Conference 7.286::digital

    does the term DVN or Video conference mean anything?
    

    
    
    
    maybe they're getting them all together to lay em off...
    
    sometimes Digitals money is well spent....
    
    :-(

    I have heard that not only the managers, but also the sellers (both new
    and base), plus the MCS Sales Bid/Win teams will also be attending 
    that meeting.  However, some support functions, such as MCS Sales 
    Bus Ops, will not.  Information is, however, strictly rumor, since both
    information and invites are being tightly controlled.  The good news I
    have heard is that *no* (repeat, *no*) headquarters staff are invited,
    expect for the sales mucky-mucks (i.e, Dawn Gilbert, Terry Oberdank,
    etc., possibly!).
    
    As I said, strictly rumor.  And, I agree, it is a poor use of company
    funds at this time.  You can't find a pen or a sticky note, but you can
    go to San Diego for a Kickoff 3 months into the year.  Penny wise,
    pound foolish -- what else is new?
    
    M.
    
    

    Wanna bet they stay at the Hotel Del Coronado on Coronado Island?
    
    My wife & I honeymooned there and it is NOT inexpensive!  But I would
    hazard a guess that the DECies will have a blast!  In any event, if any
    of y'all have any guts, you should send a memo to BP and John Rando
    asking about this... I've tilted at windmills in the past and only
    gotten stomped on for doing so....so I'm keeping 'mum...

BP himself may be showing up to touch up his tan.  I have shaken the tree here
in Atlanta.  I asked my manager (who will be going) about this and to his 
credit, he doesn't think this is a good idea either.  So who planned this 
boondogle?  No one can tell me what the agenda is.  Is there one?  Why couldn't
they invite a few of us worker bees?  I bet I don't get invited.

Paul

Two months ago, the company prevented me from picking up a $50K purchase order 
from a customer, because it would involve an airline flight.  ($500)

"Thou shalt not travel."   and all...

Tripping over dollars to catch dimes, so we can waste millions on boondoggles.

...and every day Digital looses good people for want of a competitive 
compensation package.

(sigh)

Bob

    It is not rumor.  It is fact.  Kick off meeting for MCS.  Managers go
    on Sunday, Sellers and support go on Monday.....  I'd rather stay in
    the field and sell, be with my family at night and not take red eyes,
    but certainly this is not an unusual or worhtless venture...  
    
    

From what rumors I've heard, I think it's John Paget's show & I believe there
will be plenty of management there out of the 1100-1200 people rumored to be
going. I find this hard to believe.

    Disgusting is too un-meaning on what's going on in that space.  It 
    REAKS of 'don't do as I do.....do as I say.'!  All you folks that
    scrimped and saved with pencils, hardware and software, so these
    un-knowing, un-caring, and generally un-management can do a boon
    doggle.  Why don't someone from the board ask THEM to justify this
    with dollars returned on this investment!  Rando's comments about
    we're going to do a road show to tell customers what the new
    digital MCS is all about....client server expertise to the MAX. Any
    customer in their right mind could stop him dead in his tracks
    by just asking him 'so John, how you gonna do this...you've TFSO'd
    a large piece of talent in that space,  you've done away with training,
    just how will you pull this rabbit outa your hat? (or is that really
    a rabbit?)   
    
    Also got a kick outa how he was able to blatently state that morale
    is on the raise......(what the people DIDN'T ask was how that
    happened....  answer....they TFSO'd all the vocal disgruntled.
    
    Nutha case of the same old boys singing the same old song...only
    difference is they have a new wardrobe to 'fool' the multitudes
    and are playing with borrowed instruments!
    
    glad I'm gone!  But I WON'T BE FORGOTTEN!
    
    chet

     re .3
    
     Poor use of company funds??
    
     Have you heard or seen what they are doing to the interior of
     the AKO1 facility?? We're talking renovations in the $millions here
     folks. And now I guess they determined the lobby isn't fancy
     enough, so they're planning on re-doing that also. 
    
     At the high levels it looks like it's still business as usual.
    
    

    re: .6
    
    (haven't read the rest of the string, so if this is already addressed,
    sorry...)
    
    I've never heard of restricting travel that was directly tied to
    generating revenue.  If by "picking up a $50K p.o." you meant flying to
    the site to simply pick up the paper work; then I'd agree with the
    restriction (obviously, mail is the smarter way to deliver the p.o.).
    
    If by that phrase you meant flying to the customer to close the deal
    that would lead to their generating a p.o., then the restriction is
    silly.
    
    Could you clarify?
    
    
    RE: the basenote...
    
    There's a real catch-22 here...everyone (sweeping generalization ;-)
    coplains about cost cuts, how they impact morale, etc. etc.; then when
    a morale booster is implemented, everyone (see above ;-) gets upset
    about it.
    
    I've said this before, so please pardon the repetition.   Sales, MCS
    Bid/Win Teams, and others have done a fantastic job in selling
    multi-billions of dollars of sales & services - especially in light of
    the ridiculous frenzy we've been in.  A few million to keep spirits up
    doesn't seem that big a deal to me.
    
    Steve (neither in Sales nor MCS [or am I now?], but appreciative of 
    their work...)
    

    
    I am a Field Engineer. I carry a tool bag. Day in and day out, rain or
    shine, dead of winter and dark of night, when they call I go. I go and
    have been going just like that since 1976. My reward for going is that
    I get to go again. Thursdays, I get paid just like you and everyone
    else here. I am told that our organization will increase the level of
    service in the midst of cutting back on the number of service
    providers. If that statement was computer generated I would swap a
    module in the host. I am the product. The product doesn't get
    boondoggles. The product doesn't see any help on the way in news like
    this either. But if your machine is down, call me. I will be there. I
    will fix it. It's what I do.
    
    Karl

Re .12:

Exactly the attitude that I, as a developer of software, hope for from the
people who will maintain my systems when I send them out into the world.
Don't let anybody tell you that today's FSE is just a board swapper.  A
system isn't just hardware, it's software as well--I imagine this to be
even truer for MCS than other service organizations.  The FSE has got to
distinguish between HW and SW problems (not always easy), diagnose HW
problems that manifest themselves in SW AND fix them, and describe the
SW problems to me so I can fix them.  AND all the time he/she is the face
the company presents to the customer, has more to do with what the
customer thinks of Digital than any three managers put together.

Keep up the good work, colleague.

Steve

    RE: .12 - I *love* your attitude.  It's down to earth and highly
    appropriate, even quite positive, all things considered.  Keep it up. 
    I'll keep selling you if you keep up the good thoughts!
    
    RE: .11 - If you talk to the MCS Sales reps, you will discover that
    most of them are too jaded at this point to think of this as a morale
    booster.  And, frankly, two or three days of glossed-over training, a
    few highlighted success stories, and many, many speeches from Mass. Big
    Wigs will do very little to pump up the sellers.  
    
    Western States did one of these on a smaller scale in Q3 last year, and 
    I didn't see a whole lot of improved morale as a result.  It was fun, 
    and morale was higher while there, but it was back to business as 
    usual the following Monday.
    
    M.

    As a MCS Manager I can understand the frustration from all of the above
    about the San diego trip. All the managers I know feel that the trip
    may be a waste, but there is one ray of hope...Out of the 10 managers
    in this district only 3 are going.. Maybe we will get some useful info
    to share with all..Lets hope that its the message we all have been
    waiting for. 

    I'm confused, I just finished reading a memo from the Great Lakes
    District Manager, that all office in the Great lakes area will down size
    and there a possiblity that 85% of them will close. ( Employees will go
    on the Home program ) all in the name to save money. And where sending
    a 1000's+ to San Diego for a pump up the managers meeting. Somethings
    wrong with this picture.
    
    Bill Sevic
    MCS/Field Service Eng.
    Grand Rapids, Mi 

    Re .12:
    
    Your statement has done more for my morale than all of the DVNs and
    all of the articles in Digital Today put together.  Keep up the 
    good work and customer orientation!
    
    

    re .16
    
    Is this memo publishable ???
    
    I'm in south western Ontario and since we are now part of the 
    America's I'm a little concerned.
    
    E-mail would be fine as well 
    
    Thanks
    
    Brian V
    

Re: .11  (Picking up the PO)

A little more detail.  Obviously, it was to close the deal.  "Picking up the PO"
is a figure of speech that implies that the deal has a high probability of short
term closure.

The company is headquartered in my location, and we had done several similar
pieces of business.  The customer wanted me to work this effort directly for
reasons of continuity.  (For you beancounters in the crowd, you won't find the 
value of continuity in your books, but it exists none the less.)

Instead, we sent in a local resource.  This was on a Tuesday.   The meeting 
went very poorly. The local resource was awful.  The customer was very upset 
and we lost the business.  (Turns out that the "local resource" quit that 
Friday because he had a job with a competitor.)

Wednesday of that week, I got permission to fly down for the meeting...

8-(

    .19:
    
    Can you JV (or whatever) the red-tapers for the lost $500K?
    
    Dick

    re: .19
    
    Thanks for the clarification.  The phrase wasn't so obvious to me
    because many sales agents "picked up" their POs from me in person when
    I worked in Consultant Acquisition years ago - of course, they were
    local and wanted the document in their hand before agreeing to do any
    work, so in that context, it made sense as well.
    
    Again - without the details (depressing as they may be), it would be
    foolish of me to judge; but I'll say this - I've *never* heard of
    travel restrictions on *revenue generating* travel (until now, that
    is).
    
    Steve

This note contains a reply from Jennifer Beck in MCS Marketing about the
San Diego trip.  This is posted with Jennifer's authorization.

Paul



                  I N T E R O F F I C E   M E M O R A N D U M

                                        Date:     22-Aug-1994 02:49pm EST
                                        From:     Jennifer Beck @MRO
                                                  BECK.JENNIFER AT A1 AT USCTR1 AT MRO
                                        Dept:     U.S. MCS Marketing
                                        Tel No:   DTN: 297-4906

TO:  Paul Morabito @ALF

CC:  John Paget @MRO                      ( PAGET.JOHN AT A1 AT USCTR1 AT MRO )

Subject: MCS Field Meeting                                           

Paul,

We read your notesfile conversation regarding the upcoming Americas Field 
Meeting in San Diego. Since you seem to have an active network of people who 
share your concerns, I thought you might want to get the real inside story on 
what's happening and share it with your colleagues.

The idea of having this meeting has been reviewed and discussed at the highest 
levels of the company and the questions you pose were all part of those 
discussions. What will people think? How will it be perceived given the times 
were in? Are there alternatives such as DVN, etc? Most importantly, is it the 
most effective way to accomplish our overall objectives? 

Why the meeting and Who is going?

The theme of this meeting is "Answers for the Americas". The invitee list 
includes sales, delivery, admin. and logistics. Not everyone will be able to 
attend, since we've been given a cap of 950. These field people own our destiny 
and deal directly with our customers everyday. We owe them answers to some very 
complicated questions. Our pre-event survey helped us understand exactly what 
was not understood. We have people leaving the company from sales and delivery 
at an alarming rate. We owe them reasons to believe in this company again, and 
reasons to stay. We have specific measurement criteria in place and we're being 
audited on site. No T-shirts and give-a-ways. We've designed the workshop and 
training material and collateral to be used throughout the year and to bring the 
messages back out to the rest of the organization. 

Some of the Agenda Topics:

How to manage in a zero inventory environment?
What's the new Customer Loyalty program?
How do I engage Bid Win Teams for successful proposals?
What's the strategy for selling and delivering service through partners?
What are the revenue programs now refocused on our current customer base?
What's our service support strategy for the company's move to client server?
What's PC Utility?
What's the MCS Business Plan?
Who are the competitors? How do I sell against them?

This meeting also includes TRS V.2 training for base reps, and competitive 
selling strategies workshop for everyone. We estimate we will accelerate our 
training plan by three months and will create the context in which to learn a 
very different business. 

This meeting is not worldwide. It is the Americas. We have much to learn from 
our field people in Canada and South America. They have cracked the code on some 
of the problems we experience in the U.S. and we've designed workshops where 
managers and individual contributors can share what really works. 

Why San Diego?

We booked that site in April when we planned to do this meeting for sales only 
in July. It's a bargain when combined with the special arrangments we've made 
with one air carrier. It's also one of the few sites across the continental US 
that can accommodate our audience. if the weather is nice in September, it 
doesn't matter since these people won't have a spare moment from the time they 
arrive til they return home. We've programmed 12 hour days and into the nights 
-- a concept we know all field people call normal. 

Other Rumors...

Bob Palmer is not coming. He's in Europe. 

As an employee who still owns all her stock, believe me this is no boondoggle. 
In fact, the accleration of progress to turn issues into answers in time for 
this meeting is worth the effort alone. Right now, MCS has a little edge on the 
competition -- read Dataquest and IDC reports --. But we don't have another year 
or even six months to wait for people to get the message and get excited enough 
to convey that to our customers. The rate and nature of the changes we're 
putting people through dictates we point feet in the right direction and set 
them off running. The only way we know how to effectively do that with a 
polulation of people spread across two continents, is to bring them together, 
engage them in the new game plan, train them, arm them, encourage them, network 
them and shoot them out of a cannon. 

I expect my stock to go up as a direct result of this meeting. 

JB

        A few comments - I don't know the author, but I'll give you my reasons
    for not staying with this company.  I haven't made any firm plans
    (yet).

�     was not understood. We have people leaving the company from sales and
�     delivery  at an alarming rate. We owe them reasons to believe in this
�     company again, and  reasons to stay. We have specific measurement
�     criteria in place and we're being 

    Long hours, little compensation, little recognition, irritated by the
    bean counters.  First, I want a *fun* job.  What's fun?  Doing a job
    well, knowing you did it well, and being rewarded accordingly.

�     population of people spread across two continents, is to bring them
�     together,  engage them in the new game plan, train them, arm them,
�     encourage them, network  them and shoot them out of a cannon. 

    The evidence in this notes file is overwhelmingly positive regarding
    the IC's in this company.  When we see a need and can make a
    difference, things get done.  Example: the sysop customer who let her
    PAKS expire.  Frankly, with the likely sale of Rdb (I know it's just a
    rumor), jettison of other products, I don't know what the management
    is doing, I cannot depend on them to be consistent, and I sure don't
    see them applying the same standards to themselves that they nail the
    ICs with.

>>�     was not understood. We have people leaving the company from sales and
>>�     delivery  at an alarming rate. We owe them reasons to believe in this
>>�     company again, and  reasons to stay. We have specific measurement
>>�     criteria in place and we're being 
>>
>>    Long hours, little compensation, little recognition, irritated by the
>>    bean counters.  First, I want a *fun* job.  What's fun?  Doing a job
>>    well, knowing you did it well, and being rewarded accordingly.
    
    I, too, reacted to this statement. Not only the above sentiment, but
    the fact that we've been throwing excellant people out the door. In
    that sort of environment, with the TFSO package as it currently stands, 
    is it not unreasonable to expect that people are going to pursue other
    jobs before they are "transitioned"??? And what many of them are
    finding out is that the grass _is_ greener on the other side...
    
    Dave

    the way this company can start to halt the brain drain is to start
    treating people like human beings and professionals again. its been a
    long time since that has occurred.
    
    frankly, i find this 1,000 people gathering in CA a bit insulting and
    disgusting. we've thrown so many VERY GOOD people out the door, and so
    many more are leaving of their own will, its frightening. we've got
    some very good people left who couldn't get a raise if they were god
    and we still have money for gatherings such as this.
    
    the most obvious way to determine if something is a boondoggle or not
    is to see if there is a way to determine its value and contributions 
    afterword. won't happen with this. no way.

    
     We have "950" people in the field? Amazing. This does NOTHING for me
    or my co-workers. It only makes us wonder, business as usual in some
    parts of this company.
    
    -Mike Z.
    Digital Consulting
    
    

    Where is this event being held - just curious...
    
    BGN
    

    .27
    
    I think Butthead said San Diego..
    

    I'm unsure of the date. When is it occuring. Is it by invitation only.
    If not I believe that some MCS engineers should attend to keep us up
    to date on whats happening.
    
    Several notes back some one was saying that the meeting was strictly
    to answer questions Line managers were having about MCS future ie
    shrinking revenues/engineers/increase in TEMP/contractors.
    
    I believe they will find out they are actively trying to sell MCS.
    Why else over the past few months would the reorganization do the 
    following.
    
    Align ADMIN(contracts) with MCS remember they were part of Logistics
    about 1 year ago. Prior to that they were on their own.
    
    Align logistics now with MCS..
    
