    Tommy watch, Day 1

    re.186
    
    Just the perfect person to put that in.....
    
    
    JaKe
    

      Love that p_name JaKe!

    
    Well let me have a heaping plate full of slightly charred crow.  I said
    the Rockies would have a higher winning percentage than the Broncos. 
    Obviously, this was incorrect and only my missing forethought of
    getting rid of Reeves and "free agency" prevented me from thinking this
    out clearly.  Congrats Bronco fans...
    
    Marc
    

    16:00 tomorrow it goes, Tim.  Then it goes thru a day or so of
    disinfection.
    
    JaKe
    

Well I can't post the mail that Brews sent me but I can say that he
took a plate of Crow, not a real manly portion but then again we are
talking about the Cardinals.

However, I can and will GLADLY forward Brews mail to anyone who wants 
it.

The Crazy Met

    
    I think I /er owes me a new p-name.
    
    ACCbrews

	Shame on you Brews!  Here I thought you were a mainly type, hates 
soccer, likes the Giants because they play outdoors when it's 20� below 
zero, beats up on defenseless animals.  But now this!  I bet Alabama, even 
mind you (sans points), and you try to squirm out of the bet!  For shame!  Just 
by betting on the Heels you've become stained with that baby blue hue of 
cowardice!  Now put on that P-Name I gave you!
                       
				/Don


                <<< CAM::$1$DUA5:[NOTES$LIBRARY]SPORTS.NOTE;1 >>>
                                  -< SPORTS >-
================================================================================
Note 29.263                         The Line                          263 of 315
VAXMKT::ROBICHAUD "Homer,Plato,Voltaire,DanReeves"    4 lines   7-DEC-1993 12:14
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    	Is Alabama really a 2� underdog to the Heels?  The Tide is going to
    roll over North Carolina!
    
    				   /Don

                <<< CAM::$1$DUA5:[NOTES$LIBRARY]SPORTS.NOTE;1 >>>
                                  -< SPORTS >-
================================================================================
Note 29.267                         The Line                          267 of 315
VAXMKT::ROBICHAUD "Homer,Plato,Voltaire,DanReeves"    4 lines   7-DEC-1993 12:38
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    	Despite all that ACC the Tide will still crush the Heels and I'm
    willing to wager a P-Name on it without the benefit of the 2� points.
    
    				/Don

                <<< CAM::$1$DUA5:[NOTES$LIBRARY]SPORTS.NOTE;1 >>>
                                  -< SPORTS >-
================================================================================
Note 29.280                         The Line                          280 of 315
VAXMKT::ROBICHAUD "Homer,Plato,Voltaire,DanReeves"   10 lines   7-DEC-1993 17:04
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
�    /er, I'd be more than happy to take you up on this very generous offer.
    
�    brews

	Sure thing BOSS, since ACC is to chicken to bet on his FauxAlmaMater
you can I can make a mainly non-soccer like bet on the game.  I got Alabama 
and you got the Heels, EVEN.  Duration of the P-Name to be one week (providing
we're still both here).

				/Don

    
    As a true believer in the NC, Dean and ACCrisp, I would like to renege
    on the bet.  Cain't break with tradition, can I?
    
    brews

    
    I think the Slashermain should be checking in here, too (it's a shame
    he didn't do it voluntarily, like a main's main).  Hope he didn't lay
    the points.  Big-10 roolz!
    
    glenn
    
                <<< CAM::$1$DUA5:[NOTES$LIBRARY]SPORTS.NOTE;1 >>>
                                  -< SPORTS >-
================================================================================
Note 20.417                      Big Ten Sports                       417 of 469
VAXMKT::ROBICHAUD "The Pequot Patriots?"              4 lines  17-DEC-1993 13:28
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    	UCLA will crush Wisconsin.  They would be a good dark horse to go
    all the way if the NCAA settled championships in a mainly fashion.
    
    				/Don

                <<< CAM::$1$DUA5:[NOTES$LIBRARY]SPORTS.NOTE;1 >>>
                                  -< SPORTS >-
================================================================================
Note 37.223                       PAC-10 Sports                       223 of 321
VAXMKT::ROBICHAUD "We Want Zolak!"                    4 lines  28-OCT-1993 17:00
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    	The UCLA Broons will crush whatever team the Little 11 sends to the
    Rose Bowl.
    
    				/Don
    

    	Scram Glenn, I made no P-Name bet 'cuz all you BigTenBigots were
    'fraid to before the fack.  Come on Brews, don't be like Dean or Lou
    Holtz, be a main and pay up.
    
    				/Don

    Brews sure has put a black mark on soccer haters everywhere.

I thought that Brews was continuing in the tradition of fellow Phoenicians.

The Crazy Met

    I'll have a leg of Bronco, feather of Buccaneer, leg of Ram, and some
    Lions blood to round out my fine crow dinner...

    I hope Dr. Heimlich met the Bears at the airport.

    _GSH_

>I thought that Brews was continuing in the tradition of fellow Phoenicians.
    
    If he is, at least he doesn't wear those silly p-names all the time. 
    You'd think you would win one once in a while.
    

    
>> I thought that Brews was continuing in the tradition of fellow Phoenicians.
>    
>    If he is, at least he doesn't wear those silly p-names all the time. 
>    You'd think you would win one once in a while.
    
