Conference 7.286::digital

    Why not tell the driver or leave a note on his van AND on his car?
    If it happens again, then tell somebody else, like security.
    
    Alternately, you could quickly drive into the "regular" spot when he
    was in the process of moving the van.  That would also deliver the
    message.  I presume he isn't armed. 

    	Can you park by badge number or some other system there??
    
    KMP

        You want to talk about parking... try one of these notes:

246    SLDA::OPP          12-JAN-1987    17  Blue Pass Parking
266  MILRAT::SOUSA        12-FEB-1987    66  NO PARKING at the Mill
313    SLDA::OPP          20-MAY-1987    26  Parking garage at the Mill?
354  STKHLM::OBERG        29-JUL-1987    10  Parking Problems in Cities whilst on DEC Business
651     JET::SOUSA         3-NOV-1988     2  MLO Parking between BLDGs 1 and 3
700  PAXVAX::NAYLOR       19-JAN-1989     2  Parking lot abuse

        There are *no* reserved parking spaces for employees, even
        for K.O. (at least, not officially).
        
        Yes, it sounds like this particular F.S. employee has found
        an ingenious way to "reserve" a spot close to the door.  So
        what?  It's not in violation of any policy of which I'm aware.
        
        If you really want to make an issue, start by talking to the
        employee in question.  He may be unaware that anyone noticed,
        and may agree that it's really not "fair" to do this.  Only
        after you've confronted the person who you think is doing the
        wrong thing should you even *think* of contacting security
        or his manager, and then only if you have first checked to
        see if there's any policy he's violating.  (Again, I doubt
        there is any "rule" against this.)
        
        Tom

                Up until about 4 months ago I used to park in that lot
        almost every day (some days I was too late). What I observed to
        be happening was that someone would be parked in the FS van spot
        at the end of the day, thus precluding the van from parking
        there. Since it was the end of the day, the van would then be
        parked wherever there was a spot and the driver would go home.
        Come morning, the van would then be occupying a normal parking
        space, so when the driver got there, he would move it, thus
        opening up that normal space. I don't believe that while I was
        there anyone was deliberately setting a spot for themselves in
        this manner. I know I got lucky a few times and got one of those
        spaces when they pulled the truck out and I didn't get any nasty
        looks, much less any words.
                
                /s/     Bob
                
 p.s. If this has been observed "regularly" for a given driver, then
        I'll believe that it is deliberate, but not before.

re: .4 (Tom)

IF it's deliberate...(Big IF)....then the driver is not "doing the right thing"

Rules have nothing to do with it.

Bob

        The driver may well be "doing the right thing", since there's a
        lot of latitude in what that can mean.  For instance, if the F-S
        van slot is filled in the late afternoon, then parking the van in
        a different space is perfectly reasonable, esp. if it gets the
        driver into the building and back to work as soon as possible. On
        returning in the morning, it's reasonable for the driver to move
        the van to its reserved space, and park his or her car in the
        space where the van was.  All of these are actions that minimize
        the F-S person's time going back and forth to his or her car.
        
        The person who's "not doing the right thing" is the person who
        parks in the space reserved for the van (if this is, in fact,
        what's happening). 
        
        Even if the van driver is "reserving" a space on purpose, far
        be it from me to judge whether that's "the right thing" without
        knowing his or her motives.  If the motives are purely selfish
        ("I don't like to have to walk in from the far end of the lot"),
        then I'd probably agree that it's not "the right thing", but
        if there is some reasonable justification (one that benefits
        the company, for instance, or our customers, but not just the
        individual), then it's probably "the right thing".
        
        Tom

    Ref: .2
    
>>> Can you park by badge number or some other system there??
    
    I presume by this you mean that the lower the number the better
    the spot.  If the number is supposed to imply seniority, it no longer
    works that way.  Reason -- I know of several people who came into
    DEC much before me whose badge number exceeds mine by leaps and
    bounds.  But, if it does not imply seniority for parking but just
    the luck of the draw, then it certainly is a great idea.
    
    Suchindran "Chat" Chatterjee

Ignore Ken Patterson's comments about parking by badge number.  He brings it
up at least once or twice a year.

    	Parking by any organized method DOES NOT mean any one person
    is closer to the door (it's that's desirable where you work)!  Badge
    number 3 could be the longest from the door because that person
    travels 90% of the time, for example.  Geez, don't draw conclusions.
    
    Ken (actually, my name is not Ken, but you know how people get things
        messed up in notes files!!)
    

    I think I'll mention to this person that I have noticed what
    be is doing.  I am quite sure he is doing this deliberately
    because twice the week of the 9th, I actually saw him move the
    FS van.  This got me curious, so the three days last week, when
    I got to work around 7:15, I noticed the FS van in a regular
    spot and several FS spots were empty.  At lunchtime, his car
    was parked where the FS van was parked in the morning.  The other
    two days last week, when I got to work after 8:00, his car was
    already parked in one of the "good" spots.

    Point of clarification: Employees like to park in this lot
    because it is MUCH closer to the building than the Lower Thompson
    Lot.  This lot is usually full by 7:30.  Many days I get in by
    7:15, so I really do not care if this guy uses his scheme to
    save a spot; it is not keeping me from parking in this lot.  What
    bothers me, is that this guy is taking advantage of the fact that
    he has a FS van to save himself a parking spot.  He gets a "prime"
    spot regardless of when he gets to work.  Even if there is no
    rule, what he is doing, in my opinion, is not right.


    Thanks for the suggestions,
    Mark
    

    You think you have problems???
    
    try driving through the MR01 parking lot during the day.  Near the
    helipad, people reguarly extend at least one space ate each end
    of the rows...I almost got in one accident because of blind spots
    because of this, and have heard numerous complaints.  The guards
    all agree it is a problem but besides a few of those fake tags on
    glass NOTHING has been done.  I have seen this for at least the
    past year!

