Conference 7.286::massachusetts

Candelpin (real bowling) is dying a slow death.  machines are no longer 
manufactured and replacement parts are few.  because of this the majority 
of alleys you find will be ten pin.   look in a phone book...

    Boy, you could never tell that on Saturday morning.  I was LIVID when
    REBOOT! was replaced by Candlepin bowling.
    
    Has anyone ever considered that bowling isn't really a spectator sport?
    
    jeb
    

    
    	Town and Country, Rte. 9W, Shrewsbury.
    	Auburn Ten-Pin [I think that's the name], Rte. 12E, Auburn.
    

>> because of this the majority  of alleys you find will be ten pin.   look in
>> a phone book...

I did look in the phone book.  They don't specify if the alley is tenpin or
candlepin or duckpin or anything.  I know two nearby alleys (Acton and Stow),
and they are both candlepin.

>>    Boy, you could never tell that on Saturday morning.  I was LIVID when
>>    REBOOT! was replaced by Candlepin bowling.

I thought they took Candlepin Bowling off the air?  ReBoot is on Thursday
mornings (once a week, alas; great show) in case you're still searching.

>>    Has anyone ever considered that bowling isn't really a spectator sport?

I don't know about that; tenpin sure enjoys a big TV audience.  I like to watch
it occasionally, and so do my kids.

>>    	Town and Country, Rte. 9W, Shrewsbury.
>>    	Auburn Ten-Pin [I think that's the name], Rte. 12E, Auburn.

Thanks!  I was kind of hoping for something a little closer, but there may not
be any.

						Brian

    
    	I'm surprised that the two that are closest to you are candlepin.
    	That seems rather unusual, since it seems that candlepin is all
    	but gone.
    
    	And I know that you were hoping for something closer than Auburn
    	or Shrewsbury, but I figured I'd at least give you a couple of
    	choices in case you couldn't find anything.
    

    
    	Switchboard isn't very helpful in regards to 10/candlepin, either.
    

    Burlington (Terry Avenue) has ten pin.
    
                                                             David

	Actually, tenpin started its decline long before candlepin. Several
	houses have closed including:

		Natick		- now an office building
		West Roxbury 	- now a car dealer
		Lynn 		- it's a Building #19 now?
		Peabody		- the movie theatre expanded into it?
		Medford		- coat factory outlet or something?
		Marlboro	- the building was gone and the lot was empty
				  the last time I drove by

	Some of these may have closed, but there are/were tenpin houses in:

		Malden (on Rt. 99)
		Quincy (half tenpin/half candlepin)
		Boston (you can see it from the Southeast Expressway)
		Brockton (at the mall)
		Ashburnham (out west on 495)
		
	The one that I think would be closest to you is Lanes & Games on Rt. 2
	in Cambridge right next to the Alewife MBTA station. A long time ago
	it was half tenpin (2nd floor) and half candlepin (1st floor), but they
	converted 10-12 tenpin lanes to candlepin around 1970. I haven't been
	there in a while, but I'm pretty sure they've still got 20 or so tenpin
	lanes.

	Wherever you go, make sure you call first. These places are usually
	full Sunday-Thursday with leagues. Lanes don't usually open up until
	around 9-9:30.

Larry

    
    Re .2
    
>    Has anyone ever considered that bowling isn't really a spectator sport?
    
    Until about a year ago Channel 5 broadcast candlepin bowling at noon on 
    Saturday. It was consistently the most watched sports show of the week.
    
    						Ed
    
    

>>    Has anyone ever considered that bowling isn't really a spectator sport?
>    
>    Until about a year ago Channel 5 broadcast candlepin bowling at noon on 
>    Saturday. It was consistently the most watched sports show of the week.

If you can get by the question of whether ANY sport is a spectator sport
(why watch when you can play?), then candlepin bowling is a MUCH more 
watchable sport than ten pin is.
Professional ten pin bowling has one single element of suspense:  
    will this ball be a strike?
If it is, you get to ask the question again right away.
If it isn't, you can usually predict whether the spare is makable.

With candlepin, every ball, 1st, 2nd, or 3rd, is a possible adventure.
The skill level of the bowlers is far more apparent (not to say greater).
Yes, luck probably does play a greater part in candlepin.

Candlepin is so much more approachable for all ages, sizes, and strengths
of people that I find it surprising that it never did catch on more
across the country.  Yeah, it can be more frustrating, but so is billiards
and people play that.

- tom]

PS:  My dad went to school in Worcester in the late '40s.
Worcester was/is a hotbed of candlepin bowling, with the famed "half-Worcester"
spare leave named for the city.
He tells me that candlepin lanes actually had automated pinsetters
before ten pin lanes did because candlepins were EASIER for machines 
to pick up than ten pins.  This was because it didn't make any difference
which end of a candlepin was up and the machines were easier to load.

>> If you can get by the question of whether ANY sport is a spectator sport
>> (why watch when you can play?),

Some of us have a "why play when you can watch" attitude; sort of like watching
a dance or music performance.

>> candlepin bowling is a MUCH more watchable sport than ten pin is.

I agree!  But I do like to watch both of them.

>> Candlepin is so much more approachable for all ages, sizes, and strengths
>> of people that I find it surprising that it never did catch on more
>> across the country.

The significantly lower scores may have something to do with it.  The relative
infrequency of strikes and spares as well.  Also, in tenpin, if your first ball
is slightly off perfect, instead of getting ten pins you may get eight or nine. 
In candlepins, you may get two.  This is a high penalty for a small error, and
may contribute to the frustration.

What's a "half-Worcester" spare leave?  Is there a "full-Worcester"?