    I still can't get over the now-classic 50.29...
    
    glenn
    

    re: .29
    
    Yabbut that was a discsussion, not a p_name bet, and not Crow; I know
    shocking that in ::sports a reply did not belong in the topic it is
    found.
    
    Hmm, last p_name bet I won - well there was the 1992 World Series, and
    one with a dart game later than that. Must have been about a year ago.
    But Glenn, at least some of us have the guts to back up our opinions,
    can't remember the last time you did that.
    
    

    
>    But Glenn, at least some of us have the guts to back up our opinions,
>    can't remember the last time you did that.
    
    I wouldn't call backing up outrageously bad opinions with p-name bets 
    resulting in wearing the usual juvenile "<insert NY sports team here> 
    sucks!" byline as gutsy; more like stupid.  When I've been wrong, like 
    with my prediction that the Phillies would win the WS this year, I've 
    owned up to it, just by coming out and saying so.  Would you consider
    it "gutsy" if I were to similarly predict that the Red Sox will win 100
    games this year?  I think not...
    
    glenn
    

    
    Hey, I owned up to my Cards prediction.  Don't throw me in with those
    other Phoenicians.  I am merely not owning up to my word as a former
    member of the Carolina faithful.
    
    brews

owning up with a note that you did a set/hidden on is slimier than
what other Phoenicians did. Now you're just compounding the sleaziness.

The Crazy Met

 >   owning up with a note that you did a set/hidden on is slimier thanwhat
 >   other Phoenicians did. Now you're just compounding the sleaziness.
    
    I did no such thing!  I'm just doin the Carolina, now.
    
    brews

MikeH you're gonna have to explain the layout of Phoenix to the rest of us.

The Crazy Met

    South Phoenix = Roxbury area, which is where Brews claims he lived pre-CA
    West/North Phoenix = Leominster/Lawrence/Lowell, i.e. varying stages of
                         the working class.  I'm proud to say I'm a North
                         Phoenician.
    Central/East Phoenix = Wesley, i.e. bigoted yuppie & snobsville

    
>>West/North Phoneix = Brooklyn Heights/Flatbush
                                        ^^^^^^^^
                                        ||||||||
    caused by her undies being to small.
    
    Schnorttt Schittt Schleppps
    
    JaKe
    

    TCM, I guess you could say that.  I've only been to NYC twice, but it
    sounds close enough.

So if I got this right:

South Phoenix = Harlem??
West/North Phoneix = Brooklyn Heights/Flatbush
Central/East Phoenix = Upper East Side

The Crazy Met

re: .215

rollllling!!

The Crazy Met

    > not only that, he's a WEST-SIDE Phoenician!
    
    I've never owned a home on the west-side.  Don't like to live where all
    those cars are parked in the front yard.
    
    brews

�owning up with a note that you did a set/hidden on is slimier than
�what other Phoenicians did. 
    
    Yeah, what kind of slime hides their own notes.

Mac, the way you take things out of context truly amazes me.

Of course an even worse slime is a F-mod who unhides notes that the
author has hidden. 

Though of course that is impossible when the notes don't exist :-)

The Crazy Met

�    West/North Phoenix = Leominster/Lawrence/Lowell, i.e. varying stages of
�                         the working class.  I'm proud to say I'm a North
�                         Phoenician.
    
    Shouldn't that be a Neuveax North Phoenician?

   > Shouldn't that be a Neuveax[sic] North Phoenician?
    
    That's redundant Mac.  Everyone in North Phoenix is relatively new to
    that part of town.  Even the Indians didn't live there, too ugly.   
    
    brews

    Brews, the desert is ugly to the bone.  Doesn't matter what part of it
    you live in.  Besides, if I got paid for my lousy golf handicap like you 
    sales folks, I could swing a house in a "non-ugly" yuppie scum area.

    
    It's purdy where I live.  As a matter of fact, the other noters will be
    able to see for themselves at the Phoenix Open, just a couple miles
    from my house.
    
    BTW-- had a baby rattler on the doorstep Mondy.
    
    brews

>    It's purdy where I live.  As a matter of fact, the other noters will be
>    able to see for themselves at the Phoenix Open, just a couple miles
>    from my house.
    
    it's amazing what a little water can do, like turning a desert into a
    faux pas desert.
    
>    BTW-- had a baby rattler on the doorstep Mondy.
    
    did ya tell'em he's supposed to be hibernating?

   >  it's amazing what a little water can do, like turning a desert into a   
   >  faux pas desert.
    
    The desert out here, except for the fairways of the golf courses, are
    au naturel.  We're over 1000 feet higher than the rest of the valley,
    so our climate is a bit more moderate.  We actually have trees.
    
    They are building a house across the street from me, and I think the
    tractors and the 75 degree temps roused the snake from a nap. 
    Unfortunately, he was trying to get near the house for warmth.
    
    brews
    

      North Phoenix?  Are you talking Bell Rd. area?  Isn't that Pleasent
    Valley?
    
      If I remember right (oh boy) most anything north of Camelback rd,
    east of the interstate (the one from flagstaff, I10 or I17) were decent
    areas.  Or was that the Lincoln expressway?  Being gone for 14 years
    kinda shows the ol memory or lack there of.
    