    Align parts of Digital Consulting with MCS.
    
    
    Hmm nice package ehhhhhhhh!
    
    I believe we should actively participate in these talks.
    
    Mike Turro
    

    The following entry has been contributed by a member of our community
    who wishes to remain anonymous.  If you wish to contact the author by
    mail, please send your message to QUARK::MODERATOR, specifying the
    conference name and note number. Your message will be forwarded with
    your name attached  unless you request otherwise.

				Steve






    As a ten+ year MCS employee, I am very familiar with the MCS 
    Rally meeting and similar kick-off meetings held in the past.  
    Although I appreciate the  comments shared by everyone, I do feel 
    that the meeting is required and well planned.  This is a 
    breakthrough year for Americas MCS and if 3 days of training are 
    managed correctly, we can all benefit from the improved ability 
    of the MCS sales force to understand and sell the new MCS 
    offerings. However, what I STRONGLY disagree with is the 
    conversion of this meeting by organizations like Logistics into a 
    boon-doggle.  There are over 20 people attending from the 
    Logistics organization and just 4 of them are from the field.  
    The vast majority of them have never touched a part in their 
    life nor have they ever worked in the field.  I question the 
    neccessity of this show of force from the Logistics organization 
    and the value associated. It seems to me that it's just a 
    boon-doggle and ego thing.
    

    sort of a telling sign how many people are afraid to speak publically
    these days. i don't blame them. its the climate of the day. 

    .31
    
    If course, they're CHICKENS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    
    SPEAK UP!!
    
    
    THE END IS NEAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    

.32

I don't blame them either.  It may be chicken-heartedness, or the realization
that some things may follow you and labels (such as sour grapes, non-team
players, etc) are hard to shake, even when untrue.  There are examples
where the messenger is shot because of the message.  Anyone see the
Mercury commercial where the one non-chicken (brave) soul stood up to
challenge the car-maker boss?  The next scene showed an empty chair,
with the boss asking if there were any more questions.  Intimidation.
Usually the person who is unintimidated already has a job lined up.
(I don't, and just mentioning the power structure in this public forum
gives me trepidation.)

How many people have used the "open door" policy to speak out against something
that involved accountability of their superiors and had an improved lot in
company life because of it?  It is one thing to receive "need improvement"
from your supervisor, but another to receive it from your direct report.
Senior management says they want to know.  I'd bet that some suggestions that
are taken to Sr. Mgt.are then parlayed to Middle Mgt to work on or advise.  
When a problem involves middle mgt, what do you think the outcome is?

So the people who enter anonymous notes may be more wise to be cautioned
than they are chicken-hearted.  The end may be near, but there are new
beginnings to consider, or the sincere hope to continue work in the new 
Digital while bringing issues out into the open.

I would encourage people to speak out, though, even if it means doing so 
through anonymous posting.

Mark

    Re: Last few:
    
    	To quote Frank Zappa's lyrics/titles: 
    
    	"The Meek shall inherit NOTHING."
    
    Phil

    
>    	To quote Frank Zappa's lyrics/titles: 
>    
>    	"The Meek shall inherit NOTHING."
    
    Which is probably all the more the reason why they're kind of
    anxious to keep on drawing a salary...

    These meetings have value.  They provide information critical to the
    success of the sales and support groups in MCS.  These meetings allow
    the information givers to control and measure the reception of that
    information ( make dang sure that it sinks in ), to a very large
    percentage of the target population...
    
    Good people have been tsfo'd, but we still need to do business....

        I just can't resist posting some thoughts about this.
        
        I work in the US CSC with Paul.  It seems to me that if this
        wasn't a boondoggle, the managers would have informed us, by now,
        that they'll all be gone next week.  I expect the district
        secretary to send out a message late Friday afternoon, that
        everyone will be out of the office, and there will be no further
        explanation.  This is an indication of how much information will
        be passed down to the IC's.
        
        Second, if MCS was interested in saving money the event would be
        held on Wednesday-Friday.  East coasters could fly out Tuesday
        night and stay over Saturday to qualify for the least expensive
        fares back on the weekend.  They wouldn't lose a workday flying
        back on Thursday!  Economics 100.
        
        Last, my manager's aren't talking, and one of the responses
        indicated the intended audience, but not "exactly" who would be
        attending.  I could be way off base.  I'm assuming that most, but
        not all, of the attendees will be management?  Assume 800 managers
        for the 12,500 MCS employees.  How is management working to
        achieve the 1-25 or 1-40 manager/IC ratio?  Maybe that's an item
        for this meeting to address!
        
        Dave Zaniewski

    
    RE: airfares and saving money
    
    From my contacts in the MCS area, they cut an INCREDIBLE deal with one
    airline.   I know that the folks from Dallas are flying R/T to San
    Diego for about $350 with no Saturday night stay or usual restrictions.  
    
    Folks in some Southwest Airlines cities are using "Friends Fly Free" in
    order to get two tickets for the price of one.  (About $360 for two
    people, round trip!)
    
    FWIW the similar ticket would cost about $1100 to go to Boston.
    
    As a sales rep, I'm all for the MCS meeting.  I have a huge MCS budget
    to make this year and need qualified, competent, up-to-date MCS sales
    folks to help me make it.  Given the margins involved in services (very
    high) and the smart way that MCS appears to be approching this from a
    cost perspective, I think this is a great investment.
    
    And guess what?  The customers WANT to buy Digital services and have
    been frustrated with our inability to quickly respond with creative
    solutions.  This meeting should go a long way to meeting that demand.
    
    Being in a tight financial situation does not mean that we should not
    make smart investments.  It appears that if MCS doesn't handle this
    meeting appropriately, they will be paying for it in the very near
    future...

    who attends, the costs, the politics, the whatever, doesn't matter much
    if this event improves the corporate bottom line. and we'll never know
    that. sooooooooo! would anyone who attends care to comment on the
    "training" and its value to the bottom line? 
    
    many will be waiting. few will be holding their breath.

A few back...ONE airline offering INCREDIBLE rates...


Well, my manager's are flying American.  Southwest doesn't fly in/out of 
Atlanta.  Buddy or not.  So what did Digital do, "Hey Airline, we are DEC and
we have lost billions the last few years, so have you, how 'bout a deal for
an old friend?"  


I don't think so.

Last year was The Dallas __________ (fill in the blank)

			 Kickoff
			 Meeting
			 Training
			 Boondogle

What came of that???  Did our Manager's get launched out of cannon from Dallas?
Don't know what they discussed there either.  I wonder who the guest speaker
will be at this one.  Maybe someone from a 3:00 am infommercial on how to 
get rich, be powerful, and loose weight.  How about Marshall Sylver?  Maybe
they'll come back hypnotized.


I, like HAAG::HAAG, await a report on what is discussed and decided in San 
Diego.


Yours Cynically,

Paul 

I, too, will be interested to hear from attendees, not because I'm
sitting here waiting to holler "Boondoggle!", but because I'm curious
about goings on in another part of the corporation.

Hope the meeting's a success and a prelude to a dynamite year.

Steve

        I'll also reserve my judgement, until about a week after the CSC
        managers come back and have had ample time to give us their
        report. 
        
        I guess I'll call it a "boondoggle" if they don't act energized,
        don't provide a report and can't or won't answer any questions.
        
        Dave Zaniewski

    RE .42
    
    I would call it business as usual, not a boondoggle.  Answers? 
    Communications?  I get better information from the rumors my customers
    get through the trade rags.  they have been more accurate than anything
    I get from managemnt lately.
    
    meg

I happend to speak with one of the CSC managers just before
she went. She had been told they would recieve imformation
packets and handouts to bring back and spread the word. liesl

>She had been told they would recieve imformation
>packets and handouts to bring back and spread the word

So, if all this information can be spread by handouts and info packets, why have
a meeting??

Dave

        re: .45
        
        So everybody could take a cheap trip to Hawaii, when all the
        official things were done!
        
        Dave Zaniewski

re .22

>> it doesn't matter since these people won't have a spare moment from the
>> time they arrive til they return home. We've programmed 12 hour days and
>> into the nights --

	I heard they all went to the San Diego Zoo yesterday. It was closed
	at the time and opened just for Digital. Zoo tour and dinner. I
	wonder how much that cost DEC ?

Tom

    I hope this isn't true...
    
    Jim Morton

    i will be anxiously awaiting a trip report from anyone who attended.
    the more the better. as before, i won't be holding my breath. i haven't
    that much breath left.

    The real problem isn't that all those guys n' gals got to
    go to the zoo.
    
    The real problem is that we didn't :-)
    
    Anyways, I wants to know how many cubbies the tigers had
    this year...
    
    Animal Lover

    
    So? They all went to the zoo. No problem there. The real question 
    is how many left the zoo? 
    
    jc

    So, everybody complains that they went to the zoo.  Perhaps it fit into
    the presentation?  We could *really* run with this.  For example, in
    the ape house, what would we be looking for?
    
    Charlie

>    So, everybody complains that they went to the zoo.  Perhaps it fit into
>    the presentation?  

	Of course it did.  The San Diego Zoo is well run, and maybe the 
	management can get some ideas on the care and feeding of the zoo
	inmates to use when they return home to their own zoos.

    
    Shoot the Gorillas and free all the Ostriches?
    

    Now I begin to understand why I've been getting paid "peanuts" these
    last several years.....

    well, ya see, the SD Zoo used to get a lot of DEC's $$$ through
    matching funds.  They had to make up the shortfall somehow.
    
    ed

    The zoo would seem to be one place where the 'scent of
    digital management' would not be noticed.

    Well, I talked with one guy from MCS here and he said it was "
    one hell of a good time". Yes, they also went to the zoo.
    I said welcome back to the zoo...

    Look on the bright side, at least someones morale is better?

Maybe the theme for the MCS meeting went something like this:

	Over the next few days, we want you to learn how to manage your
	business from inside a zoo.  We think you'll find this practice
	extremely relevant when you get back home and see the relationship
	between staffing levels and customer expectations that our recent
	decisions have brought about.

And so on...

Dave

    From what I heard so far from the meeting is that TFSO is no longer the
    keyword...it has been replaced with "variable work force".  This is
    just my perception....but a rose by any other name..............
    

    
    Hopefully we went to the zoo to understand the concept "Don't bite the
    hand that feeds you".
    
    /Jim K

    well would anyone who attended the "training" care to comment on its
    applicability to turning this ship around? i am not speaking of hype,
    but real info that can be translated into real dollars for the
    shareholders.

		oops, just jumped in here

		I think that MCS work is just like police work. It has to
		be online 24*7*365. Disgusting idea that a fully working
		world-wide org is to be torn down.
		
		Who is going to sort out this mess ?

		Tero the grunt

    At least a sense of humor is alive and well in this string -- Actually
    had me giggling --- and I don't do giggles before my first cup of
    coffee -- Actually these "meetings" have multiple purposes -- one of
    them is to make the sales organization feel good so that they become
    energized.  Hopefully that translates to getting them engaged into
    selling their stuff.
    
    To me that translates to more revenue -- and that means money -- and
    that means and eventual and successful end to this malaise we have been
    experiencing for far too long --
    
    Having said that, some of those comments from .45 on were pretty good!
    
    Dennis

    RE: .65
    
    <to make the sales organization feel good so that they become>
    <energized.>
    
    Isn't their a battery commercial about a company that has a 
    rabbit that keeps going-and-going-and-going? Maybe they sent their
    sales force to the same zoo for training? Gee, does that mean everyone
    else in Digital(other than MCS) is "NEVERREADY"??? 

I stand humbled...

DEC 26 5/8, change +1 5/8; DJIA 3938.74, change +5.38 at 15:25.
Report entered at Mon Sep 19 15:28:05 1994.

Paul

    We then should send all 80,000 of us to the zoo for a couple of months.

    re .67
    
    from today's wsj:
    
    Cowen & Co. lifted its investment rating on Digital stock to "strong
    buy" from "neutral".  Cowen cited, in part, optimism about a new
    high-speed computer chip the Maynard, Mass. company has developed for
    use in video servers.
    
    Mark
    

    Cowen & Co. lifted its investment rating on Digital stock to "strong
>    buy" from "neutral".  Cowen cited, in part, optimism about a new
>    high-speed computer chip the Maynard, Mass. company has developed for
>    use in video servers.

     COuld someone explain what the "video server" business is and
     in particular, what products are planned ?

     I was under the impression it is "backroom" equipment used
     primarily by big cable companies. I was also under the impression
     (based on 1st hand observations) that it was Intel based.

     THe press keeps touting our interactive video servers but it
     all seems abit nebulous to me. 

    
    Well I work in that group.  VIIS!   Product centers around alpha
    running OSF and VOD software layered on top.  The INTEL Piece
    is for the storage, running NETWARE. Talk to me off line if you
    want/need more information.   
    
    chet

    Chet, is there an appropriate notes conference to make
    further inquires ? I would guess that if one exists, it's
    probably restricted though.

    thanks, PC

    BTW: now that you mention it, I did see the storage unit
    (many many units :-) that was being built for US WEST.

    We have had TWO seminars for MCS. one in June and the other just last
    week.  These seminars were videotaped and the first is available
    through VTX IR. Second will be as well at some time soon. I have
    all the handouts and charts in my office.  
    
    Now for the problem.  Don't know if I should use this forum to 
    ask this, but since there are so many prople interrested, I will.
    
    Since the product consists of the following: (Real high level)
    	IIS	 Interactive Information Server 
    		 Intel box (for today, maybe a sable in the future) 
    	   	 running Netware and Untrastor disk arrays.
    
    	IGU	 Interactive Gateway Unit   (recieves signals from the
    		 end users (subscribers for interactive information) TWO
    		 way dialogue.
    
    	SMU 	 System Management Unit (sets up the sessions with the
    		 IGU to play movies, load information etc)
    
    	GIGA-Switch   FDDI Crosbar switch (Dynamic switching for up to
    	              22 FDDI Rings)
    
    	Black box   ????????????? Name says it all!
    
    	SAC 	  System Administrators Console  Operators interface to
    		  the system for maintenance, operation, performance
    	          tuning, etc etc
    
    	DUC	  Diagnostic Utility Console   Self Explainatory  for
    		  diagnostics and utilities to the server system.
    
    	ILS 	  Interactive Library System   (for adding content to
    		  the IIS system) Example : Take MPEG format movie and
    		  store in the IIS, add to the index of available movies
    		  etc.
    
    	Most of the systems use alpha's, the SAC is an intel PC, the IIS
    	uses INTEL PC's in a J-BOX configuration, and ULTRASTOR adapters
    	for the DISK arrays........
    
    Most of this is redundent at the customer's request.
    
    
    Now for the problem:  And I need all the help I can get!
    
    MCS states that all this 'stuff' is regular off the shelf stuff,
    and NO ONE in the field will be trained on the product. They will 
    use the Expertise Center as the point that the customer will 
    call to get support. This is an unsatisfactory solution for
    us in Engineering. Most of the customer's will require a resident
    Digital person, and since we are in the trail stage, MCS visibility
    and expertise for the products will only ensure our success, if they
    are adaquately trained on the WHOLE Product. As you can see from the
    brief above description of the product, it truly is NOT AN OFF THE
    SHELF solution! And the Customer's being who they are (big TELCO
    companies, etc) will expect a TRAINED Engineer to service/support
    the product.   I've been wrestling with all possible solutions
    even to the point that we (VIIS) procure our own service/support
    structure to ensure our success.......I've been involved in too
    many products from the other side of the fence, where MCS has sent
    untrained personnel to fix a product that they have never seen.....
    only to piss off the customer!  (Remember the applicationDEC433MP?)
    
    If anyone has a suggestion as to how to get 'past' the corporate
    stumbling blocks, please let me know!  I would do anything in my
    power to get through this knothole, even to the point that if OJT
    is required, engineering agrees to bring the 'right' people back
    and get them working in the lab on the product.  It's NOT a simple
    product, and sending an untrained engineer to a site who spent
    potentially eleven million or so ain't gonna cut it!  	
    
    	This market is getting ready to explode, and Digital is in
    it up to it's ears with their solution. Palmer, and Pesetori 
    have bought into the strategy, Rando has acknowledged it as well.
    BUT IT REQUIRES A TRAINED ENGINEER TO INSTALL/MAINTAIN/DIAGNOSE!
    
    So, notesfile pals, where do we go from here?
    
    chet

>    We have had TWO seminars for MCS. one in June and the other just last
>    week.  These seminars were videotaped and the first is available
>    through VTX IR. Second will be as well at some time soon. I have
>    all the handouts and charts in my office.  

