Conference terri::cars_uk

     Come close, but by opening the windows wide and cranking up the stereo
    I've managed to avoid falling asleep at the wheel. If this happens I
    stop asap and get a coffee, or wind the seat back and get 40 winks!
    
    BTW I reckon on stopping every 1.5 to 2 hours anyhow.
    
   Greg

    
    Came close on the way to Austria last year (in the 2AM - 4AM slot).
    
    Biting my lower lip seemed to help, but not had problems during the
    day. Dare I suggest that those falling asleep in the 2PM - 4PM slot are 
    on the road after a 'heavy' lunch?
    
    Mark

    Guess who said this...
    
    To avoid dropping off to sleep.
    Get off Motorway and find suitable B class road.
    Turn up stereo (Fleetwood Mac - "The Chain")
    Max Revs..Drop clutch..Vvvvroomm.
    Concentration will then be at a level that avoids any possibility of
    sleeping.
    
    Dave :-)

    About four years ago, I'd been to a concert in Shepton Mallet and
    was heading back to Reading. The motorway from Chippenham was totally
    dead not a car in site ( it was about 1:00am ). Next thing I knew was
    this awfull noise woke me up, I'd travelled over the white line on the
    hard shoulder - luckily it was the new style line with the raised
    bumps - otherwise I'd have been part of the scenery.
    
    I was lucky that time and take notice of the warning signs now !
    
    Andy

	No, I've never fallen asleep at the wheel, but my father did once.
	This was back in the 60s (wavey lines, wobble wobble wobble..
	flashback).  We used to travel miles and with 4 kids, my dad 
	prefered to do it at night.  One time, on the way back from 
	Cornwall, dad was piloting the Mark I Cortina (a lovely car in
	a deep claret), wife and 4 kids asleep he dropped off at the 
	wheel.  If was my mum who woke up in time to grab the wheel
	and yell at him.

	Dave

	PS In the base note, the question of driver training was
	raised, is anyone interested in this?

    What about people who drive for a living.
    
    My dad drives a HGV for BT and they used to have a good system. He
    would pick up a load, drive to the destination and while it was being
    unloaded/loaded he would have a 15 min break. Then he would deliver
    this load and while it was being.......etc etc.
    
    This meant that he never went a LONG period of driving without a
    break......if he was on a longer run then he would stop for a cuppa
    somewhere on the way.
    
    Then privatisation came......they laid off all the fork lift drivers so
    that the drivers had to load their own rigs. so that was that break
    gone. Then they introduced tachos.....so that was the little ten
    minute stops gone.
    
    Now he assures me that he regularly breaks the law in that he drives
    for too long without a break.
    
    Thats privatisation for you !!
    
    Barry
    

    � Then they introduced tachos.....so that was the little ten
    � minute stops gone.
    � 
    � Now he assures me that he regularly breaks the law in that he drives
    � for too long without a break.
    
    Barry,
    
    Weren't tachos (and tortillas! :^)) introduced to prevent people doing
    this? Presumably his tacho sheets show that he's been breaking the law?
    Who should be checking these things? BT? Some external organisation?
    
    Mark
    

    
    When I was living in Harlow I used to regularly drive to my girlfriends
    house in Richmond. On many occassions I would drive home at one or two
    in the morning (The roads were quieter and it sure beat the drive in
    the rush hour traffic the next morning to get back to work). The route
    I took involved driving around the North Circular and then joining the
    M11 at the bottom of the motorway. I found that the drive round the
    North Circular was fine (too many police, traffic lights and lane width
    changes to fall asleep) but when I hit the M11 boredom would set in and
    I'd find it really difficult to stay awake. 
    
    I remember one occassion where I did fall asleep only momentarily but
    woke up to find that I was just about to side swipe a bus in the inside
    lane. I've never finished the journey so wide eyed.
    
    Nowadays on long journeys' I tend to drive with the airvents blowing cold
    air over me, the stereo up loud playing lively music and a plentiful
    supply of ProPlus. 
    
    
    
    POL.

    Mark,
    	Too right.....but only in a perfect world.
    
    BT definately know that their drivers are beng forced to break the
    law.....but choose to ignore it. The tachos werent brought in for any
    other reason than to check up on the drivers. If you are a driver you
    have 2 choices :
    
    1 - Dont break the law, have your little breaks, and have no "lunch
    break" of any substancial size.
    
