Conference noted::bicycle

    repeat after me:
    
    It's not a race.
    It's not a race.
    It's not a race.
    It's not a race.
    
    And I mean it.  It's a requirement of our insurance.
    
    It is arguably the flattest century in the east.  Not to be
    confused with The Flattest Century in the East which is a different
    flat century.
    
    Seriously, it's pretty flat.  Traffic is occasionally annoying.
    
    There is a refreshment stop in Maine somewhere -- we change it evry
    year or so.  The course which we also change slightly every year or so,
    do about 70+ miles north of the start location and about 30- south
    of it so you effectively get 2 or 3 refreshment stops as well as
    the chance to cop out after 70 miles, which may or may not be
    good because it gives you an easy out.
    
    As for "sag support," pick up is available on call which means
    "in an hour or so" unless you are lucky.
    
    It's also a very scenic route.
    
    ed, pres GSW for another 80 days or so.

    Re .1; Trust me, if you saw how fast I bike, you would realize that I
    don't race. I went on a "C" ride with the Seven Hill Wheelman and was
    with the group that was at the back (2 groups, fast and slow separated
    by a couple of miles). 
    So I relate more with the tortoise than the hare. 
    
    I'm glad to hear about the 70/30 split. I've done 54 miles but that's
    it (done just this past Sunday). So I know that I'll be able to go the
    70 miles. It's the extra 30 miles and the fact that it get's darker
    sooner that will cause me to worry.
    		Cindy
    

    Other than the traffic in sections, this is a great century for first
    timer's.  The coast scenery will take away some of the pain.
    
    Have fun
    
    steve

    I only referred to "race" because you said "finish the race."
    
    Enjoy the ride.  If you like flowers, it goes by Prescott Park
    in Portsmouth.  Also several coastal forts from the revolutionary era.
    And unless you're a "Massachusetts was first" bigot you will find that
    the first armed resistance of the revolution occurred in NH four months
    before Lexington and Concord.  Also goes through Strawberry Banke.
    
    ed

    
    
    Where can I get more into on this ride?  
    I have never done a century and it sounds
    challenging.
    
    MikeR
    

    just got my brochure concerning the century. It says that for more info
    to send a self-addressed, stamped envelope with your specific questions
    to Fred McLaughlin, 77 South Main Street, Concord, N.H. 03301 or you
    can call 603-228-0565.
    		Cindy
    

    re" more info on this ride"
    
    What do you want?  A Cue sheet or type of cookies at the checkpoint?
    
    ed

    I've been looking forward to this century, but a trip out of the 
    area is messing up my plans to ride with everyone else.
    
    Ed, any chance I can get a detailed route sheet?  Maybe, I can talk
    a few others into riding this route a week or two later than the GSW
    ride.
    
    Bob

I have re-read the previous replies & one bit of info that would be helpful is
Where does the ride start?

They have cookies, too!!! ;-)


	Tim B

    I'll send you a route sheet provided you and I are both still here
    in two weeks (oh, how morbid).  I have run into tons of folks who
    "just followed the arrows" and discovered they'd don a centruy when
    they got done.
    
    Of course there are so many arrows in the area your mileage may vary.
    
    ed

    the ride starts at the Hampton Beach State Park which is
    just north of the bridge to Seabrook anf just south of
    "the strip"  -- the hudred or so bazaars and the public beach.
    
    This year the plan is to charge "a la carte" something like:
    
    ride	free
    parking	$2.50
    patch	$2.50
    refreshments$2.50
    rain	free
    
    Somehow it adds to a max of $10 so there might be something
    else or the above might be higher.  And we might all regret doing
    it this way but this way we don't pay the insurance company
    any mor emoney either.
    
    Join the GSW during the weekend and get a free commemorative
    coffee mug or water bottle.  (supply limited)
    
    ed

    re: .11  This is what I call a non-profit group...not like that "club"
    in Rhode Island that is charging to ride on the road.
    
    steve

    yes.  Our philsophy has always been that we don't try to
    make money on our rides.  Unfortunately we often lose money
    -- usually when it rains and we overstock on food.
    
    ed

    
    re .13
    
    I have a different philosophy on these events.
    
