Conference rdvax::grateful

"Take something very seriously,
 but not yourself"

		Joan Bayez

Definition of "Foreign Aid:"

        "The transfer of money from poor people in rich countries to
        rich people in poor countries"

[Source: quoted by someone on the UseNet]

"Peace is not the absence of war.  Peace begins not when nations are too
 invincible to be attacked, too bloodied to fight, or too drained financially
 to build weapons.  Peace is fundamentally a state of mind.  It can only begin
 when there is a profound desire to exist in harmony with oneself and one's
 neighbors, and a profound recognition that peace is the only sane alternative
 for Earth's future."

			-- Edgar D. Mitchell

"Peace is not the period of time between 2 wars"

    
    " I believe we are on an irreversable path towards freedom and
    democracy, but that could change."
    
                 - Dan Quayle

    Do you have a date for that Dan Quayle quote?

    Digression Don_who's_hobby_it_is_to_track_the_downward_spiral_of_the_
    vice_president's_IQ

    
    RE:6
    
      No, sorry. I read it in " Newsweek" about a year and half ago and
    also in a newspaper compilation of stupid Quayle quotes a few 
    months back.
    
      Another favorite: "I really believe in teachers. They are the
    only ones who teach our children."
    
                      Dan Quayle ( A heartbeat away from the presidency)

Re: .6, .7

I ran to the Dan Quayle calendar to see if it was there, but sorry, it wasn't.

I thought I'd share the Dan Quayle quote for December anyway:

	"You all look like happy campers to me.  Happy campers you are,
	happy campers you have been and as far as I'm concerned happy
	campers you will always be."

		- Quayle greeting the people of American Samoa.
		  (As reported in Newsweek, 5-8-89)

"There is no way to peace.  Peace is the way."

	- Ghandi

    
    "The earth does not belong to people, people belong to the earth.  Like 
    the web of a spider so is life on this planet, and what people do to one 
    strand they inevitably do to themselves."
    
    					PBS 'Nature' Comment

    
    
    Badges? Badges? we don't need no stinkin badges......
    
                         John Belushi (from the film Going South)
    

    
    	Its also fom Blazing Saddles......
    
    

    
    	"And what would you do if you had a brain?"
    
    		The Great and Powerful Oz.
    

    re: .11 & .12

    The original is in a classic Bogart movie, "Treasure of the Sierra Madre."

"my life's part of a global life
 I find myself becoming more mobile
 and I think a little girl in the world can do anything...

 destination my community,
 street person, my responsiblity,
 If I have a care in the world, I'd have a gift to bring..."

                                --  Indigo Girls


(I think that's how it goes...)

"When I'm not attending a Grateful Dead concert, I listen to WGBH radio"

	Massachusetts Gov. William Weld, doing a promo for a local PBS radio 
station

    
    What we have here is a failure to communicate....
    
                     (Strouther Martin as the warden in COOL HAND LUKE)
    

"There's a fine line between wisdom and wierd"   (How true!)

				Paul Hogan in "Almost an Angel"

:-C

    A lot of us crossed that line long ago.

    I should have done a mail order today and I blew it big time!

re:< Note 229.20 by RGB::SHERRED >
>                                -< (*&(&^)(*& >-
>
>    I should have done a mail order today and I blew it big time!

I forgot, too!   No biggie, I wasn't sure if I was going to go after all. The
Wednesday and Thursday Nassau shows (assuming that's where you were going to
go) should still be available to 2nd day mail-orders.  I was going to do
Thursday and Friday, now I guess I'll have to listen to tapes.

Besides, I'm saving my money for the 9 Boston shows :-)

adam

    
    President Bush's new campaign slogan:
    
    	"I've fallen and I *can* get up!"
    
    			- David Letterman
    
    :-)
    
    

    "If govt. is not about feeding the children, then what is it about????"
    
    Capt. Kangaroo
    
    

    man, who says kids today have no role models???  :^)
    
    				da ve

re:  <<< Note 229.24 by ESKIMO::DWEST "Dont Overlook Something Extraordinary" >>>
   
    > Capt Kangaroo for president! 
    
    Dancing Bear for president! :-)
    

    
    
    I wouldn't belong to any club that would have me as a member....
    
                                              (Groucho Marx)
    

    It could be worse.  It could be raining.
    
    			Marty Feldman as Igor (Eye-gor) 
    				in "Young Frankenstein"
    

"Hey Joe, eat some more.  It tastes even better if you put more in your mouth."

		-- supposedly Italian guy talking to another Italian guy
		   in a TV commercial for some microwavable pasta

{headers removed}

    From the "Parade" Magazine, Boston Sunday Globe, 29-Dec-1991 --
    
    	Best Quote by a Boss
    
    	  By chairman and CEO of Ben and Jerry's, Ben Cohen, who last year
          kept his salary to $84,000 (the company limits its top salaries
          to no more than seven times the pay of the lowest-paid full-time
          worker):
    
    	"I don't see any way you can justify somebody making $1 million or
        more a year when the low-level workers aren't making enough money
        to afford a house."

	    "I'm an ape man, I'm an ape ape man, I'm an ape man."

    From Patty, my wife, this morning...
    "You sure have PMS lately! PICK on ME SYNDROME!!!! Leave me the f#*& alone!!"

>                      <<< Note 229.31 by CLOSUS::BARNES >>>
>
>    From Patty, my wife, this morning...
>    "You sure have PMS lately! PICK on ME SYNDROME!!!! Leave me the f#*& alone!!"


No NO No...

according to my wife, men get U M S
			      g o w
			      l o i
			      y d n
				  g
				  s

    > according to my wife, men get U M S
    >  				    g o w
    >				    l o i
    >				    y d n
    >				        g
    >					s
    
    In the extreme case, this is known as SUMS (Sudden Ugly Mood Swings).
    
    tms

    
    	"And a woman can be tough!"
    
    		Janis Joplin
    
    

	"Actually, he had nothing against being a leather cutter.  He
	had mastered his craft and derived considerable satisfaction
	from it.  Nevertheless, he realized that even if he lived to be
	a hundred, he would be essentially the same person doing the same
	tasks, neither better nor worse.  He wasn't jealous of those who 
	had more money than he did, though to have more money would've
	been nice.  But it was change he longed for, and he often thought
	that in an ideal world people would change their personalities
	every decade or so, possibly learning something to boot.  Each
	metamorphosis would necessarily be a change for the better.  No
	butterfly, no matter how faded or imperfect, was ever uglier than
	the larva it emerged from."

