Conference 7.286::digital

    Too many holes:
    
    Voicemail overflows from incomming calls because of extended trips.
    Voicemail goes bonkers.
    The message gets lost.
                      
    The caller lies.
    
    Who is to police this?  What is the time frame for callback?
    
    
    Better yet is to make responsiveness a part of the performance
    appraisal system.  It certainly is part of mine but I am not in either
    Sales or Sales Support.
    

    I remember when i worked in EDS, we had a 'rule' that one *should*
    respond to phone calls and e-mail that are business related, within a 24 
    hours, even if just to acknowledge it and to say that one is looking at
    it. The rule applies whether the e-mail or the call came from outside
    or inside the company.

    The philosophy was that even inside the company, we should treat each others
    as customers, and hence you do not not respond back to a customer
    quickly.

    I thought that was a good 'rule', it seems to me that in DEC , our rule 
    is 24 months instead of 24 hours, if any...

    /Nasser

    
    
    What I can't understand (in some groups) is that person A in his/her
    office and person B who resides in the next office is out of there
    office.  Person B's phone rings and person A refuses to answer.
    Now three rings later the Department Coordinator has to answer or
    worse yet "voice-mail".  The person whoever is on the other end,
    and god only hopes it's not an already frustrated customer has
    to wait for the ring, the answer, for the department coordinator
    to see if person A can take the call...forth with, "A" should have
    answered in the first place.
    
    Comon folks....we need to work smarter here, challenge yourselves
    to answer the phone (or mail) in a professional manner and timeframe.
    So you have to pick-up someones line, no big deal..It may not make
    a difference to you, but it sure would to that frustrated customer.
    
    Think about it......then there is nor need for a penalty!
    
    Bob Montville
    Customer Services

    We already have a topic discussing this in detail.

    I could support .0's suggestion, but only if we got rid of the damned
    voise-mail, and put some real secretaries in place again.  I would
    also require folks who deal with customers to have cellular phones,
    period.
    
    On using the phone professionally....Amen!  It still blows my mind
    when DECies, in an office environment, answer the phone "hello"....

    >On using the phone professionally....Amen!  It still blows my mind
    >when DECies, in an office environment, answer the phone "hello"....
    
    Hear, hear! That's one of my pet peeves, too.
    
    Mike

    
    I'm going to ignore the line about "real secretaries".  
    
    There is the opposite side of the person who answers the phone "hello". 
    It's the person calling who expects that whoever answers the phone will
    recognize their voice.  They then get upset or annoyed that they get
    asked "who's calling?"
    

    .0's idea is good but unenforceable. Amore practical approach may be a
    $10 fine, to be matched be the cost center manager. Perhaps when the
    cost center manager starts seeing his/her operating funds depleting for
    this reason then there may be some accountability for returning phone
    calls. I wish I had a nickel for everyone I've tried to get in touch
    with but can't because they're at Decworld.

    And I, as a secretary, wish I had a nickel for every message I took
    that wasn't responded to!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    
    -anonymous
    

Of course you shouldn't answer the telephone "Hello?" or "Hello!".












You should answer "Ici, ici".




		:-)

					- - Steve

   Re: .10
   
   "Here, Here"?  Is this how it's done in France?  I never got that out
   of my 2 years of French in HS.  (I did learn quite a number of cuss
   words however.)
   
   
   Re: phone ettiquette (sp?)
   
   My mother was director of purchasing for a Fortune 500 company.  It
   got to the point that I didn't want to get together with my folks
   anymore.  She would rag on me continually about how Digital really
   wasn't interested in taking her $2M/year and if she had any say in
   the matter she would bar Digital from the list of eligble vendors to
   her company.  
   
   But when she got tired of that she would rag on me over "where do you
   get your receptionists?!?"  She would always complain about the phone
   manners of those at our office switchboards.  It didn't matter which
   office she called.  After a while I got tired of listening to this
   and called those offices myself pretending to be a customer.  I
   called multiple times---at different times---over the course of a
   couple of weeks.  SHE WAS RIGHT!
   