    		OR
    
    2 - Break the law, dont have your breaks, and have a lunch break.
    
    Which would you choose ??
    
    Barry
    

�    1 - Dont break the law, have your little breaks, and have no "lunch
�    break" of any substancial size.
�    
�    		OR
�    
�    2 - Break the law, dont have your breaks, and have a lunch break.
    
     3 - Don't break the law, have required breaks, have full lunch break,
         risk losing your job and then get the union to fight for wrongful
         dismissal !  B.T. may be big, but they cannot make you break the law
         and sack you if you don't.
    
    Of course, this would involve being without a job for some time...
    
    J.R.
    
    

    You've hit the nail on the head (ouch!!) with the last comment.....my
    dad is 56 and cannot afford to lose his job cos even with a first class
    completely clean HGV license........he has NO chance of getting another
    job.
    
    And as I'm sure you all can appreciate this is not a good time to be in
    debt with no income !!
    
    Barry
    

    Interestingly, a reply mentioned the M11 - a nice boring motorway but also
    quite fast. I too have driven from the start up to Cambridge being 
    periodically woken by the rumble-strip at the hard shoulder.

    How about a list of the most soporific roads ?

    There's something about the M3 from the M25 to Basingstoke. I found it MUCH
    harder to stay awake on that, than say the M4 to Reading. Perhaps there is
    more to look at on the M4.

    Regarding falling asleep, yes... many a time. Worst was during an all-night
    run from Calais to Geneva. I awoke in a cloud of grey smoke and burnt 
    rubber. I think I'd dozed off and caught a building out of the corner of
    one eye and had slammed on the brakes. Luckily it was in the wee small hours
    with nothing around.

I fell asleep once on the Northbound M6 on my way back to Stoke from Brumm at 
about 2am.  I woke up on the hard shoulder.  It gave me the fright of my life. 
I kept awake after that by opening the windows, singing and slapping my face a 
bit.  The singing and slapping soon abated as both were a bit painful; I think
that the adrenalin created by the shock got me the rest of the distance without
incident.

I was in my first ever car at the time.  A blue and green 2CV with striped seat
covers in the same colours.  It looked like a deck chair and went about as fast 
as one.  With the suspension of a pram and the appearance of one upturned it 
makes me feel, well, not quite nostalgic.

Is it harder on lit or unlit stretches of motorway to stay awake?  I always find
it harder to drive on an unlit section at night when tired, as the lights from 
vehicles behind me for some reason have a more soporiphic effect.

PaulC

    On one occasion I almo... Zzzzzzzzzzz :-)

    
    Come on Garry,
    
    We all fall asleep at our terminals now and then! 
    
    Or are we to understand that you are noting from a laptop connected to
    your portable phone whilst driving at 70 mph? (Stuck in 1st,presumably)
    
    Mark

    
    Turned off the A4 towards Tywford at about 3 in the morning.
    I was very tired and shouldn't have been driving but I dozed
    off at the wheel and woke up still on the road but in the 
    oncoming traffic lane. There was a car coming toward me which
    I managed to miss. From then on I had an immediate requirement
    for brown trousers and cycle clips. Not a pleasant experience.
    
    JN.

Having done a number of all-night driving stints to rallies and such, I've had
plenty of time to get tired behind the wheel.  However, once, about 12 years ago,
I was driving along a back road in my Fiat 128 and suddenly found myself in the 
oncoming lane.  It was about sun-up (after having been up all the previous day
and all night), and luckily no one was coming the other way.  I did the usual
open window and load stereo bit and made it home.

Whenever we do long trips now, the trick is (obviously) to have two drivers so 
we can swap whenever one gets tired.  I also have a cooler full of ice and Coke
to keep the eyes open.  It also tends to keep one on ones toes when you've
downed 32 oz of fluid and need to 'go'.

With two people in the van we can hit the road after working a full day and
drive for another 20-22 hours without much problem.  One thing I find 
interesting is that if I'm starting to dose off behind the wheel and switch
seats, I can't fall asleep anymore!  Maybe if I put a fake steering wheel and
pedals on the passengers side I would be able to!

