Conference moira::parenting_v3

    
    We turned Jason's seat around before the recommended time (I think
    it was 7 months).   We checked with his pedi and she said if he
    was sitting well and if his legs were getting too long for the 
    rear-facing position, then it was okay to turn him around.  (His
    doctor is associated with Fallon and the "notes" that they handout
    at each checkup concured with her).   Like Chelsea, Jason also was 
    getting fussy while riding around this time frame and we felt it 
    was safer driving-wise if we could easily observe what was going on 
    back there!
    
    Good luck,  Carol
    

Backwards facing at 18lbs and/or 7 months ?????

Is there a major differance between car seat types 
in the UK and the US?.. because most (all?) car seats
for the 0-4 years age range in the UK state that the
car seat should face forward from 3/4 months

In fact Graham (age 6 months now) has never faced
backwards.. we started him in the seat (facing forwards)
at 4 months

    Yes, it is advised that the baby be backwards until a certain
    weight, height, and/or age is attained.  I believe this is so
    that, in the unfortunate event that an accident happened, the
    impact of a crash would be minimized for the soft-boned baby.
    Someone more knowledgeable than me on this will have to fill
    in the specifics.
    
    carol

                     <<< Note 395.3 by TIPTOE::STOLICNY >>>

>    Yes, it is advised that the baby be backwards until a certain
>    weight, height, and/or age is attained.  I believe this is so
>    that, in the unfortunate event that an accident happened, the
>    impact of a crash would be minimized for the soft-boned baby.
>    Someone more knowledgeable than me on this will have to fill
>    in the specifics.
    


so why does the UK have a limit for foward facing of 4 months
and the US a limit of 18lbs and/or 7 months ???

Either we are under doing it.. or you are over doing it 

(actualy if anything the limit should be a lot higher here in the
UK.. since the speed limits are that much higher.. you have
a speed limit of 55 (65 in practice?) and we have a speed limit
of 70 (85-90 in practice).. (I'am talking about the Motorway/Freeway (?)
here of course!!!!)


So why the large difference between us ???  (Is this related in someway
to the (perceived) "sue happy" approach of some members of the USA?

    I just recently read (maybe in Parents Magazine) that the baby
    is supposed to face the rear so if there is an accident, the
    strongest part of his/her body - the back - will get most of
    the shock.  I can double check.
    
    Donna
    

    Our pedi okayed Samantha switching to forward facing at 6 3/4 months,
    approximately 18 pounds.  She said she was physically advanced enough
    at that time, could sit unassisted, etc.
    
    My advise is to ask your pedi, then you'll know you're doing the safest
    thing and won't need to worry.
    
    Samantha looooves seeing what's going on now that she's forward facing,
    and I love watching her (via mirror) play in the back.  :)
    

    Besides body weight, it's neck strength that is an indicator of when to
    turn the car seat. A 3-4 old infant still has the "wobbles" and in the
    case of an accident, that spells trouble if the seat is facing forward.
    If backwards, the shock of the collision tends to be absorbed by the
    back.
    
    Check with your doctor.
    

    The problem is that in specifying when to turn a car seat, or when
    to move from an infant to a toddler seat to a booster seat, there are
    so many variables that the manufacturers would have to create a list
    of conditions to make the appropriate change that it would be very
    incomprehensible and difficult to enforce.
    
    For example:
    
    1. When they can hold their head up
    
    2. When they reach xx pounds
    
    3. When their shoulders are xx cm apart (how many consider that one?)
    
    4. When their feet (when properly seated) touch the seat they are facing
    
    5. When their heads exceed the height of the seat
    
    etc etc etc.
    
    So, what they did is took one parameter that best includes all these
    parameters and used that: WEIGHT.  Now, what the legal authorities, as  
    usual, are trying to do is to say that that is THE parameter.  So what
    we must do is get some sort of guideline out of the respective
    approving authorities for alternatives.
    
    The difference between the UK and North America is probably because of
    law suit protection ... better safe than sorry.  The UK for example has
    had children's 4 & 5 point rear seat harnesses available for many years
    but they are not considered safer here than the traditional lap belt.
    N. American approval authorities were concerned about tunneling ... on
    the other hand, they didn't consider the risk of hernias and internal
    rupture from the lap belt.  Safety authorities are weird.
    
