Conference rdvax::grateful

    Yes, there has most definitely been a change in my "deadheadness" since
    becoming a member of this conference.
    
    I went to my first Dead show my freshman year in college, which would
    make it nearly 21 years ago.  But I couldn't tell you when, exactly,
    that show was ... or even where.  I went to a lot of concerts that
    year.  And while I liked the Dead, they weren't anything special.  I
    went more for the social aspects than the music.
    
    Over the years I've had several Deadhead roommates, and for the last 15
    years my closest friend has been a Deadhead.  I always liked the music,
    but never went out of my way to collect tapes, or even get tickets for
    showz.
    
    All of that has changed now.  Mostly because with computer access it's
    easier for me to mail order for tix.  In the 17 years prior to joining
    this conference I attended maybe fifteen showz.  In the last 4 I've
    attended about another fifteen (six this year so far).
    
    And the taper's connections I've made thru this conference are better 
    than any of my friends outside the company have access to.  Indeed, most
    of them now get their best tapes from me (i.e. the Mystery Hill/Gerry 
    Gladu connection).  
    
    I'm also much more aware of the abundance of trivia associated with the
    band ... setlists, "retired" songs, hot concerts, even personal facts 
    about the band members.  This is partially a result of the wealth of 
    information disseminated thru this conference, and mostly a result of
    the large number of friends I've made and associate with because of this
    conference.
    
    But I still can't keep track of the songs played while at a show.  Now
    I don't even try ... I just wait till the next day and extract it outta
    here ... ;^)
    
    ... Bob
    

    Interesting choice of subject, Debess.  Like you, I too was strictly
    'experiencial' about Dead shows for a long time.  For example, I
    remember attending that spring '77 Boston Garden show you mentioned,
    and I didn't realize they played St. Stephen!  I do remember them
    playing Terapin, though, because it was the first time I ever heard it!
    But I started seeing them in '73, and didn't know the names of most of
    the tunes until about '89 or so!  I just never cared - I guess I was
    there for other reasons. :-)
    
    A couple years ago I started paying attention to setlists when I
    noticed my friends getting involved in it, most notably Mystery.  It
    definitely changed my perspective on shows, but I can't decide if it's
    better or worse - just different.  I never realized that the Summer '74
    Miami Jai Alai shows were so popular (and hot) until I got involved to
    this level, even though I was there!  I just knew I had a HELL of a
    good time!
    
    At the same time, though, I have come to realize how much I have in
    common philosophically with the rest of the Deadheads at the shows.  It
    isn't merely a matter of having common musical interests anymore, it's
    much of the perspective on life in general.  Whether that's connected
    to putting more structure on the way I look at shows, and being a
    Deadhead in general, or just a happy coincidence, I can't tell.  
    
    But I do suspect....:-).
    
    tim
    

    There was a real neat person I met right at that time when I was
    starting to pay (too much) attention to the stats of the showz.
    He was great fun to party with, and just an all around good vibes type
    of dude. So anyway,.. we got to talking,. and I was working heavily
    on trying to get a decent tape collection started (which really didn't
    happen until I got in here and Probz made me a box of tapes,. thanks
    again ~) and so I asked hiom about his tape collection. He says
    something like "Oh, I've got a few,,.. but I don't listen to them
    very much" So,.. of course I ask Why,.. and his philosphy on the
    whole thing was something like go for the moment,.. not the artifact.
    
    That has stuck with me ,.. and I think changed my course. At that
    time (this was Red Rocks, '85) I was beginning to head down the 
    taper path,.. getting into set lists,.. into stats etc,.. but he
    	derailed that train for me. I returned, and am now firmly
    entrenched in the "go for the moment" mind set. The whole scene
    is not really captured via audio casette,.. and the magic is
    not really recordable.
    
    Another good friend (Mark from Slipknot) and I always have this
    argument about whether what they play is important. I'm always saying
    that its not what they play,.. but *how* thay play that makes a show.
    He says he'd rather see certain songs. I mean he's right,.. to a
    point,... in that I must agree I'd rather see a Dark Star than a
    Black Peter, or a Watchtower Dew than a Throwing Stones NFA...but
    if Jerry wants to belt out a soul searching Black Peter,. I can get
    into that, perhaps even more so than say a lack luster Dark Star.
    
    What does it all mean? I don't know. But to answer Debess' question, No
    this conference hasn't really changed me. But I was starting to change
    at one time,.. getting away from the happy go lucky play in the magic
    karmic ocean and toward the statitsical technical analytical side of
    things. I didn't complete the metamorphasis,.. and find myself
    gravitating back to the happy go lucky attitude even still.
    