		- Mather Grouse, in Richard Russo's novel, "Mohawk"

when asked if she was looking forward to doing product endorsements upon
returning to the states, olympic speedskating gold medalist bonnie blair said:

   "i'm no michael jordan"

    A Valentine's Day quote, a day early:
    
                 "If music be the food of love, play on!"
    
    -- Shakespeare's "Twelfth Night"

RE:             <<< Note 229.37 by STUDIO::IDE "now it can be told" >>>


Great for a p-name, I may use it someday!!

Scott

    ME? I like to DANCE!!!!!!

"The price of freedom is constant vigilance."

"If someone stuck a pin in my head, it would explode."

			-- Jane Q. Public in radio ad for sinus medicine

    Dennis Miller, on his 2/13 talk show, to Sen. Al Gore about his stated
    "experimentation" with marijuana: "So, who rolled a tighter joint, you
    or Tipper?"  He didn't get an answer.
    
    Jamie

    I liked what Dennis Miller said about Bush the other day:
    
    	"Ya know Buch has me wondering,.. I mean the guy is on the ropes
    	and there's nobody in the ring with him"
    
    		%^)
    
    							/
    

maybe Deenis should have his own note.

"Napalm, Agent Orange & silicone breast implants. Gee, Dow makes Exxon look like
the Make a Wish foundation"

Monsanto made Agent Orange, not Dow.

I visited their St. Louis plant around 1985 or so, and they were quite apologetic
about it. (while they were telling me about ROUNDUP, a general purpose household
defoliant that they SWORE wasn't made of Agent Orange...:-)

tim


P.S.  Maybe they both made AO, I dunno, but I know Monsanto made it.

So it goes.

    A good friend of mine who's family has worked for DOW chemical
    for years, and is rather conservative for a youngster, informs me
    breast implants are made by DOW Corning...not the same DOW Chemical and
    COrning Glass Company.
    This is one of the reasons "conservatives" piss and moan at "liberals"
    his comment was basically "get yer facts straight!!"
    
                                    
                          rfb

"I think we are destroying the minds of America.  That's been one of my 
lifelong ambitions."

			-- John Kricfalusi, co-creator of Ren & Stimpy

    	[excerpted from The Bethel (Maine) Citizen, March 11, 1992]
    
    "People that are really very weird can get into sensitive positions and
     have a tremendous impact on history."
    
    						- Dan Quayle
    

    "I tried marijuana once or twice and didn't like it.  I didn't inhale."
    
    -- Bill Clinton
    
    Maybe if he had inhaled, he'd have a different opinion.  I'm waiting
    for someone to say "I experimented with marijuana and I need more
    data."
    
    If the democrats were to form a firing squad, it would be in a circle. 
    
    Jamie

    re .-1
    
    yeah, I almost hurled when I saw that one. "I didn't inhale" ...
    
    not true, Mr. Clinton! You DO inhale!

    if he didn't inhale how does he know he don't like it ? like my mom
    always said, if ya don't try it don't say you don't like it !
    
    Chris
    
    ps. I don't think my Mom was talkin' 'bout the same thing though...

"Saying that Bill Clinton is the most electable Democrat is like saying Moe was
the smartest stooge."

tim

The whole ganja thing w/ Clinton is stupid.  he should say, "ya, i tried it
and it really isn't a big deal.  i didn't care for it, but, at least i have
tried it and can offer an opinion on it.  too many people in this country
have plenty to say about m.j. with no experience."

    "The great thing about playing the saxophone is that you don't
     have to inhale"
    						Bill Clinton

"Saying you smoked pot and didn't inhale is like saying you drank beer and
didn't swallow."

		Some Guy on TV

re JC

Yeah, but if you want to get elected, you gotta say what the people want to
hear.  What the people want to hear is that drug use is the root of all evil
in society.  It's a lot easier than having to deal with the *real* sources of
our problems.  Drug use is at worst a symptom.  All IMO.

    not me !! I wanna hear one POL say he tried it and liked it ! he'll get
    my vote !

    That's not what people want to hear. I'm starting to hear more and more
    people talk about how ridiculous the war on drugs is ( people I never
    would have expected) . That's just what the politicians and the
    oligarchy want to keep pounding into our heads, with the hopes that
    someday we'll start to belive it
     
      "Give up your rights! I'll lead you out of this mire of evil that
    personal drug use has caused" 8'O ----> |'p 

That's what the majority want, I think.  Or the voting majority, anyways.

    Danny Ainge, on his picks for who's going to win the National League
    East (baseball) pennant this season ... "I'll take the Mets, assuming
    they can manage to stay out of jail" ... apparently three of the Mets
    star players are facing rape charges ...
    
    						... Bobbb
    

"The genius of our ruling class is that it has kept a majority of the people
 from ever questioning the inequity of a system where most people drudge along
 paying heavy taxes for which they get nothing in return."

					-- Gore Vidal

Hmmmm.   Innerestin', isn't it, that the only candidate who is talking
_serious_ tax reform isn't being taken very seriously by the media (those who 
control what the people think)...

    the scary thing about the people that govern the country is that more
    and more it is becoming people i went to school with!!!  :^)
    
    				da ve_who_has_a_high_school_aquaintance_
    				on_the_ballot_in_local_elections

>:^)  my god--it's us and NOT them!!

Nah, the kids who were republicans back in high school and college, still are.
I just wish that the rest of us could get together long enough to vote them out
of office! ;-)

tim

Re: .62

>Hmmmm.   Innerestin', isn't it, that the only candidate who is talking
>_serious_ tax reform isn't being taken very seriously by the media (those who 
>control what the people think)...

   	Andre Marou is also proposing serious (and much more drastic) tax
reform, and look how much attention the media is giving him! :-(

	He's a candidate of a national party (Libertarian), on the balot in
fifty states for November's presidential election.  The same media that's
trying real hard to pretend he doesn't exist is falling all over itself to
promote H. Ross Perot.  Go figure!

Mark

    so is Bo Gritz (from what I've read on the Usenet).

    From what I've heard of Perot, if he's actually elected, we'll all be
    wearing uniforms and kissing our civil rights goodbye in a matter of
    months.
    
    I knew people who worked for EDS (founded by Perot, and run by him at
    the time), and I got the impression that organization was run much like
    Germany in the 30's.
    
    He's a scary guy, but so was Hitler.
    
    tim
    

    My comments about Perot to his supporters get me some strange
    looks..."Ya, that's what this country needs, a capitalistic millionare
    running it...JESUS!  didn't ya learn anything from Reagan?"
                       rfb

    Really? 
    
