Conference 7.286::sports_90

    Gottfreid (sp??) reportedly fired in Pittsburgh...

    re -1
    
    
    its been done. Gottfried is out of there......
    
    
    strong rumours of a new coach is ..... Mike Dikta

    Pitt wanted him to resign, he wouldn't, so they fired him!
    Rumor has it that he probably was going to go to Kentucky anyway.
    
    This should speed up the process!
    
    Bob V.
    

GTE Academic All-Americans

(selected by Colelge Sports Information Directors of America.  Players must
be starters or key reserves and carry a minimum cumulative grade average of 
3.2 on a 4.0 scale.)

University Division

First Team

Offense

QB	Gerry Gdowski, Nebraska, 3.56, accounting
RB	Thomas Frooman, Citadel, 3.75, business administration
	Fred Wittingham, BYU, 3.24, psychology
WR	Chris Baniszeswki, Northern Arizona, 3.85, political science/pre-law
	John Jackson, USC, 3.30, business finance
TE	Jeremy Garvey, Colgate, 3.48, political science
L	Ted Ashburn, Ball State, 3.67, chemistry
	Bruce Brineman, Purdue, 5.67/6.00, industrial technology
	Dan Hackman, Illinois State, 3.68, business administration
	Joseph Staysniak, Ohio State, 3.49, marketing
	Jake Young, Nebraska, 3.39, finance
K	Jason Hanson, Washington State, 3.79, pre-med

Defense

L	Don Davey, Wisconsin, 3.67, mechanical engineering
	Kelly Fletcher, Furman, 3.39, accounting
	Doug Kley, Duke, 3.45, electrical engineering
	Glover Lawrence, Yale, 3.51, history
LB	Pat Jackson, Bowling Green, 4.00, business
	Michael McGowan, Montana, 3.97, business management
	Chris Roper, Furman, 3.67, physics
DB	David Haugh, Ball State, 3.57, sports journalism
	Stacy Russell, Mississippi State, 3.57, general business administrtion
	Todd Sandroni, Mississippi, 3.57, pharmacy
	Michael Thorson, Army, 3.99, economics
	Mike Welch, Baylor, 3.71, computer science
P	Brent Herbel, Minnesota, 3.26, biology/pre-med


Some of these are pretty good players, like Joseph Staysniak of Ohio State is
a all-Big Ten selection, and John Jackson of USC is probably all Pac-10 also.

So by schools, the following schools placed two players each:  Nebraska, 
Ball State and Furman.


By conference, in order:
[I think Illinois State, Bowling Green and Ball State are all in the MAC,
right, if so they tie the Big Ten with 4 also!]
Big Ten		4	(Purdue, Ohio State, Wisconsin, Minnesota)

(Go Big Ten!!)

[Are both Mississippi and Mississippi State in the SWC?  If so they have two 
also]
Big Eight	2	(Nebraska)
MAC		2	(Ball State)
Pac 10		2	(USC, Washington State)

ACC		1	(Duke)
Ivy League	1	(Yale)
WAC		1	(BYU)
SEC		1	(Baylor)

Independent: Army.

What conferences??  Furman, Citadel, Northern Arizona, Colgate, Montana.

    
    The rumor around here is that Mike Shanahan will be the next Kentucky
    head coach.
    

GTE Academic All-Americans
By conference, in order:

Big Ten		4	(Purdue, Ohio State, Wisconsin, Minnesota)

MAC		3	(Ball State, Bowling Green)
Southern	3	(Citadel, Furman)

Big Eight	2	(Nebraska)
Big Sky		2	(Northern Arizona, Montana)
Pac 10		2	(USC, Washington State)
SEC		2	(Mississippi, Mississippi State)

ACC		1	(Duke)
Colonial	1	(Colgate)
Gateway		1	(Illinois State)
Ivy League	1	(Yale)
WAC		1	(BYU)
SWC		1	(Baylor)

Independent: Army.

    
    How about those Furman boys? They done good! They can play football
    too!
    
    B.A.
    

    Kevin Gibbs, reserve fullback for the University of Miami, was killed
    in a car wreck last night.  Gibbs was a redshirt freshman who saw very
    little action this year.  He rushed only 28 times for 82 yards.
    
    RIP 
    
    jab

    Yup, Nebraska is the only Top 10 team with Academic All-Americans.
    Nobody from Miami, Notre Dame, Michigan, Alabama, Auburn... and
    NOBODY from **CLEMSON**. I guess the smart kids go to Furman.
    
    Rich
    

    Would you rather go to Furman, play football, get a Business degree
    and go to work at a $18,000 job or go to a BIG-8 school, get 3 years
    of credits, go to the pros after your Junior year and get drafted for
    a $M+ job while you finish your degree at your own slow pace?
    
    Cowboy
    

Or you could go to a Big - 8 school.

Sit on the bench of a football factory for 4 years.
Major in undergraduate studies.
Never get drafted.
Never make it big.
Never amount to anything.

Get a job paying $10 k a year and be happy for it.


Basically be another cog in the great football machine of  NU or OU..etc...

Metz

    Re:.6
    Proving once again, the Big Ten is on top.

    That's true Metz but atleast a paid education and a shot at pro
    sports is better than nothing.  It's up to the athlete/student
    to make a go of it.  Where would he be if he didn't give it a
    try?  The ones that would amount to zero do have a chance to
    make it.
    
    Cowboy
    

Or better yet, go to Bob Jones University, get some religion, become a
TV Evangelist, make millions for standing up shouting about fire
and brimstone, find some ugly wench who wears so much makeup she
has to take it off with a Wagner Power Stripper, and then
find like the skankiest hooker you can and then just look but
don't touch.

Then open a Jesus Loves You On The Waterslide themepark, make more
millions,  shout some more on TV, then have some hallugeons(tm)
when you're on trial for tax fraud and wind up making license plates.

Sounds like a great life, eh?

    Frank, that lifestyle sounds as crooked as promoting pro wrasslin'.
    It's all "entertainment" until they start asking for donations.
    
    Cowboy
    

    .10�    Would you rather go to Furman, play football, get a Business degree
    .10�    and go to work at a $18,000 job or go to a BIG-8 school, get 3 years
    .10�    a $M+ job while you finish your degree at your own slow pace?
    
    Good question...
    	I think it all depends on how you look at life. Sure you could
    "Pass" you're way through a big time school.Make a couple Million, have
    a torn knee the rest of your life.Or you could go to Furman, get a
    degree, be on the Acedemic team,and have the satisfaction of knowing
    that you can get a job wheather or not you play a game of
    football.(a.k.a) Drug-pusher!!! 
    
    	Also, I believe that I would get more personal satisfacton striving
    to be a decent human-being.Knowing that I kick As* on the Football team
    and in the Books, making around 30K. Not bad for a farm boy!
    
    B.A.
      

    
    
    
    
    Are you really serious or are you generalizing just for laughs?
    
    
 >  	I think it all depends on how you look at life. Sure you could
 >  "Pass" you're way through a big time school.Make a couple Million, have
 >  a torn knee the rest of your life.Or you could go to Furman, get a
 >  degree, be on the Acedemic team,and have the satisfaction of knowing
 >  that you can get a job wheather or not you play a game of
 >  football.(a.k.a) Drug-pusher!!! 
 >  
 >  	Also, I believe that I would get more personal satisfacton striving
 >  to be a decent human-being.Knowing that I kick As* on the Football team
 >  and in the Books, making around 30K. Not bad for a farm boy!
 >  
 >  B.A.
    
    
    Furmanites(TM) are probably all Fred MacMurray clones that are
    "decent human beings" and all BIG-8ers are drug-pushers that
    coast through college and bust out their knees in the pros.
    
    Is this what you're saying?
    
    I hope that your note wasn't meant to be as serious as it
    sounded.  There are problems in all the conferences and the
    newsworthy problems are in the bigger schools so that's what
    we hear, nationally.  As to the number of football players
    that graduate, I'd take that with a grain of salt.  We don't
    know what the standards are at each school--for the football
    players.  Some of the schools may be passing more of the players
    just to look good.  As to the number of passing players--I
    don't care.  If they are there to get an education then they
    will probably pass.  If they are there for a free chance for
    the pros then they may not pass.
    
    Cowboy
     

    re-1,
    
    It was done all in Fun...!
    
    But "I" would go to the pro's and take my chances! But I still like
    Furman's acedemic standards.
    
    B.A.
    

	Georgia Southern beat Stephen F. Austin, 37-34, Saturday for their
	third Division I-AA chanmpionship in the last five years.  They must
	be the team of the decade; pretty good for a school that had no
	football program at the beginning of the 80's !

    Could someone post the major college bowl schedule?  What days are the
    Rose Bowl and Orange Bowl on?
    
    Thanks, Bill

Eagle Aloha		Dec. 25		Hawaii		Michigan St
All American		Dec. 28		Duke		Texas Tech
Liberty			Dec. 28		Air Force	Mississippi
Sea World Holiday	Dec. 29		BYU		Penn St
John Hancock		Dec. 30		Texas A&M	Pittsburgh
Anaheim Freedom		Dec. 30		Washington	Florida
Peach			Dec. 30		Georgia		Syracuse
Mazda Gator		Dec. 30		Clemson		West Virginia
Copper			Dec. 31		Arizona		NC State
Hall of Fame		Jan. 1		Auburn		Ohio St
Florida Citrus		Jan. 1		Virginia	Illinois
Mobil Cotton		Jan. 1		Arkansas	Tennessee
Sunkist Fiesta		Jan. 1		Florida St	Nebraska
Rose			Jan. 1		Southern Cal	Michigan
USF&G Sugar		Jan. 1		Alabama		Miami-Fl
Federal Express Orange	Jan. 1		Colorado	Notre Dame

TTom

2 Arizona players have been suspended from the team for violating NCAA
eligibility rules. David Elridge - testing positive for steroids - and
David Roney - ain't talkin' - will miss the Copper Bowl.

TTom

>2 Arizona players have been suspended from the team for violating NCAA
>eligibility rules. David Elridge - testing positive for steroids - and
>David Roney - ain't talkin' - will miss the Copper Bowl.




	 WWWAaaaaaaa!!! Why'd they go and do that?  (Is David Elridge
	 a Senior?  If it's who I think it is, he LOOKS it)

	 It's on the Copper Bowl...and it's at home....Wildkat
	 football hasn't been worth much of anything since Larry left.

	 kat

>	 football hasn't been worth much of anything since Larry left.
    
    Not exactly true Kat.  They would've gone to the Rose Bowl if they beat
    USC (it was in Tucson too).  They had a hard time keeping some of their
    receivers out of jail this season also.
    
    At least the ASU streak is still alive.
    
    Mike

>    Not exactly true Kat.  They would've gone to the Rose Bowl if they beat
>    USC (it was in Tucson too).  They had a hard time keeping some of their
>    receivers out of jail this season also.

	 That's because there is nothing exciting to do in Tucson for
	 the players... :-)
	    
>    At least the ASU streak is still alive.

	 Okay....you get football, we get basketball!  (But we still
	 beat you this year, didn't we?)


	 Wildkat

Bowl Updates:

o Terry Allen, RB, Clemson, will not play against West Virginia in the 
Gator Bowl because of a knee injury. Joe Henderson will start, as he did 
often enough this season to lead Clemson in rushing.

o Tony Boles, RB, Michigan, will not play in the Rose Bowl against 
Southern Cal. Leroy Hoard will. Hoard was MVP of last year's bowl.

o Raghib Ismail, Rocket, Notre Dame, is doubtful due to a separated 
shoulder. If he misses the Orange Bowl, Ricky Watters will return kicks 
and punts.

TTom

>        <<< Note 13.25 by SSDEVO::GALLUP "six months in a leaky boat" >>>
>	 Okay....you get football, we get basketball!  (But we still
>	 beat you this year, didn't we?)

	 Wildkat, I'm not an ASU grad so I don't care.  I'm just reporting
    the facks.  UofA won the football contest.  I don't think they've met
    on the hardwood yet.  The Cats did trounce NAU recently though.
    
    Mike

    Anyone catch the Holiday Bowl- Penn State vs. BYU?  It was the most
    exciting, unbelievable, just incredible football game I witnessed in a
    long, long time.  Gotta be the best college game of the 80's.  Maybe
    even better than that Miami Dolphins- San Diego Chargers playoff game
    in the early 80's.
    
    One highlight in this game that I've never seen before is an
    interception of a 2-point conversion attempt in which the defending
    team scored the 2 points!  Here it was, barely 2 minutes left to go,
    BYU down 41-39 after just scoring a td, and they're going for 2.  A
    Penn State linebacker intercepts about 4-5 yards deep in the end zone,
    then takes-off down the sideline 100+ yards to the BYU end zone to
    score 2 for Penn State!  Totally incredible!
    
    And, JMHO, I feel that Notre Dame deserves to be #1, just barely
    though.  Even though Miami did beat ND soundly, ND had the tougher
    schedule.  
    
    Hawk

    That's a strange rule that I never heard of.  Why not give Penn St. 6
    instead of 2?  Is it the same result for an extra point that is blocked
    and returned?
    
    The NFL doesn't allow a return on a blocked extra point, right?
    
    Mike

    Not only was that interception return for the two points exciting
    it also covered the spread for everyone who had Penn St.  I also
    agree that this game was the best of the year, back and forth with an
    unbelievable finish.
    
    Jimbo

    Points after touchdown are "dead ball" plays.  Yardage gained doesn't
    count, so I think that's the rationale for only allowing 2 points,
    though it is sort of flimsy.
    
    Don't know whether or not blocked kicks are treated the same way
    or not.
    
    NFL doesn't allow returns on blocked extra points either.
    
    John

    John, in that case of the BYU quarterback throwing an INT on an extra
    (2) point attempt, does it go against him as an INT?  My guess is that
    it doesn't....
    
