Conference govt02::basingstoke

     ... we were evicted from our flat in Islington.  
    
    ;^)
    Ray.

    One of the lucky ones huh?  Where was it?

    If I had to choose between Basingstoke on a Sunday and commiting
    suicide, I would choose the latter !!!!
    
    Suicide is more exciting.
    
    Tom 
     

    London v. Rest of the UK
    
    I think Karen's comments on London are all valid and I wouldn't
    want to live in London myself.
    
    However, I live in Reading and I still think Basingstoke is
    not a very exciting place to be.  Not that Reading is the hub of
    the universe mind, but it's a whole helluva lot better than
    Braisingsteak.  So, let's formulate a league table, rating each
    town from 0 (the pits) to 100 (ace).  
    
    I vote London rates as 100 on the basis of shops and things to do
    but as 0 for living.
    
    Reading rates as 40 on the basis of shops and things to do and 60
    for living.
    
    Basingstoke is currently out to tender .........(did I hear minus
    ratings?)
    
    Jonjon

                
    
                                      No !!!

================================================================================
Note xx.x                    do you LIKE Basingtoke?                      5 of 5
                        -< And the answer is......... >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

			Yes!                

And it's spelt BASINGSTOKE!
		     ^


				Si

    picky picky, just a slip of the finger!
    
    K
    

    It seems to me that people move to basingstoke for a better standard
    of living, better schools, and work, to quote previous replies.
    Yet, the IN THING TO DO, is to SLAG OFF Basingstoke for no apparent
    reason. Why dont you all go back to where you came from, and leave
    the people who live here and the surrounding villages through choice,
    alone from this infernal bickering.
    

    Re .7
    
    My main reason for disliking this town , is down to one major point
    - the town centre !! I dont think have I have ever seen a more
    depressing place - the choice of shops is poor and the entertainment
    is limited. As to where the people live, so what. My gripe is the
    lack of amenities for the people who live in AND around the town.
    I mean, if everybody who had moved to Basingstoke did leave, there
    would be nobody left.
    
    Harvey
    

    
    re .3
    
    The only time I ever came anywhere close to contemplating suicide
    was on a sunday in Basingstoke ! I remember it well, I was in my
    Bedsit in Cliddesden Road and to shrug off the feeling I rode the
    250 up the M3 to Fleet services and had a meat pie, which soon reminded
    me that things could be a lot worse !
    
    re .6
    
    If you want to be picky, its "Fruitfulness" - hah! :-)
    
    And finally my twopenneth is I like Basingstoke, admitted I am biased
    and I never lived anywhere else in the UK so I can't compare it
    to much. Where I live now (North Andover, Mass) I can't even walk
    to a pub in less than 30 minutes ! It has its compensations though,
    at least they're likely to be open when I get there :-)
    
    And even though I could do without some of those estates (especially
    the ones they built in/around Basing) I MISS THE PLACE ! :-(
    
    I give it 80 for livability, but only 10 for entertainment.
    
    Steve.

    
    The best thing about it is that you can leave quite quickly in a
    southerly direction (despite the roundabouts).
    
    Judy
    

.11�    The best thing about it is that you can leave quite quickly in a
.11�    southerly direction (despite the roundabouts).

    Unlike Reading!
    
    I *like* Basingstoke, .0 said (I think) that countryside is nearby,
    and there are some nice places a short ride away.
    
    Compared to some places (Crawley for example), the town centre is
    pretty good, granted the architecture leaves a bit to be desired,
    but the shops aren't *too* bad, and the 'Hanging Gardens' are quite
    unusual.
    
    (I gave up with the fruitfulness bit) :-)
    
    		Si

    
    Re. 7
    
    Actually there would be people left.  I was born and bred here and
    before the GLC moved here Basingstoke was a VERY nice Market Town.
    
    There was life in Basingstoke before the London Overspill!
    
    Lucie
    

re -.1 I am not disputing that Basingstoke was a VERY nice market town.
    But surely the present state of the town could have been avoided
    by more imaginitive planning. I am not singling out Basingstoke,
    I have stayed in Hemel Hempstead and thats a concrete disaster also.
    
    Harvey

    The best part of Basingstoke in my opinion is the part where you're
    driving out of town and in the rear view mirror you can see the
    sign with ekotsgnisaB on it!!!!
    
    Seriously though, Basingstoke, like all large towns has its good
    points and its bad points, but overall I suppose it's better than
    average ...
    
    John
    

    
    re:8
    
    Hear hear. It's easy to commute now so there really is no excuse
    for suffering here. I suppose it depends what you want in the way
    of facilities. There is a variety of pubs, theatres, cinema, lots
    of good restaurants in the area. Sports facilities, ice rink,
    Wellington Park has water sports and equestrian facilities, swimming
    pools, snooker and other clubs. OK there is only one dubious nightclub,
    but that's hardly a major downfall. What exactly do people want?
    If you want everything on your doorstep then you have to take the
    living conditions this brings.
    
    I feel sorry for the original townspeople, their nice little market
    town has been developed enormously and as well as putting up with
    that they have to contend with the people who have moved
    here doing nothing but moan about it.
    
                                         

    re -.1 "Variety of pubs"....Well I don't rate the pubs in Basingstoke
    town centre. "Lots of good restaurants in the area"...yes I totally
    agree, but this is the point I am trying to make. I like the
    surrounding area/countryside ;its the town itself i dislike. The
    centre does have some good facilities but its just so depressing.
    So who's to blame...the council for giving the Prudential the sole
    ownership of the centre ????
    
    
    Harvey

	... when I could drive into Basingstoke without encountering
	a single traffic jam. In fact I'd see no more than a couple
	of dozen cars in the 20 mile journey.

	I remember when my route took me through picturesque villages
	where many of the houses were thatched. Villages with ponds,
	churches, little pubs. A small town with a railway station, I
	remember the clouds of steam from the engines.

	I remember when my journey took me through some of the best
	parts of rural England, right up to within a mile of Viables.

	


	I remember it well, it was this morning. 




	My point (to reiterate whats been said before) is:
    	if you don't like living in Basingstoke, why do it? 
	There are a lot of much nicer places, and you don't have to go very
	far to find them. 

    
    re .18
    
    I don't think anyone disputed your right to slag things off. As
    for those of us who "were here before the overspill" we can supply
    insight as to how Basingstoke was, how it developed, what affected
    its development, such as the "overspill". Yes, Basingstoke belongs
    to those who live there now, thats half the reason of the way it
    is !
    