   Suggestions to the facilities managers involved proved fruitless. 
   "They were there to route calls, not as a customer interface." was
   the response.  Say "Huh?"

Re: .5, .6 et al:

So, what are your suggestions for answering the phone? If I call someone and 
they answer the phone with "Good Afternoon, XYZ Company, Foobar Department, 
Jane Doe speaking, may I help you" I almost always try to interrupt the 
diatribe. I usually know who I called! Please don't waste my time.

I answer my phone as succinctly as possible: "Jim Mickol here..."
And being in Sales Support, I get quite a few calls from customers.

Regards,

Jim

    also the problem with telling your name when answering the phone, is
    that the bill collector could be the one calling ...
    
    i think the best way to answer the phone is like this: Hello, who is
    calling please ?
    
    right?
    
    /nasser

    Best yet... What if we all post their names in this notes file.
    
    It can contain the following info 
    
    			 : Name
    			   Group
    		           Date and Time called
    		           Ph Number for returning the call, in case
    			        he/she reads this notes file.
                           Reason for the call ( Optional):
    
    Author shall delete the note after the person actually returns the call.
    This is beacuse sometimes a person may not receive the message and
    hence he/she gets the benifit of the doubt.
    
    If not it stays ON for ever ! Some thing like a WALL OF SHAME ;-) Worst
    offenders gets an Excellence ( shame ) award at the end of each year !
    
    Jay
    
    

	Re .11

>>   Re: .10 [Ici, ici]
>>   "Here, Here"?  Is this how it's done in France?  

	Actually, a fairly common response in France 
	is "Oui, j'�coute" - literally "Yes, I'm listening".  

	It sounds marginally less abrupt in French.

	Jim

    
    I've noticed that the biggest problem is that nobody even bothers to
    answer a phone. I've done these observations as a customer and also
    now, when I'm in Digital.
    
    When you answer the phone, the name is enough and all the other "shit
    talkings" should be avoided.
    
    We need productivity and this is one way to do it.

    Somebody (.5?) made a comment against voicemail.  I like it.  I made a
    resolution a long time ago to always return phone calls.  Near as I can
    tell, I've been able to keep that resolution.
    
    And now, with voicemail, I can let everyone who calls know where I am
    that day and about how long it will take before I can call them back.
    And the caller can leave me a message.  When I check my voicemail, I
    hear the message first hand.  And I can check for messages from
    anywhere with a phone - the airport, hotel, DECworld floor, customer
    site, anywhere.  
    
    If I get the message at midnight, I can still return the call and leave
    a voicemail for the caller.  Lots of times, we can take care of
    something without ever talking directly to eachother.
    
    Voicemail is a great tool if used properly.  I understand the frustration 
    expressed in .5.  But the problem is not the tool's fault.
    
    - Greg

    Try being the one the switchboard puts all the "We don't
    know what the **** this person wants, so send the call to Lynne"
    calls to!  I have rec'd sum real hum-dingers, let me tell ya!
    
    Lynne

    re .18
    
    I used to be a switchboard operator.  Got a call once from someone
    asking where the nearest phone was (for real).

	For the most part, I'm a supporter of voice mail.
    The voice mail system we have here in the Littleton area
    however, has one major flaw IMHO involving the automatic
    password change procedure.
    
FLAME ON:

	For the third time now, I have missed hearing/getting
    any warning of an upcoming password change on my voice mail
    account.  The net result is that when I do eventually get a
    message, I hear the busy-buzz dial tone and go to dial into
    the voice mail system, but then I can't log into my friggin
    voice mail account to get it because my password automatically
    changed on me!  What's even worse is that it always takes up
    to 24 hours to get any response from our voice mail support
    person.  Here is response I consistently get each time:

From:	(name changed to protect the guilty)
To:	TOOK::DMCLURE
CC:	
Subj:	VOICEMAIL ADMINISTRATOR NOTIFICATION

     ........................................................
      7-MAY-1992 10:45:50.40

     Notification is for: took::dmclure

     During a Voicemail System audit we noticed that your

     password expired.  It has been reset to your five

     digit extension entered 3 TIMES (15 digit password.)

