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Conference noted::bicycle

Title: Bicycling
Notice:Bicycling for Fun
Moderator:JAMIN::WASSER
Created:Mon Apr 14 1986
Last Modified:Fri Jun 06 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:3214
Total number of notes:31946

1477.0. "24-hour riding" by SHALOT::ELLIS (John Lee Ellis - assembly required) Tue Apr 03 1990 08:47

    
    Several of us have done 24-hour rides (or rides that spanned 
    several days, such as PBP or the RAAM qualifiers), where you
    could sleep as little as you wished.
    
    The record distance unpaced (no draft support) for 24 hours 
    is over 500 miles, I believe.  That may have been on a lighted
    velodrome, though.  
    
    I've done all of two 24-hour rides, and 22 hours of a third.
    The first netted 347 miles with 1:10 hours sleep.
    The second (a week ago) was 323 (as reported here), with no sleep.
    The 22 hours one got over 300 miles, with no sleep.
    
    Extrapolating, it looks like I'd break 400 by sleeping 3 or 4 hours. :-)
    
    Any others have experiences?
    
    -john
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1477.1BANZAI::FISHERDictionary is not.Tue Apr 03 1990 09:045
    Gee, I don't think there's any unpaced 500+ mi/24hr record.  I'll
    hafta check as soon as my newsletter comes in (the next one has the
    latest records).
    
    ed
1477.2That sounds like murder!CESARE::JOHNSONMatt Johnson, DTN 871-7473Tue Apr 03 1990 12:235
    Five sub-five-hour centuries back-to-back sounds unlikely.  What
    are we talking about -- normal bikes, or streamlined "human-powered
    vehicles"?
    
    MATT
1477.3What we're talking is John HowardNOVA::FISHERDictionary is not.Tue Apr 03 1990 12:346
    John Howard's 24 hr record is "paced" on a track following an
    ever changing pack.  something like 521 miles in 24 hrs.  He
    spent 15 minutes off the bike, changed dirction twice.  The
    bicycles were pretty standard, un faired, probably track.
    
    ed
1477.4See the RTTC handbook....IDEFIX::HEMMINGSLanterne RougeWed Apr 04 1990 03:4310
	If my memory serves me right.........
	The unpaced, on normal roads TT record in the UK is 501 miles in 24 hr.
Achieved by Roy Cromack certainly more than 5 years ago, maybe 10.  Roy was
renowned for his strong views on diet, training and racing technique.  He
apparently rode this race at almost even pace, letting his rivals do their own
thing early on and then destroyed them in the last quarter.
	This was achieved on the normal out and home course used in this type
of event and with riders relying on battery lamps on their bikes.  The events
are usually held about mid-summer (in the UK?? what summer???) to minimise the
number of darkness hours.
1477.5JUMBLY::MACFADYENBad wordsWed Apr 04 1990 06:058
    Re .4:
    
    If I remember, I'll check that. From reading Cycling Weekly I know that
    12 hour TTs are usually won in about 260-270 miles, so 500 for a 24
    hour seems feasible, for a human with god-like endurance that is.
    
    
    Rod
1477.6RTTC Competition RecordsJUMBLY::MACFADYENBad wordsThu Apr 05 1990 07:3916
    I did remember, and I did check it. Here, for your interest and
    delectation, are the major RTTC records...

    
             Men                          Women
             ---                          -----

10 miles     18:48, 1988, C Sturgess      21:25, 1973, B Burton
25 miles     49:24, 1978, A Engers        53:21, 1976, B Burton
50 miles     1:39:51, 1983, I Cammish     1:51:30, 1976, B Burton
100 miles    3:31:53, 1983, I Cammish     3:55:05, 1968, B Burton
12 hours     291.72, 1986, G Longland     277.25, 1967, B Burton
24 hours     507.00, 1969, R Cromack      438.16, 1983, A Mann


Rod
1477.7It's always hard to tell how "unpaced" a Brit TT isCESARE::JOHNSONMatt Johnson, DTN 871-7473Thu Apr 05 1990 08:296
    I imagine that all the caveats pertaining to draft-assists
    provided by plentiful nearby traffic (typical of British
    time-trialing) apply?  
    