    I don't think anyone was trying to be superior.
    
    Ask Dave Clark in RDC about Jazz.
    
    Regards,
    
    Steve.

re .19
    Ian, 
    
    yes, there a lot better places to stay rather than Basingstoke .
    Unfortunately ,over-inflated house prices being what they are down here
    prevent me moving elsewhere at present. Until such time as I do
    move, and until any major changes take place in the town, I shall continue
    to be critical of it.
    
    
    Harvey

re .21
    
    It's precisely because of the over inflated house prices that I
    DON'T live in Basingstoke. Come down to the coast Harv, it's a
    lot cheaper here.
    
    

    RE: 47.15
              Yes John,but when you read that sign...you are travelling
    towards Whitchurch...!!!...the last place God made..!!...To quote..
    "God made the earth in 6 days...on the 7th day he rested..on the
    Monday he got up with a hangover and created Whitchurch..!!"
    
    Nuff said...???....:-)

    
    
    	As you drive into Basingstoke from the M3, it looks a bit like
    	Dallas !!
    
    	You see the car park signs, and all is well !!
    
    	You see the car park, and know something is wrong !!
    
    	You leave the car park and find your way down into the town
    	centre and suddenly you realise
    
    	What a hole, BlazingSmoke is !!!!!!!
    
    	It's the most hideous architectural monstrosity that I've ever
   	had the misfortune to live near !!
    

    RE:47.24
    
                SO MOVE.....
    
    
    Nuff said.....???

     As an earlier reply mentioned, there are a lot of concrete cowpats
    around the south of the country : Hemel, Harlow, Stevenage, to name
    but a few (not forgetting the biggest cowpat of all : MILTON KEYNES !)
    and Basingstoke comes out incredibly well when compared to these.

     You can find duff pubs in every town or village (though I'll admit
    that the proportion is rather high in the town centre :-) and every
    criticism so far could be applied to Reading, Andover,  or any town
    you care to name [and especially to London].

     I was pleasantly surprised to find that after a few months  (once
    I could tell the difference between the roundabouts :-) I had grown
    to like the place and,  although I'd prefer to live in one of the
    nearby villages, I don't particularly want to move out of the area.
    As the man says, if you don't like it, leave it.

    Frank

   
    This note now seems to be degenerating into "So you dont like 
    Basingstoke then move". The base note asked if anybody liked the
    town. It seems that about half the people who have replied dont
    like the town and the other half just dont want to hear anybody
    slagging it off, no matter how bad it is. (eg: Well move then !!)    
    Can those who suggest "moving", please answer the question and say
    whether they honestly really LIKE this town/dump/pit/Basingstoke
    
    Harvey
    
    
    
    

    Hi Harv,
    
    "Yes I honestly like this town/dump/pit [called] Basingstoke" !
    
    OK ? I don't mind people slagging it off, there are a lot of good
    reasons to do so. All I'm saying [=me, personally] is that the same
    faults can be found everywhere. If you find a really nice place
    to live, with a decent job within twenty miles, give me a shout
    and I'm sure I can point out the bad oints for you ! :-)
    
    Frank

    
    
    RE:19
    
    Brighton Hill a no-go area after dark??? Since when?? I live there
    and am unaware of any attacks, gang fights, riots. The biggest threat
    at Brighton Hill is the chips you can get from the Big Fry! I feel
    safe out at night. I have even ventured into town after dark and have had
    no problem. 
    
    As for lack of community spirit, this cannot possibly grow in a
    town where the majority of home owners are young couples who buy
    a house and sell it shortly after to make a quick profit, why should
    they get involved in the community or get to know their neighbours
    if they don't plan to be there long?  One house near where I live has
    changed hands three times in the last year!          
                                       

    re .27
    
    
    As a place to work, yes Basingstoke has everything I need, but then
    I don't need much. Just a few shops with easy access is enough,
    and Basingstoke has that. The town I used to work in was far nicer,
    but if you hadn't got a parking space by 9.00 am you had no chance!
    
    As to actually LIKING the town, no - there really isn't anything
    to like. If I didn't work in the town I can't think of a reason
    to visit it!  How much tourism is there here?

    As a person who recently has moved away from Basingstoke I have
    followed this note with interest. I too used to live in London and
    though I had none of the bad experiences which are mentioned in
    the base note but I would broadly endorse the belief that the quality
    of life was better in the Basingstoke Area (note the qualification).
    But I didn't live in Basingstoke and there is no way I would have.
    As a shopping place it was reasonable but limited, as a centre of
    amenities I used the Sports Centre which was OK but by no means
    exceptional but aestetically it sucks. Living close by to Basingstoke
    it always seemed to me that it was a collection of communities
    surrounding a shopping centre/workplace rather than a town and that
    feeling was accentuated by my (rare) experiences of Basingstoke
    in the evening when it is the proverbial ghost town. 
    	So what did I do - I moved - not because of Basingstoke except
    for that it gave me no reason to stay. By the way it's the Englishman's
    right to gripe indiscriminately and then not do anything about it.
    If everybody in England who moaned about the weather reacted by
    saying "Well lets move then" there wouldn't be anybody there.
    
    Phil
    

    Well Phil,
    
    You've only been away for about a month and you've forgotten already.
    Its not just an ENGLISHMAN's right !!!!!!!!!!!!!
    
    
    Cheers
    
    Harvey

    Whoops - sorry about that - you obviously remember I have problems
    with geography!
    
    Phil

    Basingstoke?
    Is anyone actually saying here that they would CHOOSE to live there?
    There are only two good reasons to be found dead or alive in
    Basingstoke:
    	
    	1.  You work for Digital and can't afford to live in the
    	fine countryside of Hampshire or you would like SOME social
    	life, that didn't involve hiring a taxi when you want to get
    	pissed.
    
    	2.  You work for IBM and all of the above applies.
    
    Actually there is one other reason: you got lost at the Black Dam
    roundabout trying to find the A33 to get to Reading.
	
    	C'mon there's making the 'best of it' and there's 'putting
    	a brave face on' but you cannot be serious about LIKING it.
    
    Simon
    

>    Actually there is one other reason: you got lost at the Black Dam
>    roundabout trying to find the A33 to get to Reading.          

