T.R | Title | User | Personal Name | Date | Lines |
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1926.1 | It's official, it's a typical, it's Digital | DUGROS::ROSS | Save DEC: Layoffs, not Payoffs! | Fri Jun 05 1992 00:07 | 31 |
| It's not a rumor, it's a fact. We in the Southern Area received
mail last week stating that the powers-that-be have decided to not
include individual contributors {i.e. those people who deliver the
services and are in front of the customer more than anyone else}
for consideration for C.O.E. for FY92.
The fact that this announcement was made with one month to go in FY92
is disgusting, de-motivating {what else is new}, and shows an utter
lack of respect for the large number of Digital Services personnel who
are keeping this company barely afloat financially.
The replacement program for what was C.O.E. {a trip for employee
and spouse to Hawaii for a week this year} is a cash award not
to exceed $500. They have also instituted a program to give
up to $50 cash awards on the spot for acts above and beyond the call
of duty. Next year, the award will be a three day trip {employee
only} somewhere. Gee, just what I want after spending 30-50% of
the year away from my family - a three day trip away from them.
The Digital Services organization could lead DEC out of the doldrums if
there was some leadership, some motivational force, some insight into
the fact that we need to INCREASE services delivery headcount by at
least a factor of two while cutting management by 50%. We also need
to abolish all of the overhead timewasting systems that are blackholes
of data- SBS for example - where people spend their time tracking
how many hours I worked last week rather than finding places for me
to work next week.
|
1926.2 | | ALOSWS::KOZAKIEWICZ | Shoes for industry | Fri Jun 05 1992 09:31 | 7 |
| re: last two
Makes me ever so thankful I had the prescience to leave that brain-dead
organization three years ago...
Al
|
1926.3 | Be careful what you ask for.... | RUTILE::ZIMAN | | Fri Jun 05 1992 13:04 | 4 |
| I remember reading in this notesfile, how a number of people felt
that COE was NOT a motivator and others suggested they would prefer
$$$$$ to a trip.... sounds like at least some people got their wish...
|
1926.4 | | WLDBIL::KILGORE | ...57 channels, and nothin' on... | Fri Jun 05 1992 14:57 | 9 |
|
The fact that a highly arbitrary and unpredictable COE award is being
replaced by a smaller but more widespread award, presumable based on
objective criteria, is probably good news.
The fact that managers will still climb onto Maui charter flights over the
backs of individual contributors who used to be eligible for the award,
must be an extraordinary slap in the face.
|
1926.5 | Idle Thoughts | MAIL::ALLER | | Fri Jun 05 1992 16:08 | 14 |
|
What I heard.
COE will be used as a recognition tool for regional staff and
individuals who directly generate revenue through sales.
Non-sales individuals and staff will be awarded through some, yet to be
announced program.
It would appear that, non-sales individuals and staff, are not capable
of acheiving the same degree of excellence.
Jon Aller
|
1926.6 | A rose by any other name..... | NECSC::ROODY | | Fri Jun 05 1992 20:37 | 6 |
| Actually, one rumor that I may have heard is that the tickets to
Hawaii are one way. It's a new version of COE; "Circle of Elimination".
;^o
Then again, I may not have heard it quite this way. Things are never
the way you remember them.
|
1926.7 | I can think of worse one-way tickets to have... | SCAACT::RESENDE | | Fri Jun 05 1992 22:54 | 1 |
|
|
1926.8 | I guess I'll never get to Hawaii Now! | SUBWAY::CATANIA | Mike C. �-� | Sun Jun 07 1992 13:20 | 0 |
1926.9 | "Incentives in the DP Industry" | DENVER::DAVISGB | I'd rather be driving my Jag | Mon Jun 08 1992 12:36 | 16 |
| Re: .3 RUTILE::ZIMAN
>.... how a number of people felt
>that COE was NOT a motivator and others suggested they would prefer
>$$$$$ to a trip.... sounds like at least some people got their wish...