    
    MATT
1477.8Traffic? Middle-of-the-road? Me?? etc, etcIDEFIX::HEMMINGSLanterne RougeThu Apr 05 1990 09:1918
	Quite so, but it shows the mettle of the great Alf that his 25 m record
still stands when you consider the traffic growth since 1978.  He was pretty
well hounded out of the sport by petty officials who considered him somewhat
unconventional (to say the least).  I had the good fortune to meet him on many
occasions and when you consider his trade (a baker, requiring incredible hours)
and the fact that he had a knee-cap amputated, you had no choice but to admire
the man.  He took up triathlons when over 40 and gave them a good hammering as
well !!
	The unfortunate thing about UK TT's is that all the characters have
disappeared - all you get now is a load of posers whose parents bring them out
by car, pump their tyres up and generally make damn nuisances of themselves by
following them in their cars.
	I was riding in the 60's and 70's, they were great times - I wish I
could have been riding in the 50's.....................

yours faithfully

F.T Bidlake (deceased)
1477.9The 1990 Bud LightBANZAI::FISHERDictionary is not.Wed Jun 13 1990 08:5157
The 1990 Bud Light 24 hr Challenge was an exciting and challenging event
this year.  With $2600 in prize money for the top five finishers of each
sex, the competitiveness is increasing each year.  ($500, 350, 200, 150,
100, per top place respectively.)

It had several unique characteristics this year.  One was that for the
first time in the four year history of the event, sunburns were recorded,
not incredible sunburns, but they were there nonetheless.

The event is held around the northern end of the Great Sacandaga Lake
in the Adirondack Region of upstate New York.  The course is a 31.7 mile
loop with its main control point at the fire station in Edinburg, going
counterclockwise around the lake.  The course itself rolls a lot and
has IMO three respectible climbs on it, two of which start with shallow
leads of almost a mile in length followed by a good half mile hill.  The
hills are at miles 13 and 31.7.

The field this year consisted of 83 competitors: 10 women, 70 men on
singles, 1 tandem couple, and David Cornelson, age 38, on an arm powered
tricycle.

The women's division was won by Nancy Raposo of Newport, RI, by half a
bike length over Esther Botos of NY (or Hungary, depending) both of whom
recorded 377.7 miles.  That's right, they sprinted the last few moments
until someone said "NOON."  Other women recorded: 373.7; 348.7; 311.3 by
Amy Regan of Hollis, NH; 306.3 by Marti Wolf, age 51, of NY, NY (I knew
her from Paris); ...

The men's division was nearly as exciting with Alex Bekkerman of NY, NY,
winning with 463.3 over Rich Fedrigon of Chicago, Il, with 462.3.  Each of
the top finishers had a pace vehicle watching near the end to record their
location at NOON.  Alex lapped me for the last time at mile 454.  Rich
caught me on the mile 13 hill at 11:42 at mile 457.  As he was catching me
I heard the pace vehicle get ready to pass and said, "Oh s**t, I'm going to
be stuck behind that guys bumper till Rich crests the hill."  I mustered
my strength and dropped Fedrigon, got a 50 foot lead on him -- race rules
prohibit keeping pace, you must either take the lead or fall back. 
Realizing that his close presence was absurd, the pace vehicle passed us
all and waited elsewhere, Rich caught me again, asked me how far ahead
Bekkerman was ("A mile, maybe two.") and took off.  He might have been
doing 50 on the downhill, not me.

I got to the north checkpoint, where I had a ride waiting and called it
a race (332.0) miles.  I finished 23rd among 70 men, 3rd among 4 men 44
years old,  11th of 23 men over 40.

The men's race had 7 men over 400 miles, 26 more over 300, 30 more over 200
and 7 under 200.

David (arm power) had 236.9 miles.  He would have had more but he trashed a
wheel and had to wait for replacements.  David is training to race cross
country.  My crew (daughters age 15 & 18) say he's "good looking."

Kevin and Lisa Klasman recorded 231.9 on the tandem.

ed
    
1477.10Great reading - nice ridingGSFSWS::JSMITHSupport Bike Helmets for KidsWed Jun 13 1990 14:4711
    re. -1
    
    	Ed...Thanks for the great breakdown....doubt "Bicycling" would
    have picked up as much detail as you provided.  Also, congratulations,
    23 out of 70 is fantastic especially since I have a hard time doing
    a double metric.  Nice to see that Amy placed so well and I didn't
    realize that our own Kevin K. was the *solo* tandem entry....so
    when are Kevin and Lisa going transcontinental?  Also, what happened
    to Linda and Paul?  Didn't see their names in the standings?
    