    ... but.... they're all capitolistic millionares, aren't they?
    
    Oh well... perhaps chaos will favor us with a good selection... life
    is funny that way sometimes, you know?  The person you least suspect
    as being good sometimes ends up being just what is needed or leads to 
    some significant positive change or something.  
    Keeping fingers crossed anyway.
    
    "goes to show, you just never know"

    don't know if i mentioned it before, but according to Bob Woodward's
    book "VEIL: The Secret Wars of the CIA"  H. Ross Perot was one of the 
    big private sector contributors to the Iran/Contra arms-for-hostages
    scandal...  he evidently kicked in large quantities of his own personal
    fortune to keep Ollie North's operation running in Nicaragua...
    
    					da ve

 I heard some other interesting tidbits on Perot the other day, but unfortunate-
ly can't remember them, but they were along the lines of what da ve said.  I'ms
sure more will come out when/if he formally announces, but with the growing
Perot histeria I doubt if those who support him will want to hear it.  The
guy kinda scares me though.  But then so does Bush and Clinton.




Jum

re   <<< Note 229.70 by ROULET::DWEST "Dont Overlook Something Extraordinary" >>>
                       -< food for thought on Perot... >-

>    scandal...  he evidently kicked in large quantities of his own personal
>    fortune to keep Ollie North's operation running in Nicaragua...
    
Well, that should win him some votes, then.  Ollie's a hero!

    Hmmmm.  If Perot runs, and gets votes, he'll be taking them away from
    one of the other candidates.  Wonder what the chances are that he'd
    take enough away from Bush to let Clinton win?
    
    I think I'll vote for Pat Paulsen, despite what the courts say...
    
    j

    More likely he will split the anti-Bush vote.
    
    Not that it is likely to matter.  I have just about given up hope
    of ever seeing anybody but a Republican as President.  Or anybody
    but anti-choice, anti-bill-of-rights, reactionaries in the federal courts.
    
    Maybe, if we work really hard, we can defeat Quayle in 1996.  Maybe.

    "Other videos will follow.  Keep only the ones you want."
    
    -  from an ad for a series of 'Ben Hur' and like videotapes aired
    on CNN immediatly following a piece featuring a panel review of the
    RK video tape by attorneys responsible for the defense of 4 quitted 
    LA policemen.   

                      <<< Note 229.74 by RANGER::NOURSE >>>
                            -< I hope I'm wrong... >-

>    Maybe, if we work really hard, we can defeat Quayle in 1996.  Maybe.

Sheeit you are one scary person! :)

They (rep party) know they'd have to do major surgery for Dan Quayle to 
be accepted as a real viable candidate....

which leads to this:

It is my belief that Pat Buchannan will be REP of choice in 1996.

Now you really have something to worry about.

and I hope I am very wrong as well.
bob

    In the spirit of 0.75, and not really a quote. . .
    
    T-shirt slogan seen on a looter in LA (seen by me on CNN):
    
    Shop 'Til You Drop!
    
    No kidding!
    
    Jamie

    Did you ever get the impression that he's just one taco short of a
    combination plate?
    
    				... Robin Williams on Dan Quayle
    

"Digital has always been a marketing company, close to the customers and
their needs, but nobody knows that.  They think we're all nerds." 

                                   ***

"I told the people who worked for me they were all going to work together
and all the vice presidents quit.  They thought I didn't appreciate them."

                                   ***

"I thought if we simply broke up into business units, we would start to act
businesslike, but we didn't."  

                                   ***

"We have to make products that are simple to sell."

                                   ***

"They say I'm old and I don't know everything.  I may be old, but there's
one thing I know:  People don't buy computers."

                                   ***

"We got the client-server business all wrong.  So did IBM.  We thought
'client' meant 'little computer' and 'server' meant 'big computer'.  So did
IBM."

                                   ***

"Our software strategy is suicidal.  Doing everything for everything takes
approximately forever and costs an infinite amount of money."

                                   ***

"We put computers down on the floor.  There are wires all over the floor
and the air intake is right down there where the dust is.  Computers can
hang on the wall."

                                   ***

"We've got to let go of timesharing.  Timesharing was wonderful.  We took
all these disparate things and put them in the same place and then when
they came out the other end they were still separate.  This was a great
achievement, but it's not what is wanted now.  The world is going away from
the mainframe to smaller computers and they don't know where they're going.
They're waiting for us to tell them."

    
                            To grow restless
                       against your surroundings
                             is depression,
                          to reach out for love
                            when you see none
                                 is hope,
                             to realize life
                             will outlive you
                               is conquest,
                          when mind and reaction
                              all become one
                                 is belief,
                     and belief against your depression
                       will give you hope for conquest
                            to your surroundings.
    
                              -James W. Haughey
                             

    
         "Wherever you go, there you are."
    
                            - Buckaroo Banzai

    
    Did anyone see any of the REp. convention last night? I flipped though 
    just in time to see someone claiming Americans had the right to
    affordable, accessable haircare. Of course he quickly corrected it to 
    healthcare but I laughed so hard I almost fell off the couch. 
    
    :-Chuck

 I saw that and laughed quite a bit myself...I was thinking..at last everone
 can relax and know that their haircare problems are gone forever..




 Re Buckaroo Bonzai...when that first came out this guy that works here and I
 were talking about the movie and laughing, etc..we were talking about the part
 in the factory (or whatever it was) wher everybody's name was John..and ever
 since then whenever we see each other we call each other John :-)  Really funny
 in meetings..people can't figure out who's talking to whom :-)




 Jum/john

    
    Another from Buckaroo Bonzai...
    
    "The only reason for time is so that everything doesn't happen at
    once."
    
    :-Chuck

"I take Him shopping with me.  I say, 'OK, Jesus, help me find a bargain.'"

						-- Tammy Faye Bakker

    "Woke up this morning, 
     and both my cars were gone.
     Say, I woke up this mornin', 
     and my Caddilac and my Mercedes Benz were gone
     Well, I got so damn mad, 
     I nearly threw my martini across the lawn"
    
    	

    "This is so cool I have to go to the bathroom!"
    
    - Calvin, this morning

    
    	"Life is mostly froth and bubble,
    	  Two things stand like stone,
    	 Kindness in another's trouble,
    	  Courage in your own."
    