	I think this should be the main thrust, because if the "field" is not
	going to be trained you can bet the "Expertise Center" won't either.

	High level seminars to aquaint the system and process.  What is it and
	what is it trying to do?

	Next have a level deeper video for the different aspects an engineer
	will encounter, i.e. INSTALL, MAINTAIN, and DIAGNOSE.

	You can take the videos down to the deepest level of expertise you
	want before any lab/lecture (if any is necessary) is used.

	It might also be interesting to use videos to explain the different 
	customer applications.  This way an office can apply "training" to new
	engineers before they go on-site.

	Just some of my thoughts.

	Charles

    
    re:-1
    
    To the point!  We in VIIS WILL WALK THE TALK of interactive video
    and use on of the servers to offer interactive learning through
    a variety of transports....mainly Mosiac. We will offer a server
    to have an instructional course (We are working on this right NOW!)
    on the server in three areas, vision, sys admin/management, and
    authoring.  It could be demo-ed an a couple months or so. But the
    fact remains, you can watch videos and do CBT's till you're blue in the
    face......it will NOT help you identify a problem with hardware
    or software or integration issues on a customer site when the system
    is down and the customer is loosing millions every second.  
    
    We need another solution.  
    
    I'll keep you posted!
    
    chet

    re: .73
    
    Chet, for Digital's (your) sake and the customer's sake don't depend on
    other organizations, at least not initially.  There are too many people
    in survival mode.  I would suggest training a core group of people and
    have them travel to do installation and repair.  This is the only way
    you could control the quality of installation and repair.  Once the 
    number of units will justify the expense to the field organizations to 
    train people on this product, you may be able to pass the baton.
    
    It seems to me that many of our field organizations (local MCS, CSC's)
    are terribly understaffed now due to TFSO's, etc.  Your product would
    be just another set of boxes to fix on top of all of the other boxes
    that need fixing.
    
    Grant

    Got a meeting this afternoon to discuss that very thing!  
    
    Thought of it before,
    
    Done it before.....
    
    succeded at it before.....
    
    Thought of it again,
    
    Done it again,
    
    succeded at it again,
    
    Thought of it still
    
    Doing it still,
    
    will succeed at it STILL!
    
    
    It's just frustrating that this company DOEW NOT learn from it's
    mistakes!!!! Problem is that under the new regeme, you CAN'T admit
    that you made one......if that's so, how the christ will you EVER
    learn!!!!! that's what experience is folks!  Making mistakes, admitting
    you made mistakes, and LEARNING from them mistakes!!!!  digital Re-Orgs
    every time they make a mistake, this allows the makers to SNEAK into
    oblivion until the next time!!!!!  Part of the overall problem!
    
    chet

    
     We had a very similar problem with the RW500 series of optical
    jukeboxes. We still HAVE the problem. We have offered many training
    courses, but unfortunatly they seem to be the kiss of death for the
    attendees. At least 50% of the people attending these courses get
    TFSO'd very shortly afterwards, or even during the course....
     So we still have the problem. It seems support is being pushed back
    all the way to engineering. The field person goes out to fix a box he
    has never seen before since he can't get training. He then calls the
    CSC, after spending 8 hours looking (and billing) for a torx driver.
    The call then very quickly gets routed to someone in our group as an
    escalation since the CSC has almost no storage people left. We usually
    wind up asking if the shipping bracket has been removed or find that
    the SCSI addresses are incorrectly set or some other issue that if the
    person had even a small amount of training would never have resulted in
    a call. Meanwhile, the engineer that is supposed to be working on
    adding new features that the customers are screaming for and new
    connects that will increase our sales is on the phone doing service 80%
    of the time. 
    
     I wish you good luck, (mainly since I'll be joining your group in
    about a week)

    As I have said in other notes regarding the Regional support people.
    These were very talented senior people that could actually
    troubleshoot at the OVERALL system level.  Not just the device level.
    All the ones that I knew (with the exception of a handfull) were all
    TFSO'ed by managers that had no clue as to how to manage a wage-class 4
    individual, nor did they understand what value they would add.  
    
    Now, if they "contract" field engineers, they will NOT be able to
    actually control their actions.  These individuals will have NO loyalty
    to either Digital OR the customer!  Other comapnies have seen this and 
    are bringing thos folks back in-house!
    
    Mike A.

    would anyone who attended the training in san diego please comment on
    its content and viability?

    
    
    	ref: .79
    
    	Loyalty??    What's that??

    
    
    	ref: .80
    
    		I can't comment.....but, inquire about what happened at
    a place called "Dick's Last Resort"!   I have a T-shirt from there!
    Ask what happened there!!

    .80
    
    Amazing! HAAG has asked at least three times for a value added updaate
    for those that attended. Not one response yet!
    
    

re: .84

The answer is obvious:-(

    We were told that the participants are waiting for materials and will
    put together a presentation for us.
    
    I don't hold my breath anymore.  blue may be a good color for eyes, but
    it makes for a lousy complexion.

    re: T-shirt from "Dick's Last Resort"
    
    I've seen some very new and fashionable "Hard Rock Cafe - SanDiego"
    attire floating around in my office....and I didn't even get a pin  
    to add to my collection.  Hmmmm could it be because I used that
    boondoggle word before, during and after?

    i don't understand. supposedly hundreds of people attended this
    training. it was advertised as "intense" like a 12-14 hours a day of
    serious stuff. i've been to training that was like that, the opposite,
    and just about everything in between. i don't much care who attended.
    or why. i'm simply interested in what was presented and its value to
    dec's mission and our return to profitability. everytime i ask for a
    new modem, a laptop memory upgrade, etc., i'm told the cost doesn't
    fit into that mission.
    
    and FWIW, everytime i attend a weeks training i write up a summary and
    send it out to the appropriate peoples.
    
    so what gives? why all the hush?

    maybe they were so overcome at the Zoo that they lost memory of the
    balance of the meeting...nevermind.

    
    I think you will find in the end, that the reason for all the hush
    is THE SAME REASON for all the hush surrounding the IDC dealings.
    
    

			Making Teamwork Work
             An inside look at a company in the midst of change
	          by  Nancy K Austin  for "Working Woman"

    Is there a manager alive who hasn't yet heard the
    clarion call to teams?  Twenty-seven percent of
    companies responding to a 1990 survey of over  800
    firms, conducted by the Pittsburg-based consultancy
    Development Dimensions International, the Association
    for Quality and Participation and "Industry Week"
    magazine, say they are already using self-directed teams
    in some form. And more companies than ever say they are
    at least thinking about converting. Their vision: 
    empowered employees working together to push 
    productivity, quality, and profits skyward.  

    Sounds great, but how do you get there?  The truth is,
    the process of restructuring is almost guaranteed to
    turn your well-ordered life topsy-turvy, a fact
    irritatingly absent from progress reports on companies
    that have successfully changed themselves.  So when I was
    invited to help the San Diego Zoo with its changeover to
    a  team-directed work force, I gladly accepted what I
    saw as an opportunity to get a good look at some of the
    skinned knees and bloody noses that come with the
    territory.


    The San Diego Zoo is transforming its operation to
    reflect the  modern zoo's ultimate imperative: to
    preserve and protect the earth's wildlife. The zoo is
    leading the way in creating  innovative natural
    environments for every species in its care.  These
    so-called bioclimatic zones are slices of nature that
    group flora and fauna in cageless enclosures that
    closely resemble  their native habitats. So far, in a
    transformation that began in  1982, four zones have been
    completed:  Kopje Corner, Tiger  river, Sun Bear Forest
    and Gorilla Tropics. 

    The bioclimatic-zone concept is also the driving force
    behind a radical redesign of the zoo's human
    organization. The complexity  of managing these zones
    has made the transition to a team-based organization
    inescapable. The original management structure --- 50
    vertical  "home departments" that specialize in
    everything from mammal keeping to  information systems
    --- is neither fast enough nor flexible enough for the
    new setup.

    The four team operations enjoy a kind of pilot-project
    status,  while the rest of the zoo continues to run in
    the traditional way.  Each zone is staffed by a
    permanent, self-managing team of  9 to 10 people who
    come from a cross section of old departments. Together,
    they share responsibility for running the whole area. 
    Management plans to transport the most successful parts
    of the team experiment to the new zones as they open,
    until the home departments have vanished and only home
    teams remain. The  goal is to complete this transition
    by 1995.

    So far, results are decidedly upbeat. The average cost
    of a worker's compensation claim in a team area in 1991
    was $1786, compared with $5121 in a traditional zoo
    department.  Workers are more careful when they feel
    ownership for a project --- and they're also less 
    likely to sue. Last summer, due in part to the new
    environments, zoo  attendance was up by 20 percent. 

    Though the zoo's accomplishments are many, the process
    it is undergoing is bumpy, costly, and sometimes painful
    --- as is clear from the questions employees asked me
    during my visit.


    * I like this team thing, as long as I can replace all
    the people they pull from my department.


    As work teams started to form at the zoo, several
    managers complained that their departments had been
    "raided," their best employees taken.  Their wish to
    make up that loss will go unfulfilled; the zoo clearly
    intends to support the transition to teams. The
    changeover will be gradual, however, so managers will
    have two jobs for the next few years: running their old
    departments and letting go of a lifetime of managerial 
    habits, embracing a whole new set of skills better
    suited to what lies ahead --- and that necessarily
    causes anxiety.

    The best way to quiet this particular panic is to
    involve managers as heavily as possible in helping to 
    make the transition a success. They can be given the job
    of experienced go-betweens who coach, consult,  and offer
    moral support to fledgling team units. This option
    provides some structure for managers who are groping for
    a  handhold, and it also supplies the stability that the
    teams need at this point.

    Of course, there will always be managers who won't get
    with the program. In those cases, the managers might be
    reassigned as "technical experts: to the teams, but with
    no formal authority over what they do.

    * Why not just have us manage our departments better?
    Aren't we just replacing one set of problems with
    another and avoiding the real issue?

    Translation:  "If managers learned to be more efficient,
    none of this team stuff would be necessary.  Do we
    really need something so radical? We should just polish
    up our management skills and get rid of the deadwood."
    This is a good question, and a common one.  The only way
    to answer it is for  company executives to explain why
    improving the old system isn't enough, why what's needed
    is nothing less than a fundamental redefinition of how
    the business is run.  In the zoo's case, the switch to
    bioclimatic zones makes operations so complex and
    interrelated that they can't be run from a group of
    separate, off-site departments.  No matter how efficient
    the departments became, an on-site cross-trained team
    would always be more so.

    *  Just what happens to me when all these people
    supervise themselves?

    Making the transition to teams means a fundamental shift
    in power and  authority.  Managers will inevitably
    think, "Wait a minute, I have a lot to lose.  What's in
    this for me?"  But if the manager's role is not
    completely rewritten, the exercise is bogus.  Better
    to say it straight from the start and help bosses get
    used to being hands-off coaches who liberate rather than
    overseers who confine.  Again, involving managers in the 
    change process is essential, but extensive training in
    new leadership roles is also a must.  For example, a
    comprehensive two-year training program was key to
    smoothing the transition to teams at Aid Association for
    Lutherans (AAL), a respected insurance company.  Within
    the first year, the change boosted productivity 20
    percent and cut case-processing time by up to 75
    percent. 

    * Who's responsible for results if there's no honcho in
    charge?

    The familiar tenants of traditional management can make
    self-managing teams seem squishy and uncontrolled if the
    accountability  issue is left vague. Of course, a shift
    to teams does not dilute the obligation to perform up to
    company  standards. On the contrary.  If employees
    aren't sure how progress will be measured and judged,
    that's a clear indication that more  training is
    required and that the company needs to better  explain
    its overall plans and goals.  Corporate headquarters
    should present a clear blueprint of the whole process,
    start to finish. It should include, at least:

    -- An overall mission statement that spells out why the
       company is converting to teams and why now

    -- What social and technological changes need to be made to
       support teams

    -- Where the process will begin and how it will spread

    -- How change --- and resistance --- will be managed

    -- Who will design the work teams

    -- How long it will take

    -- How the accomplishments will be measured

    The zoo has just begun work on such a master plan for
    its conversion.

    Teams at the San Diego Zoo may sound like the
    politically correct choice. In fact, the move to
    self-management was driven by serious business and
    environmental concerns. Don't even think of airlifting
    teams into any old environment merely because the brass
    heard it's a 90's thing to do.  The reasons have to be
    big enough to support the effort and survive the
    problems.  

    Like many businesses, the zoo has become
    knowledge-based.  Keepers and  gardeners sill keep and
    garden, but more than that, they "think" for a living. 
    The way to take advantage of an asset that  valuable is
    to build a fast, flexible operation where smart people
    know they can take action a nanomoment's  notice.  Next
    time you visit the San Diego Zoo, tip your hat to the
    courageous people who make  teamwork, like the animals,
    a pleasure to watch.

    --Nancy K Austin is a management consultant based in
    Capitola, Calif. She is coauthor, with Tom Peters, of "A
    Passion for Excellence."

    After three+ years of working toward self managed teams, having them
    squished in another reorg, remaking them, getting the new teams barely
    functional, only to have them disrupted again, and again, and again, I
    for one, am ready for tradition, if only because of the energy waste in
    constant reorg's.
    
    Team, self direction, empowerment, focus, etc. are nice buzzwords, but
    they are meaningless when they are given no followthrough.
    
    Just one empowered mushroom's opinion.
    
    meg

RE: .90
    
>    I think you will find in the end, that the reason for all the hush
>    is THE SAME REASON for all the hush surrounding the IDC dealings.

What same reason is that?  I'm in IDC and I have yet to figure out "the
reason" information is being kept under wraps.
    

    
    I suppose the reason we haven't heard anything wonderful is that there
    wasn't anything wonderful to talk about. we had our "This what
    happened" meeting, and all I got out of it, "The field asked for this
    via the survey, and now ya got it."
    
    To me, it sounds like a week long party, without me.
    
    .mike.

    re: .93   
    
    
    refer to note 3405.18
    
    that says it all for me!
    
    

    The following reply has been contributed by a member of our community
    who wishes to remain anonymous.  If you wish to contact the author by
    mail, please send your message to ROWLET::AINSLEY, specifying the
    conference name and note number. Your message will be forwarded with
    your name attached  unless you request otherwise.

    Bob - Co-moderator DIGITAL

=============================================================================

As one of the many employees who are interested in what evolved out of
the "intense" meetings held by MCS in San Diego; I found it most in-
teresting when a co-worker who attended talked about the *open bars*
available to attendees at the SD Zoo and AGAIN the following evening
at another social function.  

Doesn't the open bar violate a long-standing Digital policy about booze
at official Digital sponsored events?  Sounds like the only things that
could be described as "intense" would be some of the hangovers!!

I find it absolutely amazing that the people who put this event together
actually thought the details about the social activities wouldn't get out.
Perhaps they should have had all the attendees sign non-disclosure
agreements.

re: -1

>>  Perhaps they should have had all the attendees sign non-disclosure
>>  agreements.

	I would guess the lack of concrete responses implies they did!

    You don't think that the lack of responses has anything to do with the
    attendees not having enough "technical fortitude" to be able to
    reply/use the notes software do you???
    
    Had to say it. . .
    
    P.S.  Yes, MCS/San Diego attendees can take this as a corporate
    challenge.

    so would anyone who attended the SD "festivities" care to respond? i
    find the "silence" almost unbelievable. was it that bad??? that useless??

About all I have heard was about bars, restaurants, and the S.D. Zoo.  Oh,
I did hear that if they delivered this training at each site that was 
participating, the cost would have been 8M+.  This apparently cost 2M or
so.  By converging on San Diego, the company saved 6M.  Hey, we should do
this every week.  I wonder what 2.5 days of satellite (DVN) time costs?
I guess we all know why this site was selected, it was the only one with
the San Diego Zoo.  

Paul

    
    Last week I had a meeting with one of the attendees and their notes
    on the whole meeting was some scribbling on a half dozen 5X7 sheets. 
    Mostly pictures.  I was informed that one of the highlites of the
    meeting was the reading of some of the NOTES from this NOTE.
    
      

    
    	So, inquiring minds want to know, eh?
    
    	The San Diego MCS meeting was described to me by several people who
    were in direct attendence as being very long on strategy, extremely
    short on tactics. They felt it was worth the effort, but when pressed
    for details came amazingly short of substance.
    
