Conference hbahba::cam_sports

    Is ther a need to make a topic "The official xxxx topic"?  Are there
    unofficial ones out there?

    Where's the obligatory     "(TM)" note??????
    
    
    
    JaKe
    

    notes>dir/tit="trademark"

    Now how'd I miss that,
    
    As Emily Latella always said,
    
    
    			"Nevermind"
    
    
    JaKe
    

    
    
    TM sips

    Does any one have the last hall of fame voting on line?
    
    REK

	I've been reading and writting in this conference for about 4 years
now , and I have one basic question.

	What is it about winning orginizations that make people hate them
so much.

	You get these I hate the Cowboys, I hate the Celtics, I hate the Lakers,
 I hate the Yankee's. I can see why the Browns hate the Broncos since they can
never seem to beat them when it counts, but what is it about winning teams
that brings out the hate in individuals?  Is it that they cannot stand to see 
these teams be successfull when other (their team) can't?

  Cadzilla  

REK -

I believe it was:

Bernie Kosar
Clay Matthews
Mark Price
Larry Nance
Charles Nagy
Kenny Lofton
Brad Daugherty
Craig Eh...

Oh, you said HALL of Fame, I thougt you said HAL of Fame.

Sorry

JD

I tend to disagree with Tommy a little bit.

Actually, it's not so much winning teams as much as the fact that all the
teams you mention are the subjects of some heated rivalries.

	Cowboys - Giants
	  "	- Redskins
	  "	- Eagles

are all bitter rivalries.

	Yankess - Red Sox

is another.  In fact, most of the folks who HATE the Yankees are Red Sox
fans.  And make no mistake, a friend of my dad's who is a die-hard
Yankee fan will never let him forget one particular game in 1968 when
Yaz struck out to end a game against the Yanks, the Yanks winning.
My dad will say "I hate the Yankees" and they'll both laugh about it.
My dad his his "gloat games" too.


So that's what I think it is.  Same thing with the Celtics too....


'Saw

I tend to disagree with Tommy also.

My Cowboys disliking comes from all the folks I knew that became
Cowboys fans during the glory years, wearing the jackets, etc., 
who never missed a chance to rub in the success.  The incredible
media fawning over "America's Team" was the icing on the cake -
or perhaps the "Dallas Cheerleaders Movie" was the icing on the
cake.  

As for the team, the Cowboys had lots and lots of players that
I downright admired and liked.  Staubach.  Garrison.  Lilly.
Charlie Waters.  

I guess you can't make a comment without some folks calling it
whining.   But that's how some folks are.  

Last I looked, the Cowboys and Giants, for example, had won the
same amount of Super Bowls, and the Redskins had won more.  SO no
need to feel inferior there.

The Boy have lost 7 NFC Champeenship games since the Super Bowl
began, something that is nice to think about.

And how could anyone not like Tom Landry?  An ex-Giant.  Cerebral.
Never did anything outlandish or unclassy.  

Personally, I consider the Eagles or Redskins as more of rivals to
the Giants - given that they are east coast teams, relatively close
to New York, while Dallas is way down there in Texas, not an
Eastern team at all.

Perhaps the sweeping generalizations were in reference to the *one*
Eagles fan who said stuff about the reffing.

JD

    
    Yabbut
    
    isn't it wrong to HATE?
    
    I remain,
    disliking some but hating nun!
    Kev
    

	re-1


    But why do you hate the Cowboys, What did they do to you?

	I can see where a N.Englander would not like wannbe bandwagon jumper
    rub it in your face type of fan, but most of the real COWBOY fans I know
    are not that type of people. Of the three I know in this conference
    J_Henson, John D "Cowboys R" and myself have never been ones to rub it in
    per say. 

	I can remember during the lean years how some noters did seek pleasure
    in the COWBOYS demise and let that pleasure be known. What the hell the 
    season over, we beat the 9er's,my years complete. Now I get back to some
    serious fishing.

   Cadzilla  out cutting holes in the ICE

    
    I don't hate the 49ers or the Redskins, both winners.  Nor did I
    particularly hate the old Raiders, although I did despise Al
    Davis.  But the Dallas Cowboys in the 1970s always did have the most
    self-righteous, holier-than-thou, phony squeaky-clean image in 
    football (their counterparts in baseball at the time were the Los
    Angeles Dodgers-- even I rooted for the Yankees over that bunch).  The
    image was self-proclaimed, not bestowed by others.  It's a matter of
    record-- the Cowboys were the only organization from a *National* 
    Football League of 26 teams to declare themselves "America's Team".  
    If Cowboys fans can't see what it was that caused the day after a 
    Dallas Super Bowl defeat to be declared a national holiday by those 
    not sucked into the propaganda machine, then there's no way we're 
    going to convince you that it was there...
    
    glenn
      
                          

As I've stated, I hate the Cowboys because I'm a Giants fan.  It's
a genetic thing.  If you are a TRUE Giants fan, you hate the Cowboys.

Seriously, it is something that you learn as a fan just as surely as
you learn to read in school.   


'Saw

    If one decided to try to apply for a job at a sports franchise, (not
    a hint, just a what if... I know someone who's thinking about it.)
    how would you find out what's available?  I mean, you can't really say
    "Hi, I'm a sports nut, do you have any jobs I can do?"  There's not
    a lot of engineering that needs to be done...
    

re: .18

Sure, but lots more people hate the Cowboys who are not Giants/Redskins/Eagles
fans. I tend to agree with Glenn on this. Consider that there was never
any mass hatred for the Canadians amongst NHL fans - sure Bruins fans hate them
but there is a reason there. Yankees were always seen as arrogant and Red
Auerbach exuded arrogance. Teams are not disliked by otherwise disinterested
fans becuase they are dominant, there needs to be an element like arrogance
to it. Yankees, Cowboys, Celtics all fit that mold - so did the Pistons for
their brief span at the top.

Teams that dominated and were not universally disliked: Packers, 49'ers,
Orioles of the late 1960's and early 1970's, and there are more.

The Crazy Met

    
    About 'hating the 'Boys,
    
    glenn purty much laid out the reasons in his note. The publicized
    Dallas teams of the 70's with the Doomdsay this, America's team this,
    Harvey Martin this, Gil Brandt/Tom Landry that, TooTall this, and
    Golden Richards that kinda chilled me to them. I was sooo glad when
    Pittsburgh and "dumb" Bradshaw done whupped the 'Boys and "smart"
    Roger.
    Can't say I've changed my attitide about them, either.
    
    However, this was quite a turnaround for me. I was a HUGE Cowboy
    fan in the 60's when Meredith, Lilly, Pugh and company were losing
    mainfully to the Packers. Then the Cowboy overglitz started.
    I started changing my views when said Cowboys underachieved against
    some medoicre Browns teams after their Packer defeats.
    
    Sigh.... then came accursed Doomsday.
    
    JMHO,
    MikeL
    
    

    
    "Goldie" Richards was the Steve Garvey of football.  Saw where he
    landed in jail a couple of weeks back, too, for something pretty
    bizarre.  Anyone remember what it was?  I want to say it was for
    smuggling some kind of prescription drugs, but not entirely sure...
    
    glenn
     

	Well I have to tell ya these notes have open my eyes to a whole new
consideration. I will not try to stick up for what happened twenty years ago.
At that time I lived in or near Dallas and never thought about all the
media hype going on around the country. They had and have been my team since
they came into the league 1960, before that I was a Giant fan. YA Title or Frank
Gifford could do no wrong. 

	I can see how after reading other notes over the last few years and
what has been written today what the HATE is all about. I guess if I had started
this in the summer and asked what it is you SOX fan hate about the Yankees I 
would have gotten a different set of replies.

	With that in mind, let the hate continue but hope that maybe its
in Saw's kinder gentler way!

  Cadzilla

    
>> Frank
>>Gifford could do no wrong.                                                
    
    Ol' Frankie ain't doing to bad these days either, I'd gladly trade
    places withe him fer a night with Kathie Lee.
    
    JaKe
    

>	With that in mind, let the hate continue but hope that maybe its
>in Saw's kinder gentler way!


Well, I'm unusual in one way.  I can hate a team and still respect them.

It's like with rugby.  I HATE Mystic River, mainly because they are so
damn good and we can never quite beat them when it matters.  Because of
that, I really respect them.  (Hey, last year they finished #2 in the
country, so I have to respect them).

Anyway, a team like Boston RFC I just plain hate.  They have no redeeming
social value at all, and their drinkups are not even good.


So, it's kind of similar in football.  There is absolutely nothing good
about the Eagles.  Nothing at all.   The only good thing about the
club in Washington DC is Joe Gibbs, and then there are the Cowboys....


yep, a little kinder, gentler hate goes a long way 8^)


'Saw

    Cadzilla, you would have recieved a similar response if you asked in
    the summer.  In fact, several of the answers to your question
    referenced the Yankee/Sox rivarly.
    
    My father did alot of travelling to Texas during the Cowboys' heyday. 
    He hated the Cowboys because of all the hype he was exposed to down
    there.

    I dislike the attitude fans of "dynasty" teams have.  I didn't
    have a huge problem with Dallas growing up.  I hated the Vikings
    (Lions fan).  My problem now is the way the ownership and JJ� came
    in and giving Landry the boot.  The cockiness, the signing the guy
    in the draft in the "control room", that whole thing.  The Hurricane
    connection with guys in fatigues rubs me the wrong way.
    
    Right now, da Bulls, da Niners, would also be on my "list"...
    

    Da hype definitely adds to it.  I think if the Sharks were any good,
    I'd feel the same way about them.
    
    Kathy Lee is too much of a Mall Hair type for me.  Jenny Jones seems
    better.  Or Carol Alt or Jennifer Montana if we're talking athlete wives...

I thought Carol Alt and Ron Greschner were divorced??

The Crazy Met

    When did the NFL change the rule about teams in the same division
    meeting in the playoffs?  I thought teams in the same division couldn't
    play each other until the championship game, yet KC played SD.  Why
    didn't they play Buffalo and have SD play Houston?

    I think it changed when they went to the three wildcard teams instead
    of of two.
    
    JaKe
    

re: dynasty teams and attitude - almost a Catch-22

I think the attitude of the fans is influenced by the attitude of a team.
I'm also convinced that for a team to win or come close year after year 
requires a somewhat arrogant attitude; just having the better players is
not enough. Of course this can lead non-fans to intensely dislike that
team. Of course there are exceptions to this as noted earlier.

re: NHL

As a Rangers fan I never hated the Candians for always winning. In fact the
only hockey team I can remember truly loathing was the Flyers of the mid 1970's
and they were as obnoxious a bunch as ever existed.

The Crazy Met

>>As a Rangers fan I never hated the Candians for always winning. In fact the
>>only hockey team I can remember truly loathing was the Flyers of the mid 1970's
>>and they were as obnoxious a bunch as ever existed.
    
    So TCM, when ya jumping on the Penguins bandwagon??????
    
    JaKe
    

re: NFL playoff rules.

Yup when they made it 3 wild cards they changed the rule about teams from
the same division not playing each other until the conference championship.

Consider the inherent problem with that rule - this year is a good example

Dallas
Washington
Eagles 
Minnesota
SF
NO

made it into the playoffs.

The 3 teams from the NFC East plus SF made it to the divisional round. 2 
teams from the NFC East had to play each other.

Actually even with 2 wildcard teams sometimes (New England - NY Jets in 1985)
divsional rivals had to play each other.

The Crazy Met

re: .34

JaKe, don't get too carried away. It simply means I don't loathe the Penguins,
but it would be nice to seem them lose often.

The Crazy Met

    If Carol is divorced, that makes it alt the better...

    I have a question:
    
    Was JD drinking before he entered all of these notes, OR, is his
    spellchecker broke??????
    
    JaKe
    

    Both

    
    JaKe -
    
    Connecting from home - different keypad.  Messes me all up.
    
    JD

>
>I think the attitude of the fans is influenced by the attitude of a team.
>I'm also convinced that for a team to win or come close year after year 
>requires a somewhat arrogant attitude; just having the better players is
>not enough. Of course this can lead non-fans to intensely dislike that
>team. Of course there are exceptions to this as noted earlier.

One exception I think would be Lombardi's Packers.....


I also think the market the team plays in has a great bearing.  Green Bay
is a small market, and the team never seemed to get that big head.

I know NY is a large market, Dallas is probably too, cause everything in
Texas is BIG.  8^)



'Saw

Here's a hockey question.  

I have never played the game, so I don't know a lot of the strategy per se.

I hear a lot of talk about centers being very key to a team's defense.
Now, I know the two defensemen are supposed to pick up the other teams
rush, and generally, if possible, take them to the corners.   

If I'm not mistaken, the wingers (if they don't go into the corners to help
out) are waiting on the wing to start a rush.

What's the center doing?  Is he picking up the opposing team's center?
Does he pick up the third guy in the rush (assuming each defenseman has
one)


Just curious....


'Saw

    Doesn't the center hike the ball to the pivot man?
    
    REK

    Need help with this one:  How can do this 'set seen' for a certain date
    thang ?
    
    Thnx in advance,
    
    John "D Cowboys" R.

>    Need help with this one:  How can do this 'set seen' for a certain date
>    thang ?
    
Typing HELP at the notes prompt brings up on-line help, which is quite
good.

However, what you want to do can be done by


	SET SEEN/BEFORE=date


I think that's the syntax....


'Saw

    
    However, if you actually type "date", it really bungs up the system
    so it is recommended you use an actual date AND enter is as follows:
    
    ex.   01-jan-92
    
    snort shclop cheez
    
    Kev
    

    
    Here is another thought as to why people hate teams.  Seeing them over
    and over when you are not a fan.  For example, I live in Colorado
    Springs and every single Bronco game is shown.  In fact, it has
    pre-empted two games this season that were tied at the time late in the
    game.  I really hate that, so it slowly builds against the team, even
    though it is really the TV stations.  Then again, it doesn't hurt that
    I'm an Oakland Raider fan either 8^)
    
    Marc
    

    Thanks 'Saw and Kev.
    
    John "D Cowboys" R.

�    so it is recommended you use an actual date AND enter is as follows:
�    
�    ex.   01-jan-92
    
    Kev is right about needing to enter the actual date, but he is wrong
    about syntax.  Using the above example, correct syntax is:
    
    01-JAN-1992

�    Thanks 'Saw and Kev.
�    
�    John "D Cowboys" R.
    
    Not a word about the mail message I sent you with the proper syntax.  A
    message sent out before these two yahoos entered their replies?  See if
    I help you again.

    re .17
    
    >> But the Dallas Cowboys in the 1970s always did have the most
    >> self-righteous, holier-than-thou, phony squeaky-clean image in
    >> football ...
    >>
    >> The image was self-proclaimed, not bestowed by others.  It's a
    >> matter of record-- the Cowboys were the only organization from a
    >> *National* Football League of 26 teams to declare themselves 
    >> "America's Team".
    
    glenn,
    
    I believe you're a bit off base here.  If anybody gave Dallas the
    "phony squeaky-clean image" it was the media.  I can't recall any
    Cowboy player perputrating this so-called image.  The only player that
    had the "squeaky-clean image" attributed to him was Staubach.  Let's
    face it, he's one of the few in sport who probably deserved the
    reputation.  I can't recall Staubach ever being involved with drugs,
    saying off color remarks, etc.  Staubach was a great roll-model for
    kids.
    
    BTW, you're correct in noting that Dallas was called "America's Team". 
    You're quite *incorrect* however in stating that Dallas "declared
    themselves" "America's Team".  The Cowboy organization had nothing to
    do with the genesis of this title.  It was coined by NFL Properties. 
    NFL Properties started using this phrase because Dallas led the league
    in merchandise sold.  During the slide of the mid-late eighties, Dallas
    dropped only to number 15 in merchandise sold.  Hope this helps!
    
     - Bob Roper

For a moment there I thought Kev had joined the technoweenie crowd :-)

The Crazy Met

    .51
    
    Keith, I apologize for not including you on my thanks.  Since I only
    use A1 I did not realize that you had sent me a message.
    
    Please accept my apology.   
    
    John "D Cowboys" R.

    
 >   Thanks 'Saw and Kev.
    
 >   John "D Cowboys" R.
    
    Anyone else see any irony in the fact that a fan of the Giants and a
    midget helped a Cowboy fan?
    
    Brews, who thinks that if a sales non-technoweeiniew can figger it out
    on his own, anyone should be.Z
    
    

�               <<< Note 5.50 by PATE::MACNEAL "ruck `n' roll" >>>
�
��    so it is recommended you use an actual date AND enter is as follows:
��    
��    ex.   01-jan-92
�    
�    Kev is right about needing to enter the actual date, but he is wrong
�    about syntax.  Using the above example, correct syntax is:
�    
�    01-JAN-1992
�

Actually, the correct syntax is 01-JAN-1993.  Other correct syntaxes:

SET SEEN/BEFORE=01-JAN-1992 to read really old notes from lasted year
SET SEEN/BEFORE=01-JAN-92 to read some of lEe's original notes from his younger
days.

j.

    
    Yabbut ya gotta understand one mo' thang!
    
    Po po John "D Cowboys" R. is forced to use the slow, commercially
    robust (translation=fat) electrons in All-in-Nothing while most of us
    get to use the fast, lean&mean electrons of Vaxmail so I think Mtm, you
    were being a but insensitive to him, jumping on him so quickly!
    
    Didja know that All-in-Nothing has a thing called "express mail"?  Ya
    won't believe it but I had a guy in Noo Yawk use the "Express Mail"
    option (as opposed to just First_Class) when he wanted to send me
    a rush mailgram.  We were on da phone, he sent it off and it only took
    'bout 13 minutes to reach me @MRO!
    
    Unfortunately, I gotta use both and usually gotta figger out the stuff
    the weenies won't share with me  :*(
    
    I remain,
    a_ojt_weenie?
    Kev
    

    NO problemo, John.  Just bustin' your chops.
    
    j., my syntax was correct.  Blame Kev for the date problem since I used
    his example (I didn't say it was a good one).

    I'm gettin' skeert.  I figgered everyone in here but me is a
    technoweenie.  Now I learn  that people don't know how to do express
    mail or set seens.  Maybe I am a technoweenie after all.
    
    Brews

    Don't worry Brews & Kev.  Youze guys will always be weenies to me.

    
    Whatever, Ropes.  Players like "Hollywood" Henderson were just
    creations of the media.  Nothing at all outlandish about the behavior
    of Clint Murchison and the Big Oil 'Boys upstairs, either.  And that
    North Dallas Forty thing; just a movie.  Not a shred a reality to it
    whatsover!
    
    glenn
    

Anyone can be a technoweenie, but the real challenge is to be
a propeller-head.


And I agree with Mr. Needle regarding the age of Lee's notes.  Why, 
I was reading Centennial the other night, and got to the part where the
earth was heaving up the New Rockies, and sure enough, down below, chasing
the one lone Mastadon was Lee....

Go figure....


'Saw

    That's one, Saw.
    
    Lee

    -1,
    Jeez at lEe's age, he still remembers how to count.
    
    Stupendous!!
    
    MikeL
    

lEe invented the number system.   I mean, he's seen the entire mathematical
history develop, from the early counting systems, to the Aztecs who
invented the concept of Zero, and stuff like that.


lEe, don't feel bad, I still ask my dad to tell me stories about his
days chasing dinosaurs for dinner....8^)


'Saw (who feels VERY old today)

Re the Cowboys.   And the "Dallas Cowboys Cheerleaders Movie" was just
good television, not hype fostered by the Dallas prop-a-gander machine.



JD

PS:  Is it true that Lee was offered early retirement but turned it down
cuz he was contracted to catch that coin Washington threw ;-)

    re .66
    
    Come now JD!  You surely don't believe the Dallas organization fostered
    the "Dallas Cowboys Cheerleaders Movie" do you?  ABC knew how popular
    the team and cheerleaders were and ran with it.  It's a bit naive to
    attribute the movie to the Cowboys organization.
    
    HTH's - Bob

The Cowboy organization was behind the mass marketing hype of the cheerleaders
all the way.   They even issued 'official' denial statements concerning
Bambi Woods.

HTH

JD

    
    > Come now JD!  You surely don't believe the Dallas organization fostered
    > the "Dallas Cowboys Cheerleaders Movie" do you?  ABC knew how popular
    > the team and cheerleaders were and ran with it.  It's a bit naive to
    > attribute the movie to the Cowboys organization.
    
    Wasn't Bucky Dent in that movie?  He fit right into this theme of
    hateable, teenage-heartthrob types.
    
