Conference unifix::sailing

    I have been using an Autohelm 1000 on a twenty five foot sailing boat
    for the last five years. I have moved the Autohelm back towards the
    rudder by about two inches, from the recommended dimensions. I have the
    Autohelm arm fixed to bracket mounted underneath the tiller.
    
    I have ound that it works well, up to a force 6+, as long as you have a
    reasonable amount of sail up, & that the boat is well balanced. If you
    have too much sail up for the wind condition, then you are better off
    steering the boat yourself, & it is more fun that way too.
    
    The Autohelm will over steer for you if you have too much foresail, for
    the conditions, & the water is not rough. 
    
    I rely on it a lot, as I enjoy fishing while I'm sailing. It certainly
    steers the boat much better than I can in light weather. We started by
    calling it "George" in  airborn autopilot fashion, but have found that 
    "R2D2" is a much better name as it talks to itself as it steers.
    
    The only precaution you need to take is to cover it with a towel or tee
    shirt, in very hot direct sun, as being black it can get far too hot, &
    it does start to behave erratically. Ideally the sleeve of an old shirt
    would act as a good cover. 
    
    Should you have a duff cell, as it happened to me, or have a low battery,
    it will still operate ok, but much slower.
    						Have fun, 
    								Nick			
    
    				

    I installed a 1000 on my 30 foot Pearson last year.
    
    Real simple installation. I have not had any problems with this
    unit, and I would expect the 800 to be the same. I just plug it
    in, steer the course I want, extend the push rod out so that it
    engages the post on the tiller, and press the auto button. Thats
    all there is to it.
    
    I use it mostly while under sail, but have also used it under power.
    Once, I let it do the steering for 6 1/2 hours, straigh line course.
    It brought us right to our waypoint.
    
    Autohelm's are great products. I don't know about current drain,
    but I wouldn't worry about it.
    
    Paul

    I installed the 800 on my 24 foot S2 last year.  I use it mostly for
    holding course while raising/lowering the sails and using the head when
    single-handing, which I do a lot. 
    
    I wanted as "clean" an installation as possible, and opted to mount the
    unit on top of the coming.  This location doesn't interfere with the full
    seat cushions and there is no mounting bracket on the seat-back to
    interfere with seating.  One problem with this installation was that the 
    coming was a couple of inches too high for a level installation.  Autohelm's
    longest tiller pin was still too short.  I solved the problem by
    purchasing a 1/4 inch by 6" stainless bolt.  To "create" a rounded head
    like the Autohelm's pin, I cut the head off it, and put into my drill
    chuck with the drill in a vise and used a file while the bolt rotated
    in the drill (poor man's lathe).  The pin is installed with about 4"
    above the tiller, giving me the level installation I wanted. 
    (The additioan leverage of the longer pin seems not to be a problem.)
    I ordered a 3" extension for the pushrod, which was also too short. 
    
    The resulting installation works great.  Another advantage to the
    coming top installation is that I can disengage the unit from the
    tiller pin and swing the whole unit 90 degrees onto the top of the
    coming totally out of the way but still available for quick use.
    I suggest evaluating several alternate installtions prior to installing
    yours.  This was my third idea, and I'm glad I didn't use either of the
    first two I drew up.
    
    After about 3 weeks use, my unit quit.  I disassebled it to discover a
    broken drive gear.  I called Autohelm and they said they had received a
    bad batch of drive gears, and this was a common breakdown.  I sent it
    to them and it returned within about 10 days.  No problem since.
    
    I too have wondered about battery drain, but experienced no problems
    last summer.  (I have a 35 amp alternator, average 1 engine hour per
    day.)
    
    While sailing it does a great job, except in real puffy conditions
    upwind when it seems a little too slow to react, giving a bit of a wild
    ride if over canvassed.  Downwind its a champ, even with the spinaker,
    which I also single hand with.
    
    
    
    
     

    If you plan to race, watch out for Rule 57: Stored Power.  It states
    that no "movable hull appendages" shall be adjusted or operated with
    "stored power", making an autopilot seem to be illegal.  I haven't
    tested the rule with a jury- has anyone else?

.3�                                                     I use it mostly for
.3�    holding course while [...] using the head when
.3�    single-handing, which I do a lot. 
    
    The times I need to use the head when single handed, are often caused
    by events 'out of my control' ... and the thought of trusting the
    boat to the auto-pilot (or to any one else!!) at that time fills
    me with horrors!! :-) :-)
    
    I do agree with the raising and lowering of the sails!