Dave

ps - it's been 6 months since my last road trip (2800 mile round trip in 3 days)
and I'm starting to look at maps again....:-)

� I also have a cooler full of ice and Coke to keep the eyes open. 

    White line fever perhaps ?

    Hiding it in the cooler wont help though !

:o)

Actually, trying to drink Coke through your nose WOULD be an eye opener!!

A real tip I have for long distance, all night driving, is to eat *real* food
on a regular basis.  Stop every 4-6 hours and have a real meal.  I've tried
surviving all night on candy bars and Coke, but your stomach starts to revolt
after awhile.....

Dave (sniff)

    As motorcyclists have been saying for years......many car drivers
    are dosey b*****.
    
    John.
    
    
    
    

    As the instigator of this note, I've had quite a few people mention near
    misses and some hits resulting from ZZZZZ's at the wheel - it's
    certainly not uncommon.
    
    One guy I know was on the good ol' M25 and caught up with a (usual if
    you're lucky) 50MPH queue of traffic in lane 3.  With barrier on his
    right and traffic to his left he watched in horror as a car behind,
    weaving a bit, continued at its 80MPH (with the driver dozing) into the
    back of him.  He could actually see the chap sleeping in his mirror,
    milliseconds before the crunch.
    
    They all got out alive (my friend was actually in hospital for quite a
    time), including the sleeping driver!  Apparently he was on Cruise
    Control....I guess the less you have to think about the more likely you
    are to fall asleep!
    
    With the new traffic cameras maybe keeping everyone on the
    motorway to a similar speed, (less to see), journeys (especially in the 
    early hours on a clear road), much longer and no need to  
    watch for cameras or hidden police vehicles, there may be even less to 
    keep some drivers minds alert!   I'm not condoning anything here, just
    stating there may be an increase in the sleeping driver syndrome!
    
    All those comfy, quite, cruise controlled cars really do need that
    drivers air bag that's becoming the norm.  Maybe it'll pop out complete
    with duvet and cup of horlicks!
    
    Nigel
                 

    Wasn't it Issigonis who said all cars should be uncomfortable and, in not
    giving the driver a luxurious environment, keep the driver awake ?

 

    
    I think it was probably Jem Marsh...
    
    Mark

    
    As I had to drive up to Scotland with my sister and kids I swapped my
    car for THAT Merc!!!! (Hows the 850 JIM?) That particular car has cruise
    control and it turned out to be a godsend. 
    
    My sisters flight was delayed so I didn't pick her up from Luton
    Airport till 9:30 at night. I wasn't looking forward to the 6hr+ drive
    upto Scotland but as it turned it out it was one of the easiest drives
    up North I've ever had. No foot cramps from holding my foot on the
    accelerator and no gear changes to make. All in all I must have used
    the accelerator 6 times at most during the whole journey. I didn't feel
    at all tired from the journey (then again I had my usual dose of
    Pro-Plus) either physically or mentally.
    
    Got home at 3:40 in the morning, my dad was still up, can of lager
    waiting for me in his hand, God do they spoil me!!!!!!!
    
    
    
    POL.

    Don't know if it counts but my cousin fell asleep whilst...
    
    	riding his pushbike...
    
    Simon (who would find it near impossible to fall asleep driving his
           Landy)

  <<< Note 1855.12 by UPROAR::WATSONR "Lambs... so cute... but so tasty !" >>>
    
>    How about a list of the most soporific roads ?
 
Well, I don't know about soporific, but I can't drive down the M40 without
thinking at least once about Cameron Frazer. Served the silly cow right.

Dougie Irrelevant

    Speaking as someone who has actually caused an accident I would advise
    all precautions. 
    
    At the particular point in time I had not had any sleep for 46hrs, while 
    travelling from Salisbury to Andover I crossed the central reservation 
    and whent head long into another car as a consequence of falling asleep 
    at the car.
    
    The outcome of this particular event was a cut face on my behalf and
    a broken leg on the third party, plus two severly dented cars.
    
    My advice therefore is take all possible cautions to prevent this sort
    of thing happening.                                          

    Frightening stuff... aslmost nightmarish ;-)
    
    Gary.

    Why oh why were you driving for such a long period of time without
    sleep ?

    Maybe there should be much more police attention on the ability to
    drive, such as have you had enough sleep, rather than whether you're
    doing 15mph over the limit.
    