     Please reset password after logging in.
     .......................................................


	I suppose it makes sense to have passwords automatically
    changed, but the "system" should force you to enter a new
    password the next time you dial in to get messages, but it
    doesn't.  Instead, when the password expires, it is always
    reset to something else.  Then, the VOICEMAIL ADMINISTRATOR
    sends me the generic mail message and resets it again to the
    same stupid phone extension three times garbage each time.
    Boy do I feel safe with such a heavy-duty password encryption
    algorithm (NOT!)

	Since I'm at my desk most of the time, I sometimes go
    for a week or two at a time without getting any new voicemail
    Consequently, I don't dial into the voicemail system for weeks
    at a time either, so I hardly ever hear the warning telling me
    to change my password.  In the meantime, my password may have
    expired and I don't find out about it until I try to dial in
    again and can't.  Can you imagine if you were locked-out of
    your computer user account after not having changed your
    password prior to some arbitrary date?  This is absurd!

    	If the idea in the basenote were ever implemented, then
    I'd potentially be out $100 every couple of months.

    			    -davo

p.s.	This time I've got my next voice mail password expiration
	date engraved in blood on my calendar!  How ridiculous!

Oh yeah, FLAME OFF...

    Furthermore, you can't have "no password".  Is this
    corporate paranoia, or what?
    
    Look, I don't care about phone message security.  I don't
    get any secret messages.   If you really want to come
    into my office and play with my voicemail account, that's
    fine by me.  I don't feel the need for a 15-digit password
    just to stop someone using my goddamn telephone answering
    machine.

    Actually, my understanding is that voice mail scams/criminal activities
    are doing pretty well these days.  There's a lot of things that an
    unauthorized user could potentially do.
    
    And while you might not have any "secret messages", I certainly don't
    want just anybody picking up my voicemail, or even sending voicemail to
    someone else on the system pretending to be me (which is possible).
    
    In fact, with some of the more sophisticated systems, an unauthorized
    voice mail user is really not all that different from an unauthorized
    computer user.
    
    Though I would have to say there are certainly some systems out that
    have better implementations then others.
    
    Oh;  and while we're on the topic of pet peeves;  People shouldn't be
    allowed to use voice mail unless they record a personal greeting.  I
    love calling people at LKG and getting "The person at extension 6xxxx
    is not available" ('course I hear your phones don't even have message
    lights; must be like the dark ages ;-)
    
    --Scott

    Don't get me started!!!  It's the height of idiocy NOT to have 'em...
    
    But we do NOT have 'em...
    
    :-(
    

The voicemail system in our office is pretty darn good... excellent
'human engineering'... you can 'type ahead' and it doesn't choke! No
'changing passwords' either. Very nice interface to my pager as well... I
can easily change pager numbers and what numbers are put into the
display.

Same voicemail system at my (resident) customer site... makes life a lot
easier.

Lee

At least you folks HAVE voicemail.   I think we're the only Digital location
that doesn't.

Getting messages from my secretary on the first try has about a 50% hit rate.
She's never at her desk...but my messages are.  And then its rarely more than
a name and number, if that.

It got so bad that one customer actually gave me a voicemail account on their
system, and leaves messages there for me!  Talk about absurd...

Bob

    ..sounds like you need a new secretary....
    
    

    Or an answering machine.
    
    Hillel
    

  Well you are not the only one.  We don't have voice mail in Dayton either.
 
  But I do feel the need to respond to the remark on the secretary/phones
  comment.  While I cannot speak for your secretary, let me tell you why
  our secretary is only at her desk 50% of the time.  We use to have 2 
  people to help with our sales area we are now down to 1. She is the only
  full-time secretary in Sales, the other Sales department has run on temps 
  for 2  years.  She is responsible for 14 peoples phones and supports 7 reps 
  and  2 managers and every one else who comes to Dayton "for the day".  

