Conference 7.286::digital

Yes, there are laws. Specifically, MA has a law about facility closings,
notification requirements, etc. Ask the MA Dept. of Labor for info.
And stop shouting.

--RS

Consider yourself fortunate!  If you move to NH, you'll end up with more
money in your pocket.

	paul (living in NH, working in MA, sigh...)

    	It happens within the company and I doubt there's much you can do,
    but it's worth a check. Out group got transferred from MKO a couple 
    years ago into TWO and TAY and with most of us from NH we were not a
    happy group of campers being sent into taxachusetts...  Let us know
    what you might find out.
    
    Keith

re .2:

Not if he lives in MA.

    Re -1
    
    How will you end up with more money in your pocket???
    
    Still have to pay Mass state taxes, and if you DO get layed off, the 
    money you receive is based on the state where you work not where you
    live.  Basically you are looking at loosing money at both ends...
    
    Not trying to be negative, but maybe I don't understand how you
    figured.
    
    

    
    Unemployment benefits are much lower if you work in NH than if you
    work in MA.
    
    A thought that would not have occured to many just a few short years
    ago...
    

 


    I think they can move you where that want, but if its outside a
    determined radius (60 miles?) they have to pay you relocation
    costs. Anyway what are you going to do? Say NO? :')

    I've been in the same organization for 10 years and I've been 
    moved back and forth from NH to Mass. 3 times. Infact I've moved
    from ZKO to MKO to ZKO to PKO to LJO to PKO to CTS to ZKO to PKO...
    ...and here I sit in MRO. Just waiting.

    I know many people who have been forced to work out of the 
    state they were hired to work in.  They had to go or lose their
    jobs.  It is a lousy situation but one I guess we all have to
    face if it is presented to us.  Go with the punches or leave the
    company is what it amounts to.  What facility are you moving into?
    If it is NIO, look me up when you get here!!
    
    Regards,
    Merrianne

    re: .0
    
    Is this really news to you that a company can move a department, or
    it's entire headquarters to another state???  Digital SHOULD move where
    it's operating expenses are lower, and that's probably not anywhere in
    New England, although I understand that taxes are more favorable in New
    Hampshire.  Massachusetts is a part of Digital's problems.

NH has a fairly high business profits tax.

Of course that hasn't been a problem lately.

    At least you don't have to move to another country ..
    
    >Per

I went from Dallas, TX to Marlboro, MA to keep employment a few years
ago. Heck, MA-NH-RI-VT is just one state as far as I'm concerned! And
our organization has moved from MRO to LTN to TWO to LKG. Moving to/
from NH would hardly be anything worth noting. However, I do get
annoyed when my commute gets lengthened. 

Re .5, .4: sorry, ambiguous wording.  I meant "if you move your home to NH".

Yes, so long as you do anything in MA you get taxed -- live, work, or both.

	paul

    Most of us will go to MKO but we are all activity looking outside the
    company.  In these times I feel, as most that a move of this nature,
    for some of us the drive up RT 3 will be over an hour each way, with
    the stressfulness of these jobs today, none of us need this type of
    move.  I will go for the interim, but am actively looking outside.
    
    It is unfortunate that this company can see a future in moving over 100
    people out of state.  Then we might only be there for a few months and
    they will move us somewhere again.  In the past three years they have
    moved us six times.  
    
    I did try calling the Labor Department but gave up when they couldn't
    forward me to the correct department.
    
    A very upsetting move for all of us.  But like you said, when it is
    presented to you you go with the flow or leave if that be your choice.
    
    Thanks,
    
    Lynn

    MA has a 5+% income tax.  NH has none.  You pay according to where
    you work.  NH unemployment benefits are around $196 flat rate.  Whereas
    MA rates are $312 w/ $25 per dependent, $50 health coverage and a
    stipend to assist with education fees.  (quoted from a newspaper
    article I have - sorry I cannot give paper name, date, etc.  I just
    have a copy of the article.)
    
    Given these times, I have no problem with being a NH resident, working
    in MA and paying that percentage.  If I get laid off, I get better
    benefits.  If I don't, I get to file a Non-resident tax form at the end
    of the year which will return SOME of my "investment".
    
    -sandy
    

    The plot is quite clear. Everyone in MK must move to SHR and vise versa
    this will encourage attrition which I believe is on the top 10 list of 
    organizational goals. 

    Gail 

Re:  <<< Note 3309.15 by DELNI::DISMUKE >>>

>    MA has a 5+% income tax.  NH has none.  You pay according to where
>    you work.                               ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
     ^^^^^^^^

If you are a MA resident, you pay 5% Mass Income Tax whether you work in MA or
NH. If you are a NH resident, you pay 5% Mass Income Tax if you work in MA, or
0% NH Income Tax if you work in NH.

-stephen

Why not discuss with your management the H.O.M.E. program?  Unless what
you do requires that you be 'in corpus' at a Digital facility every day, the
H.O.M.E. program is a great alternative.