    Always wondered why you lived at Black Dam - I thought it was just
    the first place you stumbled across after leaving the Crest !  :-)
    
    Frank      

    
    
    .. it may be a dump, but you're never far from a Photo Booth.
    
    

    But any thing is better than Swindon eh?
    Sorry, I couldn't contain myself!
    

    re .36
    hi Ian
    
    yeh , but you cant get a decnet (anag) pint in a 
    photo booth.!!
    
    
    
    Come to think of it, you cant get a decent pint
    in Basingstoke either !!

   Photo Booth?
    Is Basingtoke a mecca for Photo Booth enthusiasts?
    
    Mind you I had a hell of a job getting my id photos done 'round
    here.  So If I need some id photos doing can I rely on you
    guys to nip down to woolies for me?  Send em back by electronic
    mail in postscrypt format.
    
    I think on balance tho' in spite of the 'id-photo-situation' 
    I'll stick with Alpes Maritimes...
    
    Simon
    

>    Is Basingtoke a mecca for Photo Booth enthusiasts?

No, just a Mecca for Photo Booths (see 49.*).

By the way, I hear that the singer/songwriter Tanita Tikaram is
from Boringstoke.
Any other famous persons live in the Basingsnore district?


*DC (Ich bin nicht ein Basingstoker).    

    
    I think Marvin the robot from the Hitchhikers guide to the Galaxy
    must be a new Basinstoke resident. I am sure he keeps replying to
    this note i.e.
    
    "isn't Basingstoke a borrring place, I really don't know why I stay
    here, maybe I am a masochist. But I just haven't got the sense to
    go away, so I just stay here and be miserable....I think I enjoy
    being miserable................wonder what Alpha Centuri is like
    at this time of year, but then I really can't be bothered to find
    out........."
    
    
    

    Re .-1 
    
    I think you are being a little unfair. After all you did ask the
    question and as far as I can seen the majority of respondants to
    this note don't live Basingstoke but in the surrounding area. They
    just bemoan the fact that Basingstoke lacks just about anything
    that you might want from a town that has so many people living close
    to it. 
    Maybe people just love working for DEC at the CSC or the Crescent
    etc or perhaps they just get paid too well down there!
    Did you really expect a lot of positive replies?
    
    Phil

    
    re:41
    This Marvin DID get away... and I too have the brain the size
    of a planet, which is why I'm in Alpes Maritimes and not
    Basing'toke.
     

    re.41
    
    If you had read all the other replies you would realise that there are
    people who would love to get out of Basingstoke, and as some of
    these notes have already stated, other circumstances prevent them
    doing so !! 
    
    You asked the question...... Honestly, what kind of response did
    you expect ? It was a loaded question to say the very least.
    
    
    Harvey

    
    
    

    re:42
    
    So it's OK to slag it off, but a little unfair to say its good.
    I still thinks you're a lot of Marvins, I can't understand how anyone
    can say there is nothing to do! Open your eyes! Do you want everything
    brought personally to you?  The excuse that people ONLY live here
    for the work is a bit weak. If it is that unberable you could always
    commute to work.  How about some constructive points?
    
    I believe W H Smith now stock 'knock Basingstoke inserts' for 
    filofaxes!!
    
    

        You're just upset that no one but you likes Basingstoke :-}
    
    PS
    Basingstoke isn't as bad as some of the places Ive contracted in
    like Chippenham and and some place which was so bad that I've forgotten
    its name (it ws the first Garden City) and begins with L (I think)
    Tony
    

    Letchworth!!!
    

    Leave Letchworth out of this ! It is a lovely place !! :-)

    (Think you're getting confused with the second [or later] garden
    city, Welwyn GC, which *is* a pit.).

    Frank (who used to live in the first garden city)

    Basingstoke is brilliant, it has fantastic nightlife, , its pubs
    are the finest in the country, its  restaurants are second to none,
    its pavements are fantastic ,
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    Ok , now i think thats what you wanted to  hear. And i meant every
    wword
    of it ...really !!!!
    
    
    Harvey ( who has now given up on this infernal topic !!!)

    re: .45
    You misread my note - you can say you like Basingstoke as much as
    you like as far as I'm concerned but its unfair to slag off (in
    your terminology) those who just answered your question. If you
    don't like the answers then don't ask the question.
    	Your responses have included two (anti) from about as afar away
    from Basingstoke as you can get without falling off the continent
    of Europe , several (antis) from people who dont live in Basingstoke
    but in the surrounding area,several fors from people again who don't
    seem to live in Basingstoke (one of whom lives the other side of
    the world). So who does actually live in Basingstoke (rather than
    around it) if it is so wonderful?
              
    
    		Phil (from a long,long way away!)

    
    I started the note because I knew it would open a bag of worms!
    As you point out, most of the 'antis' don't actually live IN
    Basingstoke. Of course you are entitled to your opinion, and so
    am I.  But I still haven't seen any contructive criticism. It's
    fashionable to put Basingstoke down, but please don't get too upset
    if I disagree. Come on, tell us a really good place to live....
    

I asked the question in .17 (I think) as to who was responsible for the present
state of affairs - Is it the Prudential for having a total monopoly on the town 
centre. Would it not be constructive for somebody to try and get the
Pru turfed out and open up the town centre to some decent enterprise. 

We all know that Basingstoke lacks almost everything a good town has (don't we?)
so what constructive criticism would you like ? 

1) Turf out the Pru

2) Tell the council that not everybody has a car, so get them to provide 
   pavements in all parts of the town, not just the centre.

3) Free subscription to Private Eye for the latest "Lets Slag Off Basingstoke
   Cartoon" (You know it makes sense)

4) The abolition of the only 2 sets of traffic lights in the town (I mean, lets
   make it the only traffic light free zone in the UK , I'm getting
   tired of the roundabout stories.)

5) The Romna Tandoori to take over catering at Viables




And if all that fails, how about a nulcear disaster.....just to tidy it up a 
little bit !!!!!!!!


Harvey (Who actually thought he'd finished with this note but not quite !!)

    Hi Harv,
    
    	    I agree with you whole heartedly on .5 of your note.
    No more crappy ommlettes, instead just nice vinda-loos and the likes
    
    
    
    Graham.
    

    re:52
    
    London, Oxford, Portsmouth, Bristol, they're all a lot bigger than
    Basingstoke. It's a bit of an unfair comparison isn't it? I still
    say there ARE facilities in Basingstoke, and a short way out of
    town.  Yes, Yes, you may have to travel for 5 or 10 minutes.
    But if you had everything in town you'd have the problems you get
    in London, Bristol, Portsmouth.....
    