    	My personal bet is this was the last boondoggle for an organization
    struggling to find meaning in a brave, new world.
    
    
    		the Greyhawk

    well greyhawk,
    
    i about as guessed what you stated. i don't believe in passing
    judgement on that i did not experience. perhaps its best to just let it
    be.

        Well, 8 work days have passed since the meeting.  I've yet to see
        my manager in the office (I've heard rumors though), let alone
        energized.  Obviously no questions can be answered.  There has
        been no communication of any sort.   
        
        Conclusion, boondoggle for sure!
        
        The rest of the managers won't talk in detail about San Diego.
        
        Dave Zaniewski

    The following reply has been contributed by a member of our community
    who wishes to remain anonymous.  If you wish to contact the author by
    mail, please send your message to ROWLET::AINSLEY, specifying the
    conference name and note number. Your message will be forwarded with
    your name attached  unless you request otherwise.

    Bob - Co-moderator DIGITAL

    =======================================================================
    
A quick phone call to the San Diego Zoo reveals:

$ 10.55 per person for twilight tour
$ 26.50 per person for dinner package
-------
$ 37.50 per person

Digital had 900 folk there, comes to about $33,345, don't know if this 
included the open bars and entertainment or not.

To book your group for an exciting exclusive evening at the San Diego Zoo 
complete with dinner, bars, tours, DJs, and guitarists, contact Chris at
the Zoo, 619.675.7906.

BTW, Chris said "this was a real blowout event, first class all the way".
    

��$ 10.55 per person for twilight tour
��$ 26.50 per person for dinner package
��-------
��$ 37.50 per person
    This isn't too far out of line for the business meals
    guidelines.  Compared to airfare and hotel, it's trivial.

��Digital had 900 folk there, comes to about $33,345, don't know if this 
��included the open bars and entertainment or not.
    With digital loosing $180million / quarter, saving $33K will
    keep the company in business about 24 minutes longer.

    I don't get the anonymous note?  Are the group rates at the
    Zoo some kind of secret?  Will it hurt the morale of the
    animals if they find out the kind of revenue they generate,
    when they're only being paid -- I can't resist -- peanuts.

    Well ... my manager went, and when he returned he called a meeting
    and discussed the entire event, describing what happened on an
    hour by hour basis. It sounds like it may have been a good thing ...
    time will tell.
    
    As far as the Zoo is concerned ... who cares? It's so trivial in the
    over all scheme of things that it's not worth wasting time talking
    about it. The changes that are taking place in MCS in DEC, and in
    the service business industry wide, will make our worries over the
    San Diego meeting a minor concern.

    re:108    OUTA THE MOUTHS OF BABES!!!!!!!!!
    
    If you only knew whats going to happen in the long run,
    it would scare the hell out of most.  
    
    The problem is, that when the rest of us fine out, all the
    arganizational changes will have already been made, filled
    with most of the folks that created the problem in the first
    place.......empire building 101 at it's very BEST!  Nobody
    builds empires the wya digital does......
    
    Hey maybe that could be our new slogan?
    
    

    Mr Parrot_Trooper...Don't leave us hanging (no pun intended)..What's
    up?

Re: 108

"Arganizational"  has got to be one of the more creative typos (or was it
intentional?) I've seen.  Except maybe it should be spelled:

    Ar-r-g-g-ghanizational.

We could have "rearghanization", and more.  The possibilities are endless!

;-)
Dave

    Don't know what to say......been in this company twenty or more years.
    
    know a LOT of people, some high up, some low down!  ;^)
    
    All I can say is that I've posted a note in another topic about
    my thoughts as to what MCS is doing..........and understand
    that this is just a gut feel (only been wrong once) and it
    tells me that MCS will follow IDC in it's efforts to stay afloat.
    
    again, I reiterate, it's only a gut feel. Ask around, look at the
    people in the face when you mention it.....their reaction, or
    lack of one, may help you understand from your point of view.
    You know how the company works, no one is officially informed
    until all the really neat jobs are taken by the 'crowd'.
    
    If anyone out there gets 'upset' with this note, then my only 
    comment in defense to the statements above is that this sort
    of information/mis-information happens because people are not
    given enough data/information to really know the truth. If that
    be the case, then us 'street-wise' people will only be left to
    use gut-feel to understand the happenings.
    chet

        Reposted with permission of the manager that sent it to me.
        
Subject:  Highlights of Multi-Vendor-Customer-Services (MCS) meeting in
          San Diego Sept 12th thru Sept 15th 1994
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

During the week of September 12th thru September 15th, all sales people, 
service delivery managers, logistics managers and admin managers in the
America's MCS organization attended meetings hosted by MCS VP for the America's
John Paget.

America's MCS = North America and South America, with specific representation
at this meeting from the United States, Canada, Mexico, Brazil and Venezuela.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Financial Highlights:

o	The MCS organization is NOT for sale per Paget.  This is a money-making
        business for Digital. $1 billion per year in revenue

o	Digital currently has $1.2 billion cash in reserves - balance sheet
        looks good.  We have $1 billion approved line of credit as part of
	the contingency plan (with no intention of using this credit). 

o	AXP sales are now higher than VAX sales

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Highlights:

John Paget's MCS Business plan for FY95:

1-  Maintain "base" customers.  These would be the customers running in
    mid to large system environments such as VAX/VMS with systems such as
    6000, 7000, 8000, 9000, and 10000's.    ** Note **  The installed base
    has been declining approximately 10% per year.  

2-  Grow our presence in the Client-Server and Desktop market.  Also gain a
    greater presence in the PC Integration market.  

3-  Grow the channels business in MCS.  Sell services indirectly.  Goal for
    FY95 is to sell 70% of Digital products (including services) through 
    channels.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Associated goals for FY95:

o	Double the multivendor revenue for Digital

o	Get involved in joint marketing efforts with companies such as:
	Microsoft and Banyan

o	Build customer loyalty year-round to increase revenue growth

o	$0 inventory goal for logistics.  This would mean that Digital would
        not own any inventory, but would rather utilize other companies for
        our logistic needs.  I believe the quoted number for cost of current
        inventory for MCS in FY94 was $235 million.  

o	Disable the "matrix management" style that Digital has had.  Managers
        do what they feel is right without the need for large and cumbersome
        committee meetings.

o	Focus sales people to the top-1000 customers.  All other customers
	would do their purchasing thru non-Digital channels (sellers).  Digital
        has approximately  8050 customers.  7000+ of these will be purchasing
        their Digital services and products from channels, business partners,
        resellers...  Currently there are 450 resellers with Digital agree-
        ments.  In FY94, 50% of those resellers did not sell any Digital
        products.  This will have to change for FY95. 

o	Reinvest in people, the business, training...  $10 million budgeted
	to invest in MCS.

o	Grow the use of indirect channels (non-Digital salespeople) from 
	current of 12% (of total sales) to 20% in FY95.

o	Get Digital PC's into the retail space next to Compac, IBM, Gateway...

o	Desktop services goal for FY95 = $230 million
  
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Other facts:

o	80% of the systems installed in FY94 were client-server based

o	New services will look at using contractors, third-party vendors, part-
	time labor and other methods to reduce labor cost and compete with 
	companies who today offer service contracts much less expensive than
        Digital's.  

o	Bud Lawrence, VP Admin, was challenged to make our administrative
	systems a competitive edge within the next 18 months.

o	Independent survey by DataQuest shows that Digital is the top
	client-server vendor now.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------


These are a few of the highlights of the MCS meeting in San Diego.  More 
in-depth presentations will be scheduled when we receive the presentation 
materials.  Seeing these presentations first hand will be a definite 
benefit to understanding Digital's strategy.
        
        
        I was also given other items in a one-on-one session I had with my
        manager.  They are subject to my interpretation.
        
        - The official title of the gathering is "Rally" and is considered
        training.
        - The chosen cost of delivery (gathering everyone in San Diego)
        was evaluated to be cheaper than several smaller presentations.
        - The session was not directed at offsite (CSC) service delivery,
        but allowed offsite managers to how the other part of MCS works.
        - The organized social activities were intended to allow the
        inter-mingling of the different MCS "cliques".
        - Everyone is waiting on an official package (I forgot the name)
        with prepared material before publicly spreading the word.  The
        package is taking longer than anticipated to arrive.
        
        
        I'm going to be waiting for the group presentation in the CSC
        before making more comments.  The positive is, that "I" now have an 
        open means of communication regarding this event and can share
        with others that are interested.
        
        Thanks to Lisa and Karl.
        
        Dave Zaniewski

re:.113
>> o  Reinvest in people, the business, training...  $10 million budgeted
>>    to invest in MCS.
>> ...
>>  - The official title of the gathering is "Rally" and is considered
>>    training.
>> ...
>>  - The organized social activities were intended to allow the
>>    inter-mingling of the different MCS "cliques".

So, how much of the $10 million "training" budget is left after the "Rally"?

Will the remaining training also involve zoo trips, food, and alcohol?

    My mger heard nothing of this 10 mil figure!

>	Bud Lawrence, VP Admin, was challenged to make our administrative
>	systems a competitive edge within the next 18 months.
                                   ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    Comme on guys - that trip report seemed pretty positive to me - can we
    not be just a tiny bit objective, and not shoot everything down....
    
    Paul

    My only comment is that most of the bulleted items were general
    knowledge before this meeting happened (and I'm not even in MCS!) So
    why did everyone have to get together to talk about stuff that's been
    announced via mail and thru Livewire?
    
    Debbie
    

    in -1 debbie hit the nail on the head. i've seen everyone of those
    items in mail and vtx on more than one occasion. i appreciate the
    authors intention with the trip report, but it still doesn't answer 
    whether or not attending was worth it. the deafening silence speaks volumes.
    
    frankly, i give up. if it was a boondoggle i wasn't the first. just the
    most secretive.

    Many thanks for posting .113. Some comments:
    
>o	$0 inventory goal for logistics.  This would mean that Digital would
>        not own any inventory, but would rather utilize other companies for
>        our logistic needs.  I believe the quoted number for cost of current
>        inventory for MCS in FY94 was $235 million.  

      $0 inventory??!
    
      What exactly does this mean? No parts at all? The UK outsourced the
    warehousing, stockrooms etc several years ago (we still own the actual
    inventory), it has not helped. In the days when Digital ran it, a 2%
    variance (wrong quantity of the right item) at an audit was bad news.
    The most recent audit of the warehouse here had, I was told, a variance
    of over 30%! I dread to think what the situation would be like if we
    didn't even own (and therefore didn't contol) the inventory ourselves.
    
>o	Reinvest in people, the business, training...  $10 million budgeted
>	to invest in MCS.

      I agree with a previous reply, this doesn't really sound like a lot,
    especially if the ~$3m for San Diego is part of it .But then, if the
    intention is to use contract staff as much as possible, I suppose not
    too much will be spent on technical training.
                              
>o	New services will look at using contractors, third-party vendors, part-
>	time labor and other methods to reduce labor cost and compete with 
>	companies who today offer service contracts much less expensive than
>        Digital's.  
    
      In the UK they already are doing this a lot. How much of our costs
    are really due to higher costs of direct labour, and how much due
    to excessive overhead, poor organisation, awkward or broken internal
    systems etc.? The latter costs won't go away if the service engineers
    are outsourced; if anything, they may increase, since the 'contractors,
    third party vendors' etc will often not have any experience of Digital's
    systems (maybe not even access to things like Notes), so will be even
    more lost in dealing with internal 'process' than the rest of us. They
    may cost less per hour, but if they spend more hours sitting in the
    queue waiting for a CSC to call them back (if they are allowed to call
    them at all) because they need support, then not much money will be
    saved.
     
>o	Bud Lawrence, VP Admin, was challenged to make our administrative
>	systems a competitive edge within the next 18 months.

      Now THAT'S a challenge! I wish him luck, if he can succeed it will
    help a lot.
    
>        - The organized social activities were intended to allow the
>        inter-mingling of the different MCS "cliques".
    
      If they really wanted to do that, they should all have been sent on a
    week's 'Outward Bound' type course, where they were split into groups
    (with a random mix in each group) and made to solve various challenges,
    eg crossing a bottomless chasm with 3 planks, a couple of oil drums and
    some rope, or hiking 30 miles across Scottish mountains with a map,
    compass, water bottle and a bar of Kendal mint cake for sustenance.
    Unless they were allocated to their bars, dinner tables etc., and
    deliberately forced to mix, I bet all most of them did at the 'social
    functions' was eat, drink, and talk to people they already knew. That
    is just human nature.
    
      I hope this doesn't all sound too negative, it does sound as though
    the 'Rally' may have been useful, but I would wait to see results
    before regarding it as a turning point.
    
    Ken Ricketts
    PRC Winnersh, UK

    I wasn't going to do this BUT... 
    
    I was at the meeting in San Diego.  Now please don't take this to
    personally but GET A GRIP PEOPLE!!!  It was an extremely beneficial and
    informative meeting.  You got the highlights in a previous note but
    still that wasn't enough to quiet your complaining.  
    
    I am sorry for the people that belong to MCS and were not able to
    attend.  I felt that the meeting had great content, and helped to
    energize our sales force. (now wouldn't you agree that sales needs some
    positive motivation.
    
    As far as the comment goes about mingling and human nature goes,
    personally i met a lot of my peers and counterparts throught the U.S. 
    There was a great deal of information sharing and brainstorming about how
    to better do our jobs. Most everbody else did the same.
    
    Frankly, although some of the comments I read were construtive
    critisism, most sounded no more than sour grapes.. 
    
    
    
    Regards,
    
    

    re: Note 3342.121 by NEMAIL::CALDER
    
    Do you really think anyone here expected someone in your position to
    respond any differently?
    
    Ken....

    >Finally, someone who was there - who can report first hand info -
    >decides to respond.  This is, of course, *exactly* what everybody had
    >been clamoring for.  And when they finally do, the first response
    >expresses distrust in the answer.
    
    	What answer?  This was YOUR comment, a little further down:
    
    >IMO... while I appreciate the fact that you decided to step into a
    >relatively hostile note to try to stop the speculation, I found your
    >note particularly lacking in detail.   Comments like "extremely
    >beneficial and informative" don't say anything about content.
    
    
    This is the question that has been asked: repeatedly, and politely:
    
     * i'm simply interested in what was presented and its value to
     * dec's mission and our return to profitability. 
    
     * so what gives? why all the hush?
    
    It's still unanswered.

    Ok, I can't hold back anymore.... I work closely with MCS, my husband
    is in MCS, we've been with the company over 12 years. It just seems
    to me that from where I sit the company got the "cart before the horse"
    on this particular issue.  The engineers are woefully undertrained,
    they are understaffed,the CSC is losing people left and right....the
    money spent on this SHOULD have gone to training all of the engineers
    who will have to support all of the whiz-bang services these folks at
    the San Diego meeting were charged up to sell.  
    
    If you only knew how many times these engineers are sent on calls where
    they have never seen the equipment (particularly 3rd party, but
    sometimes DEC gear as well)....... Scary!
    
    I have gone out of my way to ask those who attended for feedback - 
    from management level on down.  I have yet to run into someone who
    hasn't said that it was a boondoggle and that the information provided
    was conceptual with no real details or plan.
    
    No sour grapes here, only trying to figure out the rationale behind
    a very large expenditure when we can't get raises or buy office
    supplies.
    
    Elizabeth

I am sorry if I sounded like "Sour Grapes", but I too wanted to know if
this was going to be something beneficial to the old corp.  I think if
the agenda was as people are saying, then maybe it will be... But hear 
it from my perspective, I have worked every hour that a clock will make.
I am sorry, but I want a little respect.  Now generally what I will do is
if I need to go to Southern California, where my father lives, is purchase
an airline ticket.  Hey, look MCS people out there, WE are the ones handling 
the flak.   I am personally sick of being the front man while this corporation
wavers.   STOP WAVERING!!!!

In closing I will say this,  how about a gathering for us too?  I would go 
anywhere to have a meeting with my peers and collegues.  We have all busted
our butts for this company, so how about a little respect....


Out of this topic,

Paul 

    no mention of it in this string... but, does anybody know if spouses,
    significant-others tagged along at company expense?
    
    just askin'
    
    tony

    
    If MCS plans on spending ten million to re-train it's downsized to
    the extreme workforce, then how they going to do this?  They have 
    TFSO'd ALL BUT FOUR Instructors from the training department. I know
    the four left personally, and TWO OF THEM JUST QUIT!  Yeah, they left
    for respect, and more money.  So with TWO left, that's a lot of 
    classroom hours.......
    
