Conference quark::mennotes-v1

Some people seem to be upset at some things I said. I apologize to
people I offended by describing myself as a minority (gay male) in
previous notes (though I tried to avoid that issue when I spoke about 
AA).  My intent was not to get folks pissed off.  My intent was only
to give my perspective on a debateable topic.  Sorry for any bad
feelings caused. 

I dunno.  It's all context for me, who I'm with and what I'm doing.
Sometimes I feel like a minority (and in some cities and states,
legislation defines my difference as that of a "minority"; for
example, Boston, New York City, Wisconsin, San Francisco).  There are
other times I feel very much like a white male (sexuality
unperceived).   It depends.  

One thing that I really like about being a gay white male is that,
depending on the given situation, I can either feel like the type of
person that faces the least amount of racial and gender discrimation
(white male) or I can feel like the type of person who feels the
effects of intense discrimination and hatred (gay men).  It offers me
a chance to walk in several pairs of shoes at the same time.  It helps
me to empathize with what both sides might be feeling. 

If people were to ask me if I consider myself to be a "minority," I 
would quite honestly have to say "yes and no," followed by a lengthy 
discussion.


						--Ger

    I find it really interesting that (from my observations) heterosexual
    male noters avoid like the plague any note that discusses
    homosexuality.  It is as if by replying, you will be somehow linked
    with "those people."  What ever happened to "Valuing Differences?"
    
    I am a heterosexual male who tries hard Not to act prejudicially
    towards Gays, or Women, or People of Color, etc.  But I DO tend
    to place them in a "minority" pigeonhole.  This is a result on my
    own upbringing.  I see evidence all the time of less-than-human
    treatment of Gays, whether due to some mistaken feeling of superiority
    by others, or fear of AIDS, or whatever.  It is a sad commentary
    that we have to legislate fair treatment for ALL people in our country.
    But it is much better than the alternative (people continued to
    be treated unfairly).
    
    Thank you for the note, Ger.  The more we learn about ALL sectors
    of our society, the better able we will all be to effectively deal
    with others.
    
    Jack

    
    RE: Ger...
    
    Stick with it.  People that percieved as "different" are amoung the
    first to realize how much the same we are.  Being Gay by what I'm told
    is not a decision you just are.  For most I know it was an unwanted
    intrusion in their life.  They are amoung the mass of people that
    realize they aren't right inside and get help to face it and accept
    it.  Those that I know who accept it are useful, loving people. Is
    this not what we are all supposed to be?  For those who would call
    names, well I tend to feel sorry for them they don't know.  Aids,
    yes I'm afraid of that, it kills.  I doesn't mean I run away from 
    people because they are Gay.  IV drug users are somone to be scared
    of, their dependency makes them dangerous beyond their own will.
    
    I almost wrote this in another note but it wasn't the right place.
    This note should exist.  Gerry, stand up ignore the rocks and the
    rabble that throw them.  After all it's the same rabble that say
    "Never, it can't possibly happen to me!".
    
    Cheers, john
    
    

    
    Ger, I for one am thankful that you've taken the time to share
    your thoughts.
    
    I reluctantly admit that when I was younger I was quite
    intolerant of gay people. Because of the efforts of folks like
    you taking the time to explain how life is in your shoes I've learned
    a lot and I would like to think that I've overcome this intolerance.
    If not for your efforts and others I might not have grown.
    I'm encouraged that we can discuss sensitive issues such as this.
    I'm learning. Thanks for your patience.
    
    							Best wishes
    
    								Hank

    My most cherished and closest friend on this earth is gay.  Through
    him I have learned more about life, love, understanding and acceptance
    than I think I ever could have had I never come to love him as I
    do.  I met him in high school and fell in love with him, we had
    a wonderful relationship which as it grew I began to question as
    I wondered why he didn't "touch" me.  After about two years of spending
    almost every free moment I had with him I became suspicious and
    confronted him.  It was the hardest loving thing I've ever done in my life
    and because I loved/love him so much, I was there for him while
    he learned to accept himself and I supported him alone until the
    day when he was comfortable with himself and he confronted his family.
    