    Hawk

    Nope.  No passing attempt, no interception, no completion if it's
    caught, no yards if gained or lost.  But I will have to check the
    NCAA rules to be sure.
    
    John

    re .31:
    
    > Don't know whether or not blocked kicks are treated the same way
    > or not.
    
    I believe the rule on blocked kicks is that they can be returned for 2
    points if the kick is caught in the air (i.e., doesn't touch the ground
    first).  Notre Dame returned a PAT attempt for 2 points against SMU
    this season.
    
    
    py

Path: shlump.nac.dec.com!decwrl!sun-barr!apple!brutus.cs.uiuc.edu!ux1.cso.uiuc.edu!uxh.cso.uiuc.edu!peppler
From: [email protected] (Randy Peppler)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football
Subject: New Year's Day Bowl TV Ratings (NCAA)
Summary: King Orange lives...
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Date: 3 Jan 90 18:59:54 GMT
Sender: [email protected] (News)
Reply-To: [email protected] (Randy Peppler)
Distribution: na
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Lines: 27
 
 
	For those of you interested, the big ratings winner Monday
	was the Orange Bowl.  By time slot, the Hall of Fame Bowl
	won out over the Cotton and Citrus Bowls (the lowest rated),
	the Rose whipped the Fiesta, and the Orange mauled the Sugar.
 
	The numbers:
 
		Bowl		Net.	Rat.	vs. '89  Opponents
 
		Orange		NBC	19.6	+66%	ND-Colorado
		Rose		ABC	15.1	+22%	USC-Michigan
		Hall of Fame	NBC	 9.3	+30%	Auburn-Ohio St.
		Fiesta		NBC	 8.4	-44%	FSU-Nebraska
		Sugar		ABC	 7.4	- 1%	Miami-Alabama
		Cotton		CBS	 7.2	-27%	Ark-Tennessee
		Citrus		ABC	 7.0	+11%	Illinois-Virginia
 
	I bet the Hall of Fame Bowl benefited from starting 30 minutes
	earlier than the other two.  The Fiesta blowout probably explains
	it, and Bo's last game probably helped the Rose.  The poor Sugar
	seems to get bombed no matter what time slot it's in...  Wonder
	which slot it will be in next time...
_________________                              _
| Randy Peppler |______________               / \        x
| Illinois State Water Survey |       ________| |________|____________Illinois
| [email protected]           |      /  /  /  /  /  /  /  /  /  /  /  /  /  /

    Some explanations: Notre Dame is the biggest TV draw in the country.
    The Rose Bowl is a guaranteed success when Michigan or Ohio State
    plays,because of the big Midwest audience.

    
     Do networks garantee a rating to advertisers?
    
       jim
    

    The John Hancock Bowl might be moving to New Years Day.  The Bowl game
    organizers have been very encouraged over the games TV ratings.

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From: [email protected] (Clay Phipps)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football
Subject: _Football News_ Reports _Miami Herald_ Tampered With AP Poll
Summary: 'Cane-boosting editor protests tampering to aid 'Canes in AP poll.
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Date: 25 Jan 90 07:22:41 GMT
Reply-To: [email protected] (Clay Phipps)
Distribution: usa
Organization: Intergraph APD, in semiarid Palo Alto, CA
Lines: 57
 
MIAMI HERALD CAUGHT TAMPERING
 
by Roger Stanton, "Stanton Says", _Football News_, Jan. 2, 1990, p. 6.
 
_The Miami Herald_ has tampered with the weekly Associated Press
college football poll in order to benefit its local team,
the University of Miami Hurricanes.  The newspaper has admitted to
contacting voters involved in the weekly poll to solicit support
for Miami, and to determine how the individuals would vote
if Notre Dame defeated Colorado in the Orange Bowl and Miami defeated
Alabama in the Sugar Bowl.
 
The _Herald_ made what we consider unethical contacts following the
publication of the Nov. 27 AP poll.  At that time, Colorado was No. 1,
followed by Michigan, Alabama, and Miami.  After Alabama lost to Auburn
Dec. 2, the next AP poll strangely had Miami No. 2 and Michigan No. 3.
As a result of the _Herald_'s meddling, Miami passed Michigan in the poll.
 
Positive proof of _The Miami Herald_'s actions were published in
that newspaper's Dec. 5 Sports Section.
 
_Football News_'s feeling is that the integrity of the AP poll has been
violated.  No newspaper should be allowed to contact the voters, and
the voters should never make their feelings available to the media
before any such poll is published.  Interference with the voting process
should not be tolerated.
 
[The text above is presented verbatim and in its entirety.  No copyright 
notice appears on the front page, nor in the masthead, nor with the column.]

    A tainted national championship hee hee...

    figures.  Typical of Miami.
    
    JD

    Oooh, what a delicious scandal ...
    
    The Miami Herald is one *interesting* newspaper, that's for sure. 
    They were the ones who blew the lid on Gary Hart's affair with
    Donna Rice, too.
    
    Wonder what ol' Lou Holtz thinks of all this ???
    
    Bob Hunt

       the Miami Herald is also the home of NOTEd humorist Dave Barry.
                                           Denny

    	Bob, I heard that Donna Rice and Lou Holtz were seen together
    before the Orange Bowl buying up copies of the Miami Herald.
    
    				/Don

    Wait a second.. If you were a voter for the AP Top Twenty, would
    a phone call from the LA Times **MAKE** you vote for USC? Unless
    I missed something, it doesnt sound like they threatened to blow
    up anyone's house or beat their dogs, or anything like that. Could
    be a case for that uncoverer of public shame.... Geraldo Rivera :-)
    	It just doesnt seem like the Miami Herald could have that much
    influence over supposedly impartial voters.
    				Raider_Rich
    

                    Miami Herald, La Cosa Nostra, Clemson

Mike JN

    
    Nonsense.  I read many quotes from AP voters in forums other than
    the Miami Herald, including the Boston Globe.  These unofficial polls 
    are not uncommon.  Maybe unethical, but not uncommon.  Most of the
    voters were saying that they realized that it was quite wrong to have
    Michigan placed ahead of Miami even after Miami beat Notre Dame, and 
    they adjusted their votes the following week.  There was an amazing
    number of voters who did this, something 26 out of the total 60 (?)
    voters.  Hard to believe that the local newspaper was responsible for
    this when newspapers across the country are taking unofficial polls.
    
    Fact is, the voters were also 100% correct.  Michigan had no business
    being ranked ahead of either Miami *or* Notre Dame after that game.
    
    glenn
     

Path: shlump.nac.dec.com!ryn.esg.dec.com!decvax!mcnc!xanth!samsung!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sdd.hp.com!ncr-sd!ncrcae!purch!phowe
From: [email protected] (pmh)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football
Subject: College Football Recruiting Rankings
Keywords: College Recruiting Football
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Date: 11 Apr 90 13:27:49 GMT
Organization: NCR Corp., Columbia, SC
Lines: 17
 
Below is the final Top 10 National Recruiting Rankings for college football
teams 1990 classes:
 
         Super-Prep                 Max Emfinger
 
     1. Notre Dame              1. Notre Dame
     2. Florida State           2. Georgia
     3. Georgia                 3. Texas A&M
     4. Texas A&M               4. Florida State
     5. Michigan                5. Ohio State
     6. Ohio State              6. UCLA
     7. UCLA                    7. West Virginia
     8. Southern Cal            8. Michigan
     9. North Carolina          9. Tennessee
    10. Nebreska               10. Pittsburgh
 
For those of you who follow Big Ten football. . . watch out for Ohio State !

    BTW, I think that's either 5 times in a row, or 5 times in 6 years that
    Notre Dame has been the leading recruiter in college football.
    
    Dan

    
    The Buckeyes landed the top RB prospect in the nation. Sorry, I don't
    remember his name. I heard it awhile back. He is from Ohio.

    
    
    RE: -1
    
    Must be the guy from St Ignatius.  Sporting News stated that Ohio
    State could very well have the best backfield in the nation next
    year.

More reorg hype:

o The SEC is recruiting Arkansas, Miami-FL, and Florida St. Apparently,
they and the Big 10, who've been trying to convince us for years about
how they're the best, aren't so sure now and have bought into the theory
that bigger is better.

o The SWC is talking to Oklahoma. Sounds about right to me. Now get Rice
to leave and join the Big 10, or whatever they're calling themselves
today, and you got something.

TTom

    
    OU would fit right in the SWC. Then they could leave the NCAA and have
    their own Probation Conference.

    Good point, HOOT.  Isn't Arkansas the only school in the SWC that
    wasn't on probation back acouple years ago?

    Nope.  Baylor and Rice, to my knowledge, weren't on probation either
    and in fact, never have been.  Arkansas wasn't on probation at the
    time and I don't know if they've ever been or not.
    
    John

    According to reports here, if Arkansas goes to the SEC, Texas and Texas
    A&M won't be far behind.  The SWC will try to get OU if Arkansas
    leaves.  Texas Tech has said they will leave if Arkansas does, probably
    to Big 8 or Big Sky (not too sure about the to where part).  The
    Cottonbowl will probably go independent.

In Saturday's transactions:

	Brigham Young -- Named Robbie Bosco full-time offensive assistant
football coach.

Miami University is supposedly very interested in joining a new, 
reorganized Metro Conference that hopes to be a 16-member, all-sports 
conference. Miami had said no way until football was added as a 
conference sport.

Other teams being to be added:

	West Virginia, Boston College, Pittsburgh, Syracuse, 
	East Carolina, Rutgers, Temple.

Conspicuous in its absence is Florida St. This may be due to their heavy 
recruitment by the SEC.

Current members:

	Florida St, Louisville, Memphis St, So Carolina, Cincinnati,
	Southern Miss, Virginia Tech.

TTom

> Current members:

>	Florida St, Louisville, Memphis St, So Carolina, Cincinnati,
>	Southern Miss, Virginia Tech.

        And Tulane.

    Arkansas has voted to move to the SEC.  The SEC has not officially
    invited Arkansas, though.  There has to be a 2/3 or 3/4 majority vote
    of the SEC members before a new member can be admitted.

    Florida State is included in a proposal to form a new "Mega-Metro"
    Conference. From the alignment that I saw they would play in the
    "South" Division while Miami would join the "North" Division.
    
    It has also been reported that Miami was waiting to see what 
    Arkansas was going to do before they committed to the "Mega-Metro"
    conference. Miami is unsure whether they like the proposed Mega-Metro
    or the SEC.
    
    An ACC proposal that did not include Florida State was rejected by 4
    Eastern Independents. 

    
    I'd like to see my alma mater, the University of Colorado join the 
    PAC-10 conference.  I always felt we as a university (not as a football
    team necessarily) fit in better with the western schools than with
    the Big Eight Schools.  Jeez, 1/4 of the students were from California
    anyway.  It would be interesting to see how CU would handle being
    in the Pass Happy PAC-10.  Anybody else have any thoughts on this
    and what the possibilities might be for this to happen...
    
    Peace/ed

    Rumors have it that the SEC will extend a formal invitation to Arkansas
    today and that Arkansas will accept.
    
    There is also speculation that should Arkansas leave the SWC, Texas and
    Texas A&M would soon follow.  This would turn the SEC into a two
    divison superconference.

    Hi, Ed.
    
    I would like for CU to stay in the Big 8.  Now that we are able to beat
    Nebraska and Oklahoma, I would like the opportunity to bask in the
    glory.  I have had my nose rubbed into it for years by Nebraska fans and I
    would hate to leave them behind now that the Buffs are conference champ
    contenders.
    
    I was very pleased to see Coach McCartney receive his 15-year contract. 
    Since he is in his early fifties, this really equates to a life-time
    contract.
    
    Peace/Jan
    

    
    Here is Street & Smith's preseason top 25 College Football Teams...
    
    1.  Notre Dame
    2.  Miami
    3.  Colorado
    4.  Auburn
    5.  BYU
    6.  Clemson
    7.  Nebraska
    8.  USC
    9.  Illinois
    10. Florida State
    11. Michigan
    12. Texas A&M
    13. Tennessee
    14. Penn State
    15. Alabama
    16. Arkansas
    17. Oklahoma
    18. Washington
    19. Michigan State
    20. Virginia
    21. Florida
    22.  Syracuse
    23. Houston
    24. Arizona
    25. Ohio State
    
    What do you all think?  Pretty accurate?  any glaring omissions or
    surprises?
    
    Peace/ed

Thanks for the list.

The only surprise is that Virginia is ranked at 20. The rest seems to be
the usual names that are ranked high because they have the name
recognition. Certainly Notre Dame and Miami should contend for the big
prize. Michigan State may be out of the running before the season is over
unless they contain the damage done to the program involving their
steroid scandal. Is Florida eligible for anything?

One team that I'll be looking for is Kentucky who got Bill Curry from
Alabama.

TTom

    Where would you have ranked Virginia, TTom ???
    
    The ACC Coaches poll had them winning the league with Clemson second.
    
    Bob Hunt

    Latest rumor spurred by Arkansas' defection to the SEC:
    
    The SWC will merge with the Big 8.

re: Virginia.

No, I think the Cavs should be rated higher than Clemson. My comment was
directed towards the people who usually make up the preseason polls. In
both football and basketball, they probably know a couple of teams that
might excel or is local and then they fill in the remaining slots with
the factories.

I think that on the basis of their performance last year and the strength
of their returning players, #20 is low and may reflect the above.

TTom

    RE: Street & Smith's poll
       
    BYU should have a good team this year, but #5 in the nation?  Don't
    know about that one.  Also, Michigan and FSU seem to be ranked somewhat
    low in relation to other polls I've seen.
    
    Joe

    U.S. Today had a short piece on Florida State joining the SEC. The
    story said that despite comments made by both the SEC and Florida State
    people, they (FSU) will join the SEC. The story also indicated that FSU
    has told the SEC that there is no reason to invite Miami into the SEC!