    Obviously the Cowboys had to give their permission to such a movie. 
    And the assertion that the Cowboys had nothing to do with the label of
    "America's Team" is equally absurd.  NFL Properties is nothing more
    than the merchandising arm of the NFL teams.  The teams define their
    logos, symbols, mascots, film contents, etc. and NFL Properties markets
    the stuff.  This isn't some renegade operation out making money off the
    NFL's good name.  It's a wholly-owned subsidiary of the clubs.  They
    weren't selling anything of the Cowboys' without 100% authorization
    from the Cowboys.
    
    glenn
    
                     

Mike and the Mad Dog had some excellent comments yesterday on the 
Cowboys.

Tex Schram was the master marketer of the time.   He was able to get
exposure for his team, even going so far as to convince the league
to play a second game on Thanksgiving every year that the Cowboys
would host.   Prior to that time, the Thanksgiving Day game had
traditionally been Green Bay v. Detroit.

They also mentioned that Dallas is kind of a reginal market, which
made the Cowboys "bigger" than a lot of other teams.

They mentioned that the only team in the 70s that was doing as well
was Pittsburgh, and they seemed to be big ONLY in Pittsburgh.


Personally, what interests me is the fact that Pittsburgh always was
portrayed as these mean, nasty, gritty, millworker type guys, and the
marketing hype about Dallas was that they all were these wicked smart
geniuses who happened to play football.   Perhaps Staubach (Navy)
and Calvin Hill (Yale) had a lot to do with that......


'Saw

    Regarding recent Cowboy discussion:
    
    glenn, your original statement was as follows:
    
        >> But the Dallas Cowboys in the 1970s always did have the most
        >> self-righteous, holier-than-thou, phony squeaky-clean image in
        >> football ...
        >>
        >> The image was self-proclaimed, not bestowed by others.  It's a
        >> matter of record-- the Cowboys were the only organization from a
        >> *National* Football League of 26 teams to declare themselves
        >> "America's Team".
    
    You then in 5.61 followed up with:
    
        >> Whatever, Ropes.  Players like "Hollywood" Henderson were just
        >> creations of the media.  Nothing at all outlandish about the
        >> behavior of Clint Murchison and the Big Oil 'Boys upstairs, either.
        >> And that North Dallas Forty thing; just a movie.  Not a shred a 
        >> reality to it whatsover!
    
    I stated that the media had given the Cowboys the "phony squeaky-clean
    image".  I went on to say that no Cowboy that I could recall perputrated 
    this "clean" image.  Please explain to me what 5.61 has to do with the 
    discussion.  How does Hollywood Henderson help to proclaim this "phony 
    squeaky-clean image"?????
    If anything his actions should have helped destroy the MYTH created by
    the MEDIA!
    
    Again glenn, please try and explain to me how Dallas "had this
    self-proclaimed image, etc.".  I believe that you probably will come to 
    the realization that the media if anyone laid the "squeaky-clean" tag on 
    the Cowboys.  
    
    One last point.  Let's face it, the Cowboys during the 70's were a
    class organization respected by all in football.  I can certainly
    understand why opponents and fans alike disliked all the attention paid
    to them by the media.  It's pretty simple actually - JEALOUSLY!!!
    
    :-),
    
     Bob Roper

re: .71

Unquestionably being good is necessary for a team to be widely disliked.
However it is not a necessary AND SUFFICIENT condition.

Consider that for much of the 1970's the Steelers were more successful than 
the Cowboysbut there was never a wide spread distaste for the Steelers. 
Also in football the Packers of the 1960's dominated, were respected, but 
not widely disliked.

In other sports the Canadians in the NHL dominated in the late 1970's but there
was no wide-spread dislike of them - sure Bruins fans hated them, but they
were and are major rivals.

    Why do some people still refer to the New York (Jersey) Giants as the 
    "football" Giants?  It's been 35 years since the baseball Giants left.
    
    Also, on a totally unrelated note, (and I asked this a few years ago)
    why do hockey players rub the head of the guy who scores?  Be nice...
    :*)
    
    
    Spud

    
    > Again glenn, please try and explain to me how Dallas "had this
    > self-proclaimed image, etc.".  I believe that you probably will come to 
    > the realization that the media if anyone laid the "squeaky-clean" tag on 
    > the Cowboys.  
    
    It's quite simple.  There were two parts to my original statement.  The
    first had to do with the "pretty boy" image of some of the players, like
    Staubach, Goldie Richards, Charlie Waters.  With Staubach it was no
    act; he was genuine.  Basically I was just having a little bit of fun 
    with this, I'm not blaming these players individually, as persons.
    
    The second part had to do with, yes, Dallas' general attitude: we're
    the Dallas Cowboys and this is the way we do things and we're better
    than anyone else.  Yes, Hollywood Henderson was "self-righteous", and 
    fit right in here.  The America's team.  The whole Dallas PR machine.  
    If the media promoted the image then it was Dallas which fueled it. 
    C'mon, this was great stuff, the Texas way, really, and Dallas made a 
    lot of money from the game!
    
    > One last point.  Let's face it, the Cowboys during the 70's were a
    > class organization respected by all in football.  I can certainly
    > understand why opponents and fans alike disliked all the attention paid
    > to them by the media.  It's pretty simple actually - JEALOUSLY!!!
    
    Hardly.  We've been over this already.  I have no great disdain for 
    any other successful "class" organization.  I'm from Pittsburgh and my
    favorite teams in the 1960s and 1970s were the Colts (Johnny U da main!) 
    and the Steelers-- the teams that put the three Super Bowl losses on the 
    Cowboy record!  Made it all the sweeter!
    
    To tell you the truth, I really can't work up any of the old hatred 
    whatsover for the current bunch of Cowboys.  I've even gained respect 
    for JJ, believe it or not.  But if we keep this up maybe I can get 
    there by Super Bowl Day!   ;-)
    
    glenn
    

�    Why do some people still refer to the New York (Jersey) Giants as the 
�    "football" Giants?  It's been 35 years since the baseball Giants left.

Because they're such a poor team that if they didn't append "football" to the
title, people might not be able to figure out what they're playing.

Hope this helps.

j.

    
    izzat sorta like the folks who follow car racing and have dawgs?
    
    deening.....
    
    I remain,
    understanding occasionally!
    Kev
    

    That's two, Saw.
    
    Anyone know which noter is celebrating a birthday today?
    
    Lee

Glenn -

Actually JJ and Jones make it the easiest of all time to dislike the
Cowboys.  I really never could dislike Tom Landry (ex-Giant and all
that).  But JJ is scum.   So he's easy to dislike.  

JD

PS:  New York Football Giants.  Its tradition, simple as that.

>    Why do some people still refer to the New York (Jersey) Giants as the 
>    "football" Giants?  It's been 35 years since the baseball Giants left.

Probably tradition, Spud.  It's something that used to be said a lot,
I'd bet, and now is said mainly for emphasis...   

    
>    Also, on a totally unrelated note, (and I asked this a few years ago)
>    why do hockey players rub the head of the guy who scores?  Be nice...
>    :*)
    
It's what they do.  Why do football players spike the ball?   Why
does the 3rd base coach slap five to a guy that's hit a homer....


8^)

On the Cowboys thing, I'll hazard a guess, but of course as a Giant fan
I'm a bit biased.

I think that so many folks hated partly because they were good, yes,
but also because the America's Team was a marketing image thing.

It's kind of like the difference (in my mind) between Ricky Henderson
and Nolan Ryan.  Ryan let his accomplishment speak for itself and I was
moved.  Henderson had to tell the world he was the greatest and it
turned me off.


That's just my opinion, colored, as it were, by the fact that I'm a Giants
fan....8^)


'Saw

    Was it in here that someone talked about meeting Mark Fidrych in
    Northboro?  If so, that person sent me Mark's address.  Could you
    send it to me again?  If there a "Walt's World" movie, the "We're
    not worthy" scene would be dedicated to The Bird instead of Alice
    Cooper.
    
    thanks,
    Walt
    

>    Was it in here that someone talked about meeting Mark Fidrych in
>    Northboro?  If so, that person sent me Mark's address.  Could you
>    send it to me again?  If there a "Walt's World" movie, the "We're
>    not worthy" scene would be dedicated to The Bird instead of Alice
>    Cooper.
    
Too funny.    

    
    lEe,
    
    How's you know that today is the birthday of my loinal fruit?
    Yeah, Greg's 9 today and to commemorate his last single digit
    birthday, his Cub Scout Pack is holding the pinewood derby!
    
    I remain,
    the father of a future loonie AND 1993 Pinewood Derby Champion!
    Dad_for_Kev
    
    

If someone really knows Fydrich, I think he should be a celebrity guest at 
the next Loon Reunion at the OPP...

    re: .84
    
    Yeah we're hoping the same for Lindsey and Melanie.
    
    The Crazy Met
    

    re: .85
    
    Greg hopes differently!
    
    ;^)
    
    I remain,
    like RossP, crazy too!
    Kev
    

Okay, here's a question for you all.


There is a former QB June Jones, who is now a coach (in the Atlanta or
Houston organizations????)


Anyway, there used to be a June Jones who played for Cortland State,
who was a team Central played against when I was in school.

I looked up June Jones in my football encyclopedia, but they listed
him at Portland State, which I think is a misprint.

Does anyone know if it's the same June Jones?  If so, I saw him play
college ball.....


'Saw

    
> I looked up June Jones in my football encyclopedia, but they listed
> him at Portland State, which I think is a misprint.
> 
> Does anyone know if it's the same June Jones?  If so, I saw him play
> college ball.....
    
    Pretty sure the June Jones I remember was a QB at USC in the late
    '60s...
    
    glenn
    

>    Pretty sure the June Jones I remember was a QB at USC in the late
>    '60s...
    
The June Jones that they have listed in the football encyclopedia played
between 78 and 80-something, but I forget where.  The college is listed
as Portland State which makes me think it was a typo.

I wonder if this could be June Jones Jr?

8^)


'Saw    

    re .74
     >>   To tell you the truth, I really can't work up any of the old hatred
     >>   whatsover for the current bunch of Cowboys.  I've even gained
     >>   respect for JJ, believe it or not.  But if we keep this up maybe I 
     >>   can get there by Super Bowl Day!   ;-)
    
    Okay, okay I give!  The Cowboys certainly don't need anyone else hating
    them!  What we need is a "kinder-gentler" approach towards Dallas.
    
    Better stop the mush, or people might spew!
    
    :-)
    
    Bob Roper

the main reason that Dallas went to the Thanksgiving day game was cause Tommy
like the 10 days off after the game. It help get the sick healthy and he used the
time like a mini-camp to get ready for the end of the year grind. 

 Tex Schramm was definately the evil perputrator of the hype...

 just think next week Dallas will be tied with the Donks and the Vikes as
 FOUR TIME LOOSERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 Yes folks Buffalo will do America a favor and slap some sense into the Sowboys

 mike

      Isn't Shula 2-4 in SB's?

He's 2-4 - but he'd be 2-5 if he lost another one ;-.

2-4 with the Dolphins (beat Washington, Beat Minnesota, lost to Dallas,
San Francisco and Washington)

0-1 wif the Colts.

    
> Anyway, there used to be a June Jones who played for Cortland State,
> who was a team Central played against when I was in school.
                                                                         
> I looked up June Jones in my football encyclopedia, but they listed
> him at Portland State, which I think is a misprint.
    
    'Saw, I messed up, the guy I was thinking of from USC was named Jimmy
    Jones, not June Jones.  However I looked in a couple of old Street and
    Smith's and *the* June Jones was listed as from Portland St.  He
    graduated around 1976-77, if that helps.  You're not that old, right?
    
    glenn
    

>    'Saw, I messed up, the guy I was thinking of from USC was named Jimmy
>    Jones, not June Jones.  However I looked in a couple of old Street and
>    Smith's and *the* June Jones was listed as from Portland St.  He
>    graduated around 1976-77, if that helps.  You're not that old, right?
    
I graduated HS in 1976, and graduated from CCSU in May of 1980.

I remember (I think) going to Cortland State in Noo Yawk with the
football team and band, probably in fall of 1978.  I thought their QBs
name was June Jones, but I'm more than likely mistaken....


I'm 34.  


'Saw    

    .
    Yeah, he's old then... (ha ha)
    
    June Jones, Mr. Run and Shoot, went to Portland State, same school as
    Lomax if I remember...
    

>    Yeah, he's old then... (ha ha)
    
Well, at least I'm not at the stage where I need Depends Undergarments
yet!


8^)

    Where ia the Aquaduc Horse racing park located?
    
    REK

>    Where ia the Aquaduc Horse racing park located?
    
Why a Duck?

    You know.. the horse racing place..
    
    REK

Located in Queens

The Crazy Met

    'Saw, middle-aged people like yourself use Appends(tm) for that
    contingency layer of security.

>    'Saw, middle-aged people like yourself use Appends(tm) for that
>    contingency layer of security.


Hey, I resemble that remark!  8^)


I thought middle-aged was over 40?  I don't FEEL middle aged.  I feel
as young and virile as I ever did before.   I have noticed that the
bod take just a bit longer to recover from athletic activity, but
other than that.......


;^)

    I think its located near a place I was lost in New York (and almost
    outta gas, too!)  -- Ozone Park, NY.
    
    Yeech.  Twas a scary day in the city!
    
    Chip_GSH_Bach

    da track.....
    Start at TcM's 2nd home, also known as Shea Stadium and head East then
    Head South on the Van Wyck Expressway, make a right just before
    Kennedy Airport.  This is also known as the "Belt Parkway".  Follow it
    a bit and the race track exit is marked.  It's on you right.
    
    If you hit Staten Island and the Verrazzano Bridge, you've gone too
    far!
    
    hepping this phels!
    
    I remain,
    seein every pothole every inch of da way!
    Kev
    
    
    
    

I think I know why St.Johns are called the Redmen but why is Syracuse
called the Orangemen ?

I'd understand if they were located in Florida with the citrus crops, But thet
are in New York. 


Jeff

>I think I know why St.Johns are called the Redmen but why is Syracuse
>called the Orangemen ?

Maybe they are of Protestant Irish origin.

Maybe Mike Leary could shed some light on this, if is isn't all hung
over this morning.....


'Saw

    Has anyone out there ever heard of a software company called "SAS" ?
    They are located in N. Carolina.  Before going to the library to do
    some research I thought that someone here might have run across them,
    or their products. 
    
    Anxiously awaiting some feedback from you folks.
    
    John "D Cowboys" R.

>    Has anyone out there ever heard of a software company called "SAS" ?
>    They are located in N. Carolina.  Before going to the library to do
>    some research I thought that someone here might have run across them,
>    or their products. 
    
I've heard of them.  Never used any of their stuff however.  I think
they advertise in PC Magazine, if memory serves me correctly.....


'Saw

    
    Sorry this took so long.....    :^)
    
    
    SAS Institute, Inc.
    SAS Campus Drive
    Cary, NC  27513-2414
    919-677-8000  FAX - 919-677-8123   Tech Support - 919-677-8008
    Sales: $240,000,000 (!),  Empl: 2,300  Est: 1976
    
    Privately Held
    
    CEO/Pres - Dr. James H. Goodnight (father of a JAmes Bond Bimbo?)
    Sr. VP - John Hall
    VP Finance - Greyson Quarles
    Nat'l Mkgt/Sales Dir - Barrett  Joyner
    Marketing Comm Mgr - Wink Swain
    Human Resource Dir - David Russo
    
    
    
    Snort Schleop Sloops!
    
    I remain,
    Yer Competitive SPY!
    Kev
    

    I knew that you guys wer fast, but this is incredible.
    
    Danke,
    
    John "D Cowboys" R.

    
    Aw shucks, weren't nuttin.
    
    Of course, If we used the All-In-Nothing 'trons, you wudda been
    twiddling yer thumbs for another 5-6 hours!
    
    I remain,
    Da VaxMail bigot!
    Kev
    

    Top 100 company to work for...
    
    Digital dropped out this year...
    
    If he wanted Aqueduct, why didn't he say so... Aquaduck?
    

                <<< CAM::$1$DUA5:[NOTES$LIBRARY]SPORTS.NOTE;1 >>>
                                  -< SPORTS >-
================================================================================
Note 5.107                    Questions and Answers                   107 of 109
CAMONE::WAY "Cheez-Whiz, Choice of Champions"        10 lines  26-JAN-1993 08:22
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>I think I know why St.Johns are called the Redmen but why is Syracuse
>called the Orangemen ?

>>>Maybe they are of Protestant Irish origin.
>>>
>>>Maybe Mike Leary could shed some light on this, if is isn't all hung
>>>over this morning.....
    
    Nope, I finished my Thunderbird and Maalox Friday night, told OJ that
    if I ever thought he was a_Irishman, I'd take the Pledge. 8^).
    
    Now I cain't hep y'all with the Syracuse Orangemen thang, maybe 
    Mssrs Garbarino or Cotanch can enlighten us.
    
    Now I'm a little fuzzy on the Protestant Irish thang, but the Orange in
    Ireland pertain to the Unionist loyalists in Northern Ireland ( the six
    counties of Ulster) mostly. When someone mentions an Orangemen, we
    think of the descendants of the Scot-Anglo Presbyterian settlers of
    Ulster MOSTLY. The English government looked to these people as
    allies in the Unionist movements of past centuries to keep the Union
    Jack flying over Ulster as well as the rest of Ireland. And mainly
    these now Scot-Irish Presbyterians have been Unionists.
    
    But let us not forget that throughout the history of Republicanism
    in Ireland ( mostly assumed to be Irish Catholic), Protestant Irish
    took the forefont in leadership along side Catholic Irish especially
    in the lower counties of Ireland (now the Republic) and with much
    help from Republican Protestant from Ulster. In the Risings of
    1798, 1848, 1865 and 1916, many Irish Protestants took the lead
    in preaching Irish liberty. Names like Wolfe Tone and Padraic Pearse
    come to mind. 
    
    Now 'Sawmain, as to your humorous slight towards my alleged state of
    sobriey being of Irish ancestry ( remember I have some Scottish blood),
    beware!  If'n ya really want to understand the meaning of Republicanism
    Unionists, Orangemen ( whether Syracuse or not), fork over some dough
    and buy some reading material. Because, as we all know, being of
    Scottish ancestry, you thusly have short arms and deep pockets, and
    no doubt still have your first Holy Communion money!   8^)
    
    Erin Go Bragh,
    MikeL
    
    


'Saw

My experience with their products is close to a decade old but...

As I recall their strength is packages to crunch large amounts of data, 
outputting dastatistics.  I used their software in grad school on a large
market research project.

HTH

=Bob=

>    Now 'Sawmain, as to your humorous slight towards my alleged state of
>    sobriey being of Irish ancestry ( remember I have some Scottish blood),
>    beware!  If'n ya really want to understand the meaning of Republicanism
>    Unionists, Orangemen ( whether Syracuse or not), fork over some dough
>    and buy some reading material. Because, as we all know, being of
>    Scottish ancestry, you thusly have short arms and deep pockets, and
>    no doubt still have your first Holy Communion money!   8^)
    
Mike,

You've made my morning.  Seriously.  My stomach hurts from laughing
at this so hard.

And I never knew all that stuff about Ireland....




'Saw

>I think I know why St.Johns are called the Redmen but why is Syracuse
>called the Orangemen ?

Now that I've confirmed it with another SU fan, here's your answer:

	SU used to call themselves the Braves (big-time Native American
	population in Upstate NY), and their color was orange.  After
	protests by the Native Americans (there's a reservation not
	far from the campus), they compromised and changed their name
	to the Orangemen (although I think the school uses The Syracuse
	Orange, with the men's pgm calling their teams the Orangemen).

re: .111
 
>  I knew that you guys wer fast,

... and easy

The Crazy Met

    
    Yabbut I got a question or two.
    
    How much work is there in setting up a shadow, read-only conference? 
    Since the network people were kind enough to blow away ~50% of the
    links to CAM3, and I'll bet those people accessing the ::EPP notesfile
    outnumber us, we have to suffer with long response times.  I know it's
    not the folks at CAM3, who are gracious, but I was wondering if, during
    this period of long responses if a shadow conference for the RONS would
    free up somemore links & give faster responses?
    
    Izzat a possibility?
    
    I remain,
    looking ....
    Kev
    

Thought of that, Kev.  It's fairly trivial to do.  I could probably do it to
ALPHAX.  But how many people would really use a read-only copy of SPROTS?

If it's a popular idea, PAN has a mechanism to synch conferences so it's fairly
simple to do.

j.

    
    
    Never know until ya try, I guess.
    
    Not knowing all that much about networks and links and stuff, just have
    a feeling that the fewer # of people trying to get into CAM3 has got to
    improve response time.
    
    I'd betcha that there are more RON's here than active folks.  Move
    them, and maybe things get better.  I'd use the shadow first and if I
    wanted to write, I'd jump into the live one, pump away and then exit.
    
    How do others feel?
    
    I remain,
    sorry about the inuendo, it was inadvertant  ;^)
    Kev
    

>     sorry about the inuendo, it was inadvertant  ;^)
                               ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
yea right!