Two different issues here:
1. Is COE (or excellence awards) a motivator
2. Does the employee prefer $$$ to a trip
The research project I did for my bachelors statistically (Barely...)
proved that Excellence Awards was a (positive) motivator.
|
1926.10 | Clarification... | ALOSWS::KOZAKIEWICZ | Shoes for industry | Wed Jun 10 1992 12:37 | 14 |
| It's come to my attention that some individual contributors in the
services organization interpreted my comment in .2 as somehow
referring to them. Nothing could be further from the truth. I am
outraged by the insensitivity displayed by those who make the kind of
decisions described in .1 (does this remind anyone of the car plan
fiasco?) and flabbergasted that they could not predict the effect on
morale. In short, I think this is a dumb decision. Although I am
glad to be out of the services organization, my sympathies are with the
troops who have to live with yet another slap in the face.
Hope that clarifies things.
Al
|
1926.11 | There is not 'gray' to the issue | ACESMK::KOSMATKA | Ron Kosmatka | Wed Jun 10 1992 16:27 | 29 |
| My cut at this situation is:
- the program does *not* produce the incentive/motivation
which would actually make the 'reward' cost effective.
If it worked, employees would be working 'harder' to win
the award. Result: sales, etc., would be higher and the
difference in financial performance would actual pay for
the program.
Assuming I'm right, then that would mean we (Digital) are
throwing away money at the worst possible time. Where is the
Return On Investment? One of the strongest motivational
factors right now is more likely to be job security .. or, at
least, a good chance to transfer within the company if it
should be time to move on ...
(A picture comes to mind of a banquet hall, filled with revelers,
with a bunch of starving "about-to-be-former" employees standing
at the door trying to get in.)
If the program *must* exist, then the only thing to do which is
fair is to continue to offer the COE to both management and staff.
I think this is strictly a "black-and-white" issue, there is no
gray. You either have the program, or you don't. But you don't
offer it to one level of employees and not the other.
Ron
|
1926.12 | DS COE Nominations | CSOA1::SIANO | | Wed Jun 10 1992 18:46 | 8 |
| In response to .3, I think what the field asked for was equity in the COE
process, and that all organizations have the same opportunity to receive
equitable rewards.
If the COE program was dropped totally to save the company money, I would
agree that it's the right thing to do; however, to segregate (discriminate)
a group out of the COE award program is not the right thing to do for
business and/or morale.
|
1926.13 | | JMPSRV::MICKOL | Winning with Xerox in '92 | Thu Jun 11 1992 02:04 | 14 |
| Well, I don't know about anyone else, but I'm in Sales Support and I'm working
'harder' to become a COE winner. Although a financial award is always nice, an
all-expense paid trip to an exotic place is motivating for me and certainly
motivates my wife to support my late nights and frequent travel.
And having spent most of my 14 years in DEC corporate, I do think its a shame
that there aren't more substantial reward and recognition programs for the
rest of the critical organizations within the company. Having worked closely
with some excellent Digital Services people, I can tell you that they deserve
a COE-type program as much as anyone.
Regards,
Jim
|
1926.14 | Individual Recognition vs. Teamowrk | GUCCI::BBELL | | Thu Jun 11 1992 11:00 | 12 |
| IMHO
Everyone should have heard by now that we should be focusing on the
customer now instead of focusing internally. That is always difficult
when the Company has so many organizations which inevitably will have
different agendas from time to time. This fact along with the
difficulty in selecting COE winners in a totally objective manner that
would be agreed upon by all can cause a difference of opinion on who
should and should not be recognized for excellence. And since I am not
eligible for COE, what are the chances that I will agree with the
selections this year? Does that make COE an effective motivation tool?
|
1926.15 | yes, but guarantees? | FSOA::OGRADY | George, 297-5322, US Retail/Wholesale SW | Thu Jun 11 1992 11:28 | 9 |
| .13,
Jim, does those extra nights guarantee you the trip? Does the hardwork
guarantee you the trip? If so you are better then most. IMHO the
hardwork is not the finally derterining factor, politics is. I know my
SO would gladly support me if the rewards had black and white rules.
gog
|
1926.16 | second class people | MDSUPT::FORSON | | Wed Jun 24 1992 16:37 | 47 |
| Well, I personally expected alot more activity on a subject of this
nature. My only guess is that this topic is too hot for anyone to
venture any opinions. I have heard the rumors but have seen no official
statements. This is dispite the fact that I have sent my manager 2
different memo's requesting clarification. Several other managers
have refused to answer my direct, face to face questions as well.