      Tim

All of our rattlers are WAY WAY WAY back in their dens, where they belong
at this time of year...8^)


'Saw_who_has_an_Arizona_rattle_at_home_from_Brews

    ADD ENTRY KNOW::GEOGRAPHY
    
    Mark for Mac.

It's about time you fessed up. If you had stayed on your Kevorkian like hunger
strike much longer we would have had to force feed you the bird and it's not a
pleasent site.

Oh, yeah...not only did they not beat Wisconsin handily...they LOST !!!

mediocrity ruled in the PAC10 this year...

Metz

    {sniff!}

    
    Yeah, so much for the 49ers.  I guess I really was out on a limb with
    the prediction of a win over the Cowboys.  It's just that I felt very 
    sure that the Bills were going back again, and couldn't stomach the 
    thought of the Cowboys winning it all again in another rout in the
    rematch.  It appears that the NFL playoffs peaked in the wild-card
    round this year.  Even if the Bills give it their best game (and they
    probably will), I still can't see it being near enough.
    
    I'll say what I did after last year's Super Bowl, when so many people
    cited the pitfalls that can befall a champion (which did almost
    take Dallas down earlier this year, but which they overcame): this 
    Cowboys team is young and talented enough to become the best in NFL 
    history.  It's scary.  Don't be surprised to see this core of players
    win this Super Bowl and two or three more in the coming years.  You
    have to foresee a bunch of things (not just one or two) going wrong for
    it not to happen...
    
    glenn
    
                  

gag, wretch many times just at the thought of .235's scenario over
the next few years.

Go Bills!

The Crazy Met

    
>       So what was all that stuff about the San Francisco defense not being 
>       that bad and their offense being the best? And ths stuff abou Buffalo 
>       being able to beat anyone on a given Sunday goes out the window be-
>       cause Dallas blew out San Fran?
    
    Rationalization.  Thinking with my heart and not my head.  I was wrong,
    dead wrong.  Dallas is a machine.  They will not be denied.
    
    glenn
    

    
    glenn,
    
    	It'll only last as long as Jones keeps writing checks....
    
    Claybone

    
>>    	It'll only last as long as Jones keeps writing checks....
    
  
 Ain't no reason for him to stop with the mercandise money coming in..
 Geez I.M. was just telling me about his 29 year old cousin who got
 a Troy Aikman doll....

 mikey

    
  >> -< Why do think I'm in the crow note? >-
  >
  >   I know why you're in the crow note. But I don't know why
  >   you're in the crow note making excuses. 
    
    Yeah, I guess even admitting that one is dead wrong and guilty
    of pure rationalization in an assessment of a great team like the 
    Cowboys just doesn't cut it anymore.  Next time I'll try to come 
    up with something more original, like griping about unforced 
    turnovers...
    

    A lot of people bet with who they would like to see win the game.
    KC-SF was the matchup everyone wanted but neither team was close to
    the home teams.
    
    Buffalo and Dallas are clearly the two best but if Dallas plays to its
    ability it won't be too close.

>       Nope, no six turnovers for San Fran yesterday. Their "not bad" defense 
>       just had the ball stuffed down their throats yesterday and their "best"
>       offense going didn't go.
    
    So, is a Dallas-San Fran matchup an even game, or isn't it?  I no
    longer think that it is even close, I think Dallas is clearly superior, 
    an even better team than the one that I said would require a San Fran 
    upset to beat.  You prefer carping, UCLA-style excuse-making instead of
    forthright recognition of the better team?  Friday you made such a stink 
    of the fact that the game was a toss-up, a 50-50 proposition on a neutral 
    field.  Tell you what, Tommy.  You tell me which story on Dallas is the 
    one you want to stick with, and I'll adjust my comments to meet your 
    expectations.  I was wrong in underestimating Dallas and overestimating 
    San Fran, or I was wrong on this one given day because Dallas gave such 
    a gritty courageous account of themselves.  Buffalo will get beat with 
    ease because that's clearly the expected result, or Buffalo will get beat 
    because of a bad day when they didn't play to their peak effort.  Let me 
    know, so that I can be wrong in advance for the right reasons...
    
    glenn
    

    
    
     re .245
    
     Whew... That gave me a headache.
    
    

    pretty sorry when folks have to argue over their crow entries.

>    pretty sorry when folks have to argue over their crow entries.
    
    Now that you mention it, I don't see anybody else in here even though I
    was 50%, same as most.  Why even bother?
    
    glenn
    

    I've been rooting for whoever is playing the Cowgirls since I was old 
    enough to stay up and watch Howard, Dandy Don, and the Giff, but you don't 
    see me in hear every Monday either.

      Well I'm here since I said I like KC and SF to win.  They aren't my
    teams nore did I spew about either one, but cut a wing off with some
    hot sauce anyway.
    
     Tim
    
      

    Well I said Buffalo would cover and might even win. Toss on a whole
    Crow, uncooked - with those kind of predictions cooking would be too
    merciful. Maybe some mustard on the side to hide the taste a little
    bit.
    
    The Crazy Met
    

    I'll have some of that good ole Texas BBQ-styled crow.  Da 'Boys showed
    again why they're the best.  With the youngsters they have at all the
    skill positions, we may be talking the "D" word here.