    Surely someone wide awake and alert doing over the speed limit is far 
    less of a hazard than someone half asleep at 40MPH (in a 70 limit).
    
    And I bet some of the worst culprits for high speed driving whilst also
    half asleep are highly pushed top exec's....I wonder if there's a
    profile for the most likely candidates?
    
    Nigel
                           

I once had a terrible time staying awake while driving...it was a bright
sunny day, the first day of a week-long (ready for it?) _motorcycle_ trip! 
My head was nodding and I had to use every trick I could think of to keep 
awake.  I'm certain that had I given in to it, I would have fallen asleep!

I still wonder about that time...I have never before or since been so near 
to falling asleep at the wheel.  I wonder if it was due to some sort of 
illness (though I felt fine beyond the need to snooooooze...)

							Mike

Instead of using tricks to stay awake, why not stop and have a rest?

Dave.

I fell asleep driving an army landy with a radio trailer on the back. It was
on the way back from a 3-day excercise (ie 3 days with about 2 hrs sleep per
night).

I was driving down a narrow country lane at the time, and woke up to find
the vehicle at 45deg, driving along the bank at the side of the road.

The adrenalin charge kept me awake all the way home!

These days, I often drop off the M-ways and take the windy road to keep myself
alert.

Dave

    
    Re: .32 Couldn't agreee more.
    
    All this talk of winding windows down, having a cup of coffee, taking
    windy roads is a load of twaddle. The only way to overcome tiredness
    is to stop and go to sleep. A short rest or brisk walk is not enough.
    
    Chris
    

Re: .32 & .34


Because you are not allowed to stop on the hard shoulder of a motorway for any 
reason except a breakdown.


You have to make your way to the nearest exit or service station....

often, that's too late.

    Are we talking abought 'trouser coughs' or 'roads with lots of bends
    in' ?
    
    Just wondering...

    
    Re: .35
    
    Given that junctions on motorways are on average approximately five
    miles apart, I doubt if there is more than fifteen miles between any
    junction in the UK. If you can't tell you are feeling sleepy fifteen
    minutes in advance then I would advise you to stop driving immediately
    and see a doctor. Sudden blackouts can be the symptons of a serious
    dis-order, not that I want to frighten you.
    
    Chris
    

    I wasn't going to reply to this note, but I shall do now...
    
    Re the last reply, I can assure you that driving-induced drowsiness CAN
    come on that quickly, as my experience bears out.
    
    Two years ago, I was driving on the M1 southbound near Newport Pagnell,
    at around 3pm on a sultry early summer's day. I was on DEC business,
    and had had a particularly busy spell of supporting customers with
    consultancy and giving presentations. However, on this occasion, I had
    only been going for about an hour or so, but I had made the cardinal
    error of not having any sweets or decent cassette tapes with me to keep
    me alert. As it was so stuffy in the car, I opened the sunroof, but that
    was too noisy above 60mph, so I closed it and speeded up to 75mph (no
    comments from compulsive law-abiders, please!)... Next thing I knew,
    there was this almighty crashing sound, and I 'came to'. I was in the
    outside lane, doing 75, on a busy weekday afternoon with three lanes of
    traffic, and a coach inside me in the middle lane. I looked in the
    rear-view mirror, to see clouds of dust emanating from the central
    reservation behind me -- at which point I realised I had fallen asleep
    and hit the barrier. The car behind had clearly seen what was
    happening, as it was at least 100 yds behind me.
    
    I was extremely lucky that I had hit the barrier at a point where it is
    buried in tarmac at a level with the road -- not where the barrier sits
    in a nice gravel trap that almost certainly would have spun the car at
    best. Damage was limited to a gouge all the way down the rubbing strip
    on the side of the car, plus some paint off the front and rear
    wheelarches.
    
    This incident is the reason I will always specify air-con on my future
    cars, regardless of expense.
    
    
    
    Stephen
                                                                        

    
    Re: .38
    
 >>                                               I was on DEC business,
 >> and had had a particularly busy spell of supporting customers with
 >> consultancy and giving presentations.
    
    This seems to be work related drowziness.
    
    
 >> This incident is the reason I will always specify air-con on my future
 >> cars, regardless of expense.
    
