Conference terri::cars_uk

   What are the most powerful Deisel cars availible ?
    
    I ask this because our Volvo 760 Turbodeisel (It finally arived
    yesterday) has 129bhp.  It certainly does not feel like a Deisel,
    it pulls like a train even with a light throttle load.
    
    The only drawback is it is restricted to 80mph for the first 600
    miles.
    
    Grant

    Mercedes C111??? :-)
    
    Dave

    ..... absolute chicken feed compared to some of the Cummins, Rolls,
    Detroit Scania, Ford, (even Volvo!), Fiat, Renault mills in the
    big trucks.
    
    How does 450bhp and 1200ftlbs of torque at 1100 rpm sound?

    
    Re .7
    
    Don't forget Mercedes' V8 Twin-turbo diesels!
    
    Put one of those in a 450 SEL body and have the ulitmate Taxi! :^)
    
    Mark

    GM manufacture the most powerful production engine in any truck,
    it is 3,000 bhp, dont know the capacity.  The motor drives an electric
    generator, which in turn drives the wheels.  Aparently no gearbox could
    take the torque
    
    
    John

    
    If my memory serves me right the "truck " in question was one of
    thoe mammoth ore haulers used in the iron ore mines in remote places.
    The engine was really a Railway engine motor driving a either a
    generator for traction via 4 hub mounted electric motors or a b****Y
    big fan to cool resistors used to dump the back emf from the motors
    when they were used for regenerative braking.  

    re last few 
    
    I meant production car engines *NOT* trucks etc.
    
    Grant

In my Landrover is a PERKINS 4203, this is a 3.3 Lt Diesel, and has enough
torque to smash gear boxes if you aren't careful.

Simon

    Here in the US you can get full sized GM and Ford pickups with V8
    diesels.  The GM one is a 6.2 litre, but I don't any specs on it.
    
    Dave 

    
    I saw a tractor with 4 Merin engines out of Spitfires once; went
    like a dog until the man from Rolls-Royce told the owner that the
    carbs were set for 36,000 feet ........

    Re: .11  "not Trucks"
    
    But you specifically said it was a Volvo......
    
    :-)

Of the vehicles listed in "What Car?" (British monthly for our foreign readers)
the top 10 in terms of power to weight ratio are:

Citroen BX TGD Turbo Hatchback			4.64 bhp/cwt
Peugeot 405 GTD T 1.8 Saloon			4.34
Citroen BX TZD Turbo Hatchback			4.27
Citroen BX TZD Turbo Estate			4.27
Fiat Tipo 1.9 T.DS Hatchback			4.22
Volkswagen Jetta TD Saloon			4.19
Volkswagen Golf CL TD Hatchback			4.15
Citroen CX 25 TGD Turbo Safari Estate		4.12
Peugeot 405 GTD Turbo 1.8 Estate		4.09
Volvo 760 TD Estate				4.09

If you want the most HP then the answers are

Volvo 760 TD Estate				122 HP
Volvo 760 TD Saloon				122 
Citroen CX 25 TGD Turbo Safari Estate		120
Range Rover Turbo Diesel			119
Range Rover Vogue Turbo Diesel			119
Land Rover Discovery 200 TDi			111
Mercedes-Benz 300 D Saloon			109
Volvo 740 TD Saloon				109
Volvo 740 TD Estate				109
Toyota Land Cruiser GX				102
UMM Alter II Turbo Diesel			102 (a Portuguese Land Rover 
							competitor)

/. Ian .\

>>   <<< Note 868.16 by BRABAM::PHILPOTT "Col I F 'Tsingtao Dhum' Philpott" >>>

>>Of the vehicles listed in "What Car?" (British monthly for our foreign readers)
>>the top 10 in terms of power to weight ratio are:

>>Citroen BX TGD Turbo Hatchback			4.64 bhp/cwt
>>Peugeot 405 GTD T 1.8 Saloon			4.34
>>Citroen BX TZD Turbo Hatchback			4.27
    
    ????	The BX TGD/TZD use the same engine, have identical power
    outputs, and according to the manufactureres spec weigh virtually the
    same!.
    
    How on earth does this list give such a difference?.
    
>>Citroen BX TZD Turbo Estate			4.27
    More understandable, this is a heavier car being an estate.
    