    
    I haven't been around here lately, but sorry TCM, .252 just wasn't good
    enough.
    
    brews

    TCM and Hize, you are to be congratulated.  It wasn't easy coming to
    this topic admitting to the world you blew your SB predictions.  
    
    What's fascinating is that you guys weren't even obnoxious in your
    predictions, yet you're here.
    
    What strong character!  Definetly two men for the ages!!!
    
    - Rope

    ...and that should be a lesson to all those that were standing in line
    trying to chastise me last spring.

     Ah but Mikey, its easy to come in here after a prediction is made for
    a team you don't even follow. I know you are no Billlls fan and
    certainly not a Cowboy fan   so losing and eating crow when you have no
    real interest is quite easy. 
    
    However,
    
    It makes a BIG difference when YOUR team is the one who swallows the
    olive so to speak as they surly did last Spring which resulted in what
    was to be your presence in this topic. You bailed out Mike after a lot
    of "chest puffing" about your SUNS.    :-)  

>    was to be your presence in this topic. You bailed out Mike after a lot
>    of "chest puffing" about your SUNS.    :-)  
    
    hardly.  My Suns entry was just as good, if not, better.

    It was? Then why all the Chastising as you put it.

    The chastising was from jealous NBA fans whose teams didn't make the 2nd
    round of the playoffs.
    
    Po' Mr.H

umm, MikeH there were fans of teams that did make the 2nd round of the
playoffs. But you sooooooo conveniently forgot that. And besides those other
fans never claimed that their team would win the title; certainly not in
November or December.

The Crazy Met

   >> The Chastising was from jealous NBA fans whose teams didn't make the
   >> 2nd round of the playoffs.
    
     	Sombodys got a do it  :-)

    I'll take some of that Norwegian Crow.  I called Jansen a quitter and he
    proved me wrong by coming up huge in a do or die situation.

    Thanks for the update Mike for those who didn't read through the
    spoilers...
    

    your welcome


        Huge sounds to me like he must have got a medal.  Huge in fact sounds
    like he might have may have won...  

    at the rate he was going, 4th place would be huge.

    
    	Have another helping of crow for messing up Walt's evening!
    
    Claybone

    Why would 4th be huge for a guy who's a favorite?
    

>    Why would 4th be huge for a guy who's a favorite?
    
     Jansen wasn't any better than 1 out of 7 people who were thought to have
     a chance at a medal.  I certainly would have considered a 3rd place finish
     to be an extremely good showing by Jansen.

	Walt, try that Vulcan Memory Eraser.  It REALLY works!


	billl

    He finished and didn't fall in the 500 Mike...
    

    I thought I heard that he slipped in it.

    Slipped yes, fell, no...
    

    not quite, with the timeframes they deal with, he might as well have
    fallen.  You better behave or I'm gonna tell ya what actually happened.

    Only if you're talking about a top 3 or 4 finish...
    

    Are you really watching all this stuff Walt?
    
    NAZZ

    Nope, not really... so far I've seen one night of skiing, a little
    hockey and that's been it.  I knew the Jansen story, so I skipped it.
    Might watch Tonya/Nancy and if anyone in my draft scoops a gold medal.
    

The Crazy Met

The Crazy Met

The Crazy Met

    Actually, I wouldn't expect it, Craze.  All season long he's been
    poormouthing his team and saying he didn't have alot of hopes for them
    in the tourney.

    Yes, ack did seem to see something like this coming although not quite
    like losing to a 3rd place BE team in a manner demonstrative of the
    relative strenghts of the two conferences this year.
    
    Faint praise from acc-c is hearty damnation indeed.  I suspect he'll be
    back on the bandwagon given a few more mcdonalds recruits and the two
    star frosh having their way and no "montross problem" (my quotes).
    
    I can't see how this is worse for him than the nc victory over michigan
    was for me and many others.  But he may very well be physically sick
    from this loss and so we all should be prepared to comfort him in his
    pain and suffering.
    
    smap (nee billte)

  >>  But he may very well be physically sick
  >>  from this loss and so we all should be prepared to comfort him in his
  >>  pain and suffering.
    
    
    BALONEY!!! I DIDN"T SEE NO DADGUM SYMPATHY CARDS IN NOVEMBER OR JANUARY
    SO HE'S GOTSTA TAKE IT LIKE A MAIN!!
   
    
    MikeL
    

re: billte's line about sympathy

you have gotta be out of your cotton pickin' mind! what HAVE you
been smoking????? :-)

The Crazy Met

>you have gotta be out of your cotton pickin' mind! what HAVE you
>been smoking????? :-)

Uh, same thing someone else around here has been smoking?

             <<< Note 50.285 by AKOCOA::BREEN "And thy work is crown'd" >>>
                                      -<  N O T >-
    
    The NOT was a hint that I was pulling a chain, ACC's.
    
    But if you do have some home grown drop me a line...

  >               <<< Note 50.284 by PATE::MACNEAL "ruck `n' roll" >>>   
  >  Actually, I wouldn't expect it, Craze.  All season long he's been   
  >  poormouthing his team and saying he didn't have alot of hopes for them   
  >  in the tourney.
    
