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Conference unifix::sailing

Title:SAILING
Notice:Please read Note 2.* before participating in this conference
Moderator:UNIFIX::BERENS
Created:Wed Jul 01 1992
Last Modified:Mon Jun 02 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:2299
Total number of notes:20724

682.0. "Help on rudder-tiller problem" by JUNIOR::CARRERA (Joe Carrera) Thu Oct 29 1987 14:13

    I am looking for some suggestions on how to correct a tiller/rudder
    problem. I have a '78 26' Pearson with tiller. My problem is the
    play between tiller and rudder shaft.
    
    I removed the tiller, and the top of the shaft (or whatever the
    tiller hooks onto) is worn. With the tiller in place, I have approx.
    8-10 inches of play at the end of the rudder.
    
    Are there any suggestions on how to fix this? Does the casting on
    the top of the rudder shaft come off, and if so, how do you do
    it? I was thinking of having the worn area built up and ground down
    to size. Is this a workable idea?
    
    Thanks for any suggestions
    
    Joe
    
   

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682.1correction to .0JUNIOR::CARRERAJoe CarreraThu Oct 29 1987 14:156
    Correction to 682.0. The 8-10 inches of play is at the end of the
    tiller, not the end of the rudder.
    
    Joe
    

682.2check with Pearson?!CASAD2::THOMASThu Oct 29 1987 16:259
Sounds as if you're going to have to pull the whole rudder aand have
    some work done on the head of the shaft. worst case might be a new
    rudder?!:-( 
    
    I'd call Pearson directly and talk with them about what the problem
    is and what your options are.
    
    Ed (former P26 owner) 

682.3more ideasMSCSSE::BERENSAlan BerensFri Oct 30 1987 12:5827
The tiller casting at the top of the rudder shaft must be removeable -- 
otherwise there'd be no way to remove the rudder. Usually the casting is 
clamped or bolted or both to the rudder shaft. Once you have the casting 
off the solution should not be difficult. The play may simply be due to 
the casting clamp bolt or through bolt not being tight enough. Solution 
here is to tighten up whatever is loose. Or the hole in the casting may 
be oversize. Get some brass shim stock (at a hobby shop), fit it 
between the rudder shaft and the tiller casting, and retighten. Or you 
could use a good epoxy to the fill the excess gap. Thoroughly clean and 
sandpaper the rudder post, wax the tiller casting (so you don't 
permanently glue everything together -- the tiller casting is probably 
bronze, and getting epoxy to adhere to bronze is difficult), slather 
some epoxy with a filler onto the rudder post, reinstall the casting, 
and clean up the excess epoxy. I would think that your problem could be 
solved without actually removing the rudder. 

I assume that when you first move the tiller that the rudder shaft isn't
moving. If the rudder is moving on the rudder shaft then you have a
seriously defective rudder. I also assume that you are talking about
side to side play in the tiller. Depending on the age of the boat and
how much it has been sailed, the rudder shaft bearings may be
excessively worn (quite possible with spade rudders). If so, you will be
able to move the rudder fore and aft and/or sideways somewhat. It should
only rotate. 

Alan

682.4R&R Pearson Rudder (new and improved!)MCS873::KALINOWSKIThu Aug 17 1995 14:24170
    Having replaced the bearings twice, I have written down
    the steps for fixing the slop in the Pearson 26/28/30. The tube that
    the rudder resides in has replaceable bearings at each end. These are
    held in place by compression between the rudder, the rudder tube, and
    the rudder cap. When the rudder bearings  wear out they allow the
    rudder to bounce around, or start turning in the tubes. This is 
    where you get "slop".  Wait too long and you can elongate and then 
    break the tube which is  below the water line.
    
    The solution is to pull the rudder, pry out the old bearings, and 
    glue in new ones. Time to do this is about 2 hours if you know what you 
    are doing to 4-6 hours if you don't. You should get a helper, as the 
    rudder weighs between 90-110 lbs and it is extremely awkward to handle. 
    
    If you are doing this in the middle of the season, make sure the epoxy
    has hardened before immersing the bearings, and leave a them alone for
    a day before loading them.
    