    We laughed and cried and screamed together through so much that
    words could never explain, and all I can say is that I know I'm
    a better person today for having him as my cherished and closest
    friend.  I can't begin to tell you the feeling I have knowing that
    he was able to open himself to _ME_ and know that somehow, I would
    find the strength and the will to support him..... and I did...
    Ours is a unique and incredible relationship.  I love him dearly.
    

    I forgot to sign my name!   
    
    		Judy
    

    Ger,
    
    Standing up for what you believe in is very important.  By your
    note, I feel that you have made a statement here, and I applaud
    it.  I had a very good friend (through work) that died in a auto
    accident some years back.  He was gay, and this was back in
    the days when Gay people kept to themselves and didn't let on to
    too many people.  I'll tell ya, I was appauled at the people who
    showed up at the funeral to shed their obligatory crocidile tears.
    
    Were any of "them" there when "He" needed support, or some help
    understanding something to do with his job, or just needed a friend to
    talk to?  No, there was only a few of us with the brains to see through
    the fences our society constructed to "shut-out" "Those" people.  The
    rest couldn't wait for "him" to turn his back so they could poke fun,
    and have their laughs at "his" expence.  Let me tell you, "he" was one
    of the nicest guys goin.  "He" just followed a different drummer than I
    did.  Thats all...  Didn't change the person he was.  and that was damn
    good person 
    
    So many of us on this earth place ourselves a notch above others
    of different color, or different beliefs.  To me, it's the difference
    in us that makes the world tick.  No one walking this earth has
    the right to judge anyone.  I accept gay men/women the same way I accept
    heterosexual men/women, the same way I accpet white/balck/red..
    (Aka "Those" peop le) I feel that  if sit in judgement, someday, I'll be 
    judged, someday I'll be one of "Those" people.  

    I remember, a long way back, (I was only about 19 or 20) we (my wife
    and I,, yeah, we *were* married young, and yes, we are still together..
    she's the greatest..) were invited to a friends wedding.    The two
    people getting married, happened to be black.  As it turned out, we were the
    only white people there that day.  At first, I didn't know how to feel, I
    guess I felt the same way a black person would feel when in the similar
    situation.  But within an instance, the feeling was gone, and I had a
    great time, and met some dynamite people.  ALl the people there
    at the wedding reception made us feel so much a part of the part,
    and a part of the day.  Color didn't matter a damn.  
    
    I guess what I'm trying to say I feel that what-ever type of person you
    "are", you're human first.  We're all in this together. (It's high time
    for everyone to understand this...) 
    
    My wife and I have had discussions with friends on this topic,
    (homosexuality) and I've been very surprised at the amount of people
    who have learned to accept people for what they are.  Of course there
    are still those of us out there who have not yet seen the 'light'.
    Well, I guess all you can do is pray that some day, we'll all
    understand whats important, and leave people alone. 
    
	
    Ger, keep believing in yourself, and what ever you do, take care and do
    whats right for you.  Stand up and be counted !  Life is all we
    have, ya gotta make the best of it.

    
    Gerry,
    	
    Good note - it got me thinking about how my own reactions to gays
    were shaped.  My closest friend from the age of about 5 through
    high school is gay.  I never conciously knew at the time, but when
    he told me later, I remember feeling no surprise.  One of the reasons
    we were such good friends is that we accepted each other on our own
    terms - he never minded that I was a scrawny little geek with 
    coke-bottle glasses and bright red hair.  I never gave him any grief
    because he was taller than everyone else and was as uncoordinated as
    I was.
    
    I owe a lot to my parents - they taught me to deal with people on an
    open, accepting basis.  They were definately more liberal in their
    views than most people at that time - I grew up in Maine in the '50's.
    They set the example for me with the constant flow of friends and
    acquaintances through our house - they were involved with the American
    Field Service, so visitors included people of every race, culture, and
    religion.  Beyond that, my mother, who reread "Walden" and "Civil
    Disobedience" once a year, showed me early how to speak out for the
    rights of others.  (Sounds like a cross between the Cleavers and
    radical chic, I know.)  The important thing was the sense of 
    understanding and wanting to understand.  The hardest thing for me to
    understand now is the hatred and bitterness I hear when so many people
    talk about someone who is "different."
    