    Richard

I think it's a "What Car" error: they list both at 90 bhp, but list the 
TGD Turbo hatchback at 19.4 cwt and the TZD Turbo hatchback at 21.1 cwt.

Citroen list both at 2260 lbs (20.1 cwt).

I'll fix my database and report back (I've got the entire database - complete 
for every car over �10000 - in DECdecision)

/. Ian .\

Of the vehicles listed in "What Car?" (British monthly for our foreign readers)
the top 10 in terms of power to weight ratio are:

Citroen BX TGD Turbo Hatchback			4.48 bhp/cwt
Citroen BX TZD Turbo Hatchback			4.48
Peugeot 405 GTD T 1.8 Saloon			4.34
Citroen BX TZD Turbo Estate			4.27
Fiat Tipo 1.9 T.DS Hatchback			4.22
Volkswagen Jetta TD Saloon			4.19
Volkswagen Golf CL TD Hatchback			4.15
Citroen CX 25 TGD Turbo Safari Estate		4.12
Peugeot 405 GTD Turbo 1.8 Estate		4.09
Volvo 760 TD Estate				4.09
Mercedes-Benz 300 D Saloon			4.05
Volvo 760 TD Saloon				4.05

If you want the most HP then the answers are

Volvo 760 TD Estate				122 HP
Volvo 760 TD Saloon				122 
Citroen CX 25 TGD Turbo Safari Estate		120
Range Rover Turbo Diesel			119
Range Rover Vogue Turbo Diesel			119
Land Rover Discovery 200 TDi			111
Mercedes-Benz 300 D Saloon			109
Volvo 740 TD Saloon				109
Volvo 740 TD Estate				109
Toyota Land Cruiser GX				102
UMM Alter II Turbo Diesel			102 (a Portuguese Land Rover 
							competitor)

/. Ian .\

    Can anyone make any comments on whether a diesel engine can adjust its
    own tick-over? A month ago (or was it two?) I thought that my engine
    was idling too fast. After consulting the 'expert' (thanks for the
    piccys Richard) on how to reduce the engine speed, the engine appeared
    to settle back to its original speed (~980 rpm).
    
    Now, however, it has since increased its idling to ~1000 rpm. Not a great
    increase, I will admit, but it is noticable. I also learnt last night of
    another diesel engine idling too fast. Both are Peugeot engines.
    
    Any comments anyone?
    
    Confused of Thatcham and Ferney!

    Martin, Diesels do in fact CONSTANTLY monitor and adjust their revs.
    
    Apparantly, given a fixed air flow and a fixed amount of fuel they will
    actually run away!. Thus, your right foot/the throttle back-stop gives
    a 'level', and the fuel unit has a centrifugal valve that try's to
    hold the engine to that 'level'.
    
    Several of us have seen a strange phenomena of a Lucas CAV supplied XUD
    engine at constant speed (e.g. on the motorway) suddenly accelerating
    by itself.
    
    You could have a sticky thingy in the fuel distribution unit.
    
    p.s. when it's cold try driving slowly. then lift off the accelerator
    without de-clutching, the car will slow right down then the
    distribution unit will take over and speed back up to a pre-set fast
    idle !!
    
    Richard

.21�                      the car will slow right down then the
.21�distribution unit will take over and speed back up to a pre-set fast
.21�idle !!

    Yes Richard,  I seem to experience this every time I need to slow down
    'quicker than normal'; usually when approaching (or moving in) a queue
    of traffic.  It was interesting the first time - I thought I was going
    to accelerate  into the back of the car  in front of me,  particularly
    when my right foot was covering the brake pedal! :-(

    Thanks for the explanation.

    Martin.

    Interesting topic, and thanks for the technical report, Richard! Just
    for the record, I was one of those who has experienced the "running
    away" feeling with the Lucas system on my old BX19RD but I have never
    had it happen at all with the turbo (presumably it's the Bosch (?)
    system).
    
    I actually experienced a "runaway" diesel lorry many years ago when I
    was a pump jockey at a service station at Hemel Hempstead (just of the
    M1). I thought he was revving it up a bit as he pulled onto the
    forecourt but the silly so and so parked it right by the pumps in an
    emergency stop, jumped out and ran off! The mechanic, brave sod, stuck
    his head inside the thing and calmly proceeded to hacksaw the fuel line
    until it eventually stopped! I was sure it was going to blow itself all
    the way to Birmingham. It took me a looong while after that to trust
    diesels again but they are infinitely more sophisticated now than then.
    