    Things to remember:
    
    A. The new bearings are black delrin instead of nylon and they last a
       lot longer. 
    
    B. The bearings have flat sides on outside. you need to jam epoxy
       or marine tex into there to keep them from rotating. It will not
       really adhere to the delrin. The expoxy will adhere to the rudder
       shaft, so coat the rudder shaft with car or boat wax before reinstalling.
    
    C: Once you get everything assembled and hardened (ie next day). adjust
       the rudder cap to get the slop out. I make thin shims by cuting
       spacers (using the old spacer for a template) out of plastic sheet
       (I use old antifreeze or bleach bottles). you take off the tiller.
       toss a couple of shims on top of the cap, and then tie a line from
       the tiller hole to the boom end. You tension the rudder by attaching the
       main halyard to the boom end and cranking on it. Now you can remove the 
       cap even on the water and add shims until you get a nice tight fit (you
       squeeze the shims past the cap and spacer) .  Reassemble and only then
       take off the rope, else your rudder will slip into the ocean faster
       than you can say Ahhh S*&^ ! .  For best results, put the shims between
       the cap and the factory spacer so they do not distort under load. This
       tip is esspecially important on older tiller shafts, as the tight bearing
       will "lock" into place on the wear marks of the rudder shaft. should
       that happen, the weight of rudder could cause the epoxy to fail.
    
    Note: This tip can be used to temporarily get the slop out of a bad 
       rudder (ie down to 1-2" at the tiller).
    
       The helm will feel tight to begin with. It will loosen up a bit 
       after a couple of hours of use. Now your Pearson 26 will respond to 
       the helm like a dingy.If not, see my suggestions at the conclusion
       for other tricks.
           
MATERIALS:

	CONTAINER OF MARINE TEX (will not drip out of place on upper bearing)
	NEW BEARING SET (D&R MARINE, ANNOSET MASS)

	COURSE SANDPAPER (80 GRIT)
	400 WET DRY SANDPAPER 
	CAR or BOAT WAX
	MASKING TAPE
	TOUNGE DEPRESSERS (mixing marine tex)
	CARDBOARD FOR MIXING
	1 12' PIECE OF JUNK LOW STRETCH 3/8" LINE
	ROLL OF PAPER TOWELS
	RUBBER GLOVES
	WD 40 
	LADDER
	PAN OF BOILING WATER
	SOCKET SET  (to remove cap)
	LARGE WRENCHES (to remove tiller and cap)
	LARGE FLAT SCREWDRIVER (for prying out bearings)
	HAMMER (when screwdriver is not enough)
	1 inch wood chisel.
	acetone (cleaning up)

STEPS:

	YOU NEED TO GET BOAT'S KEEL 2.5-3 FEET OFF GROUND. IF IN SEASON, YOU
	CAN LEAVE IT IN THE LIFT'S SLING. 

	BOIL BEARINGS IN HOT WATER TO EXPAND THEM

	ATTACH MAIN HALYARD TO END OF BOOM

 	UNBOLT TILLER ASSEMBLY

	ATTACH END OF junK LINE TO TILLER HOLE

	UNBOLT RUDDER COLLAR

	CAREFULLY LOWER AND PULL BACKWARDS TO GET RUDDER OUT

	CUT OUT OLD BEARINGS WITH CHISEL AND HAMMER
	(be careful not to damage the rudder tube).
    
	CHISEL OUT OLD EPOXY THAT HELD BEARING (BE CAREFUL NOT TO NICK TUBE)

	SAND INSIDE OF TUBE LIGHTLY WITH COURSE SANDPAPER, CLEAN OUT DUST &
	SWAB WITH acetone.

	SAND RUDDER WITH WET DRY 600 SANDPAPER UNTIL SMOOTH

	APPLY MASKING TAPE OUTSIDE AREAS ADJACENT TO BEARING (HULL AND DECK)

	WAX RUDDER SHAFT WITH CAR WAX SO EXTRA EPOXY CANNOT STICK TO IT

	DRY OFF HEATED LOWER BEARING AND DRIVE CAREFULLY ONTO RUDDER. USE 
	WD40 TO	LUBRICATE. THIS IS A VERY TIGHT FIT. THE BEST WAY TO DO THIS
        IS TO USE A PIPE WITH AN INSIDE DIAMETER JUST BIGGER THAN RUDDER SHAFT
        TO DRIVE IT ON. ANOTHER ALTERNATIVE IS TO PUT THE OLD BEARING OVER
	THE TOP AND TAP WITH A HAMMER.