    Cold air doesn't keep anybody alert or awake neither is it enough to
    revive you. If it had these properties then nobody would die of
    hypothermia whilst asleep.
    
    Chris
    
    PS. If you insist that you fell asleep all of a sudden with no advance
        warning then stop driving and explain this to a doctor before it
        happens again.
    

re: .39

Perhaps you can sleep in the cold, but I find nothing better than a brisk 
temprature to keep the senses sharp, and nothing worse that a "nice warm
comfy seat" to send me right off to sleep. 

Sure there is no substitute for sleep when you find yourself tired on the 
road, but even in the finest conditions a long dull solo trip on the M4/1/6/40
will erode the concentration. 

I vote for a cool car, and a helpfull passenger/co-driver

Terry

Re: .37

Maybe you have never driven on the M4 west of J12.

The juctions are about 8 minutes apart, considerably more than 5 miles and 
totally boring.  The difference of 8 minutes can be plenty between being tired,
but able to continue, and realising that the brain has switched off connection
with the eyeballs. 

And yes, I have got too sleepy between junctions before now at 3 am in the 
morning.....

my sleepies tend to strike when I get to bits of road I know very well and stop 
having to concentrate so much...

and yes I do stop when I can, and no I don't get blackouts, they tend to be 
just going to sleep with my eyes open...

    
    There you go again misquoting, I said fifteen minutes.
    
    Chris
    

>                        -< Bit touchy today aren't you >-

    
>    There you go again misquoting, I said fifteen minutes.
    
you also said 5 miles.


5 miles and 15 minutes don't match on a motorway.

Touchy ??????????

never...    

They do on the M6 :-(

> They do on the M6 :-(

got caught in a traffic jam did you ?

I was on my way back from Christchurch once on the M3 going into London, having
worked till 11.00pm on shift. Having started to doze off, I decided to pull over
and have a 15min sleep in the services....woke up six hours later...a bit cold
and with the feeling of ...where am I...


                          KR

    re: -1
    
    Try explaining THAT one to your partner.."But dear..I WAS asleep in a
    services car park...honestly..."
    
    :-)  :-) :-)

    I have often found myself nodding off particularly after lunch and late
    at night.
    
    I've found that by modifying my meal times it seems to help.
    
    Particularly late at night if I start to get tired I pull over and have
    something to eat , usually a hot meal. maybe it's simply the rest but I
    do find that it clears my head wonderfully. As for after lunch the only
    thing I've found to cure that is have an earlier brunch (10:30-11:00am)
    or don't eat at all.
    
    

    RE: .37
    
    The police report into this noted that people often become drowsy very
    quickly and without much warning.   It actually warned that people who
    think they are beyond such dozing off effects are usually the ones who
    keep on driving well beyond the recommended times.(2hrs max.)...and end
    up having the accidents themselves!
    
    Just because you have not suffered with drowsiness coming on quickly
    does not mean that you never will...and if you happen to be on a
    motorway the 1st time, you might never get to share the experience!!
    
    Nigel
                           

          <<< Note 1855.48 by LARVAE::IVES_J "Bad Karma in the UK" >>>
                           -< it's all down to food >-

    I have often found myself nodding off particularly after lunch and late
    at night.
    
    
Jonathan! I'm surprised at you. How can anyone possible fall asleep while
listening to Debbie's wonderfully sexy voice. Mind you, that only accounts
for 15 minutes - then there's the rest of the afternoon to worry about ...

RE: Earlier note about stopping for a breath of fresh air on the hard
shoulder being illegal. I couldn't give a flying fart what the law says.
The law and Common Sense only occasionally have something in common.

Dougie

    Would that be Debbie Gibson per chance Dougshire?
    
    Gary.
    
    PS. Sorry to call you that; I forgot this isn't our conference :-)

   .50�RE: Earlier note about stopping for a breath of fresh air on the hard
   .50�shoulder being illegal. I couldn't give a flying fart what the law says.
   .50�The law and Common Sense only occasionally have something in common.
   
   In this case it does, as this hard shoulder of a motorway is a very
   dangerous place, although I can't find a reference to the current
   accident rate there. It's mainly to stop people from stopping for a
   picnic, etc but I believe that a number of accidents occur when 
   vehicles in the l.h. lane wander onto the hard sholder.