     I went out for an afternoon sail yesterday and as the wind piped up 
I started to think about a tiller pilot and how they function. I've pondered
the merits of such a machine and The more I single handed, the less I felt
I needed one. As the wind grew and it got to the point where I had to reef
for the first time while I was alone I felt it would have been nice to have
my helm monitored for me. 
     For reference you might need to know that I'm sailing a 22 footer that
weighs about 2200 lbs,, I weigh about 135 lbs., and it's effectively a fin
keel and spade rudder.
     I've been tying off the tiller so far and it works okay. I tried using 
bungy cords per recommendation of my uncle, but for me the rope works better. 
When tied, the boat will round up eventually. If I compensate for the weather 
helm too much she falls off and I see an uncontrolled jibe as being more 
dangerous. I tried to simulate a 12.5 second update of my heading yesterday
and it seemed I could round up or fall dangerously off in this amount of time.
     I arrived at a question about how these machines updated the heading. 
Do they just move your tiller to a new position every 12.5 seconds? Or do 
the really adjust your course to the proper heading and then wait 12.5 
sec.s  before they adjust again? Do they work as dynamic feedback loop until
your pointing in the right direction or just compensate the tiller position
for 12.5 sec.s and then do it again? It would seem to me that if the don't
steer you straight after correcting your heading you'd be sailing a pretty 
zig-zag course in the weather I'd most want it.
     I also haven't been to clear on why the models recommended for big boats 
have a shorter update interval than the models for small boats. I would 
expect that generally speaking a larger boat would tend to track better and 
round up slower. I know that keel and rudder design will have a greater impact
on this than size, but fin and spade large vs fin and spade small I'd expect
large to be slower to react.
     I've read people in here raving about the performance of their auto helms,
but never a description of how they work. If I had a reliable, safe driver
I would be inclined to run around my deck and do more sail trimming things.
My position on the boat has a significant impact on trim and the helm.
I would be more inclined to go further and for longer times if I just had a 
good driver so I could trim sails. 
     And finally I have to ask about picking up a mooring pennant or 
anchoring. Do any of you do this singlehanded with your autohelm, or do you 
go to manual to point into the wind. I'm sure they don't know how to back
down and I can see the thing steering you away from the wind when you start
backing up.

     What can you tell me about these?
     Thanks
     	Geoff

    Geoff,
    
    There are other cheaper ways to accomplish what you want w/o an autohelm.
    I daysail alot with my wife and 1.5 year old son, so in many ways I'm
    less than single handed. The kid can be a two person job!
    
    Have you ever tried to "hove-to" with your boat? Not all boats can do
    this. But if it works on your boat you'll find it a handy way to
    run around and do things like reefing.
    
    Paul
    

As someone who added an Autohelm 1000 to a C&C 26 last year (and is very happy
with the results), let me give you my input and understanding.

First off, as your note is entitled "Autohelm functionality question" I will
assume that you are talking about the Autohelm brand and not tiller pilots in
general. The 12.5 second time that you mentioned sounds suspiciously like the
"hard-over" time of the Autohelm 800 tiller-pilot which might be very
appropriate to your boat. That time is how long it takes for the pilot to move
the tiller from one extreme position to the other. Note too that these may NOT
be the extremes to which the tiller can be moved manually, but rather all that
the pilot's actuator can do.

The hard-over time coupled with the effective thrust (I think it's 85 lbs. for
the A-800) combine to describe only some of the characteristics of a tiller
pilot. The hard-over time is an indicator of how well the pilot will be able to
hold a firm heading in difficult steering conditions like broad-reaching in a
seaway.

Response time (to course changes forced by wind, current or waves) is MUCH
faster (on the order of 1 to 2 seconds); at least on the Autohelm 1000.  BTW -
I chose the 1000 because of the increased thrust potential (125 lbs.) and the
doubled hard-over speed (about six seconds).

How does it work? There is a flux-gate compass built into the pilot which is
constantly sensing magnetic compass direction when the unit is powered up. When
placing the unit into AUTO state, the actuator arm is moved, driving the tiller
to port or starboard in an effort to maintain the requested heading. 

There is a heuristic portion to the controller for dealing with sea-state so
that (at your option) the boat's natural tendency for the bow to move a bit to
the left and right of the desired course can be ignored and the pilot 'waits'
for the bow to either come up or fall off on a regular basis. The sea-state
compensation is an ongoing process so as the sea-state changes, the
compensation will change. At your option, you can defeat the auto-sea-state
compensator and the pilot will respond to every bow movement which places the
boat at one or more degrees off-course. This option adds a lot to the power
drain on your battery though as the unit draws the majority of it's current
when 'driving' the actuator rather than holding it at a constant position.

The Autohelm also provides a tacking function. While it isn't pretty to watch,
it does work well for the busy single-handed sailor. Basically, by pushing the
+10 and +1 degree pushbuttons, the boat will tack to starboard through 100
degrees; port tacks are accomplished similarly with the -10 and -1 buttons.
Once the tack is completed and you are trimmed up, you can power-steer the boat
onto the desired tacking angle and the pilot will automatically hold the new
course.

Another feature - off-course alarm: if the pilot is unable to hold the desired
course for a period of 15 seconds or longer, it sounds an alarm to warn you of
it's problem. This seems to happen if you tack in VERY light air and the boat
just does not come back up the the desired new course.

The Autohelm (as well as most other pilots) has a standard interface to both
LORAN and windvane inputs as well.