Interesting.......
My thoughts are simple. I feel it is a not so well thought out plan
that Digital service took as a wholesale, top-of-the-line,
no-questions-asked insult. I truely believe that the C.O.E board
thought that field would scarcely notice, or care, that they where
excluded from "another award". Instead, emotions are very high and
no one wants to step up and say "that was my idea". If you look around
your region, the people that attended this in the past where the same
ones from the year before. I asked a personell manager how many field
types attend, and before he figured out that he had sliped, he said
"about 2%".
It doesn't take alot of memory power to remember the field service
vidios that circulated around in the mid to late 80's showing field
service engineers wearing yellow blazers and plaid ties and being put
on trial for replacing HDA's without following the "checklist".
Sales, and to some extent software, have always looked down there nose
at the field. To be truthful, we used that to our advantage in the
early 80's when FS was "one heck of a machine", and the business
allowed it. But field service has grow up. Everybody in the industry
has come to grips with that fact except our own corporation. Look at
how your office is layed out. Field service on one floor and , I'll
wager, sales and software on another. Team concepts look great on
the paper but, it seams, has little to do with day-to-day business.
I think our involvement with Sales' awards is in about the same
proportions as Sales perceives our involvement with there day to day
selling. The whole concept of a cash prize "not to exceed $500" is
about right with the way the corporation views the value of Digital
service. I take that as the greatest insult a corporation can
hand an employee/orginization.
I will wait to here from my manager, after they feel the situation
has cooled down enough to talk about again. Who knows, they may even
cancel the idea to exclude DS. I've seen flips in policy bigger then
this in shorted spans of time. But only if everyone mentions to there
manager that this is a bad idea......
Jim
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1926.17 | testing, testing, ... | MOCA::BELDIN_R | All's well that ends | Wed Jun 24 1992 18:19 | 7 |
| One of the standard methods of evaluating controversial ideas is to let
them out as rumors and listen to the reactions. If people keep quiet,
a bad message may get passed on. Those who feel this is wrong had best
speak up or feel the consequences later. (This of course, assuming you
are not concerned about raising your visibility.)
/rab
|
1926.18 | | JMPSRV::MICKOL | Winning with Xerox in '92 | Wed Jun 24 1992 20:23 | 5 |
| Re: .16: Well, I'm not sure that many Digital Services Individual Contributors
every believed that they were eligible for COE. Therefore, an
announcement they they are, in fact, ineligible isn't cause for much
discussion.
|
1926.19 | DS Specialists = FRUs | NEWVAX::PAVLICEK | Zot, the Ethical Hacker | Wed Jun 24 1992 21:02 | 30 |
| re: .17
Keep in mind that this is NOT a rumor. It has been communicated to our
area (GSG or whatever acronym we are this week) as well. Our unit has a
meeting with our District Mgr on Tuesday to discuss this new policy.
It's a done deal -- that's what we've been told.
People aren't speaking out because:
1. Fear that "he who speaks, leaves"
2. Many of us never thought we really had much of chance anyway
(politics, favorite sons/daughters, weak district numbers yield
few slots, your assignment must be "COE"-able [has to be
crucial enough to merit your consideration], etc.)
3. Some are hoping that the absence of COE might let us keep our
Plan A cars (for a little longer, anyway)
Besides, look at the trend in our software services business: We want
to be Systems Integrators. We will give people the "big picture" on
how to get all these different boxes to work together. We are using
more and more contract labor because we can't compete on cost unless we
use limited numbers of our people on contracts (customers figured out
that the "Digital difference" is about the same with six DEC people as
it is with 5 contractors and one DEC person). So, the emphasis is more
and more on "project managers" and less and less on "those who do".
Now, keep that in mind and re-read #1 above. 'Nuf said, I'm afraid.
-- Russ
|
1926.20 | | APACHE::N25480::FRIEDRICHS | Keep'm straight 'n level | Thu Jun 25 1992 18:40 | 8 |
| Well, I have asked around some of the EICs and no one has heard
anything (although the thought of it made a number of them shudder!).