    Colin

    What will 1/2 a tank of 4* mixed with 1/2 a tank of Diesel do to
    a Turbodiesel engine ?
    
    You guest it my dad put about 7 gallons of 4* into the Turbodiesel
    :-(
    
    Grant

    In the middle of a very very cold spell, it might be okay, but I
    would drain the tank and start over with a full load of diesel.
    
    The gasoline will burn much quicker and hotter than the diesel and
    can do some real damage to the engine.
    
    Dave 

    re-1
    
    Thanks I think the petrol has not had a chance to get into the engine
    because there was some diesel already in the tank.  Unless the 2
    fuels seporate like oil and water.
    
    Grant

    I'm not sure if they would seperate or not.  Gasoline is more refined
    than diesel, if that would indicate which whould float to the top.
    
    You should also drain the fuel filter and then refill it with diesel.
    I would guess that a symptom of gas in the fuel would be a sudden
    racing of the engine.  If you experience this, kill it real quick
    and then flush all the lines to be extra safe.
    
    Hopefully you've caught it early enough so all you have to do is
    drain the tank.
    
    What use whould a 50/50 mixture of diesel and petrol be good for?
    Especially 14 gallons of it....  A little at a time would help prevent
    fuel line freeze up in the dead of winter.
    
    Dave 

    re-1
    
    I don't think that any petrol has got into the engine yet.  I have
    told my mum not to drive the car until the system is flushed out.
    
    Fingers crossed that the petrol has not reached the engine.
    
    Grant

>    What use whould a 50/50 mixture of diesel and petrol be good for?
>    Especially 14 gallons of it....  A little at a time would help prevent
>    fuel line freeze up in the dead of winter.


Nah! Use it for the barbie. When its hot you'll never taste the differance.

Dave

    Well the garage came and picked up the car yesterday afternoon and
    drained the tank + changed the filter.  We collected the car last
    night..
    
    Grant

    
    Glad to hear you had it drained. FYI, petrol will cause a diesel to
    knock. Also you have to be careful draining the mix, as the petrol
    will have made the tank gases explosive...
    
    Bi||.

    I think this question has been asked elsewhere, but after searching for
    an hour or so, I can't find it, so ...
    
    Is putting Castrol GTX (or any 20/50 oil) into a diesel engine going to
    do any harm, or should 'Diesel' oil be used?
    
    Martin (hoos engine is in desperate need of an oil change)

    
    You should only use oil especially designed for Diesel engines - these
    oils are much higher in detergent than petrol engine oils.
    

    If you change the oil every 3k miles, it probably doesn't matter much
    what type you put in.  I used to use Castrol GTX 20w-50 in my 1500cc VW
    and changed it at least every 3k.  If you plan to go longer (5-7k)
    between changes, then you might want to look at detergent levels.
    
    Dave

.20�Now, however, it has since increased its idling to ~1000 rpm. Not a great
.20�increase, I will admit, but it is noticable.

    On inspecting the engine compartment (yesterday), for something com-
    pletely different,  I noticed  that one of the  locking nuts  on the
    throttle cable  had worked loose,  thereby causing the idle position
    of the cable to change. All is now back to normal.

    Martin.

    I followed a lorry today that proclaimed on the back:
    
    Perkins (somethingorother) Diesel
    
    100 mpg	100 mph
    
    Anyone know what vehicle might use such and engine?
    

Perkins manufacture the 2.0 litre diesel engine that Rover use in the
Montego and Maestro, and at one time they used this advertising slogan.

The Turbo will do 100 mph in the Montego, and if you drive at 30 mph in 5th,
it will do 100 mpg.

I think they call it the Prima Diesel, or something like that.

They also apparantly sell the engine to Volvo, who fit it to some of their
models in Scandinavia.

It's based on the 2.0 litre "O" series petrol engine, that originally
appeared in the Princess circa 1977.

It's such a good engine, that Rover are going to buy the PSA diesel engine
for the 200 and 400 models....

Peter.

P.S., it also breaks the current emmision regulations, but the guvnment
got a "waiver" from the EEC for it, for some reason or other.

    Volvo Scandinavia use the 6 cylinder Volkswagen diesel from the
    LT-40 van.
    
    Volvo Netherlands is using the Renault diesel (noisy!)
    
    Hans