Conference thebay::joyoflex

It isn't "it isn't."

I prefer "it's not" because it seems to have more emphasis than "it
isn't" on the fact that something is not.

Dave C.

    Seems to me that they have the same meaning, but with different emphases.
                                                             
    It isn't - emphasises the subject 'It' as being important in the
    context.                                                 
                                                             
    It's not - emphasises the negative meaning of the phrase.

    So, pace Dave C, it may well be that it is "it isn't" :-)
    
    Nick

>                -< Yes, two negatives isn't a double negative >-

	Gee, can't you folk read smileys?   I said 'double negative :-)' to
refer (obliquely) to the fact that there are two ways to negate 'it is'.

>    Seems to me that they have the same meaning, but with different emphases.

	Up to a point they have same meaning.   But emphasis changes meaning.
(Look at the many semantics possible for another logical connective such as 
'if', for instance).   And to understand these sentences, one really needs to 
hear which words are emphasised and the rise and fall of pitch, for instance:

It isn't *there*.	(Implication:  it's *here*)
It *isn't* there.	(Implication:  you said it *was*)
*It* isn't there	(Implication:  but something else *is*)

	Interestingly, it seems that I can make roughly the same semantics
with the other phrase:

It's not *there*.
It's *not* there.
*It's* not there.
                 
	Although it seems to me that I dislike the last of these slightly,
there is clearly more going on than:
                                            
>    It isn't - emphasises the subject 'It' as being important in the
>    context.                                                 
>                                                             
>    It's not - emphasises the negative meaning of the phrase.

	If I try to reflect on when I choose what, I can't think really why I 
use which.   I suspect it would be necessary to analyse a large mass of spoken
English to establish the 'rules'.

	I believe that the underlying rhythm of the sentence may be as
important as semantic emphasis in determining which phrase is picked.

Happy New Year,
Andrew.

    "It isn't" strikes me as being ever so slightly more formal than
    "It's not."
    
    Not that either of them is formal, you understand.
    
    --bonnie

    The same alternation seems to apply to 'have' - "I haven't/I've not";
    but only when it's an auxiliary verb - "I've not seen it" and "I
    haven't seen it" seem to me to convey the same idea.
    
    But when 'have' is used on its own as a verb of posession things are a
    bit confused (the more so, in the sorts of British English that I know,
    because of 'got': it seems to me that the (informal) opposite of 'I have' 
    - in the sense of 'I possess' - is 'I haven't got' rather than:
    
    	o	I've not [which sounds plain foreign to me, although I've
    		sometimes heard it in the context 'I've not an idea' -
    		which I suspect is standard American English: no?]
    or
    	o	I haven't [except when there's contrastive stress on the I]
    
    To add to the confusion, there's 'I don't have', which I tend to use in
    the hearing of people who think you should never say 'got'. I suspect
    that this, too, is standard American usage; but if I'm wrong, don't
    worry - it's just another dumb limey shooting his mouth off.)
    
    It seems I've opened up a can of hornets' nests.  I'd better sign off.
    
    b

>    	o	I've not [which sounds plain foreign to me, although I've
>    		sometimes heard it in the context 'I've not an idea' -
>    		which I suspect is standard American English: no?]
    
    No.  It sounds plain foreign to me, too.
    
    Actually, I thought it was upper-crust British English!
    
    --bonnie

    ... but I've not come across it either.
    
    :-}
    
    dick

    All right then, `I haven't a clue'.
    
    b

	re .5,

>>    It seems I've opened up a can of hornets' nests.

	:-)

    I'dn't've expected this one to go unnoticed...
    
    You can also say "'tis not".  'Tis rare, but 'tis not unheard of.
    
    This leads itself to "'tisn't", which I thought I had made up for
    playful uses -- but then I saw it once in a real, published book.

    re .11
    
    'tis called poetic license.

    �This leads itself to "'tisn't", which I thought I had made up for
    �playful uses -- but then I saw it once in a real, published book.
    
    I didn't think "'tisn't" rare. I'm sure I've heard it, and I imagine
    I've used it. Not so long ago, the quaint English translation of
    
    "It is not
     It is so"
    
    was
    
    "'Tisn't
     'Tis"
    
    b

    Ohhhhh,   this has me all a tizzy.
    
    
        :^)   Margaret