I have found that it does a great job if you keep the sail plan balanced and
not over-powered. Clearly, without a windvane, one can not expect to sail hard
on the wind if the wind is shifting at all! If you are willing to foot off 4 to
8 degrees though, the pilot does a good job of beating for you.  Reefing,
trimming, bending on of sails (including luffing up for the main) is a cinch
unless the wind is very shifty. In light air, the pilot does a real fine job of
gently holding a firm course so that you can play the sheets to your heart's
content when gently steering becomes more important. 

I have never tried to anchor or pick up a mooring under pilot. My preferred
anchoring method if no-one is around or competent to help is to flake the rode
on the foredeck and then bring the anchor (25 lb. CQR or Danforth 20-H) back
into the cockpit with me stringing the rode along outside the lifelines. From
there I can control the engine and tiller and anchor from one location; place
the anchor and start to back down on it without leaving the cockpit.

All in all, I am quite pleased with the Autohelm 1000. The ONLY thing I can
think of to really worry about (OK, two things) are that one can have a
tendency to forget to watch around you as you would if you were steering
manually; and the the autopilot just SEEMS to always head very subtly but
effectively right towards lobster pots and buoys! Remember that YOU are still
responsible for the boat and it's actions!
    
    Carl

re .7:

The problem with heaving to is that for at least some boats (mine, for 
example), the main boom is all the way out (nearly perpendicular to the 
fore and aft axis of the boat) and the mainsail is lying against the 
standing rigging. Reefing the mainsail would be difficult in these 
circumstances as the battens (unless you have full length battens) will 
tend to snag on the shrouds. And, too, some boats (mine, for example) 
require a backwinded foresail to heave to, which makes headsail changing 
problematic also. However, heaving to is a very useful technique that 
stops the boat, eases the motion greatly, and allows tending to the 
crisis of the moment.

re .8:

An excellent description of the behavior of Autohelms. Sounds just like 
mine. A couple of additional points: The Autohelm makes small steering 
corrections continuously, the humans I've observed tend to make larger, 
less frequent corrections. In many cases an Autohelm steers better than a 
human, especially a tired human on the just-before-dawn watch. I've no 
personal experience with the windvane option for Autohelms, but the one 
person I talked to that has it was not happy with it -- not enough 
damping or something. Perhaps Autohelm has improved matters in recent 
years. 

Although my Autohelm has yet to fail (purchased in 1982), I'm sure it 
wouldn't survive heavy rain or a wave filling the cockpit. It just 
isn't waterproof. Except when motoring, we prefer to use our Monitor 
windvane. The rasping, whirring noise of the Autohelm is somewhat 
annoying, the windvane is almost silent. Nothing like sailing in light 
winds with no sound except the burbling wake. Ah ......

Alan

    Hey Paul,
    	I'm not sure if I've ever tried to Hove-to, I don't reconize the 
    term, so I can't be sure. Maybe I'd try it if I had an idea of what it
    involved. I have now had to leave my tiller for extended periods of
    time, longer than just to trim the genny, and that's when the lashed
    tiller really falls way off course. 
    	One thing I have a great difficulty with is the leach line on my 
    110. That line drops out of the cleat every time I tack. Then when I
    move my weight to reset the line the boat rounds up while standing on 
    it's ear. I can deal with a heal, but when I'm on the low side and 
    nobodies steering my boat I get nervous. 
    	The single handed reefing had me really uptight because by the
    time I realized I needed a reef the boat was not handling comfortably 
    at all. I did eventually get everything set and done, but I was worried
    when I realized I had to reef. Once the sail got shorter I felt much 
    better. 
    
    	Carl,
    	Thanks for the desciption of the autohelm behavior. My quest was
    for information was not necessarally for any particular brand name, but
    just the general kind of machine. I've seen spec.s of 12.5 seconds and 
    couldn't quite grasp how this would steer a safe course.
    	
    Thanks
    Geoff

re .10:

To heave to:

  Tack the boat but leave the headsail sheeted (which will leave it 
  sheeted to winward).

  Ease the mainsail until the boom is nearly athwartships.

  Tie the tiller all the way to leeward.

The backwinded headsail will try to blow the bow off to leeward, the 
rudder will try to turn the bow into the wind, and the mailsail will try 
to stay pointing into the wind. The net result is that the boat will lie 
30 to 45 degrees (very roughly) off the wind and will move forward at a 
very slow speed (a few tenths of a knot) without any attention at all 
from the crew. It is amazing how stable and gentle the motion of the
boat is when hove to. After nearly three days closed hauled in 20 to 30
knot winds coming back from Bermuda we hove to for a number of hours to
sleep comfortably. What a relief! 

    Goeff,
    
    On my boat, I do the same thing mentioned in -.1, but my boom
    is sheeted about 30 degrees off the centerline. For me, it
    works well when reefing the main. You'll have to experiment to
    find what works for you. I've sailed some boats that won't heave
    to.
    
    Paul
    
    
    

    The notes describing how to "Heave to" are pretty much correct 
    except for the use of the main.  The back-winded jib and main should
    balance each other, not the jib and rudder.  The rudder should be
    tied over to a point that allows the main and jib to hold the boat
    at a 45 degree angle to the wind and seas.
    
