Conference 7.286::digital

How about a big one:

The facility planning in DEC is crazy.  It is much more expensive to
have a lot of small facilities than to have a few big ones.  You have to
pay for separate facilities staff, telephones, and computer support
staff.  DEC seems to just rent a new building when it needs space.

For example, in the Garbage State we have the following offices:

 2 Cherry Hill
 1 Holmedel
 1 Manalapan
 1 Mays Landing
 2 Parsippany
 2 Piscataway
 1 Princeton
 2 Saddle Brook
----------------
12 Offices Total

N.J. is a very small state  geographically.  You can drive the length
of the N.J. Turnpike in 2.5 hours.  Two well placed offices would
probably put 90% of the business within an hour's drive.

It's a silly enough situation in NJ, but when you look as the number of
facilities in MA it's absolutely ludicrous.

John

    Forms that have to be filled in when when a paperless solution is
    much more cost-effective eg Milage Claim forms
    
    Secretaries who work for less than five people: its not the
    secretaries fault, but the fault of status conscious managers who
    are reluctant to learn to use the products that earn their 
    high-level salaries.
    
    And a repeat of .1, except my secretary has not the time to list
    the numerous facilities in Massachusetts and New Hamshire - they
    take up 10 times as much space in the Telephone Directory as New
    Jersey!

    How about getting rid of Notes...
    
    And 
    
    Lat lines...
    
    David Buswell
    

    
    How about these massive, foam padded envelopes with 2 thick pieces of
    cardboard inside to protect...
    
    
    
    a single piece of paper!
    
    DEC is also the leader in a box, inside a box, inside a box, inside a
    box packing technology!
    
    Let's save some money and stop generating so much trash!
    

    How about Software contracts with Vendors that run into the
    Millions. Maybe if we really have a need for some huge
    projects we could recruit specifically for that project
    from within DEC somewhat like the "All hands on DEC" project
    where once completed the workers go back to their original
    jobs etc. At least that way the $$$$ stays within the company.

    Dividing this company along functional lines is a huge waste because it
    requires numerous hours of time being spent in meeting trying to obtain
    resources from other groups instead of getting work done. Also, this
    often involves a lot expensive and time consuming travel...
    
    -George

    1. 5 sheets of paper sent via a 12" x 9" x 1" cardboard box.  Seems
       like a cheap paper envelope would have been cheaper.  The option
       number for the stuff was BY-100AA-3Z5.2 VAX FORTRAN V5.2 DOC
       ONLY.  Came from WMO.
    
    2. Do we really need a multi-million (? $7M+ ?) Gulfstream IV Bizjet?

    Workstations on every desk?!?  How about only if you really NEED
    it.  I think that "Secretary's Row" should have access to one for
    graphics, etc... but All-in-1 is displayed fine on a terminal. 
    The same for managers who only use a terminal for mail, text, etc...
    
    I agree with the expensive facilities... we've got some locations
    in some very 'pricey' areas... and some facilities with a lot of
    vacancies.
    
    

Perhaps if each of us spent Digital's money as carefully as we do our own?


Example :  How often do we really look at our airline tickets?  A few
           years ago I was able to 'save' almost $300.00 on a round trip
           ticket to California - side trip to Colorado - simply by asking
           the travel department to rebook on one of the advertised flights.
           At that time the airlines were competing and it was possible to do
           some real bargain shopping.  The 'new' tickets did require that I
           change planes in Phoenix or somewhere, but it was no big deal.

Betty

    For starters do we really need to *move* people and objects around
    within our office areas so often? The last time we moved, each of
    the twenty-plus people in our group spent 1-3 days packing/unpacking,
    at least a week groping around trying to get back on the system/finding
    the printers/rescheduling meetings/finding the conference rooms/replacing 
    broken equipment/complaining about the move. Not to mention all the 
    money we paid the movers. And this for a move within the same building 
    to another floor.
    
      - Ganesh
    

    How about putting in a small, quiet, portable fan in every cube 
    and going easy on the air-conditioners this summer. I wonder if 
    this would save us $$$ on the electricity bills.
    
     - ganesh
     

    
    How about multiple DECWORLD's, Benefit booklets,
    and other assorted mailing to the same home? 
    Before I got married it was three per house! 
    Now I have it down to me and my husband. 
    
    

	Fans move around air they don't usually remove the heat. Also the
	very moving heats up the air as do the motors. Air conditioning
	gets the heat out of the building. FYI, I don't know if the heaters
	ever run in this building. The computers heat it. We can't do anything
	without the computers either.

				Alfred

    What about all the people who insist on printing hardcopies of ALL
    of their electronic mail?  Or excessive travel that could be avoided
    if conference calls were scheduled?

    don't worry about decworld....looks like they cancelled it...
     
    
    see the digital review this week
    

  RE: -1, Digital Review: Title Reads:

		DEC Pulls Plug
                On DECworld '89
                Cites Time, Costs

	The earlier note was refering to DECWORLD the publication for 
	employees (I believe it is quarterly) ....

	Re .1

	John I can tell you why two of those offices in NJ are there. When
a move was planned because current space was not sufficient and not expandable
the FMT was given several choices of new locations by the District Facilities
Management group. Problems arose when the district sales organization wanted
a more choice (read more expensive) location than the district FS or SWS
organizations felt they could afford. The Sales folks aren't rated on margin
dollars but the FS and SWS folks are. The district facilities manager at the
time explained to the Area F&A manager that Digital could save approximately
$1,000,000 over the life of the lease if someone could get all the district
organizations involved to agree on ONE site. The response was that this was
all but impossible. So NJ Digital got two offices when the move occurred; one
for Sales and one for FS and SWS. 
	Bear in mind that the Area F&A manager didn't have the authority to
FORCE everyone to move to one location, the Sales group felt justified with
their location because it met their business needs (read nicer location to
show customers/give Digital visibility), and the FS and SWS groups
got the cheaper rent location so they could meet their business goals (read
margin dollar metrics).
	 The bottom line is that the various organizations involved were all
rated on different metrics and therefore had INCONGRUENT GOALS so digital
would up with two buildings instead of one and an additional expense of
$1,000,000 over the next five years!


-Terry

    
    I find this hunt for scapegoats disgraceful and distasteful.  If you
    have actual cases of waste or fraud, TAKE IT UP THOUGH YOUR MANAGEMENT.
    
    Whining here won't fix a thing.

	The LPS40 in my facility prints out both Header and trailer pages.
	I have tried printing /NOTRAILER but I still get a trailer page. 

	How many times have you printed a one page document, gone to the 
	printer to pick it up, and presto you have 3 pages:

		HEADER, THE-PAGE-YOU-WANTED, & TRAILER

	Let alone if you made a mistake and need to print it again (& again..)

	I wonder how much paper is wasted, and therefore how much money
	(cost of Paper, toner, electricity), let alone the number of trees
	

    re.20 What if management is the start of waste that flows downhill?
    I can show you where digital paid $500. to ship a used microwave oven
    that could have been replaced twice with much nicer and more modern
    units. Or shipped via a different carrier for a lot less. At the price
    paid it could have gone next flight out at half the price or less.
    Best way I can think of too cut waste is for every person to ask
    themselve's "Is this the Right, Best, and most efficent way to do
    this?"  As to whether or not it's in good taste to have a note 
    to discuss waste, If a problem is not pointed out and acted on
    it just gets bigger under cover and eventually swallows everything.
    
    						Ted

>   <<< Note 821.21 by SMEDLY::MACOMBER "This note's for you! (N Young 87)" >>>
>                              -< PRINT/NOTRAILER >-

You can save trees in several ways - Look Andy, I'm being positive here :-) 

 1) Get a paper recycling policy implemented in your facility. The next
 reply in this topic contains a memo I wrote a while back to do something
 about the lack of such a policy in REO. Something is now BEING DONE and
 we should have a policy put in place. The arguments against such as 'we can't
 have one because our printouts are confidential' just don't stand up.
 Please feel free to copy and amend my memo for use at your own site. Some
 people have already done so at other sites in the UK, with positive 
 results.
 
 2) When printing on an LPS40, add the qualifier /param=(number_up=2) to
 your print command. Then 2 pages will be printed per A4 sheet instead of
 1. Other numbers can be used, but you need good eyesight (2 is easily
 readable, higher numbers aren't).

 3) Try if possible to use soft copy alternatives. This includes using 
 DECwindow bookreader and the postscript previewer.

 4) If a large technical spec or manual is announced, then instead of 
 printing off a copy automatically, THINK. Remember the last time a 
 mail was sent round announcing a new spec or manual to your group? You
 went down to the printer and found loads of copies as everyone else who 
 wanted to read it had printed off a copy too. Silly isn't it? Why not
 print off a communal copy then people can share it instead of everyone
 having one each ?

>   <<< Note 821.21 by SMEDLY::MACOMBER "This note's for you! (N Young 87)" >>>
>	The LPS40 in my facility prints out both Header and trailer pages.
>	I have tried printing /NOTRAILER but I still get a trailer page. 

I think this is part of the software and the user can't do anything about it.
SPR it against the people who write the printer drivers if you want it 
fixed, although I heard a rumour they were looking into it. It would be
an idea for you to check just in case they're not tho. The number of blank
pages printed throughout the company due to this 'feature' must run into
1000's a DAY.

>	How many times have you printed a one page document, gone to the 
>	printer to pick it up, and presto you have 3 pages:

>		HEADER, THE-PAGE-YOU-WANTED, & TRAILER

And of course, if you use the /flag option you get TWO flag pages !

		Craig.

Feel free to modify and use if you want to be nice to trees.

Replace DECpark with your site code and you're all set!.

           <<< MARVIN::DISK$ROBIN:[NOTES$LIBRARY]UK_DIGITAL.NOTE;1 >>>
                       -< UK employees discussion forum >-
================================================================================
Note 162.40                  Waste paper and Digital                    40 of 64
MARVIN::COCKBURN "Craig, PhaseV & FCNS"            63 lines  Thu  6-Apr-89 15:51
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

To:	Your local facilities manager
Subj:	Recycling Waste Paper


  Hello,
      As you seem to be the manager of facilities for DECpark I am writing to
      you for some information I hope you can supply.

      I am concerned about the large amounts of waste paper which Digital 
      bins daily. There is no obvious attempt in DECpark to recycle any of
      this paper. Given that several other Digital sites operate a recycling
      policy, I believe that DECpark should do the same and encourage the 
      employees here to put paper for recycling in special bins or have the
      waste paper collected.  Can you tell me please how I would go about 
      getting such a policy implemented if one doesn't exist. 

      I believe it is corporate philosophy to 'do what is right' and in
      this environmentally conscious age I feel the right thing to do is to 
      recycle waste paper instead of burning it. It is also Digitals corporate
      aim to be 'a good environmental citizen in all countries in which it
      does business'. Burning the paper or throwing it away seems to conflict
      with both these aims.

      I understand several companies will guarantee to shred confidential
      documents if Digital believes that recycling listings represents a 
      security risk. 

      This subject is being discussed in the MARVIN::UK_DIGITAL notesfile, 
      topic 162, replies 2,17,18,26,31,32,34,36,37,38,39 and the 
      SUBURB::READING notesfile, topic 44.

      If several other Digital Sites operate a recycling policy, why
      doesn't DECpark?

      Please forward this message to anyone who you feel should be aware of
      this issue.

      Any information you could provide for me would be appreciated.

	Thanks,
		Craig Cockburn, REO2-G/M2, 830-4510.

----------
And the reply from the site facilities manageress...

   She just called: Apparantly this issue along with several others (the
   use of CFC's being one, and the spurious blank page at the end of listings
   being another) are currently being investigated. This topic
   in particular is one that she is very keen to have implemented, and 
   she'll be talking to a representative from Friends of the Earth shortly.
   She hopes to keep people up to date with what's happening in this area
   in a future edition of the facilities newsletter.

		Craig.

    Re.19
    
    I think he's got it, by George he's got it.
    
    The answer: CONGRUENT GOALING
                
    Just suppose Digital as a company worked together towards common
    objectives in a synergistic fashion....
    
    Or is my gentle cynicism showing again?
    
    YADE
    

    AS FOR NOTE .13 (FANS, NOT AIR CONDITIONING).  I'LL TELL YA WHAT,
    IF YOU GIVE UP YOUR HEAT IN NEW ENGLAND, WE (PHOENIX & TEMPE) WILL
    CONSIDER (FOR ABOUT .5 SECONDS) GIVING UP OUR AC.
    
    PLEASE........PLEASE.......BE CAREFUL WITH IDEAS LIKE THAT.  IT'S
    TOO EASY FOR SOMEONE TO PUT THAT INTO A POLICY!  AND STUDY IT LATER.

    Once again, please don't SHOUT.

.25:
Watch out - we might want to give up our heat & keep the air conditioning. 
Some of the smaller buildings, apparently owing to all the equipment running,
get VERY hot at night during the summer when the air conditioning is turned
off. 

A different question - sometimes I see the fluorescent lights in ZK flashing.
They turn off for about a second and turn back on.  Sometimes they do this
continually, and sometimes they don't.  Usually I see this around 10 PM.
Why?

    re .28

    ZK has an energy control system which shuts down the lighting in zones
    starting at about 10pm. They flash a couple of times around five
    minutes before the shutdown as a warning. If you're still working, you
    dial a particular DTN, then dial in your zone, and the lights stay on
    for some delta (half an hour at a shot? an hour? Don't remember.) It's
    a pretty nice system.

    Whether the lights go out entirely before they pop back on is based on
    how quickly somebody got the code for their zone dialed in.

>>	I have tried printing /NOTRAILER but I still get a trailer page. 
>
>I think this is part of the software and the user can't do anything about it.
>SPR it against the people who write the printer drivers if you want it 
>fixed

	  It can be set in either the queues or some other method,
	by your system manager. Talk to him about it. I've
	personally prodded three groups in my building to not use
	trailer pages - they *are* a waste.

	Roy

Re: 821.23 MARVIN::COCKBURN

	I have sent a memo to the Local People noting the problem and requesting
	that a recycling program be put into place. Thanks. 

    Eliminate industry marketing. The notion that each industry has unique
    needs that require a whole marketing group to understand and penetrate
    in depth is rediculous! The minor differences across industries in
    application areas can be addressed by a single person in each
    application (product) marketing group, e.g., electronics CAD is
    electronics CAD no matter what industry you're in, MIS is MIS, etc..
    
    -George

    I am a Graphic Artist in the Southwest Area Proposals Group,
    which technically is a Software Services/Pre-sales position.
    
    I receive Sales Update, Competitive Update and all else that 
    goes out to that distribution list.  Several weeks ago I sent 
    off a memo asking to be taken off the list.  No response.  A 
    few weeks later I called the people at Sales Update and got 
    the mail address where I could request deletion from the list.
    Still, no response.  So yesterday I called the name listed in 
    the front of Competitive Update and explained to her that I 
    had very little need for all the literature that ended up in 
    my in-basket.
    