The Crazy Met

Acces time has been better the past few days. I figure after the next round of
TFSO cuts it'll be really fast..


Metz

    Aptly named The Valentine's Day Massacre - Al Capone would have been
    proud :-)
    
    The Crazy Met
    

Okay, here's a football related question.

I was watching the movie "Unecessary Roughness" the other night, and I 
noticed that the guy (the BIG guy) who played center, was named
something Tuiasosopo.

There have been two guys named Tuiasosopo who have played in the NFL,
Manu, and Navy, but I think this guy's first name was Peter?

Anybody know if he is related to, or is one of those guys?


'Saw

    Would someone who lives in the Boston area be willing to tape the Larry
    Bird special for me Thursday night?  I'll pay for the tape, etc.  I saw
    in the USA Today that there was a ceremony planned for Bird Thursday at
    Boston Garden and that it would be televised locally.
    
    Thanks!
    
    Bob Roper

    Hey Bob,
    
    Why not hop on a plane and fly up here?  Ya cross the border to New
    Cowshire and ya can buy center court seats for ~$350 each!
    
    Such a deal!!!!!
    
    Dave Cowans "Big Red" was interviewed on WVBF/FM by Lorin and Wally and
    Dave said that anyone can buy the pictorial book that they are giving
    out as a collectors item.  He didn't give the price but he did give
    out the4 1-800 number to order it.
    
    	Call 1-800-488-BIRD
    
    (standard disclaimer - This isn't a joke and I don't have any financial
    interest in such venture)
    
    I remain,
    occasionally reporting radion news too!
    Kev
    

Kev -

In Wal-Mart lasted night I saw a Larry Bird pictorial book for $7.95.

JD

You don't really want that show taped. Trust me.

The Crazy Met

    Slasher,
    
    You closet Lorin and Wally fan!  and to think I thought you preferred
    Dale Arnold on double ewe eee eee aye!
    
    I remain,
    wondering where their workout video is?
    Kev
    

    	Never listen to Warin and Lally.  This whole Bird hoopla is
    to much for me.  I prefer the old days when guys retired with less
    fanfare and more dignity.
    
    				/Don

                <<< CAM::$1$DUA5:[NOTES$LIBRARY]SPORTS.NOTE;1 >>>
                                  -< SPORTS >-
================================================================================
Note 5.133                    Questions and Answers                   133 of 133
AXIS::ROBICHAUD "Video Poker - Parimutuel's Panacea"  5 lines   3-FEB-1993 12:33
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>    	Never listen to Warin and Lally.  This whole Bird hoopla is
>>    to much for me.  I prefer the old days when guys *retired with less
>>    fanfare and more dignity.*
    
>>    				/Don
    
    
    Jeez we had a HUGE shindig all planned for you!! And ya kept on
    playin'!!  You must be a new-age kinda guy there Slashmain!
    
    
    8^)
    MikeL
    

Can anybody tell me who did the song

	"Dedicated to the One I Love"


I'm not sure if that's the title, but you all must know the song I mean.


thanks,
'Saw

    
    The Shirrells, circa 1965
    
    hth
    
    Kev
    

>               -< My favorite version,redone by the Mamas&Papas >-


Thanks guys.  I thought that the Mama&Papas might have done it (I think that
is the version I hear most often) but I wasn't sure....


now I can sleep at night....8^)


'Saw
    

    
    The original version is 100% Motown and the M&P has the "jingle"
    background.
    
    So which is it?
    
    deening.....
    
    I remain,
    partial recall,
    Kev
    

>    The original version is 100% Motown and the M&P has the "jingle"
>    background.
>    
>    So which is it?
    
I think it's the M&P version that's rattlin' around in my head.


'SAw    

I always like Jim Nabors version that he deadicated
to Rock Hudson.

JD

    Sorry to interrupt a friday with a work question but I need to
    know -
    
    			CTOS
    
    
    What is it?  Who's is it?  Isn't it an operating system?
    
    need info.
    
    Thanks,
    Kev
    

    You guys have it all wrong.  It was done by R.E.M.
    
    "This one goes out to the one I love..."

    never mind - found it.
    
    CTOS = Unysis ix86 workstation family o/s
    
    I remain,
    hoping you can use it as a bar bet!
    Kev
    

     re. 143:  That's "The One I Love", different song.

    
    
       "The one I Love"???
    
            Didn't Olivia Newton John sing that in "Grease"   :-)
                                                                 
    Chappy

    Q:	Awhile back in a past incarnation of SPORTS I_do believe, 
        someone posted a pointer to sports-related GIF files.  (I
        think they were GIF files, I could be wrong.  Perhaps they
        were some other format.)
    
        So the question is, where are they and how do I find out which
        ones are available?
    
    thanks,
    
    
    - ACC Chris

    	RE: "The One I Love"
    
    	Isn't that the title of Wade Boggs' autobiography?

    re .146
    
    Obviously, you referring to "Hopelessly devoted to you", or am I
    mistaken?  "You're the one that I want" was Travolta/Newton-John
    

    Walt, I know that, but I was trying to get these guys into the '90s.
    
    Chappy, you have a lot of filberts admitting you saw that movie in
    public.
    
    ACChris, I posted the GIF repository but it will cost you a p_n to open
    the vaults.

    Name yer price Heiser, but ja better have a North Carolina image
    available!  
    
    
    - ACC Chris

    
    
          I didn't see that movie in public??? I saw it in the privacy of
    my own home. Seeing Olivia in the black leather at the end of the movie
    was worth sitting thru the music. Don't ya think Mike?
    
    
           " GO GREASE LIGHTNING GOIN TIL THE BREAK OF DAWN GO GREASE
    LIGHTNIN GO GREASE ......
    
    

    Sorry Chris, I don't have any Tar Heel propaganda on my system's disks.  
    �Das Verboten!  Let me know if you're still interested.
    
    Chappy, I haven't seen it (and even if I did, I wouldn't admit it
    here).  I'm waiting for the version with the Barbi Twins to come out.
    
    Mike

    
>>            <<< Note 5.141 by CUPMK::DEVLIN "Hitting the Links!" >>>
>>          -< "Gollllleeee, this is dedicated to the Rock I love..." >-

>>I always like Jim Nabors version that he deadicated
>>to Rock Hudson.

>>JD

    I think ya gots the wrong song there JD, didn't Nabors dedicate
    
    "YOU make me feel like a NATURAL woman"
    
    to Rock Hudson????
    
    JaKe
    
    
    

    Doesn't have to be UNC.  I wouldn't mind a nice "Braves" logo, or even
    BoSox.  
    
    In any case, lemme know what cha got.
    
    

    
    Mike,
    
    I have a picture of a chicken bone you could scan in and call it a UNC
    logo.  Interested?
    
    it's free too!
    
    ;^)
    
    Kev
    

    Re:LA Law, the only problem with the stripper with the "suspenders"
    was that she had implants. The scars "down-under" were a dead
    give-away. I recorded the show using a 4-head VCR and in slo-mo
    it showed the scars.....
    
    She was not a babe....
    
    REK

    >Re:LA Law, the only problem with the stripper with the "suspenders"
    >was that she had implants. The scars "down-under" were a dead
    >give-away. I recorded the show using a 4-head VCR and in slo-mo
    >it showed the scars.....
    
    >She was not a babe....
    
    >REK
     

    Nope.... implants are bogus....
    
    REK

>    Nope.... implants are bogus....
>    
>    REK


Folks, I know we discuss a lot of music and other stuff in here, but
why are we discussing implants?   

Seems like our discussions have been getting a bit far afield today.
Let's see if we can't head them back towards the barn a bit, okay?


'Saw

	I called up the Dionne Warwick Psychic Hotline and axed who was 
going to win the 5th race at Belmont that day.  They hung up on me!  Do I 
have grounds for a lawsuit?

				/Don

    I meant I couldn't believe he checked by using slo-mo on his VCR...
    didn't mean to drag down the notesfile...
    

>	I called up the Dionne Warwick Psychic Hotline and axed who was 
>going to win the 5th race at Belmont that day.  They hung up on me!  Do I 
>have grounds for a lawsuit?


No, unfortunately you don't.  See, the psychic knew that if they told you,
and you were wrong, then you could sue, and they knew that if you tried
to sue them after hanging up, that they would say (in the future) that
the line got inadvertantly disconnected.

Gotta watch them psychics, they're pretty sharp.....


'Saw

    Actually, I have been having a blast using the slo-mo on the
    VCR. I taped canlepin bowling every week and enjoy watching how the
    shots are made/missed....
    
    REK

.Don -

Don't you know they hang up on anyone that *phones* the psychic
hotline. By *phoning*, the *know* you ain't got no psychic powers,
you aren't a believer, and are probably some schmoe trying to find
out who's going to win that night's Wheel of Fortune.  The *real*
psychic phone line don't need no PHONES.   Understand.

re 5.165:

ahh, let me try this again...

anyone who spends his spare time taping candlepin bowling then rewatching it
in slow motion has entirly toooooo much free time!


Bill

Bill,

You're be too kind. I would say the anyone who spends his spare time taping 
candlepin bowling then rewatching it needs to Get A Life.

The Crazy Met

    TCM, you read my mind!

    Ok Have your fun.. I'm too busy during the week-end to sit and
    watch it so I tape so I can speed by the commericals.... 
    I only slo-mo when I want to see how a shot was made...
    
    Heiser and TCC thinks alot of like... Now thats scary!!!
    
    REK

RE "I love the Lakers" King writes:

>     Heiser and TCC thinks alot of like... Now thats scary!!!

Don't get too scared,  we seem to agree only on unimportant things.



The Crazy Met

I might have missed the answer to this, but on the Shaq commercial
with the old hoops greats, who's the guy with the beard that you see first?

I've picked out some of the others, but can someone list all of them?


'Saw

>                   -< Russell wif beard, Walton,Jabbar,Wilt >-
                       ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Okay.  I couldn't tell because of da beard.


thanks!


'Saw
    

    I hear the "greats" weren't all that impressed with Shaq.  

>      'Saw, he's had that beard for about 20 years now.    

Yeah, but I don't remember it being that gray.  I haven't seen him in 
quite a while.

I honestly couldn't tell who it was.....


'Saw

    

    
    Yabbut wasn't there a mean looking white guy in that commercial too?
    
    had a 'stache I believe....
    
    I remain,
    onlty here till 5:00PM
    Kev
    

    You mean Walton?
    
    I wonder if they were impressed after Shaq destroyed that basket
    support Sunday.
    

     No he means wilt

    Does anyone know if there is a YMCA somewhere between Hudson and Acton?

    
    	Mac must be lookin' for a Village People concert........
    
    Claybroon

Okay, here's one for you technoweenies:

I have a VAXStation 3100, running Motif V(mumble-mumble {2.0?}).  I run things
like NOTES from a VAX cluster, but setting display back to my WS, thru a utility
called DECRemoteX.

Everything works fine until I enter a note.  I have no problem doing it from the
pull down menu on the window, but when I try to do it using the popup you get
from Mouse Button 2, it not only doesn't work, but blows away the entire NOTES
process.

Anyone know why?  Just curious.


=Bob=

Instead of using that fancy mumble application to run notes on the cluster
try the following. Login to the cluster, type SET DISPLAY/CREATE/NODE=xxx
where xxx is your node name. The type notes/int=dec and see if it all
works...if it works than the problem is in DECRemoteX.


BTW - I get the menu to enter a note using MB3 not MB2. 


Shcloe shelp sleep


Metz

    TECHNO-WEENIE ALERT, TECHNOWEENIES DETECTED, PLEASE ARM DEFENSES!!!!!
    
    
    
    JaKe
    

Re the MB2-MB3 thing.  Under Motif I think that MB2 does the stuff, because
that's the way it is in Xnotes....

hth,
'Saw

Metz

Thanks for the tip, I'll give it a try.

Basically, DECRemoteX does the "SET DISPLAY/CREATE/NODE=xxx" thang for you, but
you're right, by doing what you suggested, I can find out if DECRemoteX is the 
problem.

BTW - 'Saw is right, one of the differences between Motif and DECWindows is the
      reversal of functions between MB2 and MB3...

=Bob=

    
    Am I alone in not being able to get into the Celtics conference (for 2
    days)?
    
    What's the story?  
    
    I remain,
    wondering if it's really down, how much has our RON count increased?
    :^)
    Kev
    

>        <<< Note 5.190 by CSTEAM::FARLEY "Megabucks Winner Wannabee" >>>
>                            -< Celtics Notesfile? >-
>
>    
>    Am I alone in not being able to get into the Celtics conference (for 2
>    days)?
>    
>    What's the story?  
    


They're moving it to Harfaa, where the Celtics are gonna end up playing
for a while......


;^)    

       
    Hi,
    
    I am going to a basketball game this Saturday at the Conte Forum
    (Boston College). Can someone help me get there from Nashua?
    Would it be easier (distance-/parking-/traffic-wise) to park
    the car @ Alewife and take the T into Boston for this event
    than to drive down directly? Either way, can you please tell me
    how to get there?
    
    Thanks for your help!
     -g-

-g-

Conte Forum is actually in Chestnut Hill (Newton/Brookline), outside the city.  
It is on the Green Line (MBTA), whereas Alewife is on the Red Line, so if you
were to take the MBTA it would take a while.  I've never been there for a game, 
(I used to work nearby) but the area generally is not too congested, I'd 
probably drive in.

The other thing I'm not sure of is if it would be better to go through the city 
(Boston), or around it.  I can only give directions going around the city.

By MBTA
-------

Alewife - Red line inbound to Park Street.
Park Street, Green Line Outbound (don't know which line) to Longwood.
At Longwood Station, walk down Hammond Street, away from Rt. 9.  Take the 
first right you can, at the end of this street, you will see the stadium and 
forum in front of you, across the street.

Driving
-------

Rt.3 south to Rt. 128 South
Rt. 128 south to Rt. 9 East.
Left onto Hammond Street (Star Market on the Left, Longwood Cricket Club across
the street to the left.
Follow Hammond past the MBTA stop.
Follow walking directions above.

Good luck.

=Bob=

    -1,
    Good directions fer driving Bobby.
    But for the T (which ah recommends). Go Rt3 South to 128 south.
    Take the Rt 16 exit off 128 South ( East towards Newton). Go to
    the Riverside T station which is about 1/2 mile from 128. This is
    the Green Line.
    Take any Eastbound train and get off at the BC stop.
    
    PS. I'll check on the exact exit off 128 in Newton for the Riverside
    Train station.
    
    MikeL
    

Yea, Riverside is the same exit as Rt. 16...

But then again, you're so close at that point, why would you take the MBTA?

    Sorry about that.
    I would take the T, but if you wish to drive, just follow Rt 16 east
    from Newton towards Chestnut Hill Look for Commonwealth Ave or
    Beacon St. Either one will git ya 'round BC. But parking usually sips
    round there.
    
    JMHO
    MikeL
    

Does Riverside go by BC?  The branch of the Green Line that
goes up Commonwealth ends at BC - it never gets to Rt. 128.

There is another line that stops near Longwood, but I don't 
think that goes to Riverside either.

Mike

    
    Bob,MikeL,Mike,
    
    Many thanks for your prompt help!! I much appreciate it!!
    
    :)
    -g-

Riverside is the D line.  The B line goes to BC. But the C and D go real close
to it.  They all go right by Cleveland Circle.  If you get off around Cleveland
Circle you cain get a burger at the Ground Round or Cityside.  Better still
you can get a Godzilla Burger at the Eagle Deli about two blocks down Beacon
away from the Circle.  Then stop at M.A.'s for a quick beer.

Parking is better on the other side of the resevoir (towards CC, away from BC)
and the walk is not too bad.

Murph (feeling like a native!)

Question:

	
	On the way into work this morning I heard a cover of
	the old do-wap song "In The Still Of the Night", which
	I think was originally done by the Five Satins.

	Who does the recent cover?  The guy on the ra-did-dio didn't
	say......


'Saw

>           Boyz II Men


Thanks Tommy.  I thought it might have been them -- the tone was so clear
and clean, but I wasn't sure.

'Saw

                <<< CAM::$1$DUA5:[NOTES$LIBRARY]SPORTS.NOTE;1 >>>
                                  -< SPORTS >-
================================================================================
Note 5.205                    Questions and Answers                   205 of 205
PFSVAX::JACOB "See if We care if ya starve, Jesse!!" 11 lines  19-FEB-1993 16:03
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    I gots a question fer anybuddy who watched L.A.Law lasted night or
    lasted week,
    
    Re.Tommy Mulaney's old man, Am I the only one who thought we may be
    seeing a preview of what Kevin Farley will be when he grows up...er I
    mean grows older??????
    
    (8^)*
    
    Inquiring minds and all that SLOF
    
    JaKe
    

>    I gots a question fer anybuddy who watched L.A.Law lasted night or
>    lasted week,
>    
>    Re.Tommy Mulaney's old man, Am I the only one who thought we may be
>    seeing a preview of what Kevin Farley will be when he grows up...er I
>    mean grows older??????
    


William Hickey, the old guy.  Man, was he a ringer for Mulaney's pop
or what?


Hell, Kev acts like that now sometimes.....8^)


'Saw
    

	Have they completed the move of the CELTICS conference to
HARFAA yet?  I am unable to access that node.  Can someone let me know
what the status of the conference is?



					thanks, Alan

>	Have they completed the move of the CELTICS conference to
>HARFAA yet?  I am unable to access that node.  Can someone let me know
>what the status of the conference is?


They're not moving the conference to Harfaa.  Harfaa is a little sports
inside joke -- although I should try to get our system mangler to get
that as a node name -- it might be kinda fun.

Check the normal node for that conference -- they were doing some work
on the node last I had heard...


Sorry for any confusion......

'Saw

    I gots a question, and I think it should mainly be directed at Jeff
    Needle, but his answer will help others, hopefully
    
    I tried to access the shadow conference on ALPHAX.  Everytime I try to
    get into it, I get a message that says:
    
    "Login information invalid at remote node"
    
    
    Why cain't I get into the conference???
    
    Thanks
    
    JaKe
    

ALPHAX moved MONTHS ago to 56.361.  Use the number if you can't convince your
system manager to update the network database.

j.

    The real reason, of course, is that the conference saw you comin' Jake.
    
    NAZZ

    Okay, folks, I got_a important work question:
    
    It's probably assumed that with all the fancy writing I do in here that
    I'm somehow doing this for a living, but it's not true!  I'm a
    techno-wheenie, supporting graphics. (DECwindows, Motif, et al)
    
    Trouble is, I'm working on a project now that requires some fairly
    significant modifications to documentation created using VAX DOCUMENT. 
    I was hoping somebody out there knows VAX DOCUMENT and could give poor
    ACC Chris a few tips, pointers, etc. in what to do first.  ("Sit down
    and read the documentation" is not the answer I'm looking for here.  I
    need a quick jump start and hopefully will be off to the races ...)
    
    Thanks.  I might even offer_a p-name if the help is reel good.
    
    
    - ACC Chris

    
   >  <<< Note 5.213 by RHETT::KNORR "Dean Smith: 1992-93 CoY" >>>                       
   > -< Anybody know VAX DOCUMENT? >-
    
   > I'm a    techno-wheenie, supporting graphics. (DECwindows, Motif, et
   > al)
    
    
    Finally, I understand why, whenever I'm in a crunch with a big deadline,
    and my ass is on the line to get a proposal out, DECwindows always
    craps out, and there is no support around to help.  It's the Dean
    affect.
    
    brews

�    It's probably assumed that with all the fancy writing I do in here that
�    I'm somehow doing this for a living, 
    
    I don't think so, Chris.

    
>�    It's probably assumed that with all the fancy writing I do in here that
>�    I'm somehow doing this for a living, 
    
 >   I don't think so, Chris.
    
    Mac always did strike me as a good real-life counterpart for Al from 
    Home Improvement...
    
    glenn
    

    Chris, I used to teach VAX Document to end-users here in Phoenix.  Let
    me know what you need.

    Much thanks to all who volunteered their VAX Document services,
    'specially Clark Burrows who took the time to talk to me on the phone
    and give me a jump start.  I got numerous e-mail messages from folks
    offering to help.
    
    I steal might have a question or two down the road, so I'll keep y'all
    in my "little black book".
    
    
    - ACC Chris

>            <<< Note 5.220 by RHETT::KNORR "Clark Burrows > Dean" >>>
>                       -< Clark drives a hard bargain! >-



That, my friends, is priceless.....8^)
    

Quick question:

	Does anyone remember how Jack Kerouac died?  Did he do himself
	in or not.  I've been trying to remember......


'Saw

    
    >	Does anyone remember how Jack Kerouac died?  Did he do himself
    >	in or not.  I've been trying to remember......