   Every call that no one else can answer comes to her, along with every other
   issue that no one else can handle 'cause it ain't their job, or they don't
   know how.  Don't forget to allow time for distributing mail, FAXing, copying
   and all the other little errands she gets sent on. 

   If they want a proposal and they want it done in DECwrite, she can't
   even get a windowing terminal on her desk to access my VAXstation.  She 
   has to leave her desk and the phones to come to my desk to use DECwrite.
   I guess I feel so bad for her - 'cause I had the job before and the situation
   has gotten so much worse than when I was there.  

   So basically we're all hurting here.  The pain is not isolated.  Voice mail
   would help us here too.  It's not the end-all, be-all, but it would help
   with some of the problems we're faced with.

   just my 2 cents worth.

    /tn

    Good (Morning or Afternoon), Digital Equipment Corporation, How May I
    Help You?
    
    Good (Morning or Afternoon), "your name", How May I Help You?
    
    Courtesy, Attitude and willingness to help whomever has taken the time
    to call us.

Re: .25

>At least you folks HAVE voicemail.   I think we're the only Digital location
>that doesn't.

You may be the only location in the US, but certainly not in the rest of the
world...

Digital isn't only in the States you know...

re: .30

I'm sorry... I don't see anything in my comments that indicate a lack of 
recognition that Digital is an international company.   

Bob

Re: .31

OK, it's just that Voicemail is an American product (AT&T ?) and the 
rest-of-the-world doesn't see much of it !

- so you can't possibly be the "only Digital location" that doesn't have
voicemail....most of us don't :-)

Ahhh Gi'day...�

    They have  it  at  the  UNT facility in Munich.  Only place outside the
    states that I know of that has it...

    Some of my friends who work for competitors here in Brussels use
    voicemail, and express surprise that we don't. But then, modems are a
    management perk here.
    
    Laurie.

The voicemail product that we just got in ZKO2, VOICE:mail (tm) has some
DEC connection -- I think we actually sell it or something.

	I think the corporation uses a variety of different Voicemail
    systems depending on what's available in the locale.  The system
    with the lousy password changing procedure I was complaining about
    is provided by Northern Telecom and is release #5 of the "Meridian
    Mail Voice Messaging" system.  I think this system is in use at
    various sites in and around the Littleton/Acton/Stow area.

    				  -davo

    The VoiceMail product in use in MKO, TTB, and increasing parts of ZKO
    is Voice:mail (tm), developed by VoiceSoft corp.
    
    To quote the sales update on it...
    
    VOICEmail, produced by VOICEsoft of Rocklin, CA, provides a strategic
    solution for voice mail and call processing using VAX VMS systems.  The
    VOICEmail software has unique features and is designed to take advantage of
    Digital's current capabilities and key strategic directions, including
    ALL-IN-1 Phase II, the Compound Document Architecture (CDA), Enterprise
    Networking based on Network Application Support (NAS), and Computer
    Integrated Telephony (CIT).
    
    To summarize more of the details, it runs on a Vax 4000, with DEC DTC
    hardware. It scales well, up to several thousand users.
    
    Meridian, on the other hand, is a PABX hack. (It's in use in AKO, LTN,
    LKG, LJO, DSG et al)
    
    q
    

re .-1:

How do I get a compound document over the phone?

    Must have been a marketing person on a roll... At a wild guess, a fully
    integrated system would allow you to "forward" voice packets to real
    net mail addresses... Or they are simply using our CDA technology under
    their product... (Hey, who said they could do that!)
    
    q
    

    To follow-up on my Meridian Mail flame, I have since discovered:

    (1)	There real humans at the other end of that electronic mail
	support account which generates what look like automated
	mail messages informing you of your new password.

    (2) It looks as though the automatic password changing procedure
	will be fixed in an upcoming release.  The new system will
	allow users to enter a new password *prior* to becoming
	locked-out of one's voicemail account.  Yay!
	
				-davo

    re .38 (Gerald)
    
    Build a shelf !
    
