Conference 7.286::home_work

I've seen these brackets in the catalogs for the Woodworker's Store (On Mass 
ave in Cambridge) and in the Trend Lines Catalog (Chelsea MA, and several other 
locations)

Paul

    I have seen them at U-DO-IT Electronics off of 128.  They were not
    cheap though.  
    
    When I lived at home I made a shelf hangging from the ceiling by using
    threaded metal rods and used a piece of 3/4" pywood for the shelf
    itself.  I like looking up at the TV and I did not have a tall dresser
    to put it on. 
    
    bjm

    Try virtually any trailer sales/rental dealer.  They usually carry
    all sorts of accessories, including the wall brackets for TVs. 
    I saw them at Mann's in Rutland, MA last week.
    
    Art
    

    On the outside of my house is a black box near the electric meter.
    This box has a cover that lifts up to reveal about 15 pins or so
    inside.  The cover of the box says Neptune.  In the house are wall
    connections with, I think, 4 or 5 prong sockets.  Three of the sockets
    are shaped in an upside down arc.  I don't believe that it's part
    of the cable tv system since this and the cable aren't connected.
    Anyway, I didn't notice this when we moved in two years ago and have
    been pretty much ignoring it since it doesn't seem to be important
    but now curiosity has gotten the best of me.  
    
    Anyone know what this thing is?    

    George

                I think that if you follow the cable that comes from it
        (in back - through the wall usually) you will find that it
        connects to your water meter. It allows the town to read your
        water meter without enetering your house.
                
                /s/     Bob

    Hmmmmm...if that's what it's for thenI wonder what those wierd wall
    sockets in the house are for?
    
    George
    

    
    
    	Can you give us a picture of the hole patteren?
    
    	I think I know what you mean. something like this?
    
    		       o   o
    		     o       o
                         o       
    
    	If thats the case it's for a 5 wire TV antenna rotor control.
    It was popular before cable TV became the rage to wire the house
    for TV antenna 300 ohm down leads and rotor control. Much better
    looking than wires running out of holes in the wall floor.
    
    	If it's just 3 little holes like           o
    						o     o
    
    Then thats the connection for the antenna itself.
    
    	The advantage that a system like this had/has is that each room
    with a TV has a connection for the rotor so you can just unplug
    the rotor from one room and move it to the other and be able to
    control the antenna.  Most of these plates and the plugs can still
    be purchased from radio shack.
    
    			...Dave
    

    Thanks,  That must be what it is.  The hole pattern is more like
    your second example.
    
    	Since this is an antenna connection is it adaptable to an FM
    receiver?  The reception I now get on my stereo really stinks. It
    would be nice to be able to improve it.
    
    	Paul, if I should move this to another file just say the word.
    
    George
    

    
    
    	Re .4
    	Depends on if and what kind of an antenna is connected to the
    other end. Do you have an antenna on the house? If so then you'll
    have to make sure it's connected to this wiring. If not then you'll
    have to trace the wiring and find a place where you can connect
    mount and connect an antenna. There are special FM radio antennas
    and there are filter taps for a tv antenna to use with FM.
    
    	Best thing is to trace down the wire and see where it goes.
    
    			...Dave
    

    re .0,.1
    
    We have a "neptune" box on our house; The wire goes straight to
    our water meter.
    
    mike

    	It sounds like a remote water meter connection to me, wouldn't
    touch the thing 'till I found out though, could cause a seizure after
    opening then next water bill. :-)
    
    
    Glenn

    We too had a little black box on the house when we bought it,
    notice the operative word "had".  When re siding, after asking
    a number of people what it was with no success, we simply cut it
    off and re-side the house......
    
    Well, time for the water meter to be read and lo and behold they
    tell us that we are listed as having an external box for reading
    the wate meter.......Well we did have one, now we have a new one!
    
    

    		DOORS TO COVER 52" TV
    
    	We just purchased a 52" tv. One problem we have is finding a
    cover for the screen.  We didn't want to spent the extra $500-800
    for the cabinet with the doors.  We want to add the doors now,
    has anyone done this or can recommend how to do it.  The cabinet is 
    oak but there doesn't seem to be much to attach the doors to on the 
    corners.  I want the doors to swing back against the sides when not in
    use.
    
    any suggestions or information would be helpful.
    
    DAN STEWART
    232-2622
    SIOUXI::STEWART
     

    Woodworkers supply stores carry a set of slides that attach to the
    inside sides of the cabinet which allow the doors to be pushed back
    along the inside when open and pulled out to be closed.
    
    Try Trendlines or woodworkers warehouse in Cambridge(?).

I have a SHARP VCR which all of a sudden has been displaying a messed up
pciture.  It almost looks like the picture does when you do a fast scan
forward, but I don't think the problem is with the speed.  I tried cleaning
the heads, but it didn't seem to work.  This problem came on suddenly.  The
machine is probably 5 years old.  Can anyone shed some light on this problem?

Thanks.

   Ben

Try asking in PAGODA::VIDEO.

		Steve

While we do have a TV keyword, the notes listed there generally refer to issues
of how a TV affects the house - such as installing antennas, running cable, etc.
Repairing VCRs is really outside the scope of this conference.  Try the 
suggested VIDEO conference.

Paul
[Moderator]

    Recently our TV bit some dust.  Channels 2, 4, 5 do NOT work, just a
    fuzzy picture with no sound.  The rest of the channels VHF and UHF all
    work fine.
    
    Can anyone explain?

    Do you have cable or antenna?

    It could be because channels 2-6 are in a different band from 7-13, and
    the UHF spectrum. This would imply that part of the tuner dealing with
    the lower channel band was defective and/or the selector contact for
    that band is no good.
    
    /jim

I'd suggest asking in the PAGODA::VIDEO conference.

			Steve

    
       Typically, a television with no antenna (or with a shorted/broken
    antenna lead) will receive channels in the 7-13 range, and some of the
    higher UHF stations also.
    
       Check the antenna.
    

    Yesterday, as part of a "free installation" promotion by my cable tv
    company, I had an installer add a line for our bedroom tv.  It was a
    simple routing starting from inside the basement where the cable came
    in for my livingroom hookup, along the basement ceiling to the rear of
    the house, back outside and up along the corner trim, then back inside
    to a wall plate where the tv is located.  Since this is exactly what I'd
    planned to do to DIY anyway, I figured to let the cable co. pick up the
    tab on parts and labor, as long as the installer did it my way, which
    he did.  I went as far as to mark the location of the holes to drill. 
    He did a very nice job, and with the little installation extras that I
    would not have had doing it myself, such as plastic grommets for the
    holes, it turned out better than what I would've done.  I know some of
    you are wondering why I went out from the basement, then back in at the
    bedroon wall, believe me, it's the simplest and most direct way of
    cabling to where the tv's located, and it's not that unsightly on the
    outside (only 10' of cable exposed vs. the whole run being on the
    outside in view).  Plus, running along the trim, I plan to paint the
    cable so as to be hardly noticable...
    
    Ok, now the interesting part.  Unfortunately, I wasn't there during
    installation, but my wife was (with my explicit installation
    instructions!).  When the installer saw my previous DIY cable addition,
    tapping into the existing cable for the under-counter tv in our
    kitchen, he disconnected it, telling my wife that it was illegal and
    lecturing her on how we were ripping off not only the cable co. (of
    $4.50/month), but our (paying) neighbors (assuming they're all
    perfectly law abiding citizens, unlike us!)!  Anyway, I thought that
    the addition of cable lines within your home from existing cable was
    perfectly ok, no?  (Apparently not)  I know years ago when cable was
    1st introduced, they had strict rules and regulations about this, but I
    thought they'd relaxed on this issue.  Comments?
    