    ...always thought he eventually died of alcohol-induced liver failure.
    Could be wrong, though...
    
    glenn
    
    

>
>    ...always thought he eventually died of alcohol-induced liver failure.
>    Could be wrong, though...
>    


Okay, that kind of rings a bell.  I was pretty sure it was not the
"suck on a shotgun" method....


'Saw    
    

    
    	I think it had something to do with a perforated ulcer Saw.
    Speaking of the ole "suck on a shotgun" method, did you happen 
    to catch the mini series on Hemmingway last week?  Ironically
    I've been on this Hemmingway kick myself, read a little over
    have of his books so far. What an absolute fascinating life this
    guy led, from hunting in Africa to marlin fishing off of Cuba to
    the bull fights in Spain. It's hard to believe that at only 60
    years old, he'd want to end his life.
    
    RM
    
    

>    I've been on this Hemmingway kick myself, read a little over
>    have of his books so far. What an absolute fascinating life this
>    guy led, from hunting in Africa to marlin fishing off of Cuba to
>    the bull fights in Spain. It's hard to believe that at only 60
>    years old, he'd want to end his life.
    
I've only read "The Old Man and The Sea", but I did have to read a short
story of his in English in High School.  It was about bullfighting
and was really riveting.

I'm enjoying "On The Road".  It's hard to describe it, but it reminds me
of something else, but I can't quite put my finger on what it reminds me
of.....


Thanks for the info!


'Saw


PS  Kerouac's birthday was last Friday -- he would have been 71 I think....    
    

    Can any of you VMS System Manglers out there tell me how you set up
    "public" directories that are accessible to everyone without
    compromising the security of your system?
    
    I need to make a product available to everyone and would like to set
    something up like:
    
    RHETT::SYS$PUBLIC:[directory]
    
    Muchos gracious,
    
    
    - ACC Chris

>    Can any of you VMS System Manglers out there tell me how you set up
>    "public" directories that are accessible to everyone without
>    compromising the security of your system?
>    
>    I need to make a product available to everyone and would like to set
>    something up like:
>    
>    RHETT::SYS$PUBLIC:[directory]
    
It's been awhile since I've done it, but usually all you have to do
is to make sure the protection on [directory] is world read, and then
the protections on the files in the [directory] are world read also.

There's probably more to it than that, though, and jeff should comment....


'Saw

    ACChris, try this command at the $:
    
    HELP SET PROTECTION

    Aw shadup Mac.  I know about 1Way's simplistic commands.  I just don't
    want the "Net Police" knockin' on *MY* door, dontcha know.
    
    :^|
    
    
    - ACC Chris

>    Aw shadup Mac.  I know about 1Way's simplistic commands.  I just don't



Hey, if that's the way you feel that's the last time I offer to help.

If you make sure that the top directory is world read and your files
are, you should be all right, and the net police shouldn't have a problem
with that.  

In fact, our public directory is RWE all the way across the board......


'Saw

Anyone out there know the first time the phrase

	Ask not for whom the bell tolls, it tolls for thee


was used in literature?

I'm hesitant to say that Hemingway coined the phrase.  I just can't find
a reference.....


'Saw

I believe it was John Dunne

The Crazy Met

    I think it was that great American author, Stephen King
    
    Brews

	How come whenever there's a "natural disaster" type of event our 
yuppie Massachusetts governor holds an impromptu press conference wearing 
denim/corduroy?  Are we to believe that after said press conference he's 
going outside to fire up the snowblower instead of slipping into the back 
of a limousine?

				/Don

>	How come whenever there's a "natural disaster" type of event our 
>yuppie Massachusetts governor holds an impromptu press conference wearing 
>denim/corduroy?  Are we to believe that after said press conference he's 
>going outside to fire up the snowblower instead of slipping into the back 
>of a limousine?

One of the "highlights" [insert sarcastic smiley face here] of the
storm for me was the round the clock weather reporting on all three
major networks in Ct.

WTNH-TV8 out of New Haven opted for the dress down, denim/corduroy look
and they have been panned for it on most local media since.  Jeff Fox,
one of their weather guys didn't even shave.  

I think it was supposed to give that aura of "I just rushed in here to
deal with this emergency", but I think it backfired....


'Saw

    re: back some..
    
    Edgar Allen  Poe
    
    

I thought it was cause Weld was such a fancy dresser in a suit that, morticians
were following him around waiting for him to drop???

mike

Can anyone give me subscription information (price etc) for
The Sporting News?  

Is that one of the best baseball mags around?  This is for a friend.....


Any info, greatly appreciated.....


'Saw

    
> Is that one of the best baseball mags around?  This is for a friend.....
    
    Unless they've greatly improved in the past couple of years, I think
    it's the general consensus that TSN's baseball coverage has passed
    around the bend to the point of no return, as far as timeliness and
    quality of coverage goes.  Because of that, they've shifted their 
    attention to other sports, as well, and are no longer the exclusive 
    Bible of Baseball.
    
    USA Today's Baseball Weekly is pretty decent, I think, with very 
    recent info, all box scores, stats, team-by-team reports, minor-league
    coverage, plus features.  That's a weekly at $1/issue at the newsstand,
    or $0.80/issue through subscription.  Cheaper than TSN, I believe. 
    Baseball America is a bi-weekly at $2-$3/issue, but concentrates more 
    on the minor leagues, colleges, prospects, etc.
    
    glenn
    

    	I still like TSN.  They now have a separate "stat sheet" type
    of publication that subscribers can get, or that's the way it was
    last year.  They also put out a weekly newsletter on every MLB team
    last year that you could subscribe to.  I don't know how good
    it was, but it sounded like a good idea for fans who follow a team
    in another city.
    
    				/Don 

    I have got a vt241 and a scholar modem at home now....
    Does any one have the set-up info? I have tried a couple
    of things like the baud rate at 2400....
    
    REK

    In addition to the Baud Rate, 8 bit, no parity, 1 stop bit, don't know
    about Xon.
    
    Mark.

    ...and toggle from "Data Leads Only" to "Modem Control"

>    ...and toggle from "Data Leads Only" to "Modem Control"


And you might wanna have the modem checked by Field Service.  I've never
had much luck with a modem the first time I've taken it home.  Everyone
has been bad 8^)


'Saw

    Hey 'Saw!!
    Bleary-eyed I is back. Hey, I understand, man. I haven't had much luck
    with a madam either the first time I've taken it home....
    Oh, you said modem. Sorry.
    
    Yawn,
    MikeL
    

>    Bleary-eyed I is back. 

Too much whisky, eh?   8^) 8^) 8^)
    

    	When did RBIs become RBI or the even sillier sounding RsBI?
    Is this some kind of Box Score Political Correctness?
    
    				/Don

    You don't have run batted ins, do you?
    

    	Walt, I realize that RBI is semantically correct, but why the
    change now?  RBIs was fine for a long time.
    
    				/Don

>    	Walt, I realize that RBI is semantically correct, but why the
>    change now?  RBIs was fine for a long time.
    
There are folks out there who delight in changing tradition, or in messing
up the status quo.

The fact that they've always said RBIs for years and years means nothing
to some people.  Strangely enough, I've never seen George Will refer to
it anything but RBIs and he's a columnist who'd be keyed into correct
grammar etc etc etc....


'Saw

    Anyone know the name of some snowmobile companies other than Polaris
    Ski Doo and John Deere?  My roommate thought Ski Doo was the only one.
    
    -Walt
    

Walt,

	I've never heard of John Deere for snowmobiles. Other companies
are Artic Cat and Yamaha.

/Ron

>
>Walt,
>
>	I've never heard of John Deere for snowmobiles. Other companies
>are Artic Cat and Yamaha.

Down here, Artic CAt is a very popular brand, followed by Ski-Doo.



>/Ron

Slash-Ron?  Boy, this is gonna get really confusing now, eh?  We got
Slash-Don and Slash-Ron.   Nexted thing you know we'll have
Slash-Lon, and then we'll be in BIG trouble....


'Saw

Have any of you seen the movie "Radio Flyer"?

If you have how did you interpret the ending?

fwiw, I REALLY liked that film a lot.   The two kids were great, and the
German Shepherd in the film was a magnificent animal......


'Saw

Deere used to make snomobiles back when I was riding, 15 yrs ago. 
They were the slowest machines around, but they could pull you 
car out of a ditch. Others that I can remember (and most of them 
are probably out of business) are Rupp, Skiroule (sp), Moto-ski, 
and one made by a division of AMF whose name I can't recall.

Nicest machine I ever owned was a Mercury 440. Quick. Mercury is 
out of the business also after they decided to concentrate on 
their marine stuff.

You could always distinguish the ski-do apart from the rest 
because their cowl was always up. I think they shipped em that 
way :-)

daryll

    Anyone else having problems with mxrn access the last 2 days?  Cain't
    get access to usenet....
    
    -Walt
    

>    Anyone else having problems with mxrn access the last 2 days?  Cain't
>    get access to usenet....
    
Who's your server?  I'm using nntpd2 and everything seems fine to me....


'Saw    

    I use the same one 'Saw does and it's always available.

    I was using nntpd, not nntpd2.... different groups I guess after
    changing the login.com...
    

    nntpd has been off-line for a few days and is now back only for TCP
    access, may come back DECnet access later tonight. Best place to ask
    these questions is upsar::news-backbone in note 18.
    
    The Crazy Met
    

    Can someone tell me the words to Michigan's fight song?
    
    Thanks,
    Joe

    
    Here goes Joe,
    
    WHINE,whine whine whine whine whine whine
    WHINE,whine whine whine whine whine whine
    WHINE WHINE for Michigan, The WHINE whine of the West
    
    HTH
    MikeL
    

re:.269

which version do you want the real one or the one that JaKe and MikeL
would appreciate.

The Crazy Met

    Is that like Whine whine for ol' Notre Dame
    Our teams are ugly, excuses are lame...?
    

    Tsk Tsk Walt,
    Patent infringement and all that....
    
    8^)
    MikeL
    

    No, my showed SOME originality...
    

    Yeah, mine had more that 4 words that weren't whine.  I had a whole
    line... haha...
    
    what do you want?
    
    Hail Hail to blah Notre Dame,
    Our teams are ugly, excuses are lame?  (hey, blah might be a better
    All our teams just whine all year,      description)
    We had Tripucka, Holtz and Laimbeer...
    
    that's enough for now...

    Well I guess I ain't the poet you are, Walt.
    
    How's this
    
    Hail to the klunkering weirdos
    Fail to the victims vanquished
    Fail fail to Michigan, the damp peons of the West.
    
    Now that we've got our eighth gradeisms outta us both,
    
    8^)
    MikeL
    

    Copy cat...  (haha)
    

    Hail to the victors valiant,
    Hail to the conquering heroes,
    Hail, hail, to Michigan,
    The leaders and best.
    
    Hail to the victors valiant,
    Hail to the conquering heroes,
    Hail, hail, to Michigan,
    The champions of the West.
    
    Sid

    Version I heard (the teenage version :-) goes somthing like this:
    
    
    Hail to the mas****ators
    Hail to the fo**icators
    Hail,hail  Michigan
    The cesspool of Midwest
    
    The Crazy Met
    

    Didn't someone a while back have a fit because people didn't refer to
    the team as their real names... I think this was the Brownspot/Soiler
    discussion.  Did we decide this was ok... I think so...
    
    Just wondering if calling a team the "Thugs" consistently was ok and
    not putting us up for libel and all that bs....
    

>    Didn't someone a while back has a fit because people didn't refer to
>    the team as their real names... I think this was the Brownspot/Soiler
>    discussion.  Did we decide this was ok...

I've heard there's some guy in the American Football conference
who has a hissy if people use nicknames for teams.   He's always
bashing SPORTS, telling them to take it to Sports if they wanna use 
nicknames.   Actually, sounds to me like he's a candidate for one
of Tommy's "I think you have a little too much free time" lines....8^)



I don't think we've ever had a problem wif that in here....

    


'Saw    

    Thanks Sid.
    
    Should've known that would turn into a major fiasco.
    
    
    Joe

    No problem... just wondering if we looking for trouble or not...
    

For that Mick Mike Leary:


Cheer, cheer for Old Notre Dame
Wake up the echoes cheering her name!
Send the volley cheer on high,
Shake down the thunder from the sky.
What though the odds be great or small
Old Notre Dame will win over all
While her loyal sons go marching onward to victory!



And for all good loyal Scotsman:

Hark when the night is falling
Hear! hear the pipes are calling,
Loudly and proudly calling,
Down thro' the glen.
There where the hills are sleeping,
Now feel the blood a-leaping,
High as the spirits of the old Highland men.

   Chorus:
   Towering in gallant fame,
   Scotland my mountain hame,
   High may your proud standards gloriously wave,
   Land of my high endeavour,
   Land of the shining river,
   Land of my heart for ever,
   Scotland the brave.

High in the misty Highlands,
Out by the purple islands,
Brave are the hearts that beat
Beneath Scottish skies.
Wild are the winds to meet you,
Staunch are the friends that greet you,
Kind as the love that shines from fair maiden's eyes.

    (chorus)

Far off in sunlit places,
Sad are the Scottish faces,
Yearning to feel the kiss
Of sweet Scottish rain.
Where tropic skies are beaming,
Love sets the heart a-dreaming,
Longing and dreaming for the homeland again.

     (chorus)

    Well Joe,
    Ya done asked me and I seen my duty and I done it!  Fiasco? Nah,
    just a little juvenile fun at rivals, that's all. After all, what
    is SPORTS or sports for that matter, but taking good natured shots
    at each other.
    
    Now here's the real question... Why did you need the Michigan verse?
    Lose a bet and have to sing it at a reunion?  Can't be for a possible
    Wolverine BBall champeenship could it( ah can see Bo even now breakin'
    some furniture in his house)?
    
    MikeL
    

    MikeL, my wife knows I like their fight song, so I figured I should
    learn the words and really drive her crazy.  :^)
    
    BTW, I meant for there to be a smiley on my last note, but I didn't
    bother cuz I thought it was assumed.  Then again, you know what they
    say about assuming...   :^)
    
    
    Joe

    Looking for some music help:
    
    1) U2 does a version of "Everlasting Love"  Anyone know where I can
    find it?  What CD?  Soundtrack?
    
    2) Phil Collins has a remix version of "Hold On".  Not the single and
    not the version on "Face Value".  Sounds sort of like a lambada mix,
    if you know what I mean.  I've heard it a few times on the radio, but
    is that avaiable on a CD or tape somewhere?
    
    -Walt
    

>    2) Phil Collins has a remix version of "Hold On".  Not the single and
>    not the version on "Face Value".  Sounds sort of like a lambada mix,
>    if you know what I mean.  I've heard it a few times on the radio, but
>    is that avaiable on a CD or tape somewhere?


I sometimes find the best bet is to call the radio station......


'Saw

Does anyone have the words for Muddy Water's "Jealous Hearted Man",
off the Hard Again album?


I know the following:


	Now there ain't but two things, that I understand.
	Said ain't but two things, that I understand.
	One is a lyin' woman, the other's a jealous hearted man.

	Now I'm so jealous, when I get home my woman go to bed.
	She get on yonder roof and say 'I heard what that man' said,
	You know my dog jumped the fence __________________________


	[next verse a total blank]



Any help, greatly appreciated....



'Saw

    Even more bizarre then 'Saw's request. I have this melody running
    through my mind and the only words I can remeber are "forgive and
    forget". Song is from about the doo-wop era and I am pretty sure was
    done by one of the all-girl groups. JaKe came up with a Pat Benatar
    song that had that phrase but I know that wasn't it. Help it is driving
    me crazier than I currently am.
    
    The Crazy Met
    

Geez Craze, at least I gave 'em somethin' to work with....


Here's some lyrics -- I'll buy whoever can come up with the Artist
and Song a beer at the next get togethere.....



		Grabbed my suitcase, hurried down the road
		I got there she was on the coolin' board.
		Grabbed my suitcase, hurried down the road
		Got there she was on the coolin' board!

'Saw

    going by the depth of those thought-provoking lyrics, it must be a
    bluesman. 

>                     -< not exactly thinking man's music >-

If you heard the pain in the recording, you'd never NEED to think about
it....

>    going by the depth of those thought-provoking lyrics, it must be a
>    bluesman. 

Very astute, Mr. Heiser, very astute.....


'Saw

>If you heard the pain in the recording, you'd never NEED to think about
>it....
    
    Don't get me wrong, I like the blues, but it's all emotion (I guess
    that's why they call it the blues).
    
    If I'm not listening to instrumentals or classical, I'm listening to
    "thinking man's" music.

>    Don't get me wrong, I like the blues, but it's all emotion (I guess
>    that's why they call it the blues).
>    
>    If I'm not listening to instrumentals or classical, I'm listening to
>    "thinking man's" music.

Oh, I see.....


'Saw

    I would lump Dream Theatre, Rush, and maybe even Queensryche into
    "thinking man's" music.  

    re: .300
    
    for us unenlightened folks what did Miles Davis say??
    
    The Crazy Met
    

    Well Miles Davis' "music" speaks for itself.  I'd defy him to play
    anything by The Five Russian nationals (Mikhail Glinka, Mili Balakirev,
    Modest Mussorgsky, Alexander Borodin, and Nicolai Rimsky-Korsakov) who
    were the inventors of modal melodies/harmonies and asymmetrical
    rhythms.
    
    Davis struggles with 7/4, I'd like to see him try the 11/4 and 13/4
    compositions done by The Five.
    
    Mike

>      A couple of people have sent me mail asking me what Davis said.
>     I can't remember the exact word for word quote but basically he
>     said; Classical music was created by people who have no rhythm,
>     so they have to sit down and plot and plan every note because they
>     can't improvise and just let the music flow which is the essence of 
>     jazz. For them evrything has to be structured. 


That's pretty interesting, and contrary to what I told Tommy in mail,
I HADN'T heard that before.

I wonder if Miles knew that it was a pretty standard ability for
liturgical musicians in the baroque era to improvise pieces based on
hymns and other liturgical themes..  It's still practiced today also.


But, with that said, I can hear Davis saying that, and it DOES make
me smile.....8^)


And, finally, since this IS the questions/answers note:

	Craze, did you ever find out what that song was???????


'Saw
    

    Nah 'Saw still in the dark.
    
    The Crazy Met
    

>    Well Miles Davis' "music" speaks for itself.  I'd defy him to play
>    anything by The Five Russian nationals (Mikhail Glinka, Mili Balakirev,
>    Modest Mussorgsky, Alexander Borodin, and Nicolai Rimsky-Korsakov) who
>    were the inventors of modal melodies/harmonies and asymmetrical
>    rhythms.
>    
>    Davis struggles with 7/4, I'd like to see him try the 11/4 and 13/4
>    compositions done by The Five.
    

Don't be a musical snob, Mike.   Davis had a lot to say, said it, said
it well, and will always be immortal in the minds of most jazz 
afficionados.

And besides, everyone knows that Bruebeck was the one who pushed the
envelope with odd meters....[many 8^)]


'Saw


PS  Oh yeah, one minor nit.  The Russian Five didn't "invent" modal
    melodies, harmonies, and asymetric rhythms.  They just reached
    back into the tapestry of their culture, and "legitimized" those
    things by putting them on paper.   The music of the steppes existed
    long before the Five came along....  

>    Nah 'Saw still in the dark.
>    
>    The Crazy Met


If you can hum a few bars of it, next time you're out at a Karioke night,
ask the DJ guy.  Most of those guys are pretty sharp with stuff like that....


'Saw    

>PS  Oh yeah, one minor nit.  The Russian Five didn't "invent" modal
>    melodies, harmonies, and asymetric rhythms.  They just reached
>    back into the tapestry of their culture, and "legitimized" those
>    things by putting them on paper.   The music of the steppes existed
>    long before the Five came along....  
    
    True, the theory has always been there.  It was The Five that took it
    from the folk/gypsy music of the day and introduced it into the popular
    music of the day.  
    
    Much of 20th-century western music (including Miles), has been
    influenced by the ground-breaking standards they set in the 19th
    century.

>    True, the theory has always been there.  It was The Five that took it
>    from the folk/gypsy music of the day and introduced it into the popular
>    music of the day.  

Uh, the "popular" music of the day was actually the folk and gypsy
music.

Classical music was for the upper middle class on up -- what I'd call
"society folks" today.  The average joe didn't get to those concerts.


But, I do get the point you're trying to make.

    
>    Much of 20th-century western music (including Miles), has been
>    influenced by the ground-breaking standards they set in the 19th
>    century.

Yeah, I'll give you that.  But those influences are fairly tame compared
to some of the other influences on 20th Century Western music.......


'Saw

>Yeah, I'll give you that.  But those influences are fairly tame compared
>to some of the other influences on 20th Century Western music.......
    