They all claimed that organizing the budget is the primary concern
right now and COE nominations aren't till July..
jeff
|
1926.21 | Any late-breaking news? | DWOVAX::EROS | Talkin' Homer, Ozzie and the Straw | Tue Jul 28 1992 14:46 | 54 |
| Has anyone heard more on this? The word from DS management here is that
they've heard nothing to indicate that we're excluded from COE. On the
other hand, there's been no info received on slots either, even though
the nomination process appears to be proceeding normally in the sales
and sales support organizations.
If this rumor turns out to be fact, it just compounds the feeling of
frustration I get at the mixed messages we receive:
---------------
"We've all got to pull together here 'cause we're
all part of the sales team: sales, support and services"
---------------
"Why yes, that training _is_ free. Wait, you're not
in Digital Services, are you? Oh... In that case,
we'll have to charge your cost center $2400."
---------------
"Remember, we're all in this together! Sales, support
and services! So, go out there and grab that business!"
---------------
"...and after the overview seminar, you'll each receive
a laptop PC. We think that it's important for you to
get the tools you need to improve productivity and increase
customer exposure to our product set. Wait, you're not
in Digital Services, are you? Oh... In that case,
you'll have to order one yourself through the Employee
Purchase Program. But we'll let you pay for it through
payroll deduction."
---------------
"We sink or swim together. If you don't want to be
involved in the sales effort, then you're not the sort
of person we want in the sales team. We're _all_ part
of the sales team: sales, support and services."
---------------
"...a few days in Hawaii, with your spouse, of course. It's
our way of recognizing those individual contributors who've
made that leap from average or even above average to truly
excellent performance this last year. Wait, you're not
in Digital Services, are you? Oh..."
---------------
-- Tony
|
1926.22 | | DUGROS::ROSS | Sweating to the oldies | Tue Jul 28 1992 22:50 | 20 |
| It is definitly true. No individual contributors will be eligible
for COE for last FY.
In fact, about a month ago I got a call from a certain VP within
Digital who had been forwarded {unauthorized} a copy of the note I
entered as .1 to this note by a member of the Digital Personnel
organization {I know who it was, too}. The VP claimed that the
decision to eliminate COE for individual contributors in Digital
Services had been made back in December (!) and that he could not
believe that the information had not been disseminated to the field
yet. He also told me that it was attitudes like mine that were the
reason DEC was losing so much money. I told him the attitude
expressed in .1 was anecdotal and the result of an emotional response
to an unfair decision and hardly reflected the work I do every day to
sell Digital and bring in revenue as a software consultant.
I was bothered more by the fact that there are people in Digital
Personnel who act as snitches than by the fact that this VP took
time out of his schedule to confront me over my opinion. At least
this VP gave me pleny of time to give my views on the subject.
|
1926.23 | Sheesh | SCAACT::AINSLEY | Less than 150 kts is TOO slow | Tue Jul 28 1992 23:19 | 11 |
| re: .22
>yet. He also told me that it was attitudes like mine that were the
>reason DEC was losing so much money. I told him the attitude
I just re-read .1 and I don't see the attitude problem the VP was
referring to. Maybe the VP is one of the "good news only" VPs that
doesn't want to be disturbed by reality.
Bob
|
1926.24 | | JMPSRV::MICKOL | We won with Xerox in '92 | Wed Jul 29 1992 01:16 | 12 |
| > the fact that we need to INCREASE services delivery headcount by at
> least a factor of two while cutting management by 50%. We also need
The VP was probably ticked off about the above statement from .1. Any attitude
that would threaten his job is clearly not a good attitude...
Regards,
Jim
|
1926.25 | another pernicious attitude in .1 | SGOUTL::BELDIN_R | D-Day: 245 days and counting | Wed Jul 29 1992 09:13 | 11 |
| based on some personal experiences, I might suggest that this is what
offends the VP
>Gee, just what I want after spending 30-50% of
>the year away from my family - a three day trip away from them.
You aren't demonstrating adequate company loyalty if you have any
desire for a normal family life. :-( (but, maybe that's just old
tapes for me!)
