Conference unifix::sailing

    Well Jeff I have never stored a boat in the water, but for the past
    3 winters I have had my boat stored with the mast up.
    
    The cover becomes a hassle to weatherproof, you should back off
    all the standing rigging before hauling and I go over every inch
    of the mast and rig from a Bosun chair each spring, but I havent
    experienced any problems leaving it up.  It has no handling damage
    like the masts of others in the yard who have them removed each
    winter.
    
    I also inspect my boat at least every other week in winter, and
    tighten the yard stands each visit.
    
    Walt

    Until we got our new boat, we always stored it with the mast up
    (10 years).  In that time I am pleased to say that we never had
    a problem.  The rig on the new boat is over 50 ft. high so we dicided
    to drop it every year.  After to years of doing that I long for
    the days of storing the boat with the rig standing.
    
    					Hugo
    
    

    Wow, this note goes back to June of 1987, without too many replies.
    
    So, I am also considering leaving my wooden boat in the water for
    this winter. Strictly for economic reasons.
    
    It will be in the Providence river, just below the I195 bridge.
    There is quite a current here on both tides so it stays free of
    ice.
    
    I know obviously to shut off all seacocks. what I'm concerned
    about is the water in the hoses above the cocks. I suppose I could
    just run some antifreeze into the drains, but would have to remove
    some hoses such as head and engine intake.
    
    Anyone out there have experience with in water storage?
    Also note that this is mostly fresh water this far up Narragansett
    Bay. I am going to throw some rock salt in the bilge from time to time.
    
    Anyone????
    Don

    Don,
    
    What do you use to keep the boys from Silver Lake out of your bilge?
    
    -Paul

    Paul
    
    Who are the boys from Silver Lake????
    
    Don

    It sounds like your boat will be near the Silver Lake section of
    Providence. It's not a bad area, especially by Boston standards, but
    there are some gangs that like to steal and vandalize things.
    
    Does the marina have any security?
    
    Also, how bad are the storm surges in the area you're considering. 
    It's not uncommon for the city to close the hurricane barrier at 
    the mouth of the Balckstone river to protect the city during big storms.
    
    -Paul
    

    Ciao Don; Re .3: 
    I have stored in water for 7 or so years as I have a wooden boat and
    this certainly is the best for them. I assume yours is wood from the
    'rock salt' in the bilge etc. I do winterize the engine (fresh-water
    cooled) but keep it servicable through the winter, just in case... Just
    use anti-freeze and, if diesel, add some kerosene to the fuel to keep
    it from getting too thick. Drain the fresh water tanks and I add a quart or
    so of cheap gin to each tank and then get that into the pump system.
    This is better tasting than anti-freeze in the spring.... I also
    liberally strew rock salt over the decks and cockpit and make little
    mounds around the cockpit drains to take care of snow melting etc. Some
    people put a piece of garden hose in the drains, filled with salt,
    which will compress is ice forms but I haven't seen the need for this.
    I kept my boat in a little cove near Glouster, Ma, where there was not
    much water movement and had the ability to WALK out to my boat several
    times. Fast moving water/ice is not too good for the bottom and it is
    better to find a still place and let it freeze in. Add lots of chafing
    gear (leather is best, or plastic hose) with clamps to hold it in
    place. For two years I hung on a mooring and was concerned about ice
    freezing and then carrying the mushroom/boat away but nothing ever
    hapened; just alot of worry when the nor'easters came through. Later I
    tied up nead a bridge and put out my 4 anchors with lots of scope and
    hand buried each anchor before tieing off to the boat. I covered the
    boat about half the time, with the cheap blue plastic tarps and a
    removeable frame. I also had an old tarm (canvas) which I used a few
    times and one year, due to lazyness, I didn't cover at all. It is
    best to cover though; less maintenance in the spring. Be sure, if you
    cover, to also put chafing pieces wherever the tarp touches the boat
    ar you'll have added sanding and patching. Also tie the tarp better
    than you thing necessary and add reinforcing patches/superglued at
    each tie point. Come spring, or warm days in late winter, it is so
    easy to get ready for sailing! I wish I were doing it now, but am
    land-locked here in Italy for a time... If you have a heater on board
    you can have a nice weekend when you feel the urge. I also left the
    masts in and, if you do, be sure to tie all halyards way away from
    them AND: LOOSEN up the shrouds as they contract quite a bit in the 
    cold and can cause problems! I set them quite loose when still fairly
    warm out and when I would visit in the dead of sinter they were tight!
    
    Thats all I can think of now; it seems so long ago.. Now the boat is
    in a shed way down Maine (Eggamoggin reach) and the yard is putting
    linseed oil/cuprinol mixture on the inside and redlead on the bottom
    (I hope!).
    
    The end results were less to do in ths spring and less wear and tear
    on the boat but a bit more worry.
    
    Best reagrds and happy sailing!
    Ciao, Ed 

    In answer to your concern about the hoses above the seacocks, I have
    some experience from last season when my boat didn't get hauled until
    January.  
    