    I don't agree for the reason that I hear many artists of this century
    using modal techniques in all forms of music.  They opened a door that
    many have walked through.  Not many people open those doors.  
    
    I'll agree that there are other things that may be equally as
    important, but I wouldn't call them tame.  I'll leave it at that.

>    I don't agree for the reason that I hear many artists of this century
>    using modal techniques in all forms of music.  They opened a door that
>    many have walked through.  Not many people open those doors.  
    

But it doesn't all follow from those five Russian composers.  Bela
Bartok did similar things that they did, and has influenced a ton
of composers.  Plus, folk music of a lot of different nationalities
contain those various scales and tonalities.   

I'd be more willing to be that today's jazz/blues musicians are just
as influenced by other musicians who can trace their roots back to
native cultural type musics, as they are by the five russian guys
who formed a club to consciously change music as they knew it...


>    I'll agree that there are other things that may be equally as
>    important, but I wouldn't call them tame.  I'll leave it at that.

Good point.


'Saw

I've always considered Kate Bush "thinking" music. 

FWIW...

daryll

>      20th century western music has it's roots much more in Africa than 
>      it does in the Russian steppes or any where else in Europe for that
>      matter. 
    
    In folk music and blues, that's probably correct.  Blues isn't all that
    technical either, theory-wise.  I'm sure the evils of slavery resulted
    in Africa's large contribution to blues and folk music.
    
    >It's that kind of thinking that has people believing that
>      Bill Haley invented rock n' roll when all he did was steal from the
>      black r and b artists of the day and legitimize it by virtue of his
>      skin pigmentation.
    
    Well, way back when you labeled the classical musicians as not having
    "rhythm", I could see this is where this would be heading.  Let's try
    not to make this a racial thing though.  As a musician, I know very well 
    the true roots of rock'n'roll and R&B and it wasn't from Elvis, Bill 
    Haley, or Buddy Holly.  Most people know that they "ripped off" the
    black culture, sometimes even note-for-note.
    
    Mike (who has proven rhythm)

>    not to make this a racial thing though.  As a musician, I know very well 
>    the true roots of rock'n'roll and R&B and it wasn't from Elvis, Bill 
>    Haley, or Buddy Holly.  Most people know that they "ripped off" the
>    black culture, sometimes even note-for-note.
    
Yes, in some instances it's true.  But don't forget that a lot of
rock 'n roll musicians were "inspired" by the music and wrote original
stuff based on the new influence....


There will always be a gray area around that stuff too.  Like did
ZZ Top's La Grange REALLY rip off John Lee Hooker's "Boogie Chillen"
or was it inspired by....

Guess it t'ain't like code where you can kinda prove it one way or another....


8^)


'Saw (who has no rhythm, and cain't jump 8^) 8^) 8^))

    
    Yabbut, speaking of "thinking man's music", whatcha think of
    
    
    
    
    
    
    	Yoko Ono?
    
    
    How much thought ya think it took to compose her stuff?
    
    
    
    I remain,
    curiously thinking it should be "composte"!
    ;^)
    Kev
    

I have a few non-related questions:



	1. On WSBK-TV38, during the hockey intermissions they have
	   Pierson's pointers.  The guy seems to be pretty sharp.
	   Is he a former coach, college coach, or just an idiot savant
	   who knows hockey?


	2. Couldn't find my hockey rule book for the life of me.
	   Offsides ---  if an offensive player is still in the offensive
	   zone, and a defender carries the puck out of the zone, and
	   then curls back in with it, is the offensive player offside?
	   (I don't think so, but I could be wrong).


	3. What are the dimensions at PileItHight(tm) Stadium, where
	   the Rockies are playing?  Have they been extended to account
	   for the thin air, or are we going to have a Home Run Derby
	   there?



thanks,
'Saw

    
    >	3. What are the dimensions at PileItHight(tm) Stadium, where
    >	   the Rockies are playing?  Have they been extended to account
    >	   for the thin air, or are we going to have a Home Run Derby
    >	   there?
    
    In left field I think it's something like 330-335 down the line, and in
    right it's much further, maybe 360-370.  As you might expect with
    converted football fields turned sideways, both Mile High and Joe
    Robbie Stadium are asymmetrical, with outfield fences that generally run
    perpendicular to center instead of curving outwards.  I think
    righthanded hitters definitely will be playing Home Run Derby in
    PileItHigh, if not lefties.  So far that seems to be the case, as
    evidenced by a little dinky guy like Eric Young (with 1 career HR)
    stepping up to the plate and jacking one out to the *power alley* in 
    the first PileItHigh at-bat ever...
    
    glenn
    

>    stepping up to the plate and jacking one out to the *power alley* in 
>    the first PileItHigh at-bat ever...
    
I was afraid of that.....8^)


'Saw    

    After the first series at Mile High, it appears as though home run
    derbies will indeed be the norm: 57 runs and 8 homers in 3 games
    (although both teams committed more than their share of errors).  And I
    don't recall seeing any of the homers going over the right or
    center-field fence.
    
    The exact dimensions are 333 down the left-field line and a whopping
    370 down the right field line.
    
    The Rockies have a terrible bullpen.
    
    
    Joe

    
    
    I'm not 100% sure of this but reading somewhere (I'm only 28 so it
    is not first hand) that Pierson played with the B's in the 50's.  It
    would make sense to have a "homer" doing analysis.
    
    Jerry

    Johnny Peirson did indeed play for the Broons in the 50's.
    He had been the B's color commentator since the mid 70's I believe
    when he first teamed up with Fred Cusick. They replaced the
    "inestimable" Don Earle and a cast of others ( including beauts like
    Pat 'Boxcar" Egan and octagenerian Cooney "Wake me up" Weiland). This
    was TV. IMO, the bested Broon play by play main is Bob Wilson, radio
    guru.
    
    Peirson was full time color man until the late 80's when he retired
    to his furniture bidness and began his "chalkboard" commentary. While
    knowledgable, Peirson never sounded "on top" of things. His limited
    role now, however, brings out his expertise, which is after the fact
    analysis. Sanderson, believe it or not, seems better than Peirson
    "on the fly" so to speak.  Part of that is because po' Fred Cusick
    is showing the wear and tear of his 70+ years, 40 or so in the bidness,
    and is getting more and more inaccurate and Derek looks good in
    comparison. Cusick was quite good and accurate, while with Peirson, in
    his salad days in the 70's and 80's.
    
    JMHO
    MikeL
    

>    "on the fly" so to speak.  Part of that is because po' Fred Cusick
>    is showing the wear and tear of his 70+ years, 40 or so in the bidness,
>    and is getting more and more inaccurate and Derek looks good in
>    comparison. Cusick was quite good and accurate, while with Peirson, in
>    his salad days in the 70's and 80's.
    
Thanks for the info, MikeL.


I'm kind of fond of Fred, perhaps because he and my dad are about the
same age, and I really respect the fact that Fred is still doing a decent
job (compared to some schmoes I've heard).....

I like Derek too.

Pierson comes off pretty smart in his role, I agree.....


'Saw

    I have tickets to a Red Sox game at Fenway in early may (with  a
    customer). I willl be coming up from Rhode Island on I95. Can anyone
    post me directions from there? I was at Fenway once before and my
    best memory of the place is how tough it was to get to.
    
    Dennis Faust
    

>    I have tickets to a Red Sox game at Fenway in early may (with  a
>    customer). I willl be coming up from Rhode Island on I95. Can anyone
>    post me directions from there? I was at Fenway once before and my
>    best memory of the place is how tough it was to get to.
>    
>    Dennis Faust


Well, what I always do it take the T in from Riverside Station.
Riverside Station is the exit just before the Mass Pike off 95.

You can park there (it'll cost you like $2.75 or so).   It'll cost you
$2.00 to ride in on the T to Kenmore Square (two tokens plus .30) and
one token to ride back out.

It will take maybe 30 minutes to get to Kenmore, depending on the 
amount of folks boarding and unloading at the stops.


We don't have mass transit like that here in the Hartford area, so it's
kind of a treat for me to ride the subway....


'Saw
    

| >> We don't have mass transit like that here in the Hartford area, so it's
| >> kind of a treat for me to ride the subway....
|    
|    Wotta hick!    

Hey, I resemble that remark.  8^)


Actually, subways are pretty interesting places, especially the Metro
in Paris.


And years ago, Hartford had the opporunity to put in a good mass transit
system.  They had existing trolley tracks, some of which still went out
to the surrounding towns.   But they ripped them up.   It would have been
neat if they'd actually bit the bullet and put them underground.....


'Saw
    

    What is the bested way to search for a phrase in notes?
    I tried the dir/all/title="string" and I didn't get all
    of them...
    
    REK

>    What is the bested way to search for a phrase in notes?
>    I tried the dir/all/title="string" and I didn't get all
>    of them...
    
Check it out in notes on-line help?

Seriously, if you're looking for a phrase in the body of a note, there
is Search.

If you're looking for a phrase in the title of a topic or reply, 
then do the dir/title="string" *.*   which should give you everything.


hth,
'Saw

    
    Yabbut so I typed dir/title="string" *.*
    
    
    
    Got no such title back as a reply.  So's REK, save yer effort.
    There ain't no such title using the word "string"!
    
    hth
    
    I remain,
    having too much time on my hainds?
    Kev
    

    Hartford don't have a subway???
    
    Hail, even we in Pittsburgh have a subway system, even if it is only
    1-1/2 miles long at the present time.
    
    JaKe
    

>    Hartford don't have a subway???
>    
>    Hail, even we in Pittsburgh have a subway system, even if it is only
>    1-1/2 miles long at the present time.
    
No. 

Cities in Connecticut are quite devoid of rail-based mass transit.  Yes,
they have buses, but I can see where a rail-based mass transit system
would be GREAT.

In the old days they had trollies, and I remember as a kid, there were
still railroad tracks down in the center of Glastonbury.  Now, it might
have been a long ride up into East Hartford and then across the river,
but in the old days, it musta been neat.

They ripped up the tracks when they did redevelopment years ago.

Over in Bloomfield where we used to work, there are still a lot of lines,
and there's a group of folks trying to connect Hartford with the
Airport (in Windsor) via those tracks and some new ones they'd lay.  It'd
be called the Griffin Line (we used to work in Griffin Office Park),
and it would be wicked handy.


It seems that when most cities decided to move their trolley lines underground,
CT just never seemed to follow suit....


'Saw    

    
>>In the old days they had trollies, and I remember as a kid, there were
>>still railroad tracks down in the center of Glastonbury.  Now, it might
    
    We had trollies, too.  Used to cost 10 cents to ride from where ?I
    lived to Forbes Field, a buck to get into the left field bleachers, and
    10 cents back home.  Used to ask my Dad fer 2 buck to go to the game,
    and that included p-nuts and a hot dog.
    
    The trolley tracks were around up until a few years ago, but most only
    were surrounded by crater sized potholes that could eat a Volkswagen in
    a microsecond.  Lost a balljoint in one of those potholes in '83.  SEnt
    the bill to the city fer the repairs, and after mucho haggling, they
    paid all but $25 of the fix.
    
    JaKe
    

re: Mile High Stadium

The dimensions are affecting strategy decisions. In last nights gmae the
Rockies manager, Don Baylor, needed to make a bunch of pitching changes.
Mets have 6 switch hitters in the lineup. Rockies had been pitching lefties
all night so the Mets switch hitters had been batting righty. Normally in
that situation you bring in a righty to turn around the hitter. However since
down the line in left is 333 and the allexy is 366 Baylor brought in lefties
to pitch to Murray and Bonilla.

re: trolley,subway

LA had a great mass transit system in the 1940's - very good trolley
lines and connections. General Motors bought the trolleys and slowly dismantled
the system so people would get used to driving everywhere and buy more
cars.

The Crazy Met

>LA had a great mass transit system in the 1940's - very good trolley
    
    LIB, someone *is* actually older than Lee!

    Dennis Faust- Fenway
    
    Dennis, I'm posting two different ways to get to Fenway from I-95.
    And yes, none are easy, but also are not overly complex. Just gots
    to keep your eyes open.  I wiil post in the order ( 1 and 2) that
    I recommend ( note caveat at the end!)
    
    Option 1.
    
    Take I95 out of RI all the way to the end. You will approach jughandle
    of I-95 (in Dedham Mass) that leads to either a south/north direction.
    Stay in your RIGHT lane and exit right ( sign will say 128South/Rt 93
    North Boston). You will actually now be travelling on Rt 128 south
    
    Take 128 south to its end ( about 3-5 miles from I-95). Stay in your
    LEFT lane and you will be leaving Rt 128 for RT 93 North (towards
    Boston). This road, Rt 93N, is also known as the Southeast Expressway
    so don't be confused if you see this sign. Just be aware that you will
    be traveling towards Boston, whether the signs say RT 93 N or Southeast
    Expressway N.
    
    Take Rt 93N towards Boston for about 4 miles. Look for a sin that says
    "Mass Ave" exit. This will be a LEFT exit off Rt93. You will be just
    south of Boston proper so take this "Mass Ave" Exit. Believe it or not,
    you are close to Fenway.
    
    Follow Mass Ave for about 1 mile. Mass Ave intersects many streets so it
    will be busy. Look for the "Commonwealth Ave" sign and take a LEFT onto
    Commonwealth Ave from Mass Ave. ( Commonwealth Ave is about the last
    street before Mass Ave ends, near Storrow Drive and the Charles River)
    so watch carefully for Commonwealth Ave.
    
    
    Follow Commonwealth Ave for approx 1/2 mile and it leads right into
    Kenmore Square. Fenway Park is right off Kenmore Sqaure on Brookline
    Ave so follow the crowds and look for the rip-off paeking lots!
    
    Good luck!
    
 Option 2.
    
    Follow I-95 as directed. At the end (the jughandle) stay in your LEFt
    lanes and exit NORTH off I-95 (sign says, 128 North, Mass Pike).
    
    Follow Rt 128 NORTH for approx 10 miles and take "MassPike" East
    towards Boston.
     
    Follow the Pike East towards Boston ( another 10 miles) and watch for
    the sign to exit at "Prudential" off the Mass Pike. You can see the
    light stanchions and the left field wall of Fenway from the Pike jest
    before this exit.
    
    Take the Prudential exit (you'll be in a mini tunnel) and you will
    be on Stuart St in Copley Square. Take your FIRST left onto Dartmouth
    St from stuart st.
    
    Follow Dartmouth St for approx 1/4-1/2 mile and take a left from
    Dartmouth St onto Commonwealth Ave ( yes same Commonwealth Ave as in
    option 1). Follow into Kenmore Square and you know the rest.
    
    
    Now I don't know what time of day you are traveling into Boston but
    lemmee explain something. Option 1 is less mileage IMO and I
    recommend that option. However, if you are traveling into Boston
    at rush hour, do not do Option 1 as the Expressway is brutal for
    traffic. In this case, take Option 2.
    
    In any event, either route will get you to Fenway.
    
    MikeL
    
    

�Well, what I always do it take the T in from Riverside Station.
�Riverside Station is the exit just before the Mass Pike off 95.
    
    I95 is also known as 128 on this stretch.
    
�You can park there (it'll cost you like $2.75 or so).   It'll cost you
�$2.00 to ride in on the T to Kenmore Square (two tokens plus .30) and
�one token to ride back out.
    
    If you get off the T one stop earlier at Fenway and get back on at that
    stop, it won't cost you anything to get back to Riverside.

>    If you get off the T one stop earlier at Fenway and get back on at that
>    stop, it won't cost you anything to get back to Riverside.

Yabbut, if you're goin' to the Rat, you GOTS to get off at Kenmore....



Serious question:

	On the new Coca-Cola commercial, is that Boys II Men?

	Sounds like them, but I haven't seen enough of them to
	know.   

	Whoever it is, they are putting out some wicked cool sounds.....


'Saw

�Yabbut, if you're goin' to the Rat, you GOTS to get off at Kenmore....
    
    Only if ya don't want to walk a couple of extra blocks.  They key is
    where you get back ON the train to go to Riverside.  If you get on the
    train at Kenmore Square it will cost you 85�.  If you get on at the
    Fenway stop it won't cost you anything.

>    Only if ya don't want to walk a couple of extra blocks.  They key is
>    where you get back ON the train to go to Riverside.  If you get on the
>    train at Kenmore Square it will cost you 85�.  If you get on at the
>    Fenway stop it won't cost you anything.

When I'm in a mood to drink beer, I don't wanna WALK anywhere.  I wanna
be transported to da bar.

Afterwards, I'm probably too gone to care.

[many 8^)]


'Saw

    
    Yabbut the answer is:
    
    		Thisted afternoon 
    
    The question is:
    
    
    
    
    
    
    	When is the official groundbreaking for the new Boston Gahden?
    
    
    
    There ya have it folks!  The official notice that the Boston
    politicians and the State ones too have been paid off!
    
    I remain,
    yer occasional sprots event publicist!
    Kev
    

    Anybuddy know whqat the problem wif the "Carbuffs" notesfile is???
    
    I tried mailing the mods but got no return as of yet.
    
    JaKe
    

    Okay wizards - I can't remember how to delete a job from a print
    queue - I use delete/entry=job_number and get an error message about
    illegal combination and get a \confirm\ thrown in.  Nothing seems to
    work.   VMS Help is useles..
    
    JD

    delete/entry=job_number queue_name
    
    should do it.  Never had a problem wif the delete/entry command.
    
    Sure you ain't fat fingering it????
    
    JaKe
    

    
    JD,
    
    	Just let it print......then throw it away! :*)
    
    	BTW, what's the purchase date for the ESPP?  Judging from
    	the fiscal year calendar, it appears to be 5-31.
    
    Claybone

>    Okay wizards - I can't remember how to delete a job from a print
>    queue - I use delete/entry=job_number and get an error message about
>    illegal combination and get a \confirm\ thrown in.  Nothing seems to
>    work.   VMS Help is useles..
    
I sended you some mail, eh, you hoser.

If you're having more problems, eh, call me up on the telephone (if the
string reaches that far to vancouver eh?)

Fix it, sit back and have a beer and a donut....


'Saw_Hoser

It's even easier than that. After 5.4n, all you have to do is to 

	$ delete/entry=job_number

You don't even need to name the queue. All job numbers are unique until
you reboot.

TTom

    
>>Fix it, sit back and have a beer and a donut....
    
    Only if it's a pizza or pretzel flavored donut.  Tried beer and jelly
    donuts once and it was truely freakin' gross, same wif glazed donuts.
    
    Schnortt Schitt Schlepps
    
    JaKe
    

    
    Mr. ChainWizardSaw gave me da answer.  Just some system manager
    tricky-ness.
    
    JD

>It's even easier than that. After 5.4n, all you have to do is to 
>
>	$ delete/entry=job_number
>
>You don't even need to name the queue. All job numbers are unique until
>you reboot.


Duh, guys.  Didn't you read that JD was entering 

	delete/entry=job_number

and it wasn't working?


Going back over what he said in his note, what ONE circumstance could
cause that command not to work?  (Hint:  overprotective system manager).


'Saw

>    Only if it's a pizza or pretzel flavored donut.  Tried beer and jelly
>    donuts once and it was truely freakin' gross, same wif glazed donuts.
>    
>    Schnortt Schitt Schlepps
    
Eh, beers and donuts is an aquired taste, eh?

Shows you ain't from the Great White North.....


Coo-roo-coo-coo-coo-coo-coo-coo, Coo-roo-coo-coo-coo-coo-coo-coo!


'Saw    

    

>>Going back over what he said in his note, what ONE circumstance could
>>cause that command not to work?  (Hint:  overprotective system manager).
    
    Yeah, system manglers and software tyeps cain be a real pain in the ass
    at times, ya know?
    
    (8^)*
    
    JaKe
    

This is starting to seem like a conspiracy to me. Saw gets people to
phone into this talk show with problems that he already knows the answer
to so we'uns can fail miserably until Saw saves the day.

It's a hail of a system ;-)

TTom

>This is starting to seem like a conspiracy to me. Saw gets people to
>phone into this talk show with problems that he already knows the answer
>to so we'uns can fail miserably until Saw saves the day.

Nah, JD sent me some mail a little earlier than he put his note in.
I was busy sending my project leader a kinder but gentler message telling
him in rosey terms what I thought of his abilities, his parentage,
and his IQ, so it took me a bit to answer JD's mail.

When I saw the problem, what clued it to me was that the error was spitting
something out about "confirm".   In the past, I had a really anal system
manager who used to like to redefine the delete symbol at the system
level to be delete/confirm

		delete :== delete/confirm.

It's great for helping people to think twice about deleting those
all important files, but it's a pain in the ass for other things on the
system.

So I sent JD back some mail telling him what to look for, and then
came in here and had some fun wif ya......


Learn something new everyday!