    C'mon Mac.  TC* thinks that if you fart the wrong way, you oughta enter
    something in here.  But then, with all the P_name bets he loses, this
    is his only revenge.
    
    brews
    
    
  

    fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart
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    fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart
    fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart
    fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart
    fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart
    fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart
    fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart
    fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart
    fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart
    fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart
    fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart
    fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart
    fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart
    fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart
    fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart
    fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart
    fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart
    fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart
    fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart
    fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart
    fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart
    fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart fart
    

    I'm glad you got that out of your systems, JaKe & Kev.

    Musta been them burritos I had fer lunch.
    
    JaKe
    

    Jake, just stay away from the coroner's office.

    
    Didn't mean to start a wind-breaking contest.
    
    brews

In preparation for Crisps return to ::sprots

The Crazy Met

	TC*, Git yer sandbaggin' butt off this sacred ground!


	billl

re: .299

what does one have to do with the other.

The Crazy Met

  >> what does one have to do with the other.

     Isn't it obvious that someone who sandbags to the degree that you do 
     will never have to enter a heartfelt Crow note and therefore has no
     place here in 50? Please let's keep this note for those who cheer their 
     teams with gusto and eat their crow with clenched teeth and saddened
     heart.
    
    

	score for today...

	Tommy    2
	nails    0


	billl

> Isn't it obvious that someone who sandbags to the degree that you do
> will never have to enter a heartfelt Crow note

No!

The Crazy Met

>     place here in 50? Please let's keep this note for those who cheer their 
>     teams with gusto and eat their crow with clenched teeth and saddened
>     heart.

Tommy and MikeH in agreement. Will wonders never cease!

The Crazy Met

|Tommy and MikeH in agreement. Will wonders never cease!

Nexted thang you know, TCM will win a p-name bet...

    Tommy and I agreed all the time when we worked at GenRad.  He just
    became ornery after years of being without my guidance and supervision.

I will be the first to admit that I was woefully incorrect
in my prediction that the Pens would win the Stanley Cup.
My plate of crow is an extra-large portion, and it has no mustard
on the side. However, I am joyfully and gleefuly savoring every
morsel of the dish.

The Crazy Met
    

	Well, the Pens have tee times for tomorrow.  Their hockey season
	was brought to an untimely end by the Caps.  I'll be glad to call
	this for what it is a major CHOKE.  

	With all the offensive weapons the Pens have they were flat out
	hussled and out played by the Caps.  Individually Beaupre and
	Poulin can be thanked on the Caps behalf.
    
    	Poulin owned Lemieux and Beaupre was awsome.
    
    
    	billl

>    	Poulin owned Lemieux and Beaupre was awsome.
        ^^^^^^
I wish the Bruins could get a guy like this!


Seriously, that's the key to shutting down the Pens, when PartTime Mario
(who couldn't carry Gilmour's Jock on a day when his back is good) is
there.  Stay on Mario like white on rice, frustrate the sh*t outta him
and you'll win over the Pens...

Course, I feel sorry for the Pens biggest handicap.....Until they lose
EJ the State of Pennsylvania should issue them a big handicapped sticker
for their team vehicle.....


'SAw

    Mike H. should save a copy of .309 for future reference.  Way to take
    your crow like a man, billllllllllllllll.

inre 50.307
GenRad?
Hey Tommy, are you the guy that got hit by the train?
Suzette's brother?
And I'm guessing Generous Radio shipped Mike's butt to Feenix.

dr.a

    >And I'm guessing Generous Radio shipped Mike's butt to Feenix.
    
    No I left GenRad and moved out here, DEC hired me a month later.  My
    dad still works for GenRad though.

    
      I did six years there. And yes, Suzette is my sister.

    Tommy, did you get hit by a train before I met ya?

    
    not making any execuses, however you have to remeber one thing about
    Leimueux, the guy is hurting bad.  With his back - he is an above
    average player and with being shadowed from Poulin - he is a
    non-factor (as shown).  If it was two years ago when his back was not
    as bad - he probably would of eaten Poulin alive (as witnessed from the
    Boston series).
    
    The only Penguin who did well was Barasso. Without him, they would of 
    been done in 4 games.

yeah that Mario looked like quite the hockey player on Poulin's goal....

hahaha

re: .316

even without Lemiuex the Pens would have no excuse for losing to
the Capitals. Pens didn't have Lemieux most of the season and still
had 20 or so more points than tha Capitals did.

The Crazy Met

    
> even without Lemiuex the Pens would have no excuse for losing to
> the Capitals.
    
    And yet a Rangers loss to the Islanders would have been excused because
    of "The Rivalry"...
    
    glenn
    

heck of a difference, Glenn. Besides which an Islanders victory
would have been an upset but not by the magnitude that the point
differential in during the season would seem to indicate.

The Crazy Met

>                     <<< Note 50.316 by PTOVAX::SCHRAMM >>>
                                         ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Ah, the Pittsburgh fans finally appear....8^)

Welcome aboard.   I'm almost afraid to ask, but are you a friend of
Jake's?


8^)

'Saw

> heck of a difference, Glenn. Besides which an Islanders victory
> would have been an upset but not by the magnitude that the point
> differential in during the season would seem to indicate.
    
    Again, based on voodoo logic, where trivial things like talent and
    execution go out the window for more important things like the number
    of warnings sent down from the league office and the body count of the 
    police detail.  The results really vindicated that theory...
    
    glenn
    

give up a logical point of view? you are kidding, right??