    John
    
    P.S.  Don't tell my cable company, but somehow, my kitchen tv had great
    	reception this morning...  :-) 

Most cable companies want you to pay a per-TV charge on cable wiring, and
they get upset if you add your own splitters.  Others will charge you if
you ask them to do the wiring, but don't go out of their way to make life
difficult for those who want to put in their own splitters.  Technically,
it IS a "theft of services" to add additional taps without paying the
monthly fee.  In general, if you're going to have a cable-company rep
look at your wiring, you'd be advised to remove splitters for the time
being.

				Steve

    YOu might look in EASYNOTES.LIS for a listing for CABLE. There used to
    be one, maybe still is

    I believe that cable companies feel they are entitled to a monthly
    service charge for each 'drop'.
    So, if you have a signal splitter, i believe the cable companies would feel
    that each active output merits a monthly fee.
    
    For a _subjective_ measure of 'right' and 'wrong'...
    I have a signal splitter one of whose outputs goes to cable box, and
    the other output goes to a VCR. The outputs of each of these go to a
    two way switch whose output goes to the T.V. So one can watch EITHER
    the output of the cable box OR the output of the VCR. Also I can tape
    with VCR while watching cable. I feel quite comfortable doing this.
    At any point in time, only one program is being WATCHED. Cable company
    representatives have seen this rig more than once and have never
    commented on it. (which doesn't make it legal of course!!!)

    On the other hand, it would be feasible to wire the signal splitter
    to go upstairs to a bedroom that has another VCR and another T.V.. I do
    NOT feel comfortable doing that, and feel that I would indeed be
    stealing service in a much more dramatic fashion were the household to
    be watching two different 'live' programs at the same time. I feel that
    if I did than and if cable companies saw it they WOULD raise a fuss.
    
    
    				herb

    
    
    
    
    	Gee. When I had the cable guy hook me up at my house  a few 
    	years ago I told him I was planning on finishing the basement 
    	and doing the cable installation right with wall plates etc. He 
    	left me a reel with about 100 ft of cable left on it.....
    
    
    						Mike
    						----   

	My father-in-law signed up for cable TV with one of those
	"free installation" offers.  The guy came over,  ran the line
	to the house where all the other lines come in and then dropped
	a 100' of cable on the ground and said "have fun, we don't snake
	wires through the house anymore...haven't been for many years".
	
	The actual TV to be hooked up is on the opposite corner of the house.
	
	Garry

    re third paragraph
    
    <...seems trivial>
    
    Lets say a monthly charge of 4.95*12=59.40 a year and 59.40*100 million
    homes= 5.94 billion dollars, i think.
    
    
    
    			herb
    

    Herb, please stop goading this discussion into what could be a major,
    non-productive, non-home_work related rathole.  Your point was made,
    and taken, several replies ago.  Actually, I'll do my share by adding 
    no further replies on the subject of immoral cable piracy.  BTW, do 
    you happen to moonlight as a cable installer?  :-)
    
    The intent of this note, 4351, remains "general discussion of DIY cable 
    tv wiring, etc."  Anything else belongs in SOAPBOX or RELIGION.  :-)
    
    Thanks,
    John

    I don't feel I am goading this discussion into a major ... rathole.

    It seems to me that a case can be made that if anything will, it is
    your defensiveness, not my comments that might lead this discussion
    toward a rathole.
    
    
    				herb

    Back to the subject at hand.
    
    I moved from a 'pre-wired' new house in Atlanta to 'this old
    house' here in NJ where all the cable wires were on the outside.  The
    cable feed came in on one side and all other wiring (phone, power) came
    in on the other side.
    
    Preferring some symetry and hating the wires all over the outside, I
    called the cable company and requested a move and said I was going to
    do my own interior wiring.  The first clerk insisted that ALL splitters
    be on the exterior (for counting purposes).  It took elevation up two
    levels with the question "what if it was a new house and was pre-wired"
    until a manager finally said ok.
    
    The installer who moved the drop from the street was so happy that he
    didn't have to do any other work that he gave me about 150 feet of
    cable and handfuls of connectors, splitters and face plates.
    
    This cable company does charge by the 'set' and came out to inspect
    when we added another premium channel that required a special converter
    box.
    
    BTW - that is my current beef!  Why do I need their special converter
    box (and another damn remote control) when I already have 'cable-ready'
    tv's?  Another rat-hole for the 'moralists' to ponder!
    
    	-Barry-
    

Just a quick anecdote Mr. Moderator.  I can't resist.

We live in a builder-wired house with drops in the family room and the master
bedroom.  We pay for one drop.  We have had problems and had fixers out a couple
of times.  No problems.  Well, last time we had a fuzziness problem the guy came 
out and when he saw the two drops he went sort of nuts.  He lectured my wife, 
etc.  My wife tried to explain that we only had one TV and that only worked when
you hit it in the right place.  This guy goes in the basement, comes back out 
with about 5 feet of cable in his hand and tells my wife he has ripped the extra
drop out of the wall.  My wife goes nuts (after all, it is her turn) and calls 
the cable company and gets up a level or two in management. Calls one or several
of them 'morons' and slams up the phone.  I get the typical hysterical 'call at
work'.  When I get home I go in the basement and notice the only thing the guy 
did was steal our splitter!  So, now if we want the TV upstairs I have to go
to the basement and swap leads.  One of these days I'll have to remember to get
a new splitter.

Cable police!  Throw down all your splitters and come out with your hands up!

Stan

    After reading this discussion I found myself in the embarrassing
    position of concluding either 

    		I am a holier than thou fool or
    		there are a bunch of crooks at digital

    I don't like either conclusion. so I called my service provider...

    I spoke for 5 or 10 minutes to a sales-rep from Cablevision that
    services the Acton /Hudson/<whatever> area.

    She told me that each outlet is considered a separate service.
    She said that splitting the signal such that the separate signals
    service two different rooms is considered by them to be Theft of
    Service, unless the client is paying a monthly service fee for each
    such outlet. (I think she said $6.00)
    She said that if a service person saw such a set, the service person
    would disconnect the splitter.
    I asked her if Cablevision has ever prosecuted such a 'theft of
    service' she said she didn't know.
    So, the subject under discussion is deemed by Cablevision to be theft
    of service and illegal.
    
    As a practical matter it also looks like Cablevision will merely
    disconnect such a connection rather than prosecute based on their
    assertion that it is illegal.

    But, bottom line, either Cablevision is stealing alot of money from
    those of us who are gullible enough to pay an 'inappropriate' service
    fee, or those of us who are sufficiently industrious and insufficiently
    moral, are stealing service from the providers.
    
    As already shown, $6.00 per household per month is one HUGE amount of
    money. That either the industry 
    
    	shouldn't be getting but is or
    	should be getting but isn't
    
    I have been wrestling with this for a while and have finally concluded the
    following...
    
    Since it is inconceivable to me that the industry would knowingly allow
    people to get away with not paying a legitimate monthly fee, I have
    concluded that the Cable industry realizes it has no case.
    Accordingly, starting asap I will be wiring my upstairs bedroom vcr
    from an amplified signal splitter down stairs. Expecting at worse that
    a cable company representative may at some time in the future as me to
    disconnect it.
    
    
    				herb	

There is a VERY log series of notes on this in the CABLE_TV notes conference
located at CTHQ1::PEARL::CABLE_TV.  But of course I can not find the exact note
now!  It went into rules etc and how the Cable industry is trying to be what
MA-Bell was (and is no more) (that being they used to own everything hooked to
their network - including up to the handset in your hand, now they own up to
the 'network disconnect', and you can do your own wiring).

Herb's note seems to be, for the most part, cross posted there. (Note 169.25).

May I suggest any futher talk about legal issues of 'splitting the service' be
brought up there.

