Conference terri::cars_uk

this is because the new 5 (clio) is more upmarket than the current one
so the base 5's will remain alongside the new clio's

    I don't know if it can be done, but shouldn't this note be renamed
    to include "clio" in the title as that is what its about ?
    
    Also, if the R5 range is being replaced shortly I would think it
    unlikely they would be running the old-style turbo with it.
    
    Do you mean the R5 turbo will have the new shape ?
    
    Roy

    Sorry about the title but it should have been an answer to note 256.n.
    
    As I said my local Renault garage told me they would be running the old
    style turbo alongside "Clio" as the performance version would'nt be 
    available for 12 months.
        As this months edition of "CAR" says it should be available along
    with the rest of the range as of March 1st 1991 I suspect this was
    just sales talk after all.
    
    
    Regards martin

>>        As this months edition of "CAR" says it should be available along
>>    with the rest of the range as of March 1st 1991 I suspect this was
>>    just sales talk after all.

performance variants of many models don't appear for quite some time after
the 'ordinary' ones; look at the delay between the launch of the new fiesta
to the XR2i version... such a delay seems to be quite long for Renault; is 
the sports version of the 19 available yet?


...art

    re .4
    
    The sports version of the Renault 19 is ... not a sports car. It
    weighs 1100 kilos, has a nice comfortable ride for 4 people, good
    brakes, etc but with its 1764cc 16v engine (max bhp 140) is outclassed
    by all sorts of low-end machinery. Here in France the Renault 19
    16v sells for over FF110000 + extras. The Peugeot 306GTI16 and the VW
    Golf GTI 16 or G60 are better buys.

RE: .5;

Maybe that is why they are taking time releasing it.

Mark.

    Re .0
    
    Martin,
    See note 256.433 & .434, Greg reckons that his local renault dealer
    says they are phasing the turbo out shortly. I've also heard that
    they are now only available in white and met. grey.
    
    Anyone know different ?
    
    Royston

    See the main problem with the turbo vs multivalve is: exhaust emissions
    
    As far as Renault and Peugeot are concerned they are putting all
    their eggs into the 16v basket. Getting the turbo engines clean
    is much more expensive.

I think Patrick may have hit the nail on the head....


Greg

    Thanks Greg.
    
    The other side of the problem is that the 16v engines don't compare
    with the turbos in terms of muscle. On one end the turbos have a
    LOT of torque at all rpms (given the turbine blows) and the 16v
    have their horsepower only at high rpm with poor torque for 80%
    of the range.
    
    Therefore a 140bhp 5GTT is NOT equivalent to 140bhp CLIO 16.
    
    Interesting to watch is the enormous work and innovation that a
    lot of manufacturers are developing today to make multivalve engines
    work like turbocharged ones. Long stroke engines (more torque) and
    variable timing are the 1st attempts. 
    
    Honda just came out with the VTEC system on the 1600cc CIVIC/CRX and 
    on the 3ltr NSX.
    
    At the same time Maserati have released their latest 222SE biturbo.
    
    Both the NSX and the Biturbo are equipped with a catalytic converter,
    they have totally opposed characteristics : the NSX has a lot more
    horsepower, the Biturbo has a lot more torque (and flexibility).
    In all acceleration tests the Biturbo is ahead of the NSX.

    Only available in White and metallic ????
    
    Funny you should say that, When I first put in a quote to replace 
    my own 5GT with a scheme one back in April the quote for Black got 
    turned down, no reason was given except the fleet company could'nt
    supply it in that colour.
    	So I put in a quote for a non-metallic i.e RED. This was accepted
    and the order placed.
    	Three weeks after this date I receive a phone call saying "we are
    very sorry but if you want this model it will have to be in WHITE"
    	
    	So it looks like they had a White car to get rid of or its only
    available in two colours I.e white and tungsten.
    
    
    Regards_Martin_whos_glad_to_have_29_months_of_lease_left
    
    

    Snap,
    I ordered a Red one, only to be told some time later that there
    wern't any red ones left anywhere, and it would have to be White
    (=more dosh), or silver.
    
