Conference terri::cars_uk

    Please verify/debunk what I believe to be a correct assumption:
    
    Registrations are bought/sold as (fundamentally) vanity accessories.
    Looking in "Classic and Sportscar", I see some offered at phenominal
    prices - one is listed at �22,000!  There are several others listed 
    for more than �19,000!  This is just for the registration number???
    
    Cheers...Gary

    I`ll sell mine for �20,000 to anybody if they want it!!!
    
    A 355 SYS
    
    
    Ian.

    My daughter owns a now defunct Allegro, registration ALF 932S.  When
    she couldn't sell it as a going concern, I suggested contacting one of
    the registration transfer agencies.
    
    She is now 200 pounds better off, and still with a car to sell for
    spares or scrap.
    
    Jeff.

Re.36:

You are correct. People pay silly amounts of money for registration plates.

/Dave.

	Bit different over here - my wife just paid her $20 to have the plates
	of her choice on the DECwreck.  AND she could choose whatever letters
	and/or numbers she wanted with the limitation only that it couldn't be
	obscene, provocative, lewd, or otherwise offensive, and, of course, if
	it hadn't already been issued!


	BTW, if anyone wants either DBC 512 or GEE 93, I have the original and
	new log-books for them in my name.

	Brian

    
    Forgive me if there's already a suitable note for for this but, if
    there is I can't find it !
    
    A friend owns a Ford Anglia, reg. TOP 318 - obviously this registration
    number is going to be worth something, the question is how much ? 
    
    And, given that it should be worth quite a bit, does anyone know of
    either a company or individual who would pay to have the vehicle made
    roadworthy/restored in order to get such a valuable registration....
    
    Graham

    >>Forgive me if there's already a suitable note for for this but, if
    >>there is I can't find it !
    
    You couldn't have found a MORE suitable note than 428.* Graham:
    
    `Cherished registration plates'
    I forgive you anyway.
    
    Phil Gill.

I know this isn't the right note, so please excuse me.  I saw a 70's Rolls 
Royce around here with a UK plate on the front - BLH 2nnS.  I was just 
wondering what year and region that maps to.  It's also RHD so it appears 
to be the proper plate for the car.

Dave

    Hello Dave, the 'S' on the end gives the age between Aug '77 - Jul '78.
    
    The 'LH' gives the area. I not sure about this but I think its the
    London area. I leave that for someone else to confirm this.
    
    Royston

On what I think is an early 60's Bentley sedan over here in Woodstock, GA.  
RHD and had no US plates on it.  What year does the plate map too?

Dave

    As far as I am aware there is no way of linking an age with a plate
    such as that. If one had a link to the DVLA that might be different,
    only police etc have that.
    
    Andrew

�    As far as I am aware there is no way of linking an age with a plate
�    such as that...
        
        Yes there is - I have a book!  Stay tuned.
        
        Ian.

So the X is like the Q in some manner?  The Q is for kit cars and imported 
cars right?  What does the X mean?

Dave

�So the X is like the Q in some manner?  The Q is for kit cars and imported 
�cars right?  What does the X mean?

        The X in this case has no particular meaning.  The current
        British scheme is "L 111 AAA" where L is the year letter (it
        will become M on the first of August), followed by three
        numbers and three letters.  

        In this scheme, a letter Q is given to any car whose actual
        age can't be proved (eg a kit or imported car).

        Prior to that the system was AAA 111 L, and before that was
        [A]AA 1[1[1]].   Got it?

	In all these schemes, the last two letters of the alphabetic
        part can be used to identify where the car was registered.
        Until 1963 you registered your car with your local authority.
        These were replaced by local taxation offices, and in 1974 the
        whole system was centralised in Swansea (Wales). However, the
        2 letter system is still adhered to.
        
        To answer your original question, MB is a Cheshire
        registration, and that authority issued XMB numbers between
        May 1956 and October 1962.
        
        Ian.

Thanks!

Dave

    Ian,
    
    Would you care to tell me whan LSB 9 was first used? I was lead to
    believe at the time I bought it that it was October 1963, which makes
    it more than a year *after* the 'A' plate prefix came in. I know there
    was some overlap, but I thought that it was all over within a year. I
    do know, having seen LSB 570 on an early Triumph Herald many years ago,
    that it is early 60s, but not exactly when.
    
    Thanks, Laurie.

	Forgive me for knowing, but I was a Local Authority Clerk in the Road
Fund Office for several months in a previous life ;^)

	Originally, each Local authority was allocated a single or series of
single or two letter sets for registering motor vehicles, which was to be given
along with a sequential number.  eg. London started out with A1 up to A9999 and
so on.