    This will solve any problem with the main getting tangled in the 
    shrouds, etc.  In general, you want to keep some wind in both sails
    at all times.  This eliminates flogging and unnecessary stress on
    the rig.
    
    Try using the Main as a rudder.  It works!  I sail with a Fleming
    Self-steerer a lot (just returned from a 2000 mile off-shore sail)
    a tweak the main to keep us on course instead of changing the wind
    vane.  I usually refer to the main as "the rudder in the sky".  By
    changing sail balance very slightly you can affect you course and
    speed substantially.
    
    Good luck,
    Jeff
    
    
    
    
    

    Well, this heaving-to is something I was unaware of and will certainly
    have to give it a try. I'm going to try it in reasonable weather so
    that when the bad stuff comes up I'll have an idea of what I'm doing.
    	But I still have some questions about the steering machines. Now my
    question is about power consumption. Right now, like this afternoon
    after work, I'm going to pick up a battery. I was out on the night of
    7-3, listened to my VHF for weather on 7-4 and when it came time to 
    call for the launch my battery was dead. I took it home, tried to
    charge it and checked it with a cheap hydrometer and it is dead, dead,
    dead! It's a DieHard that came with the boat, a Marine/RV. I never
    felt too secure about this battery and was not surprised when it died.
    	So last night as I was trying to calculate a generous consumption 
    budget to determine my electrical needs it appeared that of my present
    requirements my lights were the most power hungry item on the boat. Off
    of my 12v I run a depth sounder (if it'll work for me with the new
    battery), my nav. lights, instrument illumination and my VHF. The VHF
    is mostly off, all the lights are only on at night and so far I haven't
    sailed too much at night (though I'd like to try again) and the depth
    sounder is questionable (I'm hoping it died due to low voltage, behaved
    as though there was no transducer connected).
    	So my electrical requirements now are modest. If I were to decide
    to add a steering machine this would greatly increase my power
    consumption. I've only got a 4A altenator on a Johnson Sailmaster
    outboard. So on any kind of weekend or extended weekend traveling this
    steering machine appears to be a significant burden on my limited 
    electrical reserve. 
    	I guess the question I'm asking now is what kind of reserve
    capacity do you steering machine owners have on board? I'm looking
    at a battery this afternoon and weighing price vs. reserve, what can 
    I afford and what is required now vs. potential future. 
    	My thoughts for a battery was a gelcell from Boat/us. I could
    justify a good battery at the price if it's really as good as it's
    claimed to be. Before I brought the steering machine in to the picture
    50 AH, though small, didn't seem unreasonable. What do you smaller boat
    owners with limited charging ability carry for reserve? Did you
    increase your reserve when you added the electric crew? In real life
    how does this effect your electrical requirements.
    
    Thanks for the input
    	Geoff  

There are many notes that discuss electrical systems, battery charging, 
and the like. See Note 3.whatever for a list.

A couple of comments: I would not have only a single battery on board. 
Too risky. The advantages of a gel-type battery (eg, Prevailer) are
probably not worth it for you. Spend the same money and buy two good
conventional deep-cycle batteries. The concensus is that a battery
should only be about 50% discharged for best life (a small number of
complete discharges will destroy a conventional lead-acid battery). The
usual charging system only recharges a battery to about 85% of maximum
charge. This implies that a 100 Amp-hr battery is effectively a 35
Amp-hr battery. A small Autohelm steering a small, well-balanced boat
doesn't use much power -- at a guess 10 to 15 Amp-hr per 24 hours. 

    Following up on the original memo in this topic (I noticed the title
    has changed from the original,... good idea :-) ) for Autohelm 800
    installation on a Macgregor 26.
    
    This could be of interest to others who will be installing theirs,
    and a bit of humour to those who already have.
    
    Installation Phase I:
    
    Order the extra parts to make the Autohelm fit.  Wrong parts come
    back...reorder....!
    
    Installing the plug socket:  Interesting question occurred to me
    "after" I'd drilled the 3 little holes...maybe the little Phillips
    screw and slot should face *down*?  This would have a better chance
    of keeping water out.
    
    Their almost useless little diagram indicates it should be up. 
    Has anyone had any bad experiences with the slot facing up?
    
    The little clips they provide made fitting in 14 gauge wire
    interesting.  Spreading the wire holder part of it helped.
    Also, remember to have the clips opposing each other.
    
    A problem:
    
    I'll be mounting the pivot end of the Autohelm using one of their
    options that raises it 1�" ($50 Cdn!).  But the surface it fits on
    is on an angle.  Where does one get rubber wedges or something
    equivalent to allow the fitting to be level?  (ie. Help!)
    
    To be continued....
    
    OA$_soon_to_be_autohelming
    
    Bob

So long as the surface that the pivot pin is angled _laterally_ with respect to
the boat, you should not have to use any wedges. I worried about the same thing
as I was mounting the pivot point on the cockpit seat which cants down and
outboard. One of the functions of the pivot pin is to allow the actuator end of
the pilot to move vertically. In fact, the easiest way to mechanically
disengage the pilot from the tiller is to rotate the actuator arm UP thus
pivoting the "back" of the pilot. See diagram below.