The Crazy Met

    
    Thanks for the welcome! I recently found this conference (did not know
    it existed!).  Jake and I are from the same office (I met him once or
    twice).  Because I am in Digital Consulting, I try to stay out of the
    office as much as I can (especially now 8^( ).  
    
    I guess the Stars will win the cup now.....

    ha ha, most Mets fans said good riddance when Strawman left.
    
    The Crazy Met
    

    Hey TCM, looks like the Cubs took over where the Mets left off.

    if the Cubs could get Bonilla it would be complete

 Another year, another dish of crow complements of the Knicks. With Riley
 as the matri de, Ewing the cook and Anthony as the waiter this stuff goes
 down hard. I'll need atleast a gallon of fizzy pop to wash this burnt ole
 bird down..........

 mike

    As I stated to Heiser last week, here I am.
    
    I'll take the crow burger medium rare w/onions, mayo, and mustard.  A
    little crow on the cob would be nice also with a big slab of butter.
    If there is any macrowoni salad left I'll finish the bowl.  And to wash
    it down I'll take a bitter crow ale.
    
    Those Nuggets really took it to the Sonics.  Good luck.
    
    Ciao
    Steve

>    I'll take the crow burger medium rare w/onions, mayo, and mustard.  A

The USDA says you ain't supposed to eat no medium rare crow. 

TTom

|>    I'll take the crow burger medium rare w/onions, mayo, and mustard.  A
|
|The USDA says you ain't supposed to eat no medium rare crow. 

No, no, that's okay.

The newer, cleaner condition in raising commercial Crow has eliminated
many of the disease problems that used to plague Crow.   It's a similar
situation to that of pork and trichanosys...

But it's NOT a good idea to have Crow Eggs over easy... especially in
New Jersey....


'Saw

    > The USDA says you ain't supposed to eat no medium rare crow.
    
    After that loss, I could probably eat it raw and still not be as sick
    as the Sonics played or made the local folks feel.
    
    Ciao
    Steve
    

Hey Steve,

Be sure to remind Kendall Gill that he went further in the playoffs
lasted year with the Hornets than he did thised year with the Sonics.

TTom

yabbut, TTom should be sure to remind Kendall Gill that he got into the
playoffs with the Sonics this year while the Hornets started playing
golf 2 weeks ago.

The Crazy Met

Yeah,

And remind him that he'll never make as much money with the Sonics as he
coulda with the Hornets.

TTom

    RE>Gill
    
    Boy you guys sound like you don't like Mr & Mrs Gill's little boy
    Kendall.  ;*)
    
    RE>Salary cap
    
    It will be even less if the pick from Charlotte is one of the lottery
    picks.  But that could supply us a big guy in the middle to bang with
    the "Mountains".
    
    Ciao
    Steve

�    RE>Gill
�    
�    Boy you guys sound like you don't like Mr & Mrs Gill's little boy
�    Kendall.  ;*)
    
    At this rate, the Gill/Charlotte fan thing will surpass the
    Bonds/Pittsburgh fan thing very soon.

re Gill vs Bonds

I don't know if'n it's that bad. I personally have mixed emotions about
Gill. Lest there be some misunderstanding, I think that Gill is a player
worth having. Certainly, part of the frustration with him leaving is that
he's exactly the kinda players the Hornets need.

The problem, like a lot of contemporary athletes is in the head. A
perfect example is when he came back to Charlotte he ranted on about how
the media created the issue of him wanting to leave. No, Kendall, it was
you and your manager who said that you weren't going to stay, under any
circumstances. Then, remember selling your house?

But then again, I kinda like Bonds too...

TTom

    Gill has been a head case since '90 when he was the big
    man at Illinois. Nick Anderson was more interested in 
    winning, Gill was interested in himself. That's why they
    were in the Final 4 in 89, and got knocked out in round
    one in '90, after Nick and Kenny left with all the 
    leadership.
    
    Murph
    

    I'm surprised Battle didn't do better in the NBA.

Nick Anderson certainly did the big fade thised year, especially in the
playoffs. I thought with the addition of Penny, the Magic had their 3
players with Shaq and Anderson. 

TTom

    Or Marcus Liberty...
    

Okay, I'm here to eat my big helping (make it a double please, Chef)
of Crow, because I picked Malaysia in that rousing Badminton final...

While I think the Indonesians probably got some homecooking from the
refs, I'll eat my crow like a main.....


Anyone got any Tabasco sauce?


'Saw

    Dan Marino uses it on Buffalo Wings...
    

>
>    Dan Marino uses it on Buffalo Wings...
>    


Actually, I had a hot sauce recommended to me last night that I had
never heard of.  It's called "Shotgun Willie's" and you can get it in
Two Barrel or Three Barrel strength....   I'm going to try and find it,
but if anyone has any experience with it, please let me know.

It was billed as being better than Tabasco....


'Saw

    Shotun Willie's is made in Austin, TX, according to the lable.  I've
    had their salsa and it's good.  The stores up here get too much money
    for it, though.

>    Shotun Willie's is made in Austin, TX, according to the lable.  I've
>    had their salsa and it's good.  The stores up here get too much money
>    for it, though.

Well, I'm going to try and find some and see how good it is.  