	When the one and two letter combinations ran out, a letter was to be
added to the front of the set and the limit of 6 characters was set, eg AAA123. 
When the prefix letter "A" ran out of combinations at each Local Authority
(independently), they started to use the prefix letter "B" and so on up to the
letter "Y"."  "I," "O," "Q" and "Z" were not used.  "I" was reserved for Irish
Authorities (at that time all Ireland was part of Great Britain!), "O" was not
used to avoid confusion between the letter and the number, "Q" was reserved for
"kit" cars (This may not have been the original purpose though, I don't know
that bit) and I can't remember why "Z" wasn't used.

	Most of the ?M* registrations belonged to Middlesex, so, probably this
number - XMB219 - was a Middlesex number.  Middlesex and Staffordshire were the
first to run out of three letter combinations, at which point it was decided by
Parliament (it needed a very hasty Act of Parliament!) to simply reverse the
positions of the alpha-numeric characters of registration number.  ie. instead
of ABC123, it became 123ABC.

	These ran out in 1963 in, surprise, surprise, Middlesex and
Staffordshire, whereupon, with another hasty Act of Parliament, it was decided
to add a suffix letter to the old six character number sets, ie. ABC123A, the
old three letter combinations continuing to be used in sequence as before, but
the Suffix letter to be used to denote the year of first registration.  When
this ran out, another hasty .... resulted in the format of number to become
A123ABC.  At some stage as mentioned by another Noter, the Local Authorities
lost the responsibilities and they finally ended up at Swansea - at which point
the original two letter combinations no longer refered to an area or Local
Authority and so, today, one cannot tell at a glance where a given number was
first registered.

	From all the above, I would strongly suggest that the number XMB219 was
first registered in 1962, but possibly in early 1963.

	For those interested in such invaluable data, I will say that I worked
in the "TAX" office in 19 mumble, mumble when I left school.

	Bit verbose, but I hope that gives a fairly complete history of this
subject.

				Malcolm. (phew!)

	I'm sure there is a whole book to be written about the history of
	the UK vehicle registration system! I think -.1 is pretty accurate 
	bar a couple of points:

�	Most of the ?M* registrations belonged to Middlesex, so, probably this
�	number - XMB219 - was a Middlesex number.  

	M, MA, MB are Cheshire; MI Wexford; MJ Bedfordshire; MN Isle of Man;
	MO Berkshire; MR, MW Wiltshire; MS Sterlingshire; MX Belfast. Anything
	else is London.	XMB (as stated) is a Cheshire number.


� the original two letter combinations no longer refered to an area or Local
� Authority and so, today, one cannot tell at a glance where a given number was
� first registered.

	The DVLA still allocate the letters as if they had been issued by the 
	local licencing office.  My 9 month old car was supplied by a dealer
	in Hertfordshire and has an RO registration.

	Ian.

	A correction to my original reply re XMB 219

.49�        ...  MB is a Cheshire
.49�        registration, and that authority issued XMB numbers between
.49�        May 1956 and October 1962.

	I misread my book�. nnnXMB were issued in May 1956.  XMBnnn 
	were issued in October 1962.

    
.51�    Would you care to tell me whan LSB 9 was first used? I was lead to
.51�    believe at the time I bought it that it was October 1963, which makes
.51�    it more than a year *after* the 'A' plate prefix came in. I know there
.51�    was some overlap, but I thought that it was all over within a year. I
.51�    do know, having seen LSB 570 on an early Triumph Herald many years ago,
.51�    that it is early 60s, but not exactly when.

	You were not misled -  LSB nnn numbers were issued in Argyll in 
	October 1963. The overlap depended on the authority. Those with a 
	lower volume (and I bet Argyll was one) didn't start using suffix
	letters for several years.

	Ian.

�"Where's It From, When Was It Issued"  Noel Woodall. ISBN 0 85184018 3

    Many thanks!
    
    Incidentally, I agree with the previous noter that the local two letter
    combinations still apply. 
    
    Cheers, Laurie.

Yes, you can get VAX from Pontypridd!

    What about DEC and DAV (I really fancy the No plate DAV 1D)
    
    Which counties were they issued from?
    
    Dave

>    What about DEC and DAV (I really fancy the No plate DAV 1D)
>    
>    Which counties were they issued from?

	EC is Westmorland.  AV is Aberdeenshire.  The only suffix used
	with DAV was C in June 1965, so the closest you can get is DAVIC!

	Actually, the DVLA regularly auctions off interesting previously
	unissued registrations, and it's a near certainity that they've 
	already made a lot of money out of DAV1D.

	A couple of people have asked me about the book I mentioned. 
	It appears it is no longer in print, although the author, Noel 
	Woodall, does have a book about cherished numbers which retails
	at �24 (�23.50 more than I paid for mine!)

	Ian.

    In Aberdeen, you will find RG, RS, SA.... but you will not find AV.  As
    this is not an Aberdeen registration.
    