    Rich (silver-turbot-owner-for-11-more-days-sob)

    re .12
    
    Rich, if you're after a red one, there is one on vtx available for
    takeover that is 6 months old. I had it over last weekend.
    
    Royston, (very tempted to have it myself - there is no other car
              that drives like a R5GTT on God's green earth ! )
    

    Royston, sorry, the problem is I've got one but cant take it with
    me when I leave (the country) ! ;-)
    
    Rich
    
    (However if anyones intersted I'll leave the keys in it and.....)

Well,

I'm CONFUSED......


I ordered a BLACK one to be told there was none in the country and I
could only have a RED one!!!


Greg

    re: .14
    
    Rich, can you mail or call me about your car I tryed mailing you but i
    think your quota is used up.
    
    I might be interested in it.
    
    Roy x7833 3272

    Like Graham, I ordered a black R5GTT against a quote on VTX in March,
    was told that black was no longer made but that there was a red one
    left. It was one of the last red ones to be made. Once the remaining
    black and red stocks in the country had been sold, only the tungsten
    grey, white, or Raider blue were available. Seems a strange marketing
    decision to make, when apparently red and black are the most popular
    colours!
    
    Alison

    Sorry, that last note should have said Greg, not Graham!
    

    
    Anyone want to make me an offer on a nice RED Renault 5 GT Turbo?
    
    Mark :^)
    
    

RE: .19

Keep it as an investment!

I rang DTM in Swindon (Suppliers of my current GTT), and they said that they
will take last orders in October. I want any colour so long as it ISN'T black.
Black is much too difficult to keep clean.

Taking on an existing quote isn't a bad idea.

Mark.

Mark J,

So you're going for another turbo then?

Greg

re .18  Well spotted, thank you.

    So lets recap, Renault dealers have so far said -
    
    o The turbo will still be available when the clio is out.
    o Turbo's are no longer made/going out of production shortly.
    o "Better order right now John, it'll be too late next week"
    o They are only available in white/red/tungssten but definately NOT
      black.
    
    Can anybody add to this ?
    
    Roy
    

    
    Re .22
    
    o All dealers will tell you anything they think might sell you a car!
    
    Mark

    I couldn't agree more, dealers will say anything to shift a car.
    
    Guess the only real solution is to phone Renault UK and maybe put
    some of the fears that we'll be losing this much enjoyed car shortly.
    
    Anybody got a number.
    
    Regards Martin

    
    Black looks best when its dirty.
    
    Jeff.
    

    Latest from our local Renault dealer:
    
    Only the Campus, Prima TR and GTT are still being manufactured, GTT in
    Tungsten and White only.
    
    The dealers are all off to Geneva this Thursday/Friday for UK preview
    of the Clio range - maybe they'll have more info on the Clio next week.
    
    Sue
    

    According to "performance car" the clio range will be out in 1.4 and
    1.7 form in March '91. The 16v (the only one of interest in my opinion)
    1.8 GT version will be available in May.

    Apparently its "quicker and more lively" than the 16v Renault 19.
    It will "effectively replace the 5GT Turbo."

    - Roy (who couldn't be bothered to wait and see and has just ordered a
    Fiesta RS Turbo)

    I saw a 16v Clio on the M27 yesterday. Funny I didn't
    think the 16v was going to be released until next month.

    I thought it looked rather plain. The only visable differences being
    the wider wheels, a discreet '16v' badge on the back and a massive power
    bulge in the bonnet.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not into go faster stripes and things but
    unlike the 5GTT and 19 16v I thought it lacked character.

    Still, I look forward to trying one out sometime to see how it compares
    with my RS Fiasco.

    - Roy

    There is a picture of the Clio 16v in World Sports Cars. Looked pretty
    much the same, except for the aforementioned bulge on the bonnet and
    apparently it gets slightly wider towards the rear. The magazine rated
    the 19 16v and 5GTT higher......in fact they rated the 19 No.1.
    
    (��)Munce.

    Octobers CAR compares the clio 16v with the pug 1.9, MX3 and MR2.
    
    The Clio actually comes out as they're favourite car, although yet
    again performance figures (0-60 and in gear acceleration) are worse
    than the 5gt and the ageing pug 1.9. that said and done its a great car
    and great value at about 12,500 when compared with price tags of all
    the other new hot hatch arrivals.
    