    			-- Adam Lindsay Gordon (1833-1870),
    			"Ye Wearie Wayfarer," Fytte 8
    
    :-Chuck

    "Laws are like cobwebs - they catch the flies but the wasps
    and hornets break through"
    					I ferget who

    
    re: .91  ... nice quote.  Makes me think of the laws which were twisted
    and skewed to absolve more then one man of Carol Stuart's murder.
    
    c

"I don't believe there is an American alive, man, woman, or child,
who doesn't enjoy a lovely beverage from time to time."

					-- David Letterman

    
    
		   "I know Al Gore. He wears my ties."

    
    					Jerry Garcia

"We misunderstood the immensity of the job."
		- Andrei M. Jackamets of Hoboken,
		  trying to dig out his Toyota with
		  a spatula and a frying pan.

    Hoboken?!?!?!?!??!
    
    	OOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!  I'M DYIN'!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    
    					da ve

                    You don't look like a pen-goo-in.

        
    
          "I wonder if the pope has ever seen the wave."
    
    
                                     young pope-head in Denver
                                         Sat 8-14-93

    
    
    I wonder if the pops ever seen a Dave!!
    
    
    					Old Deadhead Dave in Colo. springs
    
    

    re -.1
    
    sure...  my pop has seen me lots of times...  infact, my pop IS a dave!
    				:^) :^) :^)
    
    					da ve

"Eee-yah."
	-- Chubby Checker

    "If at first you don't succeed...suck harder until you do suck seeds."

    
    "Seemingly. if one wishes to promote family values, action would be
    taken that is pro-family rather than anti some other group."
    
                                   Judge Jeffery Bayless 

The following quotes are posted with relevance to the article I posted in 
"The World We Live In" note.  I know that on the surface these notes have 
nothing to do with the Grateful Dead, however "Deadheads" and "gunnuts" 
have several things in common.  First of all we are 2 of the most 
stereotyped groups in america, second both groups care deeply about the 
freedoms that we enjoy, and the society that we live within.

There are some great words written in the following quotes that help to 
back up the great (even powerful/magical) words written down in the 
Constitution.

Edmund Burke: 	"The people never give up their liberties but under some
		delusion." 1784 SPEECH.

Noah Webster: 	" The supreme power in America cannot enforce unjust laws by
		the sword, because the whole body of the people are armed, and
		constitute a force superior to any band of regular troops..."
		AN EXAMINATION INTO THE LEADING PRINCIPALS OF THE FEDERAL
		CONSTITUTION PROPOSED BY THE LATE CONVENTION (1787).

Patrick Henry:	"Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect every
		one who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will
		preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that 
		force, you are ruined." DURING VIRGINIA'S RATIFICATION 
		CONVENTION (1788).

William Pitt:	" If I were an American, as I am an Englishman, while a foreign
		troop was landed in my country, I never would lay down my arms-
		never-never-never! You cannot conquer Americal." 1777 SPEECH.

Benjamin Franklin: " They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little
		   temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
		   HISTORICAL REVIEW OF PENNSYLVANIA (1759).

Thomas Jefferson:  " No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms."
		   PROPOSED VIRGINIA CONSTITUTION (1776), JEFFERSON PAPERS
		   344, (J. BOYD, ED. 1950).

John Adams:	 " Arms in the hands of individual citizens may be used at
		individual discretion...in private self-defense." A DEFENSE OF
		THE CONSTITUTIONS OF GOVERNMENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF 
		AMERICA (1787-1788).

James Madison:	The Constitution preserves "the advantage of being armed
		which Americans possess over the people of almost every
		other nation...(where) the governments are afraid to trust
		the people with arms."  THE FEDERALIST #46.

Thomas Paine: 	" ...arms discourage and keep the invader and plunderer in
		awe, and preserve order in the world as well as property...
		Horrid mischief would ensue were the law-abiding deprived of 
		the use of them." THOUGHTS ON DEFENSIVE WAR, (1775).

Jefferson:	" Laws that forbid the carrying of arms..disarm only those
		who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes
		...such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better
		for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to
		prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with
		greater confidence than an armed man."  QUOTING 18th CENTURY
		CRIMINOLOGIST CESARE BECCARIA IN _On Crimes_and_Punishment_
		(1764).

Richard Henry
Lee:		" A militial when properly formed are in fact the people
		themselves...and include all men capable of bearing arms...To
		preserve liberty it is essential that the whole body of
		people always possess arms..." ADDITIONAL LETTERS FROM THE 
		FEDERAL FARMER 53 (1788).

Samuel Adams:	" The Constitution shall never be construed to prevent the
		people of the United States who are peacable citizens from
		keeping their own arms." DURING MASSACHUSETTS' U.S. 
		CONSTITUTION RATIFICATION CONVENTION (1788).

George Mason:  " I ask, sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people...
		To disarm the people is  the best and most effectual way to
		enslave them." DURING VIRGINIA'S RATIFICATION CONVENTION
		(1788).


Source:
NRA/ILA 1994 Calendar
		

    
>Benjamin Franklin: " They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little
>		   temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
>		   HISTORICAL REVIEW OF PENNSYLVANIA (1759).               
    
              words to live by!
                                                         ^dave

    run away ! run away !
    
    		- Monty Python

    I moved all this gun talk to note 210.* so please continue it there.
    
    thanks
    
    Chris_mod

    
    "One is not half of two...it is two which are halves of One."
    
    						Anonymous bathroom artist

    
    
    On Tuesday, when the sky is blue,
       And I have nothing else to do,
       I sometimes wonder if it's true
     That who is what and what is who.
    
    			A.A. Milne

    
    "and once again, I find myself thinking about my gun-toting,
     feeble-minded friend"
    
    	- Paul Kantner, after singing "Sketches of China", Saturday night,
    	  Irving Plaza, NYC
    
    

    and another one from the only good generation cops out....
    
    "I get really disgusted and despairing when I see young teens smoking
    grass and lying around listening to the Grateful Dead."
    
    - Tim Leary
    
    from a Parade newspaper article about pot that came buried within 
    the Sunday Morning Gaggatte, Colo Springs

    
    Jeepers!!!
    
    About six years ago I was listening to NPR and they had Timothy Leary
    on talking about Virtual Reality (it was my first time ever hearing 
    about V.R.).  Apparently Tim spent the day in a V.R. world and it 
    blew his mind (imagine that!).  I guess he is a strong anti drug
    advocate now and believes the youth of the future will get high on
    

    hey that Tim, go around poppin' acid for years havin' all the fun,
    telling everyone to tune something in out up down whatever, then he has
    the balls to say that ! I don't think he has got a braincell left in
    his head !
    