    And, here's a tissue, no-one said you can't criticise the town.
    But all I see is "basingstoke is.. boring;ugly;too quiet." 
    Any good examples??
    
    (I love this, I can hear sensitive little feet being stamped all 
    over the place!!!)
    

    re:54
    
    Sorry, I was doing my note the same time as you and missed your
    return.
    
    Great! Constructive wingeing!!
    
    1.  Turf out the Pru.....worth a try
    
    2.  More pavements.... thoroughly agree
    
    3.  No need for Private Eye, the Gazette attempts it's own witty
        satirical put downs.
    
    4.  Keep the traffic lights...historical interest.
    
    5.  I thought they had already. 
    
    
    Any more?
    
    

    RE: .52 and .56
    
    The note in .52 was stating some facts about your attidudes
    to the replies fo far generated.  He is quite correct.
    
    .56 
   
    Your response to this criticism is to attempt to belittle the
    comment made.  There is a much wider principle at stake here,
    which has nothing to do with Basingstok, but then in reality
    neither has this note, it is merely a collection of banter
    about a town that most of us have either lived in or near,
    whilst in the employ of Digital.
    
    It was not clear from your base note what sort of discussion
    you had in mind, I believe most contributors have taken it
    in a spirit of banter.  To then change the groundrules of
    the discussion, on the basis of disagreeing with the majority
    opinion, and then belittle the contributor who points out
    this fact, is not constructive.  Since you now ask for a
    constructive debate on overspill town planning, you once again
    appear inconsistent in your intentions for this note.
    
    Your laying down of groundrules for argument when the request
    for input was not specific is not in the best spirit of 'Noting'.
    
    I guess I will be abused, as a wingeing moron, or picked up
    on my spelling, or something else; but the facts speak for
    themselves.  Since this note has now departed from its
    theme I shall retire to another conference where the qualities
    of banter and debate are more distinctly perceived.
    
    If this reaction dissapoints you, I will gladly 'stamp my feet'
    at your bidding, I understand now that there is little in
    Basingstoke to excite the soul. I must remain charitable.
   
    -Simon
        

    
    Oh come on, lighten up.  Since when has a note had strict	
    restrictions on what it should contain or the direction it must
    go?  As far as I am concerned the whole thing is lighthearted, and
    anyone who takes it as a serious social discussion is in the wrong
    note.   
    
    I am not interested in belittling anyone, unlike you, obviously. 
    I have simply asked for reasons for disliking the town and asked
    for a little more than the fact that the pubs aren't up to much.  
    In the spirit of debate I opened a note I expected to be a lively one, 
    and it has lived up to my expectations. Everyone has a right to their 
    own opinion, (including me). If I have offended any sensitive souls
    I apologise profusely!!
    
    I Still Like Basingstoke.
    
     

    
    
    What Basingstoke is, is a half-hearted attempt by some half-witted
    architects to create some kind of dream town. The 'New Town Centre'
    was a very good concept. Ok, so we lost Moose Hall and the Horse
    and Jockey, but Woollies moved from opposite the town hall, and 
    everyone was looking forward to the modern shopping centre. For 
    some reason though it never really worked, perhaps they should have 
    replaced the Historic old town centre and with the New ? hmmmm... 
    So then to make it worse the built the 'New New Town Centre' (Woollies 
    didn't have to move this time, it was right next door) lots more
    stores moved nearer the railway station. So what do you have ? A Town 
    Centre thats 50 yards wide and three miles long ! Go out today and ask 
    10 people where the centre (or heart) of Basingstoke is ? How many 
    different answers did you get ? The Estates wouldn't be so bad if they 
    actually surrounded 'something'. Basingstoke is a town without a
    heart. Knock the bloody Town Centre down and replace it with a big 
    covered mall with shops and food places thats open until 9pm every
    night (that'll please my mate Steve who manages Olivers :-) ), and 
    lots of parking underground ! Make it a horseshoe shaped mall 
    surrounding a central square that contains tasteful restaurants and 
    pubs. And patrol the whole thing so you can lock up the drunks before 
    they leave their piss everywhere !
                         
    Basingstoke was mentioned in the Hitchhikers guide to the Galaxy,
    something like "So we just stick our thumbs out, and some green
    bug-eyed monster sticks his head out of a spaceship and says 'Hi
    guys I can give you a lift as far as the Basingstoke roundabout'".
    But this isn't a recent problem, in Gilbert and Sullivan operetta
    we are mentioned as being the place to send loonies (Park Prewett
    was the fame of Basingstoke in those days), "We'll send you to
    Basingstoke" was a real threat, not a joke one. So is it all the
    fault of the 'Marvins' that have lived in Basingstoke, or the ones
    that live there now ?
             
    Basingstoke isn't the greatest, but I have stayed in many other
    places in England (London wins a prize here) that give me the real
    screaming heebie jeebies!
         
    "Theres no point in trying to engage my enthusisasm because I haven't
    got one"
    
    

	Re: .37

	Swindon is 5000 times better than Basingstoke, it has several very
	good shopping centers, ice rink, cinema, nightclubs, hundreds of 
	pubs (admitedly only one selling real ale), garden centers, lots of 
	DIY, home improvement centers, very few roundabouts (!!), easy access
	to M4, major rail link east/west, just over an hour to Heathrow and 
	best of all the houses and rates etc are cheaper. 

	Access to the Cotswolds (including Gloucster's dry ski slope),
	Bath, Chippenham, Devizes, Bristol, Cirencester, Oxford and the 
	north (M5) is easy. You can't say that about Basingstoke !! 
	Swindon is central, unlike Basingstoke, it may not be the most 
	beautiful town in the British Isles, but you can get to the places
	that are with no problem. There are many major companies who have 
	spotted this "easy access to the rest of the UK" aspect of Swindon,
	and have based major subsiduaries in Swindon, with more arriving
	all the time.

	Don't knock Swindon, it's getting better all the time, there are 
	several of us here who won't swap Swindon for Basingstoke/Reading.

    re -.1
    
        Yes indeed, we have a contender for the next note, which is...
    