    Martin

12000 quid for a Renault 5 replacement is "great value"! I must be getting old
and reactionary - I remember my wife buying a new R5 TL for �3,300 in 1982.

I've just spoken to a colleague who is interested in a Clio 16V "sport pack" -
power assisted steering, remote control central locking and alloy wheels etc.
He says that (in Switzerland) it is SFr 23,000 = �8,745.

When I come back to the UK, I think that I'll bring a nice new LHD car - and
blow the consequences of reselling it!

Cheers

Steve

    
    Steve,
    
    Bring yourself an Integrale or an M3 and you won't have to worry
    about resale value too much.
    
    Of course, you'll also make me very envious! :^)
    
    Mark

    Steve,
         The "sports pack" that you mention is standard equipment on the
    British spec car plus a sunroof I think.
    
    Martin

    To go down a rathole here...
    
    The BMW garage up here (France nr Geneva) said that they'd stopped
    making M3's now that the new series has arrived, and that it'd be
    impossible to order one. Can you still get them in the UK?
    
    
    				Lewis.

    
    I had two hours test drive with 16 V CLIO, and I think driving it
    at 7000 rpm to hard corners is pure fun! Great handling and good
    engine. Maybe I go for it when getting next company car.
    
    Hannu

    Called by the local Renault Dealer yesterday and to my amazement there
    was a 16v Clio in Sports Blue sitting on the forecourt looking very
    purposful, Only problem is that had no facts and figures on paper, like
    what colour it came or options only what he new himself ,Apparently 
    it only came the day before and although very nice for an extra 500
    quid you can have the 19 16v.
    
    martin
    
    p.s. hated that "sports cloth" they've used and as unlike the 19 theres
    no option to have leather seats your stuck with em'.

    Another couple of things to consider about the Clio 16V are that you
    don't get height adjustable driver's seat or steering wheel, no trip
    computer, and only a popup sunroof. You do get as standard the remote
    control stereo which is a nice touch. 
    
    Cheers,
    
    Spike

    Wow, the R19 16v is only �500 more expensive than the Clio.  Sounds
    like a serious pricing slip on Renault's part.
    
    My question is, why buy the Clio?  Slightly better acceleration, but
    less equipment and noisier. Does anybody know better?

    It does get a new anti-theft device according to the guy on the Renault
    stand at Motorfair. Some sort of engine isolation switch that only the
    owner and the dealer know where its located. He said something about it
    there being some way of detecting if someone was trying to bypass it
    and if that is the case they would have to type in a PIN number in the
    engine bay - get it wrong three times and it won't move until a dealer
    sorts it out.
    
    According to the Times yesterday they reckon that the 19 16v and the 21
    Turbo are going to get the same device in the future too. I wonder if
    they'll fit one to mine when its serviced - fat chance!
    
    Anyway it sounds like a step in the right direction - now if only they
    put an alarm in as standard too.
    
    Cheers,
    
    Spike. 
         

    I had chance to check out the clio 16v over the weekend. I didn't take
    the opportunity to drive it as I just wanted to know what the driving
    position was like.
    
    I was very impressed with the amount of room for the driver. There was
    plenty of headroom, and with the seat right back the legroom is the
    best for any small car I been in. The downside though is that the
    seat-back is not high enough. Even with the headrest extended, there
    would be no support for your head if you are a tall person (as I am).
    The Recaros in my RS are much better as they have a high headrest which
    could help avoid serious wiplash in the event of an accident.
    
    I look forward to driving one in the future.
    
    They are quite closly prived to the 19 16v. As that model is priced at
    around �800 on the lease scheme I would expect the clio 16v would be a
    little less at around �700ish. Anybody any knowledge of a recent quote ?
    
    Roy

	About 150 quid, get this in November..

							G.P

    Do I take it that you've had a quote for a 16v Clio for �150 ?
    
    Maybe you could enter the full spec as a reply to note 1538.
    
    Roy

    
    Does anyone out there actually OWN a Clio 16 valve? If so, what's
    the insurance cost?
    
    Mark