	DRY OFF RUDDER SHAFT AND REWAX. CLEAN OUTSIDE OF BEARING WITH acetone.

	UNTIE JUNK LINE, FEED FROM TOP OF TUBE, AND REATTACH TO TILLER HOLE
	AFTER YOU HAVE LIFTED RUDDER UP NEAR OPENING.

	MIX MARINE TEX WITH TONGUE DEPRESSER AND APPLY TO LOWER BEARING
	AND TUBE..

	SLOWLY FEED RUDDER UP HOLE. A PERSON PULLING LINE FROM THE TOP MAKES
	  THIS PROCESS MUCH EASIER. 

	USING THE MAIN HALYARD ON MAST WINCH, CRANK BOOM/RUDDER UP INTO 
	POSITION AND SECURE.

	DRY UPPER BEARING AND SPACER BEFORE RUBBING WD40 ON INSIDE OF BEARING.
	CLEAN OUTSIDE OF BEARING WITH acetone.

	SLIP UPPER BEARING, SPACER, AND COLLAR OVER TOP OF RUDDER.

	RETIE OTHER END OF LINE TO BOOM.

	APPLY MARINE TEX TO OUTSIDE OF UPPER BEARING AND DRIVE INTO PLACE.
	THE BEST METHOD IS TO TAP THE ALUMN. COLLAR TO GENTLY TAP IT DOWN.

	BOLT UP RUDDER COLLAR AFTER ADJUSTING TENSION. BE CAREFUL NOT TO 
	SPIN BEARINGS IN TUBE. LEAVE TENSION ON RUDDER UNTIL MARINE TEX IS SET.

	CLEAN UP EXCESS MARINE TEX WITH PAPER TOWELS AND acetone.

	REMOVE MASKING TAPE APPLIED EARLIER

	BOAT CAN BE PUT BACK IN WATER ONCE MARINE TEX HAS SET (APPX 4-6 HRS)

	AFTER MARINE TEX HAS DRIED (AROUND 24 HRS):
	CHECK CLEARANCE AT COLLAR. ADJUST TO GET RID OF SLOP. USE SHIMS 
	IF NECCESSARY. 

	RELEASE MAIN HALYARD, REMOVE JUNK LINE, AND REATTACH TILLER

	TIE DOWN TILLER TO STOP ANY MOVEMENT . 
    
	IF THE TILLER STILL HAS PLAY, BUT THE RUDDER IS SOLID,
	YOU CAN TRY BUILDING A LONG SPACER BY DRILLING A BOLT HOLE IN THE 
	PROPER THICKNESS STAINLESS STEEL TO FIT BETWEEN THE RUDDER SHAFT AND
	THE TILLER CONNECTOR. I USE SMALL SAILBOAT TANGS (MARINE
	EXCHANGE, PEABODY MA $4).  IF THE HOLE IN THE RUDDER HAS ELONGATED
	BECAUSE OF THE THREADS, I SUGGEST GOING UP 1 SIZE ON THE TILLER
	BOLT, AND REDRILLING USING A MACHINE PRESS, AS YOU HAVE TO ALIGN
	THE TILLER CONNECTOR WITH THE RUDDER. USE BOLTS THAT DO NOT HAVE
	THREADS FOR THE FIRST 2.5 INCHES, ELSE IT WILL CHEW UP THE RUDDER 
	STOCK AGAIN. YOU CAN ORDER THESE FOR APPX $3 FROM JAMESTOWN DISTRIB
	IN R.I.

        KEEP THE OLD SPACER IF IT IS OK. SOMETIMES THEY CRACK, OR YOU NEED
        A TEMPLATE TO MAKE SHIMS. THEN YOU WILL BE HAPPY YOU SAVED IT.