    						_Jerry
1477.11CLYPPR::FISHERDictionary is not.Wed Jun 13 1990 15:174
    Well, Paul had 248.9 miles and Linda DNG (did not go) due to a
    fractured pelvis.  I was sure you would have heard of that by now.
    
    ed
1477.12despite the droughtSHALOT::ELLISJohn Lee Ellis - assembly requiredWed Jun 13 1990 16:035
    
    Yes, great write-up.  And good going!  I see you overcame the
    lack of foul weather at Johnstown and still set a personal best.  :-)
    
    -john
1477.13BANZAI::FISHERDictionary is not.Wed Jun 13 1990 16:3323
    YES, I forgot to mention a few other tidbits.
    
    I went prepared for foul weather.  At dawn on Sunday, there were
    sprinkles.  Enough to make me stop and put my rain jacket on.  Then
    I took it off because the rain stopped.  At mile 317, after completing
    my 10th lap, it started to pour.  I was telling myself (1:10 left to
    race) "I have 317 miles, I could stop now and still have a personal
    best. NO, NO, YOU SAID YOU'LD KEEP GOING, NOW GET!"  So I put on
    my rain jacket, mounted my trusty Serotta, and sped off down the hill
    to the bridge, the cross winds were wicked, yes, wicked.  BUT THE
    RAIN STOPPED!  I again removed my jacket and continued.
    
    The other interesting feature was, as I finished 9.5 laps, I headed
    into the southward stretch and was please to note that there was a
    north wind.  After the rain, at 10.0 laps, I noticed a northward gale
    as I began the tenth lap.  By God, I had a counterclockwise tailwind!
    
    I carried tights and a sweater all night on the chance that it would
    turn cold.  Never needed them.  I was able to keep a 15mph pace while
    on the bike till the end.  Now, If I could only have stayed "on the
    bike" longer.
    
    ed
1477.14I've always respected endurance races -- now they're fun, tooCIMNET::MJOHNSONMatt Johnson, DTN 871-7473Mon Jun 18 1990 15:036
    It's awesome to read about a final sprint in an endurance race.  Great
    coverage!  These things are becoming more than just "grind it out"
    events -- some suspense is bound to increase their recognition.
    
    
    MATT
1477.15New 50 and 25 mile recordsJUMBLY::MACFADYENRide that bikeFri Aug 03 1990 10:2022
    Re my own .6:
    
    Two of the male records I recorded there have recently fallen, the
    50 mile record, and, after all this time, Alf Engers 25 mile record.
    
    First, Ian Cammish on June the 8th lowered his own 50 mile record from
    1:39ish to 1:34:22, on the A1 in Yorkshire. He used a low-profile
    Raleigh Dynatech (steel pipes glued into alloy lugs), and, get this, a
    64-tooth chainwheel to cycle at an average pace of 31.8 mph. I don't
    know whether this is a straight-out or an out-and-back course.
    
    More recently Simon Lillistone (I think) lowered the 25 mile record
    from 49:28 to 49:13. I know little about this except that "Cycling
    Weekly" has an excellent pic of him riding a low-profile with Campag
    rear disc and penta-spoke front. This ride was definitely done on an
    out-and-back course.
    
    Neither man was using aero bars since they're banned in the UK under
    RTTC rules.
    
    
    Rod
1477.16technical questionsSHALOT::ELLISJohn Lee Ellis - assembly requiredFri Aug 03 1990 10:3712
    
    Is the Yorkshire course hilly at all?
    
    Pentaspoke?  So this would not be the same type of design
    as the Specialized tri-spoke.  What did the spokes/blades look like?
    
    What kind of clothing (helmet, especially)?  Was the handlebar
    entirely standard?
    
    Oh, and could you tell if the seatposts were aero?  :-)
    
    -john
1477.17JUMBLY::MACFADYENRide that bikeFri Aug 03 1990 12:1720
>    Is the Yorkshire course hilly at all?
    
    Don't know but suspect not.
    
>    Pentaspoke?  So this would not be the same type of design
>    as the Specialized tri-spoke.  What did the spokes/blades look like?
    
    Not too au fait with the various composite wheels available (not
    *quite* relevant to me), so I can't really say. The spokes were
    straight.
    
>    What kind of clothing (helmet, especially)?  Was the handlebar
>    entirely standard?
    
    Cammish wore a teardrop style helmet, Lillistone no helmet. Clothing
    was fairly standard lycra skinsuits, and the bars were probably the
    Mavic low profiles. Seatposts definitely aero.
    