Now if we were to start talking about how to snake a cable line from point a to
point b....

bjm

A recent note on doing cable TV wiring generated quite a rathole/discussion 
about the legal/moral aspects of splitting the signal to go to multiple 
TVs/VCRs.  Most cable companies charge for each set connected to the cable, but
it is simple, easy, and undetectable for the user to split the signal and have
more than one TV on the cable.

Anyway, I've moved all the notes of that rathole here to their own note, where
participants are free to discuss this until they are sick of it (I'm making the
assumption that no consensus will be reached) so that the other note can stick
to the discussion of what cable to use, etc.  Try to keep it civil, folks.

Since I've moved the notes out of their original place, they may seem a little
disjointed if they make reference to other replies which were left in the 
original note.  The first 12 replies to this note are ones that have been moved
here. 

Paul
[Moderator]

On the one hand, I think that the cable company should legally be able to put 
any restrictions they wish on the use of the cable they supply you.  In that 
light, I think that people have a legal and moral obligation to comply with the 
cable company's reqest, if that request is on the contract for their services.

That said, I think the cable companies are stupid to try to collect on something
that is so easy for consumers to get for themselves.  They have no way of 
detecting that you've split your signal, and they are wasting more time trying
to deal with it than it's worth.  They can't bother to sue for theft of 
services, because the most the law generally allows for such a suit is treble 
damages, and three times a $100 "theft" still isn't going to cover their 
lawyer's fees.

But it's worse than stupid.  It works out to being an "honesty tax."  As another
noter mentioned, they know full well that a lot of people are splitting their 
signal, but they have no intention of ever going after these people.  Not 
because they wouldn't win - I think they would - but because it simply isn't 
worth their while.  In the meantime, they are collecting extra money from honest
folk while providing no real extra service for them.  This allows them to keep 
their base rate a bit lower for competitive purposes.  They are perfectly happy 
with the situation as it is.  

Personally, I despise it when companies/people/government/anyone count on your
own virtue to screw you.

Paul

    Why those Satanic peddlers of smut and pornography, shall burn in the
    fires of HELL for all eternity.  It is the Lords work you are doing;
    depriving them of more revenue that would be put toward the poisoning
    of our children's minds and the down fall of this country.  On judgment
    day bolts of lightening shall come from the hevens above and destroy,
    the sanctuaries of Satan known as the Cable Office and each converter
    in each house.  Why, just the terminology of the business should warn
    us of the treachery it conceals, a splitter, that is representative of
    the forked tongue of the Devil himself.  Snaking wires, the very
    serpent that betrayed Adam and Eve in the garden of Eden.  Cable
    stationawill (if they haven't already) start sending subliminal
    messages to our homes.  The messages will instructhusbands to turn in
    wives and wives to turn in husbands that add extra lines in their own
    homes.  The American family shall be destroyed over this.  I see the
    down fall of Western Civilization as we know it today, as a result of
    this Cable plague which has befallen mankind (and womankind).  Well, to
    make this reply applicable to HOME_WORK, when I chase the Cable repair
    man out of my house, should I be beating him wiht a smooth faced or a
    waffle faced framinf hammer... now what note was it that discussed
    hammers pro/con.  What about that Castor oil based paint versus, exlax
    paint, now see Satan is there also (Red Devil Paint).  I guess I am
    ready for this up coming long weekend.
    
    Keep Smiling,
    
    Paul

I forgot the followup to the tale I told in .10.

A couple of weeks after the repair guy stole our splitter we got a call to the
effect that a cable person would be out to check our cable installation.  We
assumed either the repair guy or one of the 'morons' had decided to give us a
hard time.

The cable guy gets to our house and is still standing in the driveway.  My wife 
is looking at him from the screen door and between them is our woodchuck (ref 
note 4220).  The cable guy asks my wife to come and get her 'pet'.  My wife 
tells him that *that* is a wild animal.  The cable guy leaves and we haven't
heard from them since.  It is the only use I have found for the woodchuck.

	-------------
	| Beware of |
	| Woodchuck |
	-------------

Stan

waaa ha ha! That's the most fun I've had in NOTES in the last six
months. Thanks Stan.

The cable industry is well aware of the amount of "service theft" that goes
on, partly by homeowners with splitters, but also more industrious folks who
tap illegally into the pole drop.  The industry also has a technical
solution for this problem, namely scrambling ALL the channels and requiring
you to have a descrambler for each set in order to get any channels at all.
This is indeed done in some systems, and threatened in others.  It does,
of course, make things a bloody pain for the honest users who would like
to use the programmable tuners in their VCRs and TVs, but the cable
industry just shrugs and says "if people didn't think it so acceptable
to steal our services, we wouldn't have to do this."

The comparison to phone service is apt.  Consider that since per-tap
charges for phones were ruled illegal, basic service rates have risen
about 400%, making everyone pay the cost of the "capability" of having
multiple phones.

				Steve

>The comparison to phone service is apt.  Consider that since per-tap
>charges for phones were ruled illegal, basic service rates have risen
>about 400%, making everyone pay the cost of the "capability" of having
>multiple phones.

Seems like a non sequitur to me.  Long distance rates (among other things)
used to subsidize basic rates.  They don't anymore.  The regulators are
moving towards rates that are based on the utilities' costs.

    	In regards to multiple outlets, and paying for them, I had an
    apartment in Leominster and all of the cable outlets were all tied
    together. They came in and set up their box in the living room. I tried
    my TV without it (cable ready) and it worked. So, I tried a second TV
    in the bed room with the box that they supplied. 

    	Now as far as "theft of services" I was told (by a *very* good
    source) that a company will not sell a "pirate box" unless you already
    have FULL service. If you don't have full service, it is considered
    "theft of services". But, if you do have full service, then you are
    using it for another set, and they claim that that is legal (or they
    can at least legally sell it to you). Now in order for this to work, first
    you have to split the signal. Then you decode with your decoder.
    I know that the cable companies frown on this, but how is this any
    different that splitting the signal and using a cable ready TV
    (decoder)?? I wouldn't personally do something like this, but it is
    being done.

    	One last thing before I go. Didn't the "cable companies" loose the
    satellite dish deal?? You know they were claiming that people were
    illegally stealing their signals that were in the air. But if the
    air is over your property, it must be your's to "receive".


    		CB

                Actually the comparison with the phone company is
        flawed. Adding a second phone to your phone line doesn't give
        you the capability to make two simultaneous calls. I.e. you
        can't call your cousin Joe while your spouse is calling aunt
        Minnie. Adding a second jack to the cable does give you
        capability to watch two DIFFERENT programs (assuming one of them
        isn't scrambled) which you couldn't do without the second jack. 
                
                Now to carry it further, adding a splitter at the OUTPUT
        of the cable box and running to another room so that you can
        watch the SAME program in multiple rooms, they can't do anything
        about. After all, you could all be in the same room. This is the
        same as adding an extension telephone to your phone line. 
                
                It helps to think of what you can use the connection for
        instead of the fact that it is a single wire. One phone line
        only gives you one phone conversation. One cable line can give
        you multiple things to watch.
                
                /s/     Bob

Interesting thought... would a tv that lets you watch 2 stations on the screen
at a time be considered illegal?

Of course, once you hook up a Flinstone box, you kind of negate all the advances
in tv technology made since Pebbles was born...

    re .20
    
    The cable companies didn't loose the Satellite deal. If you have a
    satellite dish, you can pick up HBO etc, but only after you have paid a
    fee to someone or other to allow your descrambler to descramble their
    signals. 
    
    Generically regarding the "theft of services" concept. I haven't heard
    of any Cable company being silly enough to try much but threaten
    this... 
    