    I believe that an organization is entitled to receive
    $$ in whatever equivalent services are provided.
    
    That is, your VOLUNTEER TIME *is* worth *something*.
    It may "cost" you nothing, but it has value that you
    are more than entitled to charge for, in my opinion.
    
    Also, it doesn't sound like you're even coming close
    to covering your *real costs*, let alone the ones that
    are "free" (i.e., volunteer time), if you've lost
    money some years.
    
    Are you covering all phone calls to solicit those
    volunteers?  Do you cover the cost of paint and gas to
    arrow the routine?  Sag vehicle rentals, if any?  At
    least the price of *gas* for those sag vehicles?  Copying
    of maps?  These are more reasons you should be charging
    *something* for the ride itself, in my opinion.
    

re: .14

Though many clubs do view centuries as money raising events, there is an article
in the September issue of Bicycle USA (mag of the LAW) that comments that some
of the best liked centuries are viewed as celebrations which may, if they are 
lucky, break even or provide some seed money for next year.

I agree that it is necessary to charge enough to cover your costs.  While some
costs are fixed (patches are $2.50), others get amortized over the number of
riders that you have.  The ideal is to find the price that is low enough to
attract a large number of riders, but high enough so that costs are covered.

Rich
P.S.  The Seven Hills Wheelmen are running a century on September 20.

    During the mid-80's I recall this "non-profit" club in RI had a bank
    roll of $21,000.  I also heard through grape vines they put on nice
    parties for their own club people.  To me, the purpose of a non-profit
    bike club is to have public responsibity and expand the sport of
    cycling.  
    
    Covering expenses is fine, it doesn't cost that much to give out
    bananas and arrow the roads.
    
    Think of the cost to a family of 4 doing the "Flatest century in the
    East"...about $80?   
    
    Just my opinion
    steve

    
    I don't mind paying something-beyond-cost for a century-type ride,
    knowing that there are "hidden" costs of running a club, and that
    presumably the club is going to do public-service or member-service
    type things with the money. (I hope!)
    
    One compromise, by the way, is to charge an entry fee that recoups
    direct costs (e.g., snacks), and on the side, to sell t-shirts, etc.,
    at a profit ... so those who *want* to contribute, can, by buying
    the t-shirt or whatever.
    
    Of course, as I've said, my centuries and rides like NCTTB have been
    free club events, even though I hand out Fig Newtons, prepare route 
    sheets, etc.  That's a different matter, however, because anyone who 
    comes to one of *these* rides is paying enough just by *riding* it! :-) :-)
    
    -john

    Among the costs we do recoup are that we buy a ticket to the annual
    banquet for each of the "volunteers".  AS for losing money.  NBW
    cannot lose because htey preregister.  Our staff refuses to
    preregister, so if we stock food for the usual 400 and get
    a complete rainout we lose.
    
    I believe we ought to preregister riders however I defer to
    those who run the century and let them do it their way and
    for lack of differing wills, that is the way it is.  It has
    earned more than it has lost over nearly 20 years so we
    are willing to leave it at that.  This year if we accept
    any $$ for the ride we must kick back $1-per to the insurance company.
    The riders get no additional insurance benefit out of this $1
    so we just are not doing it that way.
    
    "We" are always willing to do things differently but will also
    defer to the persons doing the acutal work.
    
    Board positions are open.

    
    
    	Although my club primarily organises RRs and TTs instead of
    centuries (the century seems as peculiar to America as TTing down a drag
    strip is to the UK), I feel that an amateur cycling club should be a
    non-profit organisation.
    
    	Nobody should be organising a club thinking about money, that ruins
    the sport. Bike clubs should be run by enthusiasts who want to be there
    helping, not by people looking to make some cash. Yes, our volunteer
    time is of value, but that shouldn't mean that we have to have some
    sort of compensation. I have now organised 2 Scottish Championships and
    been involved in at least 5 or 6 others. In each event I personally
    made a loss. OK, we had the benefit of pre-registering which Ed's club
    don't, but each event's prize list went as close to the amount of money
    that I brought in after insurance. If there was a couple of pounds
    left, then I kept it to partially cover costs.
    