                 "does anybody not LIKE Swindon"
    

    47.63
    
        I stand corrected about Swindon!!!!! I'm a 'tourist' going on
    heresay about Swindon. There is actually a tourist info center there.
    Maybe Swindon is Britain's best kept secret!!
    I will relay the contents of your note.
    
    thanks
    jay_i_LOV_swindon_kuhn
    

    Don't know about Basingstoke itself but, recently I was there on
    a course and I met some really nice, friendly people down there,
    made my stay really wellcoming, you lot are extremely nice, helpful
    people.  Thanks a lot.  (Never actually been into Basingstoke itself
    though).
    
    Sue.

    re -.1
    
    Of course we bloody are !!!!!!!!!!    :-)
    

    Obviously, you ar'nt from Basingstoke........modesty is one of their
    strong traits :-)
    
    S.

    re -.1
    
    Absolutely right . Would you own up to coming from Basingstoke ?????
    
    
    H

    Re. .69
    
    Yes I would and I have done in the past!  So wotchit pal!
    
    Lucie
    

    Harvey,Harvey Harvey .... Will you never learn!! Mind you I thought
    I would keep the pot boiling by saying what a wonderful place 
    Basingstoke was compared to Milton Keynes and just wait to see where
    the reply came from saying that Milton Keynes was the best place
    on God's Earth. Not that I've been to Milton Keynes , you understand,
    so such a reply would have fitted in with the informed nature of this
    note.
    Phil

    Harvey,Harvey Harvey .... Will you never learn!! 

   Maybe, and maybe not, but this is the first reply I've entered in this topic

	Confused and befuddled of Reading

	H.

			:-)

    

    And the third Harvey is a 6ft invisible rabbit who is keeping my house warm
    while I'm out here! As I said before some people (and rabbits) will
    never learn! :-)
    
    Phil

    Good grief......
    
    I suppose thats what I deserve for not looking at this file for about
    a week !!!!!

    
    Harvey 
    
    
    
    

    
    I was born and bred in Basingstoke, and I am not at all ashamed
    to say so!
    
    I am starting to form a theory that its only scottish people that
    move to Basingstoke that don't like it. Seeing as we are into rash
    generalisations (sp?).
    
    All those in favour ? against ?
    
    :-)

    Hi Steve
    
    I'm almost tempted to ask, "Why did you leave then?",  but no..!!!
    And then you'll say "Why did you leave Glasgow ?"...ad absurdium
    
    From most of the other replies, it seems that the people who don't
    like the place are the ones who have lived in decent towns beforehand.
    
    Harvey
    
                                                                          
    
    
    
    

    re -1
    Well said Harvey, I think you have hit the nail on the head
    
    Andy
    

>   From most of the other replies, it seems that the people who don't 
>   like the place are the ones who have lived in decent towns beforehand.

    Maybe it's just the variable definition of "decent" ?

    What would *really* throw the spanner in the works would be where
    two people have come from the same area in the same town but only
    one likes Basingstoke whilst the other hates it ... :-)
    
    Frank

    Yes, but then that person would be termed a schizophrenic.  ;-)
    
    Greg (who_has_been_watching_this_note_with_amusement
          and_comes_from_a_nicer_city_(Norwich) )

    Ah, but Norwich is a veritable oasis in the desert of East Anglia.
    I mean people think this place is bad, but I'd write off the whole
    of East Anglia as being 'flat and boring'. And people who live there
    have an accent to go with it, apart from you Mr. Mendolsohn.
    
    I lived in Yarmouth for about 8 weeks and it felt like a year; about
    as much fun as diving into a vat of boiling oil.
    
    Rich
    

    $ SET DIRECTION=RATHOLE
    
    It's a well known fact (in East Anglia at least) that if you want to
    get to know Norfolk and Suffolk, you avoid Gt Yarmouth at all costs.
    Whats wrong with the beautiful (and wild) North Norfolk coastline, or
    the picturesque (sp?) villages in Suffolk and that "veritable oasis" -
    Norwich. 
    
    If its good enough for HRH (Sandringham) then it must be good enough
    for us commoners ;-) 
    
    While I am about it Mr Wod, can you spell my name correctly next time
    or we may as well start launching into an attack on Leeds. 
    
    $ SET DIRECTION=BACK_TO_BASINGSTOKE
    
    Greg

    I may have got one of your letters wrong, Greg but at least I got
    the number of them correct.
    I have actually been to Sandringham and admit it is a really top
    hole old shack, especially the 26" colour TV in t' front room.
    However, I think the chap who thought the world was flat must have
    originated from central East Anglia.
    And what's that sweet smell ? - Lavender ?, errm Roses ?, ah but no,
    it's stewing sugar beet !
    
    How can anybody say anything bad about Leeds ? - Ok I'll give you
    the football team.
    
    Rich
    

    I come frae Scotland, and I don't hate Basingstoke!!!!!
                                                      
    Jenni_I_hate_generalisations

Is it not one of the sad facts of life that all the nicest places to live,
have zilch in the way of jobs?

There is a lot in the way of criticism of Basingstoke, and in many cases this
is justified (concreted), BUT

	what are we looking for?

London is a hell of a place to get to, is smelly, dirty AND expensive!
but people do seem to like it.

Salisbury is lovely but you cannot get a job, cos businees is not there!

Basingstoke is right on the edge of NICE countryside, is handy for
the smoke, is better than Reading and has work.

Lets be honest, life is a compromise...there is no single answer.

	Yors,

		olmost konstructively,
	
	John

    re .85
    
    Well I too am from Scotland ,and I don't hate Basingstoke, I absolutely
    despise it. !!!
    
    
    H

    
    Well, I'll volunteer to be the one who likes B'stoke, I grew up on
    the Winchester Road edge of South Ham estate, it was very nice,
    and I had fields to play in just down the road (well, until they
    built Brighton Hill anyway! so then I played on the Common, but
    they built a road through that, so I played on Black Dam, guess
    what happened, so then my friend [who works in viables too] and
    I used to fly kites and walk his dog on a field near his home, but 
    they built Digital Viables on that - after that I was old enough to 
    go into pubs, the rest is a meaningless blur :-) )
    
    It seems that nice towns and jobs are mutually exclusive.
    
    Any volunteers from South Ham who hate Blazingsmoke ?
    
    

    
    HEAR HEAR .86 
    
    Actually, I don't think Scotland is up to much either....
    
    full of dreary hills, damp, scots...perhaps that's why there
    are so many of it's countrymen here?
    
    
    (Going for the wooden spoon award!!!!)
                                  

