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Conference noted::bicycle

Title: Bicycling
Notice:Bicycling for Fun
Moderator:JAMIN::WASSER
Created:Mon Apr 14 1986
Last Modified:Fri Jun 06 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:3214
Total number of notes:31946

1685.0. "French frame<-->English hardwdare???" by CRBOSS::BEFUMO (The bun is the lowest form of wheat) Fri Aug 03 1990 10:23

I have a full shimono group off of a Shogun selectra and have been looking for 
a frame for it to live on.  Since it's not a really top-notch hardware group, I
clearly don't want to spend megabucks on a frame - all I'm really lookin for is
a decent second bike.  Anyway, I have a line on a Motobecane Gran Touring 
(probably early 1970s), in my size.  The problem, I'm told, is that it's all
French-threaded.  Now, I surmise that the main points of contention will be the
bottom bracket and headstock, but I'm uncertain what exactly this entails. 
Will I be looking at replacing the entire set from pedal to pedal, or will I be
able to utilize, say, chainrings, cranks, etc and just replace the parts that
actually screw into the frame?  It's been suggested that it may be possible to
have a machine shop re-thread these areas to accept more easily available
components.  Anyone have any idea as the the feasibility of this approach? 
Cost?  Is this kind of frame worth the expense/trouble, considering that it's
in good shape, recently painted, etc?  Thanks.

						Joe
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1685.1JUMBLY::MACFADYENRide that bikeFri Aug 03 1990 10:256
    I can't answer most your of questions, but it strikes me that the only
    component you'll have difficulty fitting is the bottom bracket, since
    that's the only screw-in part (headsets are press-in).
    
    
    Rod
1685.2WAV13::DELORIEAJerseys @#%@!&amp; JerseysFri Aug 03 1990 11:4914
>> Anyone have any idea as the the feasibility of this approach? 

  The headset might or might not work due to stack hight of the previous
headset being SHORTER than the one you are going to install. Chances are the
headset you are going to install is a Japanise one which are the shortest and a
few washers will be the most you'll need to get if you don't want to cut down
the fork tube.

The BB you have is not french then all you'll need to order is french cups. 
Maybe you can find a shop that has a french BB of your style in stock that no 
one can use and he'll be happy to work a swap if the cups you have are still 
new.

Tom
1685.3TLE::SASAKIMarty Sasaki ZK02-3N30 381-0151Fri Aug 03 1990 12:0813
    It is not that difficult to find French cups for bottom brackets or
    retainer rings with French threads for sealed BB.
    
    The pedals and the freewheel are different, but you sound like you are
    going to put on a new crankset/pedals and wheels anyway. I would also
    check the diameter of the stem, I have a vague memory of a friend
    having a problem changing his stem.
    
    I've been facing the opposite problem, I've got a pretty good frame (an
    old Vita Sprint 531 DB frame) and I'm slowly upgrading the
    components...
    
    	Marty Sasaki
1685.4many possibilities.NOVA::FISHERDictionary is not.Fri Aug 03 1990 12:5011
I'd suspect the seatpost of being a non-fit, also.  Ther fron deraileur
is probably a strap on and the seat tube a slightly different diameter
so that might be a problem.  How about that little cable guide for the rear
deraileur cable, that may or may not be right.

Seat tube binder bolt is likely to be incompatible.

Do the brakes fit and have the right reach?  I cannot thionk of a reason
for them not to fit but I also cannot think of a reason for them to fit.

ed
1685.5I get the point . . .CRBOSS::BEFUMOThe bun is the lowest form of wheatFri Aug 03 1990 15:204
    Thanks folks - I think I'm going to wait & find an english frame.
    
    
    							JB
1685.6WJOUSM::SCHWABEFri Aug 03 1990 16:5211
    
    Gee, I have an old Motobecane Grand Record (super frame, probably some
    of the nicest lug work ever on a production bicycle) and a bike shop
    told me that the bottom bracket threads are probably english. I can't
    verify that however, I'm still using the original bottom bracket. 
    
    Seat post width will probably be a problem though. I know mine was
    an off size.
    
    I'd say ask a reputable bike shop. Older Motobecane frames are of
    pretty good quality in my opinion.
1685.7English??SHALOT::ELLISJohn Lee Ellis - assembly requiredFri Aug 03 1990 22:165
    Oh, yes, I also thought highly of that era and model-range
    of Motobecane.  But I always assumed the threading was French.
    Silly me. :-)  Let us know if you find out.
    
    -john
1685.8Enlish or ItalianDISCVR::HUIThu Aug 09 1990 12:2426
    This is straight out of Frank Berto Book "Complete Guide To Upgrading 
    Your Bike". On Page 8 in the Standardization and Nonstandardization
    topic.
       
    
       Before you start to upgrade your bicycle, check the botton bracket.
    If the cups are 1.37 inches in diameter and have a 24 tpi (threads per
    inch) and the bottom bracket is 68mm (2.68 inches) wide, you are in
    luck. Your bike uses English threads, the de facto industry standard.
       If you hav an English-threaded bike, your headset will be 27mm in
    diameter, while the steerer tube will be 1 inch in diameter and will
    have 24 tpi. The crank will accept 20 tpi pedal threads that are 9/16
    inch in diameter. You will be able to get standard parts from almost
    any supply source.
       If your frame has a 70mm (2.76 inches) bottom bracket width, then it
    probably has French, Italian, or Swiss threads and I advise you to sell
    it to someone who hasn't read this book. Start with a English threaded
    frame. Do spend your time back ordering parts, waiting for them, and
    then finding that they don't fit. etc.....
    
       
    If you look in most bike catalogs. They do not stock French thread
    parts. I would stick with Frank advice above unless you are going to
    build a classic French bike for display or show.  
                                                    
    Dave  
1685.9Sounds like I made the right choice.CRBOSS::BEFUMOIRAQnophobiaFri Aug 10 1990 09:252
    Sage advice indeed!  Actually, I ended up selling the parts bike &
    forgetting the whole thing.  Thanks to all for the good advice!