    Chris

What, nobody got the feeling that Dr. Tim may have been pulling Parade's
leg a little bit?  Tim wasn't a Prankster, but he's not far from it.

PeterT

    I had the feeling that he was concerned that people should be tripping
    rather then smoking pot? The article about Marijuana was rather
    lame, same old story...  Despite the evidence, it will not be legalized
    in my lifetime, perhaps around 2045 or so..zz
    

    
    Yeah, generation X does sound like something good to smoke!

    just a question of curiosity from a naive Gen X'er  do most of you
    ahem, older folk feel that marijuana willnot be legalized before the
    year 2000?
    
    survey_man
    

    in 6 years, I don't see it....not unless Bill tells the truth about not
    inhaling !:')

>              -< old=not conceived but conceiving at Woodstock.. >-

well, i wasn't exactly conceiving at woodstock (i was only 2 days old), but
i'll voice my opinion anyway.

i do not think that marijuana will be legalized before the year 2000.

i do, however, think that it may be legalized at some point in my lifetime.

- rich

    maybe in my lifetime, but not by 2000...
    
    biggest problem with legalizing now is prolly not even internal to
    US...  my bet is we're tied into too many international treaties and
    there's too much money involved in local aid, interdiction etc...
    
    					da ve

    We had a shot at this many years ago (1970's), but thanks to the 
    cocaine epidemic, and Mr Reagan's failed policy's... NO WAY.

I see encouraging things all the time, and then I see things that discourage
me.  Chance of Mr. Bill introducing anything remotely like this in his
first term is zilch I would say.  Probably not much higher in a second
term, should he get one.  Encouraging things?  German high court saying
people should not be prosecuted for small amounts of grass and hash.
Columbia doing the same thing a few weeks later, for all drugs.  But
I think Germany has a bit higher moral ground than Columbia for our country.
There are some changes taking place on our shores too.  I think that the
Clinton administration has taken a lot of the money out of interdiction
and moved it towards education, where it really belongs.  But I don't know
if we've seen much affect from that yet.  And they have said they will 
review the policy on medical marijuana, at least I think I remember something
about that.  And there is Joecylin (sp?) Elders statments about investigating
legalization of drugs, aside from the administrations flat statement that
it won't happen.  At least it puts the thought in some peoples heads.
The Supreme court saying you can't be taxed twice on drug profits,
though that comes after being arrested I believe, so I'm not sure that
its a real win.  I believe they also voted something against the forfeiture
laws also, something to the affect that the government has to file a written
intent that they will sieze your property which is subject to review
or some such.  These are all kind of just chinks in the Wall of the war
on drugs/rights, but they may grow a bit.
Discouraging things?  People still getting busted.  Gary Shepard.
D.A.R.E. (noble idea, perhaps, but simplistic, stupid, and wrong information
given about pot).

Before 2000?  I can only wish.  But I'm not putting my money on it.

PeterT

    
    
    	"Yes, People everywhere want Peace - it's usually Politicians that
    cause trouble."
    
    	Paul McCartney's Dad

    Not exactly a quote but
    From the Esquire Magazine Dubious Achievements Awards for the year
    1994:
    
    A man in Michigan was treated at his local hospital 
    after wounding himself in the head
    
    ...while cleaning his crossbow.

    Today's Boston Globe, p. 42:
    
    The court sealed the photographs, one of which reportedly showed Bowman
    in a compromising position and holding a banana.

Headers removed to protect the guilty:

>c)If any employee witnesses a fire, they are empowered to pull the fire
>  alarm.  They can pull either the yellow alarm for local evacuation or red
>  alarm for global evacuation.

    question of the day...
    
    where does one go in the event of a "global evacuation"???????
    
    					da ve

	"OK, everybody offa dis planet, NOW, DAMMIT!!!"

    to the bar.....

    ...and into the vacuum....
    
    Musta been that giant sucking sound Ross aluded to...

re .127

Rally points on the Moon, of course.  I think you need some refresher site
safety training.  :-)

I can't decide what's sillier, "global evacuation" or being empowered to pull
the fire alarm if we spot a fire.

    Remember Ford Prefect.

>I can't decide what's sillier, "global evacuation" or being empowered to pull
>the fire alarm if we spot a fire.

thanks for the news jamie.  i had always thought that, in the event of a fire,
the first thing to do was return to my office and leisurely read through my
Employee Safety Handbook.

remember, "Do not attempt to put out a fire with a fire extinguisher if you
have not been trained to use the equipment."

- rich

    When I worked as a hospital lab tech, we were told that in the event of
    a fire we were not allowed to use the word 'fire'. We were to call some
    number and report 'combustion'.
    
    We were only allowed to say 'fire' if there wasn't one.
    
    gary

That's wierd

If you take a self-defense class, they tell you not to
yell "Help" or "Rape" because people will run...instead,
they say yell "Fire!"

So if there's a fire, you can't yell "Fire!", what do
you do?  Yell "Rape!"??

:-/

tim

    >When I worked as a hospital lab tech, we were told that in the event of
    >a fire we were not allowed to use the word 'fire'. We were to call some
    >number and report 'combustion'.
    
    Wow, that's ridiculous...it's almost like taking politically correct
    disaster terms a bit too far :)))
    
    Tim, you're right...maybe my brother in law would have gotten more help 
    when he was being stabbed to death, if, instead of saying "help, he's
    stabbing me" he said something like..."ah, excuse me folks, but this
    little puke is repeatedly sticking that knife into my body..."
    
    sorry_folks_from_an_angry_Wes_who_thinx_this_garbage_of_saying_the_
    correct_thing_has_gone_Too_far

    this is a kinder and gentler nation Wes..
    people have gotten so thin skinned it has led to the point of paranoia
    with political correctness...

    "I yelled 'Fire!' when I fell into the chocolate,
     I yelled 'Fire!' when I fell into the chocolate,
     I yelled 'Fire!' when I fell into the chocolate,
	Lolly-tu-dum-tu-dum,
        Lolly-tu-dum-day.
    Because nobody would come rescue me if I yelled CHOCOLATE!"
    
    ...T. Smothers, 1966

     >   "I yelled 'Fire!' when I fell into the chocolate,
     >    I yelled 'Fire!' when I fell into the chocolate,
     >    I yelled 'Fire!' when I fell into the chocolate,
     >       Lolly-tu-dum-tu-dum,
     >       Lolly-tu-dum-day.
     >   Because nobody would come rescue me if I yelled CHOCOLATE!"
    
