Conference thebay::joyoflex

    Instead of "deliverables" you can use "deliveries".  While not
    a perfect match, it won't confuse as much as a different word.
    
    In the same vein, one could use "method" instead of "methodology".
    "Method" is plainly superior (well, it seems so to me).

    Since deliverables are really the deliverable products, perhaps
    "products" should be included in the list of suitables. (ughhh)
    
    stuart

>    Instead of "deliverables" you can use "deliveries". 

"What are the deliveries of this project?" -- hmmm.  I don't think it
will prevail. 

This seems like another case where people are challenging us to find a
word to replace a phrase.  If you have to have a single word, I don't
think there is a current one that will stand in for "deliverables" --
you might as well cave in and use that. 

On the other hand, if you want to sound like a member of the human race,
it might be better to rephrase the question and ask "What items will
come out of this project?" or "What goals must be met to consider this
project complete?"  Some people call it circumlocution to rephrase 
instead of use a made-up word.  You must decide for yourself.

					>>>==>PStJTT

    �In the same vein, one could use "method" instead of "methodology".
    "Method is plainly superior (well, it seems so to me).�
    
    "Method" is only superior to "methodology" when the word one
    wants to use is "method". When one wants to use "methodology",
    "method" will *not* do. "Method" is "method" and "methodology"
    is "methodology" and never the twain shall meet. They are not
    synonyms nor *should* they be.
    
    --- jerry

    
    "deliverable" has been around for a long time and is well understood,
    so trying to replace it is probably not worth the effort.
    
    It is also pretty efficient, word- and thought-wise; maybe you could
    try "tangible <something>", as tangible products, tangible outputs,
    ...creations, ...accomplishments, ...edifices, ...project progeny, 
    ...sorry, my thesaurus got carried away trying to produce deliverables.
    
    

   How about "tangibles"?
   
   I couldn't resist.
   
   			Terza
   

>   How about "tangibles"?
   
>   I couldn't resist.
   
        Aren't they the orange citrus fruit a bit smaller than oranges
        with a distinctive flavor?

        (Neither could I  8^)

  >  "Method" is only superior to "methodology" when the word one
  >  wants to use is "method". When one wants to use "methodology",
  >  "method" will *not* do. "Method" is "method" and "methodology"
  >  is "methodology" and never the twain shall meet. They are not
  >  synonyms nor *should* they be.

    This town ain't big enough fer them two words...
    
    "Methodology" is often abused to mean the style by which something
    is performed -- that is, the method used!  It is in this usage
    that I say they are used as synonyms but they shouldn't be.  Are
    we going to rename a certain religion to the Methodologists? ;-)
    
    Show me an example where "methodology" is more apt or more descriptive
    than "method" when used in the engineering field.  The study of
    which method to use, not the method itself, should be called methodology.

    
	> an example where "methodology" is more apt 
    
    but probably not more descriptive would be in a high-powered,
    high-level engineering meeting where discussion of "methods" 
    sounds too pedestrian to the participants.
    
    Can I plead a case for definition by custom and usage?    

    �"Methodology" is often abused to mean the style by which something
    is performed -- that is, the method used!  It is in this usage
    that I say they are used as synonyms but they shouldn't be.�
    
    Of course. Are you arguing with me? That's exactly what I said,
    too. My point is that while "methodology" is often misused in
    situations where "method" should be used, there are instances
    in which "methodology" is proper and "method" improper.
    
    �Show me an example where "methodology" is more apt or more descriptive
    than "method" when used in the engineering field.�
    
    Hmmm...let's see. Actually, I can think of a good one. The
    "Scientific Method" is actually a methodology.
    
    --- jerry

    method -- 1: A procedure or process for attaining an objext: as
    a (1): a systematic procedure, technique, or mode of inquiry employed
    by or proper to a particular discipline or art . . . . b (1): a
    way, technique, or process of or for doing something 920: a bodky
    of skills or techniques . . . .
    
    methodology -- 1: A body of methods, rules, and postulates employed
    by a discipline: a particular procedure or set of procedures 2:
    the analysis of the principles or procedures or inquiry in a particular
    field.              
    