    Brings to mind a 'slightly modified' verse from a well known
    cartoon....
    "Hey Rocky, watch me pull a miracle outa my hat!"
    
    It's just too bad that all this has to happen AFTER we get on
    trouble... What ever happened to the visionaries.....
    
    

re:                   <<< Note 3342.125 by SWAM1::MERCADO_EL >>>

>    The engineers are woefully undertrained,
>    they are understaffed,the CSC is losing people left and right....the
>    money spent on this SHOULD have gone to training all of the engineers
>    who will have to support all of the whiz-bang services these folks at
>    the San Diego meeting were charged up to sell.  

re:                   <<< Note 3342.128 by MPGS::CWHITE >>>
    
>    If MCS plans on spending ten million to re-train it's downsized to
>    the extreme workforce, then how they going to do this?  They have 
>    TFSO'd ALL BUT FOUR Instructors from the training department. I know
>    the four left personally, and TWO OF THEM JUST QUIT!  Yeah, they left
>    for respect, and more money.  So with TWO left, that's a lot of 
>    classroom hours.......
    
	Engineers and instructors are not part of the future "core" of
	Digital.  All these services will be outsourced (read contracted).
	I think the generalization said 60% by FY97?  Engineering's tech
	writers are doing it, why not everything else?  The money will
	probably just be spent to train management how to do Digital business
	with contract consultants.
    
>    If you only knew how many times these engineers are sent on calls where
>    they have never seen the equipment (particularly 3rd party, but
>    sometimes DEC gear as well)....... Scary!

	I remember when I was sent out on a PDP-9 call to fix a paper tape
	reader.  I had to ask the customer how to turn it on!  When I got
	the reader fixed, then I had to ask the customer to check it out...
    
	Do you think customers have gotten more forgiving?

    The MCS meeting was a "kickoff" meeting.  This means it contained
    training, vision statements, product direction/education, motivation
    and assessments of recent performance.  This type of meeting is common
    in sales and has proven itself to be beneficial to the bottom line.
    
    I've seen good people leave Digital, both from tsfo and from disgust, yet
    we still need to conduct business, to have meetings, to review/reward
    performance, enhance skills and knowledge. The MCS meeting was designed
    to do all of these, quickly and effectively.
    
    MCS did very well last year.  MCS KNOWS HOW TO SELL.
    You might not understand this meeting and its associated expense, but 
    then again, you might not understand the profession of selling as well
    as you think you do, either.    
    
    Go sell something, it's rewarding!
    
    Mark

    re: -1
    
    I don't know where you've been, but I have seen more true selling
    at the level of Customer Service Engineer than from any other
    function in this company. That goes for hardware,software and services.
    Right now this selling effort has increased substantially thanks
    to programs like Business$ense which allows for engineers to put
    in leads for hardware sales, and if the business closes they get 1% of
    the deal.  The engineers are the ones who have their faces in front
    of the customer on a regular basis building a partnership which
    in many cases leads those customers to turn to them for advice on
    new hardware,upgrades etc which can enhance their business.
    Fortunately these engineers have a way to increase their income at a 
    time when they can't get raises no matter how hard they work,
    and get some credit for sales which THEY have made happen.
                                                                 
    I think it would be a mistake to contract out services business for
    our larger customers who depend on that partnership with their
    engineers.
    
    Again, to reiterate my point about the meeting, it does no good to
    motivate the selling force to sell when the infrastructure of the
    services business is falling apart. (or shall I say torn to shreads?)
    
    -Elizabeth
                       

    Mark,
    
    	Fine...so it was a kickoff. If management would just come forward
    and say so it would be done and over. Yes MCS is profitable some areas
    of MCS very profitable; but that profit is being used to support other
    parts of this company rather than being reinvested in MCS. Training,
    Manuals and parts are in short supply, techs and MCS sales reps are being 
    canned left right and center and now our suppport has been drastically
    reduced.
    
    	So you had a chance to bond and cheer for the company.. I'm happy
    for you but this double standard and secrecy is what got this company
    into trouble and it wont get out of trouble until it starts treating
    its employees as bussiness partners with the respect they deserve.
    
    
    Brian V
    

    >You might not understand this meeting and its associated expense, but 
    >then again, you might not understand the profession of selling as well
    >as you think you do, either.    
    
    	Does this sound as arrogant to others as it does to me?

    >>You might not understand this meeting and its associated expense, but 
    >>then again, you might not understand the profession of selling as well
    >>as you think you do, either.    
    >
    >	Does this sound as arrogant to others as it does to me?
    
    yup. and it isn't necessary either. many of us could use some serious
    training that could really help the company and please customers. its
    EXTREMELY difficult to get these days. 
    
    i think a lot of people are a bit uneasy (i'm trying to be polite) with
    spending the corporations money so lavishly on what appears to be
    little more than a social event. myself, i have trouble with any events
    of that size where determining the effect on the bottom line is
    literally impossible.
    
    but like i said. this isn't the first such event. not likely to be the
    last. no one should take close scrutiny personally. it comes with the
    times. we can expect future events of this nature to be examined even
    more closely. given the times, i don't see anything wrong with that.

    re:  the "you might not understand" comment
    
    Arrogant,condescending,narrow-minded,maybe a little "defensive"?
    ........YOU BETCHA'!!!
    
    -Elizabeth
    

    re: .130 "Go Sell Something, it can be rewarding"
    
    To that comment I say: "Go deliver services (albeit without the tools,
    training, support or sufficient manpower), it can be embarassing."
    
    I don't mean to be rude, but "GET REAL!"
    
    -Elizabeth
    

    Elizabeth,
    
    Not defensive. I'm very proud of MCS performance last year and this
    last quarter.  I certain that the meeting was beneficial and a smart
    investment for Digital.  We made a lot of profit last year and we will
    again this year.  I *AM* acutely aware of the issues around contract
    labor and other potentially hurtful (MO) ideas being kicked around.  I
    continue to offer my opinion when invited.
    
    Not arrogant.  I'm not the best, I'm not greybird :), I'm someone who
    tries to keep focused on selling, someone who tries to implement the
    tools and skills of my profession consistantly and who tries to
    continually improve my professional skills.  "U might not understand
    selling ..." comment is cautionary; IF you have not learned the
    profession of selling, (some do not believe selling is a profession),
    then you might not appreciate the value of a "kickoff" meeting or fully
    understand its definition as a tool.  It is very valuable and needed.
    
    Condescending, no.  I value each and everyone who contributes to this
    company.  I need all the help I can get from all.  
    
    Narrow-minded.  Pigheaded maybe, but not narrow-minded.  Perhaps you
    are being a bit narrow minded in not allowing that others might know
    more about selling then you?  I'm sure you know more about your
    specialty than I.
    
    This meeting was a tool, a valuable and needed tool for MCS.  There are
    no secrets about this meeting.  Perhaps people just don't feel like
    reporting in here and justifying something they need not.  I'd say only
    a small percentage read this conference anyway.
    
    And yes, Field engineers are critical to the maintaining and growing of
    our customer base.  They are the backbone of our relationship with the
    customer.  You can have a sales rep who stinks and still maintain the
    base but if your field service rep stinks, Digital stinks and we lose.
    
    regrds
    
    MArk

    re: .130 "Go Sell Something, it can be rewarding"
    
    Anyone can sell anything, the problem is sell what to help a customer?
    A solution to a problem? You should see all the hardware and software
    at customer sites that wasn't part of a solution. It is a problem now.
    So and so sold it, doesn't do what it was advertized to do.
    
    That go sell something line really irks me. But it is so darn simple
    isn't it?
    
    -Mike Z.
     Digital Consulting

    .134
    
    It was not a social event.  These meetings, with their agenda are
    needed.  They are part of the tools chest that every sales orginization
    requires.  Spending money on them is needed. MO, My experience.
    
    .138
    
    Please feel free to take that comment about "sell something..." any way
    you want, but in case you want to know, its kind of like "see ya
    later""
    
    Go sell@!

    So, Mark, would you be willing to answer this question?
    
     * i'm simply interested in what was presented and its value to
     * dec's mission and our return to profitability. 
    
    Be specific.

FWIW, I did not take offense to the implication that some don't know
what selling is about. I'm not surprised that some did, though. We
seem to take offense to a lot of things that we didn't use to (or is
it 'used to'?).

Additionally, somewhere I read in the last few replies something to
the effect that "anyone can sell anything"? I don't believe that at
all.

Pete

    I seriously doubt that Mark, or anyone else for that matter, could come
    up with a hard-dollar justification/roi for the MCS kickoff meeting. It
    sure SEEMS like this was a rather costly event, but as has been
    expressed, this type of event is hardly unusual to excite, educate and
    motivate a sales force. Was it a "boondoggle",
    I sure don't know (I sell other "stuff"), but probably to some extent
    it was. IF this event motivates an incremental 10% of revenues for the
    "party-goers", it will have paid for itself rather quickly. How will we
    know what specific results came from this? Short answer...we
    won't...ever.
    
    IMHO, tho, it's time to move onto something else to complain about.
    
    BTW, Mark, are you saying you're NOT the least bit arrogant???
    
    ;-)
    
    

    Hey, I learned from the best.....:)

    I am a mostly 'read-only' participant of this conference but, having
    waded thru the 140+ replies to this note, I cannot help but ask the
    following:
    
    Why can't ONE person who attended this meeting put in PLAIN ENGLISH
    what exactly was presented, and how, and what direct value it has
    to his/her job and his/her customer???? NO rhetoric around "vision
    statements"; no vague reference to "training sessions"; no umbrella
    explanation using words like "motivation", "kickoff" or "assessments",
    but, to quote Dragnet, "just the facts".
    
    Maybe then we could all move on to something else...
    
    Nancy

    rep last 144
    
    My take of this is, there has been just too much  brain-washing. 
    Apparently there is no one person left in Digital, who can talk 
    in plain English.  (meaning those who attended this meeting)
    
    If there was, I may too, have understood what they were assembled
    in SD to discuss!!

I'm not a salesman, and I don't play one on TV...

I HAVE been to kickoff meetings in the past, though.
If you've been to one, saying "it was a kickoff meeting" gives a
pretty complete picture of what the event was about.

Kickoff meetings GENERALLY (I have NO specific knowlege about this one)
involve getting the team together (at whatever level you are defining
"team", in this case apparently management/senior level) in one place,
and making sure that everybody sets off into the new period in the same
direction, on the same page.

The usually involve settings specific goals and directions for the organization.

Having everyone on the same page is essential for Digital to function properly.

So is having sufficient, competent, trained engineers to deliver what is
being sold.

Lets not shoot down one corner of Digital which is getting what it needs
just because there are other corners which are not.  Lets work on getting
everybody what they NEED (not always what they want).

The only way we'll get off this topic is if we just get off this topic.

Kevin

        
    >Why can't ONE person who attended this meeting put in PLAIN ENGLISH
    >what exactly was presented, and how, and what direct value it has
    >to his/her job and his/her customer???? 
    
    Me thinks you have gotten all you are going to get.  Why should anyone
    feel obligated to answer you more completely.... afterall, "what direct
    value it [explaining to you] has to his/her job and his/her customer???",
    I don't know!
    
    >Maybe then we could all move on to something else...
    
    Whats' the hang up? Move on.  Sell something!
    
    
    Mark

    re -1:
    
    Therein lies the problem.  It's your kind pf pomposity that got us to
    where we are!!!!!!!!
    
    What these folks want to know is impotrant cause THEY have to deliver
    what YOU SELL!  And they are sick and tired of being sold down the
    river to deliver something that they KNOW can't be!!!!!!
    
    UNDERSTAND?????   (I think not!)
    
    

    
    Well here I go into the tar pits...
    
    I have seen the materials from the San Diego meeting.  They relate to
    MCS marketing conditions, goals and directions, but with few exceptions,
    they are very high-level (say, 50,000 feet) and so general that it is
    hard to say what it all means in turns of day-to-day sales conditions.
    
    The people who made these presentations are cognizant of the
    criticisms (much of which came from the attendees).  Attempts are being
    made to insert more detail and content into follow-up training.  I am
    one of the people who are attempting to do this.  It is quite
    challenging.
    
    Now, give me a hand and help me out of this goo....
     

    This MCS meeting sounded originally like an intense meeting to get
    things done.  It now appears to be somewhat of a sales, ya-hoo!
    meeting.  As an engineer, I typically was uninvited to these meetings. 
    Sales called them team building, or something like that.  I suppopse
    they have their purpose.  The one meeting I went to, I was embarrased
    at the frivolity, then again, I'm not a real partier.  One meeting I
    heard of, well, I wouldn't have signed the expense reports.

    .149:
    
    What are you talking about?  You sound hysterical.  *My* POMPOSITY got
    us where we are???  *H*H*A*A*A*A!!! Loardy Lou, we've never met and I
    doubt you know of my sales performance or if I've sold something that
    can not be delivered.  
    
    Your note really makes me laugh.  I've been talking about the value of
    a meeting and your ranting about selling impossible dreams....
    
    PROZAC!!! :)

RE: .149

	What's the big secret then?

							mike

    Mike,
    
    There is no secret.  People are not required to justify themselves to
    this forum, so they don't.  I still think that very few of the MCS
    sales folks read this conference.  Thats adds too...
    
    These meetings are common to sales orgs.;  Very common and IMO, we
    still need to do them.... 

    Let me net this out for those of us that have been glued to this string
    since the meetings ....
    
    If nothing happenend at San Diego then tell us everything that happened
    and we'll be happy, on the other hand if something happened that you
    cannot tell us about then simply tell us eveything that happened that
    you can tell us about and pretend that nothing happened about the
    things that happened that you can't talk about.
    
    re. .148    - jeez I can't belive that someone would really spell
    "methinks" as two words that's got to be as bad a spelling Rat Hole
    with a silent Q !

    My Favorite line that gives me a good laugh.
    
    THE SALES REP TOLD YOU WHAT???
    
    Mike Been there done that.
    Digital Consulting
    The only one left in Long Island!

    interest seems to have shifted to the area of sales selling things that
    can not be delivered.
    
    I don't get it.  I thought that STATEMENTS OF WORK were required. 
    Also, they need to be reviewed and signed off on by the delivery
    manager.  I can not quote a job, be it consulting or project management, 
    without involving delivery and this document.
    
    Oh, and they have to be signed by the customer as well.
    
    Are not all MCS reps using these documents?

        A very SMALL portion of the new MCS Menu is driven by SOW's.  Most of
    it has become standard offerings which should be pretty simple; the
    problem being that we are selling services, standard services, that,
    because of lack of training, people, parts, etc., we can't delivery.  

    For anyone out there, if this is incorrect, please feel free to correct
    me. I'm one of the people in the trenches that has to "fix" those
    things that MCS Sell with an administrative _solution_ that our current
    archaic systems cannot provide......
    
    Toodles.....JP
    

    
    
    
    Statement of work...  That is a good one!
    
    
    
    Very few, if any, of the "nontraditional" business I have been involved
    with lately, has had a clear and well defined statement of work.  Very
    few have clearly defined when the work is complete.  We are continuing
    to address this issue in our district, but it will take a lot of team
    work and time.
    
    Jon

    if we sell standard services.....we should be able to deliver.  Right?
    that would be the people problem?  I would not consider selling desktop
    support with 20 minute response nation wide standard.....
    
    are you saying that sales reps are taking orders to support (break-fix)
    3rd party gear without working with delivery management to insure that
    we have training, spares and estimated calls (based on mtbf) built into
    the cost to the customer?  if so, then those individuals should be
    accountable....

    s.o.w. is the most valuable of all tools for MCS reps.  I can not
    imagine how one would ever have a satisfied customer without it.
    
    Not to mention its ability to generate additionl bucks....

    re:-1
    
    You are absolutely correct that business is sold as an off the shelf
    item before the MCS delivery people have been involved in any way 
    shape or form.  Even in my area (NIS) often the Netsupport business
    has been sold before myself or my manager has had any contact with the
    customer.  In many cases, our service is sold as a fix to some nebulous
    problem before we even have a chance to qualify the network or gather
    any data at all.  In some instances a customer should be sold a block
    of consulting hours with a clear statement of work as to what problem
    or problems we are attempting to solve. (But, that isn't usually what
    happens....)  The other major issues involve actually having the warm
    bodies to deliver the service,having those people appropriately
    trained, and having leading edge tools.  Right now I am the only
    Netsupport person for Southern Cal., Arizona and Las Vegas.  We had
    one Network Planning Consultant for that entire area, but he is
    out due to a hospitalization.  As far as tools, our Network General
    Sniffer has logged more miles than I have flying around the country
    for other NIS/MCS folks in Major Metro. areas who DON'T have one for
    their customer's network problems.  
    