    She explained to me that if for some reason I had a job code 
    that began with an R or an S, that I would automatically recieve
    Sales Update lit.  Well, that was obvious to me already.  She also
    explained to me that there was no vehicle available to take me off
    the list.  I explained that I didn't need it and that I felt it
    was a terrible waste of paper and postage.  She apologized but made 
    it clear that there was nothing, short of changing my job code, 
    that would make the literature 'go away'.
    
    What a waste!
    
    Jodi-

    re: .20 "disgraceful/disgusting hunt for scapegoats".

    If that's how I viewed this topic, I would agree, but I don't view
    it that way.  I think there are some very constructive criticisms
    here that could genuinely save Digital some bucks.

    On another topic, how about the following "purely hypothetical"
    situation?  Say you are aware of many people within some of the
    groups that you associate with are planning to have a 3-4 day
    meeting, and say that this hypothetical meeting is scheduled
    to take place in a rather desireable location, for example, about
    4-5 hours SW of Los Angeles.  Hypothetically further assume
    that in talking with some of the attendees after their return
    from this meeting, that they tell you that while the location
    was very nice, the actual meeting was for 1.5 days, and the
    entire purpose of the meeting could have been handled very
    adequately via electronic mail and/or a telephone conference call.
    Now hypothetically further assume that your manager was involved
    in this meeting, as well as your manager's manager, but that
    they are really good managers, and had they hypothetically
    known about the true purpose and true length of the meeting,
    they would not have attended, despite it's hypothetically
    desireable location.

    Now with salary freeze/delay in effect, and not wishing to
    commit a very un-hypothetical CLD, just WHO would one report
    this to?

    Hypothetically wondering
    Jon

    RE: .34 The name Ken Olsen comes to mind. I believe he appears near
    the top of most chains of command in this company. Chances are
    pretty good his staff could push down to the appropriate level
    in your hypothetical case.
    
    			Alfred

    
    The best way to save DEC money is "turn off
    your terminal after work".  It is the most effective way
    to keep the electricity rate down also.
    
    Another thing to do to raise the productivity of DEC workers is
    "Allow non-work related notes conference accessable only after
    work hours".  This note file is work related.
    

>                        <<< Note 821.37 by RAINBO::RU >>>
>                        -< Just flip the switch, easy! >-

>    The best way to save DEC money is "turn off
>    your terminal after work".  It is the most effective way
>    to keep the electricity rate down also.

 No it isn't. 
 The extra wear on the terminal switch and circuitry causes the terminal
 to break down faster than if it was left on all the time. The cost to
 get it fixed exceeds the amount of electricity saved.

	Craig

>    Another thing to do to raise the productivity of DEC workers is
>    "Allow non-work related notes conference accessable only after
>    work hours".  

    	Imaginative. When are work hours? Last I heard we had people
    in all time zones. We also have people in some facilities working
    three shifts. There is no such thing as "after work hours".

    			Alfred

> The extra wear on the terminal switch and circuitry causes the terminal
> to break down faster than if it was left on all the time. The cost to
> get it fixed exceeds the amount of electricity saved.

So turn them off over long weekends at least.  The extra off/on should not
impact the terminal's life that much.  It may not save much either, but the
return / effort must be pretty large :-).

    I think the biggest loss of productivity I've seen is due to all
    the rumors circulating recently about reorgs, etc. and people spending
    time worrying about their jobs instead of being productive.
    
    You can talk all you want about how everyone should just ignore
    the rumors, keep their heads down, and trust Digital's senior
    management, but no matter how much you say it it won't happen.
    
    Why won't they go ahead and make an announcement??????????????????
    
    							Pat

    
    Re .42  Rumors about change:  human nature at work in a large company, 
    	    fairly hard to eliminate even if one wanted to.
    
    I would like the excess junk mail to be stopped.  Here we are
    spared from Sales Update etc., but everyone constantly recieves
    fliers from Ed Services hawking courses.  Seriously, publish
    one catalog quarterly and be done with it.  Alot of the stuff I
    get is targeted at managers who need to learn a certain Digital
    OA product (you know the one, rarely if ever seen in the land of
    of job code J's).
    
    Please, stop the junk mail.
    
    jt

    Re: Turning screens off:
    
    One good reason for not turning your screen off over the weekend was
    that old lot of VR-260 monitors that just might not ever power back on
    again (particularly attractive back when the replacement parts were on
    six week backorder).
    
    About them VR-260s:
    
    You want waste?  How about some facility (which will remain nameless)
    wherein you'll find an average of 1.75 workstations per cubicle?
    Probably over 2/cubicle if you only count the software engineers, and
    leave off the non-engineering personnel.  Now, if these workstations
    were being fully exploited to enhance the productivity of the engineer,
    maybe it wouldn't be so bad, but I can't remember the last time I've
    seen more than two or three of them (in the whole damned building)
    being used for anything more than a smart terminal emulator at any
    point in time.
    
    Go around the offices, and ask them why they're just being used as
    smart terminal emulators, and you'll typically get the answer that "the
    system only has 12 Meg on it, and it's too slow to do anything
    locally".  That would be depressing by itself, but go on to consider
    that these smart terminals are the ones being used to implement some of
    the very software that's too slow to be used on a lowly workstation.
    
    Oh yeah, one thing a VAXstation running (in total) VMS, DECnet, SET
    HOST (or VWSLAT) can do better than a standalone terminal:  It's got a
    big screen.
    
    Hah.
    
    I look around, and see precious few windows open on these screens, and
    what windows are there are rendered in some craola font that makes a
    24x80 window take half the screen.
    
    Now, this much just gets me p*ssed, just a bit.  Enough so that I use
    my workstation to do all my builds and testing.  You know, I don't lose
    as many builds, etc, because I don't see my CTERM or LAT links drop
    when the remote cluster goes down.  Oh, nevermind.
    
    What really gets me is that these systems aren't always "just" a
    VAXstation-2000, either.  Look in some offices, and you'll see all the
    latest advances in workstation technology.  Color, 2 and 4 processor
    SMP workstations?  Sure.  Of course, I've only seen a single pair of
    colors being rendered on any of those color screens for the life of the
    system...
    
    Why do these people get the fancy hardware:
    
    1) They asked for it, and someone was dumb enough to give it to them
    without asking why they think they need it.
    2) They had to debug some support for it ONCE, over the course of a
    couple of weeks to a month, and they managed to finagle it for a lot
    longer than that.  Try a year or more.
    3) They're ???, and you're not?
    
    Even better still, you can even find some of these Macho-VAXes sitting
    around powered off, because the owner doesn't want to be bothered with
    the system management headaches of getting it running.  
    
    When pressed on the waste issue, you'll usually get an earfull all
    about the "deadwood" and "waste" in every other department in the
    company.  If you want to find waste, start looking in your own
    department.  You probably won't have to look too far.
    
    Now, I may or may not be biting the silver spoon that's been feeding me
    here, but it still sort of sickens me to see this much hardware getting
    so underutilized, only to have to wash it down by listening to a load
    of self pity about how all those OTHER departments are wasting so much
    money, and making our work environment so much worse.
    
    Before anyone says it:  Yes, I have succumbed to the dark side of this
    farce, and I'm probably just as guilty of all these things, myself.
    
    A more insidious form of waste, from back when I worked in one of those
    much more common departments where you had to wait a year or more to
    get a replacement for that terminal that's been belly-dancing at you
    ever since you moved in:
    
    I was once given the choice between having a bookcase or a
    documentation set.  Couldn't have both.  Think about who this helps.
    
    In another department, I was told that the cost center was already
    paying for too many doc sets (and updates), so if I wanted a doc set, I
    had to "scrounge" (steal) one.  Think about who this helps.
    
    Come to think of it, it makes it even more puzzling that I'd find
    myself complaining about having two workstations to run SET HOST on...

Re: .44

>    In another department, I was told that the cost center was already
>    paying for too many doc sets (and updates), so if I wanted a doc set, I
>    had to "scrounge" (steal) one.  Think about who this helps.

My manager has a policy that I consider quite sensible: instead of each person
having their own doc set (a status symbol?) we have a library with one or
two doc sets (currently one for VMS V5 and one for VMS V4, plus other
non-VMS doc sets) for the whole group.  You're supposed to sign out the
manuals you need and return them when you're done; the problem is that
some popular manuals turn up missing.  I also have private copies of some
manuals that I use a lot, like System Services and the Guide To Using
Command Procedures.  About half the names on the signup sheet are "Bob
Messenger", though, so apparently not everyone is as enthusiastic about the
system as I am.

				-- Bob

    Lets make that quick, as beeing written during "office hours".....
    I don't believe that the discussion (it started already by the time
    of Whirlwind and PDP1) of to turn off or not to turn off machinery
    won't lead us very far into productivity..
    
    How about some savings in overhead ? (I do have a mgr jobcode!)
    Couldn't people not "manage" themselves a little more ? 
    I couldn't think of a better company than DEC to implement
    some more of "high performance management" where a group would
    manage itself, including people devellopment, reviews etc..
    (not to speak about defining each one's contribution to the
    group's goal and objectives). The manager could then reduce
    her/his involvement to play sort of referee or "godfather"
    whatever you might call it.
    This might have been difficult during the times of fast grow,
    as such a group needs to be  very stable to function without
    daily conflicts, but today ?
    I've heard of this concept more or less thru rumours, so I'd
    be interested to see if it really exists within DEC and how
    happy/unhappy folks are about it.
    Personally, if it makes sense, I wouldn't mind either playing
    "godfather" or to swap my mgr job for a technical one.
    Fred

>    Another thing to do to raise the productivity of DEC workers is
>    "Allow non-work related notes conference accessable only after
>    work hours".  

As .39 pointed out, there isn't any such time (even locally). Here are another
two points that occur:

(1) I am writing this reply at 11.56 my time (UK). Smack in the middle of the
    "working day". Other times, you can find me in here all Sunday morning, or
    from 0700 till 2345 on a workday, when I have a big chunk of work to do.
    Bean-counters like to have people schedule things neatly - "30 minutes for
    this, 90 minutes for that, oh now it's 1730 I can go in the Digital
    conference and play". Unfortunately life is not so easy.

(2) Which conferences are non-work-related? SF (science fiction)? Definitely
    "yes". How about DIGITAL? Some would say "yes", I say "no". As long as
    notes are reasonably concise, and directed to better understanding and
    managing our company, I believe contributing to this conference is
    not only work-related, but potentially much more productive than many
    routine tasks. How about the CDD/Plus conference? That's clearly
    work-related, isn't it? Not if it isn't relevant to my work, it isn't.
    How about NEURAL_NETS? How about MARKETING? How about QUALITY?

--Tom

    re: Underutilized hardware
    
    OK, any one of you with unwanted VAXstations (12 MB!!) please send
    them to ZPO. Over here in SWS I run a VAX-11/750 (6 MB) on 1xRA81
    and 1xRA60. Its supporting 16 (more to come) software specialist
    doing everything from All-in-1 to DSS, to Rdb, DBMS,...MAILbus
    (actually I don't run MAILbus, not enough juice). We have to be
    familiar with software that we support, and yet this 750 (I truly
    respect this workhorse, the number of sw we run on it on 6MB) is
    ALL we have.

    re: .49
    
    It already exists - it's called D.I.A.L. (Digital Idle Assets Listing).
    To obtain an account, call DTN 240-6305.  They'll usually set up
    the account within a few hours.
    
    Don't expect to find a lot of workstations.  Do expect to find a
    lot of 750's, 11/70's, RM and RP disks, VT100's and the like.
    
    Al
    

Re: .44

It's that kind of 'waste' that prompted me to enter a note a few months
ago about the seeming abundance of workstations in 'corporate' and a dearth
of workstations in the field.

Re: .49

There's already as system for excess hardware, it's called DIAL (Digital
Idle Asset Listing). 


                <<< MEIS::PUB$:[NOTES$LIBRARY]ASKENET.NOTE;3 >>>
                            -< Ask The Easynet V4 >-
================================================================================
Note 1295.0                           DIAL                             4 replies
DPD09::ANDERSONAB "Brent Anderson"                    4 lines  17-JAN-1989 15:03
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    
    How do I access DIAL (Digital Idle Asset Listing)?
    
    
================================================================================
Note 1295.1                           DIAL                                1 of 4
QBUS::MITCHAM "Andy in Atlanta"                       4 lines  17-JAN-1989 15:57
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    DIAL administration recently moved it's offices to Andover, MA.
    For the time being, send mail to Cathy Kennedy at FOOZLE::KENNEDY.

-Andy
================================================================================
Note 1295.2                           DIAL                                2 of 4
KOBAL::TALCOTT                                        3 lines  19-JAN-1989 15:46
                         -< DIAL is in the phone book >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    DIAL has a number listed in the phone book. Under DIAL. DTN 285-6151.
    
    							Trace
================================================================================
Note 1295.3                           DIAL                                3 of 4
DR::BLINN "Eat dessert first -- Life is uncertain"   16 lines  20-JAN-1989 09:36
               -< DIAL is on DIAL::, but the people have moved >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

        SET HOST DIAL (or access TSN, request DIAL)
	Username: DIAL

        Presto!  You're into DIAL.  However, you need to be registered to
        do anything useful, and you need a user guide as well to figure
        out how to use the system, although it's sort of menu driven.  (It
        really ought to be a VTX infobase, but that's another story.) 

        Contact Cathy FOOZLE::Kennedy, DIAL administration, DTN 240-6305
        to get more information on getting a DIAL account. (508-474-6305). 

        The number in the back of the Digital Telephone Directory is
        wrong, because DIAL moved their offices in December, 1988 to
        the AET1-1 facility at 6 Tech Drive in Andover, MA.
        
        Tom
================================================================================
Note 1295.4                           DIAL                                4 of 4
SALSA::MOELLER "Conscientious, or just codependent?"  7 lines  20-JAN-1989 18:46
                            -< idle assets indeed >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

>    < Note 1295.2 by KOBAL::TALCOTT >
>                         -< DIAL is in the phone book >-
>    DIAL has a number listed in the phone book. Under DIAL. DTN 285-6151.

    You're not going to live THIS one down, Brent !
    
    karl

        re .49 and "All Hands on DEC" for hardware - Educational
        Services (in BUO) does have a group that will rent some
        equipment for short-term use (typically for classes held
        here).
        
        Also, this same group recently headed an effort to collect
        un-used equipment for re-distribution (if possible) within
        Ed Services.
        
Jim Stratton
        

Re: .51 & DIAL

I just accessed DIAL and noticed the main menu had 2 choices:

        O       US DIAL
        N       Worldwide DIAL

so it appears that the DIAL system is getting pretty popular.

It should be pointed out that DIAL allows a user to seek specific hardware.
The resultant seek reveals hardware, quantity, condition and a name and phone
number to contact about the equipment. In short, DIAL is pretty neat!

Lee

	... in getting equipment to his Field office, I would throw a note of
caution out here - DIAL material is NOT free!  It does hit a CC as capital
equipment, at least mine has.  One good thing about it - it gets to you FAST!
And in many cases was cheaper than DECDirect.

	If anyone knows how to get idle equipment FREE, send me MAIL PRIVATELY
ASAP!  :>)

    I believe there is a notes conference for swapping used equipment
    with in the company.