    They didn't require the signing of any contract to this effect, in
    providing the service. I think a lot of cable company providers are to
    enthralled in their current cash-cow, and don't realize that they must
    improve this service significantly over time, to retain ownership of
    this market. ATT are looking ver seriously at providing full Fibre
    Optic level service to the home, in the not too far distant future,
    with Multiplexed multiple voice lines, data lines and video signals
    being possible. This will make the existing cable wiring networks
    totally redundant, and I wouldn't be at all surprised to see
    super-networks (an expansion of the current superstations) to start
    targeting directly at home services.
    
    Me, I get peeved, when I pay AMericable about $8.00 /month for a
    premium channel like HBO, when they only pay about 50 � per home to
    HBO. And then, when I ask them about Why they only offer HBO and
    Cinemax, and not TMC, showtime, Playboy or any of the several other
    premium channels, they shrug and so, no demand... Someone should take
    these people off to a Freshman college Economics course, to understand
    the laws of supply and demand...
    
    arrgghhh..!!!
    
    q
    
    

    RE: .23
    
    Theft of service IS prosecuted, but only where there is no paid service
    into a particular home.  I know of one instance here in MA where this
    occurred.  I doubt if there would be any legal battles over a splitter.
    
    Dan

    You can split the signal all you want once it's in your house.  I have
    2 tvs hooked up to cable (both with boxes).  For the second tv I only
    get charged for the box rental, not for the signal.
    
    Chris D.

Re: .25

It varies by cable company. Most disallow splitters without paying an
extra fee.  However, most will only disconnect any splitters they happen
to see when they make a service call, and don't go out of their way to
find "illegal" splitters.

They do get a lot more upset by illegal descrambler boxes.  A system in
New York found a way to send a signal over their lines which disabled
hundreds of the illegal boxes people were using.  When they called to
complain about losing service, they were charged with theft of services.
The cable company described their method as a "silver bullet"; I've now
seen ads for boxes which call them "bullet proof".

				Steve

    
    I've been watching what's been going on in the cable business for
    several years. The AT&T court case is very relevent to cable TV. The
    case made no mention of service provided. What it did say was that the
    owner of the house owns ALL WIRING THAT IS IN THE HOUSE. That includes
    phone and cable. The cable company owns the cable up to the point where
    it enters the house. After that you own it. The AT&T case also went on
    to say that the company providing the service has nothing to say what
    the home owner does with the service once it's in the house. I also
    believe that the cable companies know this. They just use scare tactics
    to get the customer to pay for the extra outlet. I know of one instance
    where the cable company caught this guy for having more then 1 outlet
    while he was only paying for 1. They threatened to charge him for the
    extra outlets. He countered threatened them with a law-suit. The cable
    company never charged him.
    
    Mike

I wasn't aware that the local phone companies could no longer charge
for additional extensions, which is what "homeowner owns everything
inside the house" implies. Is this now true?

    Re .28:
    
    The only way the phoneco can charge for extensions is if you are
    renting the 'phones from the phoneco; but that charge will only
    be for the rental of the 'phone, NOT the additional connection
    point.  (Although in some areas you can pay a monthly "wiring
    maintenance" fee so the phoneco will maintain your internal
    wiring.)
    
    This has been the setup since "the breakup".

Re: .28

It has been over 15 years now that consumers have been allowed to own their own
phones and add extensions inside the house as desired.  The change regarding
"ownership" of the in-house wiring is somewhat more recent, but still 
predates the breakup of the Bell system.  There have been a number of
clarifications to the rulings which created the business where the local
phone companies have to inform you that they are not responsible for the
in-house wiring.  Most now offer a service contract for in-house wiring
(at a ridiculous fee) or will charge by the hour for repairs.

			Steve

Re: .29

I don't think you can rent phones from the local phone companies anymore.
You have to obtain them elsewhere.

			Steve

    re .29
    
    Yes, you can still rent telephones from local companies.  At least New
    England Telephone does this.
    
    Dave

    
    	Since the general concensus here is that "everybody does it"
    (except me, we enjoy a cable-less life :-), why don't all of you
    contact the cable regulators in your town and demand that the service
    agreements be changed to the cable company only owning the line up to
    the house?  With enough people complaining, you can get the regulators
    on your side (well, more likely, also complain to the elected officials
    and let _them_ pressure the regulators ;-) and get the rules changed to
    follow the AT&T mode instead of using the AT&T model to rationalize the
    illegal signal splitting.
    
    							-craig
    
    p.s.  Re: .28  Yup, the phone company now provides, and charges for,
    "a line" that comes to your house.  You can split it and put extensions
    anywhere you want and in whatever quantity you want.  I think the only
    proviso is that the equipment you hook up to the line has to be
    compatable with the phone company requirements and they do have the
    right to cut off your line if you hook up non-compatable equipment.
    

    I just moved across town, and took may cable equipment with me.  The
    house I moved into had a wire coming off the street that was split (by
    the cable company before I moved in) before it enterred the house.  One
    wire went directly inside, the other wire went around the house to the
    den.
    
    In the old place, we only had one cable and it was not split anywhere. 
    When the cable installer arrived at our house, we paid $20.00 for
    having the privelege of ferrying our equipment across town, having
    someone in the office program the new line, and have this bozo connect
    the cable in our living room to the box.
    
    The real point is this:  We are not charged anymore (by Cablevision in
    Leominster) at our new address then we were at our old address, and
    they must know about the outside splitter.
    
    Regards,
    	    JAM

Many thanks for the answers.  I've been away for a while and swamped with work
and just read the replies today.  Shall check the antenna again today. (Yes
it has an indoor antenna with a booster amplifier in line.)

Shall check with another antenna.

Thanks.
Arnold

    
    
    
       Boy, there is alot of morality flying around in this note,
    and since I have none( I use to take the bells out of the 
    telephones in my house so that they could not tell how many
    I had, and charge me for them), I will state this: When the
    Cable Company deducts for the hours, and sometimes days, that
    the cable is not working per month, I would consider paying
    extra for my # of splitters.  Strike that last comment, NO
    I wouldnt pay extra!!! I will probaly FRY in Hell with the
    rest of you non payers.
    
       Scott 

�I will state this: When the
�    Cable Company deducts for the hours, and sometimes days, that
�    the cable is not working per month, I would consider paying
�    extra for my # of splitters.  
    
    When I've called my cable company and cited cable outages for periods
    of a day or more, they have deducted for the days without service.

    
    They may deduct the days you have a outage, but they don't deduct the
    hours. We have United Cable, and a couple of years ago I had pneumonia.
    I stayed home for 2 weeks. And every day my cable would go out from
    10am to 1pm. It seems that they were putting in a new service near buy
    and for some unknown reason they had to cut the service for everyone
    else in that area for that period. The cable company wouldn't refund my
    money for the outage unless it was over a 8 hour period per day. For
    the 2 weeks I was without cable for a total of 30 hours. And they
    refused to refund me any money. 
    
    Mike
    

    
    
    
    Dosnt it make you feel good to have to pay to watch your own TV!
    
    

    
      The way I feel about it is if I want more splits (more sets for
    convenience) and they want to charge me for it, they can run a whole
    new service to my house as well. The lousy signal we get probably
    could not stand the split w/o signal degradation anyways. :>)
      What is legal and what I feel is right is two different things in
    this case. I believe that one house = 1 service no matter how many
    sets you want to use.

    
    RE .40
    
    The Federal Governmernt has already ruled that 1 house = 1 service. The
    cable companies know it, but they don't heed to it. This ruling was
    against AT&T about 15 years ago (before the split). It applies to the
    cable companies also, but they'll charge you if they can. You can then
    file in cort against it, bit they're betting that you won't. And if you
    do push it they'll disconnect your service until after the court case,
    which will be a few years.
    
    Mike

I saw a blurb in Video Review (I think) for a gadget which attaches to the
cable line and keeps track of the frequency and durations of signal outages.
It was under $30, if I recall correctly.