I'd imagine we'd pay through the nose for it up here...(which sucks)


'Saw

Never considered bottling that stuff but whatever floats yer boat Saw. 

    Well if Kev is going in here I guess tcm expects an appearance from me.
    
    I predicted rangers comeback but saw canucks as prevailing in five. 
    They are a little ahead of themselves and somewhat dependent on bure
    but overall an excellent club with good overall speed.
    
    since this is the place for it, if ref is going to call tv penalties
    why doesn't he call the same number for each club.  Difference in this
    game did come down to number of powerplays per club.

re: .350

nah, those kind of predictions don't really call for the CROW note.

re: powerplays

Canucks had 38 in the series, Rangers had 28. enuf said. 

The Crazy Met

    Better stop in here first.  Been too busy lately to get in here much,
    so let me get a heaping of browned crow, served a la butty.
    
    boC

    
    Twas pointed out in the Browns note that a note here would be deserved,
    so...
    
    I'll take one helping please, and even buy two for my good buddy
    Bill Belichek.
    
    Browns got crushed; Steelers clearly deserve a shot at SF/Dallas.
    
    JOe

    
    I'm here too but serve mine with lots of Pete's.........
    
    GRRRRRRRR

    Guess I deserve a heaping helping of Crow ala king fer by dribble
    about the 49ers.  I guess they did come down from Olympus afterall.
    
    
    billl

    
      What were "Super" Mario's numbers last night? Before CBS cutaway,
     he looked decidedly mortal.

Mario finished with 16 points and 8 rebounds.

He had no chance against that awesome Kentucky front line ;-)

TTom

    Been too busy to stop in for breakfast so I'll swing into the 
    cafe for lunch.  I'll take mah crow chicken-fried just like them
    good ole boys from em-eye-crooked_letter-crooked_letter-eye-
    crooked_letter-crooked_letter-eye-humpback-humpback-eye eat it.
    
    
    
    billl

     As I write this I'm wearing a deep rose taffeta number. It's ankle
    length with a plunging neckline and bloused sleeves that accent the
    shoulders without giving them too masculine an appearance. I've a corsage
    of violets and baby's breath and though my pumps are pinching just
    a bit I must confess that I do find the whole thing slightly arousing.
    
    Hats off to UCLA. I figured them to do the typical Whack-10 early
    retreat from the tourney but after a serious scare against Missouri,
    they came back and smacked UConn around and earned their way into
    the Final Four.

    re .361:
    
    Tommy, that is a classic!  It's enough to guarentee you NOTY, 
    whether you want it or not.
    
    
    
    billl

>    So much for the PAC being weak.  They'll be champs.

Early entry in to the KOD contest, Mike?

TTom

I'll eat some crow for my support of UConn.

I know I'm a bit late, but I was out sick.  I was pulling for UConn all
the way -- they ran into a good UCLA team, and to be honest, it was 
enjoyable to watch the two of the slug it out, even if UCONN came out on the
low end of the scoreboard.

Gimme some crow -- I think I'll have the naked wings smothered in
Triple X hot sauce....

Can I have a Newcy Broon to go with that too?


'Saw

	RE: The World Series

	To the Tribe, thanks for the ride, it was a great time. Now that
	you have a taste of the big time hope ya come back next year and
	stay for dessert.

	To the Braves, hail to the champs. Well fought, well won.

    
    	Groaner watch day 1, in the appropriate note.

    
    	Yup,
    
    		I remember the Indians beating the Sox. I believe I said
    congradulations to the Indians. Also that the Sox lost to a better
    team.
    	Paul just admit that the Indians.
    
    
    
    	CHOKED................
    
    
    Ron   :^)

	C'mon, Groaner!  Suck it up and take it like a man.


	billl

I'd like either crow or ibis as the bird, with a sliced orange garnish on
the side, with fava beans and a nice, clear broth...

    
    
    
      I'd like mine well done please with a backed potatoe and vegtable of
    the day.
    
    

I'm glad I was out sick yesterday, otherwise I might be in here with ya.

Your notes had me going, and knowing me I might have bought into the fact that
after 0-9-1 in the last ten, they were due.

'Saw

    Glenn will be in ahile.  I got him to give me 1.5 again.
    
    Ain't deja vu wonderful!

>    Glenn will be in ahile.  I got him to give me 1.5 again.
    
    You don't eat crow for that.  It's through the nose...
    
>    Ain't deja vu wonderful!
    
    But hollow consolation for a true Broons fan nonetheless...
    
    
    glenn
    

Oh fellow notes, I have truly let you down.

I have sinned, I have sinned, I have most greviously sinned.

As one of the acting faux mods, I actually attempted to engage George in
a discussion and in the process, I feel that I have offended your
sensibilities.

I have become part of the problem.

In the future, I promise to refrain from these discussions.

TTom

    Just don't let it happen again.
    
    As a reward for your confessions, the Panthers are awarded two victories
    over the Falcons this season.
    
    NNTTM
    
    UMDan

    
    I'll serve up a large scoop of crow for Mike Heiser who ain't man
    enough to admit that the Suns suck and will never win a championship.
    Every year we hear about how great the team is and how they'll win it
    all and when the NBA finals are over, Mike is no where to be found.

    
    
       This place ought to be full today.
    