E-Net Equipment Swapping	ESDNI0::SWAPNET				  864

    People with needs and/or extra equipment may want to check it out. I
    haven't looked into it in a very very long time though. I think it used
    to be just for networking hardware but I could be wrong.

    			Alfred

    re: .48 and all replies
    
    the *real* problem is not in locating the hardware, but rather in
    convincing the *M* up there that we need it. and we're not even asking
    for VAXstations! we just wanted a machine (no matter how slow) that has
    got enough memory to run software (like MAILbus) that we're expected to
    support, to be knowledgeable about, not trained on and do not have a
    running system to try out. got my rambling?? I know of VAX-11/780s
    with lots of memory around (probably for free) and yet we know we
    wouldn't get it cos it'll cost "too much" to maintain. even that
    loneranger 11/750 was almost thrown away! just so we can save the
    maintenance money. How does the rest of sws (in US and the world)
    work?
    
    ps: I apologize if this is the wrong conference but I needed to
    let off steam :<(
    

    The following is a mail message I sent after receiving a note from
    corporate telecom stating that our telephone costs had gone up 10%
    in the past year.  I know there is already a (large) note on the
    subject of DTNs and node names on business cards, but this is another
    way we could cut waste.
    
    Dave
    
From:	NSSG::SMITH        "Dave - Networks & Technologies - DTN 226-5920" 15-FEB-1989 16:57:51.69
To:	ASABET::AWARENESS
CC:	SMITH
Subj:	Phone costs

Although I will take your advice about cutting phone costs, I have a
suggestion that may help you achieve your goals:

Please have whoever made the decisions about including DTN and nodenames
not be allowed on business cards change it.  I believe that by using DTN and 
e-Mail instead of long distance, your goal of 10% reduction would be achievable.,
It is human nature to be lazy and use the easiest way.

Regards, Dave

	Who should this be sent to? Looks very promising!


                          Reflective Light Fixtures

       Pre Finish Metals has developed a reflective silver material to
       install behind fluorescent lighting fixtures. It's mirrored
       surface bounces light into work areas, cutting lighting costs by
       as much as 50%.  Early this year McDonnell Douglas Helicopter Co
       installed the reflectors on about 7000 fixtures. The company
       expects to recoup the cost the cost of installation, about $45 to 
       $60 per fixture, within nine months and save nearly $250,000 a
       year on lighting costs.
       {Business Week May 29, 1989}

<><><><><><><><>   VNS Edition : 1831      Friday  2-Jun-1989   <><><><><><><><>

    I probably wrong about this and have the wrong attitude, but it
    bugs me to no end to see the grounds crew out planting flowers and
    replacing the wood chips, hire more people, when people have been
    leaving my organization/company and we can't get reqs to replace
    them.  I'd soon see the grass grow longer than my group not be able
    to respond to problems!
    Maybe I'm to thick to understand why.
    ed
    

    I'll second the idea for the reflective fluorescent light fixtures - I
    hate it around here when the warm weather comes and they turn off half
    of the overhead lights to save on the air-conditionging bill!  It's
    fine if you are just working on your screen, but real near-sighted
    folks like me need a flashlight to read manuals!  With those things,
    there might be enough light to see by in this place!
    
    /Charlotte (working on the dark ...)

If anyone wants to see these reflectors in action, stop in NIO in Salem N.H.
and you will see the real impact. We just had these installed throughout the 
entire building, and they now give more light than the two tube fixtures they 
replaced, BUT when one burns out, it really darkens a larger area.

JMP

    re: .62
    
    Ed,
    
    You should  of  been here at NIO last week, while taking my usual lunch
    time walk around the building, I lost count after 15 or so guys working
    the grounds.  The had one guy driving a tractor with  an airator device
    on the back, 1 or 2 guys going around with tractors speeding  a liquid,
    followed  by  at  least  a  half  a  dozen  guys  spreading normal lawn
    fertilizer using the walk behind  spearders.  Most of them appeared top
    be contract help since there were  a  few  trucks  from some local lawn
    care co.  And to top it  off  most off the guys I counted were the ones
    working on the established lawns, it did not included the crews working
    around the new FCC chambers built out back.
    
    Claude

    RE: .62, .65
    
    Cutting "environmental" costs is a common way companies use to save
    money in times of crisis.  First they let the grass grow.  Then
    they stop restocking office supplies (BYOP - Bring your own pencil).
    Then the bathrooms start smelling bad.  Then the paint on the walls
    starts to peel.  
    
    It's a kind of illness that spreads through the company.  The 
    psychological impact is very negative, and productivity suffers.
    
    A company that compromises its working environment to save a few
    dollars is hiding from the fundamental business changes it should
    make to operate at an adequate margin to stay healthy.  

    Well, Mx Johnson, you have your opion of whats important and I have
    mine.  I spend 8 hours+ INSIDE the building and could care less
    about the grass.  I *think* that someone is screwed up though when
    the grounds crew can hire people for cosmetics, and I can't hire
    people to handle customer complaints!

    
    Cutting envirmental cost you say is common way companies use to
    save money in times of crisis?  Well someone just delayed a salery
    action and used some such excuss.  beats me.

    	ed
    

    We do tend to go a bit overboard on the aesthetics of the outsides and
    insides of our buildings.  In my building, MR04 a lot of the pictures
    on the wall have limited-editions, numbered and signed.  Personally, I
    think that's going a bit far.
    
    However, letting things go to pot isn't a catch-all solution.  I spent
    some time in one of Data General's prime engineering facilities last
    month and my biggest impression was "what a hole."  If they can't keep
    the buildings at least slightly maintained, then what does that say for
    the attitudes of the people working in there?

I'm reminded of the recent paint job that parts of SHR recieved.  They repainted
just those portions of corridors which would be visible to members of the
Executive Committee who visited the site for a meeting and tours.
				/AHM

rep to < Note 821.68 by HACKIN::MACKIN "Jim Mackin, Aerospace Engineering" >

>    We do tend to go a bit overboard on the aesthetics of the outsides and
>    insides of our buildings.  
    
    That may  be  true for the Engineering/Sales buildings etc. But here in
    NIO (Module Line/System MFG), they have always  spent  the  $'s to keep
    the  outside green, but inside the only time they paint the walls  etc.
    (with  exception  to  new  contruction), is when there's going to be an
    open house or a major announcement (8700/8800).  

    Of course for the  last 3 years (seems longer) thev'ye been busy trying
    to relayout the place (factory of the future etc.)  and  now  with  CSS
    coming in it continue's, some of the people in my  group have moved 4-5
    times in the last 2 years, and it's still temporary (waiting for CSS to
    move in completely and decide which areas they want)
    
    Claude  (who has spent 9+ of my 16yrs in DEC, in NIO 12yrs of existence
    at various times)

    There are more reasons to keep the grass cut around the site than just
    the obvious esthetic and morale ones (though I've got to admit that
    poorly-maintained facilities are disheartening).  I have really bad hay
    fever, and this is prime pollen season.  So I'm glad that the acres of
    grass around HLO are kept cut short enough that it doesn't go to seed. 
    Not only does it look reasonable, but I'd much rather spend my time
    here in my cube than at the allergy clinic -- and I almost had to make
    a run there over the weekend as it is (thank goodness for Seldane...).

The appearance of Digital's facilities makes an important statement about
the company.  Just like you wouldn't want a salesman showing up at a 
customer site with a dirty, wrinkled suit, and scuffed shoes, you wouldn't
want people driving by our facilities to see the grass uncut, and the 
buildings in disarray.

Impressions are important, and first impressions, even more so.

If you are concerned about the money that Digital spends on landscaping,
then I would suggest that you organize a group of volunteers to do some of
the routine maintenance on your lunch hours, or for a short time before or
after work.   Digital will benefit from reduced costs, and the volunteers
will gain landscapping experience, as well as a sense of accomplishment from
watch THEIR lawns and gardens grow!

Bob

    In PNO, all groundskeeping is done by about 6 DEC employees.  They
    "volunteered" for that position the last time we went through the
    "excess manufacturing personnel" saga.
    
    Mike

I think the original complaint about the grounds keepers was the quantity of
people working on the grounds. It seems to me things could be cut back a bit
Do we need an all-or-nothing decision? I think in a lot of cases there is an
over emphasis on appearance. I am reminded of one of the best editorial I've
seen in an Engineering magazine. I've kept it on file over the years and now
and then have to pull it out when the occasion warrants it.

	"My Secretary's Pants" by George Rostky
	reprinted w/o permission from Electronic Design, Sept 1, 1975

Ralph, an old boss of mine, decided one day that things were getting too lax
around our shop. The company, he felt, would do a lot better if we were more
businesslike.

I guess he figured that to *be* businesslike, you've got to *look* business-
like. So he issued a memo directing that women were not to wear pants at the
office. In a business environment, he reasoned, pants were proper attire only
for men.

My secretary, Rita, who did great things for pants, promptly removed hers and
tossed them onto my desk. I thought this was a rather admirable demonstration
of (among other things) her annoyance with a stupid memo.

Without unseemly haste, I brought Ralph her pants and congratulated him on the
effectiveness of his memo writing. Fortunately, at this point, he recognized
the idiocy of the whole operation and rescinded his memo.

Now most of us don't spend much time issuing memos about what women in the
office should or shouldn't wear. But how much effort do we wast on other nutty
issues?

When we face real problems do we try to tackle them? Or do we allow ourselves
to be diverted into solving non-problems? Do we exercise our authority by making
decisions on proper attire, the arrangement of stuff on desks and lab benches,
operating procedures and other trivia?

I visited a company where everything was perfectly shipshape. It was obvious
that somebody worried about these things because the walls were spotless; the
desks all looked the same; the lab benches all looked the same; and, by golly,
the engineers all looked the same. Everything seemed to be perfectly
controlled except for one small matter; the company's products were dull and
behind the times. And the company's sales and earnings were plummeting.

The company was being clobbered by an outfit whose people spent their time
designing the most desirable, most profitable products. They had no time to
worry about anything else.

    
    RE: .62
    
    Here in HL0,lawn cutting/landscaping costs are under control.
    $101,000 (yearly average) does it all.
    
    Mike

    RE:.76
    
    Why doesn't DEC just put landscaping under facilities? I'm sure
    we could buy our own lawnmowers and hire some grass-cutting people
    and save some decent money.($101,000 for just one facility's
    landscaping is quite a bit)

    I don't know Ken! How many decies does it take to mow the lawn.
    Better yet how many decies can you get for a 100k.

	Based on some budgeting figures I've seen you can get 80% of
	a software engineer or about 60% of a tech writer for $101,000
	a year. People cost more than their paycheck. There is benifits,
	management overhead, cost of office/supply space, and a whole
	bunch of other things that I probobly don't have a clue about.


				Alfred

    One could replace lawns, sculptured bushs, fields of wood chips,
    with environmentally adapted plants that are aesthetic and require
    very little maintenance.
    
    -George

	May I recommend the conference ENVIRONMENTAL_ISSUES , NOTE 118.0.
    File TOWNS::SYS$DEVICE:[NOTES$LIBRARY]ENVIRONMENTAL_ISSUES.NOTE
							Dave

    The facility in which I work (LKG 2) is smack dab in the center
    of the town of Littleton, MA, and on a hill, too.  Given our extremely
    high visibility, I think the money we spend on landscaping (and
    I suspect gardeners are several times cheaper than engineers) is
    an excellent investment, especially since the  money seems to go
    to local businesses, which makes them happy.
    
    Allow me to suggest a REAL cost-saving measure.  At another facility,
    the conference rooms were rigged up with some sort of motion sensor
    that controlled the lights.  I thought it was a delightfully Digital
    solution to the problem of saving electricity: it was very high-tech,
    the payback period was measured in decades, and if the
    meetings got too dull, the lights went out and we'd have to wave
    our arms like lunatics to turn them on again!
    
    All right, so that's not such a good idea.  Here's another one.
    The product development cycle seems to me excessively long.  If
    we could cut it by an average of a month, imagine how much salary
    time we'd save?  We could put that to work on more releases, which
    would presumably generate more revenue.  And shortening our time
    to market would probably increase sales in and of itself.
    
    I think there are very significant savings to be realized in shortening
    product cycles.

It may be effective, but if it costs more to install than the potential savings,
then it's still wasteful.

/john

    Consider how many facilities are in New England.There could be a
    group,based at the mill,who's sole job is to drive around and cut
    the grass at all the facilities.
    (I'm only half joking)

    For the cost of mowing grass for one season at Digital (people and
    equipment), we could finance several universities and private companies
    to develop a perennial grass that only grows an inch or two in hieght
    so that it doesn't ever need mowing!
    
    -George 

    RE: .87 The grass seed companies and several schools are already
    working on it. I doubt a few more bucks will speed the process that
    much.
    
    			Alfred

    I listened to the Quarterly Report video today. They wheeled on
    Jack Shields (presumably to show that he was still alive and kicking)
    for a Q & A on cost saving.
    
    He said he was extremely interested in employee ideas on cost saving.
    Even said he'd read a letter from an employee. So who wants to do a:
    
    EXTRACT A.TMP 821.*
    SPAWN
    MAIL
    SEND/SUBJ="Employee ideas to cut waste" A.TMP MTS$::"OGO::JACK SHIELDS"
    
    Dave

    Re : 1" grass.
    It already exists. The grass grows to 2" in height, then stops.
    Some parks have already tried it but it has not been successful
    because it gets dirty and scruffy over a period of a few weeks.
    The usual grass may be a pain to keep short but at least it
    constantly renews itself.  If you do not believe this, consider
    how bad the grass looks in February/March after a few months of
    no growth.
    Calvin

    off the grass, I'd like to expand on .83
    "Shortening devellopment time"
    How would you do it ?
    What are the reasons for lengthy phases ? are there too many (phases) ?
    
    I don't have the answers having left engineering a few years ago,
    but just one thought:
    
    Is Engineering (management) still prepared to take risks ?
    Such as:
    Instead of playing every project on the "safe side" producing
    "average" products within "average" time and budget as planned,
    or
    taking the risk of blowing a few, but producing also a few
    excellent winners ?
    I am attracted by the latter approach, but honestly don't know
    which one is better. Looking towards the past, I'd say that the
    "risk taking" approach wasn't very benefitial to the indivdual's
    careers as definately "playing the safe-game", sticking to
    the process was.
    As far as to the organization's long term goal (was there any ?)
    and DIGITAL benefits, I am not really qualified to judge.
    Fred

    re: .83 & .91  (Shortening development time):
    
    Bill Demmer, VP Midrange Systems, is on the cover of last week's
    "Electronic Business" magazine.   The cover story is about this
    topic exactly.  Demmer talks about the benefits of shortening product
    time-to-market, and _specifically_ about reducing the development
    time.   The benefits amount to _much_ more than saving salaries.
    
    Check it out.
    
    -Don Montgomery-

    RE .89  A letter
    
    Perhaps a program should be set up in which any employee with a
    cost saving idea can submit it (mail, etc) for review. The ideas
    could be reviewed for feasability and, if accepted, implemented 
    company wide rather than in "pockets" (i.e. energy saving lights 
    here but not there, etc).
    