			Steve

    I would like credit for outages also, but if you sit down a figure out
    how much you'd actually get, sometimes it's not even worth the phone
    call and the time to talk to them.
    
    Let's say there's 30 days per month which makes for 720 hrs of
    service they should provide.  If you don't have any premium channels
    your bill is probably around $10.  10/720 gives roughly 14 cents per
    hour.
    
    I recently spoke with the Technical Manager of Continental Cablevision.
    He said the newer systems are scrambling everything and that they
    were using something called HRC, harmonic something or other.  He said
    HRC shifts the audio portion.  So even if you split the signal you
    can't watch or listen to it without a converter box.  Unfortunately,
    my town, Hopkinton, has one of these new cable systems which renders
    all these new video features totally useless.  These include:
    channel scan, favorite channel, channel lockout, p-i-p, A/B selectable
    VCR recording.
    
    -al

I don't know about you, but my bill is one h*ll of alot more than $10 and I don't
have any premium channels.  The cable monopolies are ripping everyone off, and
they don't even care.  They do just enough to get their monopoly renewed.  If
we move to a remote area, we are going to get a satelite dish and bypass the
d*mn cable company completely.

They are going to make things so hard and unfair that when the telephone company
figures out how to send video over the phone lines, the cable companies will be
out of business.

How do the cable companies explain pre-wired homes?  They sure are not charging
for every room in the house.  Just because there is wiring in every room does
not mean there is a television in every room.  There is one signal coming into
the home.  If there is more than one box, then they can rent the box, but if
there is only one box, there is only one service.

I will laugh so loud when I see the cable companies go begging to the government
for protection from those terrible competitors (while their companies go broke).

Ed..

> we move to a remote area, we are going to get a satelite dish and bypass

Why wait? You can get a dish now. But won't you be in for a surprise ...

When you get a dish, you still get to pay to receive stations. Least
that's the situation a friend has found who owns a dish. Anyone know
what the story is?

    My step-dad was going to install a dish because his town didn't have
    cable at the time he was contemplating this. However, he found out
    that in addition to the high cost of purchasing and installing the
    dish, yes, there are costs associated with receiving stations.
    
    Since that time cable has become available and he now pays the
    ridiculous monthly fees.

    
    
    even with a satellite dish you have to pay for what you see. there are
    many many different folks who sell the subscription, and many different
    packages. Soo, you can choose what package you want and who to buy it
    from. You do this all over 800 numbers, leave your box on overnight,
    and by the next day should have access to the services you chose.
    
    Some stations are broadcast in the clear, eg PBS. CBS, ABS and NBC now
    scramble their signals unfortunately.
    
    Simon

That doesn't make any sense.  How can ABC, NBC, and CBS scramble their signals
and still have regular TVs pick it up?  No way!!  The only things I know of that
dish owners have to pay for are premium channels, such as HBO, CINEMAX.  I think
Nashville Network and ESPN are also scrambled.  But, anything readily available
over the air is readily available with a dish.  Isn't it simply a big antenna?

Ed..

    
    This might cheer you up.  In the UK we get four channels for which
    we pay about $110 per year per television - no matter how many sets
    you have.  (unless the second and subsequent sets are battery powered)
    The only benefit is there are no commercials on the BBC!
    (As for satellite TV in Europe, it's so crappy that whatever it
    costs it isn't worth it.)
    
    Regards,
    
    Colin
    

    I have one television, unplugged and turned with its tube against the
    wall of our unfinished basement.

    I get great satisfaction from tearing up the quarterly solicitations from
    the cable company (my house was already wired when I moved in).

    By the way, they do lower the asking price when they send solicitations
    to a pre-wired house.

    Your cable fees are helping to clog our nation's landfills.  :-)

    
    
    ABC, NBC and CBS scramble their signals from their studios to the local
    affiliates. How do you think the affiliates get their siganals? The
    afiiliates descramble the signal and broadcast it to you over the air.
    
    The above isn't always true, some programs are in the clear. But
    generally these days the networks are scrambling.
    
    Simon

re: .41

Can you give some legal citation for that?  It's nice to be really well
prepared.

re: all

As I've stated recently in the NORTH_MIDDLESEX conference, I don't mind paying
to descramble premium channels.  I mind their stupid hardware, which prevents
me from programming my VCR in the way for which it was intended, and does
little for the picture quality.  I'm quite willing to pay more for a sattelite
dish just to express my frustation with the cable company.

   Gary

    
    re .52
    
    Sorry , I don't know the legal citation. I remember the case because my
    brother was/is a salesmen for AT&T at the time. I'll ask him, and see
    if he can find out the exact case when it went to the Federal corts.
    
    Mike

re .50:

>    I have one television, unplugged and turned with its tube against the
>    wall of our unfinished basement.

    Ours is unplugged somewhere in our unfinished attic.  My in-laws sent
    it to us despite our insistence that we had no use for it.

>    I get great satisfaction from tearing up the quarterly solicitations from
>    the cable company (my house was already wired when I moved in).

    Quarterly!  We get solicitations addressed to "TV Viewer" at least
    once a week.  Perhaps I should mark them "no such person at this address"
    and drop them in the mailbox.

    There is good reason for the networks to scramble their signals.
    
    First, a lot of the shows are distributed in advance of the actual
    air time by as much as a week or two, and thus satellite dish owners
    would have long previews.
    
    Second, and the main reason, is that a lot of the programs are
    distributed with only commercials for national distribution inserted.
    A lot of the commercials are inserted into program breaks at the local
    stations.  Satellite viewers see either blank sccreen or "Insert
    commercial here" during that time.  This means that satellite dish
    viewers are not being bombarded with commercials which is cheesing
    off the advertisers.  So scrambling it ensures that you don't see
    'em without commercials.
    
    Stuart

�If
�we move to a remote area, we are going to get a satelite dish and bypass the
�d*mn cable company completely.
    
    It won't help.  My father-in-law switched back to cable after using a
    sattelite dish for a few years.  He had the choice to pay for cable or
    pay to descramble the sattelite signals.  He chose the cable since at
    least the cable company hasn't started charging for repairs.

Give them time.  They will.  I still think they will price themselves out of
business - or at least back into a heavily regulated industry (which is what a
monopoly should be - heavily regulated).

Ed..

    re: .50, .54...
    
    Yes!  I don't know where anybody finds the time to watch TV anyway.
    And when I occasionally get caught up with all the things I need to
    do, there are plenty of other activites around that are a lot more 
    fun than watching television.

    
    
I also posted this in the Cable_tv notes file.
    
    
			CONTINENTAL CABLEVISION

			UNAUTHORIZED RECEPTION

Dear Customer,

	Recently, Continental Cablevision has increased it's efforts to detect
unauthorized reception of cable service.  Service technicians are checking
cable lines for unauthorized secondary outlets, unauthorized reception of basic
service, and connections to our system with any device not approved by
Continental which decodes premium services such as HBO, Showtime, or the Disney
Channel.  In addition, the use of signal boosters, pre-amps, amplifiers or any
other equipment not installed by Continental personnel is prohibited.

	There are many reasons for our effort to detect unauthorized use of
cable service.  First, theft of service is a crime under both federal and state
law, punishable by financial penalties and imprisonment.  By eliminating
unauthorized service, paying customers are not forced to subsidize those who
steal cable service.

	Second, when unauthorized connections are made to our cables, sevice
problems are often created which can affect the quality and cost of providing
service to others.  Service problems arise from the use of inferior equipment
not supplied by Continental, such as cable splitters, connectors, amplifiers,
inferior quality cable wire, or improper connections to Continental's cable. 
By doing so, signal leakage is caused, which must, according to the Rules of
the Federal Communications Commission, be corrected by the cable company.  If
we are unable to correct the problems, we are required to terminate your
service until the signal leakage is corrected.