    On one major customer whose nationwide network we service, not one
    of the engineers across the country has had any training on Phase V
    DECnet or the DECnis 600's. I could maybe understand no training 
    on a 3rd party product, but this is on our own equipment. We put
    in a plan for logistics stocking to ensure that parts would be
    available when needed, and I can't tell you how many times I've
    been told "we have one of those modules available in Andover".
    Our contract databases.....well, that's another nightmare.
    
    It seems to me that this type of high level stuff that was presented
    at the meeting could've of easily been accomplished via DVN.  The
    camaraderie/bonding/motivation stuff is very low priority given
    the MAJOR inadequacies that exist in the delivery organization.
    
    Elizabeth
    

An SOW CAN be a wonderful tool.

It can also be signed off by a manager with dollars in his/her eyes,
and then handed off to IC's to implement.  Rarely are the trench-folk
brought in to review SOWs.

As to the MCS situation, what I'm hearing is that there are standard services
being sold as they always have.  No need to question, right?  Standard T's&C's
may specify X hour response in an X by Y window (as in <= 4 hour response
24 X 7, etc.)

Only now, MCS management has cut back to 1 guy covering 3 states!  How can he
possibly meet the response requirements???

One of the problems with the standard services is that they are in such a 
state of flux at the moment that many people do not fully understand which 
service provides what. We then end up with an irate customer who has paid 
for the service they are getting but is expecting a different service.

Hopefully things will settle down when the transition to the 'new' services 
is complete and everyone has a better understanding of what they are.

Terry

    re: 160.....welcome to the real world!
    

    Mark,
    	If this was only a motivational meeting, then it should have been
    billed as such.  What it was billed as, was a plan to put MCS back in
    business, and provide an answer to the problems.
    	The response that it isn't any of our business (not your exact
    words, but what came across) really gets people upset, or aren't you
    aware of that?  It is our business, since ALL of us are at risk, and we
    see our peers leaving, and we may be next.  We see a lot of money spent
    for what is being described as a motivational experience for sales
    people (sort of like a celebration) when that money could have been
    used to save several jobs.  HOW DARE ANYONE CELEBRATE WHEN PEOPLE ARE
    LOOSING THEIR JOBS.  How dare anyone justify this as anything more than
    a boondoggle, without giving details of what happened.  ONLY SELF
    CENTERED, EGOTISTICAL people would justify such a venture, and then
    attempt to hide what went on, with the excuse that we are too ignorant
    to understand (an interpretation of what you said about others
    don't have to justify what went on).  WE ALL HAVE TO JUSTIFY WHAT WE
    DO, AND THAT INCLUDES SALES, MANAGEMENT, YOU AND ME...
    
    	Do you understand now why people are getting mad?
    Jim Morton

    Jim,
    
    Pfffft!  Hot air man.  I didn't say it was a motivational meeting.  I
    said that was part of it.  And I didn't say it was none of your
    business.  I said you might not be able to appreciate the value of a
    "kickoff" meeting or other sales tools, if you are not a professional 
    sales person.  I did not say no one needs to justify, only that no one 
    is required to, in this forum.
    
    How dare this and that:
    
    Pffft.  Go ahead, assume you know know where to spend the MCS budget if
    you like.  It should be sizable, since we did 4.25 B last year.
    
    EXECUTING: (conditional-attack-ship) 
               

    As an MCS engineer I constantly see new hardware that has been put on
    contract.  The problem is the first the engineer hears about it is when
    it breaks.  The customer then informs the engineer that it has been on
    contract a while.  No pre contract inspection done, no stratedgy to 
    get training, no manuals, no parts, and then the sales rep looks like
    he or she is doing a great job getting new buisness.  Next the customer
    is upset and the engineer is stuck taking the flack.  The emphisis is 
    on getting new buisness, and everything else is forgotten.

    -1:
    
    That is not the way it is done here.  Feel free to contact me directly
    and I'll be happy to tie in my delivery management (stan Bomstyk) and
    we can share with any the tools, processes and procedures we use to
    insure we make money and the customer is happy.

        Mark,
    	You can't blow off what people are asking and saying that easy. 
    Just because I'm not a "PROFESSIONAL SALES PERSON" doesn't mean I can't
    appreciate the value of a "kickoff".  Appreciation has nothing to do
    with it.  PEOPLE are loosing their jobs, while others are having a
    party to "KICKOFF" sales.  We aint makin a profit, and you have the
    nerve to say that I don't appreciate the value.  My friend! Have you
    heard of priorities?
    	For the most part you didn't even address what I was saying.  Let
    me try again.  PEOPLE ARE UPSET BECAUSE THIS MEETING WAS ADVERTISED AS
    A CURE TO MCS'S PROBLEMS.  IT ENDED UP BEING (by what appears to be) A
    KICKOFF, WHILE PEOPLE ARE LOOSING THEIR JOBS, AND OTHER AREAS THAT NEED
    ATTENTION AND FUNDING AREN'T GETTING IT.  Now, your snide remark about
    me know how and where MCS funding should be spent is ridiculous.  I
    don't know where it should be spent, but I do know where there are
    higher priorities than a KICKOFF.  You said there was more to it than a
    kickoff.  Then prove it, explain to us poor dumb non sales types...
    	You are right about one thing.  No one has to explain in this
    forum, but it would be a smart thing to do rather than keep it a
    secret, since expectations were already set.  Not explaining only leads
    to suspicion.
    
    	Mark, don't get me wrong.  I have no problem with KICKOFFS,
    REWARDS, PROMOTIONS, CELEBRATIONS, unless it is at the expense of
    others and the company.  I figure that you go out and kick some major
    BUTT, and then CELEBRATE, not CELEBRATE and then go out and KICK BUTT,
    but then again, I'm not a DIGITAL SALES PERSON, so I guess I can't
    understand such things, for they are beyond me...  Call me full of hot
    air or something else, I'll call it common sense...
    
    Jim Morton
    

    I didn't realize how much wisdom and keen business sense I was missing
    out on because I am not a "professional sales person".  
    
    Throwing out a number like 4.25 billion without providing the margin
    dollars is useless.  The bottom line is that the Corporation as a whole
    is not making money right now.  What Mr. Ricciardi doesn't seem to
    realize is that this San Diego meeting is just the tip of the iceberg
    when it comes to some of the decisions (or lack thereof) that have
    been made recently.  Evidently in Mr. Ricciardi's territory, everything
    is running perfectly and all of the problems that the rest of us have
    seen are the exception.  
    
    I may be only a lowly non-sales DEC employee, but I still have all
    of my stock from YEARS back.  That makes me a STOCKHOLDER with 
    more than a vested interest in seeing this company make good, sound
    decisions.  
    
    Elizabeth
    
    p.s. Touche' Jim!!

    
    Is it just me, or has there always been a somewhat difficult
    relationship between those that sell and those that have to 
    deliver what has been sold?  Seems to have been like that, with
    some individual exceptions, since I came to the field.
    
    Shouldn't our mutual success depend on mutual respect for each
    other's value?  The problem seems to be that an expectation was
    set in some pre-San Deigo communications that a PLAN was to be 
    presented (I know that's what my manager thought) for the 
    "revitilization" of MCS.  As far as I have been able to determine,
    it was pretty much a normal sales "kickoff", with the added element
    of having other discipline's management there to participate.  Some
    of the non-sales attendees, probably due to inexperience with such
    affairs, failed to see much value.
    
    Perhaps if those selling could meet with those delivering and discuss
    how each could help both succeed (training issues, manpower, etc),
    perhaps some good could result?  Many of the noters here appear to
    believe that was the purpose of the San Deigo meeting.  I don't think
    that was the case, but it should have at least been a start.
    
    How long can those that sell, sell what is NOT being delivered before
    something must change?  How long can those that deliver NOT deliver
    before nothing can be sold?  Seems like we need each other, at least
    as long as we are all here trying to do our jobs.  
    
    I would be interested in communicating via email with noters that 
    read what I've written and think, "Boy is that area screwed up!"
    Perhaps I can be a force for change if something is broken where I
    work, why not?
    
    
    

        
    	>You can't blow off what people are asking and saying that easy. 
    >Just because I'm not a "PROFESSIONAL SALES PERSON" doesn't mean I can't
   > appreciate the value of a "kickoff".  Appreciation has nothing to do
   > with it.  PEOPLE are loosing their jobs, while others are having a
    >party to "KICKOFF" sales.  We aint makin a profit, and you have the
    >nerve to say that I don't appreciate the value.  My friend! Have you
    >heard of priorities?
    	
    Many good and valued people I work with, in and out of sales, here, in
    this office, have been layed off.  I am not real happy about that, but
    still, having been in sales for so long, I fully understand the need
    for meetings such as the one in CA.  I am not putting sales people
    above anyone else at Digital, nor am I saying the profession of sales
    is better than others; I am saying that, and for the last time, I hope,
    living and working and learning and earning in this profession, you
    gain a better understanding of what the value is of a sales tool, over
    people who don't.  
    
    And as I mention later, we, MCS are making a profit.  And thats great
    for all of us...
    
    "having a party to KICKOFF SALES "...  while others lose their jobs...  
    Yeah, uh huh.  Thats what I said, MCS partied out there..nothing but
    party noon till night...sheesh..
    
    >For the most part you didn't even address what I was saying.  Let
    >me try again.  PEOPLE ARE UPSET BECAUSE THIS MEETING WAS ADVERTISED AS
    >A CURE TO MCS'S PROBLEMS.  IT ENDED UP BEING (by what appears to be) A
    >KICKOFF, WHILE PEOPLE ARE LOOSING THEIR JOBS, AND OTHER AREAS THAT NEED
    >ATTENTION AND FUNDING AREN'T GETTING IT.  Now, your snide remark about
    >me know how and where MCS funding should be spent is ridiculous.  I
    >don't know where it should be spent, but I do know where there are
    >higher priorities than a KICKOFF.  You said there was more to it than a
    >kickoff.  Then prove it, explain to us poor dumb non sales types...
    	
    A cure?  Well, I missed that.  I'll say this, according to the data, 
    MCS made a billion in profit last year. Kinda nice that. (someone out 
    there, another noter, asked for that...)
    
    I guess if you believed that these types of meetings CAN maintain
    and/or increase margin, then you'd have no problem investing in them...I
    do believe that, based on 17 or so years in sales...  I guess you don't
    based on YOUR experience....
    
    >You are right about one thing.  No one has to explain in this
    >forum, but it would be a smart thing to do rather than keep it a
    >secret, since expectations were already set.  Not explaining only leads
    >to suspicion.
    
    I wouldn't expect a programmer to spend his time or energy justifying
    why he needed a 3rd party debugger or what ever type of tool he needs
    to get his job done better .... to me that is...  I'm
    sure that person has to justify it to his management... Just like I'm
    sure MCS managers had to justify to theirs.. all the way up.
    
    I still think the biggest problem you all have is that not many MCS
    sales folk read or write in this confernece or for that matter any
    others..  And if they do, they could be a little gun shy....I mean this
    whole string, ceptin from me of course, has been a bit agressive.  You
    can call it secretive if you like, but I think you might be spicing the
    sauce....
    	>Mark, don't get me wrong.  I have no problem with KICKOFFS,
    >REWARDS, PROMOTIONS, CELEBRATIONS, unless it is at the expense of
    >others and the company.  I figure that you go out and kick some major
    >BUTT, and then CELEBRATE, not CELEBRATE and then go out and KICK BUTT,
    >but then again, I'm not a DIGITAL SALES PERSON, so I guess I can't
    >understand such things, for they are beyond me...  Call me full of hot
    >air or something else, I'll call it common sense...
    
    Jim, again, I'm not saying Digital Sales people are any better than
    anyone else.  But sheesh, man, can't you admit that someone trained in
    a profession might know more about it then someone who is not?   You
    are being silly here, have fun...
    
    I think .171?:
    
    No, all is not well here either.  I lost at least 150K in the last
    quarter of FY94 because we did not have a Pathworks 5.0 consultant
    available in the AREA, anywhere....  I lost  50K for lack of a VMS
    consultant.... sheesh....  I'm currantly trying to place 2 recently
    tsfo'd folk (through an agency)....  things are bad all over, or at
    least not good, but sitll, we need to keep using the tools of the
    trade...          
    

    
  > I didn't realize how much wisdom and keen business sense I was missing
  >  out on because I am not a "professional sales person".  
   
    Yawn
     
    >Throwing out a number like 4.25 billion without providing the margin
    >dollars is useless.  The bottom line is that the Corporation as a whole
    is not making money right now.  
    
    MCS 1.0 billion in profit.
    
    >What Mr. Ricciardi doesn't seem to
    >realize is that this San Diego meeting is just the tip of the iceberg
    >when it comes to some of the decisions (or lack thereof) that have
    >been made recently.  
    
    Hmmm.  I don't agree with you.  I see some silly ideas, but not an
    iceberg....  my opinion....  And, as you know, I liked the San Diego 
    meeting idea.
    
    >Evidently in Mr. Ricciardi's territory, everything
    >is running perfectly and all of the problems that the rest of us have
    >seen are the exception.  
    
    I have the same problems... as Ive noted.  Evidently Mr. ricciardi
    works to correct them and acheives his goals regardless...most the
    time.
    
    >I may be only a lowly non-sales DEC employee, but I still have all
    >of my stock from YEARS back.  That makes me a STOCKHOLDER with 
    >more than a vested interest in seeing this company make good, sound
    >decisions.  
    
    Call yourself what you will.  Being concerned is good.
    
    >p.s. Touche' Jim!!
    
    EXECUTING :(undeclare-ally '.171)

    Mark,

    	To correct you!  There are a lot of people in this conference that
    are part of MCS (MULTI VENDOR CUSTOMER SERVICES, the most profitable
    part of DIGITAL EQUIPMENT CORPORATION).  As a matter of fact, SALES is
    just the newest addition to MCS.  To be quite frank, where do you think
    the profitability of MCS comes from.  HINT!  It aint sales, but from
    FIELD SERVICE (HARDWARE) contracts and from SOFTWARE contracts.
    	Just because a person isn't from sales, does not mean that they
    don't understand what a motivational meeting is about.  Still that
    doesn't mean that it is necessary.  There is such a thing as self
    motivation.  I stand by what I said earlier.  There are more important
    things than having a KICKOFF...  Most of us don't even have the tools
    we need to do our job, like training, and systems to troubleshoot with,
    or parts to fix the customers problems, nor do we have the power to
    change that, but you think it is of utmost importance for sales to go
    to a KICKOFF so that you can do your job.  Maybe you're not looking at
    the whole picture.
    	Most of us in MCS were expecting an answer to our problems so that
    we could continue to be successful, and what we get is a KICKOFF, while
    the problems still exist.  Fix the problems first, then party.  IF a
    salesperson needs motivation, then I think they are in the wrong
    business.  True motivation comes from within...

    	One more thing.  I wish you would comment on the subject rather
    than calling me full of hot air, or being silly, or whatever.  I've not
    attacked you or anyone else in this conference, and I expect the same
    respect from a partner in this business.  Please show professional
    courtesy!  Thanks!

    Jim Morton

    This thread is starting to suspiciously resemble a stuck record
    player with only one difference: as the record goes round and
    round in the same groove the line gets longer and longer :-)
    
    And how come there always seem to be this inverse relationship
    between content and length of postings?
    
    Since we're definitely into the third round of the same discussion
    I'm reminded about an old joke on jokes which assigned a number
    to each joke. So first guy starts telling: "13" he says, audience
    chuckles, "43" audience laughs, "54"...guffaws from the audience,
    "8"..audience is in the aisles rolling with tears in their eyes.
    "Hey, I can do that" thinks the other guy. "12", says the second
    guy whereupon an icy quiet settles on the audience.
    
    The first guy turns to the second guy: "You've got to understand...
    its all  in the timing".
    
    Hey, maybe we can do the same here :-)
    
    Salesy type:   ".88..."
    Supporty type: ".101!"
    Salesy type:   ".121?"
    Supporty type: ".15*&!!!!!%%@@@@!!!!!"
    Salesy type:   ".88 AND .77!!!"
    
    
    
                                          

    let's see now....
    
    Where's that NEXT UNSEEN button?

    
    Is it good news that MCS is the MOST profitable part of the company
    right now?
    
    Or, is it the business cycle that when product stops moving, services
    experiences an increase as hardware ages?  Then...
    