    If the idea pans out the employee might even receive an award as
    an added incentive. Of course the administration of the program would
    cost, but the payback might just be worth it.
    
    I believe some other companies do this.
    
    Bob                                   

    
    back to .83
    
    How do we properly set up incentives that keep managers from attempting
    to completely overstaff projects, which cause development times
    to explode. Overstaffing increases risk  by introducing more
    interdependencies, more overhead (project leaders, supervisors),
    and almost always defeats any attempt to work SMARTER! 
    
    How do we reduce the built in overhead - Phase Review processes,
    SQM, Field Test admin etc... For a six-month development effort,
    there is a six-month overhead cycle BUILT-IN!
    
    I feel that ANY project, regardless of size and complexity, goes
    down the tube with any more than 10 individuals on the development
    team. Actually, i prefer from 3-6 max. It forces you to look at
    SMARTER implementation strategies. If doing software, it makes
    you provide equivalent functionality with less code. You will
    always end up with a simpler, less complex implementation. However,
    the tendency is to always have 3 or more turners per light bulb.

        Empires are continually rewarded - small successful efforts are
    not. Empires, if forced into the marketplace without the comfort
    of Digital would very quickly go under. Yet they seem to continue
    to proliferate. 
    
    	bs

    Every company I've work for has, at one time or another, had a profit
    squeeze.  Every time this has happened, everybody starts running around
    looking for money-saving ideas like reducing grounds maintenance
    instead of looking for the real problem.  You can't regain
    profitability by trimming travel expenses and turning out the lights.
    You've got to look at how you are wasting expensive resources by
    keeping people from doing their jobs (administrivia), or paying people
    to do jobs that really don't need to be done.  Why, with all the
    complaining one hears about understaffing, do we still have about the
    lowest productivity in the industry (in terms of revenue/head or
    profit/head)?  Address that and you'll be saving some REAL money.
    
    -dave
    	

>    I feel that ANY project, regardless of size and complexity, goes
>    down the tube with any more than 10 individuals on the development
>    team. Actually, i prefer from 3-6 max. It forces you to look at
>    SMARTER implementation strategies. If doing software, it makes
>    you provide equivalent functionality with less code. You will
>    always end up with a simpler, less complex implementation. However,
>    the tendency is to always have 3 or more turners per light bulb.

    That's the traditional approach in DEC for most projects, like the
    stuff done by CLT, TLE or NAC. The end result is that we are totally
    disoriented and lost when it comes to engineering something which
    require more than 10 engineers; and there are projects which will
    require large teams! In a building I can see from my office, Amadeus is
    staffing 300 engineers for the European equivalent of the Sabre Airline
    Reservation System. Not far away from here, IBM is engineering all its
    communication controllers (3745 et all): a single site, over 1,000
    engineers. When I talk about these projects to old time DECcies, the
    traditional answer is 'we could do it with a lot less engineers'. Gimme
    a break! There ARE projects which require a lot of persons, and they
    are very typical projects which we just can't handle.

    Denis.

    re .93

>   If the idea pans out the employee might even receive an award as
>   an added incentive. Of course the administration of the program would
>   cost, but the payback might just be worth it.
    
    I believe that's how 3M comes up with a lot of its products. (Imagine
    how much money the person who thought of POST-ITs made!)

    Rubbermaid may do the same thing too. (I know they have employees take
    home new-product prototypes to try out in regular use to see if the
    things really work.)

    About shortening development times, the VNS recently carried an article
    about NCR developing a new entry-level cash register: 85% less parts,
    65% less suppliers, no physical prototype, all computer designed,
    computer approved by all involved organzations, etc. etc. at an
    incredible savings in time and effort. A PAPERLESS-developed product.
                                             ---------

    Hmmm - we have computers, don't we? If we didn't print _everything_
    maybe we could be a lot more concise in everything. People have a lot
    less patience reading verbose mail than verbose manuals. One of my
    "regular sidelines" (i.e., for DEC but on my time) is redoing parts
    of manuals, like lexical functions, cramming a lot more information in
    a lot less space. How about cutting the VMS docset size (physically) in
    half and still charging the same price? Wait! People might even be
    willing to pay _more_ if they don't have to dig through so much to
    get their answers!! :-)

    "Less is more, more is less."

    /Petes

    Regarding reducing product development cycle time, there's a new (isn't 
    there always?) conference that I'm sure would love to hear your ideas:
    
    		     JOKUR::PHASE_REVIEW_NOTES
    
    A topic exists to discuss the need to automate aspects of the information
    creation, flow, and retention process.  At least, the seed (no,
    not grass seed) is planted.
                                                            
    Process simplification and using information wisely should be more
    a priority than grass or paper, I believe.

    - Jim    

        Well, i'm a believer in the Phase Review process. One way
        they have helped improve the process is by issuing the updated
        software development guide. I believe it had been quite a few
        years since it was last developed.
        
        My real issue is the proliferation of people on projects. The
        more ways you slice up a project, the more turf there is that
        folks fight over. If it is  a new project with architecture and
        brand new development, and you staff it with a huge team, about
        all that gets developed is a swamp. 

RE: .93
    
>    Perhaps a program should be set up in which any employee with a
>    cost saving idea can submit it (mail, etc) for review. The ideas

    I don't see why you need to create a "program" to handle cost-saving
    ideas.  In fact, it sounds counterproductive to add new administrative
    layers.  The open door policy already lets you take your idea directly
    to the people who can implement it.  Only you can "own" your idea,
    and see that it succeeds.

    
    MATT

    	Alot of companies offer financial incentives for cost saving ideas.
    	When I worked for Raytheon they offered 10% of the first year's
    	savings up to some limit.  This would require administration.
    
    	Joe Oppelt

re: < Note 821.101 by CSC32::J_OPPELT "You don't notice absence of pain" >
                    -< Money might make us think harder... >-

   and several other .*'s (Not to necessarily single you out, Joe.)

   I dunno, maybe I'm strange, but we began this discussion of "waste
   management" and identification of cost cutting/expense controlling
   measures in response to a delay in the US Salary plan, and now
   we're entertaining conjecture about incentives and awards for such
   ideas. Wouldn't elimination of the damned salary plan delay be a
   significant enough incentive for anybody? I'd be glad to suggest
   any cost cutting measures to get back our salary plan, personally,
   without _ANY_ other incentive. And the idea that such measures could
   stave off potential delays would act as an ongoing incentive.

   -Jack

    I have no specific ideas for shortening the development cycle, only the
    recollection that where I used to work, the cycle was half as long for
    projects of comparable size.   I'm currently on the biggest project
    I've ever been on, so I don't know that my experience applies here, but
    on the other hand, when I look around I can see what Mr. Schuchard
    alludes to in his recent replies.  Two or three senior engineers can
    accomplish more than one senior and nine junior engineers (to pull
    numbers out of the air) in the same amount of time. 

    I think of quality as conformance to requirements.  One consequence of
    long development cycles is the large window for people to fiddle with
    the requirements.  Change the requirements and you may have to start
    all over.  The shorter the cycle, the less fiddling about, and the more
    conformance you get--the more quality you get.  (This is the Crosby
    Quality system, by the way.) 
        
    Two vague impressions persist.  One is that the test-site cycle is
    extremely long.  I have the gut feeling (naming no names and fingering
    no projects) that Digital sends out less than final software to test
    sites, then expects customers to wring out the bugs.  I remember a
    place where we had a test staff trained to wring out bugs, and the
    intent was to send out test-site software that didn't have ANY bugs.
    It never worked out that way, of course--that's what test sites are
    for--but I seem to recall the software was more solid, both before and
    after the test-site cycle.  One would have to weigh the costs of
    building up a test organization against the benefits of reducing the
    overall test cycle by perhaps a month per project plus the increase in
    customer satisfaction (from receiving solid software). 
    
    The SSB (nee SDC) cycle is also undeniably long.  How long should
    it take to duplicate tapes and put them on a shelf?  To print up
    documentation, it could take as few as three weeks.  I speak from
    near-total ignorance here, but the SSB part of the cycle may stand
    some pruning.  We are doing our part by trying to reduce the production
    cycle for documentation, at least.

    	re .102

	Actually I see this topic as a knee jerk reaction to the freeze.
	Some people are hurt or insulted, angry or frustrated by the
	freeze, so to vent their feelings they want to lash out at as
	many other things as they can.

	I don't think that rescinding the freeze will motivate people
	(to come up with ideas, or even to work harder at their jobs
	for that matter) any more than the freeze is going to encourage
	people to work less.  In general.  Perhaps among the participants
	of this conference we might see that happen, but I see the noting 
	community as an outgoing minority, and not representative of the
	DEC population as a whole.  In fact, this particular topic might
	give management the idea that if they institute more freezes they
	will squeeze more cost-cutting ideas from us!  This topic would
	not have been born without the freeze.

    	Joe Oppelt

    couldn't hold this back any longer...
    
    During the SAMS-I training a couple of weeks ago, one of the Harvard
    B-school faculty gave this definition (tongue in cheek)
    
    	Increased productivity =
    
    		less people working more hours
    
    -Barry-
    

>    During the SAMS-I training a couple of weeks ago, one of the Harvard
>    B-school faculty gave this definition (tongue in cheek)
>    
>    	Increased productivity =
>    
>    		less people working more hours

That should be "fewer" people. Are you *sure* he or she was from Harvard?

    His word probably was "fewer".
    
    My Cornell mind may have translated to "less".  While Hahvahd may
    have been better in English, we certainly had a better Engineering
    school.
    
    	-Barry_EE_64-
    

    re .104
        
>    Actually I see this topic as a knee jerk reaction to the freeze.
 
    Not so.  I started this note because it seemed like a good idea
    at the time.  SPR has not yet instituted a wage freeze.

    
    	re .103
    
    	This subject just came up with me and my supervisor.
    	We release out software to Release on July 10, and it
    	won't come out of SDC until 16 of October.
    
    	Seems a bit long, no?
    
    	/prc

I received a course description over the tube.  I usually print
them out and tack them on my wall if they look interesting.  I
guess I should have read this one first.

This one was five pages long - and had a 36 page distribution 
list.  2300 names.  The file took up 165 blocks of system space
of 2300 users' quotas - 379,500 blocks.

This issue has been raised in the conference before.  There are 
certainly reasons for including a distribution list, but those
are far outweighed when the list becomes totally excessive.

If 10% of the people were as foolish as I was in printing it out
(Gee, I assumed it was under 40 pages) and if 100 other people
in the company are sending out such memos, then the numbers
begin to mean something.  

Maybe it's small, but we could work on the little things like this
while the company fixes the large and more fundamental problems.

Dave "Stack o' Paper" Sorrells

(Distribution list deleted)

        Re: .110

        I can beat that:  When I came to work this morning I had
        a course announcement sent to 9500+ employees, with the
        distribution list included.  Each copy is 600+ blocks (160
        pages if you print it), with a total size of 1.5 Gigabytes. 
        My first response was to send a message to the author
        complaining about the waste.

        [To make it worse, I received three copies and the original
        sender told me that some people have received as many as seven
        copies.  It was only sent once, but it got stuck in the mailer.]

        					B.J.

    RE:-.1
    Yes, I got three copies too.  It had 9551 lines, or about 9540 names in
    the distribution list.  Now if each of the 9540 people got 9540 lines
    of names, then there are 9540 * 9540 lines of names, times three
    copies! 
    
    Truly astonishing waste.  Suggestion:  All mailers should be changed to
    not list distribution.  That includes A...1 and the associated
    gateways.  On special request, up to a screenful of distributions can
    be added, not the whole list.
          fred

    Hopefully all good network citizens have deleted the excess copies
    as soon as they realized the duplication, printed if wanted, and
    deleted the last one once it has been read/hard copied/saved.
    
    Of course you did.

	re: 9500+ line mail

	Obviously, lots of people got this - I received 4 copies.

	  I called the number in the message, and was told that they
	used the "MTS Mailer", and that program or whatever it is
	caused the problem. They had not intended the distribution
	list to be appended, nor (obviously) for multiple copies to
	go to each person. They're looking into the problem.

	Roy

    There was nothing top prevent folks editing and removing the dist list
    before printing, right? So disk blocks are the senders fault, the dead
    trees are the fault of the person who printed the mail!
    
    
    - Andy

    re .-1
    
>    There was nothing top prevent folks editing and removing the dist list
>    before printing, right? So disk blocks are the senders fault, the dead
    
    If the addressee doesn't have an MTSmail account, the mail goes to a
    print queue and gets printed in it's entirety (sp?). We got nailed but
    good here at SHR, in fact I got so fed up that I deleted the print
    queue to clear it as it had over 400 entries in it (49 pages of
    forwarding, 2 pages of text). I re-created the queue, restarted it, and
    a new message started printing, about 3-4 pages of forwarding, 3 LINES
    of text...
    
    I should delete all of the MTSmail accounts here and buy stock in a
    paper mill :^)...
    
    /Harley

The irony of the "electronic mail list disk/network wastefullness" is
that it is an opportunity where NOTES can save, rather than waste,
resources.  Some of these examples should probably be given to those
now considering NOTES policies.

[Please, I don't want to raise the debate of PAPER mail versus electronic
or conferencing ... the need for paper in many circumstances has been
established ... but anyone with access to E-MAIL can and should have
access to at least some conferences and/or VTX, and those should be
used in place of 75-90% of "bulk" electronic mail.]

- greg

    MTS can auto-forward to VMSmail. Anything else (like printing
    umpty-three copies of the message) is VERY poor administrative practice.

    I just got my first (and, I hope, only) copy of this infamous message.
    What's truly amazing is that it is nearly content-free.  I wrote
    back to the originator expressing my displeasure.
    
    At least here at ZKO, we've got MTS set up to forward to our
    VMSmail-type systems.
    
    				Steve

    re .-1, .-2
    
    Doesn't MTSmail require that Joe User have an MTSmail account for it
    to be forwardable to VMSmail? All of the printed messages were to users
    who didn't have accounts (at least that's what I've been told; I'm not
    the MTS mangler at this site).
    
    Of course, if this IS possible, we'll have to get a room full of RA90's
    to hold all of the forwarded messages (unless the forwarding lists can
    be omitted from the actual message).
    
    /Harley
                                        

re: .3

>    Doesn't MTSmail require that Joe User have an MTSmail account for it
>    to be forwardable to VMSmail? All of the printed messages were to users
>    who didn't have accounts (at least that's what I've been told; I'm not
>    the MTS mangler at this site).

Whoever told you that was misinformed.  The site message router can be told
to route mail several different ways.  Three choices are:  to ALL-IN-1 mail,
to VAX Mail, and to hardcopy.

Yes, ALL-IN-1 mail can be told to forward to VAX Mail, but it's a waste of 
network bandwidth and computes to do it this way other than temporarily.

Can't help you on the disk farm, sorry!  8^)

Ray

re: 821.114

>	Obviously, lots of people got this - I received 4 copies.

Gee, I've only gotten 1 copy so far.

re: 821.115

>    There was nothing top prevent folks editing and removing the dist list
>    before printing, right? So disk blocks are the senders fault, the dead
>    trees are the fault of the person who printed the mail!