	Finally, as a condition of service, customers may not add to, disturb,
alter, move, rearrange, disconnect or attempt to repair Continental's material
or equipment, or permit others to do so, without the expressed written consent
of Continental Cablevision.  Should you have any equipment or cable wire
attached to your cable service that has not been installed by Continental
personnel, or otherwise not authorized, you should disconnect it immediately to
avoid interruption of service, embarrassment or possible prosecution for theft
of service.  Thank you for your cooperation.

    

    Hah.  This sounds almost word for word like AT&T's justification for 
    all those years of phone monopoly (not the stealing service part,
    but the b.s. about only their equipment being good enough...)
    

    
    re .59
    
    This is nothing but b*llsh*t. If I were you I'd forward that letter to
    the Atorney General's office. What they are doing is illegal and
    unethical. 
    
    re .60
    
    Years ago AT&T made far superior equipment to what was out there. It
    was cost effective for them to. It's expensive to send out a repairmen
    every time they had to make a repair to their equipment. So they made
    high quality phones so they didn't have to send our their repairmen so
    often. My mom still has the origional dial phone AT&T installed in her
    kitchen 30 years ago. And it still works fine.
    
    Mike

.59 is the CATV industry standard scare letter.   They get a few people to pay
for their extra hookups, or go legit on their pay stations, and all it costs 
them is some postage.  

Stealing cable service is immoral, and a crime.   Sending the signal that I
already pay for, to the location that I choose to watch it, is not immoral,
and may or may not be a crime depending on how much you pay your lawyer.

If the equipment that I place on the cable causes a problem for the service
provider then they didn't implement their network correctly.   CATV is not
rocket science.

Bob

    But they do check the system periodically. They stopped by my house due
    to some RF leakage and found some bad connectors in the implementation
    they had done for multiple drops when the house was being built. This
    was 6 years after the house was finished. They had a meter and wandered
    around the house sniffing out connections. Made for an interested
    conversaation when they were told it was one of their installers that
    did them.

    Is there a privacy issue here? If some cable installer started poking
    around my property, and insisted on coming in, I'd tell him to take
    a hike (so I could disconnect my upstairs connection!). Who do these
    people think they are, the IRS facrysake?
    
    John

    I have a problem with my color tv.  Have noticed since returning from
    vacation that the tint is more green and cannot be adjusted out.  Have
    tried jumpering out the VIR and manually adjusting the set but still
    have to much green.  Is this something I can correct myself (like replacing
    the signal module) or should I call for a repairman?  Any suggestions
    would be appreciated.

    Give 35186::Electro_Hobby a try on this one (due to my original node
    not having a full DECnet database, I sometimes use the node address
    rather than the name). Anyway, you'll probably find more info there.
    
    Eric

RE: .0

 That happened to us once... Turned out to be the picture tube was on its way 
out. One of the gun filaments had begun to sag and was shorting out hence the 
green non-removeable tint.

 A new picture tube took care of it.

    If you have a schematic and IF YOU REALLY KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING
    (there are vary dangerous voltages around the picture tube), a good way
    to differentiate a picture tube gun problem from a driver problem is to
    swap the drive lead from two of the guns (i.e. red and green). If the
    problem changes, so that the prevailing color is now something else,
    then its probably the driver circuit, but if it stays green, then its
    probably the CRT.
    
    Eric

RE: .0
 Forgot to mention,,,,when the TV guy came out to check it out, he turned the 
TV upside down first thing and lo and behold the normal color returned and 
wasn't green any more!

 Turning it right side up the green came back and this was repeated several 
times so it was no fluke.

 You might want to give this a try yourself?? (It has to be on, warmed up
and displaying the green symptom when you do it)

Most shows would probably look better upside down.

    Must be an Australian model TV.
    
    		Steve

    I suspect what he was trying to do was to move something that was
    shorting out a part of the picture tube, or at least get it to fall
    elsewhere. If the upside-down trick did work, then you might tru to tip
    it forward (on to its screen.....gently) to try to dislodge the
    particle.
    
    Eric

    Or keep the TV upside down and turn the yoke 180 degrees...
    
    -TB

    I realize that there are high voltages back there when the TV is on. 
    Are there any residual electric charges stored back ther when the TV is
    off?  Can I get zapped with the TV unplugged? What about the Microwave?
    
    
    
    Steve

    The picture tube can hold a charge for WEEKS, even with the set
    unplugged. That voltage is on the 2nd. anode connection (the area where
    a large wire attaches to the bell of the picture tube). This connection
    is covered by a round piece of rubber that cups over the connection.
    Since it goes back to the high voltage rectifier, this voltage is also
    present in the high voltage cage and can be as high as 26KV on a 25"
    set!!!!!!!! To safely work in that area, the picture tube should be
    discharged, but unless you know what you're doing in that area, I'd
    keep my fingers away (hence why I'm not listing the procedure).
    
    Eric

    You can get more than zapped. If you don't discharge the picture tube.
    And YES even if you unplugged it.
    
     JR

A color picture tube can store enough charge to kill a healthy person.

A B/W tube will probably only kill you if you have a weak heart.

RE: <<< Note 4507.8 by WONDER::BENTO "U know my name, look up the #" >>>
    

 Bzzzzzttt. Wrong.. :-)

 The plug to the yolk is keyed so it only fits one way and the pin 
arrangement on the tube won't allow the plug and harness to plug in any other
way. 
    

    Most states that use or used the electric chair would only use 3-5KV
    and as R.10 said there about 26KV (more like 30KV but you wouldn't
    know the difference if it hit you).
    
     JR 

    .13:
    
    IF there's enough slack in the wiring harness to permit it, you could
    grasp the yoke as it sits on the neck, and rotate it.
    
    Not to argue with Gerald Sacks in .5, but 90� rotation would probably
    be an improvement in most shows.
    
    Dick

    I was only kidding folks!
    
    -TB

    Actually the comparison is flawed because of the length of the time the
    victim is exposed to the voltage, plus the current involved. However,
    the voltage from a picture tube could do some interesting things, like:
    
    1)If it flows from one arm to the other (i.e. across the heart) and
    then to ground, it could stop your heart!
    
    2)If you just get a jolt and are not grounded, you would have a violent
    muscle contraction(s) and probably do some good damage. I remember a
    person who got zapped, and had a nasty scar on his arm.
    
    In my younger days, I was working on a tube amp that had about 400
    volts B+ and a defect in the power supply. The cap discharged into one
    hand and exited my other one to gnd. The zap gave me burns on both
    contact points and threw me across a room and knocked me cold for about
    5 minutes. The doctor told me he couldn't understand why I was alive!
So give the picture tube GREAT CARE when dealing with that high a voltage.
    
    Eric

The comparison is also flawed because the electric chair is connected to a
power source with lots of current (it's the current that kills you - high
voltage won't overcome current limits of the power source).

The discussion was around a TV set that was not turned on (or, presumably,
plugged in).  Picture tubes have a fair amount of capacitance, which can
store a fair amount of energy given the high voltage.  Once you're above
about 1 KV, voltage doesn't matter and it's the energy discharge through
your body that kills you.

A B/W picture tube doesn't operate at as high a voltage, so the energy
stored is less (even if the capacitance is the same), and so it (tends) to
fall below the threshold necessary to kill you.