I would think that even a small fore-aft angle on the pivot would not be a
problem as there is a bit of slop designed into the female mating portion of
the actuator arm.

What IS important is to start out with the pilot level at a zero degree heel
angle (but I don't remember exactly why!) The leveling is achieved by using
varying length tiller pins and/or bracket extensions either above or below the
tiller.  BTW - after talking to Autohelm about my installation, it is OK to
move the tiller pin further from the rudder post than they recommend if that
will solve a leveling problem (curved tillers). The downside is that you lose
some response time and maximum tiller deflection angle, the upside is that you
gain leverage!

                                                                      
                               +---+                                  
                               |   |                                   
                               |   |                                   
                               |   |         +------------------------+
                               |   |         |                        |
                               | *-----------|                    @   |
                               |   |         |                        |
                               |   |         +------------------------+
                               |   |                                   
                               |   |                view from top    
                               |   |                                   
                               |   |                                   
                               |   |                 autopilot         
                               .   .                                   
                               .   .                                   
                                                    view from side
                              tiller                                  
                                             +--------------------------
                                 +-----------|                         |
                                 |     ^     +--------------------&-----
                               --|--   actuator arm               |  & = pivot
                               |   |                             \|      point
                               -----                              \   
                                                                   \  
                                                                 angled
                                                                 mounting
                                                                 surface

Good luck,
Carl

    	Bad news...it angles the other way (Fore/aft) by about 10 deg.
    It would have to move forward at least 8-10" before it levels out.
    Too much to sacrifice on the handling.
    
    	The reason for keeping its angle level is the flux-gate compass
    I believe.  The more level it is, supposedly the more accurate it
    is?
    
    	The best solution I can figure is to acquire some form of hard
    rubber (or some other material) wedge.  But I have no idea where
    to get one of these.  The missing part is due in today, so I'll
    also ask the fellow at the store.

    	If I get desperate, I might be able to mount it on the 10 deg.
    angle and put the tiller pin in vertically (as you say, the actuator
    can rotate). 
        
    	I may or may not get Phase II done this weekend, although I'd
    like to, since the wife and I are hoping for a weekend cruise to the
    States (4-6+ hours).  It would be a great test for the Autohelm (any
    suggestions for a nice port West of Rochester NY, and East of
    Youngstown on L. Ont.?)

    
   	Thanks for the suggestions
    
    	Bob

>    	The best solution I can figure is to acquire some form of hard
>    rubber (or some other material) wedge.  But I have no idea where
>    to get one of these. 

Perhaps your local shoe repair shop might be able to supply one of these.
You could also make one from a piece of teak.

--RS

    
    I'd like to add a general tillerpilot question... not specific to
    Autohelm.
    
    On my boat the traveller runs along the transom and the mainsheet
    connects to the end of the boom.  In sloppy seas and light winds
    when the sail has little force to keep the boom over (on a reach, say)
    the boom will occasionally be thrown over toward the centerline.
    
    When the boom comes over, the mainsheet droops and can get caught
    underneath the tiller pilot... when the wind fills the sail again,
    the tiller pilot is pulled out of its cantilever bracket and thrown
    onto the cockpit floor (if you're lucky).
    
    I tried tying the mainsheet up with a bungy cord to the backstay and
    to various locations on the rail, but the mainsheet would just slip
    through.  I just disengaged the unit & decided that until I figure
    this out I just won't use the tiller pilot in those conditions.
    
    Any suggestions?
    
       /Jim
    

re .18:

We use a beveled piece of teak to solve this problem. You could also 
mold a wedge-shaped epoxy pad under the mounting bracket.

re .20:

Why not use a preventer or vang to hold the boom to windward? Just run 
the preventer or vang to the leeward rail or stanchion base or something 
and haul it tight.

    RE: .18
    
    I have seen and used wedges made by dinghy fitting manufgacturers.
    
    E.g. Jack Holt make some very neat ones to fit undxer their jamb
    cleats. ANd RWO under pulleys and things.

    	Well, I've finally completed the installation.  Phase II and
    III (sea trials) were fairly simple actually.  As for the angle
    installation, I sawed away at the heel of an old running shoe.
    It works perfectly!  The off-white matches the trim too.
    
    	The pivot socket is actually much bigger than I expected, but
    its installation was fairly simple, only three bolt holes.
    One thing I noted was proximity to any mass of nearby metal has
    a detremental effect (as with any compass).  I was going to install
    a chrome vent near it....now I'll make it plastic.
    
    Sea Trials:  Very interesting.  Had a good day for it too, 10-20
    knot winds on 2-4+ foot seas.  I don't know if the AH 1000 moves
    the pushrod any faster, but with the 800, I found it would start
    to oscillate for a bit after it was hit with a good size wave.  It
    couldn't correct fast enough, and then it over did it and didn't
    return fast enough.  Consequentially, it weaved back and forth for
    about 3-5 cycles before it settled down.
    