    							/
    

Bare with me, this could be long.  But, I have several thoughts on this
subject.

First, being a computer scientist (or whatever label you wish to affix to
my profession), I think and act logically.  I really enjoy structured
languages like Pascal.  Sometimes, I see the structure of Pascal woven
into the set lists.  For example:

Pascal:   if (this) then	   Set List:	UJB ->		(not finished)
	     begin 				  Terrapin ->    (finished)
		----				  Black Peter -> (finished)
		----				  Dark Star ->   (not finished)
	       if (that) then			    Space ->     (finished)
		  begin				    Wheel ->	 (finished)
		    ----			  Dark Star ->   (finish it off)
		    ----                          Playin ->      (finsihed)
		  end;                          UJB		(finish it off)
	     end;

So, I look at it like each time they do not finish a song off, a different
"path" is taken.  The return to that path will come eventually.  And, like
the example above, other paths may be "spawned" from another path.  But,
the path is always unwound "in order", that is, using the example above,
I'm not sure they would finish UJB before finishing Dark Star.  Now, maybe
this could be an "ask the univere question", have they ever not unwound
a song progression in the "right" order???

********************

I too have loads of tapes, thanks to the bunches of kind folks in this file.
In the beginning, I just collected and collected... i love listening to
the tapes, and I still do.  When I go to shows, I don't sit there and say
oh, i want this and that.  sure, i have my "wants" ... but usually i figure
out if i got them *after* the show... mostly because the music INHALES me..
i totally get soaked up my the music and i do not like being bothered while
taking it in... some folks i go to shows with like to talk, etc... if that
happens, i usually split to a cool, quiet location.  but, as slash says,
if i don't get "my" songs, i don't bum out... i definitely live for the
moment and make the most out of each song... if they happen to crank out
yet another Ts->Nfa, i just laugh and say, "here we go again" ... 

when i first saw the boyz in the west (colorado), I was totally freaked
out by the difference in the crowd noise.  I could actaully hear them
play, rather than hearing 8 million heads screaming and talking.  what
a contrast to the east!!  this could not have been better; the music just
infected my body for the night... i didn't even go to the can for a
bladder break... no way was i gonna miss a beat of those nice, quiet,
shows...

i still collect tapes.  the quality of the tapes of shows of the 90s are
very very good.  And, as slash pointed out, no way does the tape even
come close to reproducing the "real thing"...  rarely do i listen to a
tape and say, "oh ya, i remember this... this was great."  i've listened
to tons of tapes, been to lots of shows, so it is hard to remember the
details all the time...

for instance, that show in Albany '90 (sat show) was KILLER and I vaguely
remember (i was off _beyond_ Pluto)... i just remember dancing my buns
off and really lovin' every second...  but, when i listen to the tape,
it is ok... if i listen to the UJB -> Playin'  LOUD and my parents house,
then i really get psyched... just goes to show that the same tape can
move me differently if played differently....but no way, even if you
have the best stuff, will the tape ever come *close* to the experience
i had with my uncle at that show.... yow.

jc

	What got me into the dead was the amazing interplay of the
	musicians in this incredible band, and it's still what keeps
	me into it.   In this way things really haven't changed for me.

	The studio albums really didn't do all that much for me way
	back when, they do more for me now though.  But back then (around
	1977-78) when I first listened to Skull+Roses, *really* listened,	
	I was blown away and still am.  Then I heard Live/Dead during some
	strange, late nights in college.  Wow!  This is from another planet
	I thought.   I could drift off and follow Phil's lead, or follow Bob's 
	rhythm, or the beat of Bill+Mickey, or the keys, or of course Jerry's
	spiralling leads and explorations.  Simply amazing, dense, cosmic music!
	No 2 versions the same.  Improvisation. Music with *spirit*, feeling.
	I love it.  The more I expanded my consciousness about life in general,
	the more I loved the Dead, and the 2 went hand in hand.   My college 
	roommate was right!

	I first saw the dead in Providence January 1979, at least I think
	so - it's the oldest ticket stub I have.  Don't remember much 
	about it at all, except that there was something different going on
	compared to other concerts.   Thinking of some other early shows I
	went to, like 4/?/82 Hartford with Phil's earthquake space, I was
	more of an outside observer as opposed to being *involved* - it's
	hard to explain.   I really got on the bus in Worcester 10/20/83,
	I'll never forget it - me and Mindy semi-close to the stage experiencing
	the most incredible feeling of being immensed in and *with* the music, 
	as one, the environment we were part of, everyone around us, strange
	coincidences occurring, electrified in the most positive way.  It was 
	intense and breath taking to say the least!   Though it started a few
	years earlier, from that point on I could not get enough. I experienced
	'deadness' in the live setting.

