Conference terri::cars_uk

 Re .140 CRATE::HOBBS
 >>   What does annoy me is the guy behind who gets impatient?frustrated?
 >>   because of the gap and pulls out, overtakes on the left and pulls 
 >>   back in again. Petty.
     
    FLAME ON>>>
   	You are the one who is breaking the law, Bob!  If there is room for
    someone to overtake you on the left on a Motorway, then you cannot be
    overtaking anyone else by definition and so you should not be
    travelling in an overtaking lane!
    
    	Little known, less acknowledged and even less obeyed law says that
    there is only ONE driving lane on Motorways,  all other lanes are
    OVERTAKING lanes, NOT to be used for driving in!  You seem to be one of
    my PET HATES as per the Topic.  People like you convert Motorways to single
    lane since it is illegal (on Motorways only) to overtake on the left.
    
    FLAME OFF>>>
    
    	I've said it before and I'll probably say it again - drive on the
    left in Great Britain!
    				Malcolm.

    I little noting tip -
    
    When replying to an old note, particularly when addressing the author,
    its worth looking at the date.
    
    I don't think "Bob" works for the company anymore and to be fair his
    thoughts on motorway driving may have changed in 4 years. 
    
    Roy

    furthermore:

    "Bob" is now "Barbara" & was last spotted, thumbing a lift to Detroit.
    
    Roy, your restraint should be commended. I, however, am mere mortal &
    cannot resist Mlle. Sarcasm when she pops her head up so invitingly.
    :-)

    Mike.

    Not law, merely advisory.
    
    Quote from the new edition of the Highway Code (page 39, "On the
    Motorway" section):
    
    "164. Keep to the left-hand lane unless overtaking. You may use the
    lane to the right of a stream of slower vehicles to overtake them but
    return to the lane to your left when you have passed them."
    
    .
    .
    .
    
    "167. Overtake only on the right unless traffic is moving in queues and
    the queue on your right is moving more slowly than you are. Do not move
    to a lane on your left to overtake. You MUST NOT use the hard shoulder
    for overtaking."
    
    Note the lack of the words MUST and MUST NOT except once in para 167.
    The note at the beginning says "In the following rules the words
    MUST/MUST NOT refer to requirements of the law." and "A failure on the
    part of a person to observe any provision of the Highway Code shall not
    of itself render that person liable to criminal proceedings of any
    kind, but any such failure may in any proceedings (whether civil or
    criminal ...) be relied upon by any party to the proceedings as tending
    to establish or negative any liability which is in question in those
    proceedings - Road Traffic Act 1988, Section 38."

    That last section from which you quoted Dave, has not been altered
    since the Highway Code was introduced - LONG before the first Motorway
    was built, much less a Highway Code section for it written.  The
    Highway Code section on Motorways was taken directly from the new laws
    governing the use of Motorways!
    
    	Hence - the Motorway section of the Highway Code is law.
    
    	Regarding my note to which you refer, I'm still in catch-up mode
    and only "next unseen'ing" those Topics that are of little or no
    interest to me.  The fellow to whose note I refered may have left, but
    his note remains and he just hit my biggest pet hate - Motorway
    converters!  Offence was not meant, but if the cap fits and all that
    jazz!
    
    	Regarding Headlamp wattages, there is, in the construction and use
    regulations - ie. the law, words which state that one may not use a
    greater than 36W (YES thirtysix Watt) bulb in any headlamp with clear
    glass.  This obviously refers to cars built before around '48-50 which
    had those great big headlamps, as did my Jaguar 1 1/2 litre (I've still
    got the manufacturers service manual somewhere).  It has been
    susequently updated to cover modern style headlamps with beam
    controlling patterning in the glass, to specify a maximum wattage of
    55W - that is why that is the standard fitted today.
    
    	Hope that helps.
    				Malcolm.                        

    Has anyone seen the new Highway Code? -Does it still show hand signals?
    
    Several months ago, the indicators on the Citro�n went on the fritz on
    the way home.  I ran the window down and did hand signals - should have
    seen the looks I got 8*) 8*)
    
    Good job it was daylight!
    
    Richard
    
    

>    Several months ago, the indicators on the Citro�n went on the fritz on
>    the way home.  I ran the window down and did hand signals - should have
>    seen the looks I got 8*) 8*)
 
	It's a motoring offence to drive if your indicators are not working.   
    
	Heather - who took her test in '74, and it was an offence then too!

    The why have and be tested on handsignals, and how do you get to a
    garage.
    
    Simon

	Because some older cars don't have indicators fitted, so you have to 
	know what they are.

	You can get towed to a garage.

	Heather

Who in their own right have a tow to a garage if the indicators had broken down,
I certainly would not and I doubt if 99.999% of drivers would either. 


P.S Heather Do you happen work for the BBC Watchdog program ;-)

    Hand signals were removed from the driving test several years ago.
    
    ~sam

    
    
    Oh no they were not..
    
    you can still be asked to demonstrate and hand signal, and when doing
    the MOTORCYCLE driving test you will be expected to backup indicator
    lights with hand signals when/if necessary..
    
  Alan

        Hand signals were still in the test in '88.
        
        1st test failed, my fault.
        