    							-- MW9NCD
    
    So, "methodology" has only one meaning, the one you would derive
    from the roots of the word, while "method" has a number of
    meanings, the quoted ones of which are very close to the meaning of
    "methodology". 
    
    BTW, the root of "method" is meta- and hodos, which means "way".
    "method" dates from Greece.  "methodology" dates from 19th c. when
    modern science was coming to.  Synonyms of "method" in MW9NCD are
    mode, manner, way, fashion, and system.   

    re: .11
    
  > Of course. Are you arguing with me? That's exactly what I said [...]

    Ahhhh it's clear now.  Jerry, your last message gave your definition
    of the words while your first only pointed out that there were
    differences.  The result: we agree, unless you are disagreeing with *me*. 

    re .12
    
    What is the "MW9NCD"?

    Today method vs methodology; tomorrow the world!

    We've strayed a little but it *has* been fun - not having seen any 
    replies from the originator of this topic about "deliverables" makes me
    wonder if he found enough nonsesquipedalianisms in our collective
    wise-doms to have gone off to more tangible pursuits.

     "MW9NCD" would be the dictionary he used.  The 920 would
     have meant (2), typed without the finger on the shift
     key.
     
     Dan

    MW9NCD = Merriam-Webster Ninth New Collegiate Dictionary
    

    I thought MW9NCD was a radio station! But in any case it is a
    deliverable while methodology is not.
    
    I would use "poderabilia" "ponderabilien" "ponderabilis" etc. or
    should I say ponderables?
    
    (You should not take it "cum grano salis")
    Rudi.
    

    My, this discussion is becoming notable!

Thanks for your responses.  I'll yield to "city hall" on this one; 
"deliverable" does serve its purpose well.  However, I'll use
"object," "output," "goal," or "objective," wherever possible.

Moffatt

    I'm surprised that no one extrapolated the method/methodology
    discussion to include methodologist.  To me, that progression helps
    to put the whole question into perspective.  A methodologist studies
    or practises the science of methodology.  The science of methodology
    provides an analysis of various methods.
    
    A "method" is used to achieve a particular result.  "Methodology"
    is a discipline by which various methods may be compared to determine 
    which might be the better "method" for solving a given problem.
    
    Not that far removed from:  "zoo" (the subject); "zoology" (the
    study of the subject); "zoologist" (one who studies the subject).

   One who studies methods is a methodist.

    Re: .20
    
    Who studies the methodologist - a methodologistogist or a
    metamethodologist?
    
    Bernie

RE -1

>    Who studies the methodologist - a methodologistogist or a
>    metamethodologist?

The methodologistogist of course. A metamethodologist is either someone who
studies metamethods, or metastudies methods.

Arie

    Haven't we missed an olog?
    
    Methodologistologist?
    
    
    Ian.

RE -1 (Ian)

>    Haven't we missed an olog?
>    Methodologistologist?

Only if we agree that methodologistology is the science of methodologists.
I mean: study of the behavior of them. Or.... well never mind.

Arie

    Re: .23
    
    > A metametholologist is either someone who studies metamethods,
    > or metastudies methods.
    
    I thought someone who studies metamethods is a metametamethodologist.
    
    Someone who metastudies methods _could_ be a metamethodmethodologist.
    
    Bernie

    
    There must be a method in the madness of this note.
    
    (But I can't find it!)
    
    
    ..klaas..
    

    ...or even a methodology in the metamadness.
    
    Ian.

    Enroll in a meta-methadone treatment program immediately!

RE -1

>    Enroll in a meta-methadone treatment program immediately!
                 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I'm glad you found out personally that methadon has the same sickening effects
as the stuff you want to get free of.....

Arie