    3-1 Bahhhhhhhh

    
    OK, I'll take a regular-season size serving (w/ ketchup; hold the
    pickles) for predicting a 3-1 Tribe advantage in their series
    with the Yankees.  The bullpen stunk, and starting pitching wasn't
    much better.
    
    Joe

    
    No crow here... when the Indians are dethroned as AL champs 5 years
    from now, then I'll stop in.  Until then, tough luck.  Big deal, the
    Yankmees won a handful of meaningless games in the middle of the
    season... we all know what will happen in the playoffs, just like last
    year when they masterfully completed a monster choke.
    

    
    Groan-man, thought you had 1/2 days, I was looking for a couple of
    peaceful mommets before you started making a bunch of excuses.....
    
    No excuses from Hal, Admit they just were outplayed in the series.
    
    /westy

    It seems the best team won.
    
    
    CHARLEY

    
>    It seems the best team won.
    
    No.

RE    <<< Note 50.386 by CHEFS::7A1_GRN "Go GB/USA/Ken/NZ/Oz Olympic team" >>>

>    It seems the best team won.
    
  That should be, "It seems the better team won".

  George

Wail, since they won the whole enchilada and beat all the other teams in
the prescribed form and format, I think you could say that they were the
best and in the series they were better.

Now, can we compare 'em to posterity and vote on whether they were good?

    
    	Ok, I'm here but who's serving???  and what???
    
    	The Chief,
    		WAHOO!
    

    >>It seems the best team won.
    
    >No.
    
    Out of the two it certainly seems that way
    
    
    CHARLEY

    
  Out of the group, the best team won.

  Out of the two, the better team won.

  George

>                            -< Good, Better, Best >-

Good has not been established.

  Good point.

  George

Crow helping #1:

        "The Bucks will never get a chance at picking Marbury."

        Obviously, they did, and they knew what to do with him.  Allen and
        a first-rounder next year is a good deal for them.  (As said on
        SportsChannel, the mind reels at the thought of Chris Ford dealing
        with "The Traveling Marburys".)

Crow helping #2:

        Don't remember the exact quote, but it was something like:

        "Not only won't John Wallace fall out of the top 10, he'll go 7th"

        I'm actually glad he didn't go 7th, because then he'd be with the
        Clippers...

Me too! I just wonder how much Jimbo payed Chicago to take Knight. He's
a stiff he'll bounce around for 5 years or so filling that need for a 7 footer
on several different teams during those 5 years. Brad Lohaus without a
brain.......

 mike

Gee, there's Mikey's anti-UCONN bias showing again....8^)

    
    
        Give me a helping of that black Stuffff. Should have known better
    than to hype an Orangeman.
    
    
    
    Chap

>Should have known better
>    than to hype an Orangeman.

No, Chappy, they'll pay for underestimating him.  They'll all pay!

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

I think this is a good deal for Wallace.

I don't know the exact financial difference between the picks but who
wouldn't rather play for the Knicks than the Clippers?

The TNT guy had little or no clue what was going on. On the pick afore
when Portland took the high schooler, Jermaine O'Neal, the crowd cheered.
The TNT guy said he din't know that there were that many fans of him.

Pitino had to tell him that the fans were cheering cause John Wallace was
stilll available.

TTom

>>        "The Bucks will never get a chance at picking Marbury."
>>        Obviously, they did, and they knew what to do with him.  Allen and
>>        a first-rounder next year is a good deal for them.  (As said on
>>        SportsChannel, the mind reels at the thought of Chris Ford dealing
>>        with "The Traveling Marburys".)

	Are you sure about that pick??

	SportsChannel was reporting it as a "future first round pick" ...
	and the joke was that the future would be when either
	(a) the Timberpuppies make the playoffs or
	(b) Kevin McHale retires to the golf course

	Vinny

	btw - I have never seen anyone so happy (Marbury) to be going
	      to Minnesota! He is really excited about playing with
	      his freind Kevin Garnett ... throw in Gugliotta and the
	      future does look bright for the Timberwolves ... they
	      just need to move JR Rider for a little more stable
	      shooting guard ... 

and hope maybe Rider sees the light or gets traded for some other
talent...

The toss in pick is in 99 or 00 depending on something.

TTom

>>    Rider may be a Celtic.

	Is there a reason we started this in the crow note??
	Saving the time of reposting when it doesn't happen?? :-)

	Latest rumor I heard had Rider going to Portland, not sure
	for what though, since now that Minny has their point guard
	they wouldn't need Strickland, and they are already set
	at forward ... 

	Vinny

    I meant to comment that Joe Garbarino's kid is wise indeed for someone
    who's lived 1/7 of a lifetime.
    
    That Minnesota "draft choice" is supposedly Andrew Lang but trading a
    player this close to 7/1 was inconvenient.  They make the switch later.

    The Rider deal was made on draft day, but can't be announced until July
    1st.  He is definitely going to Portland.  Minnesota is getting a
    player and a draft choice in return, and the player is definitely NOT
    Rod Strickland.  That from Jackie McMullin.
    
    NAZZ

    In case you're a shut-in for EoY you may want to know that Rider was
    picked up for marijuana and possession of stolen property(cellular
    phones)

I'm sorry.

I just thought abuot replying to Paul and George.

I'll try to do better in the future.

TTom