'Saw

I've always felt that any system manager who changes the meanings of DCL
verbs by making them into symbols outta be shot or worse have to do all
of their work from captive ALL-IN-1 accounts.

>		delete :== delete/confirm.

I regularly delete all symbols at the top of my login cause I've been
burned before by this type of thing.

TTom

>I've always felt that any system manager who changes the meanings of DCL
>verbs by making them into symbols outta be shot or worse have to do all
>of their work from captive ALL-IN-1 accounts.

Agreed.  

If you're gonna do stuff like that because of certain users, then
make symbols JUST for them.  Don't affect the rest of us, is my idea
of good stuff...


>I regularly delete all symbols at the top of my login cause I've been
>burned before by this type of thing.

Fortunately, our system manager is cool about not screwin' us up....


'Saw

    	RE: 5.344 and deleting a print job with confirm set...
    
    	I used to get the same error. You have to enter:
    
    		DELETE/NOCONFIRM/ENTRY=xxx
    
    	And I'm not even a system mangler.
    
    	scott

>    	RE: 5.344 and deleting a print job with confirm set...
>    
>    	I used to get the same error. You have to enter:
>    
>    		DELETE/NOCONFIRM/ENTRY=xxx
>    
>    	And I'm not even a system mangler.
>    
>    	scott


That would work too.

But I steel stand by my original opinion that a system mangler shouldn't
be diddling with DCL and redefining all sorts of stuff for everyone....


'Saw

�But I steel stand by my original opinion that a system mangler shouldn't
�be diddling with DCL and redefining all sorts of stuff for everyone....

Absolutely 'Saw.  I take the libertarian approach to system management.

				/Don

>Absolutely 'Saw.  I take the libertarian approach to system management.

Here, here.  Way to go, /Don.

I'll tell you, it was probably a young upstart, who is pretty anal-retentive.


I've always had a symbol that I define, list, which gives me a similar
output to what the old RSX  pip/li command used to give.   But I'd never
impose that output style by redefining DIRECTORY system-wide!


Compute free or die!

'Saw

    smart system manglers use a barebones SYLOGIN.COM and put their
    preferences in their own LOGIN.COM
    
    Mike (a smart system mangler)

Even smarter system managers have no idea what a logical is because they work
on UNIX...

Learn the wonders of lpr commands and you'll beg to have a problem so simple
as a misdefined logical.

Metz doing lrp for a distributed printer management application on UNIX.

>Even smarter system managers have no idea what a logical is because they work
>on UNIX...

The SMARTEST system manglers ain't tied to one opsys.  In addition they
know networks.  Not just DECnet, but TCP/IP, and are into Novell.


>Learn the wonders of lpr commands and you'll beg to have a problem so simple
>as a misdefined logical.

Been there, done that....;^)


>Metz doing lrp for a distributed printer management application on UNIX.

I ran across some folks doing a similar thing on OSF/1 using DCE RPC
stuff, when I went to a one day DCE seminar about 18 months ago....

fun is.  8^)

'Saw

    Re: lpr
    
    At least Ultrix includes the printserver client with their OS.

    
    I would have just unplugged the printer.
    
    brews, nontechnoweenie accessing notes from a captive All-In_One
    account

re: .365

And a compiler, and a software development environment, and workstation
software, etc.

The Crazy Met

Another way to get around it is to supply a different fifth letter for the verb

So when 

dele*te :== delete/confirm,

typing 

$ delex/entry='number' avoids the substitution.

		

    ANOTHER way to get around it is to print the right damned file in the
    firsted place!!!!
    
    
    JaKe
    

Hail,

I thought we wuz gonna not use no more paper. 

"Print is dead!". Thus spoketh Harold Ramis. 

TTom

    Anyone know the answers to a couple of Tennis questions?
    
    1.  I thought for sure that Bjorn Borg won an Austrailian Championship.
        However, my Sports Almanac says he won only the French(6 times) and
        Wimbledon (5 times).  Did he indeed not win the Aussie Grand Slam
        Event?
    
    2.  I believe Jimmy Connors played Martina Navratalova in an exhibition
         match last year.  Who won, and what was the score?
    
    Thanks - Bob Roper

    
    Rope,
    
    2. I believe Jimbo won and he didn't score with Martina.
    
    

    
    
          Nope Borg never won the Aussie or the US open, at least as a
    singles player.
    
    
    
    Chappy

    Martina's ex-girlfriend's on Donahue today...

    Re: -1
    
    There's one for Tommy's viewing schedule.
    
    Most people know that they tell people with severe allergies to move to
    Arizona.  What they don't tell you is that, if you never had them in
    your life, you will be sure to get them.  Even if it takes up to 10
    years after your move, you'll get them.
    
    Mike

And his body wasn't wide enough either.....Sorry Walt.

Or was your picture "not to scale"?

'Saw

    It was from a different angle you don't get on TV.  Plus, TV always
    makes people look larger than in real life...
    
    Barkley's haid gets bigger off the court. Besides, it was around the
    same size as the basketball, that's not scale?  And as far as his body
    goes, he's lost 200 pounds since he's been drafted.  Made him a new
    player.  Just has been more gradual the Miller, so you tend not to
    notice.
    

Walt, you slay me......

Gee 'Saw your being real repetitive today.

re: Borg

Borg was as obsessed with winning the US Open as Lendl is with
winning Wimbledon. Of course Borg never did win the US Open
and I doubt Lendl will ever win Wimbledon; then again Agassi
won Wimbledon so I guess it is possible for Lendl to pull off
a miracle.

The Crazy Met

>    Martina's ex-girlfriend's on Donahue today...
    
    Walt, Martina's ex may be on Mrs. Donahue, but I doubt seriously doubt
    she'd be on Donahue.
    
    HTH,
    brews

    good point... what would your neighbor be on?  Brush with greatness?
    Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous?  Anyone else?
    

Does anyone know for sure what went on with Kev and Winnie in the barn
after they cut to commercial last night????

Must have been good if he dragged his wife and new kid down to the train
station to meet her 8 years later....

mike

    That was the best series finale I've ever seen.  It tied up loose ends
    and didn't leave anything unfinished.

I liked the ending, kind of like a "Dragnet" kind of
ending.

It certainly played on ALL the emotions possible.


It's good to see it bow out, though.  Kevin had lost his
youthful look, and the plots were running out of room....


'Saw

    Nothing like killing dear ol' dad off within two years of the show's
    end.  Massive tension-induced coronary, no doubt...
    
    glenn
    

    So tell me,
    Did Notre Dame git the halfback recruit in "Coach"? Missed the
    end of it, only saw Hayden on a newly bought mattress.
    
    MikeL

    Yes, the halfback recruit decided to go to Nortre Dame on "Coach".
    			Fred

re: Coach

"Notre Dame is Notre Dame" - they got the kid.  Lou Holtz was heard 
to say it was the best coached Minnesota State team he had ever seen.

re: Wonder Years

I choose to assume that Winnie and Kevin did the wild thing in that barn.  
Sentimental fool that I am, I was bummed that they didn't get married.

=Bob=

	"The Wonder Years"  -- kinda like home movies ta me. (fun to watch once 
	in a while, but too much is really boring)


	billl

    Is there an 800 number to find out a zipcode for a city?
    

    Call or stop by the local post office or go down to the mailroom. 
    Either of these places should have a zipcode directory.  You might even
    be able to call the local library for the info.

    
    What is the town you are looking for, I have TONS of towns in my
    database to send patches.
    
    Marc
    

    Post office closes at 5 and the mailroom at 3:30... 

    
    	Well, I know it's the Friday of Memorial Day week-end but I'll take
    a shot anyway.
    
    	I just found out my son is playing in an AAU Basketball Tourny this
    week-end in New Britain, Conn. and I'm trying to get directions; (on
    the map it looks like a straight shot down I84) (I'm coming from
    Leom.MA.).
    
    	The next thing would be hotels in the area;nothing fancy, cheap and
    clean is fine maybe a Super 8 or something like that.
    
    	Other niceties: Things to do in the area (playing Sat and Sun.)
    
    	Estimated travel time. From Leominster(or Worcester)
    			       From New Britain to Springfield MA.(Hall of
    								    Fame)
    			       New Britain to Mystic Seaport.
    	

    How do you get there from Clinton?
    
    BTW - is the military on alert or something?  The local F15-E flyers
    have been really active all month.  There's been afterburner trails all 
    over the skies this month.

>    	I just found out my son is playing in an AAU Basketball Tourny this
>    week-end in New Britain, Conn. and I'm trying to get directions; (on
>    the map it looks like a straight shot down I84) (I'm coming from
>    Leom.MA.).

Depends on which part of New Britian you're going to.  There are
two possibilities.....

You can go out I84, and there are several exits which will put you 
into New Britain.  

	a) Take the West Farms Mall exit, get on CT 71 and go straight.
	   That takes you near the Central Ct State University Campus.

	b) Take I91 South, take Exit 22 (the RIGHT HAND exit 22, not the
	   LEFT HAND one).  This puts you on CT 9, which takes you right
	   into downtown.

	c) Go I91 South, take Exit 21, take a right off the ramp,
	   you're now on another part of 372.  This brings you
	   into the part of New Britain near Beehive Field (where the
	   New Britain Red Sox play) and one of the High Schools 
	   (New Britain HS).  There may still be Pulaski HS somewhere
	   but I'm pretty sure they merged NBHS with Pulaski a few
	   years ago.

    
>    	The next thing would be hotels in the area;nothing fancy, cheap and
>    clean is fine maybe a Super 8 or something like that.

	Again, this depends on which section your in.  If you're near
	Beehive Field, you're near the Berlin Tpke (US 5).  There's
	a plethora of motels there, ranging from fleabag to decent.

	There's a couple of hotels downtown (HoJo's etc)


    
>    	Other niceties: Things to do in the area (playing Sat and Sun.)

	West Farms Mall, 
	New Britain Red Sox (have to check the paper to see if they're home)
	Wadsworth Atheneum (museum) in Hartford.

    
>    	Estimated travel time. From Leominster(or Worcester)
>    			       From New Britain to Springfield MA.(Hall of
>    								    Fame)
>    			       New Britain to Mystic Seaport.

	Figure 1:15-1:30 to get from Worcester to Hartford.  Another
	15 minutes to get to Westfarms exit on I84.
	If going down 91 figure 15-20 minutes to get to exit 22 or 21
	another 5 to get to NB itself.

	NB to Springfield figure an hour.  HoF is exit 4 off I91 North.

	NB to Mystic.  Hmmm....   Get on CT9 south, to 95.  Figure
	a good 45 minutes anyway....

    	
Hope this helps.  A lot of it is guesstimates, but it's better than
nothing...

If you're a AAA member, it might not be a bad idea to give them a call....


'Saw

    
    	Nothing like a good test on the day of a long week-end :-)
    
    Thanks a lot. The games are at Central Conn.St. so that looks like it
    shouldn't be to bad a ride (at 6AM Sat).
    
    We knew he was playing in Conn., just didn't know where until last
    night. 
    
    Thanks again.
    Brian.
    
    PS. Mike, Clinton's one of those towns you can't get to from Leominster
        :-) :-)
    

>    PS. Mike, Clinton's one of those towns you can't get to from Leominster
>        :-) :-)

>    Thanks a lot. The games are at Central Conn.St. so that looks like it
>    shouldn't be to bad a ride (at 6AM Sat).
    
Yeah,  your best bet then is the I84 ride.

I'm not 100% sure but I think the West Farms exit is 40 (might be 39).

When you get off the ramp, it comes to a stop light, take a left.  You'll
come to a set of lights on the main drag (New Britain Ave I think).  Take
a right.

Stay on that road, and eventually follow the signs for CT 71.

The college will come up on your left once you're into New Britain.
They may have actually put up signs for it now.  8^)

I think that 71 around the Collegeis called Stanley Street, and you
want a left off of that to get to the atheltic building....


I can't remember any more details at this point......sorry.  8^)


'Saw

    
    	Even more detail! That's great. This is a lot more detail than they
    gave my son..."the games at 8:30AM at Central Conn.St..." I can read a 
    map pretty well so I would have got to NB OK but from there it would
    have been a crap shot. 
    
    	Thanks again and have a good week-end.
    
    	Brian
    

    
    Ou est l'heure?
    
    je Remain,
    Kevin
    

    
    	Hi,
    
    	Thanks again for the directions everything went real well.
    
    His team won their division! (4-0) He had some good games individually
    as well. His coach uses all ten men and uses a full court press
    constantly (score permitting) it seems to work. The second half is when
    they would pull away from most teams.
    
    	(Bragging father alert!!!)
    
    	My son is more defense than offense minded;but usually he'll get
    his points by working hard. In his last game he had:
    8pts, 11rebs,3blks,and 3stls in just a little more than 1/2 game
    playing time. 
    
    	Brian
    
    
    	

Congrats!

Glad the directions worked out.  It's been a while since I've been over
that way and I was kind of winging it...


Sounds like a GREAT weekend......


'Saw

Yea Brian, he can probably run a race faster than you now too!!!


=Bob=

    
    	Hi =Bob=
    
    	Only in a sprint. I can still beat him over a distance.(but I
    better get running again ;-))..
    
    	Brian
    

Quick question:

	There's a song on the Dirty Dancing soundtrack called
	"You Don't Own Me", and it's done by a group called the
	Blow Monkeys.

	First, does anyone know who originally did the song.

	And where have I heard of the Blow Monkeys before????


'Saw

    Leslie Gore mid 60's (65?)
    

    Nope, you can have the 60's...
    
    I believe the Blow Monkey's did a song in the 80's called "Digging
    your scene", but I'm not sure...
    

>    Nope, you can have the 60's...
    
Well, to be perfectly honest, I always liked the 50s and 60s better than
the 70s.

The thing that's kind of weird on the song "You Don't Own Me" is that the
guy is singing the girl's vocal - all the words are "female", and you don't
often hear that....

'Saw

So, any of you folks know how to get to the Worchester Airport?


I'll be going there tomorrow, and other than it being in or around
Worchester, I don't know how to get there.

Much appreciated.

JD

    I don't know how to get to the Worchester Airport.  I'd imagine you
    could take a plane there and let the pilot worry about it.
    
    I know a few ways to get to the Worcester Airport (one is by plane of
    course).  If you're driving in, let me know where you'll be coming from
    and I should be able to help you out.  It's fairly easy -- just follow
    the signs.

>>    I don't know how to get to the Worchester Airport.  I'd imagine you
    could take a plane there and let the pilot worry about it.
    
>>    I know a few ways to get to the Worcester Airport (one is by plane of
    course).  If you're driving in, let me know where you'll be coming from
    and I should be able to help you out.  It's fairly easy -- just follow
    the signs.
    
    
    C'mon Mac, make up yer mind (That is if you have one!)
    
    JD,
    Woostah airport is sort of in the NW corner of Woostah.  Ya gotta
    follow route 9 through woostah and turn onto route 122 north.  I'd
    say it's about 3-4 miles from that intersection and if it helps, it's
    on top of one of the tallest hills in the city and you can see the
    control tower from the intersection.  It's well marked with signs as
    MtM alluded to.
    
    Pray tell, why would you (or anybody) want to go to the Woostah airport
    for?
    
    I remain,
    been there a few times though,
    Kev
    

Thanks Kev -

Well, my wife and I are taking a one-way road trip, driving my
recently retired in-laws Lincoln Town Car to Fort Myers, Florida.

Now, on the return, we are flying into Worcester Airport - cuz some
new outfit flys outta there to/from Florida, and they are mucho
cheapo.

JD

    Watch out for the Virginia and Georgia cops.  A CB and a Escort
    are recommended.
    
    Fireworks can be bought in So. Carolina but stay awway from that
    tourist trap with signed for 300 miles.  Don't remember the name
    but believe me, you'll know which one I mean (Frontier Village?)
    Of course the ailines might frown on you bringing explosives......
    
    :^)
    
    I remain,
    did the drive (both ways) about 7 years ago to West Palm Beach
    Kev
    

JD, 

Is the FLA thing permanent for them, or is it just half-year.  

(i.e. will there still be reason to go to Watertown on occasion?)


'Saw

Sawmain-

They done sold the old homestaid in Watertown, and are gonna live
the Florida life.  Of course, they bought themselves a conversion
van, and, lucky me, will probably visit us for a few weeks every
summer.

JD

�Now, on the return, we are flying into Worcester Airport - cuz some
�new outfit flys outta there to/from Florida, and they are mucho
�cheapo.
    
    So the pilot is getting you to Worcester.
    
    And Kev, it ain't it in the NW corner.  I'm in the NW corner and there
    ain't no airport.  The airport is on the West side.

�    Fireworks can be bought in So. Carolina but stay awway from that
�    tourist trap with signed for 300 miles.  Don't remember the name
�    but believe me, you'll know which one I mean (Frontier Village?)
    
    South of the Border of course.

Oh cool, JD... We call that the In-Law Soak.  They come up and sponge off
you for a couple of weeks.  The wife loves it, and you get to have your
f-i-l telling you how to do things all the time....

Well, at least that's the way my married friends describe it.....


'Saw

    
    Yabbut it AIN't on the 270 degree line, is't above that and in my book,
    the one with words, not pictures-only, in your book which tells me the
    NW corner.
    
    Now lets not mention the little hill on airport road to JD OK?  Let's
    make it a suprise to him and the SO.
    
    ;^)
    
    

�    Yabbut it AIN't on the 270 degree line, is't above that and in my book,
�    the one with words, not pictures-only, in your book which tells me the
�    NW corner.
    
    Yabbut a corner implies 2 boundaries with another locale(s).  The NW
    corner of Worcester is the area between Holden and West Boylston.

    
    Yabbut this ain't a geography discussion!  It's about Geometry!
    
    Member when ya was gonna graph something in the 10th grade?  Ya needed
    a "x" and "y" axis.  Them's the names given to two lines intersecting
    at the middle (center) at 90 degrees to each other.  In the quadrant
    where "x" was a negative vallue and "y" was a positive value, you'd put
    a point corresponding to the coordinate value of the "x" and "y" and in
    this case the point would fall into the quadrant named 2. Quadrant 2
    was usually indicated as having a geometric value fallling between 270
    degrees and 360 (or zero) degrees donchaknow!
    
    Coincidentally, on a 360 degree compass, the sector between 270 degrees
    and 360 (or zero) degrees is called NW since 270 degrees is true [sic]
    West and 360 (or zero) degrees is called true North [sic].  Now, 
    (are you following this?  Am I complicating it for you?), since we have
    already established that Woostah airport is not at 270 degrees from the
    center of Woostah, it is therefore correlated to the fact that it would
    fall within the confines of what we had earlier (remember?) labeled
    quadrant 2 - the NW sector.
    
    Next week, we can talk about trapeziods......
    
    I remain,
    perferring astronomy and heavenly bodies,
    Kev
    
    
    Coincidentally, 
    
    A 

Youze guyz is unbeleivable!  Who give a hoot what corner of Woooster the 
airport is in, the important thing is how to get there.  BTW, my BIL is a pilot, 
and reports that it is a pretty cool place to fly into.

re: the inlaw soak

The best cure is to have kids.  The ILs oggle the kids so much that you can 
actually make a break for it, "I'm going to the store, be back soon".

=Bob=

    
    The problem I have with my fil is his beer drinking.  He's usually
    pretty good at putting them away, but he drinks terrible stuff, even
    /er wouldn't drink it.  When I go to his house, I bring my own, so I
    don't have to drink his.  When he comes to my place he either a.) feels
    guilty about me bringing mine to his place or b.) doesn't want his
    taste buds spoilt by drinking something half decent, so he brings his
    own.  After he leaves, there are usually severla cans of this crap in
    the refrigererator left over until he comes back.  It's pretty
    embarassing to have company over, have them look in thje fridge and see
    those yellow and black beer cans.
    
    brews

                <<< CAM::$1$DUA5:[NOTES$LIBRARY]SPORTS.NOTE;1 >>>
                                  -< SPORTS >-
================================================================================
Note 5.428                    Questions and Answers                   428 of 429
TNPUBS::MCCULLOUGH "Melanie is standing - walking s" 10 lines   9-JUN-1993 13:30
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>Youze guyz is unbeleivable!  Who give a hoot what corner of Woooster the 
>>airport is in, the important thing is how to get there.  
=Bob=
    
    Well, for starters, I'd say that the people who are employed there
    would be pretty concerned if they didn't know where the airport is,
    especially if they are hourly workers.  Cain you imagine their chagrin
    about not getting payed if they didn't show up for work???????
    
    That's a *LOT* of people, I recon, who not only give a hoot but also
    care!
    
    snort!
    