        2nd test indicators failed so test cancelled, I wsn't allowed to      
            continue using handsignals
        
        3rd test cancelled by DOT
        
        4th test passed
        
        
        Simon

Me...

1st test	Hit cyclist. Not my fault, honest.
2nd test	Incident with a bus on a zebra crossing. My fault
3rd test	Passed

What is this driving test thingy? Is it new?

Dave.

'scuse me, Mr. Kerrell, but did you make a New Year's resolution which may have a bearing 
on your new noting style ? 

    re: -2
    
    I suspect the driving test might be a pet hate....
    
    

    Is it my imagination or are the number of cyclists now not using lights
    increasing ?
    
    -tony

    No, they've always not used lights.  It's just more noticeable in the
    winter months....8*)
    
    Richard
    

    Although I have received some rather strongly worded replies in the
    past about this hre I go setting myself up again:
    
    Flame On>>>
    
    Cyclist not only don't use lights, but apparently cannot read... you
    know the bits in the highway code about traffic lights... RED MEANS
    STOP!... I have seen a number of pedestrians running for their very
    lives from these dang cyclists that cannot read.
    
    I am not sayiong that only cyclists are guilty of this, what I am
    saying is that there is a MUCH higher incidence of cyclists blatently
    ignoring the highway code in this particular area than there are of
    other road users.
    
    I am sure they think that because a bike is small and usually light
    weight that it cannot do any harm... *WRONG*.  If it's in the highway
    code it applies to *ALL* road users.
    
    Flame Off>�>
    
    Bob (Gotta agree with the Tone on this)

    RE: .263
    
    At the risk of repeating myself, you lot don't know you're born. If
    you want to see cyclists in action, go to Amsterdam. I lived there for
    a year; believe me, it's something else... Here in Brussels cyclists
    are very rare, at least those that stay alive more than a week are. You
    really have nothing to moan about.
    
    Laurie.
    
    PS. As a noun, it's spelt "licence", with an 's', it's a verb.

    Many thanks for the correction Laurie..... I do appreciate your
    concerns, but once again it is *MY* Pet Hate...
    
    If my opinions strike a chord that you don't agree with.. <NEXT UNSEEN>
    
    Bob

    re .264
                                                                
    Spelling and Grammar nit-picking should be confined to ef92, where we
    can safely ignore it.
    

    
    Agreed !

    Hey,
    
    I was helping the guy out. Firstly he clearly has no idea how well off
    he is in comparison to other parts of Europe. Secondly, and it was a
    PS, I pointed out something else he didn't know, in a factual and
    non-judgemental way. 
    
    Laurie.

    
    It's true, some cyclists do jump red lights - I do it myself sometimes
    when I'm cycling on my own and believe it's safe to do so.
    
    I think that cyclists do this for the same reason that the majority of
    car drivers routinely break the speed limit - because they can get
    away with it.
    
    Trevor

Actually I sometimes go the odd 1mph over the limit because I'm in a hurry.

Dave ;-)

    
    .269
    
    But you'd be the first person to whinge when somebody pulls out and
    knocks you off your bike straight to the nearest life support 
    machine.
    
    -tony

    tony,
    
    I thought green meant something like 'proceed with caution' not 
    
    	right foot down 
    	lets have some fun
    	5 points for a cyclist
    	10 for a nun
    
    peter
    
    
    
    

    
    
    WHOOAA!
    
    >	right foot down 
    >	lets have some fun
    �	5 points for a cyclist
    �	10 for a nun
    
    It's 1000 points for a cyclist....
    
    8*) (only a semi smile)
    
    
    Bob

    
>     But you'd be the first person to whinge when somebody pulls out and
>     knocks you off your bike straight to the nearest life support 
>     machine.
    
    You mean if I had just jumped a red light ? No, then it would be my
    fault entirely. My point was that I only ever jump lights on my bike
    when I feel there's no danger to me or to anyone else from doing it
    (i.e., usually when there are no cars around).
    
    I've never felt in any danger on the occasions when I've jumped lights,
    because I'm in control. I've had plenty of experiences where bad
    driving by someone in normal circumstances *has* almost put me on a
    life support machine, and this is completely out of my control.
    
    Trevor

    
    But Trevor, jumping lights is illegal. Why do you do it on a bike when
    you wouldn't do it in a car ?
    
    -tony

    What really hacks me off is the BMX kiddies who zip out of cover onto
    pedestrian crossings without warning, leaving me shredding my tyres on
    the Shellgrip while the old ladies at the bus-stop go "Oooh! Tut-tut!
    etc".
    
    Richard
    

 Even a roller skater is a vehicle and is covered by the rules
and so are PRAMs and child buggies.

I have nearly taken out 6 bicyclists who have jumped the lights. 
One day I'm going hit one. But I might make him/her get off the bike first.

    
    > You mean if I had just jumped a red light ? No, then it would be my
    > fault entirely. My point was that I only ever jump lights on my bike
    > when I feel there's no danger to me or to anyone else from doing it
    > (i.e., usually when there are no cars around).
                                       ^^^^
    Ahem!... What about pedestrians?!
    
    - Celia

    
>     > (i.e., usually when there are no cars around).
    
    I did say "usually" when there are no cars around. No, actually I was
    lying. I always try to run pedestrians over.
    
    Trevor