How many people check the length of a MAI Lmessage before printing a copy?
I expect not too many.


In any case, the load on the net of such a large message is still a worse 
problem.    

    Re: .several
    
    There's a trivial fix to the "gee, I didn't know how big it was going
    to be when I said 'PRINT'" problem... have VMS MAIL display the length
    of the message (as 'NN lines') at the top of the screen when you first
    see it.
    
    MAIL already knows this information, it's hidden in DIR/FULL where not
    many people look for it.  I think it could be squeezed into the top
    display line (the one that says '#NN' and the date received) so it
    wouldn't eat up more real-estate on the screen.
    
    Anyone want to file a suggestion QAR?
    
    

    While there was a shortage of toner, one of the unit managers here sent
    a message to everyone in their unit rquesting that they only print
    stuff that they absolutely need.  Guess how many copies of this memo
    I've found in the LN03 output tray :-(((
    
    Bob

    re .121
    
>>    Doesn't MTSmail require that Joe User have an MTSmail account for it
>>    to be forwardable to VMSmail? All of the printed messages were to users
>>    who didn't have accounts (at least that's what I've been told; I'm not
>>    the MTS mangler at this site).


>Whoever told you that was misinformed.  The site message router can be told
>to route mail several different ways.  Three choices are:  to ALL-IN-1 mail,
>to VAX Mail, and to hardcopy.
    
    But MTSmail still has to know Joe User@site's E-Net mail address; how is
    that mapping done without some kind of MTS_to_VMSmail information? We
    have ~2000 Joe Users here, I wouldn't want to have to maintain that
    list :^)
    
>Can't help you on the disk farm, sorry!  8^)
    
    Maybe I'll plant a few '82's and the afore-mentioned 49 pager and see
    what sprouts :^) :^) :^)
    
    /Harley

    The real kicker is that the header memo said that a course description
    followed the distribution list, which is why many people printed
    the darn thing to begin with.

    Did anyone receive the course description?  
    
    I didn't!

	I think the mail message should have been forwarded BACK to the
	originator. Let them deal with the disk space issues.. :-)

							mike

    
    i'm with .127 - i received 3 copies and deleted them all. Now what
    was the message - anyone get that far?
    
    bs

re: .126

To get electronic (either ALL-IN-1 or VAX) mail, the site message router 
has to be specifically told that Joe User has an electronic mail box; 
otherwise, the mail will get printed and delivered hardcopy.

>    But MTSmail still has to know Joe User@site's E-Net mail address; how is
>    that mapping done without some kind of MTS_to_VMSmail information? We
>    have ~2000 Joe Users here, I wouldn't want to have to maintain that
>    list :^)

Yep, someone has to enter and maintain that information.  It takes people 
and machine resources.  It's neither free nor easy.

Ray

    re: .131
    
    That's nonsense. Virtually everyone is in ELF. I shouldn't be a
    big deal to make a program that accesses the ELF database periodically
    to automatically update the MTSmail database. One might have to
    add an extra field on ELF for net address but that's no big deal.
    This would allow each person to update MTSmail themselves without
    involving some overhead bureaucracy. In fact, that's probably why
    it hasn't been done already -- might eliminate some overhead jobs.
    
    -George

re: .132

>    That's nonsense. Virtually everyone is in ELF. I shouldn't be a
>    big deal to make a program that accesses the ELF database periodically
>    to automatically update the MTSmail database.

ELF is not particularly bullet-proof.  As proof, note that you can change 
your ELF registration to a non-existent node/user pair.  You are then 
locked out from making any further corrections; the only people who can 
bail you out of this situation are the central ELF folks.

>						   One might have to
>    add an extra field on ELF for net address but that's no big deal.

There is already such a field.  You can put anything you want in it.

>    This would allow each person to update MTSmail themselves without
>    involving some overhead bureaucracy.

Ever notice how many people bother to keep their ELF entries updated, 
assuming they even know how?  If you want a corporate Mail network that 
works, you can't leave it up to the users (some of whom may be very 
dangerous when put in front of a terminal) to keep it running well.

MTS in fact does do some automated updateing.  It uses extracts of the 
Employee Master File to decide who belongs to which site.

Ray
(Disclaimer:  I have no connection to the MTS software, systems, or staff,
other than being reachable through it.) 

    Here in ZKO, the MTS-to-VAXmail translations are updated in an
    "automatic" fashion from the site employee database.  I say "automatic"
    in quotes because, though I know it happens by default, I don't know
    if it's a program or some poor soul who has to enter all the changes
    manually.
    
    But since very few (if any) of the ZKO nodes are running
    ALL-IN-1, this is a necessity.
    
    				Steve

    Only 2000? There are 3000 DECcies in Reading, England, ALL of whom have
    MTS-to-VAXmail translations posted if they don't have ALL-IN-1
    accounts.
    
    Just another poor excuse for a massive waste of dead trees.
    
    Andy

    Our group's secretary doesn't forward course, organizational, and
    other corporate announcements, but posts them in a VAXNOTES
    conference.  That way, there's only one copy hanging around on
    disk.
    
    MATT

    re .136
    
    That's the way to go...
    
    Two years ago I had set up a private conference for my group to
    use as a commun mail for all technical info. Hence, there would
    be only one copy and all memo's would be easily retrieved. Instead
    of forwarding infos all around, we would just post it in our
    commun conference/mail box. Besides VaxNotes offers many searching
    tools to retrieve infos later.
    
    Only a few people understood the benefits of this set up. But 
    other complained about having to monitor a conference beside of their
    mail, others said that we already had Stars as a technical database.
    
    After one year I deleted the conference...
    
    Vaxnotes could find a lot of *official* applications in this company.
    Just use your imagination... Still last year, at great expenses a call
    escalation program was designed by some internal application
    programmers. It has not a tenth of the functionality of Vaxnotes, it
    is cumbersome to use, you need to login in one special account (why ?)
    and it's purpose is to allow communication between the different
    individuals involved in a call escalation. 
    
    Why don't we use the right tools instead of trying to rediscover the wheel ?

re: .105 (Harward science)
>    	Increased productivity =
>    
>    		less people working more hours
>    
>    -Barry-
 
    It just happens that our customers are not interested in
    buying "more hours" ! They are after better "solutions"
    to their computing challenges in terms of products and services!
    Fred   

>    Vaxnotes could find a lot of *official* applications in this company.
>    Just use your imagination... Still last year, at great expenses a call
>    escalation program was designed by some internal application
>    programmers. It has not a tenth of the functionality of Vaxnotes, it
>    is cumbersome to use, you need to login in one special account (why ?)
>    and it's purpose is to allow communication between the different
>    individuals involved in a call escalation. 
>    
>    Why don't we use the right tools instead of trying to rediscover the wheel ?
    
    ... Not only do I agree that VAXNOTES could be the ideal basis for
    escalation tools (just add some of AVN plus a "dashboard"
    functionality ) but also am I getting worried about the fact that
    we have already an "official" one for Europe (ECSO) plus a Corporate
    one, plus a GIA one plus plus.... Isn't that waste ?
    
    Fred

re: < Note 821.114 by CHIRPA::SWONGER "Carpe Diem" >
                                    -< FYI >-
>	re: 9500+ line mail
>
>	Obviously, lots of people got this - I received 4 copies.
>
>	  I called the number in the message, and was told that they
>	used the "MTS Mailer", and that program or whatever it is
>	caused the problem. They had not intended the distribution
>	list to be appended, nor (obviously) for multiple copies to
>	go to each person. They're looking into the problem.

     Well, here we are more than three days later and _AGAIN_ I've got
     a new copy of this sucker in my morning's MAIL (only the second
     one for me, though). Replying to the message is like sending mail
     to a black hole. I suppose I should wade through the damned thing
     and find the phone number, although I know I'll be really pissed
     when I reach someone on the other end.

     -Jack

    RE: .133   "up-to-date info"
       
>    If you want a corporate Mail network that works, you can't leave it up
>    to the users (some of whom may be very dangerous when put in front of a
>    terminal) to keep it running well. 
>
>    MTS in fact does do some automated updateing.  It uses extracts of the
>    Employee Master File to decide who belongs to which site. 
     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    
    Ah yes, the Master file.  You take it for granted that this great
    big computer company maintains an accurate corporate data base.
    Unfortunately, that does not appear to be the case.
    
    As a driver for one of the Digital Commuter Vans (Acton to Merrimack) I
    periodically get a mailing list that the Commuter Transportation
    Department requests from Personnel.  This "Master" list provides me
    with the names and mailstops of people working at ZKO and MKO who live
    in zip code communities along my route.  I can then send out an
    invitation to take adavntage of one of DEC's least publicized benefits. 
    
    The last list I got was passed around one evening on our van to see if
    anybody recognized some names worth calling directly.  In one quick
    pass we spotted close to twenty people who we knew for a fact were no
    longer working in New Hampshire, some of them were former riders who
    transferred to other facilities more than a year ago. 
    
    So, don't assume that there is any source of information in this
    company that will tell you where everybody is, let alone how to
    send MAIL to them.
    

>    Only 2000? There are 3000 DECcies in Reading, England, ALL of whom have
>    MTS-to-VAXmail translations posted if they don't have ALL-IN-1
>    accounts.
    
>    Just another poor excuse for a massive waste of dead trees.
    
>    Andy

Gee, maybe if MTSmail didn't include a trees worth of bogus information (the
distribution list) those trees would still be standing; what's MTSmail's excuse
for including it?

/Harley_who's_NOT_the_MTSmail_mangler_at_his_site

        RE: .137
        
        
>    Just use your imagination... Still last year, at great expenses a call
>    escalation program was designed by some internal application
>    programmers. It has not a tenth of the functionality of Vaxnotes, it
>    is cumbersome to use, you need to login in one special account (why ?)
>    and it's purpose is to allow communication between the different
>    individuals involved in a call escalation. 
 

        GIA Field  Service  has implemented an escalation program
        this year which  is  not  cumbersome  to  use and is very
        effective in maintaining communications over a very large
        area.  It is called  C-ONE  (Customer Outage Notification
        and  Escalation  or  Customer-ONE)  and  uses   the  same
        principle as VAXNotes for information storage.   It  also
        adds    a  very  effective  means  of  communicating  and
        escalating  problems  to  higher  levels of Management or
        Technical Resources.    This is something VAXNotes cannot
        do by itself.

   
>    Why don't we use the right tools instead of trying to rediscover 
     the wheel ?

        If we  just  freeze  everything  where it is now, then we
        will be past over by our competitors who will continue to
        improve and do things  better for their customers.  It is
        important that we always try  to  find  a  better  way or
        improve  on  what  we already have.    I  hope  we  never
        restrict  the  creative  and imaginative people who  make
        this company what it is today.  That would be real waste!
        
        
    

>Gee, maybe if MTSmail didn't include a trees worth of bogus information (the
>distribution list) those trees would still be standing; what's MTSmail's excuse
>for including it?

So that when you reply, the reply can go to everyone who received the original
message.  Along with more trees of information, so that reply can go everywhere.

    RE .137
    AMEN!!!!!!!!!!!
    
    Sometimes I think we don't have eyes to see the obviuos (sp) or 
    ears to hear what we are saying to the rest of the world.
    Curtis

    I suggest this would be profitably persued in IAMOK::MTSNOTES.
    
    - Andy

The Stow, MA site is apparently making major efforts to cut costs.
This memo was issued today to all tenants. It is reprinted here without 
permission.

Issued by: Tony Fernandes, Stow Site Services Manager
Subject: OGO FY90 SERVICES

As a result of the US wide effort to reduce the company's expense
structure, the OGO Site Services Organization has responded with
service budget reductions. Implementation of these reductions should
have minimal impact on productivity and comfort, but will yield a
savings of $483K. Your cooperation and support for these actions,
and ongiong help in identifying additional opportunities for savings,
will be greatly appreciated:

1.  OFFICE SERVICES

* Elimination of four (4) convenience copiers and reducing availability
  of the walkup Xerox 1090 copiers to regular business hours (exceptions
  will be considered on a case by case business need).

* Reduce stock of standard DEC forms.

* Reduce stationery supply inventory to large volume items only.

* Reduce frequency of mail delivery/pickup to once per day versus
  current three times per day.

* Eliminate handling of personal mail.

* Reduce scope of custodial services; e.g. reduce frequency of trash
  pickup, eliminate routine cleaning of enclosed offices, etc.

2.  PLANT ENGINEERING

* Tenant requested off-hours work will be reduced with the goal being
  zero off-hours work.

* Off-hours lighting schedules and availability will be modified to
  reduce electrical consumption.

* Building temperatures and temperature schedules will be adjusted to
  reduce electrical consumption while maintaining a comfortable and
  productive environment.

* Purchases and/or installation of any new electrical consuming
  equipment into OGO will be closely monitored. The goal being equal
  reduction of power consumption by elimination of older equipment.

3.  SECURITY

* Elimination of on-demand locksmith services, i.e., opening of
  offices, files, desks. Requesters may come to Security to sign out
  keys.

* Elimination of non-emergency message delivery to common conference
  rooms.

4.  FACILITY COSMETICS

* Frequency of inner-loop lawn mowing will be reduced, mowing of grass
  on outer-loop will be eliminated.

* Planting of flowering annuals will be by-passed.

 5. MISC & GENERAL

* Passenger shuttle service will be discontinued.

* Community Contributions budget has been reduced.

* Name plate holders and extension cords will no longer be supplied at
  no cost. Requesting cost centers will be charged or will have to order
  these items on their own.

* Telephone availability in common conference rooms will be reduced.
  Teleconference capability will only be available in the following
  rooms: Assabet, Pilot Grove, Cortland and Bolton.

All of these actions will be effective by July 2.

If you have any questions, or need further information, please feel free
to contact Tony Fernandes @276-9010 or on All-In-1 mail @OGO.

I received the attached course announcement last night.  Why do we have an
external company coming in-house to teach us how to customize EVE/TPU?
Doesn't Ed Services have instructors qualified to teach this material
the site training group could hire for a week?
    
    
    
From:	SHARE::ETEREGISTRAR "23-Jun-1989 1639" 23-JUN-1989 20:42:13.37
To:	@DISK$USER3:[TSS]TSS.DIS;
CC:	
Subj:	Upcoming Cours-Customizing the EVE/TPU Text Editor

                  ETE - Engineering Training and Education
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                  ETE      Courses Description
________________________________________________________________________________
Title             CUSTOMIZING THE EVE/TPU TEXT EDITOR                         
Instructor(s)     PRODUCTIVE SOLUTIONS CO.      
Date              24-JUL-89 - 28-JUL-89
Time              8:30 -  5:00
Location          SSD CLASSROOM HLO2-1/D07      
Course Number     01CEE-01
Course Fee        $ 1200
Registration      Log into COURSES software on SHARE.
                  Username and Password are both COURSES.
Cancellation      PLEASE CANCEL 3 WEEKS PRIOR TO THE COURSE START DATE TO     
                  AVOID BEING CHARGED.                                        

Course Description: The EVE editor can be easily customized to add new          
                  features. The features can be simple or complex and meet
                  specific user needs or application/group needs.
                                                                                
                  This Lecture/Lab course will teach the students how to
                  customize the EVE interface. The students will learn how
                  to program in the TPU programming language. The
                  construction of the EVE interface in the TPU programming
                  language will be explained in detail. The student will
                  learn to incorporate these modifications and utilities
                  into an EVE interrface for personal or group wide use.
                                                                                
Course Highlights:                                                              
                  *  Simple and Complex methods of Modifying the Interface
                  *  Command, Initialization, and Section files
                  *  Components of EVE; How EVE is constructed using TPU
                  *  Using EVE$BUILD to build your own transportable interface
                  *  Elements of the TPU programming language
                  *  EVE/TPU procedures and TPU built-ins
                  *  Programming techniques in TPU
                  *  Common extensions to the EVE interface
                                                                                
Prerequisites:    Students should be proficient in high level programming
                  language and be comfortable with programming logic and
                  concepts.
                  