    
    	Wow does that bring back some old memories. When I was about 
    	ten or so I found that Smothers Brothers album in my fathers
    	record collection and it quickly became one of my fav's. ;-)
    	I havn't heard that in years. Too funny..... 
    
    					Later,
    					     Jim

    
    I don't have this phrase totally right but I want to get this quote in today
    because it's eating at my minnnnnd.  It's from Dylan's "Masters of War"
    and he's talking about the war/hate mongers of the world  and he says
    to them :   "you've given(?) the worst crime / the fear to have children/ 
    		 in our time ..." 
    
    It's the essence of the phrase ... Josh, do you have your Dylan lyrics
    book handy?  
    
    carol

    "You've thrown the worst fear
    That can ever be hurled
    Fear to bring children
    Into this world..."
    
    
    ...mike            

    cool!  Thanks Mike!  See how close I was! 
    
    :-)  :-)  
    
    

"Be Fruitful and Multiply."
                - The Book of Genesis

    On a lighter note ... my 9 year old daughter is entering a science
    fair. In the Official Science Fair Guidelines note they sent home
    there was a stern warning:
    
    "No human body parts will be allowed with the exception of hair,
    nails, and teeth"
    
    Makes you wonder what happened in the past!

    what school was this
    Jeffrey Dahmer Elementary?

    You REALLY don't want to know!
    
    I have been a Science Fair judge at every level: 
    	school
        district
    	regional
    	state
    	International
    
    This will be my 20th year as a judge. 
    
    I have seen sone TRULY WIERD STUFF! come doen the pike... everything
    from a Baptist view of evolution to Nobel-prize quality exhibits (I
    mean it... the girl who did this work is now in the Ph.D program at
    Stanford after getting an engineering BS at MIT and a bniology BA
    at Harvard concurrently...in three years) (and going "Hello, sailor!"
    every Saturday night) (she was and probably still is a real hellion)
    
    anyhoo... the thing most brought in was bones. But there was a lot of
    blood and other things on occasion too...
    
    ...judge mikey

    "The blues isn't about feeling bad ... it's about making other
    people feel worse"
    
    - jazz man to Lisa Simpson

    Violence is NOT a RIGHT
    

>    Violence is NOT a RIGHT
    

yeah... it's a priveledge to which the fine people of Amerika have given to
their government.  :-(


- jeff_feeling_very_Monday-ish

    
    
    	"Happiness is not a state to arrive at, but a manner of traveling.
    
    					- Margaret Lee Runbeck
    
    
    
    
    	:-)
    
    

    
    	One of my favorite quotes...think it's R. Hunter's work.
    	Never deceases to amaze me.
    
       "Some folks would be happy just to have one dream come true
        But everything you gather is just more that you can lose."
    
    

    re: last
    kinda like my "The more you make the more you spend."
    
    rfb

    re: -2
    
    Is that from built to last?  
    
    In any case, it's running through my head now to the tune of BTL! ;-)
    
    

    >>Is that from built to last?
    
    
    "Mission In the Rain" - done once or twice by the Dead but most common
    for JGB.

                       
    Mission in the Rain
    -------------------
    
    I turn and walk away then I come 'round again
    It looks as though tomorrow I'll do pretty much the same.
    
    I must turn down your offer but I'd like to ask a break
    You know I'm ready to give everything for anything I take.
    
    Someone called my name you know I turned around to see
    It was midnight in the Mission and the bells were not for me.
    
    Come again, walking along in the Mission in the rain,
    Come again, walking along in the Mission in the rain,
                       
    Ten years ago, I walked this street my dreams were riding tall
    Tonight I would be thankful Lord, for any dream at all.
    
    Some folks would be happy just to have one dream come true
    But everything you gather is just more that you can lose.
    
    Come again, walking along in the Mission in the rain,
    Come again, walking along in the Mission in the rain,
    
    All the things I planned to do I only did half way
    Tomorrow will be Sunday born of rainy Saturday.
    
    There's some satisfaction in the San Francisco rain
    No matter what comes down the Mission always looks the same.
    
    Come again, walking along in the Mission in the rain.

    
    ah yes..... "click"
    
    

    
    I could do a jerry show soon 

    ditto
    

    
    
    Only the children can see
    
    R. Hunter
    liner notes inside 3 from the Vault

>    Only the children can see
    

	I -loved- that story - it made me feel like a child -
	cause I know I would have reacted with joy even if I
	didn't know what they were all about - I probably would
	have run after them to try to get on the bus...

	Debess

    	From "The Moral Animal", by Robert Wright:
    
    "Giving men tips on how to have a sucessful monagamous marriage is a
    little like giving a Viking a pamphlet entitled "How not to pillage"".
    
    	Standard discliamer re: the above is not intended to endorse either
    non-monagamy or non-Mariage, etc., I just thought it hilarious....
    FWIW, the book is fascinating; it is subtitled something like "An
    exploration in Evolutionary Psychology", which attempts to explain
    quite a bit about modern-day problems between the sexes, in
    childrearing, and a whole lot more based on a Darwinian perspective of
    ingrained successfull gene-passing strategies. Highly reccomended....

    From a radio ad on during one of yesterday's football games: "Call
    1-800-D-I-V-O-R-C-E.  Because not all matches are made in heaven."
    
    And one I made up myself: "Anyone who's not their own cousin hates the
    Cowboys."
    
    Jamie

    
    
    HA!  :-)                                             
    Jamie, *that's* gonna be an instant classic.
    
    I'll be using that one if you don't mind. :-)
    
      
    Steve-O

    GO COWBOYS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    America's team my arse
    
    The governemnt should let Texas secede and then overrun them in a mass
    invasion

    RE:" The governemnt should let Texas secede and then overrun them in a
    mass invasion"
    ^^^^
    I'm sure that most Texans would leave if everyone from Mass showed
    up....%^)

"The music seemed to creep up through the heavy carpet, to ooze from
the walls, to flurry, like snowflakes, from the ceiling, rising and
falling in measured cadences unlike any music I had ever heard.  It
seemed to steal, now softly, now merrily, on tiptoe into the room to
see whether we were awake or asleep, to brush away a tear, if tear
there was, or gambol airily and merrily, if such was our humor, and
then as softly, sometimes sadly, to steal out again and lose itself
in the distance.  It was just such music as a boatful of fairies
sailing about in the clear water of the fountain might have made, or
that with which an angel mother would sing its angel babe to sleep.
It seemed to enter every fibre of the body, and satisfy a music-hunger
that had never before been satisfied."
					- H.H. Kane (1888)

    i think i was there 
    

"Every year 11% of women aged 15 to 19 become pregnant. President Clinton
    is trying to change that." --CNN Headline News, January 29th, 1996

    what with some of the most recent discussions in here about men and
    women, I thought this appropriate....IT'S A JOKE!!!!
    