    
    Rod
1477.18CorrectionsJUMBLY::MACFADYENRide that bikeMon Aug 06 1990 08:2510
    Re my own .15:
    
    Untrustworthy memory! Having reread the articles, in the interests of
    accuracy I should report that it was Peter Longbottom who lowered the
    RTTC 25 mile record, and that the 50 mile record that Ian Cammish beat
    was held by Ray Booty, and is indeed a straight-out record (ie not
    RTTC).
    
    
    Rod
1477.19Also saw that Pic in CW .. greatSIOG::OSULLIVANJohn O'SullivanFri Aug 10 1990 11:539
    RE.15
    
    Rod
    
    
    It's difficult to understand how the 25 record could stand at 49' and
    the 50 at 94'. Surely the average speed would be lower over 50.
    
    John
1477.20Makes these records of questionable valueJUMBLY::MACFADYENJust like you, but differentMon Aug 13 1990 06:199
    Yes I would have thought so too, if the course were out and back. But
    it wasn't, I'm sure it was a straight-out (place to place) so Cammish
    could have had the wind at his back the whole time. For example a new
    50-mile straight-out female record was set in the UK last autumn on a
    windy day, and the woman who did that went through 25 in 47 minutes or
    something amazing like that.
    
    
    Rod
1477.21Wind-aided records? Not legitimate to me! BCSE::KLASMANALL-IN-1 DESKtop for PCs. dtn 381-0731Mon Aug 13 1990 08:366
I would think that if these TTs are going to be run on point-to-point courses, 
that a maximum wind speed would be set for establishing a record.  This is done
in track-and-field, esp for the sprints (100m, etc).  Wind-aided records are not
really records (though its great fun to ride with a hurricane for a tail-wind)

Kevin
1477.22JUMBLY::MACFADYENJust like you, but differentMon Aug 13 1990 10:159
    I doubt if anyone would study place-to-place records with a view to
    analysing athletic performance with time, since obviously they're going
    to be set on windy days. They have curiousity value.
    
    However RTTC courses are all out-and-back, with the finish near the
    start, so when one of those is lowered that *is* news.
    
    
    Rod
1477.23??NOVA::FISHERDictionary is not.Mon Aug 13 1990 13:136
    Isn't there also something funny about the definition of
    "with the finish near the start"?  Like not requiring the finish
    to be the start in elevation so that "some" great records also
    have "interesting" terrain characteristics.
    
    ed
1477.24JUMBLY::MACFADYENTue Aug 14 1990 06:0315
>            <<< Note 1477.23 by NOVA::FISHER "Dictionary is not." >>>
>
>    Isn't there also something funny about the definition of
>    "with the finish near the start"? 
    
    I checked the RTTC handbook last night and the rules state that for TTs
    up to 15 miles the finish should be within a mile of the start, up to
    50 miles it should be within 2 miles, and for a hundred mile course
    within 5 miles. No mention of elevation, so in theory you could design
    a downward sloping course. That said, the courses I've been on all had
    insignificant height diff between start and finish. It's pretty flat
    round here!
    
    
    Rod
1477.25height diffSHALOT::ELLISJohn Lee Ellis - assembly requiredFri Aug 17 1990 08:273
    
    Right, but a TT starting atop Puy de D�me (name?) might make a
    big difference. :-)
1477.26New RRA 50, 100 recordsJUMBLY::MACFADYENThere&#039;s no going backMon Nov 12 1990 13:4417
Some more RRA (Road Records Association) records have fallen.

The big one is that Ian Cammish made his long-awaited attempt on the 
straight-out 100 mile record on the 1st Nov and succeeded in slicing
11 minutes off Ray Booty's record set in 1956 (!). The new record is
3:16:56, or an average speed of 30.47 mph. Cammish used a Dynatech-framed
low profile with rear disc and clip-on aero bars, and started near Stamford
on Lincolnshire to finish on the A45 near Ipswich. He stuck to main roads 
 - couldn't do it any other way! - and had a helpful northerly wind 
(likewise).

Cammish's four-month old 50 record, reported earlier in this note, has also
fallen. Pete Longbottom did a 1:30:14 on the A1 in Yorkshire on the 4th of
November.


Rod
1477.27details, pleaseSHALOT::ELLISJohn Lee Ellis - assembly requiredMon Nov 12 1990 15:358
    
    I'm impressed that a record had held for so long (34 years!).
    What kind of regulations are there to something like the
    straight-out 100?  Tailwind seems allowable.  How about
    net climb/descent?  Pacing?  These guys must have nerves
    of steel to ride on a trunk road like the A1!
    
    -john