Intended Audience: Technical developers who want to build a custsomized         
                  EVE interface for themselves or for use by a group of users.
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                  Engineering Training & Education,
                  Supporting Semiconductor Operations


    Have you asked the advertiser? Asking here is not productive.
    
    Having said that, I believe we're REAL short of instructors. Those
    4,000 moving into sales et al could probably stand 10% going to Edu.
    
    - ���

    Yes, I have asked the advertiser.

    Asking here may or may not be productive, depending on whether someone
    reading the note has more knowledge of the situation and/or is more
    willing to respond than the person responsible for mailing the
    announcement.

    It may very well be that no course development has been funded (funding
    *sometimes* depends on the ability to return a certain level of
    revenue from the course the same fiscal year it is developed) for
    this course. 
    
    Also, there may not be a strong enough market out there for an "editor
    specific" course.
    
    My knowledge on funding is tied to how I understand external training
    (customer) to work.  Perhaps someone with more knowledge on the
    internal side can add more.
    
    Irene
    Ed. Services-Customer Training
    
    p.s.  sounds like a great course - wouldn't mind taking it myself.
    

Re last few:  Sure, there are no doubt "good reasons" why a
DECcie didn't teach that course -- no instructor assigned to it,
no official DEC course, etc.  However, if that's the case, then
perhaps that's the sort of perspective that DEC as a company needs 
to break out of -- that is, perhaps we can use existing resources
in more creative ways.

I'm a software technical writer in the database area (Rdb and
tools). Last month I taught the Rdb/VMS Application Programming
customer course in Edmonton, Canada (5 days - the regular 
Educational Services course offering). I thoroughly enjoyed
the experience, and believe I benefitted greatly: expanded and
strengthened my database technical skills (preparing for the
class and handling student questions), and also gained insights 
into how customers learn and use the product I had been documenting. 

I know there are writers at my site (ZK - Spitbrook Road) and
elsewhere who are experts in EVE/TPU. (I've attended some
excellent training seminars here at ZK by one of them.) I wouldn't
be surprised if there are some writers (or people in other jobs)
who would welcome the opportunity to prepare and deliver a course 
in EVE/TPU customization. 

P.S. for you managers reading this: In addition to the personal and
professional benefits I gained from my teaching experience, my cost center
got some monetary benefit (an internal funds transfer) for my teaching 
services. So, it's possible for everyone to benefit: the employee, the
cost center manager, and the company.

    I received a response today from someone involved in planning the
    course.  She said there were two problems:
    
    	1. Ed Services could not supply an instructor (she didn't
    	   say if it was a timing problem or if such instructors don't
    	   exist)
    
    	2. An Ed Services instructor would have cost more than the
    	   outside contractor
    
    Personally, I think something is wrong if it cost more to use
    internal resources to teach a course than to hire an external
    contractor.  Does anyone in Ed Services know if there is a
    particular person or group in that organization which might be
    willing to investigate this situation?

If what is going on in Dallas is any indication of what is going on in the rest
of the country, it probably was a shortage of instructors.  People seem to be
bailing out of Ed Svcs. right and left here.  In the past two years, we've had
4 very senior Ed Svcs. instructors join us in Software Services.

As for why the cost is so high, I've been told by my manager that when Ed Svcs.
was made into a cost center that was expected to turn a profit, the internal
cost for training skyrocketed.  Sounds like Ed Svcs. needs to be a bit more
competitive in pricing.

Bob

    re: 153,

�    Personally, I think something is wrong if it cost more to use
�    internal resources to teach a course than to hire an external
�    contractor.

    There definitely is something wrong. Our overhead structure as a
    corporation is such that this is true in a number of areas, not just
    Ed. Services. Of course, that's why we're going through (and/or will
    be going through?) a massive re-organization. 

>    	2. An Ed Services instructor would have cost more than the
>    	   outside contractor

This is ridiculous!  Aren't these people being paid a fixed salary?

    re. 156
    
    What if he/she had to travel from U.S.A. to Europe etc. and
    the Contractor lived in the same European city as the plant ?
    
    Just guessing but I hate it when things cost more internally
    than externally as well. Now what about F/S costs ?
    
    Lloyd

    re: .156

>>    	2. An Ed Services instructor would have cost more than the
>>    	   outside contractor
>
>This is ridiculous!  Aren't these people being paid a fixed salary?

    My statement of the second point was imprecise.  I should have said
    that Ed Services would have charged more for the instructor than
    the outside contractor.

    My uninformed guess is that the charge for the Ed Services instructor
    included a profit, as was mentioned in a previous reply.  If this is
    the case, I don't understand why it is being done for internal courses.

    re: .157

    Good point.  In this case the course is being offered in Hudson, MA,
    USA.

    I was excited by the news in New Hampshire views this week.  They
    will be putting up new distribution boxes so that we can get their
    outed newsletter easier.  Boy did that make my day!
    In stead of a new box, how 'bout a raise?  Or a subscription to
    Nashua Telegraph, who prints Digital news before NH Views.
    ed
    

    I see approximately 50-100 people in the WMO cafeteria each day
    wearing "CONTRACT" badges, while:
    
    1.  My hard-earned raise has been delayed at least 3 months due
    	to expense-cutting.
    
    2.  There are hundreds of people in WMO and NIO looking for new
    	jobs through the Transition Management Program.
    
    Why is DEC paying outside contract and temporary agencies
    _real_cash_money_ while there are plenty of people already drawing a
    DEC check while looking for work?
    
    -Don-

    Those who think that contract workers are a waste, think for a minute.
    
    We hire contractors for sound business reasons:
    
    	1.  We need a specific skill that does not exist in the corporation
    	    currently *and* makes no business sense to develop.  
    
    	2.  The need is temporary (and temporary might be several years).
    
    	3.  The cost to hire, train and retain similarly skilled people 
    	    exceeds the cost of the contractor.
    
	4.  We can get rid of the person on a moment's notice.
    
    Given the key criteria "temporary", "special skill", and "cost",
    what sense is there in retraining idle people to perform jobs there
    is no corporate need to develop?  Better they should train for jobs
    where there is a long term business requirement than simply as higher 
    cost replacements for contractors.

    Our business is the design, manufacture, and sale of computers
    and related products and services.  We should spend our precious
    capital developing skills which support that business goal
    directly, not on ancillary tasks such as landscaping, clerical,
    or maybe even MIS (to use an example).
    
    Al

    

    re: outside contract employees
    
    There was a rumor going around a couple of weeks ago that that these
    contracts were going to be phased out and not renewed beginning in Q2
    (that is, next fall), but I never saw anything official on the subject
    (and you know how it is about rumors in *this* place!).
    
    I've wondered the same thing every time there is a slowdown in DEC; eg 
    four years ago, when my previous (engineering) job was cancelled and I
    was "outplaced", but the outside consultants in the group still had
    jobs (and made a lot more than any of us did).

    Re: [.158]:  You mean that Ed Services makes a profit, but outside
    contractors don't?
    
    Re: [.160]:  Hey, Digital will be glad to hire you on as a contractor
    instead of a direct employee.
    
    When the job is finished, you'll be laid off, and you won't have a
    complaint, will you?  8^)

    RE: .161
    
    
    very well said!

    I just received the following at my office:
    
    A WORKSYSTEMS, ULTRIX, SUN... Training Package, which contains:
    
    	- Study Guide
    	- Brochures
    	- 3 cassette tapes
    	- 1 Video Tape
    
    One of these packages was sent to EVERY SALES REP AND SOFTWARE
    SPECIALIST IN MY OFFICE!!!
    
    I happen to find this material useful as, no doubt, will others. But
    Sales Training could have sent one or two copies PER OFFICE instead of
    one per person! 
    
    -Colleen

    re: .163
    
>    Re: [.158]:  You mean that Ed Services makes a profit, but outside
>    contractors don't?
    
    I'm afraid I don't see where I implied that outside contractors don't
    make a profit.  My point was that I don't understand why Ed Services
    should make a profit on internal courses, if indeed they are.
    

    re: 166,

�    My point was that I don't understand why Ed Services should make a
�    profit on internal courses, if indeed they are. 

    As I understand it, no part of Digital is permitted to make a
    "profit" on internal activities, just expense relief. However, if
    Ed. Services uses their employee instructors to deliver courses to
    paying customers and make a profit, that's goodness. If they then
    have to go hire contractors in the short term to meet their
    "internal" commitments, so be it. Why should this give anyone
    heartburn? 

    re: .167
    
    Let's say my cost center, which has nothing to do with Ed Services,
    wants to offer a course related to a Digital product.  Assuming we
    don't have anyone qualified to teach the course, we can contract for
    an instructor from Ed Services or we can contract for one outside the
    company.  [For simplicity I'm ignoring a previous suggestion to have
    a Tech Writer familiar with the product teach the course.]
    
    If Ed Services does not have any qualified instructors available to
    teach the course, then I see no problem bringing in someone from the
    outside.  However, if an internal instructor is available but cost
    more than an external instructor, then I believe there is a problem.
    The overhead for an internal instructor should not be so high that
    an external contractor can provide a body and make a profit for less.

    re: .168

�    The overhead for an internal instructor should not be so high that
�    an external contractor can provide a body and make a profit for less.

    I think we're on the verge of violent agreement, Jerry. If this is
    the reason that Ed. Services is using a contractor in this case then
    I think it points up the problem that the re-org is trying to solve.
    All I meant to do is point out that this could also be a
    "second-order" effect of the hiring freeze. 

    - Larry.

    
    Ref: 170
    
    I agree with .170
    
    In my opinion, when discrimination is permitted to exist in any
    form whatsoever, then it will exist, where the preference will be
    to bring in those from outside that one 'likes' or prefers, rather
    than doing the right thing in accepting transfers, training them
    accordingly.
     

Follow-up to .152, .153, and others on the use of outsiders to
teach courses to DEC employees:

Here's an example of the trend I'd like to see DEC encourage --
the creative use of "non-traditional" internal resources for providing
instruction to employees [and where appropriate, customers too].
From the June 26 "New Hampshire View" (internal newsletter):

"Art Williams, MSD Group Manager, presented the [Individual Recognition]
awards to Eric Postpischil and Steve Realmuto, Senior Software Engineers
in the RSX Development Group. Steve and Eric conceived, developed, and
taught a one-week training course on the C programming language which was
required by software engineers in the RSX group for their assignments on
a new project. Their course saved training costs and eliminated several
weeks of excess waiting time. Other groups have expressed an interest in
the resulting course structure and materials."

 Digital - Salem, NH, facility redesign drastically reduces electricity use
	{New Hampshire View (Digital newsletter), 26-Jun-89, p. 10}
   "There's gold in them thar hills" can be applied to "them thar Lights" in
 Salem's NIO facility. The Granite State Electric Company recently presented a
 check for $108,000 to the NIO plant management as a 100% cost rebate due to
 Digital's participation in Granite State's Commercial and Industrial Lighting
 rebate program. Mark Lambert, a facility engineer and NIO Energy Coordinator,
 worked with Fred Guertin from the Corporate Energy Group in Maynard to help
 re-design the lighting fixtures. With the installation of the new equipment,
 lighting quality was improved while electricity consumption was reduced by
 50%. Beyond the rebate check, Digital will receive the continuing benefit of
 reduced electricity cost. More than $125,000 per year will be saved. Granite
 State Electric is a subsidiary of the New England Electric System (NEES) who
 understands that conservation is among the best and least costly methods of
 meeting New England's increased demands for electricity. Salem Manufacturing
 is one of Digital's first sites to participate in this program. Other
 cost-saving ideas are under development throughout New Hampshire
 Administrative Services as New Hampshire's public utilities look for ways to
 keep costs down while providing reliable supplies of electricity.

re: .153, .168 and others suggesting that contractors can be less expensive
 to use than internals resources -

	Nope - Sorry, but I have to agree with the noter who alluded to
	it all being "funny money". According to my brand of Mathematics
	it's not reasonable that an outside contractor can be cheaper
	than what would be charged by an internal resource (with the possible
	exception of travel expenses incurred by internal resources which
	might not be required by local contractors as was mentioned.)

	Here's how I see it. Let's say in any given week DEC has a given
	amount of cash, call it X. It also has a fixed amount of money to
	pay to various vendors (materials, power, taxes, etc.), call it Y.
	It also has a fixed payroll which it pays to employees, call it Z.
	(For simplicity sake we'll leave revenues out of the picture as I
	think they have no bearing on the case at hand.)
	So after paying its expenses (Y+Z) out of its cash (X), it has some
	amount, call it N, left.

		X - (Y + Z) = N

	Now, all things remaining the same, if DEC also chooses to buy an
	outside contractor who has a cost of C, this equation changes to

		X - (Y + Z + C) = N - C

	Unless I miss my guess, by definition

		 N-C < N

	ergo DEC is out more money and in fact the use of the contractor
	cost DEC more.


re:  <<< Note 821.161 by HOCUS::KOZAKIEWICZ "Shoes for industry" >>>
                         -< Contractors are not waste >-


	While I agree with you in theory, Al, I cannot agree that in practice
	what you say is true.

>    	1.  We need a specific skill that does not exist in the corporation
>    	    currently *and* makes no business sense to develop.  

	I see instead that the skill does exist in the corporation but we're
	choosing not to use it. I know of plenty of engineers "on transition"
	who are _not_ doing jobs that contract engineers _are_. In some cases
	there may be a difference in level of expertise, but not necessarily
	in ability. Unfortunately, in my 11+ years of experience in engineering
	I have _*NEVER*_, I repeat, _*NEVER*_, seen a contractor brought in
	for the reason you mention, but rather, because there is a need for
	personnnel on a project to get the job done and the cost center can
	not get the approval for funding to increase headcount and bring in
	another employee, but they _*CAN*_ buy a contractor because that
	doesn't increase headcount or affect budget! That's stupid!

>    	2.  The need is temporary (and temporary might be several years).

	I think several years is unreasonable to consider as temporary. I
	think some government agencies agreed , which is why our TAGs are
	now not allowed to mork more than some relatively short period
	(a year or less) without taking a leave. Besides, on average
	people in DEC spend less than three years in a given position,
	so attrition should accommodate temporary need within any given
	organization.
    