    I would give it a rating as a very precise, but somewhat inexperienced
    helmsman!  If you're trimmed reasonably, and nothing too upsetting
    hits the boat, then it handles it perfectly.  I don't think I'd
    trust it in rough weather though for any period of time.
    
    It's still marvelous though!  Push the button, then go for a drink,
    check out the bow, adjust the sails, or whatever.  It'll be great
    for single handling.  I think I'm spoiled already!
    
    Bob
    
    P.S.  Good location on U.S. South shore of Lake Ontario....
    Checked out Wilson N.Y..  Kind of small, but a nice place to visit.
    A nice 5-7 hour run.

re .last:

The steering oscillation may not be an Autohelm problem -- it may be a 
boat problem. The response of a boat to a steering input (change in 
rudder position) depends on the amount of damping in the system. With 
insufficient damping the boat's heading will oscillate back and forth 
and slowly settle down on course. With too much damping the boat will be 
slow to respond to rudder changes. The directional stability of a boat is 
another way of expressing this. See Marchaj 'Seaworthiness, The 
Forgotten Factor' and various texts on self-steering gear. FWIW, a servo 
pendulum windvane (eg, Monitor, Aries) is especially good at steering 
boats that lack sufficient damping.

    	Interesting approach to the problem.  I wouldn't necessarily
    say that lack of "damping" is a problem per-se, just a characteristic
    of the design.  For instance, a fin keel boat will respond much
    faster than a full keel boat to steering input.
    
    	For its size, the Macgregor has a thin keel, but relatively
    deep.  This make for relatively quick response.  A warm body helmsman
    can anticipate the reaction and pull back on the tiller to smooth
    it out on course the first time.  The Autohelm on the other hand,
    just doesn't seem to react fast enough to the course correction
    resulting in the oscillation.
    
    	Combine this with the fact that it's a relatively light boat,
    and bounced around by sizeable waves more than say a Catalina 25,
    with 1700 more pounds of boat.  This just makes the extreme cases
    a little harder to handle for the poor little Autohelm.
    
    	Don't let me give the wrong impression.  For 98% of the time
    it works just as it should, and even with normal bouncing around,
    the Autohelm holds a good course.  Just "once on a while" it starts
    to loose it.
    
    	What are some of the other tiller Autohelm owners experiencing?

    
    Thanks for your comments  :^)
    
    Bob

  I've just sent my Autohelm 1000 off to have its drive gear replaced, seems
I've gotten one of the defective ones.  It will be sorely missed.  I single 
hand quite a bit on Lake Winnipesaukee and find the Autohelm takes all the 
hassle out of trimming when the wind pipes up.  The boat is a Pearson 26,
longish keel variety.  Before the addition of the Autohelm I would lash the
tiller over with bungie cord  but found myself rounding up or on a beam reach
when trimming for close hauled.  Sort of see-sawing across the lake.  With
the Autohelm I can set the boat about 10 degrees off close hauled and trim
everything in nicely.   

  Using the Autohelm to head up close to the wind doesn't work well.  A 
combination of the reaction time of the unit and wind shifts means unexpected 
tacks if pushed too close.  

  We don't experience much in the way of large waves on the lake, but wakes 
from large power boats create a similiar situation.  I have not noticed any
oscillations.  The Autohelm works practically from stop to stop to keep the
boat pointed in the right direction but it dampens out very quickly.  The boat 
is relatively well balanced.  I have noticed that the unit is sensitive
to sail balance.  

  Overall I am very happy with the unit so far.  Just wish that they could
return it from repair in less time.  There is about a 14 day turn around time
right now due to a backlog.  Replacing the gear looks to be about a 10 minute
operation.

					Ron
   

    Good to find this entry!  I have a couple of problems with an autohelm,
    which someone might have some insight to.
    
    First, the background:
    
    I have owned an Autohelm 2000 for 5 years now.  I first used it on a
    Tartan 30 with excellent response.  As previous notes have stated, I
    was able to track under sail (even on spinnaker runs) and power with
    very precise accuracy.
    
    Now the problem:
    
    I transfered the autohelm to a new boat, a tiller steered S2 34'.  The 
    only complaint that I have had with the Autohelm 2000 is the amount of
    wires running from the power source to the control unit and then from
    the control unit to drive unit.  So, in my infinite wisdom, I decided
    to install the control unit in a cockpit cut out and run the wires under the
    deck.  Therefore I cut and shortened the wires going to the drive unit
    and ran them to a marine outlet.  So, when I use the autohelm, I just
    bring out the drive unit, set it up to the tiller and plug it in.  I
    also added a remote hand control unit as well.
    
    Since this installation, I cannot get the unit to function properly. 
    I can set it on a course, press the "auto" button and watch the unit
    try to compensate for course deviations.  The unit's control movements
    will increase and then the unit will go hard over, pushing the tiller 
    to the length of its drive arm.  I have tried both positions of the
    "left or right" installation switch with equal results.  I have also
    played with the rudder gain knob to no avail.  The S2's helm
    is actually lighter than the Tartan's.  Have I done something to muck
    up the system by shortening and/or running the wires to a deck outlet?
    Has anyone had similar experiences?
    
