| T.R | Title | User | Personal
Name | Date | Lines |
|---|
| 738.1 | Emperical verification! | SSMP03::SAVIERS | | Sun Jan 31 1988 19:53 | 17 |
| A few summers ago, we were first to arrive next to a 42' power boat
near Fisher's Is that was sinking. With 4 electric bilge pumps
and several "frightened men with buckets" it still was a losing
battle. Fortunately a local harbormaster showed up with a gasoline
pump and after 15 minutes the transom freeboard was increasing from
6" -a very close call.
I heard the next day that they lost a rudder - probably a 1.5 or
2 inch shaft!
So a serious motor driven pump is a great idea, the problem is how
to handle and store a gasoline engine and fuel, or how to power
one off the main engine.
Any good solutions out there?
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| 738.2 | The `Heck' with the pump, get a sponge!! | TOLKIN::DEMOSS | | Mon Feb 01 1988 13:02 | 17 |
|
I'm not too sure that the largest pump is the best way to go??
TRUE with a 2" - 4" hole in the side of the boat you don't have
much of a chance to keep up with it. More than likely the boat
will sink before you get the thing set up!!
Now being of NAVY extract(?) the hole should be plugged with ....
anything !!! (Your foot will reduce the hole more than half) before
looking for the pump!!
If you plug it to make it a 1/2 the size, you have reduced the water
intake by (approx) 1/2. Then you can stuff the spaces to make a
smaller spaces until all you need to keep the boat dry is a sponge!!!
Now where did I leave that bucket and sponge??
`Charlie'
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| 738.3 | PLUGIT | GRANMA::HAJOHNSON | | Tue Feb 02 1988 11:41 | 10 |
| Could not agree more with .2. Keep several size wooden plugs aboard
to stop whatever flow you can. Sizes to fit your thru hulls should
be a must; and keep them close to the thru hulls. Books, pillows
and sails can also be used to stop the flow.
If you can keep you cool and find the leak, you can probably slow
it enough to keep up with it.
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| 738.4 | You can't always find it | SPCTRM::BURR | | Tue Feb 02 1988 12:24 | 37 |
| It's all well and good to say 'plugit', but I have to agree with
Alan and Grant that you really need to have a good high capacity
pump. As someone who has had the unhapply experience of looking
down at my cabin sole 4" under water after noticing that the pump
was running, I can tell you that trying to find a serious leak under
18" or 2' of dirty water when the boat is bouncing around like a
cork is not my idea of fun. Its even less so when the water is
gaining on you rapidly. That was in a glass boat-an engine cooling
water line let go.
Last Fall, on our way up to Maine to put the boat away for the winter,
we popped a seam in a gale. This was not a bad leak as it was only
about 4-5" of caulking seam that let go...not more than 1.25 sq."
in total area. It was, however, underneath about 1200 pounds of
(removable) inside ballast just forward of the mast step (under a
built-in bureau of course) and it kept 2 2000 GPH Rule bilge pumps
going full time to keep up with it. BTW, we were about 75 miles out
when this happened.
Had we not had the pumps, we would have lost the boat or at the
least, we would have had to get the CG to bring us a gas powered
pump and by the time that could have arrived, we would certainly
have ruined much of the cabin equipment and probably gotten the
engine under water.
In Steve Dashew's "Circumnavigator's Handbook" he describes the
damage control pump system he has rigged on his new boat as well
a a somewhat less sophisticated (and less expensive) system on his
previous boat. The new boat has a separate 2.5 HP diesel powered
damage control pump housed in the engine room of his 60' custom
cutter. In his old boat, a modified Columbia 50 (I think) he rigged
a power take off from his main shaft to a high capacity pump. He
agrees that anyone who is going to sail off shore MUST have a big
pump for damage control and that this pump should not be electric.
I'm looking into how I can rig something similar for Caprice.