    Back to my friend...  It hurt me to see how some of our high school
    classmates treated him when we had a reunion - avoidance and
    hostility.  But, I was glad to see that those of us who were closest
    in school just treated him as our friend - the same person we knew
    when we moved the Physics teacher's VW into the gym.  As he put it,
    he didn't become someone else, he just figured out who he was.  
    At the next reunion, I hope some more people will join in our 
    friendship and acceptance.
    
    Ron

    
                         -< News from Charles Haynes >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    
To: The known universe
Subject: "Out on national TV"
From: haynes (Charles Haynes)

In the past, when I've been asked how "out" I am, I've sometimes
replied:

	As out as you can be without going on national TV.

Well, now I have to find a new line.

On June 11, 1992 my sweetie and I came out on national TV as
bisexuals. Not just on national TV, but on the Geraldo Rivera Show.

I kid you not.

It was one of the hardest, scariest, most outrageous things I've ever
done in a life of doing hard scary outrageous things. It also makes me
prouder than ever of my wonderful sweetie who is NOT into scary
outrageous things, and who is quite private - unlike me.

Here's how it happened.

Robyn Ochs, a well known Boston Bisexual Activist was contacted by the
Geraldo show. They were going to do a show including "Tom Smith" the
author of "Half Straight, My Secret Bisexual Life" (and a lying
scumbag) and were going to pitch it as a show on bisexuality. They
were going to include a woman whose husband had recently died of AIDS,
and who found membership cards in various gay baths while going
through his effects. She is HIV+. We have no idea if her husband
identified as straight, bi, or gay. Another guest would be "Jane Doe"
a married woman who's husband knew and approved of her women lovers.
All of these people would appear in disguise, and not using their real
names.  Finally we would have Robyn and David Lourea, a bisexual
activist from San Francisco as the experts.

She put out a call for happy out bisexuals in a stable long term
relationship who were willing to be on the Geraldo show under their
own names and faces. I read this and said to myself "Damn. She's
talking about *us*." Actually, it would have been better if we could
have found a bi couple who were also in a monogamous relationship, bis
of color, or bis in a motss relationship, but I sent Robyn mail saying
we might be willing, and called my sweetie.

She was not enthused.

We talked about it for a while, I explained why *I* wanted to do it,
and why I thought we would be a good choice. She explained how hard it
would be, how this was not something SHE would have volunteered for,
but finally, after many days of discussion (and my assurance that she
could back out at any time and I would not hold it against her in any
way) we agreed to do it.

We cancelled all of our commitments for Thursday, asked her mother to
fly up to watch our two year old, and finalized arrangements with the
producer of the show to fly out.

Then the Robyn told us that David would not be doing the show, and
that she wanted the show to have two experts and would not do the show
otherwise (and I agreed with her reasoning and still agree.) We were
faced with being the ONLY "voice of sanity and reason" on the show.
Yikes. Robyn mentioned though that she had talked to Loraine Hutchins,
a Washington D.C. area bi activist about doing the show, and that
Loraine might be willing to do the show by herself even though she too
agreed that two experts would be best.

That's how it turned out.

Wednesday at work was a nightmare. I couldn't concentrate, I had
trouble getting any work done. Every little while panic would wash
over me and I would silently scream "WHAT IN HELL HAVE YOU DONE?! YOU
*IDIOT*!" I'd take a deep breath, talk calmly to myself, and the panic
would recede for a few seconds. Evidently Janice was having similar
problems only much worse.

I talked to Loraine a bit on the phone before we left and got some
good advice about appearing on TV. Here's what I remember:

	If he asks a question you don't want to answer, answer
	a question you DO want to answer. You don't have to
	answer his question, you don't have to say you won't
	answer his question, just get YOUR message across.

[This helped a lot. Geraldo wasn't some giant media star, he was just
a person. I didn't have to run this game his way, we could run it OUR
way. Whew.]