    Thanks
     Joe

A possible cause: Did you get all the wires connected correctly (I've
managed to miswire connectors)? It sounds like the control box is
telling the drive ram to push when it should pull and visa versa. 

re:                      <<< Note 1440.27 by LANDO::STONE >>>
                           -< AUTOHELM 2000 Probs. >-

First thing you need to determine is whether the Autohelm is pulling the
tiller in the correct direction when you are off course. To find out:

1) unhook the autpilot from the tiller.

2) turn on the autopilot

3) Manually steer several degrees to port of the course you have told the
   autopilot. The autopilot should try to steer to starboard.

4) Steer several degrees to starboard of the course you have told the autopilot.
   In response, the autopilot should try to steer to port.

If the autopilot steers the other way, then the "left/right" switch wiring
is probably causing your problem. If the autopilot is steering in the correct
direction, then your problem lies elsewhere.

--RS

    I am contemplating purchasing an autopilot for my C&C 33, which has a
    wheel.  Does anyone have any comments regarding the Navico or
    Autohelm products, esp. Autohelm's new 4000 that dosen't use a
    belt drive?  Does the new "direct drive" 4000 system put any load on the
    wheel when disengaged?
    
    Are their any other brands I should consider?  
    
    My usage (I had a Autohelm tiller pilot on my previous boat) consists of 
    very frequent usage for very short durations, so holding a good
    course is really secondary to the mechanics/electronis holding up to
    multiple on/off cycles.
    
    Regards,

    I have a 3000 on my Catalina 36 and I have had very good results with
    it.  It does have difficulies if you are over powered going up wind.
    Reducing sail helps.  I sail out of San Diego which has light (under 15
    knots) winds most of the time, so I only have a 155% roller furling
    genoa.  
    
    I like the 3000 for several reasons vs. the 4000.
     -It is completely removable, motor and controls.  This protects it
    from the weather and from theft.  Also should you make off shore trips
    a second backup unit can be installed in less than one minute.
    
    A good friend of mine has a 4000 on a Down East 38.  Last year he took
    in from San Diego down past the end of Baja and over to the Mexican
    coast and back.  At about the half way point the nylon gear that
    connects the motor to the ring on the wheel stripped out.  Another
    crusing sailboat had the same problem, but they also had 8 spare gears
    which got my friend going again.  500 miles out of San Diego the spare
    went out and he had to hand steer the rest of the trip.  Not a happy
    camper.  Autohelm admits a design error and will retro fit a metal gear
    if you send back the unit, which my friend did.  Now when he is
    steering manually the clutch occasionally grabs causing the wheel to
    jurk.  
    
    Another friend has a Erickson 32 with the 4000 and has had no problems. 
    I believe his is a early model with the nylon gear.  
    
    I would be happy to discuss further if you want, DTN 492-3315
    
    Chuck

    I installed an Autohelm 4000 on my Pearson 36 Cutter and it worked
    great.  There is no drag when the wheel is disengaged.  See note
    649.8 which describes a power spike problem that I had.
    
    Larry
    

    I had a 4000 onstalled on my Moody336 when we took delivery last May.
    Thus far the unit has performed well in both light and heavy weather.
    On a particularly bumpy cross channel 6/7 occ 8 the unit performed
    brilliantly. There is no drag when disengaged ,I think that some of the
    early units had problems.
    
    cheers..........Pete

    Lucky me, there was an Autohelm 4000 under the tree this Christmas.
    I would appreciate any and all installation advice.
    
    I have a Catalina 30.
    
    I also received a Solvonics MA-12 solar panel which I will post in
    another note.  (I must have been a MUCH better person than I thought
    in 1990).
    
    Adam

    I've had my AH 4000 for 1 1/2 seasons and I love it. I had no
    trouble with Autohelm's installation instructions and I left
    the mooring for a shakedown cruise after about 3 hrs. work.
    
    I was forced into mounting the control head on the side of the
    starboard lazerette, parallel to the centerline.  This creates
    a little hand-eye coordination difficulty with a new helmsman,
    (pushing - means go to port; + means go to starboard) but, nothing
    serious.  
    
    If I had it to do over, I would have mount the control head
    connector a little higher off the cockpit deck.  Right now it's
    about even with the average shoe tip and I've had to resolder
    the connections after it took a swift kick during a reefing
    operation.
    
    Other than that I give it high marks!  It has really made a dif-
    ference in my ability to safely singlehand a 32ft Ketch that has
    no auto sail handling devices like roller furl etc.  I also find
    that it allows me to keep a better lookout as well, and it's
    indispensible on those no-wind iron jib days.
    
    Good luck and wear that safety harness!!
    
    Bob 

    Has anybody in this conference a windvane option for the 2000 or
    3000 Autohelm ?
    I have heard some rumors that it is not worth the money.
    