    Scotlland is lovely- you obviously went there at the wrong time
    of year! (And it doesn't sound like you have any Scottish friends
    anyway!)
    Back to Basingstoke.....I only work here, and I do like it. I worked
    in Surbiton before and Basingstoke is so clean in comparison. The only
    facilities I would like to see are a Late Night Dry-Cleaners and
    Shoe-Menders, preferably at the Railway Station. Those are the only
    things I miss about Surbiton, apart from the Thames and adjacent
    pubs. Somehow the Basingstoke Canal isn't the same. (Doen't do much
    for your clothes or shoes either!)
    Rosalind

    Just to enter some comments leading on from .86 and .89 and also
    to encourage the drive for this note to reach reply 100! I would
    agree that generally the nicest places don't have the jobs in the
    UK but there is no reason why it should be that way for a company
    like Digital. Look at the Digital site at Valbonne which is certainly
    a nice place and Digital seem to have made the decision that this
    would be a great place to encourage people from all over Europe
    to come and work (admittedly they are having second thoughts about
    it now). Now why does Digital UK decide to have the CSC (an almost
    completely telephone dominated operation) in an expensive hole like
    Basingstoke when they could have chosen ,for instance, the very
    beautiful Highlands of Scotland. They would then have given people an
    incentive to work there apart from money,company cars,loyalty to
    DEC or whatever it is now and cut their office rents as well.
    	I heard that one American based banking(?) operation had taken
    this theory to heart and put their computer centre in the South
    East of Ireland where they got numerous EEC grants,cheap rents as
    well as cheap labour and a great place to encourage their employees
    to come and work for a while when they needed them.
    	End of serious note - now you can go back to "Well Scotland's
    horrible as well" etc
    
    Phil

	Well,

		its all about devolution.

	I remember all the great ideas about devolution quite well.

	The sad fact is that although its all logical, company type chaps
	who make such decisions seem to be afraid of any part of their
	organisation becoming 'inaccessible'!

	Ask any person who was in Scotland at the time that devolution was
	talked about ie me, and you could be busy for hours!

	By the way, we do have Ayr. As thats my home town I do like
    	to think there are worse places! So Digital has made SOME effort.
                                        
    	
    
	Jumbo.
                                                                         

    re -.1
    
    I used to work in the Ayr plant, and to be honest, I didn't realise
    what a good town it was until I left !!!
    
    
    
    Harvey

    re .89 and .90
    
    
    as .90 said you don't have any Scottish friends..... at least not
    any more.
    
    
    jimmy

    
    
    I knew it would work..tee hee
    
    Someone said base the CSC in the Scottish Highlands. Nice idea,
    but then you would get people moaning that there is nothing to
    do, nothing to see but lovely scenery, etc. etc. You can't please
    all of the people all of the time.
    
    And a big hallo to all my Scottish friends!!
    
    
    

    placing the tsc anywhere apart from BASINGSTOKE would be an improvement
    so I tend to think that the general level of moaning would continue
    (because you cant please everyone) but to a lesser degree.
    
    My personal choice would be STRANRAER
    

    re:- .78
    
    >From most of the other replies, it seems that the people who don't
    >like the place are the ones who have lived in decent towns beforehand.
    
    Well why did they leave then !
    
    Maybe, their decent town couldn't offer what they have here ! ...
    
    ... a 'decent' job !
    

    re -.1
    
    Yes, that is exactly why I left.....for a better job. 
    
    I've now got a better job at the expense of a better place to live.
    
    Which one would you prefer ????
    
    
    Harvey

    Hi Tony
    
    I believe that this was pointed out in reply 6 or thereabouts.
    
    You put that in so you'd get no 100 I'll bet !!!!
    
    
    Harvey

    
    re -.99
    
    I'm not the one moaning ...
    

    re -.1
    
    Just 'cos I moved here for a job doesn't mean that i cant criticise
    the place ! 
    
    
    
    

    re.anything
    
    Basingstoke must have some hidden attributes which we don't know
    about, 'cos it's beem mentioned in the enormously famous series
    "Hitchhikers...." AND on telly in the equally famous prog.."Only
    fools and horses", Rodney got his CSE in art at the Tech...well
    someone had to go there. Is it only the butt of every joke?
    
    And why does Steve Hird insist on relating his life story of Basingstoke?
                           
    
    
    

    
    
    
    Que the Hovis music.....
    
    

    It's not just us Deccies who complain about this place, about 12-14
    months on BBC2 on a friday evening there was a documentary shown
    (I think it was part of th Arena seies or something like that) which
    stated that BASINGSTOKE came fifth in an EEC poll to find the most
    boring town in Europe so I guess there has to be some room for
    criticism its not just us being petty. It was also  a pretty boring
    documentary come to think of it. Figures I guess
    
    Bored of Basingstoke 

    Basingstoke was recently voted the second most boring town in England,
    can't remember who was first. It's an improvement though, it came
    first last year.
    
    (��)Paul.

    Re .104

    For the record, Basingstoke was (in)famous way before TV ...
    Gilbert & Sullivan took the rise out of it in "Ruddigore".
    [ But to be fair, this was based on the location of the Park
    Prewitt (sp?) asylum rather than the modern town centre :-) ]
    
    Frank (another vote for Basingstoke)

	'Im Indoors and I moved to Reading to be close to work - 120 miles
	a day travelling was getting a bit too much ....

	After a few months (about 5) I got so frustrated with Reading's
	traffic and the town in general that I decided to move back
	to Portsmouth and suffer the journey rather than live in Reading ...
	
	Blasingsmoke has got to be better than that - hasn't it ?!?!?!

	Oh well I s'pose I'll find out after Xmas......

	Jane

    
    Hi HBUTT!
    
    
    I'm just trying to colour life with a charcoal stick!
    
    Actually, I am quite happy that I left Basingstoke except that I
    miss my Mum and Dad and Brother and old friends. Guess thats why
    I keep babbling!
    
    I don't even miss the beer in Basingstoke, its much better in East
    Tisted (ask Mike Roe)!
    
    Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to all you B'Stoke noters! At
    least you can get drunk on the premises!
    
    I'm going to somewhere far worse than Basingstoke for Xmas (anyone
    want to start a "Do you like CLEVELAND ?" note ?
    