--Scott

    re .15
    MA raised their weekly unemployment benefits from $312 to $325 (before
    dependents) within the last year.

    re .17  exactly
    
    re .19  Good news! (for some, I guess)  8^)
    
    

  Re .0: Is this move being made to accommodate the sale of part of the 
Storage business (and of SHR1 & 2) to Quantum?
  The good news (if you can call it that) is that the distance between plants
is probably just over 60 miles, and that should qualify some people for relo-
cation benefits. I suggest you clock the mileage between plants yourself and
check VTX ORANGEBOOK for the latest relocation policy.
  I have been a renter for the entire time I have been on my own. Several
people have asked why I rent instead of buying. I say that being a renter I
am "buying freedom", that is, the freedom to move on short notice without
the hassle of selling one place and buying another or (heaven forbid) being
an absentee landlord of the old place. It's a good thing I didn't buy a home
because I have had 6 job relocations in the last 15 years, three due to job
changes and three due to group moves.

��       <<< Note 3309.21 by TOOK::MORRISON "Bob M. LKG1-3/A11 226-7570" >>>

��  Re .0: Is this move being made to accommodate the sale of part of the 
��Storage business (and of SHR1 & 2) to Quantum?
��  The good news (if you can call it that) is that the distance between plants
��is probably just over 60 miles, and that should qualify some people for relo-
��cation benefits. I suggest you clock the mileage between plants yourself and
��check VTX ORANGEBOOK for the latest relocation policy.

    I think you're incorrectly intrepreting the policy.  The
    policy says:    (can I post this here or will it violate
    		     some inane capriciously enforced rule?)
   

         The employee's commute to work must increase by the
         following three mileage tests, measured by the shortest of
         the more commonly traveled routes between locations:

         1.  the distance from the old work site to the new work
             site must be at least 15 miles; and,

         2.  the distance from the old home and to the new work
 |           site must increase the commute by a minimum of 50
             miles; or exceed 75 miles; and,

         3.  the new home location must be within a "reasonable
             commute" * to the new work location and closer than the
             old home to the new work site.


    To me, this says that if you don't meet the mileage
    requirements you don't qualify.

    It doesn't say anything about whether relocation will be
    authorized.  That will be determined by the whim of some
    manager.

    I am also in the group that is to be moved. We are being given every
    indication that there will be no relo available. 
    
    There are two reasons for this move:
    
          1. The sale of SHR1 to Quantum -- we have to get out
    
          2. Merger of two similar groups. The other currently 
             resides in MKO1. We were told that there was no 
             space available anyplace between the two sites. 
    
    There are some people in our group who commute now from RI and CT. 
    
    Linda

>    I am also in the group that is to be moved. We are being given every
>    indication that there will be no relo available. 

  I read the policy yesterday and there is nothing in it that requires the
company to offer relo to people involved in group moves. In fact, I could not
find any mention of group moves at all. However, I think it would be useful
for someone in this group to ask headquarters if management can, in fact, not 
pay relo to people in a group move who are eligible (by mileage standards) 
for it.    
  No space available closer than Merrimack? That seems hard to believe. 

Re: MA tax

Probably a nit (although not, in the financial sense), probably subject
matter for another topic, and quite probably, for another conference,
but -

Mass. income tax is not 5% or even approximately 5%, but 5.95%, or for all
intents and purposes, 6%. That's practically a 20% difference, and it
amount to almost 2� hours pay a week.

-Jack
    (who's glad to be back in NH with that money in HIS pocket)

    -Jack (who's glad to be back in NH with that money in HIS pocket)...
           
       -to pay the property tax when the bill comes in, right?!

    I believe there were relo policies - pre COD days.  I think they have
    all been revisited since then, thus some people recalling a relo
    policy, some not.
    
    -s
    

Interesting the change to the policy (notice the change bar). When
we moved from TWO to LKG, I believe the policy was 65 miles total,
not 75, and I do not recall the requirement that the commute
increase by 50 miles. This is rather nasty; if you drive 30 miles
now and go to a 70 mile drive (an unpleasant change to the say the
least), you are not eligible, but you still lose another hour
and a half or more of your life everyday.

When we came into LKG, it was all we could do to squeeze into
spare nooks and crannies, space was so limited. Recent shuffling
has eased that a bit, but with the reductions in floor space
(both office and lab) over the past year, space is still a
difficult commodity to come by.

    re: .28
    
    The Federal tax laws regarding what is a deductible versus a
    non-deductible move changed recently (last January, I believe).  The
    change was based on Census Bureau data taht showed that the average
    length of commute in the US had increased to 50 miles -- a number that
    was skewed by not taking into account people who take public transit or
    walk or bike rather than driving.  The median -- the distance the
    average person commuted to work -- was only about 20 miles. 
    
    But they used the 50-mile number to determine the deductibility level,
    and most companies base their relocation policies on the Federal rules.  
    There may be tax consequences to Digital if they don't match the Fed.
    policies. 
    
    --bonnie

    
    
      It's interesting that the Clean Air Act goes as far as suggesting
    employers charge for parking to encourage carpooling,  (And thus 
    energy savings, pollution reduction and apple pie),  yet even
    during times of great economic dislocation,  when folks are forced
    to accept longer commutes,  they miss the obvious benifit of 
    helping folks to live near their place of employment...
    
    
    							-al

    Anyone heard the rumor that RDB will be sold to oracle?
    
    -rlu

    Who hasn't?  The question is - how many believe it?
    
    				Steve

    
    ...only those who know...heard any denials from corporate?