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| 738.5 | jury rigged pump | RDF::RDF | Rick Fricchione | Tue Feb 02 1988 13:03 | 16 |
| A pump can be jury-rigged in some cases by taking the raw water
intake hose off of your engine and using it in addition to a bilge
pump. A length of hose, sufficient to reach probable points of
damage, that can be connected to the raw water intake hose is a good
thing to keep around.
I'm not sure what the gpm rate is on this setup, but it couldn't
hurt.
Rick
* one of course shuts the seacock before disconnecting the raw
water hose, lest they create leak #2 :-)
|
| 738.6 | The engine can move a lota water... | TILLER::SEARS | Paul Sears, SHR1-4/D27, 237-3783 | Tue Feb 02 1988 13:12 | 45 |
| There are a number of sources for plugs. For instance i never go out w/o a
bottle of worcestershire sauce.
When i took delivery of Cachalot, i was poking all around down below as an
excited new owner will do, when i noticed the hose from the galley sink to
the throughull. Thinking to myself it looked a little rusty, i squeezed it to
check my hypothesis. I was right. It was more that just rusty, it was totaly
rotten. In just a few seconds, it disolved, and a 1.5 " stream of green water
was comming in. The closest thing to grab was the Worcestershire sauce
bottle, which it turned out was just the right size to plug the fitting and
slow the torrent to a trickle. I learned a few things: the survey was right:
all T/H fittings should have seacocks (they do now), think before poking, and
always keep DC plugs nearby any T/H fitting. Also never go out w/o a good
bottle of worcestershire sauce.
I believe many offshore cruisers have the ability to switch engine cooling
water from the sea to a well-screened bilge intake source. An engine water
pump can get rid of a lot of water. The screening is important, however, so
as to not clog the engine coolant circulation passages (either FW cooled or
SW cooled).
A complete water-removal system might have many parts:
- Two cockpit-accessable hand pumps, each .5-1.0 gal per stroke
- two electric pumps, one automatic w/ float switch, the second manualy
switched.
- a Y valve and sufficient strainers, pickups, hoses and filters to
channel the engine water intake from the bilge.
- an aux pump fighting for fanbelt space on the engine, along with its
hoses, strainers, etc.
- a seperate deisel pump (gasoline is for cars, not boats)
- assorted buckets
- rebuild kits for the above hardware (especialy the electric and hand
pumps.)
- a frieghtened crew; when the wind's blowing 40 kts and you'r in the gulf
stream, it's amazing how fast the crew can pump
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| 738.7 | don't use the engine pump? | PDPSRV::BERENS | Alan Berens | Tue Feb 02 1988 14:27 | 19 |
| The engine sea water pump can indeed be used as a bilge pump in an
emergency. However, the usual small marine diesel has a very small
sea water pump -- ours pumps on the order of 200 gallons an hour at
cruising speed which is not exactly high volume. Morever, if the pump
or line strainer clogs the engine will eventually overheat and stop.
Then your troubles are much worse. It would be better, I think, to
install other more adequate pumps.
Be aware that most bilge pump gallons per hour ratings are the maximum
that the pump will pump with no hoses connected to the outlet. Add the
normal hoses and through hull fittings and pump capacity is reduced 25%
or more. According to a Practical Sailor test, the best manual pump is
the big Edson -- a true 30 gallons per minute and with valves large
enough that the chances of clogging are minimized. Installing the pump
is not at all easy due to its size and its 2" diameter hose. Still, it
is nice to have. I'm not looking forward to ever using ours.
Alan
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| 738.8 | Pump output | BOMBE::ALLA | | Tue Jan 21 1992 09:28 | 13 |
| I tested my Rule 1500 pump for output. (19 year old 1500 gph)
The bilge on the triton is 3 1/2' + below the water line and the
outlet on the transom is just under 2' above the W/L, so assume
a head of 5 1/2'
I got 600 GPH on the pump which uses 1 1/4" hose.
The cockpit has a Whale Gusher 10 pumping at the same head.
I carry wood plugs and pieces of wood and sealers to stop leaks
if need be. Hope I never need them.
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