	If he doesn't seem to be understanding what you are
	saying, interrupt him and re-state it. Don't be afraid
	to jump in if he's just not getting it.

	Condense your message to its essentials, and keep
	repeating it. When you get anxious, repeat your
	message to yourself as a mantra.

I called my mom a few nights before we were going to leave and said:

	Me:  Hi mom! Guess what, Janice and I are going to be on national
	     TV. What's your worst nightmare?

	Her: Geraldo.

	Me:  [Brightly] Right in one!

	Her: [Silence]

Ahem. She'll get over it.

Wednesday night we flew out to New York, slept a little on the plane,
arrived at 6am New York time, took a limo to the hotel and went back
to sleep. 11am EST we got out of bed (I had slept, Janice hadn't much)
and got ready to go to the studio. We dressed in our "happy,
successful, attractive" drag and tried to relax. Fat chance.
Especially since we then took a taxi across town to the studio.
Relaxation and New York taxis don't mix, but we did survive.

Lugging our suitcases up to the front of the building we see a line
stretching out the door and down the sidewalk. It's the audience. We
waltz on in and wait for the receptionist to finish with the short
gray haired man in front of us. He mentions that he's going to be a
guest on the Geraldo show - oh shit! This must be "Tom Smith!" I take
a step back and check for psychic cooties.

Checking out the folks in the lobby I noticed a number of scary
looking people dressed all in black, sporting tattoos and various body
piercings, wearing "bisexual pride" buttons, pink and blue triangles,
linked male/male/female/female jewelry and other familiar icons. I
suddenly felt much more at home. It looked like we would have a
cheering section in the audience! I could have hugged them. (I *did*
hug them after the show.) We struck up a conversation, and one of them
asked me if Robyn was coming. I mentioned that no, Loraine was going
to do the show instead.

	"Loraine? Loraine *Hutchins*?"

	"Yes."

	"Ohmigod. I'm not moving. I HAVE to see her. Ohmigod."

Great. I was going to be on TV with God. Fortunately she is a
benificent deity, so it was fun.

We got escorted up to "The Green Room" and entered a new world. The
green room is the room where you wait before going on, where you get
made up, there are monitors on the wall showing what's going on on the
other networks, a large monitor showing what's being taped right then,
refreshments, and places for people to sit. We sat. We introduced
ourselves to the other people in the room, including a woman with
large bright pink triangle earrings. "Hi, you must be Loraine, we're
Charles and Janice."

Loraine was nice, smart, competent, funny, and friendly. We had a
good time back in the green room psyching each other up and chatting
with the other guests. As it turned out, only "Tom Smith" was truly
slime, the others were very nice, friendly people, just as scared as
we were.

Finally the time came and we were lead to the studio. We stood
backstage for a moment then were lead on to get microphones and to
take our seats. Sitting there in my comfy chair, I looked out over the
audience, spotted our cheering section and smiled, and thought to
myself, "Hell, I've dealt with bigger and more hostile crowds that
THIS." (Have you ever stood up in front of a room full of 700 X Window
System programmers and said "C sucks?" I have.)

Anyway, the lights went up and we were on our way.

And... you'll have to watch the show. I'm not going to describe it
here except to say that I think it went well considering the
constraints of the venue. We made our points, we managed to keep it
from being a show about how icky bisexuals were, how we lie, how we're
promiscuous, how we spread AIDS, how we're confused. Instead I think
we managed to get across a good powerful message about bisexuality.
Check it out.

Afterwards we chatted for a bit with Loraine, went downstairs and
chatted with the NY bisexual activists. Hugged people all around and
got in the limo, drove back to Newark, got on the airplane, drove
home, and went to sleep in our very own bed.

So, those of you who've wondered what I look like, or what Janice
looks like, or what Charles and Janice and Loraine verus Geraldo would
look like, or who don't know us and want to see out proud bisexuals on
national TV, check out the Geraldo show to air sometime around June
25th. We won't know the exact date till a couple of days before. If
you are local to Janice and me, we plan to get a tape from the studio
and have a private showing.

	-- Charles

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