    Stuart
    

    There was an article in the Monday Boston Globe stating that all
    children, regardless of weight, should be facing the rear of the car
    until one year of age.  It didn't state why.  Does anyone know?
    It said to put the toddler size car seat in facing the rear.  Can
    you do this with the Fisher Price seat?  My son is 8 months old and
    is just about outgrown his infant car seat.  I was looking forward
    to letting him face forward in his big seat.
    
    
    				Mary

    Mary,
    
    To answer your question about the Fisher Price toddler-size
    seat: yes, you can definitely face it to the rear of the car.
    If you still have the instructions that came with your seat,
    they cover the details - there may also be instructions right
    on the seat itself. 
    
    Lucy

The reason that children under the age of 1 should face the rear in a 
car seat is that their neck muscles are not completely developed.  I
read a long article on this at the Brigham & Women's NICU that discussed
types of car seats and reasons for using them.  I don't remember if
it was that their heads flopped forward or what (that doesn't seem right
since both my kids have had nice head control for a while, and they're
only 9 months old now), but I do remember that it had to do with
neck muscle development.

    
    	
    	I was always under the impression that it might lessen
    	the impact or chances of "flying" out of the seat should,
    	heaven forbid, you get into a car accident.
    
    	With the seat facing forward there's more of a chance for
    	the child to come out and go through the windshield, into
    	the back of the front seat, anywhere.
    
    	With the seat facing backward, the backseat would come
    	down onto the car seat itself and "cushion" the impact
    	moreso than facing forward.
    
    	???
    	/Kim

In part true ... but the reason for rear facing seats is that in the event
of a head on type accident (usually the more damaging) the force of the impact
is spread across the infant's back and the back of the car seat.  Because
the infant seat straps are comparatively narrow, the stress of an accident
would likely crush the ribcage because the bones at this stage are very soft.
The distributed impact across the back is less likely to cause internal
injuries.

In a rear-end collision, generally there is less impact inertia, therefore
the stresses on the rib cage are smaller and so the straps are considered
sufficient.

As the infant gets older, the bones strengthen and the risk of crushing the
ribcage decreases.  Generally this is considered to be around the time when
the infant can hold his/her head upo unassisted.

Unlike the height and weight limits, time limts like 1 year tend to be
extremely arbitrary.  With most seats, in the rear facing position at one
year many children's legs are scrunched up and is quite ridiculous, whereas
with others it is no problem.

So, use the age as a guideline, just like the ability to hold the head up,
but consider what the protection you are trying to achieve is and consider
your child's own development and you'll have a much clearer idea of the
right time to turn the seat around (and move it to the back if you've used
it in the front ... remember you should not have a forward facing car seat
in the front seat anyway!).

Stuart

    Thank you Stuart, I'm glad I read all the replies before putting in my
    two-cents worth on this one.  
    
    Very well put, I couldn't have done that well myself!
    
    BTW, when AJ was an infant the "better" of our two cars was a two
    seater, we had no choice but to put him in the front.  Fortunately we
    never had an incident or accident.  We also knew that the Dept of
    Transportation had tested the car (a Pontiac Fiero) and had rated it at
    the top of the scale for "survivability" in head on accidents.  We got
    rid of this car for a more "family style", 4 door sedan, when he was
    only a few months old.  It was necessity since the other car had
    absolutely no heat, and it was the dead of winter!
    
    Lyn

    How old should a child be before you can put them in a booster seat?
    My daughter is almost 3 and really hates her car seat. We're wondering
    when we can put her in a booster...
    
    Thanks.

    We put Ryan in one this summer, around the time he turned 3. He's
    in roughly the 75th percentile for weight and height so I felt
    comfortable doing so.  The biggest advantage to the booster seat was
    his increased ability to see out the window.
    

There are many discussions on this question (when to use a booster) ...
if you use the keyword listings you'll find them, no problems.  Suffice
it to say that age alone is NOT the criterion for moving from car seat
to booster seat.

    Thanks for the previous reply.
    
    Related notes include 217 (when to not use carseat), 315, and 945.
    
    Laura
    co-mod