						Brian

    
    	"The scores are higher in ten-pin" is a silly reason not to like
    	candlepin, since, relatively speaking, the scores are similar in
    	that particular game.  If ten-pin games average 250 and candlepin
    	games average 140, you can still calculate how well you're doing
    	relative to others in that sport.
    
    	I mean, it's not like you should be saying "I can average 190 in
    	ten-pin but only 95 in candlepin".  Heck, you could apply that
    	logic to football/baseball and opt to play football because the
    	scores are higher [exception: T-ball].
    

    Some sports are easily approachable by a wide range of people in
    various stages of fitness.  I consider bowling to be one of these.  I
    am <blush> out of shape.  Very.  Yet, there is no doubt that I can go
    bowling anytime I like (I don't like, but thats just personal
    preference).
    
    Volley ball, unless it was a REAL wimpy, strictly casual, strictly
    recreational group would probably be too much (I've NEVER seen a group
    within Digital that wasn't real heavy duty about their volleyball -
    quite intimidating for the casual "sportsman").
    
    Soccer?  Nope.  Rugby?  Uh-uh.  Football?  Right!  There are a LOT of
    sports that are more appropriate for young and fit people.  Still more
    that demand lots of money and special equipment.  If you played
    football in high school and college, you might very well continue to be
    interested in the sport even though you are too out of shape to play,
    and don't have the time or skill to coach.
    
    Bowling does not fit this category.  Of course you can argue that there
    is a difference between watching your eight year old try to keep the
    ball out of the gutter, and watching a professional player rack up a
    high score.
    
    But I guess I do lean toward the philosophy "Don't watch, DO", at least
    where the demands of the sport make it a possibility.
    
    BTW, yes, I am PAINFULLY aware of how heavily watched the bowling shows
    were.  Since they were not reliably broadcast, I accidentally taped
    them several times, and I read the article in the Telegraph (with great
    joy) that announced the demise of the show.  I was aghast how big the
    audience was (though they said it had declined steadily) and how long
    it had been on the air.  This is what I expect in rural West Virginia,
    where at one time they were desperate for programming, not from the
    outskirts of one of the largest US cities!
    
    And of course, my biggest beef was that it always landed squarely on
    top of a program I *did* want to watch (which was unavailable on
    another channel because my pathetic cable company doesn't carry but one
    copy each (local) of each network - ANOTHER story).  They couldn't
    pre-empt Flipper, now could they?!?!?
    
    But, karma being what it is, either one or two weeks later ABC dropped
    Reboot.  I do occasionally watch the re-runs on Thursdays, but I don't
    think they get new episodes, if indeed any are being produced, now that
    the biggest US market has dried up.
    
    Now, what was the question?
    
    jeb
    

Comparing candlepin scoring to tenpin scoring is more reasonable than comparing
football to baseball because the former pair are quite similar.  You roll a
ball down an alley at ten pins, try to knock them all down; if you knock them
all down, you get 10 plus the pin count on the next two balls; and so forth. 
The only difference, aside from the physical size and shape of the balls and
pins, is the dead wood and the use of a third ball per frame.  A more
reasonable analogy might be in Canadian Rules Football versus American
Football, and there people have said they prefer one or the other because of
the scores.

Yes, you can calculate how well you're doing relative to others in the sport
equally easily, but not everybody cares how they are doing relative to others
in the sport.

I learned tenpin first, and as a highly infrequent bowler, I was able to get a
strike or a spare with some regularity (perhaps once or twice per game).  It's
satisfying.  In candlepins, it's extremely difficult for me (maybe a mark every
three games).  I accept it, but I miss that satisfaction of getting a mark once
in a while.  It means more when I get it, but I may not get one in an entire
outing.

I like candlepins, I find the game challenging and fun, I like the homey feel
of playing a local game, so don't get me wrong.  I'm just explaining what I see
as some of the reasons people have for preferring tenpins.  It's not wrong,
it's just different.

						Brian

I'm surprised duckpin bowling hasn't entered this conversation.  Duckpins was
big in Connecticut when I moved there in 1968, although I was and still am a
tenpin kinda guy.  There was a duckpin lane next to Riverside Park in Agawam at
that time.

And yes, the lanes on Route 2 near the Alewife T station has both candlepin and
tenpin.  Downstairs is all candlepin, and upstairs is about 2/3 tenpin.

After WCVB Boston (channel 5) canceled the candlepin show, WNDS Derry NH
(channel 50) had a candlepin show on Saturdays.  That is, until the Global
Shopping Network bought the station recently so that we can have even more
places to buy cheap jewelry and overpriced sets of coins.  Channels 46, 50, 54,
60, 62 and 66 all now have home shopping or infomercials.  Ugh.

Paul

>  <<< Note 2106.11 by DECCXL::WIBECAN "That's the way it is, in Engineering!" >>>
> 
> What's a "half-Worcester" spare leave?  Is there a "full-Worcester"?

A half-Worcester is the leave after a bowler's first ball chops out the 
3 and 9 pins or the 2 and 8 pins out of the full rack.
It's a very frustrating thing to do, because it is so hard to do it if you try!

The story is reported to be that a team from Worcester was playing 
in an away match against several other teams.
Late in the match, with the Worcester team trailing, one of their bowlers
left this leave, making the chances of getting the mark he needed to have
his team catch up rather unlikely.
An observer (or opponent) is said to have commented on the situation
as "taking the team half way back to Worcester"  - a comment on 
the likely elimination of the Worcester team from the event.

I guess if you chopped out the 2-8 and the 3-9 on one's first two deliveries,
that would be a full Worcester.

- tom]

    
    	That's VERY tough to do while playing 10-pin.
    

There's one other ten pin alley I know of, Gardner Ten Pin in 
Gardner Ma, not far from exit 22 off Rt. 2. Not exactly close
though. 8-)

Dana