	I started collecting tapes of this music right around the time I heard
	Skull+Roses and Live/Dead.  Mostly stuff off of "dead-air" radio shows.
	I found it hard to find "heads" who were willing to trade and dub their
	bootlegs which I found incredibly frustrating and selfish.  For this
	reason, among many others, I'll always dub tapes for anyone.  I finally
	met someone at JGB in Hampton Beach in 1984 who was very generous with
	his tapes, and started collecting a lot more.  But the ultimate for tape
	trading is GRATEFUL and the net and the wonderfully kind folks and 
	tapers who lurk here (not to take anything away from non-tape-people:
	you're all great!).   

	Contrary to previous notes, I wholeheartedly disagree that tapes can't
	reproduce "the feeling", that they can't capture a *major* part of the
	experience.  Of course there's more to the experience than the music
	itself, but the music is the main er, carrier, it's the energy source	
	which draws the participants.  I find myself getting that "feeling"
	of awe many many times cranking a great tape in the car or at home.
	Not always, but I feel that adrenalin rush and chills up my spine
	at shows or when I'm listening to certain tapes.  For that, I'm 
	eternally grateful to tapers & to the GD organization for distributing
	fantastic sounding soundboards and audience tapes.  It means a lot to 
	me.

	Writing this makes me feel great!

	Thanks,
	Ken
	

    Hmm...I've always really enjoyed the early studio work - American
    Beauty and Workingman's Dead especially.  Maybe some of the later stuff
    less so.
    
    As for getting the 'feeling' of a live show from a tape, I just have to
    turn it up REALLY LOUD! :-)
    
    tim
    

    in reference to JC's use of Pascal to interpert dead set lists....
    
    
                     SICK PUPPY!!!!!!!
    
    
    
    
                                      %^) rfb

    Yea, I was thinking that too.  As a fellow programmer, JC, I suggest
    you take some vacation.  You need it. :-)...
    
    tim
    

>    Yea, I was thinking that too.  As a fellow programmer, JC, I suggest
>    you take some vacation.  You need it. :-)...
 

thanks mon!!!!  now, if i can just rumage up enough vacation time to take
a *real* vacation... sure wish we'd adapt the european policy of 6 weeks
per year!!!!


re: Ken

YES YES YES... I know what you mean about the interplay mon.  Sometimes, I'll
be just hanging out, tending to my cholestrol problem, catching up on bills
and the checkbook all while cranking a tape.  Then, all of a sudden, I start
to move to the music... i drop the pen, lay down on my bed, and totally 
deadicate my brain to listening and analysing the music.  The interplay is
incredible... sometimes phil is off in his own space, then you have the
drummers providing a killer back beat, wier providing some great supporting
rythyn and JERRY !!!! just off painting a killer picture with music......
some fo those 25+ minute scarlet->fires are really, really, mind boggling.

re:   <<< Note 173.9 by BIODTL::FERGUSON "the rainbow does not have a beard" >>>
   
>rythyn and JERRY !!!! just off painting a killer picture with music......
>some fo those 25+ minute scarlet->fires are really, really, mind boggling.

 Funny you should use that as an example. It takes me 25 - 30 mins. to get 
to work in the a.m..  I popped in 9/14/90 MSG set II scarlet -> fire, which
took me all the way to work. 8-) 8-) 8-) I had that crannnnnnkeeeeeeeeedddddd
to the MAX. And it really sent me down a road that me as it's only traveler.

Shawn

I guess I've always been a setlist junkie.  I have the setlist written
down on my first stub, but you can be a setlist junkie and still "live
for the moment".  I guess tha same goes for tapers, although it's a bit
harder to "live for the moment" when you're constantly attending to the
tapedeck.  I think I'm a good-vibes junkie too.  that's what I connected
to first before the music, but the music kept me coming back.  I also
love jazz, and  the Dead's pretty jazzy for rock-n-roll - just the way
I like it.  I'm not sure if the notesfile has changed my life too much.
If it has, it's definitely on a positive note.  I guess if I was lucky
enough to live closer to all you good folks out east (and in Colorado
8-), I'd say the notesfile would've effected me more.  Too bad I didn't
work for DEC when I used to live in Boston.

peace,
t!ng