    Most of the people that make their own parking space at MR01 do
    so because they are using the credit union and will only be in the
    building for a few minutes. They should have a small lot for people
    using the credit union, with say, a 20 minute limit. Many employees
    spouses come into MR01 to use the credit union, and many times they
    have infants with them. 
    
    Too bad DEC couldn't install DEC Credit Union Instant teller machines
    in all of it's smaller plants to reduce the amount of people having
    to drive to places like MR01, NR05, etc. to use the credit Unions.
    I'm am sure that the cost of installing machines could be covered
    by the increased productivity. 
                                
    Mark
    

    
    I have to strongly differ with you Mark; many (I would say more
    than 80%) of the cars who park in the wrong spaces in the back parking
    lot are there for the day. Poeple in our organization
    have complained for years about these cars, as they are a real hazard,
    (especially in the winter) but very little has been done.
    
    And the entrance by the parking lot Bruce is referring to is Employee
    Only, so I doubt spouses use it. Most facilities have guest parking;
    if security could actually keep DEC employees from parking in them
    for the day, they could probably be used for real guest/temporary
     parking.

    David

    Re: .13
    
    About DEC installing ATMs for DCU use.  I am not very clear
    about this because I keep my DCU interaction to a minimum
    possible, but isn't it true that DCU is not part of DIGITAL
    and therefor DIGITAL does not install those ATM's or for
    that matter provide DCU support at small sites.  It is the
    DCU management that makes those decisions, isn't it?

        This is a topic about "parking lot abuse".  There is a DCU
        conference at BEIRUT::DCU.  Questions about ATMs and the DCU
        policies about where to place them have been asked there in
        the past.  It is the appropriate place for DCU discussions.
        
        As for "DCU" parking at MRO1, isn't the small lot adjacent
        to the MRO2 entrance "circle" designated at least in part for
        that purpose?
        
        Tom

    The three spaces in the circle in front of MRO2 are for
    handicapped/medical parking.  People going to the DCU sometimes
    park in them.  They also park around the circle which is posted
    as a "fire zone/no parking".
    

        Interesting.  I guess my memory had failed me -- it has been a
        while since I worked in MRO. 
        
        I know that the TTB facility (in South Nashua) has a couple of
        spaces dedicated for DCU/ATM parking, really close to the door
        into the lobby where the ATM is located.
        
        I'm sure that the facilities manager at other facilities could
        reserve parking for short-term use in accessing the DCU.  Getting
        the employees to cooperate in its use is, of course, a different
        problem. 
        
        If you think there's a need for dedicated short-term parking near
        the DCU or ATM at your facility (or at one that you visit), try
        contacting the facility manager IN WRITING, explaining the problem
        you perceive and recommending a specific solution.  At worst, you
        will be ignored.  At best, your suggestion will be implemented. 
        
        Tom

    
    It would seem that unless someone like a VP has to get hit with
    the parking problem before something happens to change it. I belive
    the same happened to the 3 deep. Someone upper mgmt person got hit
    or locked in a spot before they got rid of it.
    
    How about this: Announce in DTW or somewhere in advance that colored
    stickers will be handed out on a first come first serve basis for
    each of the limited lots. Those who get them can park in those lots
    those who don't, can't. This may not gaurantee a spot though.
    
    I'm in the suburbs of Chicago. Across from this building is a new
    building being put up by Metropolitan LIfe (who we bought this building
    from). They've already put in a 3 or 4 storied parking garage for
    their building. Other places out in the field have the same
    arrangement. When the wind is whipping out there, I'd rather walk
    in from a garage than an open lot.

        RE: .19 -- You are assuming there is a parking problem that needs
        to be solved.  Digital already has a perfectly good system for
        parking at most New England facilities:  first come, first served.
        When you arrive at work, you take an available space.  No one is
        responsible for enforcing "limited access" parking, with a very
        few exceptions, such as handicapped parking, commuter vans, and
        field service spaces, which are usually reserved.  A system based
        on "colored stickers" is no more fair than the current system,
        unless the stickers are only given to those with a business
        justification (and who's going to determine the valid business
        reasons?). 
        
        Tom

.9�< Note 700.9 by COVERT::COVERT "John R. Covert" >
.9�                             -< A wind-up artist >-
.9�
.9�Ignore Ken Patterson's comments about parking by badge number.  He brings it
.9�up at least once or twice a year.
.9�
 Ken, (I know this an alias)
    Do you by chance have a low badge number?

    Well, I have a low badge number (3 digits) and I don't want parking by
    any assignable means.  It ain't broke; don't fix it. 

Re .20:

>No one is
>        responsible for enforcing "limited access" parking, with a very
>        few exceptions, such as handicapped parking, commuter vans, and
>        field service spaces, which are usually reserved.

No problem, Tom.  Security is responsible for enforcing parking regulations such
as not parking outside the lines, along the sides of roads, etc.  Masses of
employees ignore them completely at ZK; they appear to be ignored every time
I've visit MK as well.  So if they are put in charge of enforcing some arbitrary
rules about colored stickers, people will ignore those rules as well.
				/AHM

    
    You can have any one of the thousands of parking spots at the mill
    every day.  Yes there is an assignment scheme:
    
    -Arrive at 7:00 A.M. and take your pick.
    -Start work after 6:00 P.M. same rules apply.
    
    -Also if you come in at 12:15 P.M. you can allways find a spot near
     the door.
    
    Jon
    

    re.21
    Reveiling well guarded secrets:
    Keith (the real name) has a low badge number. The only time he
    would contribute with serious replies is when the topic is
    food related (solid or liquid) around Thanksgiving in particular!
    Fred, greeting Keith