Is there still a CFA? I ask because with the Big1x taking in Penn State
and the PAC-10 apparently recruiting Texas and Texas A&M, neither of
those conferences belong to the CFA and those teams being recruited do.

Did Notre Dame entering into their own contract begin the end for CFA?

TTom

    
    The PAC 10 is NOT recruiting anyone.  Texas has approached them about
    joining, and the PAC 10 isn't sure it wants to add anyone.  I believe
    that Texas is pissed about Arkansas going to the SEC so quickly and
    spilling the beans about Texas also joining, before UT was ready to
    announce it.  Maybe Mac can shed some light.  I know the people of
    Texas, amd the Texas legislature is upset.
    
    Bruce

    According to the USA Today, the Big-10 has approached Nebraska with
    an offer for the Huskers to jump to the Big-10.
    
    Nebraska Marty

    Latest rumor on the Conference musical chair scene:  Miami Hurricanes
    to the SWC.

    re .75:
    
    SportsChannel reported this morning that the possibility of Miami
    moving to the SWC was contingent on Texas and Texas A&M remaining in
    the SWC.
    
    
    py

    Miami. SouthWest?  No wonder over half of the nation's youth can't pass
    a geography test.
    
    	--dan'l

    The PAC-10 has stated that they have no wish to expand.

    As a carry over topic from another note (Big Ten I think), I was
    wondering how many of you give money to your alma matter(s).  And if
    so, do you give to the athletic program, academic department, or both?
    
    Just curious because I give to Ohio U academics.  Hell, they payed for
    most of my education with an athletic scholarship.  But it burns me up
    when Carnegie Mellon has the nerve to send me fundraising materials. 
    At $5,000+ per semester, they got enough of my money.  (And I don't
    think that my opinion would be any different if it were my undergrad
    instead of graduate institution.)
    
    	--dan'l
    

    Half my paycheck goes to Pampers and the other half to Kodak ...
    
    I would not choose to give to the athletic funds of my alma mater.  I
    love my school dearly but Thomas Jefferson did not establish Virginia
    so it could win the ACC title.   {Obviously, given the Wahoos dismal
    gridiron history before George Welsh arrived.}  College sports have
    enough money by now.  Besides, they don't let me in for free when I go
    back to C'ville to see a game.
    
    If I had it to give, it'd go for academics.  The education I received
    keeps me going from day to day.  The sports teams are entertainment.
    
    Bob Hunt

I kick into the general fund. On the card you can designate which college
or which scholarship fund you want your money to go to but I just let
them figure out where to spend it. Also, as with a lot of groups, once
you give you're on their list. About the only other donation I make is
for a local - Charlotte - scholarship.

And of course, being a resident of NC my taxes also support State.

TTom

    
    Merrimack College has spent far more in postage sending me
    solicitations than they'll ever receive back from me.
    
    Dickster
    

    I contribute to both the athletic program and (more) to the academic
    program at Georgia Tech. I guess that's why we were recently rated #1
    alumni program in the USA again.
    
    Chris

    	I didn't go to college either Stephen, so I spend it at the
    dog track.  Raynham has had some great ads lately.  The one I like
    best starts out like a dating service ad then tells you to go to
    Raynham.  The last line is "If you have to spend the night with
    a dog, you might as well make some money".  HAHAHAHAHA�
    
    				/Don

    Well, the last few times my school has called looking for money
    (they're running a pretty serious fund-raising drive at the moment), my
    response has been "I've got a high-school junior and I'm raising him on
    my own.  What do you think?"  The inevitable reply back is "I
    understand completely - we won't expect anything."
    
    College giving is pretty low on my list of potential charities, but
    when I'm in a position to do so, it'll be to the academic programs.
    
    A&W

    I give to the Track and Cross Country programs at my alma mater,
    Northeastern University.
    
    JD

When I give, it's usually to support the music program at CCSU.

And, btw, if you are giving, pick up a Matching Gift form, because
in a lot of cases, the giving you are doing is eligible to be
matched by DEC....

'Saw

    I have never, or will ever, give money to my alma mater Stephen F.
    Austin (in Texas).  Coming from Europe I had to pay ten times more for
    every credit hour than the American students so I believe they have
    too much of my family money already.

    
    If I wanna send $50 to a college, and DEC will match the offer,
    why can't I just ask DEC to send the whole $100, and then everyone
    is happy.
    
    Dickster
    

    It's Hurricane season!!  The #1 ranked and defending national
    champions take on BY-Who in an ESPN game at 5:30 MDT tomorrow.
    
    The game is obvious being portrayed as a matchup between 2 of the
    most prominent preseason Heisman candidates, with QB Craig Erickson of
    Miami and Ty Detmer of BYU.  The Canes may have the nation's most
    explosive offense and a tough defense, although the defense will
    probably drop a notch below last year's unit.
    
    BYU also has an explosive offense, but it's not on the same level as
    Miami's.  The Cougars have a typical WAC defense - weak.
    
    It could be interesting with the game being played in Provo, but as USA
    Today puts it, the Canes "might be too big, too bad and too focused."
    
    Don't get too scared watching this one, Irish fans.
    
    
    Joe

    
    Don't worry....Irish fans sure aren't scared just gald to see Miami
    has a schedule with more than 1 or 2  of the top 50 teams on it this
    year!
    
    Dave

    Quote of the weekend.  By the ESPN announcer doing the Miami BYU game:
    
    	"The Mormons are on fire!"
    
    I knew BYU's offense was potent, but their defense looked outstanding. 
    What a pass rush.  Are they really that good?
    
    Notre Dame will probably be #1 now, until they get knocked off by
    Michigan, and then Michigan will be #1, until...
    
    We're in for another one of those years, boys and girls.
    
    	--dan'l

Virginia has a very easy schedule the rest of the way and could
conceivably be 11-0 on New Year's Day. BYU also has a fairly easy road.

TTom

    	The ultimate "mythical national championship".  Virginia vs.
    BYU.  8^)
    
    				/Don

    
    Wasn't that a BYUtiful game on ESPN last Staurday night!!!
    
    That Miami (of Ohio?) team really got stuffed! :-)
    
    Bob V.
    

    Give Ty Detmer the Heisman NOW!  This kid passed for 406 yards and 3
    td's against the team that's supposed to win it all again this year! 
    Say goodnight Miami, season's already over!  HAHAHAHAHA!!!!  :-)
    
    Hawk

As long as ND is on the schedule Miami's season isn't over. Good game by
Ty who probably bought himself a ton of votes for his performance. Excellent
offense by BYU using the motion and picks to get they're guys open constantly.
Miami's front seven on defense had lost a lot from last year.


mike

    
    Can you believe it?  The road to the national champeenship is
    gonna go through the Holiday Bowl?  The WAC champ is bound to
    this bowl.  Unless BYU stumbles in the WAC conference, they
    should be undefeated at the end of the regular season.  I don't
    feel that any of the WAC teams can beat them.
    
    Did any of you catch the comment about the BYU linebacker who
    played on their '84 national championship team?  That was 6
    years ago!!!  I don't agree with the policy that allows their
    players to go on a *mission*.  There's a big difference, physically,
    between a player who is 24 and a player who is 19 or 20.  Let 'em
    do their mission after their playing days are over.
    
    Claybone

    Looking to the bowl games, if BYU wins their division, which they
    probably will, does the winner of the WAC still have to play in
    the Holiday bowl, if so they'll do what they did when they won the
    national championship. They'll get matched up against a 6-5 team
    which is what happened that year, they played Michigan who was 6-5
    and barely beat them. BUT I thought I heard last year that the winner
    of the WAC can now turn down the Holiday bowl, and they will take
    the runner-up. That way if BYU is still undeafeated, they can play
    on the 1st, which means millions of more dollars for the unniversity.
    They're defense is very gutsy, Miamis offense had more speed and alot
    more size. 
                                               Dan

>    Did any of you catch the comment about the BYU linebacker who
>    played on their '84 national championship team?  That was 6
>    years ago!!!  I don't agree with the policy that allows their
>    players to go on a *mission*.  There's a big difference, physically,
>    between a player who is 24 and a player who is 19 or 20.  Let 'em
>    do their mission after their playing days are over.

	You are advocating that the NCAA should penalize student-athletes
who take 2 years out of their lives to, in their own small way, make this
world a better place??? Geez, talk about priorities being out of wack!!! Besides
there isn't that much difference between 22 and 24 years old. Also, most 
college 'seniors' are arround 23 anyway, because most of them were 'red-shirted'
their freshman year anyway.

	JimH

I agree with JimH. I think this is a good rule. The dedication and
commitment of those students to take 2 years out of their life to
participate in their "mission" is admirable independent of anything else.

TTom

    Congrats to BYU on a great game played.  I think the Canes may have
    went in to Provo a bit overconfident.  To me the biggest suprise was
    not how well Detmer moved the offense but BYU's pass rush.  Miami also
    didn't run the ball very well and BYU had some outstanding open-field
    tackling.  If Detmer continues to play this well he should win the
    Heismann, but if Ismail gets a couple TD's on national TV he could
    undeservedly win it.               
    
    Looking at BYU's schedule, they shouldn't lose another game.  Their
    only semi-tough games left are home against Colorado State, and on the
    road at Air Force and Hawaii.  They are ranked #6 this week by USA
    Today.
    
    It was a good weekend for the WAC.  In addition to BYU's big upset,
    Wyoming beat Washington State, and Utah won at Minnesota.  The WAC over
    the Big-10, one of the weekend's few bright spots.
    
    Joe

    Geez it was nice seeing the finger pointing, taunting, disco dancing
    Canes humbled by BYU.   I don't care what happens now, that was
    sweet.
    
    Penn State lost to Texas - another upset.
    
    JD

Alabama lost to Mississippi State (or was is So. Miss. State).

Anyway, from the line, that was a big upset too.....

'Saw

>	You are advocating that the NCAA should penalize student-athletes
>who take 2 years out of their lives to, in their own small way, make this
>world a better place??? Geez, talk about priorities being out of wack!!! 

	I'm not advocating any penalties.  I'm for letting them do their
	missions AFTER their playing days.  This way, everybody is equal
	agewise.  

>Besides there isn't that much difference between 22 and 24 years old. Also, 
>most college 'seniors' are arround 23 anyway, because most of them were 
>'red-shirted' their freshman year anyway.

>	JimH


	You are correct.  But we're talking one year of red-shirt and
	two years of mission work.  These guys, theoretically, start
	playing when they're 20 or 21.  There's a BIG difference between
	an 18-19 year old and somebody who is 24.  I personally was
	red shirted my freshman year.  I arrived there at 165 lbs.  At
	the end of my red shirt year, I weighed 195 and dropped my 40
	yd dash time by .16 seconds.  This all took alot of hard work
	of course, but, think how much improvement can be made in 1-3
	years.

	I wonder what a typical *mission* for a BYU lineman entails?

Claybone
    
ps  Saw, it was U. of Southern Mississippi (the golden eagles)
    
pps  JD, I loved watching the hot dog 'canes get whupped too!

>	You are advocating that the NCAA should penalize student-athletes
>who take 2 years out of their lives to, in their own small way, make this
>world a better place??? Geez, talk about priorities being out of wack!!!
    
    Umm, Jim, a "better place" for you is not necessarily a "better place"
    for me.  For these missions there is no doubt that the proselytizers
    make personal sacrifices.  I agree that one of them could be their
    sports eligibility time, just like the rest of the world.  I'd give a
    kid 5 years starting from his freshman year.
    
    Dan

    This is the second straight year Southern Mississippi has started their
    season with a major upset.  Last year, they knocked off Florida State
    in their first game.
    
    On the down side, Slippery Rock lost big to Springfield. :-(
    
    
    py

What about Wesleyan???????


re Mission:

	I don't know much about the Mormon faith, but I have known
	several.  Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but most
	of the missions I've known about entail traveling and spreading
	the word by entering peoples homes and talking with them.

	While I'm not a big outwardly religious person, the few times
	they've called at my house, I've invited them in and let
	them do their thing.  It's something they have to do, and if
	I can help someone fulfill their obligation in some small way
	it's fine by me.

	However, I do agree with Claybone that they should wait until
	after they play...

'Saw

PS  Thanks Claybone for the Miss. correction.  Looks like 'Bama don't
    have no chance for that Title now....

	There's nothing that prevents student-athletes from any faith
	from performing the same type of missionary work, and coming
	back older (and therefore, presumably, stronger and faster), is
	there ?

	Why not have athletic boosters fund college players to do missionary
	work, thereby improving the quality of footbal team good ole
	State U can place on the field ?

    Well, I was a Mormon for about three months and was on my way to being
    baptized.  I went off and did some research on my own (rather than
    listen to strictly LDS doctrine) and found the religion to be total
    fabrication.  But that's neither here nor there.  Go to the Mormon
    conference if you want to discuss all that.
    
    In defense of the church and their missionaries:
    
    - I'm sure the mission for the football players is the same as any
    other mission.  These people do not compromise.
    
    - The mission is totally out-of-pocket.  Yes, that's right.  The church
    pays hardly anything.  If you get sent on a mission to Paris, for
    example, you pay for that trip and your living expenses.  That's one
    reason you see so many of them riding bikes.
    
    - The missionaries are monitored.  If they do anything that would not
    fit in with the Doctine and the Covenent (the Mormon "laws") they are
    reprimanded and sometimes punished.  For example, I know a guy who did
    his mission in Argentina.  He went to see a movie on a Sunday and was
    punished.  Don't remember what that punishment was, but none the less,
    he was punished.
    
    - Because of this missionary work, the LDS church is the fastest
    growing church in the world.  It is one of the first western religions
    to be accepted in Asia.
    
    	--dan'l

    If a Miami defensive end left school after his junior year to become a
    Hare Krishna for 2 years, should he be allowed to play on the football
    team when he returns?
    