   
    
    >    ... but I believe that a number of accidents occur when 
    >    vehicles in the l.h. lane wander onto the hard sholder.
    
    Probably being driven by people who didnt sto for a rest and fell
    asleep at the wheel.
    
    

    Have you ever driven down the motorway and noticed how many cars but
    mainly lorries, drift from the inside lane to being well on to the hard
    shoulder, and back again. It's frightening to thing what might hapeen
    if you break down on the motorway, let alone stop for a sleep. This is
    why you are meant to pull over as far as you can to the banking when
    you break down, and wait for assistance sat on the bank away from your 
    car. Unless you just want to end your life sat in your car asleep on
    the hard-shoulder.
    
    Neil

>    car. Unless you just want to end your life sat in your car asleep on
>    the hard-shoulder.
    
This is what happened to my god-mother's youngest daughter (they'd broken down)
Her car was swiped by a lorry.  She was in a coma for 2 weeks before they
switched the life-support systems off.

    
    I was told by a traffic cop that there are 20 deaths  a year in hard
    shoulder accidents in the UK.
    
    Ian.
    
    

    Falling asleep in the early afternoon is not necessarily to do with
    lunch:  it's a known physiological fact that humans naturally have two
    sleep periods each day - night-time and early afternoon.   Official
    advice I read recently was 'avoid driving in the early afternoon'.
    
    That said, I just don't eat big lunches if it is in any way possible to
    avoid them, because if I do I find it entirely impossible to stay
    awake, at the wheel, at the table, at the terminal, or wherever.
    
    Oh and yes, I did doze off at the wheel once, in about 1958, in
    Sydney Australia coming home from a party at around 4 or 5 am.  Luckily
    the Austin A55 stayed on the road until I came round.  (Do I get a
    prize for the most boring incident related so far?)
    
    Ken. 

re .-1

>    Falling asleep in the early afternoon is not necessarily to do with
>    lunch:  it's a known physiological fact that humans naturally have two
>    sleep periods each day - night-time and early afternoon.   Official
>    advice I read recently was 'avoid driving in the early afternoon'

I find my lowest point during normal waking hours is early evening 18:00-19:00
Usually after lunch - except when it has been particularly good - is not 
a problem. I have always since my student days found that its the early
evening time when I am most likely to fall asleep. Does this mean I should
not drive home after a hard day in the office? or better still, go home 
immediately after lunch :-)

	Dave

    re.57  Not to get off the subject entirely, but the after lunch theory
    fits to my experiences quite well.   Rather than make an effort to 
    stay awake, I take out an article I have titled "It's OK to Sleep
    in the Office", place it on my table, lean back and take a 15-20 minute
    snooze.   I find that this way I can still get something done during
    the rest of the day rather than waste it by trying to stay awake.  BTW,
    the article describes this physiological effect and states that an
    employee allowed to take a quick snooze is actually more productive for 
    the rest of the day.
    
    I often have experienced this in the car as well and will, without
    hesitation, pull over and grab a 15-20 minute blink.
    
    --Dale

    	I once fell asleep STANDING UP on a packed train, now THATS
    embarrassing!
    
    	The soloution to keeping awake on the motorway is simple.....
    	drive like hell for a mile or two, then spend the rest of your
    	journey glued to the rear view mirror watching for blue lights!
    
    	Seriously though, I have found that by stopping and taking some
    	vigorous exercise (no comments please) I can wake my self up
    	quite well....a quick run or 20 press ups do the trick!
    	No traffic cop will nick you for stopping on the hard-shoulder
    	in order to wake yourself up!
    	
    	Graham.

    �No traffic cop will nick you for stopping on the hard-shoulder
    �in order to wake yourself up!
    
    I think you'll find the official answer would be to leave the m'way at
    the next exit to stop and wake yourself up. I'd be most surprised if
    they agreed that thats a good enough reason to stop on the shoulder.
    
    Roy

    ....since ANY tip to stay awake may save a life I'll throw in my 0.02:
    I found that drinking a can of Dextro energy drink (don't know if
    available outside The Netherlands) helps a lot. It's a drink containing
    grape sugar (glucose,dextrose) that supposedly goes to your blood within
    six minutes. Almos all gasstations overhere have it, icecold. The
    alternative is a few tablets of sugar, ofcourse.

    I guess any other (sports)energy drink should have the same effect.