    :-)

    
    re .107
    
    I think it was Grantham that pipped Basingstoke this year.
    
    re .110
    
    Steve,
    
    I hope you are referring to Cleveland, Ohio and not Cleveland, England
    :-)
    
    
    Tony_who_was_sent_to_Basingstoke_after_having_been_sent_to_Coventry

    
    
    HAVE YOU EVER BEEN TO NEWMARKET
    

    
    re .111
    
    Hi Tony,
    
    Yep, Cleveland Ohio, the same place that the river got so polluted
    one year that it caught fire (nasty chemical fire, cooked all the
    mutant fish).
    
    Makes Basingstoke look like St Tropez :-)
    

    Couldn't resist it .... 
    
    But has anybody noticed the Tourist Information sign in the New Market
    Square !!!!!!!! I ask you !!!!!!!!!!!!

    Probably put there to assist the lost Scotsmen who clutter up the
    place ... :-)

    Especially on a Saturday night !!!

    I'll admit it : I LIKE BASINGSTOKE .
    
    Most people always moan about the places that they live in ( must
    be the trendy thing to do ). 
    
    However, as a fairly new person to the area I find the atmosphere
    around this place fairly pleasant. I have walked thru' the town
    centre at night and I live to tell the tale, no riots, no muggings,
    no no-go areas. In fact it was peaceful. 
    
    I like eating, so the number of restaurants around here makes it
    particularly interesting to me. The other saturday night I went
    out for a meal, I hadn't booked up so it was a spur of the moment
    thing - All restaurants full, pubs packed - If its such a boring
    place with nothing to do why were there so many people enjoying
    themselves?? Can't quite figure that one out.
    
    Re earlier note about swindon. My idea of a nice town ( heaven )
    is one without any DIY shops, not a garden centre in sight and naff
    all for home improvements.
    
    Might I suggest that if your idea of fun is laying turf, decorating
    the house or building a barbecue then maybe the nightlife in basinstoke
    isn't quite right for you. However I have heard that Sainsbury's
    homebase diy shop is planning late night opening on saturdays to
    cater for this:-)
    
    Here's to eating
    
    Larry
    
    

    
    I'll throw a little carrot into the pot.
    
    Could be sometimes a name can colour a view of a place before you've
    been there.
    
    Ayr, Norwich, Welwyn Garden city... names with a bit of light
    that don't sound *rough*. (not saying that any place mentioned in
    this note is rough.)
    
    Basingstoke, Swindon, Slough....(God thats done it!!)
    Sound a little down when you say them.
    
    Truthfully I lived in Slough for six years and enjoyed it.
    It had good and bad places like anywhere else... I guess
    its what you make it.
    
    D2
    
    P.S. I lived in Grantham a long time ago as well. Not bad
    but it was boring. The chip shop only opened four days a week.
                             

    
    
    PPS I now live in Lower Earley, {8-( ,but thats another conference!!
    
    D2

No.

1)	The bus service is a joke. There are no late buses. The taxis are
expensive. There seems to be no strategy to encourage use of public transport.

2)	There are no 'interesting' shops. There are hardly any shops which
are not part of a chain. Also true for many towns across the UK but 
Basignstoke excels.

3) 	The Communities are 'invented'. Housing estates have been built on
a production line scale. There are few corner shops. Just occasional M&W
monopolies. A 15 minute walk to buy a newspaper from a filthy, overpriced
M&W doesn't make my day.

4)	There is little encouragement to walk anywhere. There are no pavements
along Heather Way, just paths to the bus-stops.

5)	Cars are encouraged. Walking, bussing and cycling are discouraged.
Cyclists are intimated on roundabouts by cars which can get up to high speeds.
Basingstoke have scored a bit of an own-goal by closing rat-runs, and not
using them as cycleways.

6)	Architects are entitled to get stoned just like the next man. But
if they insist on dropping acid, they shouldn't be sitting at their desks
at the time.

Must go, last 56 to Kempshott at 1820. bleah.

Dougie

    
    
    
    Sorry, but I *like* doughnut city...

You came in at 3am on a Sunday morning to write that!

I've thought of something I like about Basingstoke. The Library. Some of the
green bits are quite nice too. I think that's about it. The coffee shop in 
Kempshott Sainsbury's because its usually quiet.

Dougie

    No, silly, I live in the States!
    
    Just like coming over there!
    
    Linda

I like lots of places I don't live in! I liked Basingstoke the very first time
I came here. It seemed clean, bustling and affluent. There's a nice church
sort of affair where you can sleep on the grass after your interview, and 
there's loads of trains to London.

I have tried to like Basingstoke. I do make the effort every now and then. Its
a shame that it has such a transient, cynical professional population who are
just passing through, pausing only to sneer at Basingstoke. (And I know I'm
generalising and I know I'm including myself in the description above.)

I resent slightly the, "Oh, but you don't have to live there - just work there"
attitude. Walking through the town centre at lunchtime is like a 
visiting a Marks and Spencer trade show. Can't people undo their badges, just
for half and hour? "Hi, my name's Dave and my badge shows how important I am.
Hey, so I forget to take it off for lunch - but that's the kind off busy guy
I am" 

A trip to the library shows how much is going on in and around Basingstoke in
clubs and societies. Having said that, I've never visited or lived in any 
other town in which the quality of life is so drastically affected by owning
a car. 

I hate town centre's which close at 6pm. If you wander around the shopping
centre late at night, its a fairly spooky feeling. 

Er,

that's it

Dougie
 

    
    Yeh, ok, I did miss the stores being open at night and the centre
    was kinda spooky after hours...
    
    

    
    Well Dougie - coo whot a speach!
    
    Its just as well your gonna be winging your way back to Brighton
    then!  I agree with you whole-heartedly, but I am one of the
    unfortunate ones who was born and bred here, so the people I know
    here tend to be more important than the surroundings.  One very good
    thing to be said about Basingstoke is that within 10 minutes you
    can be out in 'beaut countryside - and Hampshire certainly has lots
    of that to offer.
    
    So, start crossing the days off until you go and be gone!  But I
    know full well Dougie, ol'bean, you'll never forget us here in dreary
    old Basingstoke eh?
    
    Slater
    Luce
    
    

RE: .-1;

>> Its just as well your gonna be winging your way back to Brighton

Sorry, was that winging or wingeing?

;-)

Mark.

    Basingstoke was fine, until all these 'Outsiders' decided to move
    here for the Fresh air and the wide open spaces. ;-)
    
    Wayne (Whos Mother was born in Basingstoke, and her Mother, and
    her mothers mother, and so on.)