    If a Notre Dame QB left school for 2 years of drug rehab, should he be
    allowed to return?
    
    Should a Michigan safety who leaves school to work in 7-11 to pay his
    child support be allowed back on the team?
    
    Dan

�    If a Miami defensive end left school after his junior year to become a
�    Hare Krishna for 2 years, should he be allowed to play on the football
�    team when he returns?

	Not sure Dan, but it would be awful hard running in those flowing
robes.  HTH.
   
				/Don

    	I was going to do some missionary work once, but then decided
    on another position.
    
    				/Don

    'Bama football fans are eating crow now that new head coach Gene
    Stallings has blown the first football game to Southern Mississippi,
    27-24. A few overzealous alumni (Leroy Jordan, et. al.) had Bill
    Curry (Powder) ditched for Stallings, and it already has backfired.
    At least, Curry won at Bama. He put Ws on the scoreboard (good
    cliche!). Now, Siran Stacy (sp?) is hurt (out for year) and Stallings
    is in deep trouble. 'Bama fans deserve this for the shoddy treatment
    they handed Curry.
    

>>  'Bama fans deserve this for the shoddy treatment
>>   they handed Curry.
    

WHOA NELLY!

Hang on a minute.  Yeah, Curry got the shaft but you can't make
sweeping generalizations about 'Bama fans.

True, I'm a 'Bama fan from afar, and because I'm not down south
I'm not experiencing the whole political-Bama-football-is-life-or-death
thing, but I thought Curry did a fine job and got the shaft. 

I'm disappointed he's not still there, very disappointed....

'Saw

    Saw,
    
    	Bama fans like you and I are in the minority.  The majority
    	of the fans down there are as you described.  Roll Tide!!!
    
    Claybone

    This Morman business is gonna hit college hoops in a big way when
    projected #1 frosh in the USA Shawn Bradley (all 7'-6" of him) hits the
    road after his freshman year to do his 2-year stint.  Several schools
    shyed away from Shawn because of this.  It's gotta be tough to build
    your team around a kid, lose him for 2 years, then get him back for 2. 
    Tough to recruit around him too.  (But I doubt BYU is complaining too
    much ...)
    
    
    - ACC Chris

USA Today has a new fan participation "gimmick" this year: The USA Today
Top 25 Fan's Pick. If selected you get to vote with the "experts" on the
USA Today/CNN Top 25 College Football Poll, which comes out every Monday.

To participate send a POSTCARD to:

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Include:
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TTom

	>You are correct.  But we're talking one year of red-shirt and
	>two years of mission work.  These guys, theoretically, start
	>playing when they're 20 or 21.  There's a BIG difference between
	>an 18-19 year old and somebody who is 24.

	You missed my point Claybone.  How much bigger and stronger is a 23 year
old 'red-shirted' senior compared to a 24 year old 'missioned' senior?
Not much!!!! Those 18-19 year olds have to play against the 23 year olds,
so what's the difference???

	>I wonder what a typical *mission* for a BYU lineman entails?

	I don't know if it is a 'typical' mission, but I know Micheal Smith
of the Celtics spent two years in some South American village. I doubt if many
of them are sent to Club Meds! :-)

JimH

    BTW how many well equipped gyms are there for these missionaries to
    keep in shape, or even yet get bigger in the Third World countries they
    visit ?
    
    John "D Cowboys" R.

    
    	Point taken JimH.  But an edge is an edge no matter how 
    	small or large.  I don't feel it's fair to have a LB from
    	an '84 team playing in the 1990 season.  Keep the age
    	requirements the same for everybody is what I'm advocating.
    
    	I don't have access to any information regarding what the
    	missions entail, but, I'd wager the majority of the football
    	players going on a mission have access to ample facilities
    	for weight training and such.  
    
    	Claybone

I'm not a mormon but my brother is...

When he came back from his 2 year mission in Italy he had lost about 20 pounds 
(and he is a stick to begin with) and looked about 5 years older. It took him
about 1 year to fully get back to the physical strength he had before he left.

It's true the mission is almost fully funded out of the missionaries pocket but
they can get sponsors to help defray a small portion of the cost. 

Btw - I don't think they go for 2 full years any more but 18 months is the usual
time with some electing to go the full 2 year route.

I don't think it is a big advantage for them (if any at all) but I agree with
Dan in saying that once you start college you should only get 5 years of 
atheletic eligibility. It's the fairest way across the board. Noone is making 
these kids take their mission at this time. You can take them at any time.
I've met 60 year old husband and wife missionary teams through my brother.

The only exception should be in times of war.

Metz

    The BYU players who go on missions don't get much of an opportunity to
    work out or even practice.  Going on a mission doesn't benefit them at
    all, in any way.
    
    John

>    	I don't have access to any information regarding what the
>    	missions entail, but, I'd wager the majority of the football
>    	players going on a mission have access to ample facilities
>    	for weight training and such.  
    
    	This is not correct.  I am a Latter-Day Saint, and access to
	weight training facilities is not available.  LDS missionaries
	are allowed one day per week (during the day, they return to
	proselyting at night) where they are given the opportunity to
	do their shopping, and have a little time for "recreational"
	opportunities, but activites likely to cause injury are restricted
	in the mission field.  LDS missionaries are there to support their
	mission, and football/basketball players, musicians, etc., are all
	treated the same.

	I'm not saying that missionaries would never be involved in a
	pick-up basketball game on their personal day; however, Im have
	known several football players serving missions, and they keep in
	shape the way other missionaries do - situps, pushups, jogging, etc.

	It wouldn't make much difference to me if the NCAA changed its policy.
	Quite frankly, I think red-shirting should be removed as an option
	as well; and, I think that the old rule of prohibiting freshmen to
	participate in varsity sports was a good rule.  However, I don't think
	any one can argue correctly that missionaries come back in playing
	condition and can compete equally with those who have not gone.  That
	just isn't the case.

>                                                            Noone is making
> these kids take their mission at this time. You can take them at any time.
> I've met 60 year old husband and wife missionary teams through my brother.

  This is not exactly true.  LDS young men are asked to serve a 2-year
  mission between the ages of 19-26, preferably towards the earlier of those
  years.  Those older couples who serve missions often have served missions
  in their youth as well.

  Obviously, no one forces any athlete to serve a mission.  Many don't go.
  But their is some pressure from home to go around the age of 20-22 years
  old.  Quite honestly, I think most of those who do serve missions would go
  even if they were left with only one year of eligibility for athletics.
  Not all, but most would.

  I'm not sure what good it would provide, really, for the NCAA to make this
  change.  Does it really benefit the student athlete ?  Is the NCAA supposed
  to be promoting winning, or personal growth through athletics ?  Should
  schools with non-winning teams just dump them, because they can't compete ?

      RE: the game

   	I'd have preferred a tie, but it's always nice to see Miami
   humiliated, groveling, and slobbering on themselves in shame and
   terror.

   Re: Missions

                Just because someone doesn't happen to be a
               __(insert_whatever_belief_system_you_want)__,
   doesn't give some nut the right to go into their home and `save' them.
        To think it is your right, or duty, is arrogant, insulting,
   disparaging, rude, megalomaniacal, ineluctably idiotic.... and silly.
   (the fact that it is attempted in a polite manner is beside the point)

                    God spare me from religious maniacs!

   Mike JN

Florida just got declared personna non grata for the post season. I
didn't catch what other penalty they suffered. Their basketball team got
some time and has to pay back some tournament money.

TTom

    No time for Gator basketball.  Just a reduction in scholarships over
    the next couple years.  Football team isn't eligible for any bowl games
    the next 2 years.
    
    Florida president didn't have many kind words to say about the NCAA ...
    
    
    - ACC Chris

    
    Just a few questions:
    
    1) How "lucky" can the Irish get?
    
    2) Where will Gene Stallings be coaching next year?
    
    3) How 'bout them DAWGS ?
    
    :>)

some answers:

>    1) How "lucky" can the Irish get?

They have a lot more luck left. However, the play selection and overall
coaching of both Michigan teams helped them out a lot. They hardly even
had to pray for this one, especially with the late game pass defense that
the Spartans "fielded".
    
>    2) Where will Gene Stallings be coaching next year?

He'll stay at Alabama through the next season. The reason will be that
the insiders that drove Curry away demanded another insider and they got
what they wanted: not a good coach but someone with Crimson Tide in their
blood. That's why he'll last 2 years and then be fired.
    
>    3) How 'bout them DAWGS ?

How bad is Alabama?

TTom

>  They have a lot more luck left.
 
The luckier-than lucky Irish have used up all their luck for the next 2 
seasons after this latest hoax over MSU.

Joe
    
    

The IMPORTANT question, ladies and gentlemen, is:

		How did Wesleyan do this week??????

Winners:
	Slippery Rock 42, Lock Haven 7
	Kansas Wesleyan 14, SW Kansas 0

Losers:
	Rhodes 29, Kentucky Wesleyan 6
	Lindenwood 35, Iowa Wesleyan 21
	Missouri Valley 37, Nebraska Wesleyan 31

TTom

    Looks like the remained of the Notre Dame scheudle ... or is it BYU's ?

 Boy I'm really going to miss Hoot today. He must be livid about them calling
 that OSU/USC game with 2:36 left...Really can't see were that had a choice
 with that lighting. USC probably would have ran out the clock anyways. So
 as usual the Big Ten looses to the Pac-Ten....

 mike

Supposedly they made a deal that if Ohio St had recovered the on sides
kick they woulda let them play. They didn't and that was that.

Ricky Ervins dominated this game and made the rest of the Trojan O much
easier.

TTom

    What was the final score of the Pitt-West Virginia game?

    Dave Klinger fired two TD's of 78 and 56 yards, the last with 2:31 to
    play, to allow Houston to sneak past Rice 24-22. Rice had a 19-7 lead
    in the 3rd quarter ....
    
    AAAAAAARRRRRUGGH !!!!!!!!

A Big DID-NOT-COVER for the Cougars. Maybe the only decent team in the
SWC is TCU.

TTom

    Yeah riiight .... give me a break ...

    Hey Doc, Andre Ware's really tearing up the NFL ain't he?  Has he
    busted up to 2nd string on the depth chart yet?  And is it true
    that Andre and Major meditated under the same mahatma maharish?
    
    >only decent team inthe SWC is TCU.
    
    SWC?  I thought that they disbanded the other day cuz the few good
    teams they had left for greener pastures.  
    
    re: Coach Bill Mallory's Indiana Hoosiers
    
    STUDS.  These guys drag the floor walking to the shower.  Main!  Too
    bad they don't have Virginia on their schedule this year!  These guys
    could be for real and knock off even a MSU or Illinois this year.  No
    doubt that Mallory's building program is over the hump.
    
    (NOTE: I didn't say "rebuilding" cuz the Hoosiers have no substantive
    gridiron past to recover, being 11th on the Big10's all-time won lost
    percentage board.) 
    
    Big10 Tom         

    Very big game this saturday. Florida ST. at Miami, should be a whale
    of a game, it always is when these two teams meet. Last year FSU
    beat Miami, I think 24-10. Miamis only lost, but Erickson didn't
    play. These two teams have explosive offenses, while each team has
    let up a good amount of points, This could have a big outcome on
    the National Championship.
    
                                                  Dan

 A Florida At. win should lock up the National Championship for them. Miami
 gets right back in the thick of things if they win. Cause in two weeks
 the Canes will kick the crap out of ND as will USC later on in the year...

 mike

    re -1
    
    Mike would you care to wager on that USC game.
    
    
    Tom

    
    Florida State will play at Auburn on Oct. 20.  This should be a very
    tough game.  Auburn has not lost at home since FSU beat them in '86. 
    FSU also has to play UF the last game of the season.  They have 2 very
    hard games left.
    
    ND goes into Knoxville in November.  This should be a very good game,
    also.
    

    re .150
    
    I don't know about Mike, but I will !

Auburn's coach, Pat Dye, has exactly *ZERO* filberts.  None, zip, zilch, nada. 
Not a single testicle to be found on the man anywhere.

I can't believe he went for the tie against Tennessee.   His comments were that 
"we had played too hard to lose".

This is not the first time he's done this.  He did it against Syracuse in the
Sugar Bowl a few years back.   Auburn will *never* win a national title with
this man at the helm.

Bob Hunt

    
    ESPN interviewed both coaches before the game and both Majors and Dye
    said they would go for the tie if the situation arose.  Both said it
    was too early in the SEC schedule to risk a loss.  BTW, Majors leads
    all active coaches with 10 ties.  Dye has 3.
    
    AU went for the tie against Syracuse so that the public would not have
    to listen to Macpherson whine about Syracuse not being national
    champion.

    
    One other thing, 2 of Dye's ties have been against Tennessee(20-20 and
    26-26).
    

    
    I didn't see the end of the Tennessee game, but I've never blamed Dye
    for kicking that field goal against Syracuse.  The odds were against
    him by at least 10-to-1.  Auburn had to get into the end zone from past
    the 15-yard-line, a near impossibility when all the defense has to do
    is protect the end zone.
    
    The 2-point conversion is also a losing proposition.  I like it in
    other situations for an element of strategic decision-making, but 
    forcing a coach to take a choice between what is likely a loss or 
    being branded "gutless" is not fair.  If two teams score touchdowns in 
    the final minutes, only the last one is expected to go for two.  Why is
    that?  Why not share the blame with the other guy for not trying to put 
    his team up by eight so that they can't lose?  (Or in the Syracuse game 
    why not blame MacPherson for taking the safe field goal instead of 
    trying to put Auburn away with a TD?  His odds were much better than 
    Dye's...)  Usually the crying comes from the other team, which wasn't
    good enough to stop the opposition in the final seconds, but then
    expects the other team to give them the game anyway on an anomoly.
    