    	Now to the point (if your still reading... :*). In each event I
    have had vlounteers. The worst was the RR championships where I needed
    in the region of 15-20 marshalls and a total of about 20 cars. Nobody
    was given compensation, not even a ticket to the Xmas party. The
    majority were members of my club (and remember we do have only 25
    members) and some who had come up to the race to watch but 'wanted to
    know if they can help.' I help in only one race where I get
    compensation for giving up my time and that's a ticket to the after
    race banquet for our annual 2-day event.
    
    	I have often complained that cycling needs to take itself out of the
    1930s and make itself more attractive to a modern population. But, at
    the same time, that doesn't mean we need to follow today's bad habits.
    Keeping it non-profit means that the sport stays friendlier and that
    should be our main attraction...
    
    $21,000? My clubs funds are sitting (after we convert it into your
    backward monetary system :*) at $800...
    
    Graham.

     Frankly, I see nothing wrong with a club turning a profit (and the
    being self centered and throwing themselves a party)...
    
     We forget that a lot of "free" time is invested by the club for these
    centuries. All we tend to see is patches - food - drink - maps... Most
    well organized centuries have sweep vehicles, 3 stops (for those 25 -
    50 - 75 - 100 mile option rides) all manned by people.
    
     I don't agree with raping someone with high application fees, but the
    profit itself allows clubs additional options like membership drives,
    keeping current members interested and active in the well being of the
    club that supports continued membership that supports our sport.
    
     My $.02
    
              Chip

    
    re .16:
    
    I don't agree with what NBW does.  They are at the opposite
    end of the spectrum from what I am advocating.  For one thing,
    you want riders to look at the cost and feel they are getting
    what they pay for, more or less.  And that's not how I,
    even with my liberal attitude towards clubs being able to
    make *something* back from an event, feel about "Flattest".
    It's simply not "good value", even compared with other clubs
    who *are* making a small "profit".
    
    re .19
    
    I was definitely *not* talking about compensating volunteers
    with money!  Did you get that impression?  I DID NOT mean that,
    I DID NOT mean that, I DID NOT mean that!  Okay?
    
    Although I do think it's nice to rewards volunteers with a
    banquet as Ed suggests, or with free T-shirts the day of the
    event, or something, it's not strictly necessasry.
    
    But even that is not what I meant.  I meant that the CLUB could
    be making back in $$ what their volunteer time is worth.  And it
    certainly doesn't mean by making money back that a club isn't
    non-profit.  It means your proceeds go toward other "good" things
    that your club may do.  Maybe your club has or might think about
    starting a community service program in educating kids about
    biking, for example, or have a helmet program to provide for kids,
    or even contributing the $$ to a local bicycle advocacy group or
    LAW, or, or, ... well, you get the idea.  There *is* at least
    *some* money to be made off of these events, to the further good
    of bicycling.  THAT is what I'm talking about.  It is NOT
    unreasonable to charge a small amount more for good programs.
    
    I'm the Program Chair of American Youth Hostels Greater Boston
    Council.  This year, we jacked up the price for our "Cape in a
    Day Plus One" Century weekend to make a profit.  In the past
    we have had no problem filling this trip and saw an opportunity.
    Where does our "profit" go?  To fund our Youth Opportunities
    Program, a program to bring inner-city kids out to hostels where
    they learn new skills & have new experiences---hiking,
    mountain biking, and other activities.  Volunteers got T-shirts
    and that was it.  And we're still a non-profit group.
    

    We've ratholed this topic but while it occurs to me here's a case
    that I object to.
    
    The company that makes Ultra Energy gave several cases of the stuff
    to AYH some years ago for BAM (Bike Across Missouri) with the statement
    "Give these to the riders" The idea being to promote further sales
    with free samples.  Riders at BAM were told, "We have Ultra Energy"
    for the special price of $5 a bag.
    
    That kind of money grubbing bugs me.
    
    ed

    re.21
    
    	OK, I misunderstood... Brains not firing on all cylinders today,
    sorry...
    
    Graham.

     I was not implying that sags, stops, etc... get paid either.
    The point was that there are freebies in there, but because
    they're not itemized, most people take them for granted...
    
     And as far as participation... The most powerful message comes
    from the consumer. If you don't like it don't do it! Simple and
    well within your control.
    
     Chip