    
    " Here's to beer, so amber and pure---
    Not as sweet as a woman's lips,
    but a damn sight more sincere."
                                        Old Irish Toast

    Each friend represents a world in us, a world possibly not
    born until they arrive, and it is only by this meeting that
    a new world is born.
				- Anais Nin

  But then they danced down the street like dindledodies, and
  I shambled after as I've been doing all my life after people
  who interest me, because the only people for me are the mad
  ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be
  saved, desirious of everything at the same time, the ones who
  never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn
  like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders
  across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight
  pop and everybody goes "Awwww!"
                                        - Jack Kerouac

    re .-1
    
    wow! I just read that in my copy of "On the Road" about 10
    minutes ago, waiting for mammoth ACCESS queries to run. I
    was thinking of putting that in here.

>   wow! I just read that in my copy of "On the Road" about 10
>   minutes ago, [...]

I got it from Bartlett's Familiar Quotations...I decided to update
the /etc/motd on our timesharing system, opened to a random page,
and that jumped out at me.

But you're right...it couldn't be a coincidence! :-)

Dan

    That's one of my favorite Kerouac quotes.  A perfect example of
    sentence formation :-) .  Reading him is like plunging headlong
    into a sea of words.  Listening/watching tapes of his stuff makes me
    feel connected to a swirling world of ideas and dreams and I'm reminded
    again of the similarities between his work and dylan's.
    
    c

    "Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk.
    That will teach you to keep your mouth shut."
                                                  Ernest Hemingway
    
    
    and a couple just for Furthur tomorrow........
    
    The road of excess leads to the palace of wisdom.
                                                    William Blake
    
    Toss the pot, toss the pot;
    let us be merry.,
    And drink till our cheeks
    be as red as a cherry.
                            17th Century drinking ballad
    
    FURTHUR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

	"I didn't intend for this to take on a political
	 tone.  I'm just here for the drugs."
					- Nancy Reagan


[Her reply when asked a political question at a "Just Say No" rally.]

    from a bumpersticker Hoot gave me....
    
    Give us this day, our daily dead...
    
           
    
    
    from a letter to Hunter...
    
       "we didn't follow them around to listen to dead songs...we lived one!"
    
    
    we should all pay particular attention to  that last one....and live
    it!!!
    
    rfb

    here's another classic from a letter to Hunter...
    
    "Oh my gosh, You mean we're deadhedas.?"
       
             5 year old girl after finding out her 3 favorite songs 
    (Wheel, UJB, Box) were all by the dead.

>    Give us this day, our daily dead...

	like it!

>       "we didn't follow them around to listen to dead songs...we lived one!"
    
>    we should all pay particular attention to  that last one....and live
>    it!!!
    
	depends on which one ;-)

    re;
    depends on which one!
    
    
    all rolls into one.....%^)
    
    rfb

Who said the following?

Well, I do something very different on the guitar. I don't so much play
the guitar as make up stuff... the notes that I play during the solo, I
conceive it as a composition that's happening instantly at the time that
it's... You know, you have 2 minutes to fill up or you have 9 minutes to
fill up or whatever it is - a piece of time which is anywhere from 2 to 9
minutes long and you're gonna decorate it with notes - you're gonna make
a composition in there.

The quality of that composition is determined by what you're physically
capable of playing at that time, what the rhythm section will allow you to
play and whether or not the keyboard player who's supplying the harmonic
climate is going to mess up what you're playing by sticking in his favorite
Jazz Chord right there. These are all the dangers a person faces when
improvising a guitar solo.

There are some guitar players who will practise their guitar solos and they
will always be perfect and they will be the same every night - I don't do
that. When it's time to play, I don't know what I'm going to play until I
start doing it; and then an idea will pop up and I'll just develop it in the
same way I'd develop an idea on a piece paper except that I don't have to
wait to hear it - I get to hear it as it's coming out.

Answer will be posted tomorrow.

 

Me.  I said it.

  I don't know.  You want me to say "Jerry".   8)
  
  I did read Jerry say something similar to this in MUSICIAN magazine...
  
> You know, you have 2 minutes to fill up or you have 9 minutes to
> fill up or whatever it is - a piece of time which is anywhere from 2 to 9
> minutes long and you're gonna decorate it with notes - you're gonna make
> a composition in there.

  He said there's a million different ways to get from Point A to Point B in
  a chord progression or a song, and that he thought he had gotten much
  better at it over the years.  (This was in the team interview of Jerry
  Garcia & Elvis Costello.)

  The heck with it, I'll guess it's Jerry.   - JayC.

    couldn't be Jerry, not if it's a direct quote anyway...no "mans" and
    repetitive "ya knows".....%^)

    i was thinking of guessing Phil, until he said something about
    what the rythm section would let him do...  :^)  kinda hard
    for it to be Phil...  he IS the rythm section...  :^)
    
    					da ve

    My guess is Jimi Hendrix.
    
    	dave
    

	sure sounds like jerry to me.
	hendrix didn't often use a keyboard player, did he?
	he played his own rhythm.
	he, like SRV, could play two parts at once.
	
	maybe duane allman?
	
	it's probably that phish guy :-q
	

    >>it's probably that phish guy :-q
    
    I'm with you Jay. What IS his name NEway?

	who cares?
	
	;-)  ;-)
	
	

    Amen

    Flounder?

    Gorton

	
	Sheeeeeeeshhhhh.....Armand....it's tomorrow already!!!!


			:^)   	:^)	:^)

    uhhh, actually, where i am, it's "today" again...  :^)
    

>    uhhh, actually, where i am, it's "today" again...  :^)
 

		Dohhhh!   

"how do you get a deadhead to tune in tomorrow?"

    I bet it's Trey, but I'm guessing it's really some cool old guy
    you'd never expect, like Dick Dale or someone.. ;-)
    
    No, seriously, it'd probably be Hendrix, but I'm guessing Trey. 
    What do I win?

    Tom

I'll take a wild stab and say



Pat Metheny


PeterT

although Carlos also comes to mind...

    It rambles uncharacteristically, but it could be a variation on 
    the Frank Zappa -- "each solo is a discrete composition" -- riff.