    I remain,
    thinking people who have airplanes parked there give a hoot too!
    Kev
    

    
    THe yellow and black beer are generic.  They just say beer on the them. 
    Although, my fil is partial to a local brew called "A-1."  I don't
    think it's ever been exported out of the boundaries of the sate of AZ. 
    As for myself, I usually try to find Moosehead on sale at Price Club
    for about 8 bucks a 12 pack.  Can't beat that deal.  And I don't do
    light beer.
    
    brews  

Moosehead......SKUNK...

try some Red Hook or sam Smiths or even FullSail....I'm suprised you didn't get
used to good American Beer like Anchor Steam or Sierra when you lived in San
fran...

Yes I am a beer snob,

 Metz

    Question:
    
    Who wrote this?
    ;^)
    Kev
    
    
                           ***  Horace ****
    
        Much to his mum and Dad's dismay
        Horace ate himself one day.  
        He didn't stop to say his grace,
        He just sat down and ate his face.
        "We can't have this!", his Dad declared,
        "If that lad's ate, he should be shared!".
        But even as he spoke they saw
        Horace, eating more and more:
        First his legs and then his thighs,
        His arms, his nose, his hair, his eyes...
        "Stop him someone!" Mother cried
        "Those eyeballs would be better, fried!".
        But all too late, for they were gone,
        And he had started on his dong...
        "Oh! Foolish child!" the Father mourns
        "You could have deep-fried that with prawns,
        Some parsley and some tartar sauce..."
        But Horace was on his second course:
        His liver, his lights and then his lung,
        His ears, his neck, his chin, his tongue;
        "to think I raised him from the cot
        And now he's going to scoff the lot!"
        His mother cried: "What shall we do?
        What's left won't even make a stew..."
        And as she wept, her son was seen
        To eat his head, his heart, his spleen.
        And there he lay; a lad no more,
        Just a stomach on the floor...
        None the less, since it was his
        They ate it-that's what haggis is.
    

Oh fellow Beer SNobs -

If ever in Vancouver area, try Lord Granville Pale Ale.  great stuff.

Vancouver Island Brewery makes good beer also.

Sam Smiths is wonderful, nut brown and I like the Taddy Porter.

Red Hook, Full Sail, Blue Heron, Pyramid Wheaten and Ballard Bitter
were all Seattle Favorites.

Too bad don't have much of that out here.  Sam Adams is way
overrated.

JD

Some of the micro-brews around NEare not bad; but bottled stuff does
not match up with the things .436 mentions

The Crazy Met

    Tommy, I guess JD knows as much about beer as he does most other
    things.

Or more than you know about music, Mike.


Sam Adams is over publicized. It's certainly not close to the best beer in
america but who determines what tastes best? Taste is highly subjective and I
still can't figure out how one advertiser can say their product tastes "better"
than another.

Metz

    Anyone know where they sell Molson Special Dry around Bahston?
    

>Or more than you know about music, Mike.
    
    Metz, I'm up to the challenge if you are.  We'll see who the music
    theory king is in here.

Mike -


Nice try.  I haven't been in the City (Boston) in a while.  I
know the commonwealth brewery and a few more.  I'm glad Tommy
pointed some out, which I'll have to try.  Must admit I'm
not a big fan of Geary's though, TB.

Dare to disprove me on any of the beers I mentions, oh one
who thinks he's right all the time because he post UselessNET's
and knows the theme song for player introductions?

C'mon Tiny Mike - put up or shut up.  

Personally, I'll take Red Hook or Lord Granville over all others
I've tried so far.  Of course, as Mikey Ego would tellya, I'm
wrong about my preference. 

JD

Sure thing Mike..I'll match up Jd's beer selection with your music selections
any day....and the winner is...

JD's beer selections...

I guess that settles that,

  Metz

    
    
    
    
    PENN PILSNER ROOLS!!!
    
    JaKe
    

    
    >>the refrigererator left over until he comes back.  It's pretty
    >>embarassing to have company over, have them look in thje fridge and see
    >>those yellow and black beer cans.
    
    Just take those leftovers and sell them to your local auto body shop. 
    they're great fer removing rust and grease and any other garbage from a
    car.
    
    JaKe
    

    >>Who wrote this?
    >>;^)
    >>Kev
    
    
    >>                       ***  Horace ****
    
    Jeffrey Dahmer Suess ??????
    
    
    Schnorttt Schittt Schleppps
    
    JaKe
    
    

    
    Phew, thanks JaKe, I was gettin a little worried that folks didn't
    wanna play the guessing game (must be my deodorant).
    
    The answer is (hidden behind the form feed)
    
    
    
    the next one too silly!
    
    
    
    
    
    
    	Graham Chapman of Monty Python Fame!
    
    chomp, chomp - want some haggis?
    
    ;^)
    

    JD (speaking of tiny), I'll concede the barley knowledge to ya.

I like Red Hook.  It's a most excellent brew.

I also like Samuel Adams, but have had better beers.  For me, the specialty
beers that Sam Adams comes out with are better than their regular beer,
especially the Oktoberfest beer.

My favorite is Newcy Broon, Newcastle Brown Ale.  I could drink that forever
and not get bored with it.


I had a stout at the Northampton Brewery that was also a fine fine brew.


'Saw

�             -< 'sept JD wants to get OUT of there, not IN!  ;^) >-
    
    Then why did he ask how to get there?

�It's certainly not close to the best beer in
�america but who determines what tastes best? Taste is highly subjective and I
�still can't figure out how one advertiser can say their product tastes "better"
�than another.
    
    It was entered in a nationally recognized competition and won an award.

�             -< 'sept JD wants to get OUT of there, not IN!  ;^) >-
    
>>    Then why did he ask how to get there?
    
    
    Wail, my bestest guess is he had some kind of operating system crash. 
    Ya see JD had a big-endian little-endian clash in his brain-to-fingers
    system.  Ya know, sorts a like the HP workstation family.  He had a
    (gasp!) thought but to type it, he had to go through a bit-swap process
    and in the end, there was a malfunction and although he thought he put
    down what he meant, he became bit bound and this manefested itself
    sorta like dyslexic ya know.
    
    I think his therapy still has a way to go....
    
    I remain,
    turbochannelled!
    Kev
    

    
    What I keep on hand in the fridge vs. what I drink when I am out is a
    different story.  Youu would think that an area that has year 'round
    beer drinking weather would have lots of options, but I think the blue
    collaredness of the area means you see a lot more oly and keystone. 
    Occasionally you see Sam's or Anchor in the stores (I prefer Sierra
    Pale Ale to A.S), but there really is a dearth of local microbrews here. 
    
    brews

Pete Wicked Ale is now available in the NE stores. Sometimes I come
across Anchor Steam as well.

The Crazy Met

>Pete Wicked Ale is now available in the NE stores. Sometimes I come
>across Anchor Steam as well.

We've had it in the little packy near my house, and in the packy my
dad works in for over a year.

I'm keeping my eye out for Pete's Wicked Lager, because I've heard that's
good as well....


'Saw

Hey Brews,

 The stuff I'm naming off is the stuff I keep in the refrig. No stinking generic
beer or Red,White and Blue or Pabst will ever grace my fridge...
  When I go out I get the really good stuff.

 Metz the beer snob...

	If it ain't Fosters in the oil can, why bother?

I had an entire glass of beer at the OPP with youze guys recently...

    
    If that's true Metz, either you don't drink enough beer, or us poor
    sales guys don't get paid enough.  8^)
    
    Fosters?  It's Australian for Bud, mate.
    
    brews

Since beer goes right to my waist and us soccer guys need to be slim to continue
our highly aerobic activity :-) my vote goes for I don't drink enough beer...

Add in the fact that beer really fires up my allergies in the summer..(must be
the spores in it..) and my lawn only takes 30 minutes to cut (can't justify a
beer after pushing the mower for only 30 minutes)...

Plus the wife is preggo and I feel bad about swilling in front of her when she
can't have none..

Metz

Metz stop doing that when I have coffee in my hand.

The Crazy Met

>Add in the fact that beer really fires up my allergies in the summer..(must be
    
    is that a common problem up there with all that rain?

    
    >>Fosters?  It's Australian for Bud, mate.
    
    Nah, Fosters is Aussie fer Kangaroo Pi$$.
    
    
    JaKe
    

�We've had it in the little packy near my house, and in the packy my
�dad works in for over a year.
    
    Have you ever known TCM to be up with current trends?  He thinks Kenny
    Rogers is still mainstream pop and that the Mets are still World
    Champs.

Allergies are only a problem up here in early spring when the goldenrod
sprouts along much of the highway. The rain is actually good for the allergies
because it knocks down the pollen and clears the air...

I was much worse in New England and I'd probably die in L.A. or any other
smoggy area. ...

Metz

    I was just wondering...  I was fine in N.E. but became affected after
    living here for 10 years.  And Phoenix does have a smog problem too,
    which amplifies it.

Okay, I'm throwing this in here on the off-chance that this might coincide
with someone's outside interests.  I've posted it in another conference
as well, but I'm looking for the quickest possibility of an answer.....


	
	Back when I was in college (ok, I graduated in 1980) I used
	to listen to a jazz band called "Manhatten Wildlife Refuge"
	a lot.  They were headed up by a really accomplished trombone
	player (who coincidently hailed from Middletown CT and I 
	know some folks who used to play with him), named Bill Watrous.

	I know he did a lot of studio work in NY, and I know he
	had a problem with nose candy for a while, or at least that was
	the word around....

	He had a trumpet player in his band who was pretty phenomenal
	also, a guy named Danny Stiles.


Has anybody heard anything of either of these guys????


'Saw

    Neither one of them has called me for quite some time, 'Saw.
    
    Lee

Yea Saw seems like I was just reading another conference and somebody mentioned
these guys. 

Jeff

>Yea Saw seems like I was just reading another conference and somebody mentioned
>these guys. 

Any idea which conference?  

DUH.


Serves me right for looking for a serious answer in here....8^)


But I just thought I'd give you cretins the benefit of the doubt just
this once, it might help me out, BUT NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO I end up
getting gray-hairy baloney answers.....


But, man oh man I do love this conference so!


'Saw

    Now 'Saw, if you were to ask what style of earring and what color Ralph
    Lauren Polo shirt goes best with your cellular phone, I'm sure at least
    Marky Mark could provide an answer.

>    Now 'Saw, if you were to ask what style of earring and what color Ralph
>    Lauren Polo shirt goes best with your cellular phone, I'm sure at least
>    Marky Mark could provide an answer.

Oh, Mac, Mac, Mac....


I don't wear Ralph Lauren Polo shirts (I don't play polo so why wear 
a polo shirt?)  -- well actually why pay all that money for something that
I can get for $10 from Levis?

Earring styles I manage myself.  Still haven't found a couple of the ones
I want yet.



Mac, you really should lighten up and live a little.  Shave one side of your
head, get a tatto, buy some leather pants..  It'll give you a whole new
outlook on life....


'Saw

    
    Yabbut this is (sorry!) a serious question that I deen to wonk.
    
    Has Scotty Pippen always been a Chicago Bull?  Some folks here in the
    office think that he was once with the Lakers.  Was he ever a Laker?
    If he was traded to the Bulls, who were the other players involved?
    
    And, where did he go to colledge?
    
    Thanks,
    
    I remain,
    kev_the_unknowing!
    

    He was always a Bull.  He attended the Tijuana School for Wayward
    Girls.

    Pippen went to Central Arkansas Class of 87....
    
    REK

Pippen has always been a Bull, but the Bulls obtained the draft pick
to select him via a Draft Day deal with Seattle.  

Ken

    	Does CNN plan on carrying the Chicago celebration/riot/carnage live
    tonight?
    
    				/Don

>    	Does CNN plan on carrying the Chicago celebration/riot/carnage live
>    tonight?
    
Yes.  I heard Wolf Blitzer got the call.....

ya know, one of you technoweenie software types should write a 
pc-game called "Champeenship Carnage" - pick a sport, a champeenship
final.  Pit two players.  two modes of play: 

1.  Fan mode = in this mode, you get to decide what type of 
celebration you want to have - and when you want to start the
carnage - right after the game, or during official ceremonies.

Also, have to decide if you riot even if you lose.  Extra points
for original idea.

2.  Authoriy mode - decide how to combat the carnage - preemptive
strikes - the Philly World Series scenario - etc...

Could be great fun.

Records would be kept on amount of damage, injuries, deaths, media
coverage.

JD

    >         <<< Note 5.484 by CUPMK::DEVLIN "Be My, Be My Yoko Ono..." >>>
     Bare Naked Ladies?
    

Bingo Walt.  Canada's finest.  Great CD.


JD

    	CAMERA:  Hey Fan, your team just won the <Insert League Here>
    		 Championship, what are you going to do now?
    
    	FAN:	 I'm going to go burn a Buick!

	
	Barabas!  Barabas!  Barabas!


'Saw

	Enrico Pallazo!  Enrico Pallazo!  Enrico Pallazo!

    Anyone know where I can get a copy of the touch typing tutorial
    saveset?

>    Anyone know where I can get a copy of the touch typing tutorial
>    saveset?


I didn't know such a thing existed.....

I'll ask around if you like.


'Saw

    
    Yabbut Mike,
    
    I've got "Mario Teaches Typing" at home on Greg's pee cee.  While
    *I've* never used it, I know it keeps records of your typing progress.
    Is that what you were looking for?
    ;^)
    I remanie,
    a dyed in the wool hunt and pecker!
    Kev
    

    
    >>I've got "Mario Teaches Typing" at home on Greg's pee cee.  While
    
    Geez, that Lemieux guy sure is talented, ain't he???
    
    JaKe
    

    
    He shore is!  When ya make a typing misteak, ya get your knuckles
    whacked by a hokey stick and then the program "halts" for 2 minutes
    cause a slashing!
    
    Teaches ya to think about where ya put your fingers before you push!
    
    I remain,
    patiently waiting to see what a misconduct does!
    Kev
    

    No pee cee, DEC won't let me get one.  I'm talkin the old VMS version.

I need some help.

Seems that this individual who shall remain nameless (and who is not part
of my group) sits near me in the office (like right over the other side
of the cube wall).

Now this individual is very loud.  So loud in fact that ships in the river
batten their hatches and start looking for fog when he talks.  That I
can deal with by putting on my walkman and cranking the volume way up.

But the thing that's driving me utterly crazy is this guy has something
caught in his chest.  I mean, it's like something he keeps trying to
GACK up every 30 seconds or so, with the most horrendous sounding HOARK
attempts.

I mean, I cannot describe the sound, but it is to sound what putrefaction
is to smell.  I mean, hearing him trying to GACK that thing up sends
shivers up and down my spine.  

I keep getting worried that one day soon that thing is gonna GORK outta
his mouth, and scuttle over the wall on little (BIG?) green phlegmy legs,
and attack the soft flesh of my throat....


What can I do?  Is there something I can bring in here to protect myself?
Should I just ask him to stop trying to GACK up a lung?  Should I wear
a garbage bag (with appropriate holes for head and arms) over my clothes
in case some pulmonary tissue goes into orbit over the wall?  I mean,
this is like being at a psychotically twisted Galagher show!

Any hints?

    
    Tell that bastard that if he's sick, go to the freakin' hospital.
    
    AND, ask him to save ya some of the throat oyster when he finally hurls
    it out, and go buy some tabasco fer the event.
    
    JaKe
    

    Either that, or a nice "Orange Juice and Battery Acid" cocktail sill
    probably do the trick of relieving the thing from his throat, and
    removing the lining of his thraot too.
    
    And....er...Nevermind.
    
    (8^)  (8^0  (8^|
    
    JaKe
    

    Just curious:
    
    What would happen if every NBA team won all it's home games? And by 
    exactly the same score that it lost by on its opponent's home court. How
    would the playoff determinations be made?
    
    Rodney
    

Many coin flips. 

Actually your scenario would be impossible since there
are teams that play each other an odd number of times during the season.

The Crazy Met

    Too late to move your office?  Have your boss sit in there when
    talking to you and have him give a listen?
    

Yeah I moved to another cube in a somewhat similar situation.

The Crazy Met

Tommy must have left himself logged in and someone else is using his account.

The Crazy Met

    Saw,
    
    A better way to do it isgo home tonight, eat a pound of peanuts, a
    couple of tacos wif hot sauce, a half gallon of chili, drink a sixpack,
    have some nachos wif jalapenos, and a bowl of cooked cabbage.
    
    Then, tomorrow, every time ya gots to release the gas created by it,
    walk over to his cube, stick yer rear inside, and let fly.
    
    If he complains, tell him fer ever time he makes that disgusting noise,
    you'll rip one out in his cubicle.  Then, maybe he'll get the message
    and go fer a walk when the ol throat gets clogged.
    
    JaKe
    

>I keep getting worried that one day soon that thing is gonna GORK outta
>his mouth, and scuttle over the wall on little (BIG?) green phlegmy legs,
>and attack the soft flesh of my throat....

    'saw, I'm concerned.  If someone is that sick, you shouldn't be kissing
    him.
    
    brews

    I need to draw upon the expertise in this notesfile.
    
    The electric cord on one of my lamps was cut in half. How do I properly
    splice in another plug? What materials and equipment to I need? and how
    do I make sure that it is safe?
    
    The Crazy Met
    
    

     I would replace it(the cord) if possible. Never heard of a splice for
    a lamp cord. I suppose it could be done though. 

    Easier still, just move the lamp halfway back to the outlet. :*)
    
    Lee

You can get a replacement plug in the hardware store.  Just figure out
which lead of the plug needs to be hot, and then if you look at the
cord, it's usually "segemented" into two sides, and one has a different
side is different than the other.  (They put a different texture on the
plastic coating of the wire).

Just attach the plug according to the directions.


Of course, in that case, you've now got only half a cord. 


So, you're best bet is to find a new cord to put on, which is probably
easier.....


'Saw

PS  The folks in the hardware store are usually pretty knowledgable, 
    and if you can get over the stupid feeling of asking them a dumb
    question (and NONE are dumber than MY questions), they are an
    invaluable source of help.

I found a dead, green phlegm monster in my cube this morning.  It was
16" in diameter, and all dried up.  I guess the cleaning lady shot it with
some Raid for Green Phlegm Monsters.

No sign of my "neighbor".


Hmmm.......

      'Saw,
    
      I would walk over and ask him if he's ok.  After he says yes (which
    is inevidable), then say, well I was wondering 'cause I sit on the
    other side of the wall and it sounds like you are suffering from
    having to hack as much as I am from having to listen to you hack.
    
      Ask him if he has seen a doctor.  If so, tell your boss to move you. 
    If he hasn't, tell him to go before he chokes to death, 'cause you
    won't run to give him mouth to mouth.
    
      If all else fails,  well Jake did have a brutal idea even though you
    may end up suffering more than the other guy.
    
      Tim

    
>>         <<< Note 5.511 by CAMONE::WAY "Nobles of the Mystic Shrine" >>>

>>I found a dead, green phlegm monster in my cube this morning.  It was
>>16" in diameter, and all dried up.  I guess the cleaning lady shot it with
    
    OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHHH!!
    
    Take this thang home, Frankie boy.
    
    Marinade overnight in Thunderbird wine to tenderize.
    
    Tomorrow, put it in the oven afore ya leaves fer work, with the
    leftover wine(whatever ya didn't drink) around it in a roasting pan,
    cover, turn oven on to 275, go to work.
    
    When ya gets home, crank the oven to 400, throw some carrots,
    potato(e)s, and a neighborhood cat alongside it, bake fer one more hour
    uncovered.  After the hour is up, remove from oven, let sit 15 minutes
    before carving, the cat should be medium rare, and the Phlegm monster
    well done, eat with horseradish.  Better than any sinus oyster ya ever
    had.
    
    
    Schnorttt Schittt Schleppps
    
    JaKe
    

Monday nights tend to be drinking nights for me.

This morning I'm handling the headache okay, and the stomach was fine.

Until just now.......8^)


GAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKK!

    I forgot to mention, Saw, feed the medium rare cat to yer wolf hound,
    he'll be happier than a pig in dung.
    
    JaKe
    

	Now I remember why Jake looks familiar...

	He's really Julia Childs in disquise!


	billl

    Shhhhhhhhhhhhh billl,
    
    don't let everybody know, I gots a reputation to live down to.
    
    JaKe
    

My dog actually likes cats.  I found a little abandoned barn kitten when
my dog was young, and I brought it in and fed it, and they got to be
great friends.  Ultimately gave the cat to my mom.

My dog goes after "critters" -- woodchuck, squirrel, skunk, possum.....
I've found more woodchucks with their heads gone when I get home some
days during the summer....


'Saw

    Hey TCM, try 12DOT2::HOME_WORK

Believe it or not, Mac, I actually did take a look at that notesfile 
but they don't have anything in there that is relevant.

The Crazy Met

TCM 

Unplug the LAMP
Take a pair of wire strippers and get four leads of copper showing
twist the matching pairs together 
Wrap in Duct tape till the cable won't bend 
Plug in 
Whatch for sparks or fire
Turn on the lamp and start reading again.