    :-)
    
    John

    .23:
    
    Phones at MR have the lights.
    
    The PBX(s), though, don't have the additional circuitry to make them
    light.  I was told that this was too expensive (at the princely sum of
    $1.xx per phone, if memory serves).
    
    Dick

    >Great idea for making DEC more effective: Whenever someone fails to
    >return a phone call, their salary is reduced $100.
    >What do you think?

    so if you were a product manager and at the height of your project you
    were getting 40 calls a day and 100 VAXmail messages and you had a lot
    of project related work to do would you call back everyone with a
    question that could be answered by them reading the last Sales Update
    article or about a product that isn't even announced yet and won't be
    if you don't get your work done.

    Some people are more productive to this company when they are not on
    the phone.

    
    The way I see it, if you don't return phone calls, either you don't get
    your work done, or someone else doesn't get their work done. If they
    are calling you, it will probably effect you or your product in some
    way if you fail to respond.
    
    /prc

    And eventually that will affect the customer (internal or external).

    everything eventually does, the question is where does one spend time
    to do the most good and what process takes care of the exceptions that
    are really important.

    Yesterday I recieved a call from a SW vendor sales rep Orlando FL 
    describing an opportunity and he wanted to work with DEC. He also said 
    that he has been trying to talk to a DEC the sales rep for past 30 days and 
    she has not returned his phone calls. Yesterday I left messages for her 
    as well as her sales unit manager.They have not called me back.I am going 
    to leave messages for both for next one week on  daily basis till they 
    return the call. If they do not return the call in next 7 days, I plan to publish 
    the names of these people in this notes file and also copy their VP
    sales.
    
    Jay
      

    Sending their names up the chain would be a good idea ... and
    appropriate.  Posting them here would not.

    re: .47

    A call from "a software vendor who wants to work with DEC on an
    opportunity" may be a nuisance call and nothing more.

    Some of these calls turn into endless discussions that involve
    tin-cupping for development equipment, trade show support, leads, and
    even cash by that vendor.

    Of course, this may be a real hot genuine end-user sale of
    significance, but I wanted to show the other side.  A lot of calls come
    in that are nothing but time-wasters.  Don't be so quick to judge.

    
    Re: .49
    
    What you say is certainly true, but how can you know which ones
    are worth pursuing and which are not if you don't return the calls?
    
    Steve
    

    
    ... of course, we'll never know until we ANSWER THE DANMED PHONE!!
    

    
    Actually as I think of it, I am reminded of my days as a product
    manager when dozens of customers used to call with me questions which
    had nothing to do with the products that I managed.  I asked them
    why often enough to understand that Digital employees in the field,
    (at least at the time 1983-1987) were as a group very unresponsive.
    In the words of one customer, "I'm calling you because I know you'll
    help me."
    
    fwiw,
    Steve
    

    i think we should have a rule about this issue in DEC, if you dont return 
    your calls and messages within, ..uhmm.. say one year (... we dont want to
    push it too much..), a warning will be issued against you at the end of 
    the same calendar year you received the message that you still did not
    respond to.
    
    5 such warnings should generate a sever warning against the said person. 
    (but if you do respond any time between the fifth warning is reached, the 
    counter goes back to zero, and we start all over again. ( this will
    give people an incentive to respond quickly )
    
    5 sever warnings, and that is it, you lose one day's pay ! no if's and
    but's about it..
    
    we got to take a stand here !
    
    this thing is getting out of hand !
    
    thank you,
    /nasser

    
    ...of course, the 1-day salary deduction will take place in conjunction
    with the salary adjustment that occurs immediately after the salary planning
    period scheduled immediately after the fifth severe warning is issued,
    to ensure timely reinforcement.
    
    :-)/2
    

I suggest we set up a task force with a few subcommittees to study 
this issue....

    
    Why don't we appoint a V.P. or two to look into this????
    
    

    This was bouncing around in mail a while ago, it seems appropriate for 
    this topic,
    i removed the names of who forwarded it around, it has no private
    stuff in it, so i guess i can post it , if moderator think i should
    not post it , feel free to delete it..

    i sure hope things like this below dont happen too often..