    
    8*)

Is there any way to track down past owners of a car given the license plate 
number?  Someone on the net would like to find the person who imported a 
Pontiac Firebird (1970 I think) that ended up with the plate 'UTW 119R'.

Thanks
Dave

    Dave,
    
    I don't think 'Joe Public' can get this info which would be kept by the
    DVLC.
    
    However just for the record the 'R' indicates it was registered in the
    UK between Aug '76 and Aug '77. The system is different now though as
    the reg will reflect the original year of registration if this can be
    proved or if not it will get a dreaded 'Q' plate.
    
    Royston

        The registered owner of the number can write to the DVLA in
        Swansea and ask for the history. You get back photocopies of
        all the documentation on record, e.g. old log books etc.
        
        Ian.

    Any details? Is there a special form/department/address?
    
    Laurie$LSB9

    DVLA
    Swansea SA6 7JL
    
    will do for a start, or phone 0792 72151

    Another query if that's OK,  HUV 16C, registered December
    1965, and I don't know where 'UV' suffix is from.
    
    FWIW, and if anyone's reading   the number plate is attached to my
    latest acquisition (wait for it !) a 1965 Lambretta Li150 Golden
    Special. The guy (Mike Karslake) that ran the Lambretta Preservation
    Society died a couple of years back and they decided to auction off the
    collection  of 100 original and restorable scooters. As the auction was
    just west of Okehampton, Devon, about 40 miles from me I couldn't
    resist and picked up this restorable one for �320. If that seems a lot
    bear in mind that a running and good condition 1967 SX200 went for
    �1250 ! I reckon on a couple of years tinkering and tidying to get mine
    up and running and then it's back on the road on a scooter for the
    first time in 7-8 years, great and NO I will not be wearing a parka !
    (I was a scooterist, not a mod !)
    
    Thanks for any help, if no-one ever talks to me again I'll know I've
    upset the biking community !
    
    	Euan 

        'UV' is a London registration.
        
        McRocker.

    
    Talking plates....
    
    anyone out there called Roy who wants an F plate -  F936 ROY
    
    willing to swap for any F or personalised plate.
    
    Roy to pay for the transfer.
    
    
    Gary.
    
    0344 723823 (onsite @dell)

    Gary
    
    Try contacting one of the places that buy and sell cherished plates.
    They should pay for the transfer, issue you another F plate 
    and give you a few hundred quid.
    
    Royston
    
    PS Looking for ROY 570N myself :-)

    
    Royston,
    
    I'm trying to save the cost of a phone call.
    
    
    Gary

    "I'm trying to save the cost of a phone call."
    
    Dell hasn't changed your natural inclinations then, Gary?
    
    Keep smilin'

    re .67
    
    Out of interest I checked up on this and to swap plates the cost
    is �160 (2 x �80) transfer fee.
    
    Royston

    Hi!,
    
        I used to own one of the first MR2's into Australia and had a
    Victorian number plate of 'MRTWO'. This cost AUS$ 250. I'm in New South
    Wales now and a similar plate, where you have full choice of letters
    and numbers costs AUS$ 300 per year. For $150 flat fee you can choose 3
    letters, 2 number and 1 letter.
    
    I put this combo through MS Bookshelf dictionary with a pattern of:-
    
        ???oo? (i.e. o=0)
        ???ii? (i.e. i=1)
        ???ee? (i.e. e=3) etc
    
    It came up with some interesting results such as
    
        CUR50R (CURSOR)
        NUD15T (NUDIST) (which we are)
        REB00T (REBOOT)
    
    and some others.
    In the end we went for REB00T since CURSOR had already been taken and
    NUS15T was a bit to much of an advertisement.
    
    The point to all this is that BOOKSHELF is a great way to find numbers and 
    you can use it for U.K. type plates since they are of a similar format.
    
    Cheers
    Anthony Greenan

    Anyone seen the plate ROV4 ?
    
    My dad had it on a Morris Minor which he bought for measly money (many
    years ago, of course).
    
    He eventually sold it for something like �50. The moggy then came into
    the possession of the managing directory of Rover (or some such high-up
    bod, I can't remember). He re-built and fully restored the moggy and
    gave it to his daughter, who promptly drove it all around Europe and
    then wrote it off.
    
    The plate was last seen on some high-up Rover executive's car. To think
    my dad could have kept this. They had ROV1, 2 and 3 if I remember
    rightly, and ROV 4 just topped them off.... I haven't forgiven him to
    this day ;-) !!
    
    I wonder where it is now........?

Someone around here has an intersting collection of Rolls and Bentleys.  
Monday I saw a 2 door convertible, early 60's Bentley - reg number 236 LNX, 
with no US plates.

At least twice a week I see the same guy in some sort of Rolls, usually a 
newer one (70's up) but once in awhile in an older one.  Maybe he'll notice 
me when I get the Isetta on the road!

Dave