    I'm with Mssr Beaupre, it sounds like Zappa.  Early Zappa probably,
    back when he still cared about doing guitar solos.
    

	and you would indeed be correct.
	
	altavista says it's from a 1984 interview w/Zappa
	
	
http://www.music-planet.com/zappa/fztext/i.84.europe.html

	

    I shoulda known.  It's not spacey enough to be Hendrix.
    
    	dave
    

    "Why are you so different?
    Why are you that way?
    If you don't get in line, boy,
    They'll take you away..."
    
                          DMB

    "Committing mass suicide is one way to get people to read your Web
    page." - WBZ radio 6am news
    
    Sure it's tragic, but the phrase "quasi-religious cult of computer
    programmers" made me spew coffee out my nose.

    made me think of the DECheads....

    this morning on CNN, it was said that the sucide participants left a
    couple of tapes saying they were going to go join up with the UFO
    hiding behind Hale-Bop..seriously! and ya'll though my Life Force
    theory was a bunch of bunk....
    
    
    rfb_out there

    there *is* a UFO out there...  part of the advanced party.
    earth is their new food source...    the law enforcement people
    are their advanced agents, setting up the slaughterhouse chain...
    the Florida execution chamber is their prototype bbq. so all
    you death-penalty proponents are providing aid & comfort to
    the extraterrestrial carnivores!!!

    I knew it!  not to make light of 39 people dead, but I list a bet
    with my wife, she said it was connected to the comet (before
    it was confirmed), I said eclispe.

    FRY EM
    

Fools!  The comet IS the UFO!

PeterT

    	I apologize in advance for my disconnect with the news... I suppose
    I could turn on my car radio on the way home tonight... But if anyone
    could enter a 1-2 line syopsis of what the heck happened (39 people
    killed themselves, related to the Comet? There's a WEB site related to
    this?), I'd be appreciative..
    
    	thanks,
    
    -Chuck
    

Chuck,  39 people were found dead in a home in a small town outside
of San Diego, CA.  These 39 people were all of similar age, 25-30, 
and all computer programmers/web designers.  They were all dressed
simmilary with some sort of purple sash draped around them or
something like that.

There was no sign of struggle or foul play ....

They think it was a mass suicide.  Evidentally an  anonymous tip
called this in.  They've since found the person who phoned it in.

that's all I know.  This ufo/comet connection is weird.  

    

    	Ah, thanks..... I also went & looked at www.cnn.com & got the whole
    story... What a world...
    
    -Chuck
    

    Jim Jones meets cyberspace

That's the thing about psychosis - it tends to be
self-correcting in the evolutionary scale of things.

So...they left to join the mother ship, eh?

...just when I thought life was getting wierd,
it shows how really wierd it can get.

tim

So, if there's "more intelligent" life out there and their ship is 
hiding behind the comet, why does the only vision this evokes seem to be 
the 3 Stooges hiding & moving about in shrubs.

too bad the 39 web designers couldn't write a java applet to show them 
common sense...

� So, if there's "more intelligent" life out there and their ship is 
    
    Nobody said they are more intelligent...

    yeah, and the aliens brought a book titled "To Serve Man"
    
    /rick_who_apologises_to_those_who_don't_find_this_situation_something_to_joke_about
    

>     yeah, and the aliens brought a book titled "To Serve Man"

You forgot the punchline, rick.  Turns out it was a cookbook.
(Old, old sf story...)

PeterT

    I tried to find this for Earth Day:
    
    "Oh, so Mother Nature needs a favor? Maybe she should have thought of
    that when she was besetting us with droughts and floods and poison
    monkeys. Nature started the fight for survival and now she wants to
    quit because she's losing?! Well I say hard cheese."
    
    	- C. Montgomery Burns

	she ain't never gonna lose Jamie - if anyone's going to, it'll be us.
	if it gets to the point that the Earth can't sustain life, it won't
	be the Earth that won't be around anymore...

	she will survive...but will we?

    i love Mr Burns...  :-)   and no, not the same way Smithers does...
    
    i hear his voice often in meetings....  anytime anyone says
    "excellent"...  :-)
    
    					da ve

    No response wanted, it was just a funny quote from the Simpsons.  The
    evil Mr. Burns figured out that if a six pack holder could trap a fish,
    a million of them stitched together could sweep the ocean clean.
    
    I like the quote, it carries the anthropomorphism of nature to a
    logical conclusion.

>    No response wanted, it was just a funny quote from the Simpsons.  The
>    evil Mr. Burns figured out that if a six pack holder could trap a fish,
>    a million of them stitched together could sweep the ocean clean.

Of course, the sad part about this is that these things already exist.
Not made out of six pack holders, but isn't this the essenitial idea
behind gill nets.  And they make ones that are many miles long.  
Though maybe they are being banned these days.  I don't follow that 
aspect of the ecological crisis very closely.

PeterT

	Gill nets don't sweep the ocean clean of everything... just
	the market sized fish :-/  By law the "squares" of the net have
	to be a certain size so that smaller fish can swim right through.
	
	Draggers really decimate the ocean floor, scooping up everything
	that's on the bottom. When it gets to the boat, they toss over
	"waste" - infantile fish, etc, which usually don't make it, leaving
	behind it a wake of a stirred up bottom with nothing left. :-/

	Things *are* getting much better. Deep sea fishing has improved,
	and there are haddock showing up frequently now.  5 or 10 years ago
	a haddock was a rarity.   20 years ago you could catch em from shore.
	
	/Ken

    cod stocks are still decimated though...  :^(  the fish that made the 
    industry here, destroyed by the industry it created...
    
    we better get used to a veggie diet folks...  and a light one at
    that...  if we don't start changing the way we live, we won't...
    
    					da ve

    and environmentalism is out of control...........
    
    grumpy

    
    re:nets
    
     The nets your talking about are drift nets that are miles long. They
    turn an ocean into a desert!
    
    Divide

    I'll never give up meat!

    I waslistening to an old NPR Science Friday (courtesy of RealAudio)
    yesterday and the guest, a marine biologist, stated that 97% of the
    life on this planet exists in the oceans.  I'm not sure if he meant
    number of species, biomass, or something else, but it's an incredible
    figure.
    
    Jamie

   Oceans, just like the rainforest, have species we don't even know about.

    "No, No, NO!  Damn this machine!"
    
    - suit in a hurry cursing copier.

    "If you don't like the way I drive, stay the ^%$& away from my car."
    
    me to suit who was complaining about my lack of brake light and improper
    use of turn signals

    "I'm just glad to be feeling better. I really thought I'd be seeing
    Elvis soon." 
    
                Bob Dylan statement from Columbia Records