    -----------------------------------------------------------------
Subj:	My plumbing supplier and DEC

I had an interesting experience over the weekend; I had a plumbing problem. 
So, I went to the local plumbing supplier to get some parts I needed. While 
I was there, I chatted a bit with the owner of the store. When he found out 
I worked for DEC (his store is in Maynard near the Mill), he said. "You
know, a couple of guys are coming in to sell me some personal computers
from DEC this week." I said "Great! What will you do with them?" He then
described software he wanted to use (estimates, designing bathrooms, etc.)
I said it sounded like DEC could take care of him. 

Then he said "You know something? It has taken 2 years to get a salesman to
come and see me?" "What?" I said, "You're kidding." He said, "No I'm not. 
If I didn't do a lot of business with DEC I would have given up by now. I 
first called them 2 years ago, and they told me they were selling their PCs 
through vendors. I called the vendor they gave me. The representative came 
in, and told me I could do better than DEC. I said `but I want DEC. Aren't 
you a DEC supplier?' She said she was, but told me I could do better with 
some Japanese model she had. She was so persistent, I finally asked her to 
leave the store. You know, DEC should get to know the people they have 
selling their stuff." 

By this time I was fascinated. "Then what happened?" He said, "Well, IBM 
came in, on their own. I told them what I wanted to do (and told them I 
would probably buy DEC), but they did up a proposal and brought it in 2 
weeks later. They were going to sell me 3 PCs and some software for $25K. 
They called me by phone every two weeks after that. Very polite, but
very persistent." 

"I was still determined to buy DEC, so I called again. They referred me to
someone in Marlboro. I called her and was told she was on vacation for 2
weeks. I waited the 2 weeks and called. She told me I had to talk to
someone else. I called them. They sent me back to her. By now I'm
frustrated; IBM is still calling every 2 weeks. Even my wife said to buy
IBM. `To h*ll with DEC if they don't have their act more together than
that.' But, I do a lot of business with DEC, and want to buy DEC." 

I was in a hurry to go fix a leaky faucet, but was really engrossed. "So
what did you do?" "I did the only thing I knew to do," he said. "I called
Ken Olsen's office. I used to be his plumber and thought maybe he could get
me an inside track." (An inside track! To buy our computers!) "How long ago
was that?" I asked. "Oh, a few months ago. They're coming in this week. He
must've pulled some strings." "Yeah." I said. "He has a lot of power." 

As I was leaving, he said, "I hear they're having more layoffs there." I
said, "Yes, probably. *You* shouldn't be surprised." He said. "No. Not
really." 

    re: .57
    
    Shouldn't be a problem posting this here, since I first saw that
    message in a NOTES conference sometime ago.
    
    Might very well be in HERE somewhere already...
    
    -- Russ

    Are the cars of our sales reps furnished with cellular phones?
    I have an Uncle who works for Sun. The company furnishes his
    car with one and he swears it is his most valuable tool in sales.
    The traffic in the Bay area can be a bear as anyone who lives
    there or has vistited knows. He calls his voice mail and returns
    calls while in transit. Do we? If so great if not let's get going.
    
    Jim C.
    
    

    
    Wasn't there a specific ruling *against* cellular phones for sales
    reps?
    

    
>    Wasn't there a specific ruling *against* cellular phones for sales
>    reps?

	I seem to remember that there was at one time but that it was later
	overridden by someone named Ken Olsen. Of course that doesn't mean
	that some sales reps didn't have them before that  or that some others
	have been denied them since.

			Alfred

    I believe this is strictly an account group decision. If you can
    substantiate the business need to your manager, you can get one. The
    managers typically limit it to a dollar value per month. Well, that's
    the way it works in NJ.

The Orange Book (Personnel Policy book) was recently updated with a new policy
with respect to Cellular Telephones. It basicly is approved on a per account or
by approval of your VP. I think the dollar limit specified is $150 per month.

Joe