< .127

Oh, whinging, absolutely!

There must be so much dosh created by professionals in Basingstoke,
and they just swan off to their posh country cottages without putting
anything back in. (That reminds me, must remember to pay the poll
tax).

I was in Southport at the weekend, and I remember thinking, I must do
some serious shopping before going back to the town with the saddest
looking M&S in the country. Basingstoke isn't designed for your
serious self-indulgent shopper, you don't 'shop' in Basingstoke, you
'pick things up'. I spent an hour in Southport in one second-hand book
shop. Why can't we have that kind of nonsense here?

When I finally found my joss sticks in Basingstoke , in the Oxfam
shop, the woman behind the counter asked me if I minded an OXFAM carrier bag.
Apparently some people wouldn't be seen dead shopping in Oxfam.

And now all the house-martins are leaving home. And Henry Hedgehog
has disapeared. And the neigbours ginger cat has been peeing in the
garage again.

Dougie


 

 

Ok Basingstoke - all is forgiven.

My home in North London is in a quiet part of Kingsbury. Apart from the sound 
of a shotgun going off in the middle of the night and the police cars and 
the double murders. 

I've only been there 3 weeks. Quelle Excitement.

Dougie

    
    hello dougie,
        
       just read your note and i also live very near kingsbury, infact i
       live in kenton.
    
    roshni.
    

    Well...after just over 4 years since this note was started, has anybody
    any further views on the state of the metropolis as it stands today?
    
    H

    	Is it any different to 4 years ago? 

    	I still don't live there.

    	This topic title is still misspelled!

    	Ian.

    	BTW - it's *exactly* 4 years since you signed off .49...
    
     �    Harvey ( who has now given up on this infernal topic !!!)
    
    	Ian.  :-)

    
    re -1
    
    �	BTW - it's *exactly* 4 years since you signed off .49...
    
    I should have guessed someone would have noticed !
    
    Anyway, at least I can say I no longer live there ..progress indeed!
    
    Farmer 'Arv

�    Anyway, at least I can say I no longer live there ..progress indeed!
                                            ====
    
    	I thought you only 'stayed' there!  (Ethnic/linguistic joke).
    
    	I.

Basingstoke is OK. I live here. I met my wife here. All of her
family are great, and have lived in Basingstoke all their lives.
(her grandad was mayor in the early 60's)

It seems churlish to complain really.

Mark.

  re -2
    
      �	I thought you only 'stayed' there!  (Ethnic/linguistic joke).
    
    
    No, Ian. I actually LIVED there, I am now STAYING elsewhere..(phew...)
    
    But, apart from the fresh water system, public health,education and the
    roads.....what do you think has improved/worsened over the past 4
    years.
    
    o Well...personally, I'm disappointed in the 'refurbishment' of the
      George (Hole in the Wall) at the top of town!
    
    o The appearance of the town centre has improved somewhat.
    
    o There is a new Indian restaurant (its okay if you want a drawing pin in 
      the lime pickle)
    
    o The Black Dam roundabout's road markings are a joke....
    
    o New leisure complex at Westfield lido....
    
    o House prices plummeted.... 
    
    Hmmmm..... 

    
    Yes, I've got some good words for Basingstoke too - they've all got 4
    letters!
    
    Ok, seriously: it depends what you want, doesn't it? Some ex-Londoners
    think Basingstoke is great - much more space and greenery; other 
    ex_Londoners I know got hacked off with it and returned - to the East End!
    - as they felt isolated from all their mates who didn't move down in
    the GLC overspill days. 
    
    My daughter thinks Croydon is great (the boyfriend's in Croydon - some
    connection there?) and her boyfriend thinks that Basingstoke is one
    up on Croydon!
    
    As for me? I've lived in better ... and worse!
    
    R.                                            

Basingstoke isn't all bad. I fell asleep in the grounds of the Churchyard  once
waiting to go to Snams for my interview. No hang on, that was another time.
This time was when I was looking for digs - got it now.

Basingstoke has some extremely nice Housemartins and snuffly hedghogs which don't
like the flash from cameras.

I didn't like not being able to get a bus after 7pm. The lack of a 'middle'
to the town, and trying to negotiate the roundabouts on a bicycle surrounded by
10,000 company car drivers. (My Housemate was knocked off his bike and needed
emergency surgery on his nonce - Ironically  I was further up the road complaining
about the traffic jam he was causing as I tried to drive to work.)

Basingstoke is nestled in some lovely countryside, and there's loads of nice
places to drive to within easy distance. This  is a BIG problem with London.

Basinsgtoke has leafy suburbs with big gardens. 

Dougie

    
    Basingstoke is a hole !
    
    I spent 2� years there and watched my house plummet from �63,000 to
    �48,000.
    
    The shopping centre (despite being improved by the new roof) is
    useless, it's okay if you want to go to a small branch of any
    nationwide chain, but there's no *real* shops there.
    
    The roundabouts are a pain in the neck - just an excuse for all the
    morons to try and cut you up.
    
    The facilities (swimming pool, cinema, bowling alley etc etc) are okay
    for a town about a tenth the size of Basingstoke - everytime I went to
    any of the above there were always too busy to be worth the effort.
    
    The best thing about Basingstoke is the A339 - the road to
    civilisation.
    
    Paul

    
    The A339 the road to civilisation?!?!?!?
    
    The WORST road in the universe is how I (Who until today had to travel
    it every working day) see it. A pathetic country lane with people who
    couldn't drive to save their children's lives on!
    
    I don't care where it goes, if I never travelled along it again, it'd
    be too soon (In fact, Monday will be MUCH too soon...).
    
    Mark

re .141,.143 

>    The A339 the road to civilisation?!?!?!?
    
Certainly is. It takes you from the urban bustle of Basingstoke all the way to
the lovely old market town of Alton deep in the heart of rural Hampshire. Only
about 12 miles but it makes all the difference.

Nigel

    
    Ah! The OTHER A339... :^)
    
    I didn't realise it also went SOUTH of Basingstoke.
    
    Mark

    I feel that Basingstoke has changed a lot in the past few months.  The 
    roads are safer, streets are cleaner and Winklebury (estate that is!)
    has become the "hip" place to be...
    
    Isn't it a coincedence that all this started to happen within hours of
    Paul Watterson gathering up his racing pigeons and his tesco's frozen
    tripe and going back oop north, eeh its grand lad down ere..