  Eric, your correct about the comparison but the comparison was not meant as
  a "How to make your own electric chair". It was meant as "This picture tube
  deserves respect and if it doesn't get it it has the ability to let you
  know it". The electric chair is more like a frying of your insides where a 
  jolt from the picture tube just stop heart and respiratory system. Died is
  died whats the different's if it take you 3-5 min to fry or 3-5 sec to stop
  you heart. From reading Steve questions in R.09 I can tell he hasn't worked
  on a picture tube before and may not even have worked on a television before.
  You have so you know that the key words are care and respect when it come to
  working on the high voltage but what key word or advise do you give someone
  who has not. Who's first experience will be with the high voltage and who will 
  probably be home alone in the living room working on it. NOT keep one hand
  in you packet at all time. This doesn't work with these voltages.
  (nothing personal Steve or Eric)


     JR

    
    I was going to attempt a reply like .18 but passed and .18 did a good
    job. Yes it does deserve respect. But I've been zapped by the guts of a
    TV (don't really know how much charge was stored though), Ignition on
    cars (also very high volts), and 110 AC, and probably 220 AC as well.
    No wonder I'm so crazy :-). But I hate 110 AC it always seems to hurt
    more. Static shocks are also high voltage. Duration is also a key if
    you get zapped by a TV (that's off anyway) you tend to discahrge it
    quickly.
    

I've been zapped by the second anode of a black-and-white TV.  It's quite a
jolt.  There's not much power as it's the discharge of a relatively small
capacitance capacitor, but it might kill someone with a weak heart.

I've also been zapped by the secondary of a TV power transformer.  Either
350 or 700 volts (I don't remember if I grabbed the center tap or not).
Sometimes I wonder how I survived my early electrical experimentation as a kid.

-Mike

    Thanks, this is all good info. I didn't think they put all those
    warnings on the back, and inside, the TV for nothing. I have been
    inside the TV and never been zapped. I am one for taking something
    apart if it's not working exactly right, to see if I can fix it.
    Sometimes I'm successful sometimes not. I always wondered just how much
    electricity could be stored in the TV. 
    
    Now what about Mocrowave Ovens?
    
    When I was in college, I had a motorcycle with a Magneto. The mechanic
    who rewired the bike told me all about how much electricity the Magneto
    stored. So I stayed away from tinkering with the electrical sys. 
    
    Steve

Microwave ovens are similar - there can be quite a large charge stored up,
if not in the magnetron then in the power supply capacitors.  Be very careful!

			Steve

    
    I have a 13" RCA XL100 w/remote, it's about 2 years old. We were
    watching it Saturday night, turned it off via remote. Sunday afternoon
    my wife tried to turn it on and nothing happens ! We tried via remote
    and the power button on the set. I tried unplugging it and a different
    plug. I know there is power there. The only thing that happened was
    my wife put the set on top of the video player to dust underneath.
    She also wiped the screen and buttons ... ???? any ideas ????
    
    Randy
    

    
    Check for some sort of overide off switch which might of got triggered
    while dusting. Probably on the under side flush mounted or some such.
    Also, if you still have the owners manual check that, they usually
    have some sort of troubleshooting matrix of what to do when certain
    things don't work.
    
    
    Hope this helps!

    
    I couldn't find a reset button .... I'll look again.
    
    The troubleshooting matrix said to unplug it for a time.... I did.
    
    still nothing
    

    Re. .26:
    
    Also consider whether you've recently had a local thunderstorm. A power
    surge from a close-proximity lightning strike can blow the TV's power 
    supply, or worse.
    
    Antony.

I had a similar problem in an RCA 19" Colortrak.  It turned out to be a bad
connection in the motherboard.  The motherboard is in the bottom of the set.
Putting the set on the VCR *may* have deformed the motherboard enough to 
cause a disconnect.  You may be able to confirm this theory by pressing up
in  the right :-) location on the bottom of the set to make the connection.

Stan

    
    Well the problem I mentioned in .24 has been repaired.
    
    It was the Horizontal Deflection Unit(I suspected that from the
    beginning ;^)  )
    
    The HDU is this tiny capacitor that Robinson's says is a common
    cause of TV problems.
    
    The bill came to $61 ....  $6 for the part ! not too bad .....
    
    Randy
    

    	This probably doesn't belong in its own note, but I couldn't find
    an appropriate note to stick this under (feel free to move this note to
    a better location, moderators).
    	My rear-projection, big screen TV needs some attention beyond what
    I can give it. Since it's too heavy to move, I'd like to bring in a
    professional to take a look at it. I'm looking for a reliable TV
    repairperson in the Amherst-Milford-Merrimack-Nashua N.H. area (butt
    crack not required). If anyone knows of someone reliable in this area,
    please let me know. Thanks.
    	What happens is that the TV appears to have power, but nothing
    happens...no picture and no sound. It suddenly stopped working
    overnight. I pulled the back off and found 3 125v/5amp fuses on the
    power module, all of which were intact. I could find no other fuses or
    breakers on the set itself. It seems to power up OK. I can hear the
    crackling of the other modules warming up when power is applied. I
    tried a couple of different antenna sources to no avail. I thought
    about vacuuming out all the dust which has accumulated in there, but I
    didn't do it. I also wasn't going to start fishing around looking for a
    short (I was doing this while my kids were asleep and no one else at
    home - Didn't want the kids to discover my charred remains).

You could always try asking in TURRIS::VIDEO.

		Steve

    
      When you say no picture, does it get a bright background, or does it
    stay totally black - as if it was shut off?
    
      If it stays totally black, the horizontal is very likely not working. 
    In most sets, the horizontal circuit makes lots of voltages that are also
    used elsewhere. There is a starter circuit that kicks it going and then
    it runs itself with feedback.
    
      In any case, it is very likely not a short. And even if it is, it
    will have taken out some semiconductors somewhere.
    
      Of course, this all assumes that your diagnosis that there is power
    getting to some parts of it is correct. A common problem is that the
    main power relay fails. You can press the button, the relay clicks (Or
    makes some other sort of noise) but power does not get turned on. That
    relay is easy to spot. It will be an approx 1" cube of plastic near
    where the power cord attaches to a board.
    
    				Kenny

>      When you say no picture, does it get a bright background, or does it
>    stay totally black - as if it was shut off?

Yup, totally black like it is shut off. No sound - no nuttin'.
    
>      If it stays totally black, the horizontal is very likely not working. 
>    In most sets, the horizontal circuit makes lots of voltages that are also
>    used elsewhere. There is a starter circuit that kicks it going and then
>    it runs itself with feedback.

I figured as much. It was easy to get to and check the fuses on the power
module, but I figured something in there was regulating different power amounts
to different components...where I wouldn't have a prayer of figuring out what
was wrong.
    
>      In any case, it is very likely not a short. And even if it is, it
>    will have taken out some semiconductors somewhere.

Good to know. I regret at least trying to vacuum out all the dust to see if
it would help. It sounds like it probably wouldn't have made a difference.
    
>      Of course, this all assumes that your diagnosis that there is power
>    getting to some parts of it is correct. A common problem is that the
>    main power relay fails. You can press the button, the relay clicks (Or
>    makes some other sort of noise) but power does not get turned on. That
>    relay is easy to spot. It will be an approx 1" cube of plastic near
>    where the power cord attaches to a board.
    
I'm pretty sure power was getting to several modules. With my head in the back
of the TV with the power on (I never said I was too bright), I could hear the
crackling of power arcs on the dust from several modules.

We've been calling around places and located a certified Mitsubishi big-screen
TV repair place in Nashua. The guy happened to be working on a slightly bigger
model of the same TV as mine with the exact same problem (or so it sounded) when
we called. He seemed to think there might even be a recall on the part that's
causing it...but we're waiting for a call back at this point.

Thanks for the help.

    Our VCR has suddenly stopped recording from VHF channels. Will record
    from UHF just fine, though. Any thoughts? 
    
    Thanks,
    Lynn

VHF antenna disconnected?

	Steve

    You'd probably have better luck in TURRIS::VIDEO.

    
    	I have a problem with my VCR/TV which has bugged me for weeks 
    now and I hope someone can help me figure this out. I have an
    outside TV antenna which goes directly into my VCR which, in
    turn goes to my TV.  When I am watching TV without the VCR on, 
    the reception is good on all channels. However, when I am 
    looking at TV via the VCR (or when I am taping) the reception
    is markedly worse and even results in pure garbage on some channels.
    