    The only solution is to bring on overtime.
    
    glenn
     

    I don't believe in playing for ties. Dye wasn't playing for the
    tie, there was almost two minutes left in the game, and you have
    one of the best D's and at least two timeouts, he knew UT would
    not sit on the ball, he knew they would throw the ball down field
    and thats exactly what they did, but there defense couldn't stop
    them, and UT missed the FG. Dye was trusting his defense to hold
    them. If they had gone for it and missed the conversion they would
    have lost, It will come down to these two teams for the SEC title.
    Now what he did against Syracuse was totally chicken s__t. Even
    some of the seniors in the locker room after the game were saying
    they couln't believe it, that was the last game of the season.
    A bowl game. Now that Auburn didn't lose that game, if they can
    get by FSU, they have a legitimate shot at the championship game.
    
                                                Dan
    

    sorry about last reply, I can only wish. It was suppose to say
    a legitimate shot at the national championship not championship game.
    

    
    > Now what he did against Syracuse was totally chicken s__t. Even
    > some of the seniors in the locker room after the game were saying
    > they couln't believe it, that was the last game of the season.
    > A bowl game.
    
    You're correct that the only persons that would have a legitimate 
    complaint with Dye's (or anyone's) tie strategy would be his own 
    players and the Auburn fans.  Not the opponents.  If the opponents 
    aren't good enough to win outright, they shouldn't expect to be 
    "given" anything.
    
    glenn
    

    I agree fully with .158, Dye wasn't playing for the tie in this game.
    There was plenty of time left for AU to win if they could get the ball
    back. Now, the Syracuse game was a different story, and Dye's decision
    in that game definitely indicated a lack of filberts on his part. 

    
    I stand by my opinion that Dye tied Syracuse just to shut their coach
    up.  AU had nothing to gain or lose by going for the win.

    Not only did Pat Dye prove his risk-aversion once again by going for
    the extra point (the tie) instead of the two pointer (the lead), but
    when his defense *did* get the ball back after a missed Tennesee FG
    attempt, he had some decent field goal position, some time outs, and
    enough time on the clock to at least *try* to get into FG position. 
    Pat elected to sit on the ball and let the clock expire.
    
    Dan

       Dye is in the hospital for treatment of a 'pre-ulcerous' condition.
                                             Denny

    re .163
    
    You call your own 20 yd line "good field position"?  You think 10
    seconds was enough to do anything to get into FG position?  Boy, are
    you lost!!!
    

    There were 15 seconds left, a couple of time outs and I believe the
    ball was spotted well past the 20 - remember, Tenn. missed the field
    goal.  They coulda tried something other than the safe comforting tie.
    I thought they were around the 40.  One sideline pass later in 2 or
    three tries, and we're talking about a 47-yard kick to win the game.
    
    I have no doubt that games have been one with similar or worse
    predicaments.
    
    Dan

    The ball was on about the 23 yard line, with I believe 13 seconds
    left. Because at the most it was only a 40 yard F.G. attempt.
    
                                                         Dan

    Saint Douglas Of The Heights would have thrown a TD pass to Gerald
    Phelan for the winning score.
    
    Against Pat Dye's wishes, I'm sure ...
    
    Bob Hunt

    
    The missed FG was from 34 yds.  That means the line of scrimmage was
    the 17 so the ball came out to the 20.  There were 15 seconds left when
    Tennessee called that last TO.  The kick took at least 4-5 seconds so
    that left at most 11 seconds with the ball at the 20 plus remember AU
    was penalized 5 yds for too much celebration so the ball was really at
    the 15.  Not good field position at all...
    

    
    Could someone explain the significance of the insignia on the Miami
    Hurricanes' football helmet?
    
    Steve

How dare you bring actual facts into this discussion :-)



Metz

    .170
    
    Stands for Uppity
    
    

    >  -< Dan will still insist that they should have tried to score.... >-
    
    Damn straight!  Maybe there was only a 10% chance to win, maybe less,
    but there was still a chance.  Has it ever happened before?  Yes.
    What more reason for trying do you need?
    
    Dan

and what would you guess the percentage is of throwing an int or a qb sack or
a fumble causing your team to lose ?

Metz

>and what would you guess the percentage is of throwing an int or a qb sack or
>a fumble causing your team to lose ?

	To me it all comes down to, you out on the field to try to win or
trying not to lose??? I'ld want my team to throw the ball as deep as possible
and hope something good happened, accepting the risk that the other team could
also take advantage.

	Of course we all know Pat Tie-Dye's past history in these situations
are. The guy is a 1st-rate wimp!!!

JimH

    
    >                    -< Less than the chance to win >-
    
    Wrong!  Really, Dan, you're outdoing yourself on this one.  Auburn was
    deep in Tennessee's scoring position.  Even a long interception gives
    Tennessee another possibility for a field goal.  Auburn, on the other 
    hand, needs 50 yards in 10-15 seconds for a field goal attempt.
    
    All this concentration on "gutless" Pat Dye and the tie and no one 
    concentrates the fact that Auburn had to make a miracle comeback just
    to get there.  If everyone hates ties so much (I assume that's so 
    because of this irrational extremism against them-- "better to take the
    loss"), why aren't they legislated out of the rules?
    
    glenn
                 

    Glenn, given the situation...mediocre field position, TOs left, limited
    time on the clock...has the offensive team won or lost more games.  I'd
    bet they've won...easily.
    
    Dan

    
    I would be willing to bet that given similar circumstances(less than 15
    seconds remaining, ball on your own 15, score tied) that the vast
    majority of the games ended in a tie.  I would guess that defense
    scoring would come in 2nd and offense scoring would come in last.

    
    Looks like the Denver Bronco's lent their refs to the Buffalos this 
    weekend. 

    Can you believe this, I've got a co-worker in my office 
    who actually wants to know how 'Bama did?
    
    Bob V.
    

�    Can you believe this, I've got a co-worker in my office 
�    who actually wants to know how 'Bama did?
    
Sure, Bob, because there's a couple of guys in here (including me)
who'd love to know how the Tide fared.  I'm not thrilled with the
coaching situation, but once a fan, always a fan.....right Claybone????

So, how did Bama do, and how'd the Wesleyans do also????

'Saw    

    
    	Sho 'nuff Fransaw Chainway!  Bama won.  I didn't see
    	their score in our paper but my mama told me they won.  
    	She didn't know who they beat though.  She was too busy
    	makin' cornbread and black-eyed peas for my pa to notice....;^)
    
    	Claybone

    
    Alabama beat SW LA 25-6.
    

Oh man, cornbread Claybone?  mmmmm......

I may be a Yankee, but whenever I went south I always ate really well.
The folks in the south know how to put on a good feed, and the food
is like home-cooked!

Cornbread is one of the few things I can do in the kitchen...learned how
because I love it so much....


Go Tide!
'Saw

    
    Here is the combined out of conference records of some major
    college football conferences.
    
    Southeastern       Southwest           ACC            Big 8
    ------------     ------------     ------------     ------------
       17-7-1           14-10-0          19-4-0           16-13-1
    
    
       Big 10           Pac 10
    ------------     ------------
       16-13-1          17-14-0
    
    
    I do not know how many losses came by top 20 teams.I will try and find
    out.
    
    
    Go Vols
     Dave
    
    
    
    

	Also, how many wins came against Division I-AA teams (several for
	the ACC, I know).

    As sportsmen, it's Colorado's honor-bound duty to forfeit the game to
    Mizzou.  That they haven't done so is a display of dishonor.
    
    Will the sports "journalists" prove capable of accounting for their
    lack of honor when casting their final poll ballots on January 2nd?
    Or will they display the same brainless simplemindedness that has 
    Virgina and Clemsuck, two squads that have feasted by playing girl's
    schools, in the top 20.
    
    Big10 Tom

>    Or will they display the same brainless simplemindedness that has 
>    Virgina and Clemsuck, two squads that have feasted by playing girl's
>    schools, in the top 20.

The comparison between Indiana's and Virginia's schedule is being made
over in ACC. But here's Clemson's and Indiana's schedule of teams - and
their power rating - that they play outside of their conference:

Long Beach St        52.63
Appalachian St       59.76
Georgia              76.91
South Carolina       80.25
               avg   72.31
 
Kentucky             68.21
Missouri             75.09
Eastern Michigan     57.61
               avg   66.97

TTom

    .189 is incorrect not once but twice.  
    
    G-g-get it t-together willya, TTom?
                     
    Big10 Tom

Right you are. Clemson's teams' average 67.37, much closer to Indiana's
66.97.

TTom

    Still wrong on two c-counts, TTom.
    
    Big10 Tom 

I can live with it.

But thanks for the interest.

TTom

    Wait!  I *cain't* live with your obtrusive inaccuracies.  You made
    the fallacious comparison between the Hoosiers' schedule and that 
    of the unmentionable cheat-ass school from South Carolina and that
    is a shame.
    
    But, then again, you've never had any compunction about shameless
    inaccuracy when it's in your favor now have ya TTom?
    
    Big10 Tom

    >As sportsmen, it's Colorado's honor-bound duty to forfeit the game to
    >Mizzou.  That they haven't done so is a display of dishonor.
    
    I agree completely.  Some may argue that CU might have scored on the
    real 4th down if they knew they had to run a play.  On the other hand,
    there is no guarantee of that.  
    
    It would be a far lesser injustice if they were to forfeit the victory
    to Mizzou.
    
    And McCartney was classless to deny this by pointing to the field
    conditions and the alleged 90 "slips".
    
    Dan

T, Show me how the numbers favors Indiana and I'll remind you that it is
you, sir, that are denigrating others, not I.

TTom

    re: .188
    
    It is absurd to suggest that CU should forfeit the game.  The referees
    made an inexcusable error, not CU.  Colorado would certainly not have
    spiked the ball on Third Down (really fourth down) if they had known it
    was fourth down.  They would have run a play for the TD.
    
    Jan

    >T, Show me how the numbers favors Indiana and I'll remind you that 
    >it is you, sire, that [sic] are denigrating others, not I.
    
    Oh quit it with the bull-puke willya.
    
    I ain't denigrating nobody.  All I'm doing is pointing out the rather
    amazing and none too comforting fack that for some mysterious reason
    the Almost Close was unable to schedule a single tough nonconference
    opponent and that the three squads they have that are any good at all
    are enjoying the benefits of running and hiding from manly competition.
    
    >it's yours
    
    No, it's yours.  I axe you one last time: Denounce your fakery in the
    comparison between ClemSuck and the Hoosiers for it is incorrect on at
    least 4 factual levels that I caain point out if you force me to make
    you look bad (again).
    
    Big10 Tom

    So, where are those two defenders of good, Dan and Joe C., with
    a scading commentary about the Miami-Kansas pre-game fight?  
    
    JD

    >if they knew they had to run a play.
    
    You're so right, Dan.  But a small nit: McCartney's people cain 
    count, they knew the scorer failed to advance the down count, yet
    they maintained a sneaky silence for their part hoping to get and
    exploit the mistake for their craven purposes - and they in fack
    ended up doing just that!
    
    So, in summary: It wasn't just a quasi-innocent case of a mistake
    being found out and Colorado to craven and dishonorable to do the
    class Cornell-style thing and forfeit the victory over to the true
    winner, it was a cae of the Buff coaching staff - self-proclaimed 
    role models and leaders for their athletes, student body, and state's 
    children - actively participating in a cheat-ass!
    
    Big10 Tom

Hey, I like college football. Like I've said before, I like the Big10. I
went to and support ACC schools but the issue of who's is the most
immoral football scheduler is not something that keeps me awake. 

The issue of voting on rankings has been around since voting on rankings.
BYU was perhaps the biggest benefit of this system. Virginia certainly
adds fuel to the fire with their scheduling William & Mary. Clemson
doesn't help their cause with App St but losing to Georgia Tech hurts
worse. BTW if the Tigers are fluff, where does that put Georgia?

But look at a lot of teams records and you'll find cupcakes. In fact,
it's the norm and not the exception. True, at the very top there are
programs that week in and week out play either conference games or other
national programs. Michigan falls into that category. Their
non-conference foes are Maryland, UCLA and Notre Dame. Colorado and 
Tennessee have started out with very strong schedules. Miami-FL plays the 
biggies but it also plays non-biggies such as Kansas and Boston College.

Virginia has a weak non-conference schedule but so does Nebraska, who 
also got a lot of #1 votes this week: Northern Illinois (Div 1-AA),
Minnesota and Baylor. But like I said, playing non-competitive games is 
what's happening. As I mentioned, the beloved Hoosiers hosted that 
powerhouse Eastern Michigan.

I think a lot of this discussion goes back to a basic inferiority complex 
that some supporters of the Big10 - and maybe even the Big10, itself - 
suffer from: no repsect. We hear it about how they get third rate money 
for third rate time slots on TV. I'm sorry that they don't have a better 
PR person, what can I say.

TTom

    
     re.200
    
    >You're so right, Dan.  But a small nit: McCartney's people cain 
    >count, they knew the scorer failed to advance the down count, yet
    >they maintained a sneaky silence for their part hoping to get and
    >exploit the mistake for their craven purposes - and they in fack
    >ended up doing just that!
    
    Do you really think the CU coaching staff was counting on an 
    official's error to win the game?  That their play calling was
    based on the error sticking and that was the driving force in
    their play calling.  The Missouri coaching staff can count as
    well.  Why didn't they say something?  For example, let me use 
    your rationale and reverse the case.
    
    Missouri's coach's people can count.  They knew the scorer failed
    to advance the down count, yet they maintained a sneaky silence
    for their part hoping to get and exploit the mistake for their
    craven purposes--and they in fact ended up just doing that!
    
    This scenario is just as ludicrious as the first one...
    
    (Missouri now has the sympathies of the college football world, who think
    they got screwed and lost a game that they had won already...whereas
    it was quite possible that CU would have scored just as well and
    won the game legitimately.  Because of the error, CU's never had
    the *chance* to win the game honestly, which in my opinion is just as
    damaging....)
    