    And lastly, what is the profit forecast with warranty moving into the 3+
    years range?
    
    Better save that profit???

    Jim,
    
    As you know, (yawn), no one is attacking you.
    
    It's the words you write down in your notes, the style you use, the
    sometimes silly, usually dramatic....
    
    
    
    Being forced to retype all the time is tedious too.
    
    
                                                 

Just out of curiosity, how does the $1B profit break down? And what were the
expenses for MCS to make that profit?

>Per

    >And lastly, what is the profit forecast with warranty moving into the 3+
    >years range?
    
    It's looking great! Lots of those companies that are offering 3-year
    warranties DON'T have a service organization. Guess who's knocking on
    their doors to become their service provider? Yep, put the 'V' back in
    MVCS (That's MULTI-VENDOR Customer Service) and I think you'll figure
    it out. 
    
    We alread provide warranty service for Dell File Servers, and we're
    working on getting _all_ their warranty business. If a customer requests
    it via Compaq, we can provide warranty service for their systems. We
    also provide warranty service for NEC laptops and Apple. ALL of these
    folks pay MVCS to provide the warranty service for their equipment.
    
    Don't be so DEC-centric, and take a look beyond the walls of Digital.
    There are plenty of opportunities out there. Next take a gander at the
    PC Integration business and the mind boggles. I know of one worldwide
    project that is in pilot phase that, if successful, will generate $4-6
    Billion (with a B!) in hardware and support revenue for Digital over
    the next 4 years. So far, the customer is pretty happy with the
    results.
    
    MVCS does much more than just swap boards in VAXen. We support (on the
    hardware side) DEC, HP, SUN, IBM, etc. We'll fix damn near any PC on
    the planet (There are some older, proprietary systems out there that
    parts are almost impossible to find for, as the vendor has long since
    disappeared, but we usually offer to cut them a deal on upgrading).
    We'll install and support Novell, Banyan, Pathworks, LAN Manager and
    just about any other network operating system. We'll cable your site
    (usually using a cabling contractor, but we still get a cut of the
    action!). 
    
    There IS money to be made, Digital just *still* has lots of "process"
    that gets in the way of us bringing in even more of it. We're turning a
    profit anyway. The most amazing thing is that upper management seems to
    think that Digital as a whole can be made profitable by laying off MVCS
    folks.... 
    
    Isn't that sort of like killing the goose that lays the golden eggs?
    
    Harry
    

    1.  While not a professional sales person, I can recognize the value of
    	getting everyone together and making SURE they all understand the
    	marching orders.  On the other hand, the embarassment and
    	consternation that occurred recently, when a consulting client asked
    	to borrow a yellow pad to take notes, point to the lack of more
    	basic "tools" in other areas.
    
    2.	The disconnect between sales and delivery is a problem, but not
    	necessarily of sales' making.  For years DC (EIS, PSS, SWS)
    	management has been telling the sales force "DOn't worry about
    	delivery, that's our job.  You just get out there and sell it."
    
    3.	Mr. Ricciardi would perhaps find a bit more sympathy if he could
    	unbend enough to tell the rest of us just what was so valuable
    	about this "important sales tool".
    
    \dave

    Ref .163
    
    Boy I hate it when I have to miss one day of NOTES and have to catch
    up.  Being in MCS and being left as a Team of one (1) supporting 7
    product sets, down from 5 members three months ago (and the call 
    volume has not decreased), supporting the whole free world, I worked 
    from 7:00am to 11:40pm yesterday and did not get a chance to read 
    any NOTES.  That is now common since we support 7x24, and a team of 
    one means you get to rotate the pager with yourself.  So, the 
    downsizing has hurt in some (many) places.
    
    I think what is missing or not understood in the discussion over the 
    last few days is that there is some fustration when you support 
    products that are sold into environments that they were not meant to 
    be sold, or have never been tested.  I have had Sales people tell me 
    that their job is to sell and mine is to make it work.  In the long run
    you have an unhappy or frustrated customer, support person, and maybe
    Sales person; and we all lose.  We are all in this boat together and
    if we are going to keep it afloat and get it moving again, we all 
    have to work together.  Forget the boondoggle in San Diego, it happened, 
    its over.  The whole problem was and is, the lack of communications
    within the company and that is what needs to be addressed.  That is
    the cause of most of the items brought up in this NOTE....  Lack of
    quality communications generates frustration.
    
    dp  
    

    Since I missed most of yesterdays discussion and this mornings,
    let me give you an example.
    
    SOW (Statement of work) is a great tool, however, it does not cover the
    following...
    
    Mr Sales rep sells VAX 3100 Pathworks server and 5 AST PC's to Mr. customer
    for his business.  Mr. Customer already has a PC at home and needs to
    integrate into proposed solution.  Sales Support rep say sure you can
    do that through Async Pathworks etc.  
    
    Mr. Digital Consultant gets a call to go install the customers
    configuration.  First PC's Came without monitors. Consultant waistes
    time tracking these down.  So Consultant installs VMS, and PATHWORKS
    SERVERS.  Calls AST to find out where the monitors are.  Hmm you did'nt
    order the monitors.  Monitors arive two weeks later.  Consultant goes
    back on site to finish configuration.  Install DOS, windows, PATHWORKS.
    Hmm Problems with Third party Networks boards don't seem to work with
    AST PC's more time waisted on support call (Thank god they did'nt cut
    my service to CSC) 3 to four hours waisted figuring this thing out. 
    Sales rep orders DEC ETHERNET Boards as replacement should arive next
    day consultant goes home.  Next day, still problems with customer
    configuration.  Customer should have bought PS@ Compatible mouses not
    Serial Mouses.  ANother Day waisted.  Next day all finished customer
    appears to be happy about current configuration.  I finish installing
    other third party software, and Mr. Customer then comes in to say so
    when will you be comming out to my house to get pathworks running
    there????  Hmmm Mr. Customer nobody told me about that, let me make
    some calls.  Hello Mr. Sales Rep.  Did you tell Mr. Customer that they
    can run Async DecNet to run PATHWORKS.  Why Yes I did.  Well wheres the
    routing License for the VAX Server!  Hmm you mean we need a routing
    license.  Yes you do, You'll have more than one circuit on that
    network.  I'll get you a quote.  Half day waisted to get quote from
    antiquated(IMHO) system.  Mr. Consultant That will be an addition
    $3,500.00.   Oh Mr. Customer....   AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    
    Feel the pain!
    
    This is a true story!  Theres more to this.  Did'nt tell you about the
    printer they sold them.  DeclASER 2200, took 1.5 hours to print one
    graphic page from EXCEL.  Also the graph came out on two pages, half on
    one half on the other.  OH Mr. Customer you need more memory on this
    printer. AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH....
    
    How much money did we loose on this deal, what did we have to give the
    customer to please them.  All I know a simple install that should have
    taken three to four days, too almost a month, the resources I used to
    get it done were phenominal.  We Lost Money, we just could'nt account
    for it.  
    
    I Have about five or six of those stories.  Some of these customers no
    longer buy from DEC Err Digital.  What kind of bad blood did we have by
    not having people who knew the answers or were at least trained to know
    the pitfalls.  A lot of you guys should have a kickoff.  :-)
    
    P.S. Hey /Dave, remember wher NY Suburban had about 25 delivery people?
         Just two or three of us left now from that ORG.  And now people are
         leaving of there own free will.  This affects bottom Line Profit and,
         project schedules.  We no longer have the inhouse bodies to
         deliver.  The Field Technicians are now running around Like
         Chickens without their heads.  But they are good people none the
         less.  Less That is!
    
    
    
    
    
              C A N   Y O U   S A Y   B O O N D O G L E ! ! !

    
    
    To bring this topic back on point, .22 stated that the agenda items
    for the meeting were the following:
    
    > Some of the Agenda Topics:
    >
    > How to manage in a zero inventory environment?
    > What's the new Customer Loyalty program?
    > How do I engage Bid Win Teams for successful proposals?
    > What's the strategy for selling and delivering service through
    > partners?
    > What are the revenue programs now refocused on our current customer
    > base?
    > What's our service support strategy for the company's move to client
    > server?
    > What's PC Utility?
    > What's the MCS Business Plan?
    > Who are the competitors? How do I sell against them?
    
    These are the questions that require an answer. Sales people were
    not the only people at these meetings:
    
    > The invitee list includes sales, delivery, admin. and logistics. 
    > Not everyone will be able to attend, since we've been given a cap 
    > of 950. These field people own our destiny and deal directly with 
    > our customers everyday. We owe them answers to some very
    > complicated questions
    
    So this was not billed as a sales kickoff meeting. Since these people
    own our destiny, these people should be able to tell us exactly 
    the contents of the meeting and answer questions related to the agenda.
    
    > We've designed the workshop and training material and collateral to 
    > be used throughout the year and to bring th
    > messages back out to the rest of the organization.
    
    While this may not be the correct forum (notes) to present this
    material, when and where will it be presented. I am part of MCS. 
    I, therefore, am part of the organization and have a right to know. 
    Forget all the pompous asinine "professional sales person" crap, 
    that is not how the meeting was billed. Finally:
    
    >We have people leaving the company from sales and delivery
    >at an alarming rate. We owe them reasons to believe in this company
    >again, and reasons to stay. We have specific measurement criteria in 
    >place and we're being audited on site.
    
    What is this "specific measurement criteria"? As far as I can tell,
    someone still owes me a reason to believe in this company again, 
    a reason to stay. It should have been communicated at this meeting.
    
    Note: I am a mostly read only noter. It's time for this company to 
    cut all of the doublespeak and communicate the truth. If it's a 
    boondoggle and kickoff meeting, say so. If not, we have been told that 
    we are owed the contents of the meeting.    
    
    Doug Hood
    An MCS employee
    
    
    

    I just thought I'd jump in here to make note of the fact that the
    author of note 3429 ( Employee Theft ) has provided us with an
    interesting (and relevant) data point.  Fourteen replies (and less
    that 3 hours) after the original note, someone from security entered
    a reply addressing some of the concerns raised.  It took a great
    deal longer than that for anyone "in the know" to post any info in
    reply to this thread.  Just thought it was interesting ....

    My unit manager gave us a 45 min run down on San Diego this morning.
    
    He is still waiting for the official RALLY handouts but he answered
    all questions.
    
    the stuff discussed was mostly what already been mentioned.
    
    Managing zero inventory - outsourcing logistics for non Digital 	
    	products and possibly DEC products
    
    Variable workforce - outsourcing techs to cover peak loads and short
    	term projects and older products
    
    both of the above are an attemp to reduced fixed expenses as a 
    percentage of net operating revenues.
    
    Hype around channels sales and channels selling services and on the 
    other end Customer loyalty program for our large dollar customers.
    
    Zoo trip was from 6pm on and included a quick bus tour and dinner
    (no presentation)
    
    Everything was mostly just conceptual no target dates or percentages
    but it left no doubt that the direction of MCS is changing.
    
    
    
    Brian V
                      

>    Managing zero inventory - outsourcing logistics for non Digital 	
>    	products and possibly DEC products
>    
>    Variable workforce - outsourcing techs to cover peak loads and short
>    	term projects and older products
>    
>    both of the above are an attemp to reduced fixed expenses as a 
>    percentage of net operating revenues.
    
    ...and our competitive advantage is in managing?

    Could someone out there give a little bit more information on the 
    VARIABLE WORKFORCE?
    
    What does this mean for the present workforce? What does this mean for 
    the customer? Are indepedent agents going to service OUR customers?
    What does this mean?
    
    

  Variable Work Force has been explained to us (US Customer Support Center)
  as a process where employees will be asked to leave Digital and come back
  as contractors basically doing the same job.  This way 'they' can staff
  for the steady state of business and then pull in more contractors as
  seasonal or product spikes occurs.
  
  No time frame was mentioned for this, but I got the idea it will replace
  the TFSO process in the future.
  
  No details were given with regard to length of contracts, how training is
  provided (will Digital pay or would we be on our own) or what the
  percentages of 'badge toting specialists' vs contractors.
  
  From this explanation it certainly seems that someone up there thinks the
  core competency of Digital is its' managers.
  
  Dave

IBM has announced essentially the same thing, only they call it the
Mobile Workforce.

It seems to be the latest trend.

How do I boil it down? They arrive at an organization of managers (the
same managers they've had) who bring in hands to do work. When the
product ships they fire the hands, sit back and congratulate themselves
for not having to manage people issues. 

These are the same people who never developed (or displayed) people
skills or leadership qualities.  This way, they don't need them!

    It's nothing more than a sad joke.  They TFSO the 'technical' people
    so the numbers can justify the management structure....sound familiar?
    
    Who suffers?  You guessed it!  The CUSTOMER!  And the Acronym chart
    has the probability of what will happen in the future in the term CLD.
    
    ie: Customer LEAVES Digital.  And on another note, how do you suppose
    that service can be accomplished in the same vien with NO Logistics
    support internal.  People are not looking at the WHOLE picture with the
    decisions that are being made.....It's just another stop/gap fix that
    will take a year or the loss of a couple hundred customers till they
    realize that they 'mis-calculated'...(a management term for WE REALLY 
    SCREWED UP AGAIN!) and then there will be another re-org, the faces
    that caused the problems will be buried somewhere else, so no
    accountability will be traceable. 
    
    The sad part of this is that MCS touts a profit.  And cause they do,
    the company does not mess with them.  But look at the whole picture.
    IF you claim a billion in profits, but see that the reality was that
    you spent two billion to make three.....but when you calculate the
    salaries of the people DOING the SERVICE, and the SPARE PARTS REQUIRED,
    that only amounts to probably 500 mil.  Wheres the rest go?  YOU
    GUESSED IT! Now they want to make more 'profit', how do they do it?
    let the people that DO the service go, and contract em, save about 40%
    in employee cost there, and farm out spares.....don't know what that
    saves, but it sure ain't TIME!  and presto/chango, we make more.......
    
    just a guess, but I'd be real surprised if I were wrong.
    
    chet

    I don't believe MCS spent 2 billion to make 1.  My understanding is
    that we cleared 1B.  
    
    I think letting CSEs go is a gross miscalculation and needs to be
    resisted by all.  You can have a bad sales rep and still maintain the
    base (service and hardware), but if you have a bad CSE, you lose. 
    Everything.
    
    I did not hear that Digital intended to "contract" these ex-employees,
    rather that we would sub out to thrid parties or other individuals.  I
    guess it makes more sense to management to assume that recently removed
    decies would remain available for this.  If it were me, I'd take what I
    could from Digital just as long as it took to get a real job.....
    
    As far as parts/spares being inventoried by third parties: it might
    work locally to some extent, but I'd love to see someone manage a
    nation wide rollout by using 450 individual third parites....
    
    How much time will be spent justifying ourselves to third parties in an
    effort to satisfy a customer.....?
    
    

Bear in mind that no matter what you call it, Variable Work Force, Mobile
Work Force, Future State, or Planfully Outsourced Digits, it's not
strictly an MCS issue. 

Ever watch PBS when they show a pack of hyenas as they separate a target
(calf, whatever) from its herd, run it down and eat it? This is how ten
hyenas can feed from a herd of hundreds of larger animals that could
stomp them if they chose to.  The natural process works when the herd
doesn't stand and fight. Tomorrow they'll choose another herd, another
target.

Right now it's MCS and SES and the site Facilities people. Tomorrow is
another day to divide and conquer.

    What do you suggeset ??? MCS stand and fight...what a joke.
    
    Take your paycheck and continue looking for a job, or ride it out.
    
    Either way there is nothing you can do personally to protect your job 
    here. The decision to axe people has nothing to do with their skills
    or performance strictly meeting numbers handed down from high.
    
    Re parts. In Canada for a lot of desktop parts (non dec)we are using a 
    company called Advanced Exchange, they provide us with spares instead of 
    DEC sourcing them directly.
    
    Re flex workforce. Again in Canada monitors keyboards and mouse are
    currently being delivered by a "Special" taxi service. These guys are
    paid per event to deliver and install the above. A lot of time techs
    are never even aware that the call is out there.
    
    
    This #$@T is already going down....
    
    
    Brian V
    

    re:195
    
    You are missing the point.......It don't matter if it is 2 billion
    or ten billion. The point I was trying to make is that whatever
    it took to make the billion profit IT WAS TOO MUCH! And if some
    one with a little fortitude attempted to change the org, for the
    better that is, then you would see a Bil/half profit, or two bil
    profit. the problem is that as long as there IS a profit, then the
    tactic/cost of getting it is not questioned.  SHOULD BE THOUGH!
    