Dick
|
1926.26 | You posted it; expect people to read it | SMAUG::GARROD | Floating on a wooden DECk chair | Thu Jul 30 1992 18:42 | 20 |
| Re .22
While I disagree with the VP that objected to your tone I also fail to
understand why you are upset that the VP saw your note. You posted .1
in a notesfile that is explicitly accessible by all Digital employees.
The VP that saw your note is a Digital employee. You should have had
every expectation that he may have seen your note. Nobody broke any
rules (or in my mind norms) by bringing your note to his/her attention.
I often extract notes from non-restricted conferences and forward them
to Digital employees. I'll continue to do so. If you don't want
something seen by a Digital employee don't post it in a notes file that
is accessible to all Digital employees.
To be honest I'd be happy that you got an opportunity to get your point
across to someone that is responsible for the decision making. If I
were you I'd thank the person that brought the note to the attention of
the appropriate person rather than be annoyed at them.
Dave
|
1926.27 | | SDSVAX::SWEENEY | Will I make it to my 18th Anniversary? | Thu Jul 30 1992 20:11 | 23 |
| Dave,
Since you are experienced with this form of communication, I have
trouble believing that you believe that it is anything but a "chill" on
the expression of ideas and opinions that nameless people are sifting
through the vast quantity of material here, taking it out of the
context of debate and presenting this to a vice president that one
doesn't even work for, and saying "gotcha, Dave" or "gotcha, Pat".
I got this treatment once a long time ago for saying something as
innocuous as "groups X and Y aren't working together". I was asked to
defend it and I said "we invite them and they never come, they never
invite us, thanks for showing interest, now, are you going to do
something about it or what?" We had to preserve the appearance of an
absence of conflict rather than actually work together.
I wrote that, and I always write with the expectation that nameless
gnomes want to embarrass me, or even embarrass Digital externally with
what I write here. Careful writing, free of sarcasm and ridicule is my
goal. It's part of the insane politicized degeneration of Digital that
we have to worry about the nameless thought police running off to, at
least in theory, powerful vice presidents who will not refute ideas or
opinions but intimidate writers into silence.
|
1926.28 | forwarding | SSDEVO::EGGERS | Anybody can fly with an engine. | Sun Aug 02 1992 00:41 | 11 |
| Re: .-1
You may consider it a chill. Perhaps it is, but it is reality.
Anybody who posts a note in any non-restricted notes conference (and
perhaps even the restricted ones) had better think long and hard about
posting anything they don't want forwarded to the most embarrassing
possible person.
Dave Garrod knows about that possibility, and whether or not he
considers it a "chill" simply doesn't make any difference to the
reality. He merely stated the reality.
|
1926.29 | Knowing a note can be extracted breeds responsibility | SMAUG::GARROD | Floating on a wooden DECk chair | Sun Aug 02 1992 01:19 | 33 |
| Re .-2
I don't consider it a "chill" at all to know that any note I post could
be forwarded to another Digital employee. In fact I consider it a
necessary check and balance that serves to naturally moderate a notes
conference (as you know I'm fundamentally opposed to a notesfile
moderator acting as a censor -- but that's a different issue), knowing
that one's words could be spread encourages responsibility in what one
says.
What I hope happens is that if somebody sends an extracted note to
someone else and they have nothing but malicious intent I hope the
recipient is sensible enough to get annoyed with the sender, not the
writer.
I personally try to only state:
a) Facts
b) Opinions that I'm happy to be read by all Digital employees
I also believe that if you want to complain about something or somebody
then you should have the 'guts' to complain to the person that runs
that something, or that somebody.
It'll be a sad day if the central DEC politbureau mandate that notes
can't be extracted. It was a major mistake in my opinion to effectively
make mail messages the 'property' of the sender and not the receiver
when a policy was written to prevent mail messages from being posted in
notesfiles.
Dave
|
1926.30 | | SSDEVO::EGGERS | Anybody can fly with an engine. | Sun Aug 02 1992 01:25 | 8 |
| Re: .-1
Disagree with you on that one, Dave. I regard the "don't post VAXmail
without persmission" rule akin to an implicit copyright.
Actually, I do it anyway, but only when I am prepared to take complete
responsibility, including the author's wrath, for violating the rule.
Nobody has every complained about the occasions when I've done it.
|