    Andr�

I wonder if we will ever be able to get hold of the American Jolt Coke or 
whatever it is called. I have heared that it is impressive stuff.

Simon

    PCW had a mention of someone inporting it an issue or two ago. I think
    that they mentioned prices ~�2.50 / can !
    

    The stuff I mentioned costs about $1.20-$1.40 a can. They are only 0.2
    liter, though.

    Andr� (Who's sometimes considering bringing them to work ;-))

    RE Jolt Coke.
    
    I thought this was phased out. I remember reading aboout Jolt a few
    years ago. I think it had twice the caffiene and twice the sugar of
    normal coke, I heard it failed as the trend was toward more healthy
    things NOT less healthy. Shame really. what I remember most was the
    slogan " Live 2 seconds into the future "
    
    RE Coke
    
    A colleague who is also a pilot says that the CEA has reccomended that
    pilots DO NOT drink diet coke  before a flight as it may cause
    drowziness !!! Makes you think

    
    I heard (about 6 months ago) that Jolt was now available in the UK.
    
    However it was about �2 a can and only available at a few night clubs,
    as I recall.
    
    Mark

    Surely you can achieve the same effect by dropping a couple of Pro-Plus
    (essentially pure caffeine tablets), and washing them down with an
    ordinary Coke?
    
    Laurie.

    The trouble with stimulants like this is that they can let you down
    with the same speed with which they pick you up. Be carefull!
    
    Graham.

	Have one of those glucose tablets that are fruit-flavoured in tins.

	They work a treat, and are quite cheap.

	..........but don't spill them, the icing sugar stuff gets everywhere!

	Heather

	..........but don't spill them, the icing sugar stuff gets everywhere!
    
    I second that !
    
    Terry

    Well it sure looks like this is a common problem with most people out
    there, both inside and outside of our company.
    
    It would seem many people have their own cures or ways of overcoming
    drowsiness, however there are still quite a few (if this sample is
    anything to go by) who think it will never happen to them!!  - They are
    probably the most vulnerable!
    
    So, keep taking the forty winks (in appropriate stopping places), the
    pick-U-up drinks, sweets, chocolate, fresh air and of course the
    country lanes and stay awake at the wheel.
    
    And never think it couldn't creep up on you......fast!
    
    Nigel

	A tale:

	On Monday night this week I got food poisoning (thanks a bunch,
	Mr Sainsbury). On Tuesday, after a fairly sleepless night, I
	drove from Suffolk to Newbury. After 100 miles or so, I started
	to feel drowsy. After a few miles more I realised I was in danger
	of falling asleep at the wheel/blacking out/whatever, so I
	pulled on to the hard shoulder to avoid causing an accident.
	Within what seemed like nanoseconds I was being interrogated by
	the Hertfordshire gendarmerie and issued with a parking ticket
	by some spotty youth in what was obviously a hired uniform and
	a stolen police car, who seemed to be of the opinion that it is
	better to cause a multiple pile-up rather than break a motorway
	parking restriction. Needless to say I shall be writing an E_F-
	style communique to the Hertfordshire constabulary.

	JJ.

    JJ
    
    Last Saturday's Times had a report of a judge who ruled that it was
    legal for a driver to stop on a motorway hard shoulder for a sleep.
    
    The judge at Guildford Crown Court allowed an appeal against a fixed
    penalty conviction.  The driver had been given a #16 ticket after
    police found him asleep at the wheel on the M25.  He did not pay the
    fine but appeared before magistrates at Woking, who increased the fine
    to #60.
    
    The driver told the judge that he had not felt tired when he passed the
    previous junction, but that suddenly he became unable to continue his
    journey, so rather than risk an accident, he stopped.
    
    Paraphrased without permission, The Times, October 17th 1992.
    
    Sue
    

	Damn, posted my tenner off to the fixed penalty clerk yesterday...

	JJ.

    I once fell asleep in mid-sentence - woke up with my wife hitting me to
    wake me up.  This was on the M4, in the fast lane, at about 6:00 pm.
    
    If I'm ever queried about stopping on the hard shoulder (which I never
    have been), prepared excuse runs something like "It was overheating,
    officer, really into the red.  I've been waiting for it to cool down, I
    must have dropped off....."
    
    Richard