    Again, I seem to be looking focus, There is STILL and WILL BE UNTIL
    MCS folds, TOO MUCH OVERHEAD in the way they do business......
    
    They may have a neat way of folding it into the numbers to hide
    the fact, but that fact still remains.  I've seen over the
    last years, higer level people being allowed to continue working
    and replace a lower level person, so the organization can TFSO the
    lower level person.....and for no salary cut! THAT MAKES A LOT OF SENSE 
    EH?  If they got rid of the middle/upper dead meat, then the cost of doing 
    service would IMMEDIATELY zoom upward......instead of spiral down. 
    
    We aren't talking rocket science here, just a little common sense. 
    
    Chet

    
    
    What we have been told is, "In the very near future, 10 to 50% of our
    local engineer workforce will be contractors.".  
    
    
    The zero inventory logistics is less of a big deal.  How I understand
    it, the zero inventory plan is for products that Digital will be
    authorized to provide factory warranty service.  Such a deal could be
    struck with any of the "Name Brand" hardware providers.  Most of the
    little companies around here, that are certified warranty providers,
    maintain little or no parts.  The parts come directly from the original
    manufacturer.  This is the way most of the warranty service is provided
    in the desk-top arena.
    
    But, what do I care.  I am outah here...
    
    
    Monday Morning Digital MCS Customer
    
    Jon Aller

    regarding .189 etc. 
    
    a) haven't we proven in the past couple of years, that our
       core-competency is management ;-)
    b) when you dismantle the value-chain down to management, investors may
       find out that they better hand their money to a savingsbank - 
       then we can to the final round - out-placing management...
    c) if you would have several thousands of Digital shares in your
       portfolio (i.e. 300,000 or so) you would also run for the short time
       profit.... in this case you must not necessarely have Bob as your 
       forename 
    

    Re .195:
    
    	I agree with Mark here.  MCS is making HUGE profits, and it is
    suicide to get rid of the MCS engineers.  When they leave, you can bet
    that they won't be going to a temporary job service, but look for a
    real job.  If Digital thinks that they can count on Quality Engineers
    from off the street part time, this company has another thing comming,
    and it aint profits...  If it aint broke don't fix it!  You won't make
    more profit by laying off the people with the skills, you only send
    them to our competitors.
    
    Jim Morton

    
    re: .201
    
    	Or directly to the end user. - Jim K

        According to the town hall meeting we had in Alpharetta, last
        week, MCS turned it's first quarterly profit in a number of years. 
        It was on the order of 5M.
        
        Dave Zaniewski

    It was the first time in a number of quarters that MCS made their
    budget not just a profit.  MCS has always made a profit; just not as
    much as needed or budgeted.  The figures touted were also only for the
    Americas Zone, not Corporate MCS.
    
    Joe Pflanzf

    re .205
    
    Only two things come to mind after reading .205:
    
    	Feedback = Hendrix
    	Loops    = Fruit
    
    rick

I dunno - I'm beginning to believe that Nasser Lives On...

    Re .205
    
    	So how long have you been into scientology ?
    
    Brian V
    
    (hows that for feed back)
    

    
    re: .205
    
    	Say hi to your uncle Isaac for me.
    
    - Jim K

    re: - (a few)
    
    Nassar, who took and english class while he was away.... but still
    doesn't understand the use of the "shift" key.
    
    Toodles.....JP

Seems more like Doane and Carnell than Nasser.

- Pc.

    
    	Do you think RP may have finally figured out how to communicate to
    us via The Notes File?
    
    	Either that, or we got a real spaceman out there. Of course, he
    could be an IDC/SES OSF/1 documentrian.
    
    		the Greyhaw

    
    Yeah, greyhawk, but it was a 'special K' with the purple dot on it!!!
    
    
    ;^)   x   1 to the tenth!
    
    p/t

    Hey! Thomas Newton,  Where do you get the time to write that stuff?  Do
    you believe people will continue reading it?
    
    Jim Morton

    
    	Was awed by 'ol Newton baby there until I read a fantastic piece of
    fiction by one Marlo Morgan called "Mutant Message Down Under". Very
    interesting history behind the book as well as the book itself.
    	Marlo claims she had a walk with Australian aborigines of a small
    dying tribe that communicated telepathically, were one with nature,
    etc. All that good New Age escape stuff. Before Harper would publish
    this work (and a piece it is), they went thru this long song-and-dance
    with Marlo who claimed it was true and wanted it printed as
    non-fiction.
    	Business sense being what it is today, Harper said it's our
    $1.7-million sweetie, and it's fiction. So now Marlo is on the
    book signing, talk show circuit, and, of course, she says not only is
    it all true, she's been back several times and she's got more.
    	If you get a chance to see, or hear, this one - don't miss it.
    The book is a trip, to say the least.
    
    
    	Newton, my boy, if you need an Agent, you just call 'ol Greyhawk
    here in Chicago. I know more people than THREE Rolodexs, and baby,
    you'll be rich!
    
    
    			the Greyhawk

    Nah, I don't think Newton exists. I think the messages are the first
    awakenings in the collective consciousness of the network; deus ex
    machina.
    
    ciao, martin, who is Trying to Understand the Celestial Truth Inherent
    in the Messages and is Calling for the Believers to Come Together in a
    Great Mass when All Will Be Revealed.

    Re: .-1
    
    You are indeed close to the Unified Truth but you must first reverse
    the telescope. Newton _does_ exist and is the collective conciousness
    of the network.
    
    It is _we_ who do not exist. This Realization of our own non-existence
    is the Great Dichotomy. Acceptance of this is the pre-condition to
    understanding the Unified Truth.

    re: the Newton chronicles, looks like an updated version of "Doctor" to
    me
    	Bill
    

Actually, the Superfluous Use of Capital Letters is an
Aid to Compression (by Certain Boy-Wonders mentioned
Elsewhere in This Very File), since it is Well-Known
that the Capitals use One Less Bit than the Small Letters.

    ^R^e^c^o^m^m^e^n^d ^a^l^s^o ^u^s^i^n^g ^t^h^e ^C^t^r^l ^k^e^y
    ^s^i^n^c^e ^t^h^i^s ^a^l^s^o ^R^e^m^o^v^e^s ^O^n^e ^E^x^t^r^a ^B^i^t
    ^f^o^r ^e^x^t^r^a ^D^a^t^a ^C^o^m^p^a^c^t^n^e^s^s.

    if u cn rd ths u cn gt a gd jb at hi pa

    
    >>  if u cn rd ths u cn gt a gd jb at hi pa
                                          ^^^^^
    DARN!  I can read the whole thing except for this part! :-) 

    May be hight payment ??

    
    	Py? Whr? Cn i gt som? Hw? Wh d i cl? Mybe RP cn hlp m.
    
    		th Gyrk

    re .299
    
    hi pa = haiku sized performance appraisals?
    	
    1
    =
    -1.
    
    
    

    Stock's up...
    
    	Humor's up...
    
    		Just stopped rainin' in Texas...
    
    
    Everything's kinda lightenin' up all over!  Yessir...I like it!
    
    ('hi pa' in the South is just that...I don't get it...it's like "hi,
    Ma", right?)
    
    							Tex

re .231

>>> 'hi pa' ... I don't get it

I don't get it either!!!

    High pay... like in Tai Pai... ;}

    Well, I don't know what y'all call your parental units in the Orient,
    but in Grapevine, TX (Home of Joe Bob Briggs, the Drive-In Movie
    Critic), we calls 'em "Ma" and "Pa".
    
    And Ma and Pa were allus into compression, by the way.  I'd say "Ma,
    this here possum ain't done!  It moved!".  Whereupon, without taking
    the Marlboro outta her mouth, she'd say "Kwitcherdambitchinneat!".
    
    Ma prolly woulda answered one a them "if u cn rd ths" ads (specially if
    it said "Hi Pa" on the end, 'cause she woulda knowed it was Flossie
    down at the Dixie Diner what took it out) if'n we had a subway to run 'em 
    on in Grapevine.  And if'n she could read.

    Possum for dinner usually involved a form of compression before the
    cooking started, if I'm not mistaken ...

     I for one was not/am not impressed by the seemingly lavish use (waste)
    of precious funds for the 'boondoggle' in S.D.
    
    We've all heard all the hype about 'kick-off' and 'vision' and all the
    other policitally correct rhetoric, and all the Field engineer's I know
    are not impressed. I'm one, and I did play one on TV. 
    
    All I wanted to see was results. I wanted my UM and the rest of the
    group to come back glowing, positively esctatic about the 'new' plans
    and ideas, ready to pitch in and inform the rest of us about how great
    it was going to be in the future. That hasn't happened.
    
    All I have seen/heard is more buzzwords and business as usual. I still
    have to fix whatever is broken, with fewer and fewer spares, less
    support, longer hold times, slower networks and more paperwork.
    
    I used to think that this company was doomed, now I'm really starting
    to worry.
    
    .mike.

    i was told, because of my comments in this string, to ASK those that
    attended. the implication being that maybe this wasn't the best place
    to ask. OK. i bit. i asked. 
    
    it was a boondoggle. not the first. not the last. but definitely a
    boondoggle. 

    well my district had its "official" meeting about the big MCS meeting,
    complete with overheads and all. I now understand why no one wanted to
    talk about it---bad news for MCS worker bees.
    
    Customer Loyalty program - Increased focus on base customer
    	mostly just small freebees news letter and management visits
    
    Logistics - increased use of other people/companies as a parts
    	supplier. Outsource the logistic space and personell in small
    	areas
    
    Space reduction - decrease office space where ever possible, close
    	small offices, restructure larger offices and try to get more
    	people onto the home program
    
    Variable workforce - chart showed a goal of 50 % of DECs staff would
    	be vairiable/non-traditional workforce. This would include stuff
    	like...
    		- couriers (parts delivery)
    		- technical couriers (keyboard monitors and mouse swaps)
    		- contractors (by day,week,month and call)
    		- sub contractors (by product,customer and location)
    		- outsourcing
    		- franchising
    		- spin off
    
    	an example of spin off was to take a Digital employee in a remote
    	area or that works on a specific product set and get him/her to 
    	go into bussiness for themselves and Digital would provide them
    	with a fixed price contract to repair all XYZ's in the area. They
    	would be encouraged to grow thier own bussiness during this time
    	and at the end of the 2 years Digital would just pay them per
    	event.
    
    	The kicker was the way it would be decided who would do the work
    	ie what would be contracted out. All MCS bussiness is broken down
    	into CORE COMPETENCY, CONTROLLED, and COMMODITY.
    
    	Core would be done by Digital and included Customer MANAGEMENT
    	Call MANAGEMENT, Understanding the Customer, Call Escalation and
    	On Site CONSULTING.
    
    	Controlled included such thing as REPAIRs on site as well as boards
    	call entry and call qualification.
    
    	Commodity was pretty much everything else (logistics)
    
    
    	OPINION follows
    
    	So as you can see management got together and decided that they
    	were Digital's core compitency and everyone else was just overhead
    	Pretty much what has been discussed in this notes file before.
    
    	Brian V
    

    When you ask any group of individuals in a large organization which is
    most important, which is indispensable, they tend to say, "Why us, of
    course!"  It's not true, but it's understandable.  Guess what? 
    Managers, who are people too, have the same opinion of themselves as we
    have of ourselves.  Unfortunately, they're the ones who get to decide
    8^(

    It sounds as if the SES experience is already being looked at as a
    success model, even before it is implemented.

.238>
    	The kicker was the way it would be decided who would do the work
    	ie what would be contracted out. All MCS bussiness is broken down
    	into CORE COMPETENCY, CONTROLLED, and COMMODITY.
    

See 3238.* and 3447.* for some of the thrilling details of what's coming
your way soon.

Engineering is not far behind.


                         "To err is human, to moo bovine"   A/~~\A
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       Actually, the spin-off idea is *potentially* good. I don't know that
    I would be eligible, and I'm not in a remote area anyway, but the
    chance to set up on my own with the backing of a guaranteed contract
    to start things off would be very appealing. For the right people, and
    implemented in the right way, it could be a great opportunity.
    
      Unfortunately, if they follow the SES/IDC model, people are likely to
    be told they have been selected for it rather than given the opportunity
    to volunteer. The 'contract' will be a non-negotiable stitch-up, and
    anyone refusing it will be deemed to have resigned.
    
    Ken                

>    anyone refusing it will be deemed to have resigned.

After moe than two weeks of using this verbiage consistently,
they have discovered that they've been using wrong word.  Now,
you are to be "separated for refusing to go to work for the 
outside company."

    The following entry has been contributed by a member of our community
    who wishes to remain anonymous.  If you wish to contact the author by
    mail, please send your message to QUARK::MODERATOR, specifying the
    conference name and note number. Your message will be forwarded with
    your name attached  unless you request otherwise.

				Steve






			Core Competency Phobias

		-----------------------------------
	
   From	Note 3342.238                 San Diego MCS Meeting                  
		.
		.
		.
    	So as you can see management got together and decided that they
    	were Digital's core competency and everyone else was just overhead
	...
		.
		.
		.    
		-----------------------------------
		
		I read Notes to keep up on what's happening in the 
	company but this note took my mind right back into a dream I 
	had last night,  one of those dreams that felt so real while 
	I was in it.

		Time had skipped ahead to Thanksgiving.  I was at down 
	at the field watching the high school eleven take on their
	traditional rival.  We were killing 'em, pushing 'em all over
	the field.  But I couldn't recognize any of our boys.  They had
	on the local colors but they were all faces out of the National
	Football League.

		Back at home,  I couldn't recognize the place either.  It
	was beautiful!  As I started through the front door, Martha 
	Stewart brushed past me on her way out.  And oh the smells from 
	the kitchen;  my mouth watered with anticipation!  But the sounds
	were different.  Instead of my wife's effeminate swearing,  I 
	heard the lilt of Julia Child's lyric voice.

		Three children shouted, "Happy Thanksgiving!" Not my
	children but handsome children,  I think I've seen them on some
	show on TV.  As I looked down the table at the crystal and 
	silver and the most bountiful display of food I've ever seen,
	my eyes came to rest on the most beautiful creature I've ever
	beheld.  (In my mind,  I silently asked my wife to forgive me
	and to go on with her own life and be happy wherever she was.)
		
		I felt euphoric as I pulled back my chair at the 
	head of the table.  But, as I did,  some guy who looked a lot
	like the father on the Waltons, smiled at me and sat down in 
	my place.  I was dumbfounded and couldn't move for a moment.
	Then the phone rang and I walked over and picked up the receiver.
	The caller addressed me by name,  saying this is Hell calling and
	you've been outsourced.

		Everything seemed to go dim as I stammered into the phone.
	Then I realized that I was awake.  It was all just a dream. I
	was talking into my alarm clock.  What a scare.

    re: turning techs into "contractors"
    
    There's a lot of talk about "non-traditional workforce" and
    "contractors", and the talk is generally negative. This may
    be true for some people.
    
    For those techs with a little business sense and the ability
    to negotiate, it may turn into a goldmine. Everyone seems to
    think that being a contractor is bad, and that Digital can
    treat contractors anyway it wants. This is not true.
    
    There are contractors out there who have literally made millions
    off of Digital. Many times Digital has outsourced key operations
    to contractors, and then had to pay through the nose as those
    contractors gain control of the information, the customer, and
    the business. While I've read many statements saying "Management"
    is our core competency, I've seen lots of evidence to the contrary.
    
    Good people who can do the job are hard to find, no matter what the
    technology or discipline. If Digital dumps the techs out on the street
    and tries to hire them back as contractors at lower cost, then the
    opportunity exists for those people to take advantage, and hold out
    out for favorable conditions. Some people will finally get the chance
    to charge Digital for the true value of their services ...
    
    

    I have heard that variable workforce and downsizing are not going to
    happen in the MCS delivery side.  Change of heart.  This is good.

    re: .246
    
    Hmmmm .... well, we're already outsourcing sunstantial business
    in the delivery side of MCS here, and we have a contractor shagging
    calls ... ooops! ... I mean delivering service.
    
    Who did you hear that from?
    
    

    probably like everything before... someone makes a decision... forces
    it's implementation... moves on to more blue sky... leaves someone else
    to live with the decision... decision is changed... too late for many.
    
    tony

    Actually, "new business", MVS business, will be outsourced when
    profitable.  For example, sell service on HP4+ printers for 23$ a month
    per printer and source it at 17$.
    
    No more consideration for inserting third parties on the base...