>    	3.  The cost to hire, train and retain similarly skilled people 
>    	    exceeds the cost of the contractor.

	We're not considering hiring people, but making use of the people
	we already have in the company. Training is often not an issue
	(re: engineers "on transition" to do engineering work, for example),
	and retention of excess people is already taking place anyway.
	(See the mathematics above.)
    
>	4.  We can get rid of the person on a moment's notice.

	Granted.
    
	Regarding clerical, groundskeeping and MIS personnel, as long as
	we remain in business and have our own facilities I expect these
	are services we will require. There's no getting around that, and
	I don't think anyone would claim that not to be the case. Don't
	get me wrong, you've seen plenty of my notes in this conference
	and others indicating that I'm adamantly opposed to indiscriminate
	hiring. I certainly recognize that there are costs associated
	with full time employees which are not borne for contractors
	(e.g. bennies, vacations, etc., etc., etc.). But I must contend
	that using internal excess manpower, in general, and in the long term
	will cost DEC less money. Buying contractors is largely false
	economy. (My apologies to any of my contractor friends - this isn't
	meant as an attack on you, but I do feel that we need to "look
	out for our own" first.)


	-Jack

>	I certainly recognize that there are costs associated
>	with full time employees which are not borne for contractors
    
    This really isn't the case.  Contractors pay their own benefits and set
    their rates to cover these costs.  One way or the other, you pay for
    benefits.  Look at the hourly rate we pay contractors versus the hourly
    pay earned by Deccies doing the same job.  I expect you'll see a
    significant difference.
    
    -dave

re:           <<< Note 821.176 by BMT::BOWERS "Count Zero Interrupt" >>>
                          -< Ain't necessarily so... >-

    Maybe you misread me, Dave. I simply said that DEC bears costs associated
    with full time employees that it does not bear for contractors. Certainly
    contractors pay for their own benefits and charge accordingly as you
    mention, but the overall benefit to DEC of using contractors is largely
    the ability to terminate them at will, where allowable by the terms
    of the contract, or at the contract's expiration, otherwise. While I
    have no facts to substantiate my claim, I expect that if you take into
    account _ALL_ of the benefits paid for by DEC to which an employee is
    entitled, and add that cost per employee to each employee's salary, the
    hourly rate for a given employee is probably comparable to the rate
    paid to a contractor in a similar position. Keep in mind that this is not
    simply the figure included in your benefits brochure mailed home annually
    (i.e. DEC's contribution to your Social Security, etc.), but also the cost
    of maintaining an Employee Assistance program, providing Life Centers,
    giving you Christmas turkeys, etc. All rather "intangible" things that
    a contractor must pay for out of his/her own pocket if interested. I don't
    want to debate the equity of these programs nationwide, either - simply
    recognize that they _are_ benefits paid for by DEC which are available
    to all employees located where they are offered.

    -Jack

Recently the SDC did a mailing to all ADS customers encouraging them
to acquire CDreaders and drop subscriptions to traditional magnetic media
and paper.  The mailing included an easy to use order form, plus a
customized description of each addressee's current subscription costs,
and an estimated time to repay the hardware costs (usually less than
a year).

Their last report (and I may be off on the numbers but in the right
ballpark) showed an 8% "buy rate" (which is phenomenal for a direct
mail campaign).

Those 8% conversions will save the company between $1-2 million
dollars in real money, *annually* (in fact, it increases since the
traditional kits keep growing and becoming more numerous).

Have you ordered yours?

- greg

    re: .174

>re: .153, .168 and others suggesting that contractors can be less expensive
> to use than internals resources -
>
>	Nope - Sorry, but I have to agree with the noter who alluded to
>	it all being "funny money".

    At the corporate level internal cross-charges are funny money; I
    don't believe that is true at the cost center level.  It is my
    impression that a cost center manager pays both internal and external
    bills from the same pot of money.  Unless the CC managers gets enough
    brownie points for being good corporate citizens to offset the
    stigma of exceeding their budget, it doesn't seem unreasonable that
    they'd consider their own bottom line first.

    re .179

>   At the corporate level internal cross-charges are funny money; I
>   don't believe that is true at the cost center level.  It is my
>   impression that a cost center manager pays both internal and external
>   bills from the same pot of money.  Unless the CC managers gets enough
>   brownie points for being good corporate citizens to offset the
>   stigma of exceeding their budget, it doesn't seem unreasonable that
>   they'd consider their own bottom line first.


    True true true. "Expenses" are expenses, it doesn't matter where they
    come from.

    Bizarre problems:

    Software Services couldn't subcontract consultants to a customer
    because, even though the consultant cost was passed straight through and
    paid for by the customer, the district had to earn 50% margin (100%
    profit) on their EXPENSE (we give the check to the consultant, hence
    it's an expense). I don't even want to talk about the _battle_ to change
    that and all the "that's just the way it works, sorry"'s.

    Copier paper is bought and paid for through facilities. What do they do
    to contain paper expenses? Secretaries have to order their own boxes of
    paper for their LN03. It's not even the same paper, so I'm sure we're
    losing volume discounts as well.

    Someone in the office had their mail opened by facilities because it
    looked like personal mail. It was a work related letter to their doctor.
    There should be more effective ways to save money.

    The list goes on...
    

    /Peters  

    re: .180
    
>    Someone in the office had their mail opened by facilities because it
>    looked like personal mail. It was a work related letter to their doctor.

    This is absolutely unacceptable!  If the mailroom personnel had reason
    to suspect the mail was personal they should simply have contacted the
    sender.
    

    re .-1

    a)   They didn't contact the sender, they just opened it, put it into a
         manila envelope with a memo about "personal use" of mail, and sent
         it back through internal mail (they didn't notify the person even
         afer opening it).

    b)   All mail, once it enters the mailroom, is "Digital property" for
         Digital to do as it wants.

    I wonder what the rules are if it had been marked "Confidential". I 
    suppose if it were marked "Personal and Confidential" they might have
    at least returned it, but unopened. I too think that there was a less
    outrage-provoking way of doing things.

    /Peters

     Now that you got me on the topic...

     Someone else, different office, sent literature to a customer in
     a hand-addressed manila envelope. That too was opened and returned
     -- clearly in error -- as personal. Meanwhile, the customer was
     waiting, and waiting...

     Also, what does the Digital person say to the customer when trying to
     explain why they didn't get their information? "Sorry, our mailroom
     opened it because they thought it was personal mail. I didn't know
     until it showed up after being sent back to me."

     Would you the customer think:

     (1) this person couldn't get together a simple request for information
         and has come up with a really lame excuse

     (2) boy, if I send a letter to someone at Digital, I wonder how many
         other people get to read it before it gets to the person I sent
         it to

     (3) what impressive cost containment, we should hire on another person
         at _our_ mailroom to do this, too

     Somehow, I don't see any positives in this.

     /Peters

    Sounds ridiculous. I've sent and received hand-addressed mail for yonks
    with no problems. Take it up with your group Manager.
    
    - ���

re: .178

>Have you ordered yours?

Yes, we have...unfortunately we can't seem to get ADS/SSB to stop sending
multiple copies of the traditional media and documentation.  It's really a
shame, because most of it gets thrown out without ever being used.  There
is apparently some trick related to the fact that we have Colorado Springs
contracts on some of our systems that causes us to get 2-3 copies of some
kits and documentation...not sure why SSB can't detect this duplication.

So...as of now...we may have actually gotten our first ConDist CD, but if
so the box is hidden under about 100 unopened boxes and envelopes of
traditional media and documentation.  Ridiculous!
								paul
P.s.  (and we have tried to correct this situation, believe me!)

    Paul,
    
    The ConDist CDs are shipped in a cardboard box which is somewhat
    smaller than those used by the SDC for other software/documentation.
    Knowing this should make it easier for you to locate without opening
    every box.

re: 185

I've forwarded your note to Paula Zenitz (blumon::) --- she is
the ConDist product manager (or was, we're transitioning it to SSB).

- greg

Ladies and Gentlemen,
		     I am interested to know what you think 
of the following which has been extracted from a new product 
status report. In order to maintain a standard of company 
confidentiality, I have removed the name of the product and 
replaced it with *new product*.

My query is this, does digital REALLY NEED all of the quoted
resource to introduce a new product and why?

Don H


 'There are now eleven' *new product* 'work groups formed and meeting
  to develop strategy and deliverables for the announcement. 
  They are the Messages group, Announcement group, customer
  Communications group, Sales Communications group, Field Launch
  group, Customer Events group, Product Management group,
  Consultant Programs group, Services group, Applications group,
  and the Competitive Strategy group'.
 

Certainly could be seen as extreme. Is this new product high impact, high volume
etc etc? What PAC code is assigned to it (S1, S2 etc etc)?

Andy

Re: < Note 821.188 by AYOU46::D_HUNTER "The Blue McJock." >

> My query is this, does digital REALLY NEED all of the quoted
> resource to introduce a new product and why?

Yes -- *if* all those groups are indeed doing what their names indicate.
Introducing a new product (i.e., introducing it properly and effectively)
is a complex process. Moreover, DEC needs to be aggressive to ensure that
the product wins acceptance and cooperation among "those who count": 
independent consultants and other specialists (whose opinions influence
customer purchases), third-party developers of related hardware or software,
and so forth. It's certainly not enough these days to engineer a great
product and then simply issue a perfunctory press release.

Now, if it could be shown that any of the groups you mentioned was doing
useless (or no) work, or if two or more groups performed overlapping 
functions, that would be waste -- and a good manager would be on the
lookout for such instances.

I can't find out how much the internal crosscharge is!!

Without that, my boss (rightly!) won't let me sign up for it!

This is in the UK, by the way, and I'm chasing it down the "appropriate
channels".

Sometimes, it's hard to try and "do the right thing."

Peter.

re: .191  Cross charge amount

I've forwarded that one on as well (to both Pmgt and ESSB's US liason).

- greg

    Don't get me wrong, I believe that the CD distribution is a great idea
    and that all internal people should use it as much as possible.
    
    What I have a problem with was the mailing itself.  Was the 9x12x3 inch
    cardboard box and tape really needed to send out 6 pages of
    information?  We had more of those boxes laying around our office area
    than I could believe.  I would hate to think what ZK3-4 looked like...
    they must have gotten them shipped in by the palete!
    
    As a result, they were all hand delivered by the shipping people to
    each office as opposed to using the mail rooms...
    
    I just can't believe that that was an efficient way to do a mass
    mailing.
    
    cheers,
    jeff
    

Well, it perhaps could have been done better (the mailing), but
it's already paid for itself, and they may have just used what
was handy (SDC understands boxes, shipping labels, etc) ... at
least they've got it done.  Besides, boxes get opened, envelopes
sometimes get tossed.

By the way, the business about not being able to cancel subscriptions
to traditional media has been passed on to the appropriate person
in SDC --- if it's fixable, I believe they're the ones who can fix it.

- greg

    By the way, once this has been running for a few years, what are
    we going to do with all our old CDs?
    
    Unlike magtapes, they're unreusable.
    
    I imagine they're unrecyclable as well (plastic and metal too
    tightly integrated?).
    
    

BTW, I got (some of) the figures I needed this morning...

The CD documentation disk is $40.39.... what a bargain!

Oh, and unfortunately I still haven't been able to get the price
for the ConDist, ESDC haven't got a price yet for Q1 FY90.....

Peter.

    re: .195
    
    CD's are made from a polycarbonate resin; GE's LEXAN (a good customer
    of ours) is one supplier.
    
    Polycarbonates are quite recyclable. An optical disk would be like
    any other coated product - you sand the coating off and then regrind
    the base resin.  The recycle can then be used to make other products,
    usually utility grades.
    
    Since most CD grade polycarbonate resins are manufactured in upwards 
    of 30,000 LB batches, you might consider how many CD's would have
    to be collected in order to make any noticable difference in the
    recycle pile...
    
    Al
    

    re  .154
    
    Sorry to have missed the string of notes when this was more relevant,
    but better late than never....
    
    People have been bailing out of Ed. Services for some time elsewhere,
    as well, at least in the U.S.
    
    Wish I felt like someone high up cared enough to check, and ask why.
    
    -- former Ed. Servicer, bill linn

> Oh, and unfortunately I still haven't been able to get the price
> for the ConDist, ESDC haven't got a price yet for Q1 FY90.....

It too should be inexpensive enough for your manager to sign off on.
That is, internal prices only reflect pure manufacturing/stocking/dist-
ribution costs and should almost always be well under $100.

Consider advising your manager that CD will normally be between one
and two ORDERS OF MAGNITUDE less expensive than other ADS offerings.

re: recyling

It's not a few years ... they'll be obsoleted every couple of months.
I doubt there's much of value in the plastic ... on the order of a
penny I'd expect.  On balance, I doubt it scores very high on the
environmental scale.  It'll be a long time before DEC's discs can
be noticed against the output of the audio industry, and probably a
long time before all CDs together are a disposal issue.

Let's see ... a disc weighs perhaps a quarter ounce?  And your docset
or 9trk tape weighs ... ?

- greg

>It's not a few years ... they'll be obsoleted every couple of months.
    
    I meant, it'd be a few years before I'd accumulated enough
    obsolete disks to worry about.
    
>On balance, I doubt it scores very high on the environmental scale.  
    
    Well, that was my point.  Or did you mean "on the environmental-affect
    scale"?  :-)
    
>It'll be a long time before DEC's discs can
>be noticed against the output of the audio industry, and probably a
>long time before all CDs together are a disposal issue.
    
    The difference is that when I get audio CDs, I don't intend to
    dispose of them.  Or, if I do, I'll sell/give them to someone
    else who will use them as audio CDs.   By contrast, once a
    digital CD has become obsolete, it's scrap.

>Let's see ... a disc weighs perhaps a quarter ounce?  And your docset
>or 9trk tape weighs ... ?
    
    CDs won't make my docset obsolete (this is a religious issue!).
    And I'll reuse the 9trk tape many times before it wears out.
    

        And what is to stop CD technology from going into a re-usable
        state in the near future. 
        
        Be like me, go for CD-Art. I am collecting old cdroms to make into
        wall hangings etc.
        
        q
        

    There's a little note in the directions for the CD that says you
    can dispose of it by feeding it into a paper shredder!
    
    Willie

    re .202
    
    Are you serious ? CD's are flimsy but I wouldn't have thought they were
    flimsy enough for the average office shredder ! Industrial strength
    maybe.
    
    Jon

    Page 2 of the AD Software Consolidation manual, after the FOR INTERNAL
    USE ONLY warning (Don't let these things get outside the corporation!):
    
    "	When you recieve a new update, destroy the old CD platter
    	by putting it through a paper shredder or cutting it with
    	a paper cutter.							"
    
    
    Willie

	in reply to many notes in the .150 to .170 ranges....

	Sorry for the late reply but I got WAY behind on following
this conference and am just now catching up.

	I am the Training Operations Manager for one of the employee
training groups  in Ed Services.  The assertion by the person from 
MAET that we cost more than outside consultants is, unfortunately, 
often true.  We do provide a lot of training for MAET but they also 
get a lot from the outside.