    Anybody have any ideas of why this may happen ??
    
    Thanks for any advice.. Paul

    Try the TURRIS::Video conference.
    
    Jodi-
    

    Jodi, Thanks.. 
    
    Paul

    
    Sounds like normal behavior. The VCR transmits its signal to the TV on
    channal 3 or 4 (you get to choose). When it is transmitting a signal,
    all the other low VHF stations (2, 3/4, 5, 6, 7) -- _on_ _the_ _TV's_
    _tuner_ -- tend to get swamped.
    
    When it is not transmitting a signal (i.e., when the VCR is turned off,
    or when you have turned off the signal to the TV), low-VHF stations are
    fine, because the VCR is just passing along the antenna's signal, just
    as if the VCR weren't there.
    
    So, when you want to watch a VCR tape, or TV stations tuned by the VCR,
    you turn the VCR's TV signal on and you watch channel 3/4. When you
    want to watch TV channels tuned by the set's tuner, turn off the VCR
    (or its TV signal).
    
    JP

Also try placing terminating resistors on all your unused Cable TV outlets.
Radio Shack sells them. This helps decrease your cable's tendancy to also
act as a good antenna.

The new cable laws no longer allow Cable Companies to charge for
additional sets.

So this problem has now been rendered moot.

    
         Where can I get a copy of the new cable bill? I am still being
      charged for additional sets and I would like to be able to show
      them that they owe me money.
    
                                              Randy
    

	Getting a copy of the law will be expensive -- you have to buy it
	from some printing service, and it's literally hundreds of pages
	long.

	Also, remember that it went into effect only this month, so charges
	for extra lines for September are OK.

	And, you can still be charged for multiple decoders.

	Roy

    	If the cable companies went to scrambling everything, people with
    basic service and cable ready TVs (which most are), that currently don't 
    need boxes, would now require them.
    
    	If the cable companies make this change they will easily recoup
    some, if not all, of what they lost from not being able to charge per
    set. 
    
    	For whatever reason, I have come across a few people with only
    basic service and a cable ready TV that had a box anyway. When I asked
    them why, they told me they thougt they needed it. They were amazed
    when we just connected straight to the TV and eliminated the box and
    remote.
    
    	Not sure if anyone in here falls under that category, but if you do, 
    it'll save you a few bucks to return the box/remote and just hook the 
    cable right to the TV. It also eliminates one remote since you only need 
    the one for your TV. The only drawback is you'll have no access to the
    pay-per-view channel/s, but if you don't use this anyway, why bother.
    
    	Ray

>     	If the cable companies make this change they will easily recoup
>     some, if not all, of what they lost from not being able to charge per
>     set. 

	They'd also lose alot of customers.  Some cable co.'s are trying
	to go the box route in NH (not Warner in Nashua thank goodness)
	and they are seeing a very vocal customer base, that has also
	caught of the eye of the town council that negotiates cable service
	for the town (ie. they risk losing renewal of their contract).

	If there was only real competition .....

    By eliminating the box, I lose most of the higher non Pay-per-View
    channels (>32), so if I want to get the most out of what I'm being
    charged, I still need the box.  Anyone have any idea how one can
    eliminate the box and still get all the channels?

> Anyone have any idea how one can
> eliminate the box and still get all the channels?

	1st make sure your tv is "cable ready".  Then look for a switch
	(or setup menu mode) that says something like CATV/TV.  Make sure
	it's enabled for CATV.

    Many older "cable ready" TVs can't access the higher cable channels.
    Models built in the last 5 years or so should be able to tune in
    up through cable channel 125.
    
    				Steve

>	They'd also lose alot of customers.  Some cable co.'s are trying

	    I don't think the cable companies will lose many costumers.
	People who are used to the convenience and the reception cable 
	offers wont want to give it up.  Who's willing to go back to the
	snow and static and inconvenience of `regular' TV?
	    Personally, I think paying $24.00 a month for basic cable
	is too much.  There are a couple of cable channels that I miss,
	but only slightly.  And instead of pay channels, we use the VCR.

				Just me,
					  Tim

					

>>	offers wont want to give it up.  Who's willing to go back to the
>>	snow and static and inconvenience of `regular' TV?

I was.  Over a year ago I dropped the converter boxes back to Americable's
office in Merrimack.  The person in front of me was doing the same thing.

Life does go on if there is nothing to watch on TV.

Brian

    
    
    Its a difficut thing to swallow having to pay to watch your
    own TV.  The other difficult thing is flicking thru the 50
    someodd stations and finding nothing good to watch!!!
    
    JD

    re:70
    	
    	I believe that over-the-counter boxes are available for non-cable
    ready TVs to decode the higher channels, but I think they start at
    about $40 and up. It may not be worth it.
    
    	As was mentioned, newer TV's have no problem accessing the higher
    channels. Newer VCR's can tune the higher channels too. If you have an 
    older TV but a newer VCR, you may be able to use it to reach the higher 
    channels that your TV doesn't get by going through your VCR.
    
    	Ray

    I can clearly remember when I was a kid in the 60s hearing about 
    there one day being "Pay TV".  I would lay awake at night worrying
    about how I was going to earn enough quarters to plunk into my TV
    to keep it going.
    
    :^)
    
    Jodi-

    Those who love/hate cable TV should visit the UPSAR::CABLE_TV
    conference.

    -- Ward

    
    
    thinking about this, perhaps laws should be changed such that an AT&T
    breakup occurs. It seems to me the person who owns the cable into your
    house also owns the services offered. And most neighbourhoods only have
    1 cable provider due to the infrastructure cost!
    
    Soo, Mr and Mrs Congresscritters, I suggest we force cable companies
    to break up into into people who own the cable, and people (more than 1 
    hopefully) who push services down it. So 1 company gets channels 1 thru 
    100, and another gets 101 through 200. Plus so much each bandwidth for 
    data and ISDN and telecom.
    
    Thoughts?
    
    Simon

    No need for that sort of legislation - it will soon become as
    obsolete as the current FCC regulations about what kind of services
    can be offered on each part of the broadcast spectrum.  We'll have
    fiber optic cables coming into our houses with broadband services
    from a variety of providers, plus competing satellite broadcasters,
    and you'll be able to pick and choose what you want.  But you'll
    likely pay more for all this freedom.
    
    			Steve

    
    Do you think that it will be THAT soon that we will have fiber optic
    cable coming into our homes?  I've been reading alot about this stuff
    and it's all really confusing, so many different scenarios around what
    the "information highway" will consist of that it's hard to get a handle on
    what will really catch on and what won't make it. Most articles I've read 
    seem to imply that it will be ~10 years before fiber optics make it into a 
    large number of homes, if it ever gets there. I think that if fiber
    replaces broadcast TV that'll free up LOTS of bandwith for wireless 
    services that we haven't even DREAMED of yet. Something to wait for I
    guess.
    
    Steve B.  

No, I don't think it will happen in the next five years, but additional
regulation is not the way to solve the problem.

				Steve

    	Satellite TV will definitly happen in less than 5 years. I'm not
    sure how much of the project I'm working on is general knowledge and
    how much isn't so I can't say much more about timeframes.
    
    	I can say that estimates for the new satellite hardware (~18" dish)
    will cost ~$700 installed. Monthly rates are expected to be ~$25-$30
    for basic service.
    
    	Ray

    Re: .83
    
    Direct broadcast satellite TV has been "just around the corner"
    for the past ten years.  I really think we'll see a viable product
    on the market by the end of 94 from the consortium led by Hughes
    (actually, Digital has a small part in this as well.)  But I expect
    it to be slow to take off for a couple of years.
    
    				Steve