    Don't get me wrong.  I just think it's ridiculous to think that
    either team wanted the official's error on purpose, instead of a 
    fair, honest game.   Now, everyone loses...
                                               
   
   Peace/ed

    >So, where are those two defenders of good, Dan and Joe C., with
    >a scading commentary about the Miami-Kansas pre-game fight?  
    
    As Bill Murray once said, "Didn't see it".  According to the Globe,
    Kansas was riled up before the game and the fight ensued.  They didn't
    lay blame, nor can I.
    
    But then, no one has ever said nothing bad has ever happened with
    Miami.
    
    Dan

    >You're so right, Dan.  But a small nit: McCartney's people cain 
    >count, they knew the scorer failed to advance the down count, yet
    >they maintained a sneaky silence for their part hoping to get and
    >exploit the mistake for their craven purposes - and they in fack
    >ended up doing just that!
    
    Wait, it gets worse.  I heard Saturday that a number of CU players on
    the field knew that they were about to take the 5th down and went
    complaining to the sidelines wondering what to do!  Players who weren't
    coy enough to be sneaky had to be ordered to be sneaky to pull this
    off.
    
    As I've thought about this I can't help but come to some very poor
    conclusions about McCartney.  Last year he pushed the moral high ground
    of rallying around a player's death to exhort his team.  This year, he
    lowers to accepting an indecent victory.
    
    Dan

    
    The National quotes Coach Erickson as accepting responsibility, but
    they give no description of what actually happened.
    
    glenn
    

    � This year, he lowers to accepting an indecent victory.
    
    Gee, if I had only read *this* sentence in Dan's note, I couldn't be
    sure if he was talking about the Buffs' McArtney or Michigan State's
    George Perles.
    
    C'mon, State, give back the win and restore Michigan to its rightful
    perch at No. 1.   Big Ten honor demands that you do so.   Not to
    mention the tube ratings.  We don't want another Rose Bowl with your
    boring green uniforms and your "halfa" helmets.
    
    Haw-haw ...
    
    Bob Hunt

    >Don't get me wrong.  I just think it's ridiculous to think that
    >either team wanted the official's error on purpose, instead of a 
    >fair, honest game.   Now, everyone loses...
    
    Ed, if CU did the honorable thing, and gave Missouri the victory,
    everyone wins.  From what I've read of the Cornell, nearly identical
    situation, everyone came out smelling as a rose.  Even the poor wide
    receiver who made a tremendous catch to briefly win the game swallowed
    his disappointment and felt better for doing what's right.  Dartmouth
    won the game; Cornell won tremendous respect; even the referee who
    admitted his error ended up a winner in this situation.
    
    Steven, re: Mich/Mich St.  That was referee's judgement which is not
    nearly the same thing as an extra down.  Games are decided by referee's
    judgement ever weekend of the year, and must be accepted.  FOr
    instance, every time the Jets lose this year, it is indoubtedly due to
    poor referee's judgement.
    
    Dan
                                                           

    
    	Enough already.  The only player I know of who even had
    	a suspicion that the down marker was wrong was Bienemy.
    	He wasn't sure what down it was but I doubt he was
    	snickering in the huddle about winning the game on 5th
    	down.
    
    	Dan, "I heard..." doesn't cut it.  You guys are making
    	them out  to be a bunch of crooks who haven't an ounce
    	of honor amongst the whole team.  Give it a break unless
    	you can document your accusations.
    
    	BTW, I think they oughta give the W to Mizzou.  They
    	still have to play NU and OU.  If they beat both of
    	them, they win the Big 8 title regardless of a loss to
    	Mizzou.
    
    	Claybone

    	>Dan, "I heard..." doesn't cut it.  You guys are making
        
    Very well.
    
    "ESPN reported, on College Football Game Day at 12:00 Eastern Time
    Saturday afternoon..."
    
    And they didn't say just Bienemy, and they didn't say just one player. 
    They said "a number of players on the field..."
    
    Does this sit better with you Clay?
    
    Dan

    re: 208
    
    Dan, the refs screwed up big-time in that game!  Read my lips--the REFS
    screwed up, not CU.
    
    If you notice the replay, the refs never stopped the clock when Jon
    Bowman got the first down that brought the Buffs to the 3 yard line.
    Then they never changed the down marker or the scoreboard when it
    second down (so there were two second downs).
    
    The pressure was high, time running out, confusion reigned due to the
    ref's incompetence.  CU's coaching staff and players were not
    surreptitiously planning dastardly deeds on the sidelines.  They were
    trying to make sense out of the situation and drive for the TD.
    
    As a CU Buff fan, I am so sorry this situation ever happened. It wasn't
    fair to either team.  Mizzou will always feel they were robbed of a
    victory - and CU is haunted by this game and finds it a shallow victory
    indeed.  
    
    But it was the REFS who screwed up.  If the refs had been on top of the
    situation, CU's playcalling would have been different.  And they would
    have either won or lost the game on their own merit---not due to the
    incompetence of the refs.
    
    It is appropriate that the refs have been suspended.  And the only
    humourous side of this is a quote from Nebraska Marty from the Big 8
    Conference.  He states that the refs got new jobs--they are teaching
    math at CU!
    
    Regards,
    Jan  

    
    In Miami's pre game fight, it was stated that the Kansas players were 
    warming up and that the Miami players just moved in and tried to take
    over the area KU was using.  Erickson (sp?) took the blame for this.
    
    Bob V.
    

    
    	Sure Dan, mail me the tape.  Make sure you dub in your
    	snide comments about players not coy enough to sneaky 
    	being ordered to be sneaky.  It'll make for much better
    	narration then Lee Corso's comments........
    
    	Claybone

    Erickson of Miami has been trying to change Miami's image, the one
    fostered by Jimmy Johnson.  Earlier in the year, he tried to get
    his players to stop taunting.  Then he tried to get them to stop
    the big time celebrating after every play.  He took the blame for
    the fight, saying he should have held the team away from the Kansas
    players (evidently, the tunnel onto the field was on the side of
    the Kansas team).   I give Erickson credit for trying to get his
    team to act a little classier.  And before someone comments - no,
    he didn't want to ban celebrating - but merely reserve celebrating
    for things like touchdowns - and not for tying one's shoes....
    
    Of course, if a certain other team had done what Miami had done
    this past weakend, a certain defender of all that is good would
    have been on the attack already...
    
    ALso, no discussion on Tennessee's sexual assault case?  Thankfully
    Majors suspended those involved - even though nothing had been
    substantiated.
    
    JD

    >CU didn't break any rules, the refs did.
    
    Oh how wrong you are.  The refs didn't break any rule, they made
    a_egregious mistake worsened by their being to stubborn to review
    the situation prior to declaring the game over.
    
    No, Gaulke_boy, it was CU who broke the rule.  You're right that
    the craven Buffs didn't break any rule of football.  The rule they
    broke was the rule of honor.
    
    Shame on Colorado.  And double shame on any Buff fans hungry and
    guiltless enough to actually defend this well-documented crime of
    success-over-basic human decency.
    
    MrT

    >what the fuque do you know about honor?
    
    If I were in CXO I'd be washing your mouf out with soap right
    now, Gaulke_boy, for one thing.  For another, I know enough about
    honor to have been completely unsurprised by McCartney's craven
    dishonorable greed-driven stinking cheaty theft.  
    
    After all, this is a "leader" of young men who spent all last fall
    on national television doing self-serving maudlin interviews bragging
    about how proud he is that his daughter bore his dying QB's illegitimate
    child.
    
    Some people will do anything to enhance recruiting.
    
    MrT

    The Tennessee players involved in the assault were suspended by Majors
    for known Team Rules violations rather than unsubstantiated sexual
    assault.  
    
    Tom Warthen

    
    
    
    I believe since the Cornell-Dartmouth game there have been at
    least two other incidents of a major referee mistake like the
    fifth down this year.  In 1961, Notre Dame beat Syracuse 19-17 
    on field goal after time had expired and the officials did not
    realize the game was over.  In 1972, Miami (Fla.) beat Tulane
    24-21 on a similar fifth down in the closing seconds of the game.
    
    Neither Notre Dame nor Miami gave up the victory.  In this
    year's Colorado-Missouri game, Colorado intentionally grounded
    the ball on what they thought was 3rd down.  If they knew it
    was fourth down they would have ran the same play they ran on
    "fifth down" and scored like they did anyway.  Because of
    the officials error, their victory is tarnished.  And they
    didn't get a *chance* to win legit.  
    
    
   Peace/ed

    Bob ... if any team has an UGLIER helmet and uniform than Michgan State, it
    has to be Michgan ..... ugh ....                                       

    So, comparing CU to Notre Dame and Miami!  Even I won't go that low!
    
    Not having the benefit of a clock stopping incomplete pass,
    Colorado would have had to rush the play and the results 
    could have been quite different.  However, CU claims they
    would have passed on third down.  Mizzou, of course, would
    have run it back for six and won by two touchdowns!
    
    :-)
    

What *is* the Michigan helmet supposed to represent anyway.  I've
never figured that out......

'Saw

    
    I love Michigan's uniforms and helmet, even if I don't like the team. 
    The helmets are a throwback to the leather days, where (I guess) they 
    painted the strips inside the seams on the top.  Makes 'em look like
    some kind of beetle or something...
    
    glenn
    

    Mr. T - it is clear that you have not thought the CU-Mizzou game out
    properly.  I give you the benefit of the doubt for being an intelligent
    person--since you work for Digital.  However, I think you missed the
    boat on this one!
    
    CU is as much a victim in this game as Mizzou because of the ineptness
    of the referees.  We were not allowed to win or lose this game based on
    the abilities of the players on the field.  We were not allowed to call
    the plays as they would have been called if they refs had been
    competent.
    
    And the pontificating of people such as yourself merely adds an
    unnecessary level of emotion.  And you remark regarding the personal
    tragedy experienced by the McCartney and Aunese families falls into the
    classless category.  
    
    Jan

    
    CU is a victim as much as Mizzou? If both teams got a "L", that could
    be true.  It seems like CU likes this we are the victims, woe is us
    thing too much.

    >I give you the benefit of the doubt for being an intelligent 
    >person--since you work for Digital.
    
    What's this, some kinda twisted joke?
    
    Intelligence don't got nothing to do with it, CU stole the game
    under the questionable leadership of a coach who relentlessly 
    exploited his QB's cancer to campaign for a #1 ranking and in the
    process he didn't show the requisite class to say that the bearing
    of illegitimate children is what's ruining this Great Nation of ours.
    
    Oh, go ahaid and take cheep shots at me, but *I* have the facts of the
    matter in my corner.
    
    re: Michigan's helmets
    
    The design was devised by a coach from way back, even maybe before the
    Great War, for the purpose of making it easier for their QB to be able
    to identify his receivers.  There is nothing symbolized by the design.
    
    MrT

>                 ...  We were not allowed to win or lose this game based on
>    the abilities of the players on the field.  We were not allowed to call
>    the plays as they would have been called if they refs had been
>    competent.
    
    WE ?????? Hey Jan, I dident know you played for Colorado. What number
    are you???   ;^)   So by that last sentence you ADMIT that CU got a
    HUGE gift.
    
    All I know is one thing:
    
    	Colorado "beat" Mizzou by 1 by virtue of a 5th down.
    
    	Nebraska beat Mizzou 69 - 21 (Mizzou's last TD came as time ran out
                                      aginst Husker 4th & 5th stringers)
    
    As a Nebraska fan my mouth is waterin for some Buffalo meat. Bring on
    Colorado November 3rd !!! The sea of red in Lincoln will be ready !!
    
    Nebraska Marty

    
    re. .230
    
    >>All I know is one thing:
    
       >>Colorado "beat" Mizzou by 1 by virtue of a 5th down.
    
       >>Nebraska beat Mizzou 69 - 21 (Mizzou's last TD came as time ran out
                                      aginst Husker 4th & 5th stringers)
    
    Using your rationale.  Nebraska should beat Colorado 69-22.
    Football doesn't work that way.  Nebraska's insignificant
    schedule should catch up to them when they play Colorado,
    just like it did last year.
    
    
    Peace/ed
    

    Peace/ed - Just admit it. As a CU fan you are shaking in your boots
    about the prospects of having to leave the confines of Boulder, travel
    to Lincoln to play Nebraska (where the refs call obvious clips on punt
    returns) without the inspiration of SAL as CU used last year.
    
    You and I have been over many of these points before in note 27 already.
    
    Yes, Nebraska does have a patsy schedule this year. I have admitted
    that many times over in note 27, but the Huskers are starting to 
    look pretty good. Buffs are dog meat come Nov. 3rd. I will be just
    one of the 76000 dressed in red in Lincoln for the game. Cant wait !!!
    I'm telling ya, I have kept in touch with the mood back in Nebraska.
    The whole state cant wait. I have been to many NU games in Lincoln and
    the Husker fans RARELY boo an oponent as the visiting team enters the
    stadium. But I tell ya, the boo birds will be flyin when Buffalo meat
    comes out the shoot. I hope Hagen has good lungs because he will need
    it as we shout ourselves sore when CU has the ball.
    
    Party in Lincoln Nov. 3rd !!!!1
    
    Nebraska Marty

    
    $  @whiny_sourgrapes_NUfan_brokenrecord.com

    >Of course, if a certain other team had done what Miami had done
    >this past weakend, a certain defender of all that is good would
    >have been on the attack already...
    
    JD, it might interest you to know that last year when Notre Dame didn't
    let USC out of the tunnel before the game, and started a brawl I didn't
    comment on it.  That is, until a few weeks ago when people were saying
    that these kinds of things "never happen at Notre Dame".
    