    I keep the boat in Salem, Ma. not far from the power station.  The
    harbor itself never seems to freeze.  But, my raw water intake was very
    slushy/frozen by the time the boat did get hauled.  So, you may be wise
    to consider some way of getting some sort of anti-freeze or gin or
    something into any line you if you're not sure it is drained.
    
    djc
    

    Well, so far so good with the in-water storage. The rigging did
    indeed tighten up! I was late in getting to it. What a cold
    December. It kept me from getting my cover on, then into the busy
    Christmas season. Managed to get my frame up two weeks ago. I use
    3/4 conduit and the clamps available from Boat-U.S.. They work very
    good. I ordered some of the rubber chafing pads to protect the cover
    from the clamps and conduit connectors. They worked fine until spring.
    When I tried to unsnap, the snaps remained snaped and tore out of the
    pad. So much for that neat idea. I use old rug pieces. This is the
    first time for storage in the water, thus my plastic cover would end up
    in the water. I finally got to begin to get it on last weekend. I used
    an old one as a pattern and cut & basted it so that it comes just below
    the gunnel. I will put a variety of grommets in just above the gunnel
    to lash the cover to the frame, and will dangle some sand filled
    Clorox bottles from the bottom of the cover to keep tension on it.
    
    It is a real pickle to figure out what to do around the shrouds. I'm
    going to use a combination of tape, velcro and grommets but expect
    serious wind conditions are going to raise havoc. So by the time I
    get the newer cover cut, I hope it will be finished this weekend.
    Just three months late.
    
    Another issue is how to gain entry. I would like to put zippers in.
    In another note, which I can not find, someone talked about a resource
    for large zippers in the greater Boston area.... Anyone remember???
    
    Don

>>    When I tried to unsnap, the snaps remained snaped and tore out of the pad

	I had problems with dodger snaps that pulled out of the cabin top!
I talked with a canvas maker, and he said that he uses stuff called

	Door-eze

	Its cheap and is about 5" long and the diameter of a pencil.  Its
waxy stuff.  He says that its better than silicone that works its way out.

	I tried the stuff and its magic!!!

	dave

re .9:

I'm not clear -- is your new cover plastic? If so, I'd suggest you use 
canvas instead. Canvas has several advantages: Its heavier weight keeps it 
in place better, it breathes, and it is more durable (this is the sixth 
winter for our canvas tarps and they are apparently still in very good 
condition). The life of plastic tarps is so short that it is hardly worth 
spending any time modifying them. Access is easy if you simply overlap tarps. 
Just fold the tarps back at the overlap. We also use conduit for our frame. 
We use pieces of tire inner tube taped to the frame with vinyl electrical 
tape. Cheap, effective, and cause less chafe than carpet (which can be 
abrasive, especially after it gets wet and freezes). 

    re large zippers.
    
    At one time the Eastern Mountain Sports stores carried sleeping bag
    sized zippers.  It's worth a call to see if they still do.  The one
    closest to you is in Framingham on rt. 9.
    
    - gene

    This time of year, immediately following the depression, I look
    to working on the boat. So I decided to leave it in the water this
    year (comments on the pros/cons?) and am looking for a good heater.
    Does anybody know about heaters: ceramic vs resistor vs fuel?
    The environment here gets in the 30 degrees F.
    Perhaps I can work on the wood inside (varnish or oil?), and
    repair/rebuild subsystems.
    
    
    bernie

    I leave my boat in Houston, Tx in the water year round. We obviously
    don't get freezing water around the boat, but it will dip into the
    teens and stay below freezing for reasonable periods of time.
    
    I use a 1200 watt ceramic heater that has an instant off switch built
    into the base of the heater inside my boat. It's left on 24hrs/day on 
    low during the winter. The switch is nice in that if it gets knocked 
    over onto a cushion, it turns off immediately. I then lose my heat 
    inside my boat causing other problems, but that's a different story.

    I open the drain valves in my engine block, close off the seacocks and
    set up the heater. That's about all that's needed. I open up the engine
    access as well as any access that makes it easier for the heat to stay
    around exposed water tanks, etc. It seems to work well. On low, the
    interior of the boat stays in the low-mid 40's. 
    
    It can seriously increase your monthly power bill. Calculate your KWH
    charge time 1.2 KW/hr X 720 hrs/mo to determine your increase in bill.
    
    The heaters can be purchased at most hardware stores. I like the
    ceramic ones because they put out good heat, but stay cool enough that
    they become next to impossible to start even a paper fire should a
    piece touch the ceramic elements. Bottom line is I don't fear I'll come
    back to a smoldering hole in the water where my boat used to be.
    
    Hope this gives you something to ponder....
    
    Robert
    

    Varnishing in an enclosed cabin is a SURE way to cure your winter
    blues :-) .
    
    

    
    Robert;
    
    Thanks for your ideas. I began with a ceramic heater but after a week
    of thinking of the possibilities of fire, and the effect on my
    neighbors, I decided to go through the standard winterization procedure.
    If there is way for nature to find a reason to stop the power to the
    heater it will happen, and it will be during the sub-freezing period, and
    it does not pay.
    
    Now when I'm on the boat I keep the heater on to work in comfort.
    
    Thanks,
    
    bernie