    
    Peter

    I just finished installing my Autohelm 4000.  The hardest part was
    fishing the cable through my steering pedistal and making sure it
    wouldn't get caught in the chain.  One change I plan to implement right
    away is to install a waterproof jack between the drive motor and the
    pedistal.  It never dawned on me before that the way the 4000 is
    designed, you can't remove the drive unit for safekeeping, winter
    storage, etc. 

    I am going to be installing my Autohelm 4000 in a couple of weeks. Your
    comment about needing a connector between the drive motor and the
    pedestal is the right on. I have been trying to find a suitable
    connector to use. It needs to be watertight and not too big or ugly. So
    far I have not found anything that even remotely looks like it will
    work. Any idea where to find such a device? 

    We are about to put an autohelm on my friends Tartan 30... are there
    any good comparison charts on the various vendors?

    I have a comparison chart from Defender Industries catalog and what I
    see is that the Autohelm 4000 takes almost twice the current as the
    3000 does.  So the question I would pose is, "What are the advantages
    and disadvantages between the 4000 and the 3000".  
    
    Beside the obvious ones like,  4000 = no belt, compact mount, high
    price - 3000 = removable unit, shin bruiser, belt breaker, reasonable?
    price.
    
    What else would you say are the pros and cons of the 3000 and/or 4000.
    
    Is the 4000 worth the $200+ pricetag?
    
    Jeff
    
    PS - I will publish the comparison chart tomorrow or Thursday as a
    reply to this note.
    
    

    
    	I also have a T30 and an Autohelm 1000. Love it. This assumes its
     tiller steered (like a real boat, right Dave?). Insure you/they go with
    the 1000 and not the 800. Mr. Autohelm suggested this to me when I
    ordered and I'm glad I spent the xtra $xxx.
    
    Paul

    re -.1
    I just installed the AH800/2. The /2 is a new model this year. It has
    the same power (125lb force) as the AH1000. The main difference is that
    you cannot connect it to any external electronics (loran, windvane
    etc.). It is about $150 cheaper than the AH1000 for the same power and
    basic performance.
    
    -John

    
    	I'm gonna add a auto-tiller, IRS willing. I was wondering if/how
    	to get a free fluxgate compass in the deal. The new Autohelms
    	have the readout right on top, Navico makes you spend less up
    	front, but 200 more for the remote control, which has the readout.
    
    	The hassle is, I don't think the unit will give me the heading
    	unless it's operating.
    
    	What I really want is the header/lifter indicator of the KVH flux-
    	gate, without spending $6-800.
    
    	Has anyone looked into this?
    
    	Scott

    I bought an Autohelm 4000 last year at Boating Equipment Liquidators in
    Alexandria, VA.  They are the outlet for returns/repairs from BOat US.  
    
    The unit I got was returned to factory, repaired and sold with new
    factory warranty for less than BoatUS (about 50% off list).  
    They usually have a fair number of units. 
    
    I also got:
       never used Nissan 3.5 OB for 350 
       two winch handles 28.00 for the pair
       Apelco hand held 117
    
    You never know what they have from week to week.  If you luck into a slow 
    week, its Monty Hall time. 
    
    Their phone is 703-823-1056.

    Anybody have any info on how the autohelms (or other brands) work with
    heavy displacement boats? The charts I've seen for the products say
    something like "for boats up to 45 ft LOA and 21,000 lbs). Great. My
    boat is 36 ft on deck, 45 ft LOA and 28,000 lbs. Wheel Steering.
    
    Any suggestions on what to get?
    Thanks,
    Robert

The adequacy of the autopilot will depend as much on rudder balance as on
the size of the boat. If your wheel is similar in diameter to what you'd
find on a smaller boat, and the boat is reasonably easy to steer with the
sails out of balance, you won't have any trouble.

Basically, the autopilot will have trouble under the same circumstances that
a human helmsman would have trouble: a) too much effort to turn the wheel, or
b) difficult-to-predict rudder response, e.g. running with following seas.

--RS

    Has anyone installed or had a boat with the autohelm ST7000? I have a
    heavy displacement boat with hydraulic steering and I am planning on
    the purchase of the autohelm ST7000. Both West Marine and Autohelm
    suggest that you have the unit professionally installed. Has anyone had
    any experience with professional installation or self installation?
    
    regards
    jimk
    

    Yes. We blew up five ST6000 course computers (same as ST7000, the 7000
    control head only gives you graphical rudder indication).
    
    Autohelm replaced them all and eventuallyt had to install, free, a
    Constant Running pump. The type 3 took too much power/blew PAs, I
    wouldn't risk the type 2 either. Autohelm had to fly an engineer to
    Jamaica to fix it for us, so that's a good indication of the company's
    service.
    
    Incidentally, we have a spare course computer, new, never been used and
    will sell it to you cheaper than list. My boyfriend Ray can give you
    lots of advice on this issue...
    
    Ashikin
    
    Incidentally, we've done about 2,000 miles on the ST6000 now and it's
    working well...