    Dan

    If you look at the way NU is playing compared to the way CU is playing
    at this point, it would be make sense to think that NU will have their
    way with the Buffs.  But I guarantee NU will not roll over the Buffs.
    CU will be ready for NU come November 3rd.
    
    Look at how well CU has performed against NU the last 6 years, yet only
    once (last year, obviously) has CU had an excellent team.
    
    1984 in Boulder: CU loses a hard-fought game 24-7 after leading 7-3 at
    the end of the 3rd quarter.  CU was 1-10 that year.
    
    1985 in Lincoln: NU wins another close game 17-7, but it was tied into
    the 4th quarter.
    
    1986 in Boulder: CU wins 20-10.
    
    1987 in Boulder: NU wins fairly easy by about 2 TD's, but I forget the
    exact score.
    
    1988 in Lincoln: NU wins 7-0.  J.J. Flanigan fumbles in the open field
    when he definitely would've scored a TD.
    
    1989 in Boulder: As we all know, CU wins 27-21, but Husker fans are
    still crying about bad calls.
    
    1990 in Lincoln: Buffs win!!!!!!!!!!
    
    Joe

    >If they knew it
    >was fourth down they would have ran the same play they ran on
    >"fifth down" and scored like they did anyway.
    
    I know you'd like to think so Ed, but it's a terrible assumption to
    make, and these facts show that to be so.
    
    * The ball was grounded on 4th down with 2 seconds to go in the game.
    
    * After having a 1st and goal on the 3, Bienemy had twice failed to
      score on goal line plunges.
    
    * After the real 3rd down, the clock was briefly, wrongly and
      inexplicably stopped by the referees, giving CU its chance at having
      the real 4th down.
    
    * If the referees hadn't made their error, CU doesn't stop the clock. 
      The QB doesn't go talk to the coach and get a play.  They don't get a
      rest.  They don't make changes.
    
    * In short, instead of being panicky, rushed and disorganized for the
      final plunge, they were able to be cool and calculating.  It makes a
      great deal of difference.
    
    Yes, they still might have scored regardless, but to forfeit that last
    frantic opportunity and retain honor is a far lesser Wrong than what
    has occured.
    
    Dan

    re: .233
    
    @sys$nocharacter:5th_down_whiney_about_field_hypocritical_crybaby_Cu.com

    @rathole

    @butthole
    

    Whoa, lots a mud slinging goin on here. If you cant stand the heat,
    then get out of the kitchen !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    
    Nebraska Marty

    re: .231
    
    I was not trying to say that NU will beat CU by some rediculous score
    such as 69 - 22.
    
    I was mereley stating that NU had an extremely easy time with a team
    which dealt CU fits. I understand that the common opponent thing does
    not mean much many times.
    
    All I'm saying is that it's gonna be VERY hard, all things considered,
    for CU to beat Nebraska this year. I think that Oklahoma will be
    tougher to beat than Colorado. But then, when have I ever been known
    to be correct with my predictions.   ;^)
    
    Nebraska Marty

    If you look at the ever-widening CU Buff scandal from the right vs.
    wrong standpoint, you gotta really hope that they get stomped big
    time by the power house Corn Huskers.  The Huskers need to stomp
    these questionable individuals into the dirt for their own purposes
    anyway, but now there's a moral dimension to the game and clean
    cut Tom Osborne is just the main to teach this shady McCartney
    character the life lesson he deserves!
    
    MrT

You mean the Nebraska of Baylor, Northern Illinois and Oregon State fame?

TTom

    
    Are you talking about the Northern Illinois that gave Top 25
    ranked Fresno State their only loss 73-18.
    
    The Fresno State that beat Fullerton State (38-3)
    by two touchdowns more than mighty Auburn (38-17)?
    
    That Northen Illinois?  The one Nebraska beat 60-14?
    
    Oregon State?  
    
    Didn't they just whip Arizona by two touchdown?  
    The Arizona (4-2) which gave Illinois it's only loss?
    
    Baylor well they're only 3-3.
    
    ???
    
     p.s. You forgot Minnesota which NU beat 56-0.
          Isn't Minnesota leading the Big X currently?
    

Be that as it may, and remembering that it's someone else's hot button,
Nebraska has a current schedule rating of 66.51, compared to Virginia's
70.73 and Indiana's 67.58.

Oregon State's win over Arizona was an unexpected bonus, adding to the
rating. As Minnesota loses more games, this will bring it down. Same goes
for Baylor.

TTom

    
    Are Fullerton State and Cal State-Fullerton the same school?
    

    
    
    SOOOEEE  Claybone       49-17   ouch!!  what has happened
    to those "run off to the sec" hogs of yours?
    
    Cadzilla

    re: .242
    
    Well said !!! And I'll be there in the sea of red at Nebraska Nov. 3rd
    screaming for it to happen !!!
    
    Now that Oklahoma got upset in a conference game, I'm not sure who to
    root for in the Colorado Bufallo Meat vs Oklahoma Okie's game this
    Saturday. I think Nebraska plays Iowa State this Saturday. Iowa State
    beat Okie.
    
    Nebraska Marty

   Is it true that Colorado Buff cast-off Bill(ious) Mallory led the
   Indiana Hoser's to another Excellent Loss?

   Inquiring minds deen to wonk
   Mike JN

         I was saddened to read that UMASS' fine sophomore QB, Gary
    Wilkos suffered a broken neck (fractured first vertebrae) in their
    game against Delaware on Saturday.  Fortunately he was not paralyzed,
    however he will be placed in a halo cast for the next several months
    and his career is probably over.  According to newspaper accounts
    Wilkos was down on field for over forty minutes until such time
    as he could be immobilized and placed in an ambulance.  The injury
    and comments by the Delaware defense evidently fired up UMASS because
    they held Delaware to minus 80 yards in offense in the second half.
    
         Although the victory should move the undefeated UMASS team
    to the top five in Division 1AA, the outcome was indeed bittersweet
    as there is a large fall off in talent in going to the second string
    QB.  Nazz or John Hendry, any other news on this injury?
    
    Russ
                                                 

    No news yet, though when I'm up in Amherst for the game Saturday I'll
    ask my former colleagues on the medical staff.
    
    Tis indeed sad, and it takes away from one of the greatest football
    wins UMass has had in recent years.  We were 0 for 14 going in against
    Delaware.  From all accounts, Wilkos is a good kid (I know one of his
    professors) and a great team leader and I'm very, very sorry to see
    this happen.  If anyone can come back from an injury like this, he can.
    He's the best QB we've had in a few years.
    
    This leaves UMass at 5-0 and UNH at 4-0 atop the Yankee Conference. 
    UNH has 4 league games left and we have 3.  We also have the game with
    Northeastern this week.  The final game of the season is UMass at UNH
    on Saturday, November 17, in what should probably be the game of the
    year in New England college football.
    
    I'll predict that both teams will win the rest of their games prior to
    the showdown.  After the Northeastern game, UMass is at Richmond and
    has Villanova at home.  UNH is at BU this week, has Villanova at home
    and is at Rhode Island.  I unfortunately must predict a UNH win now
    that Wilkos is out.
    
    It's more important that Gary is out of danger, however.
    
    John                                      

    Only what you reported.  It is indeed good news that Wilkos will not
    be paralyzed.  He was not taken away by ambulance for over 40 minutes
    even though Delaware has two ambulances at every game, because
    coincidentally, bot were being used when Wilkos went down. 
    
    I certainly hope he can recover enough to lead a normal life, and I
    pray he never even considers playing football again.
    
    NAZZ

    What did the Delaware defense say to provoke the Minutemen ???
    
    I'd be surprised if a Tubby Raymond team showed poor sportsmanship.
    
    Bob Hunt

    >Is it true that Bill... Mallory led... Indiana... to another 
    >Excellent Loss?
    
    No.  The Excellent Loss theory would in no way apply to the ass-
    kicking I witnessed from my sky box in the Dome Saturday afternoon.
    
    You should improve your thinking, Mike.  Mistake-prone.
    
    Big10 Tom

    Re: 13.254
    
         Supposedly the Delaware players were saying things like
    "Take that meat off the field", "another one for the boneyard" and
    "next one for the ambulance", the last one directed at the 2nd string QB.
    
         Probably pretty typical trash talk, but given the obvious
    serious nature of the injury, it served to wave a "red flag" in
    front of the UMASS team.

    Very surprising behavior from a Tubby Raymond-coached Delaware team.  I
    suspect Tubby will take some action.  It would be within his
    philosophy.
    
    Bob Hunt

    Didn't Virginia lose its ALL-ACC tightend (McGonical ?) for the rest of
    the season? I think I heard he ruptured his spleen falling while trying
    to save his girl friend's dog at an excavation site.

    Yes, tight end Bruce McGonnigal (sp?) sat out the Wake Forest game
    after he had an accidental fall down some stairs.
    
    I had heard that he some internal injuries but that he would return in
    time for the Georgia Tech game.  Virginia's got this Saturday off so
    hopefully he can use the two weeks to recuperate fully.
    
    Certainly a ruptured spleen is more serious but I haven't heard that
    diagnosis yet.
    
    Bob Hunt

    I'm happy to report that Gary Wilkos is back on the UMass campus.  He
    was at the game Saturday and was wearing a halo brace and watched the
    game from the press box.  He's completely mobile and should make a full
    recovery for normal life.  Don't know whether he'll ever be able to
    play again though.
    
    I can't go into the medical details but he was never paralyzed and the
    reason he was on the field for 40 minutes before being moved was that
    both ambulances at the game were at a hospital - 1 had brought out an
    unconcious Delaware player and 1 had brought out a fan who'd had a
    heart attack.  Gary was in the hospital all week and was transported
    back on Friday.
    
    It was a clean hit and he didn't have his head down.  He was hit front
    and back simultaneously and the person who hit him from the front got
    him right under the chin and snapped his head back.  For those of you
    who've never seen him play, Gary is a skinny little guy (Doug Flutie is
    more impressive physically) with no fear at all and he takes an awful
    lot of physical abuse during a game.  He did show a lot of brains after
    the hit, however.  He knew something was wrong and stayed down, where
    another player might have tried to play through the injury and then
    really gotten messed up.
    
    The reports in the Globe about the Delaware players were exaggerated. 
    Our team physician told me that the players and coaches who he heard
    were all very concerned.  Most of them came over to Gary to wish him
    well, telling him to get better soon because they wanted to play him
    again - not out of malice but because they have tremendous respect for
    him.  Most football players, despite the macho posturing, do have a
    great mutual respect for a worthy opponent.  Gary is a worthy opponent. 
    He's exciting, he's tough, he makes things happen and for a fan, he's a
    lot of fun to watch.  He's very well respected among his teammates and
    was named captain for one of the games this year as a sophomore.
    
    In short, the people at Delaware were great during and after the
    injury.  There may have been a couple of jerks who said something but
    by and large, the Fightin' Blue Hens conducted themselves with lots of
    class.
    
    It was very moving to see Gary walk into the stadium on Saturday.  It
    was during pregame warmups.  The team burst into applause, two of the
    starting offensive linemen escorted him up to the press box, one of
    them (who had his helmet off) was in tears the whole time and the fans
    gave Gary a standing ovation.
    
    It's good to have him healthy.  In talking to the doctor and trainer,
    the people I worked with in school, I was again reminded of how lucky I
    was to have worked for such good people and how lucky the athletic
    department is to have such dedicated, high quality people there.  They
    handled it exactly right and I'm convinced Gary is walking today
    because of them.
    
    John

   � In short, the people at Delaware were great during and after the
   � injury.  There may have been a couple of jerks who said something but
   � by and large, the Fightin' Blue Hens conducted themselves with lots of
   � class.
    
    This is *much* closer to what I would have expected from Delaware and
    Tubby Raymond. Thanks for clearing this up, John.
    
    And that's also good news about the UMass quarterback.
    
    Bob Hunt

    Here is a Denver Post survey of 20 Heisman voters (5 from the South, 5
    from the Midwest, 5 from the West, 3 from the East and 2 from the
    Southwest).  Players get 3 points for a first-place vote, 2 for a
    second-place vote and 1 for a third-place vote.
    
    1. Shawn Moore, UVA           40 points
    2. Ty Detmer, BYU             29.5
    3. Overrated Ismail, ND       28
    4. Eric Bieniemy, CU          8.5
    5. Vaughn, Michigan           5
    6. Klingler, Houston          5
    7. G. Lewis, Washington       3
    8. K. Swilling, Ga Tech       1
    
    
    Notice a trend here?  Every one of these candidates plays for a top-25
    team, and 6 of those teams are ranked in the top 10.
    
    Joe

    Geez, I at first glance I thought .262 might be an interesting reply.
    Then I see:
    
    3. Overrated Ishmail, ND
       ^^^^^^^^^
    
    Life must be real hard to have to live every waking moment (and
    probably sleeping moment too) with such hatred of anything that even
    vaguely resembles ND.  How aweful it must be being you.  But, thanks
    for being you cause like JD said yesterday, it makes me want to see ND
    win, just for the entertainment you provide.......
    
    At least Dan has other things to worry about, like the Jets, Lakers,
    Prez Bush, etc.  :-)
    
    Hawk

    Hawk, you probably rooted for Goliath too, and didn't mind it even when
    he got caught with illegal objects in his shorts that he pulled out
    when the referee wasn't looking.
    
    Dan

    Good one, Dan!  At least you can make light of things and put them in
    their proper perspectives, I think!  :-)
    
    Hawk

    Hawk, Ishmail *is* overrated.
    
    Mark.

    Mark, *actually*, I *feel* that Ishmail *is* *overrated* too *!*
    
    I'm just *tired* of *seeing* anti-ND *stuff* in *every* **freakin'**
    note by *a* _particular_ noter who *doesn't* have a *life* after
    *ND-hatred* *.*
    
    *H*T*H*
    
    Ha*wk

    Vaughn should have more votes...