	In employee or internal training, we do NOT make a profit
(or at least we are not supposed to).  However, we are not supposed 
to spend more than we recover either.  We charge enough for our 
courses and instructors to break even.  Of course, we have to factor 
in all of our overhead expenses.  The nature of the Digital beast
is that those overhead expenses are high.
	
	When we set a price for a course, we do not know whether
we will use our own instructor, import one from a remote training 
center (or get a DECcie from outside Ed Services), or go outside 
the company.  We charge the same price regardless.  We end up losing 
$$ on some courses and making money on others.  My job is to make sure 
we balance out in the end.  Last year (FY-89) we came very close (within 1%).

	As far as instructor resources, there are surplusses in some
parts of Ed Services and shortages in others.  We are trying to balance
those things out, too.  

	Hope this clears some things up.

Frank

How about U.S. Field News.  Not only is it pure B.S., I got my July issue on 
August 28.  Talk about timely communication.

Bob

Re                      <<< Note 821.117 by STAR::ROBERT >>>
               -< What percent of our disk blocks hold garbage? >-

  I just spotted this note, and it reminded me of a prototype which my
  (then) group developed a few years ago. It was an Expert System which
  hunted around for files you might want to delete and created a command
  procedure which you (system manager) could edit (remove the comments)
  and run to delete no-longer-needed files. Some users reported
  significant savings in disk space (upwards of 10%) on a regular basis,
  and this was with a fairly primitive prototype (there were plenty of
  suggested improvements, most of which were feasible). Some users liked
  it enough to add a friendly user interface which made editing and
  running the command procedure much easier for system managers, and
  some even set it up to run semi-automatically.

  The project was dropped for lack of funding (priorities required us to
  devote our efforts elsewhere), and the fellow who developed it has
  recently left Digital for IBM, but, to my knowledge, the program
  (called EXPURGE) still exists and maybe still runs. It seems to me
  that if we could cut Company-wide use of disk space by 10%, we would
  be saving millions of dollars -- hopefully far less than what it would
  cost to develop and maintain the software. Just to set expectations at
  the right level: I don't believe that such a program would be
  genuinely useful until it finds a home in a proper engineering group,
  and gets developed into a real piece of software. It still needs
  plenty of work.

  If anyone is interested, I believe there's a dormant notesfile with
  some info at YIPPEE::EXPURGE. If you want the name of a person to
  contact for more info, please send me mail.

    Another way to save disk space is to file mail that you know that
    if needed will only be needed in the next 30, 60 and 90 days
    in separate mail folders. Then on the first of each month go in
    and delete the messages beyond the "expiration" date. 

Re: .175 (discussion about contractors).

In the UK at least, the excuse "I'll use a contractor because I've got the
money, but can't increase the headcount" is supposed to be abolished soon.

All contractors will be included in the headcount (of course, this may be
adjusted from the current figure) and subject to the various constraints
that that implies.

In addition part-time people will be counted as part-heads.  Right now one
part-timer is still counted as one head.

jb

    re: .209
    
    Don't count on the "current figure" being adjusted when contractors are
    included in headcount.  A while ago our college co-ops started being
    counted, but our authorization didn't increase.
        John Sauter

	I'll chuck in a small war story here about "Part time" heads.

 Seems that there is an operations group in HLO that for years hired Assebet
 High school students as part of their work study program. They needed jobs
 in the industry while they went to school and the operations managers  needed
 operators on second shift to run arround the computer rooms hanging tape. 
 They got hired and were listed as "temporary part-time employees". The 
 students actually shared a job. IE for every "job" there was two students. 
 One week working followed by one week in school.

 The Bean Counters changed the counting algorithm and the four students got
 treated as four bodies. Even tho on any given week you could only find two.

 We ended up after much hoo-rah and lost battles having to stop the use of the
 students and replace them with 2 full-time people. Net result to bean-counters
 was my headcount went down by 2. They are happy. My expenses went up by $22k.

 You see the students worked for ~$12k a year total cost or for the four 
 students ~$48k. A full time DEC operator ( on who I must pay medical, training,
 and all the other hidden costs) has an average cost of ~$35k. So my two full
 time people cost me ~$70k vs ~$48k.

 To the bean counters the name of the game was reduce heads. I was trying to
 cut expenses, and give a couple of high school age people a start on their
 careers. 

 I already told you who won. (At least this year)	/jon

Dropping the high school co-op program from Assabet is surely a sign that
DEC no longer exists and Digital is here to stay.

I'm one of the Assabet Valley Voc. High School graduates who was allowed
to participate in the high school co-op program in Marlboro in 1978.  I've
been with Digital since then {moving up from Jr. Operator to Prin. Programmer}
and know of at least another dozen employees who came thru thru same program. 
 In return for slave wages {3.67/hour without any vacation, sick time, 
or holiday pay}, two high school students per year were allowed to work as 
operators alternating weeks during the school year.

It was a mutually beneficial experience for myself and for Digital.
Trying to get and keep good operators has always been a challenge.

Someone in Hudson should take a look at the number of employees working 
for DEC that came thru the program and think long-term value instead of 
short- term dollars.

    Well, I just got my August/September issue of U.S. Field News, on
    October 20, informing me of such late-breaking news as the Field
    Service name change, etc.  What a waste!
    
    Can anybody tell me how to get off the mailing list?
    
    Bob

        Now here's something really incredible.  A unit of software
        engineers who happen to have Software Specialist titles (SWS/E)
        tell their manager that they don't want Sales Update and
        Competitive Update.  So, said manager arranges to put here copies
        in a  public area and stop all specialists' subscriptions.  Here's
        the response:
        
                  I N T E R O F F I C E   M E M O R A N D U M

                                        Date:     14-Dec-1989 01:09pm EST
                                        From:     <someone's name>
                                                  <someone> @SLSTRN @OGO
                                        Dept:      
                                        Tel No:    

TO:  <a local secretary>


Subject: RE: Canceling Competitive Update subscriptions

Software Services personnel are pulled by job code from a distribution
list and individual names cannot be deleted.  Please have the recipients
pass their copies to someone who needs them or discard in Confidential
trash bins.

<someone's name>

I would suggest that someone in the unit collect all of the issues each week,
put them in an interoffice envelope, and send them to <someone>.

/john

    Re:  -.2
    
    It's no wonder we can't sell computers when we obviously have no
    idea how to work them!!!
    
    Don
    

    RE: .214
    
    Last May I posted reply .33 to this note telling my story of
    being a Software Services person who performs in a graphic 
    artist function.  I asked several times to have my name removed
    from the Sales Update distribution list.  I finally called 
    <someone> who told me my name couldn't be removed from the 
    distribution list until my Job Code Number changed.  
    
    Well...it did change last summer because of JEC and I still
    receive Sales Update and all it's related collateral.  Grrrr.
    Fortunately I found someone in the office that really appreciates
    me passing it along to her.
    
    Jodi-
    
    
    
    Jodi-
    
    

    
    What's really frustrating about this situation is that those people who
    can use Sales Updates and aren't in SWS/SALES can't get them since our
    job codes aren't approved.
    
    I'm in DIS and need Sales Updates both for equipment ordering info as
    well to help being prepared for the customer visits I'm involved with.
    Several months ago they "purged" my job code from the list and when I
    called I was told if I wasn't on the list I couldn't get it, no matter
    what. It then turned out that so many people complained that certain
    job codes were reviewed and reinstated...
    
    -Ray
    

    Ray, I get Sales Update and I am in MIS.  All I did was send them a
    memo telling them why I needed it.  I don't recall it being that hard
    to be put on the list.  By the way, someone must maintain a list of
    "other people" that are not pulled by job code.  Because I am a 16 job
    function and sales I believe is 58 & 59.  So <someone> is updating the
    other list.

    
    .218, Ray, want mine?  :-)
    
    gog
    

Speaking of Sales Update, here's an article from the 11-Dec-89 Sales
Update that deals directly with this topic...

Lee


                            FOR INTERNAL USE ONLY

                                                                  S11205.TXT


COMMITTEE TO ELIMINATE RED TAPE (CERT)

                                                  Management Response Center
                                                              DTN:  276-6477

(See Hardcopy for Art)

One of the highest priorities within Digital today is eliminating internal 
barriers that prevent you, the Sales Force, from doing your job effectively.  
Digital Management has set forth to identify and resolve these "red tape" 
issues, and your input will be a key component to successfully identifying 
solutions.

During DECathlon'88, participants were promised that the overwhelming "red 
tape" imposed on the Sales Force would be eliminated. To fulfill that 
promise and to meet your selling needs, Ken Olsen and Dave Grainger have 
asked that the Committee to Eliminate Red Tape (CERT) be established.  This 
committee, chaired by Abbott Weiss,  will report to the Corporate Operations 
Committee and will operate for no more than six months.

The purpose of the committee is to empower you, who are closest to the 
customer, to eliminate impediments which make it unnecessarily difficult to 
sell and service accounts.

In order to make it easier to do business with Digital, this cross-
functional team was selected from the field to assist in problem resolution 
and barrier removal.  The members are knowledgeable and eager to work on 
resolving the problems that you encounter in your job.  

The committee meets regularly to address issues such as:

                      Administration                                       
                      Measurements
                      Software Licensing
                      Warranty
                      Cross-Functional Teamwork/Support
                      Information Overload in the Field                    
                                                                           
Considerable effort has been made already to improve these areas, and it is 
the committee's intention to build on that work, not to repeat it.  Some of 
what needs to be done may involve spreading the word and implementing what 
other task forces, committees and individuals have already created.  The 
committee plans to:  enhance the field's empowerment; stress that policies 
are guidelines, not rules; encourage and provide closed-loop communica-
tions; and above all, keep the customers' perspective when initiating 
change. 

YOU CAN MAKE A DIFFERENCE!  WE NEED YOUR PARTICIPATION

One of your responsibilities, as a Digital employee, is to help maximize 
the company's efficiency, effectiveness and ultimately our profitability.  
Therefore, if you are aware of "red tape" that directly affects these 
areas, the company depends on you to communicate and help solve these 
problems.

WHAT STEPS SHOULD YOU TAKE?

o  Identify those areas that you believe are preventing you from getting 
   the job done in a timely manner. 

o  Share with us your ideas for resolution to the problem.  Be creative.  
   No problem is too trivial.  All solutions will be considered. 

o  Discuss the "red tape" issues you identified with your manager.  He/She 
   will be responsible for channeling your ideas through the Management 
   Response Center.  The Management Response Center (MRC), which was 
   announced by Dave Grainger on November 2, will be the vehicle for 
   sharing ideas and solutions.  The MRC will track the timeliness and 
   effectiveness of the business issues raised by you and keep you informed 
   via ACCESS.  Contact the MRC at DTN 276-6477.

Make a Difference!                                                         

re: .221

Talk about an oxymoron.  A COMMITTEE to eliminate red tape?

Bob

    re: -.1
    
    >> "Talk about an oxymoron. A COMMITTEE to eliminate red tape?"
    
    Yeah, and if you want to play, make sure you "funnel your ideas through
    your manager" besides. 
    
    :�/
    
    /se
    
    

    	I noticed two things this past Monday that disturbed me:
    
    1. The new Digital World mag was in my mail box first thing in the
       morning. On the back cover a letter even states that "Digital internal 
       mail costs slightly higher than the US mail! 
    
    2. In the same afternoon, we all received a copy of CSG's Forefront
       Mag.
    
    What bothered me the most was that these arrived on the same day that
    people were givin "at risk of being TFSO'd' early notices. 
    
    Get with it! 

    re .224
    
    Did those reports also state who was footing the bill?  Sorry but if
    you want to yell FIRE in the crowded theater, you should have all the
    facts.  Don't just throw out something to antagonize the public - and
    since you decided to be anonymous, how can we know if you can be
    considered a "reputable source".
    
    -sandy

    re .224
    
	First, I am not saying the content of the post is true or untrue.

	However, I don't think it is appropriate for anonymous postings to be
	allowed to pass on hearsay or innuendos - those things that are
	unsubstantiated.

	There is no accountability for anyone to support these postings
	and any amount of rumors or lies could be posted this way, only
	damaging the already-too-fragile environment we have internally
	now.

	If someone wants to post something as "it has been reported" then
	let them hang their name on it, too.  While this note may be true,
	I am compelled to disbelieve anything that anyone is unwilling to
	connect there name with.

		--chas

    I too think it is wrong to post allegations anonomously. If you're not
    willing to put your name to it don't say it. I think it irresponsible
    of the moderators to allow people to post unsubstantiated rumours
    anonomously.
    
    I'm the first to call a spade a spade but I'll also put my name to it.
    By hiding behind anonymity you are no better than those you accuse of
    poor practises.
    
    Dave

    well i agree with the last two to a certain extent. if you are going to
    intimate a wrong doing then back it up with facts that are verifiable
    or don't say anything. on the other hand, i speak from personal
    experience, that writing notes in this file, even if they are totally
    true, can have serious negative consequences on one's career in the
    "new DEC".

	In any event the whole attitude is wrong. Management started
	it, with their argument that nobody should expect a pay rise,
	the resources to do a good job, etc., "because every cent we
	give you means someone loses their job". This reminds me
	strongly of the ancient nursemaid's threat that every time a
	child says it doesn't believe in fairies, a fairy dies.

	Digital is a business corporation, not a lifeboat. How many
	employees it has depends on how many it needs to be profitable.
	Digital has no obligation to give employees job security.

	If Mr. Pesatori is doing a fine job (and I certainly admired
	the staging of the Alpha PC announcement and his role in it)
	then as far as I am concerned he is welcome to a chauffeur
	driven car, a helicopter, a steam yacht and a troop of dancing 
	girls. The same goes for other employees.

	Conversely, if the company is not prepared to give an employee
	or a team the resources needed to do an effective job, it would
	do best to let those people go and save the money it is spending
	on them today.

	/Tom
	

    re: .230
    
    	>This reminds me
        >strongly of the ancient nursemaid's threat that every time a
        >child says it doesn't believe in fairies, a fairy dies.
    
    Well, it's true!  The proof?  Children have been saying they don't 
    believe in fairies for years now in spite of edicts from their
    nursemaids.  So, today there are *no* fairies to be found!  ;^)
    
    Steve

    	Hey, I'm doing a good job...and I've looked everywhere and can't
    find my dance troop! I'm happy to hear I deserve one though. I guess if
    I keep working hard and doing a good job, I'll get what's coming to me!

re .230:

I disagree -- I am opposed to the idea of giving any Digital employee
"a steam yacht and a troop of dancing girls" no matter how good their
job performance.

If person X is doing a good job and needs resource Y to do an even better
job, then it's right and proper for Digital to supply resource Y.  So
for example it's appropriate to provide laptops to those who travel
extensively and need to write reports while travelling.

On the other hand, if something is a "perq" that doesn't strongly relate
to improving job performance and that costs Digital real money, then
I say cut it out!  If that person is doing a great job, give them
a bigger salary or a bonus.  I am very much opposed to under-the-table
compensation by means of perqs.  Yes, I know it's a fairly common
practice.  I think it should happen less, not more.

	Enjoy,
	Larry