    
    Long story, but does anyone have the words to some of the Schoolhouse
    Rock jingles...
    
    I'm just a Bill
    Shot Heard around the World
    Conjunction junction, what's your function
    Person place or thing is a Noun
    
    or any others
    
    Thanks
    
    Marc
    

    But did you ask your question there, TCM?

nope, but I got the answer here. thanks to all who responded. Guy
at the hardware store recommended putting in a new chord and set me
up with the stuff I needed to get it done. Thanks all. BTW for this
kind of wire both sides are the same.

The Crazy Met

    
>>My dog actually likes cats.  I found a little abandoned barn kitten when
    
    I like cats, too.
    
    
    DEEP FRIED!!  They taste just like chicken.
    
    
    JaKe
    

And on JaKe goes with his week long roll.

The Crazy Met

    T-shirt I bought for my brother
    
    So many cats, so few recipes...
    

    So many dogs..
    
    So little space on my gas grill....
    
    REK

    TCM, I thought wanted to fix a light, not a guitar.  What's with this
    chord thing at a hardware store?
    
    Lee

    
    You mean to tell me that the claim of knowledge in this conference is
    all a lie (gasp) none of the people with mentalities of children know
    the words to any of the schoolhouse rock specials.  What has come of
    America?  Guess I should drive my Nissan home and drink Becks while
    watching my Sony.
    
    Marc
    

Well, on the *OFF CHANCE* that one of you might know.....


	They've been airing a commercial for Inside Edition, with
	all these scenes and this verbage crawling up the screen
	that says stuff like "We put this guy in jail" and crap
	like that.

	What I'm interested in is the music behind it.  It's definitely
	either opera or some large orchestral/choral work, but I 
	can't place it.    

	Any ideas?


'Saw

Saw this little tidbit on the toob:

	22% of US adults actively pursue a sun tan.
	29% of US adults actively avoid the sun.

Question: what the rest of 'em do?

TTom

Saw this on Sportscenter the other day:

17% of women executives consider golf more important than sex.
11% of men  "       "      "       "   "      "       "    ".

hey get your stats right, it was 13% of women execs

The Crazy Met

      Women still get to play with b@!!$ and a driver.
    
      As to the suntan %,  I think its because the rest don't pursue
    either!
    
      Tim

         During a recent game of Trivial Pursuit, the question was asked:
    
    "What sport was featured on the first cover of Sports Illustrated
     Magazine?"
    
    I thought the first cover featured Roger Bannister breaking the 4
    minute mile barrier, so I answered:
    
    "track and field"
    
    According to the card, the answer was baseball.  Is this correct, or
    can I file a belated protest?
    
    Russ
                                       

    
    Where's da Ninj' when ya really need him??????
    
    :*(
    
    I remain,
    never on the cover but frequently under the covers!
    ;^)
    Kev
    

          
    > According to the card, the answer was baseball.  Is this correct, or
    > can I file a belated protest?
    
    Yes, baseball.  The sweet lefthanded swing of Eddie Mathews, Milwaukee
    Braves...
    
    glenn
    

    y'know speaking of Eddie Mathews, his name came up in one of the Boston
    Globe's recent columns (Bob Ryan?).  The writer recalled somebody on
    the Red Sox getting a big strike out of Mathews in 1967, during the
    pennant strech.  I remember Mathews coming to the AL at the end of his
    career, but I don't remeber who he played for - was it the Tigers?  And
    was he there as late as 1967?

    > I remember Mathews coming to the AL at the end of his
    > career, but I don't remeber who he played for - was it the Tigers?  And
    > was he there as late as 1967?
      
    Yup, and also for the Tigers' great 1968 season, although I don't think
    he made it through the end of that year...
    
    glenn
                   

    Anyone else here that BP wants non-business notesfiles gone next?
    

>    Anyone else here that BP wants non-business notesfiles gone next?


Yeah.  Big argument about it at a recent meeting.  They don't want it
to turn into a debacle like the vacation accrual thing.

I guess BP is one of these folks who subscribes to the "The beatings will
continue until morale improves" theory.

He's already lost a lot of people's loyalty, and I see a lot of people
just going through the motions.....


But hey, you don't have to have high morale or people who care when you're
trying to strip the company down so that you can sell it off to the 
highest Japanese bidder.....


What they don't realize is that yeah, you can close notesfiles, but then 
folks will send lots of mail to large distribution lists and use just
as much "net".   If they're gonna start probing our mail messages to
see if they're personal or not it's gonna cost a lot of time and money.


He ought to see that a happy employee is a productive employee and that
sometimes you have to spend a little to get more in return....  But
what can you expect from a rich guy who wants for nothing?


This ain't even the Titanic sinking any more -- it's more like the
Minnow and BP is the Skipper.....

      Sure checking mail messages will take time & money.  That means a
    new group will have to be formed in order to investigate how long
    it will take and how much $$$ it will cost.  This is justification
    to add on another VP and 10 managers with 2 workers!
    
    
      

The non-business notes files thing comes from an "initiative" to cut 
telecommunications cost by 20% across the company.  One of the managers
in Corporate Telecommunications had people brainstorm on ways to do it.
Their list had all kinds of outlandish things on it (cut the number of 
telephones on desks by 50%, do away with VMSmail [go to all All-in-1], etc.),
including the elimination of non business notes files.  Of course in her 
intimate wisdom, this manager "acidently" sent the list out to the world.  
The whole company picked up on it and went nuts...

=Bob=

>                   -< we could always meet on the Internet >-


Nah, Mike, they'd shut down our access to that too.   I mean, the more
you take away from your workers, the more they just want to "storm that
hill" for you, ya know.....


'Saw
    

    They can't shut the gateway off because we perform various support 
    functions to customers through it.

    That's right... I run field tests and it's a lot more cost effective
    to get information to/from the network than making phone calls and 
    faxing/fed ex'ing info back and forth.
    

>    That's right... I run field tests and it's a lot more cost effective
>    to get information to/from the network than making phone calls and 
>    faxing/fed ex'ing info back and forth.


Well, then they'd hire jackbooted network Gestapo to make sure we weren't
out there exchanging ideas that enrich our lives, and make us more
productive human beings.


You know, Charles Dickens had a character who had an attitude like
DEC's in one of his books.....


'Saw
    

    Yeah, and I ain't a technoid & I don't play one on tee vee but I'm
    under the impression that All-In-1 requires 3x-5x the space of a 
    good ol' Vaxmail account.......
    
    ?
    

�    Yeah, and I ain't a technoid & I don't play one on tee vee but I'm
�    under the impression that All-In-1 requires 3x-5x the space of a 
�    good ol' Vaxmail account.......
 
As Mr. BobHunt would tell us, the "store/forward" feature of a the A1 software
is much more efficient than the immediate forward of VMSmail.  My organization,
Corporate Telecommunications, beleives that for our internal uses, there would 
be a 40% reduction in network resource use if everyone used A1.

Disk space is cheap, bandwidth and network resouces are expensive...

=Bob=   

    
    Excuuuse me!!!! but the store/forward "feature" takes 4EVER to get
    stuff done.  I hate it!  VaxMail, with it's lean, mean and FAST
    electrons really get the work done quickly!  
    
    A1, on the other hand has "commercially robust" (read FAT) electrons.
    It takes forever to get things done.
    
    me?
    
    I remain,
    preferring to be fast on my feet & get thangs done quickly!
    Kev
    
    ps - BobH had a vested interest in A1 so he was baised!
    

With FDDI networks and ever increasing bandwidth network cost is continuing to
go down. Why do you think AT&T, MCI, and the cellular companies are investing
so much in these information highway ideas of the future? Because they have the
forsight to see ideas that were once displayed only in Buck Rogers and Dick
Tracy coming to fruition in the next decade. Information will be everywhere.

Then there is the company that has no vision and is just intrested in selling
cheap hardware components. We call that company DEC, "they" call it Digital.

Metz

All-In-One is like making love to someone while you wear a whole gross
of condoms all at once.

You're so far removed from anything with decent response time, and there
are so many layers in there for the computer illiterate, that those of us
who learned how to use these magic boxes would be at a severe disadvantage.

It's too bad the head honchos are putting all of their efforts into
cutting people, cutting cost and hiring more VPs, instead of address 
important issues, like what customers really want, and what is really
going on in the market place.


Metz, the last paragraph of your note should be put on a plaque and
saved for posterity.....


'Saw

Digital is tapped in to the information highway, and have made inroads into 
communication over cable TV (the digital channel), which could easily be the 
growth market for communications in the early 21st century.  Unfortunately, 
they are showing signs of dropping the ball on this due to "resource problems"..

=Bob=

    Whats the new node for the BOSTON_CELTICS CONFERENCE.

    VIA::Boston_celtics
    
    
    REK

With SPORTS being the unique and diverse community that it is, and knowing
that we have some highly literate participants, I'd like to pose the
following question:


	I started reading William Faulkner's "The Sound and the Fury"
	last night.  It certainly was a demanding read at the start
	and I was curious if anyone else has read it, and what
	did they think of it?


'Saw

    1) Who is William Faulkner?
    
    2) Was this the Monarch Notes version you were readin' Saw?
    
    3) We don't read nuthin' unless it has no redeeming value.
    
    4) You have too much time on your hands.
    
    HTH,
    
    Your friend NAZZ

>                   -< I trust I speak for most SPROTS-ists >-
>
>    1) Who is William Faulkner?

A classic American novelist from the south, who was born 1897(?) and
died in 1962.   The novel I'd heard of before "The Sound and the Fury"
was one that some of the English classes read in high school, "As I Lay
Dying"....  I think it was about a Red Sox fan in August....8^)

    
>    2) Was this the Monarch Notes version you were readin' Saw?

Nope, it's the original version by Faulkner hisself, the one without
any discernable punctuation....
    

>    3) We don't read nuthin' unless it has no redeeming value.

Oh, I watch 'Beavis and Butt-head' for that....

    
>    4) You have too much time on your hands.

I should probably find me a woman, then, huh?

    
>    HTH,

As always!  8^)
    

'Saw

    Gee 'Saw,
    
    Then who is having the sex on the pool table with Heather then?
    
    Truely, I have not clue what that means either.
    
    Gin

>    Gee 'Saw,
>    
>    Then who is having the sex on the pool table with Heather then?
>    
>    Truely, I have not clue what that means either.
    
Well, 

Sex On the Pool Table is a drink they serve at Boston Billiards.  I'm 
assuming it's a variation on Sex On The Beach (which always tasted like
Hawaiin Punch to me), but instead of being red it's green.

Now, Heather was this waitress who was selling shots at Boston Billiards,
and she seemed to take a liking to my friend Gerry, who's married.

(Here's Chainsaw's First Law:    Women in positions like that tend to
 gravitate towards the married guys, under the assumption, misguided or
 not, that they are "safe")

So, she kept working on him to buy a shot, buy a shot, and when he finally
did, she said "Now you can tell your friends you had Sex on the Pool Table
with Heather"......


So that's it.

Now as to clues, hey, I'm from the East Coast, and supposedly we East
Coast folks can't even BUY a clue, never mind have one, so I can't help
you with your clues.....


'Saw

    Does anyone heard about a NBA pre-season game (or a regular one ?) in
    London (UK) ?
    
    Thanks in advance,
    
    Jean-Pierre.
    

    I haven't.  However, during October there's the McDonald's open in
    Germany (?not sure about this).  The Phoenix Suns will be representing
    the NBA against Europe.
    
    Mike

Here's a serious weightlifting question.

I can't remember the "steps" for the two lifts in Olympic competition:
the clean and jerk and the snatch.

The Clean and jerk is where you pull the weight off the floor, get "under"
it in a squat position (with the bar in position as if you were going
to do a military press) and then stand up.  After a pause, you basically
military press it (with some body assistance) over your head.   Right?

I can't begin to describe the snatch lift.

Anyone wanna help out on this?????


'Saw

             <<< Note 5.572 by CAM3::WAY "The Jerky Boys rool!" >>>

>I can't begin to describe the snatch lift.

>                         -< I ain't touchin this one >-
>
>
>>I can't begin to describe the snatch lift.


Yabbut, I'm being SERIOUS about this.  I know it's rare that I am, but
I am....  It's been the subject of an on-going debate for a while......


'Saw

    Hey, what happened to my Mickey D note?  Someone move it or delete it
    by accident?
    

    Not I.

Saw,

	I think the difference is the clean and jerk is a two step process
as you described. The snatch lift is all one motion no stopping.

Ron

>   <<< Note 5.577 by SNAX::ERICKSON "Please walk under my tree stand...." >>>
                                      ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

If I wear international orange, you're not allowed to shoot me, right??? 8^)


>	I think the difference is the clean and jerk is a two step process
>as you described. The snatch lift is all one motion no stopping.

Oh, okay, cool.

It's been so long since I've seen a competition I had forgotten, and it
has been the topic of discussion here....


thanks again,
'Saw

    I'm looking for McDonalds cards from different cities.  I still need
    the following:
    
    Definite:
    Broncos, Bucs, Oilers, Vikings,  Chiefs, Falcons
    
    Maybe:
    Bengals, Seahawks
    
    They should be selling them (instead of collecting points) for less
    than $1/sheet (3 sheets/team).  I'd trade them or buy them if people
    could help me out.  I can send out Giants or Pats probably.  If anyone
    can help me out, I'd be grateful.
    
    -Walt
    

    Walt, here's a tip for you:  GET A LIFE!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    
    NAZZ

    Walt has a life, he's just making investments.  Until you realize how
    much $$ these cards are going for, you shouldn't make such accusations.
    My Dad has Mantle's rookie card, appraised at $15K.  If you hang onto
    them long enough, you'll have a nest egg, or a nice piece of sports
    history for your kids to inherit.

Not the new stuff fella. They're printing a zillion of 
everything and dealers are socking away unopened cases to boot.
The old stuff will continue to go up in value, limited supply and 
plenty of demand. 

As it is now, dealers are keeping most of the prices on new stuff 
artificially high, being the money-grubbers that they are.

Notice how many shops are going EOL these days?

The bottom has fallen outta the market.

Maybe it'll become a hobby again....

daryll

The new stuff is simply for collecting purposes only unless you get really
lucky and get hold of a misprint or some other oddity on the rookie card of
some future star...

Metz

Whose Dad still has has collection from 1933-1935 of cards when they used to
come with chewing tobacco and cigarettes instead of gum and refuses to get it
appraised or even lock it up...

    I know 3 different dealers/shop owners.  And for the most part Cards
    today are for short gain only.  Some cards go up quick and the card
    dealers can make a quick fast buck but dont plan on seeing too many
    of those cards hitting the 4-digit mark... Low 100's at best.
    
    This of course exclude's the limited edition, autographed cards that
    come out every so often.
    
    The best card I got recently was the Michael Jordan car that hes
    wearing Sam Vincints jersey (Couldnt find his).  I have 9 of them
    now :-)
    
    I have a couple nice cars (being a youngin dont have any 60's or early
    70's) but I have 2 Joe Montana Rookies, A Art Monk rookie... I like to
    look at them every so often.
    
    I do have alot of late 70's early 80's baseball cards that dont intrest
    me at all... Maybe Ill put a note in here (and class adds) to see what
    there worth (in $$ or trade)...
    							MairB

    Ok...
    
    If you remember, McDonald's did the same thing with basketball cards
    last winter.  Here they had a national set, and a Celtic set.  They
    also had sets for Cleveland, Lakers, Orlando and Chicago.  I bought
    Celtic sets here for $1-$2.  I traded for the other sets even (except
    Orlando, that had Shaq, I got that for $10).  I sold the whole thing
    for $70... seemed worth it to me... especially since in the process,
    I got one of the 18,000 McDonalds issued that had the whole thing.
    The Orlando set still goes for $40 or so if you can find it around
    here...
    
    If I get these from people and sell the whole set for $50, is that 
    worth it?  Assuming I even want to sell it.  Some collect stamps.
    Others coins.  Franklin mint chess pieces... cars, miniatures...
    
    What's the big deal? Figured I could get some friends to help me out.
    I'll just keep quiet for now... If I'm looking for Patriot cards around
    here, then I'm not going to get much here.  But I can get more for
    another cities, just like in the McDonald basketball ones, the local
    Shaq or Jordan or Pippen (who wasn't featured in the national set),
    is worth more.  These will be MUCH more limited than the Upper Deck,
    Topps, etc... since they are only sold to "regional" areas... 
    
    Besides, if I worked for Celtics, maybe I could collect autographs...
    assuming I had courtside seats... (smiley goes here)...
    
    Am I excused now?
    

    I have 3 different Bo cards (baseball).  Also have Canseco's from the
    40-40 year.  Ken Griffey Jr., lots of Shaqs, etc.

I've got the Nolan Ryan card from his rookie year.   I guess in mint condition
it goes for around $1200.

I didn't buy it, I've had it from when I started collecting cards so I 
could chew bubblegum.  8^)  You remember, back when they actually put
bubblegum in with the cards.....


'Saw

    I've got cards from when I was growing up too... only I'm not as
    old as you, so mine are newer... haha...
    
    Rookie Payton, Yount and Brett cards, plus some Clemente's, early
    Carew, Nolans, Aaron, Mays... some are signed because they wouldn't
    give me their jockstraps...
    

	=bob= has a Dick Radditz that "almost" got signed.


	billl

    Squat   Picking up weight from floor to waist level
    Dead Lift Picking up weight over head also known as the clean and jerk
    Bench Press laying down on weight bench and pressing weight...
    
    
    REK

    
    	Ha!  "Squat" is what you know about weightlifting REK.
    
    	The squat is a lift where the bar is across your back (shoulder
    	blades).  You squat down with the weight until your thigh bone
    	is parallel to the floor (some folks go deeper, some less).  You
    	then return to a standing position with the weight (hopefully).
    
    	The deadlift is where you pull the weight from the floor to
    	almost waist level (you've gotta have mighty short arms to
    	bring it to waist level).
    
    	The clean and jerk and the snatch have already been described
    	correctly.
    
    	You almost got the bench press right.  You didn't mention what
    	you press the weight with (arms).
    
    HTH,
    
    Claybone

Walt,

Get the decaf next time.

The only point I was making is that the scum (read: dealers) who 
have ruined this hobby by outpricing everything to the point that 
kids can't even afford it anymore are having their chickens come 
back to roost. They deserve it.

Collectors, like yourself, are what this hobby used to be about. 
Getting excited opening wax, completing a set the hard way, or 
getting a card of a favorite player. I think it's sad that the 
first thing out of a kids mouth when he buys a pack of cards is 
"What's it worth?".

Investors, bah.

daryll

�	=bob= has a Dick Radditz that "almost" got signed.

har, har.  Go ahead, have one more laugh on the way you snookered ole' =Bob=.

Actually, I have a small fortune of baseball cards from when I weas growing up.
Lots of Aarons, Mantles, Koufax, and of course, my hero, Willie Mays.  One time
I priced them out just for the hell of it, and estimated about $3000 worth.  I
then concluded that it didn't matter, because I would never part with any of 
them.  They WERE my youth.  Virtually every day during th esummer, my mother 
would give me a dime, and I would walk to Nick's Variety, and buy two packages
of cards from the little old Greek guy.  I had braces back then too (have I had
braces all my life?), and I used to save the gum for when I got them off.  I 
literally had two years worth of gum saved before my mother pitched it.  At 
least she never pitched the cards.

=Bob=

>    	The squat is a lift where the bar is across your back (shoulder
>    	blades).  You squat down with the weight until your thigh bone
>    	is parallel to the floor (some folks go deeper, some less).  You
>    	then return to a standing position with the weight (hopefully).

I always go deeper.  

And if you're ass doesn't hurt the next day you ain't doing them right.

Actually, what's bugging me these days, Claybone is that little notch
in yer spine where the bar rests.  I haven't built that back up.

They have a little rubber pad, but real men don't use that....


>    	The deadlift is where you pull the weight from the floor to
>    	almost waist level (you've gotta have mighty short arms to
>    	bring it to waist level).

Deadlifts rool!

If I'm not getting tunnel vision in the last 4 reps of my 3rd set,
I'm not working hard enough.

    
>    	You almost got the bench press right.  You didn't mention what
>    	you press the weight with (arms).
    

Ugh, I hate bench press.  That's why I'm getting a little masochistic
with it -- so that I can get something out of it....


'Saw

    Yo lEe,
    
    Ya still got that Abner Doubleday card from whence you was a whelp?
    
    MikeL
    

    Quick Question:
    	There were a few noters in here that mentioned they lived
    	in athol, I moved to athol 3 months ago, could one of you
    	send me mail VLNVAX::MBROOKS I have some questions about the
    	area :-).. Well one question.... Thanks in advance...
    
    							Mike Brooks