    IsHmail probably is over rated but ISMAIL isn't
    

    I wonder what one would say if Ismaihl(sp?) was on their favorite
    team?? I would bet they would think differently, Huh?????
    
    
                                                M.J.
                                             

    
    Can someone please tell me why he's over-rated? If you mean he
    shouldn't be in the top 10 Heisman poll then fine I agree, but 
    don't berate the kid based on the University he happens to attend.
    He's got alot of talent and any real football fan could see that.
    Maybe you should ask the Michigan player's if they think he's 
    over-rated.
    
    
    Steve

    Steve, like you, I feel the Rocket is not a top contender for the
    Heisman.  However, during every Nother Shame (tm) telecast, the announcers
    have all but mailed him the award.
    
    Thus, he is overrated.
    
    Mark.

    Where will the Rocket play in the pros?  I've got to admit that in the
    open field I'm not sure I've *ever* seen a college tailback or flanker 
    with that kind of speed.  Usually when a guy gets into the secondary, a 
    defensive back with an angle on him can at least get a shot at him.  
    Ismail just explodes and is *gone*.  Unfortunately, I don't think he 
    can play running back in the NFL because I'm not impressed with him 
    around the line of scrimmage, nor have I seen any great pass receiving 
    skills (as in what he does before he gets the ball; size also hurts him 
    here).  No doubt he'll catch on even if just for his kickoff/punt
    return abilities and general big play threat potential, but what kind
    of a future does the NFL hold?
    
    Run-and-shoot material, maybe?
    
    glenn
    

    
    Mark, that's a crock of you know what! I have watched several
    telecast's and have not heard thet kind talk at all. Yes, maybe
    they had mentioned that he was a Heisman hopeful or something
    to that effect, but every announcer say's those things. 
    
    
    Steve

    
    That poll back in .262 shows Ismail third, very close to second.  No
    doubt that he's in everyone's top 5 (fifth would be about as high as I
    would go).  There's no denying that Ismail has been pumped for the
    Heisman from the opening game.  I've heard it mentioned in every ND
    game thus far, usually in reference as one of the favorites.
    
    glenn
    

 The Rocket in the pros would be a perfect Dave Meggett....

 mike 

    I'd say he's overrated because last I checked he was barely in the
    top 30 in total offense (including his runbacks) and wasn't in the
    the top 20 in receiving or rushing. Guys like Vaughn, the guy from
    U of Washington, etc seem more worthy to me.  Anyone got any stats?

    
    True, he is over-rated in the Heisman balloting, but not as a 
    player. 
    
    
    
    Steve

    If Rocket didn't play for ND he wouldn't be a top 10 candidate...

    
    Walt, what if he played for, Michigan, USC, UCLA, Miami etc...??
    
    I still think you would see him in there.
    
    
    
    Steve

    
    I think Eric Bieniemy of Colorado is underrated.  He leads the nation
    in rushing (both in sheer yards --1228 yds and yards per game--153.5
    yrd/pg).  He also achieved this against some very excellent defensive
    teams--against the rush (Washington--which I think leads the nation in
    rushing defense, Illinois (another very good defensive team), etc.
    
    Also, he didn't even play in the Tennessee game...
    
    Peace/ed

    I'd like to see the difference in stats between Ismail and Desmond
    Howard.  Howard's not in the race, is he?

  I'm another one who thinks that Eric Bieniemy is being overlooked for the
  Heisman. Going into the CU-Wash game, Washington's defense had only given
  up 23 yards on the ground average per game. Bieniemy gained 148 yards against
  them. Last week he gained 187 yards against Oklahoma and he leads the
  nation in rushing with a very tough schedule. What more does he need
  to do to get recognition for the Heisman ?

					Keith

    	If Bienemy has stellar numbers against NU this week(like say 180+
    yds. rushing and a couple of TD's), look for his stock to rise.
                                                   
    	Bienemy's being 'overlooked' for the Heisman is because he, like CU
    overall, got off to a slow start this year.  He was suspended for the 
    Tennessee game and performed sluggishly for a few weeks afterwards.  The 
    'if he played for ND' bit doesn't wash simply because Rocket has had some 
    great games this year and he's #4 in the polls, which is behind Bienemy.
    
    	I'd like to see him win it too, but the reality is that he hurt
    himself early with poor judgement and poor performance.
    
    						 glen j.
    
      
    
      

A game between Ball State and Ohio U, that was scheduled to been played in
Ireland, will now be played in Muncie, Ind. It seems that the promoter of
the event wanted some additional money and the schools didn't think that
there was $150K difference between Indiana and Ireland.

TTom

    Yesterdays national said that the Rocket had gained over 700 yds. (735
    yds I think) the last 3 games. 
    
                                              Dan
    

    Well, with CU playing Nebraska this weekend the jokes are already
    flying: 
    
    1.  The "N" on the Nebraska helmet stands for knowledge.
    
    2.  What's the difference between Nebraska cheerleaders and catfish?
    
    		One has warts and whiskers, the other lives in a lake.
    
    3.  What's the difference between corn flakes and Cornhuskers?
    
    		Corn flakes look better in a bowl.
    
    4.  A Cornhusker ran into the Police Department and said "Officer you
        have to help me, it's beginning to rain, I locked my keys in the
    	car and I have to get the top up!"   The officer said "Well, your
        top is down!"  The Cornhusker said "You can't help me?  My family
    	can't help me either, they're locked in the car!"
    
    That's all I can remember off the top of my head.
    
    Live from Charger Central......Glenn

    UMass clinched a tie for the Yankee Conference title with a 26-9 win at
    Richmond while Villanova beat UNH 10-7.  A win by UMass over Villanova
    Saturday will wrap up our first un-shared Yankee Conference title since
    1978, and a berth in the Division 1-AA playoffs.
    
    John

    ASU snapped the school's longest losing streak in history on Saturday,
    by routing hopeless OSU, 34-9.  Five games is the record set by this
    year's team.
    
    They were actually supposed to be good this year, but they've had more
    than their share of injuries.
    
    Looks like the ASU-Arizona game this year will, once again, only have
    state bragging rights on the line.  I couldn't believe what Washington
    did to Arizona!
    
    Mike

    The University of Massachusetts won its first undisputed Yankee
    Conference title since 1978 (the first undisputed title by anyone since
    Rhode Island did it in 1985, and we shared 4 titles in the 80s) with a
    3-0 win over Villanova on Saturday.  The only points came on a 24 yd FG
    by placekicker Marco Gabrielli with 1:06 to go in the first half.  We
    have one remaining regular season game at UNH Saturday with a chance to
    be the first undefeated UMass team since 1963.  If we beat UNH it sets
    a record for consecutive wins in a season and ties the record for most
    wins in a season.  If we can then win at least one playoff game, 10
    wins will be a season record.
    
    Williams extended its Division 3 winning streak to 21 with a 46-18
    pounding of arch rival Amherst College on Saturday.  Both games were in
    Amherst so it was a momentous football day in the foothills of the
    Berkshires.
    
    John

    Can someone please tell me what happened to the Pitt Panthers this
    year?  I don't live and die for Panther football, but I have noticed
    the scores.  They must be awful this year.  I thought the players all
    loved Paul Hackett.
    
    Anybody got the scoop?
    
    	--dan'l

    
    >                      -< What happened to Pitt? >-
    
    The most devastating blow was when Curvin Richards, a legitimate future
    All-American running back candidate, went down with an injury.  He has
    since returned but with limited effectiveness.  I know he came back for
    a few plays in the ND game, ripped off a few nice runs, then re-injured
    the hamstring or whatever has been bothering him, which pretty much ended 
    Pitt's hopes in what was a close game.
    
    Flipping through the channels Saturday, I noticed that there seemed to
    be about 600 people (family and friends?) in the stands for the game
    against Temple, although the announced attendance was 16,000.  I know
    that the season has been a major disappointment, Richards or no, but
    that's pathetic even in the bad weather.  It's almost no wonder that
    with that kind of support in this group of senior's final game, they
    went out and rolled over...
    
    glenn
    
    

    Pitt and Temple also had a bench clearing brawl during Saturday's
    game - in which Temple's head coach was punched out by a Panther.
    
    JD

    Another shameful episode up in Big Ten country. When will the
    despicable state legislatures do something about this? This could never
    happen in the righteous and beautiful Southeast because we have access
    to the Great Lakes via the Love Canal.
    
    Chris

    The Minutemen came up flat against UNH and lost 36-18.  Bye bye
    undefeated season and bye bye home game in the first round of the
    playoffs.  We get to go to beautiful Williamsburg, Va on Saturday to
    play William and Mary.  The winner of this will probably get the 1-AA
    version of the Lambert Trophy (I think it's the Lambert Cup) symbolic
    of the best team in the East.
    
    No excuses.  UNH showed their quality and just plain stuck it to us. 
    They scored on 4 of their first 5 possessions.  In fact, on their first
    touchdown, while attempting to kick the extra point, their holder
    fumbled the snap and the kicker passed for a 2 point conversion.  I
    sort of knew then it wasn't going to be our day.
    
    Even though UNH won, they still didn't make the 1-AA playoffs.  We're
    the only New England representative.
    
    UNH is the best passing team I've seen all year.  Their QB, Matt
    Griffin (from Athol, Ma adding insult to injury) was out for their 3
    losses and his loss really showed.  We couldn't stop him all day.  He
    kept hitting TE Matt Chmura (younger brother of BC TE Mark Chmura, both
    from Deerfield, Ma - more insult) all day and we just couldn't stop it.
    
    We did win halftime, however.  Our marching band made the trip.  It was a
    little difficult for the 60-member UNH band to compete with the
    290-member UMass band.  We don't win every game, but we always win
    halfime.  Always.
    
    John

                  
    Through fifteen years living in New Hampshire (during a few of which I 
    attended almost every UNH home game with a friend who eventually ended 
    up as a Wildcat kicker), I have never been able to figure out the 
    Yankee Conference.  That counts double for UNH itself.  Once again, UNH
    appeared to have the top talent in the conference, but lost three
    straight games to lesser teams to put them out of the running.  And 
    this coming after how many years in a row where a victory over UMass 
    would have clinched the conference title, but no matter what the odds, 
    UNH would blow that game?  It figures that this year when the game 
    meant more to UMass the Wildcats would finally lay one on.
    
    What do you think it is, John?  Coaching?  Paterno protege' Bill Bowes?
    In the late seventies I remember Bowes as being ultra, ultra
    conservative, but even that doesn't appear to be the case anymore.  Why
    the consistent underachievement?
    
    glenn
    

    I know we've knocked UNH out with a far inferior team in 1984 and 1989,
    and a couple of other times, but the only time UNH has ever beaten us
    with anything truly on the line was in 1975, when we both went into the
    game unbeaten and the winner would win the conference and the playoff
    bid.  Other than that, they never have.
    
    I don't know why UNH always has that problem because I'm not close
    enough to them and I don't see them very often, but they certainly do
    have the reputation of being unable to win the big one.  Not that I
    mind.....
    
    John

   I'm not sure which topic this belongs to, but this one seems as good
   as any.  Does anyone know how many yards Darren Lewis of Texas A&M
   rushed for this Saturday against Arkansas?  Since A&M is not rated,
   all I can find out from here (Colorado) is that A&M won 20-16.  I
   also know that Lewis and Bienemy (sp?) were picked to the first team
   backfield on the Kodak All-American team.

   Thanks,

   Jerry

Hey, how about them Virginia 'Hoos?

Talk about a trip from the penthouse to the outhouse... They're lucky 
they were good early, otherwise they'd be playing in the Astro-Bluebonnet
Bowl.

    Heard on WFAN this weekend: Two worst defenses:Virginia and the Denver
    Nuggets. 

    Anyone know if the Pitt/PennSt. game is going to be on the tube this
    weekend?  ESPN maybe?
    
    Thanks.
    
    	--dan'l

    	Mike "What's the latest bandwagon" Lupica says Penn State should
    be #1.

    The Penn State/Pitt game will be televised Saturday at either 2:00 or
    2:30 (check local listing for the time and channel in your area).
    
    Dennis
    
    ps - The Penn State student body broke into Beaver Stadium after the
    big win against Notre Dame in South Bend this weekend and tore down the
    goal posts. They then carried them up to the top of the stadium and
    threw them off. There was then a procession down through the town with
    the goal posts. It cost PSU about $7K each time the goal posts go down
    like this.
    

    The fine 1990 season for the Minutemen ended with a crashing thud on
    Saturday.  After going through the first 9 games of the season with a
    record of 8-0-1, UMass lost its second straight game at William and
    Mary 38-0.  Lots of positives from the season, little positive from the
    end of the season.  Making the playoffs was nice, winning at least one
    game would have been better.
    
    The Globe and National are both getting complimentary letters today
    thanking them for the fine publicity given to UMass this year, and for
    also (in the Globe's case) waking up and realizing that BC isn't the
    only school in Massachusetts that plays football.
    
    John

Florida is going to drop its series with Miami in 1992. Previously
scheduled to continue until 2000, Florida, and everyone else in the SEC,
is reworking their schedule to accomodate the new 12-member, 2-division
alignment.

Acatually, it's just a number game. When you increase the size of the
membership of a conferences, there will be less non-conference games and
who would voluntarily want to play Miami in a non-conference game.

TTom

    I very seldom buy the USA Today, and was wondering if anyone could tell
    me when there bowl preview is coming out.  I think it is Dec. 31st, but
    wasn't sure about this.  Thanx.
    
    Joe

    I'm not positive but it is normally the friday before the games. It has
    been for the last 3 or 4 years. The nationals was yesterday, they had
    a 13 page pull out. The USA's is normally pretty good. If you can get
    your hands on todays copy of the USA it will probably tell when its
    gonna be. If I was you I would buy it tomorrow and see if it's there
    if not it will be in Mondays, but there are quite a few games this
    weekend.
    
                                                 Dan