Conference moira::parenting_v3

   Well, I never babysat when I was younger and making money doing odd
   jobs.  I was always into raking/shoveling/mowing/etc around the
   neighborhood.  I have no doubt that boys can do as good a job as
   girls if given the chance, but I didn't see much of that when I was
   growing up.  
   
   However, your wife does have a good point - there is a greater
   tendency for people in general to point fingers these days.  I will
   probably never again pick up an unknown hitchhiker like I used to a
   few years back for just that reason - and I would not even
   *consider* picking up a female hitchhiker.  There is just too much
   chance of being accused of, well, nearly anything.  But then in
   areas like that I tend to not trust people as much as I could..
   
   - Tom
   

    I wanted to add my opinion.....I think it is fine.  I have a younger 
    brother, he is now 13, who has been babysitting for a little over a 
    year.  He is experienced in watching children over 1 yrs old.  I am
    all for it!  I had never thought that anything could/would be 
    misinterpreted.  He babysits for my children and for my sisters 
    children.  Because he is still so young (not too young though), he
    is able to relate to them very well...more like a playmate (but has
    a great deal of responsibility, which he handles very well).
    
    I think it is an added asset for a boy to have (or girl)...If he can't
    handle it, I am sure he would say so.
    
    Well, I just thought I would share that.
    
    --Lisa

    Our favorite babysitter -- in fact, the whole neighborhood's
    favorite babysitter -- when Kat was still at the age of needing
    such things was the neighborhood paper boy.  We knew him and knew
    he was a responsible boy who was good with kids.  As .2 said he
    was much more of a playmate than most babyistters, and able to
    relate well to the kids he was watching.  The neighbor's kids
    used to bug their parents to go out so they could have Paul come
    and watch them.
    
    So boys can be every bit as good at childcare as girls.
    
    He's going to face some difficulty from the kinds of unfair
    prejudice his mother is exhibiting, though.  Most abuse does come
    from a male who's in charge of watching the child, but it's
    usually a relative, not a hired sitter.  But people are going to
    think that way, so it's not going to be as easy as it would be for
    a girl.
    
    --bonnie

	A resounding YES!!!!!!!!

	Please do encourage him to babysit.  It's good for him to get some 
experience in the "nuturing realm".  It's good for the babysittees to see a 
male in a nuturing role.  

	We just started Katie with her first "kid" babysitter.  We use a female 
only because the only kid in our small neighborhood that we know well enough,
is the right age and so on happens to be female.  When we move this summer, 
we'll be scoping out the neighborhood for likely kids of either gender.

	I wouldn't be at all concerned about the abuse aspect.  As Bonnie 
stated, the abuser is MUCH more likely to be the child's parent, step-parent,
or grandparent.

Tracey
  

I'd much rather have a boy who is interested and knowlegable babysit than
a girl who is only doing it because everybody assumes she knows how to take
care of children because she's female.  There are caring and competent
sitters of both sexes.  We should not foist our stereotypes and prejudices
on our children.

				Steve

We have an 16 year old who sits Sammy when we go to Bible study.
He's taken the baby first aid and hygene course given at a local
hospital; matter of fact, Sam cries when he left one evening
since he plays with Sam by helping Sam tumble.

He has a three year old brother and the three year old sometimes
comes over and play while he sits Sam.

I recommend that with any sitter, be sure you check them out.
Yes, there's sick people out there but are you going to spend the
rest of your life distrusting every one?

cal

   Cal,
   
   You are right, of course - its not healthy to mistrust the whole
   world.  I guess my point was that as a service provider, there is
   potential liability and, like being selective when chosing a
   babysitter, the boy (and maybe parents as well) should also be
   selective when chosing clients to work for.

   - Tom
   

    I'll only say my son's favorite sitter is a boy in the neighborhood.
    Mike is great with Sam, more into playing things that Sam wants to
    play than a girl.  I see nothing wrong with a male sitter!
    
    Kathy

We used to have one of my co-worker's sons take care of Kathryne
when she was very little (before he went off to college).  We
really liked him.  Have also left her with a friend's male 
sitter and liked him a lot, too.  He was great with her when
she got a bloody nose - he actually stripped the bed and did
the laundry!!!

My oldest brother also used to baby sit and was just great at it.

    .0 > she has heard that most cases of sexual abuse occur with 
    .0 > male babysitters. 
    
    Well, this is complete misinformation.  The great majority of abuse is
    committed by family members.  Kids are probably safer with the average
    male baby sitter than with their parents, aunts, and uncles.
    
    It clearly is possible that the boy will commit abuse, or be falsely
    accused of it.  But the chance is almost vanishingly small, and to
    shape his life on account of it would, in my opinion, be a tragic
    mistake.  There is certainly a much higher likelyhood that he will
    commit rape as an adult, or be accused of it; should parents therefore
    not raise boys at all?  I think telling him he may not babysit makes
    less sense than telling him he must not enter any building because it
    might collapse in an earthquake.
    
    		- Bruce	(who babysat as a kid, and has had several male
    			 babysitters with his own kids)

Re: .11

There's a lot more to that story from Massachusetts than it seems on the
surface.  I would be cautious about trying to generalize that particular
case.   

				Steve

    I agree with Steve.  One might as well conclude that it is dangerous to
    drive a school bus.  That case does not carry implications about male
    babysitters.

� She feels that he would be vulnerable to either doing something that would 
� be wrong, or misinterpreted. 

Ditto to all the previous replies.  Not only do I agree with the previous 
replies about the majority of abuse coming at the hands of relatives, but also 
it is a fact that there is a high correlation between abusers and victims of 
abuse.  So as for his being vulnerable to doing something wrong, that is only 
likely if he himself has been abused.

As for the second premise, that he may be misinterpreted, I think that this is 
relevant, but certainly not to the degree that it should prevent him from 
babysitting entirely.  I think babysitting for neighbors and close friends, 
etc. is a good place to start.  Because they don't start out suspicious, they 
are less likely to see things that aren't there.  It's probably a good idea 
to avoid situations that may look suspicious -- for example if there are two 
children, to avoid situations in which he is alone with only one of them 
behind a closed door; if they are old enough to go to the bathroom by 
themselves to make sure the bathroom door is shut, and the like.  

Now all this may sound paranoid to those of us enlightened folks.  But for 
the benefit of those of you not living in Massachusetts, there was a 
kidnapping her recently.  What started out as an teenager babysitting for a 
small girl appeared to grow into an unnaturally strong attraction, and 
resulted in the girl's parents being investigated for abuse (for allowing the 
relationship to happen in the first place); a restraining order to prevent the 
young man from seeing the girl; and eventually, the young man kidnaping the 
girl, who was eventually found, unharmed.  Unusual yes.  But it happened, and 
it was a major news story for several weeks.

Hope I didn't go overboard here.  I am all for encouraging your son to do 
babysitting, if he is interested and qualified.

And ditto to the many replies that have had very good experiences with male 
babysitters.  My son even once had a male daycare "teacher".

re: .1

�   I will
�   probably never again pick up an unknown hitchhiker like I used to a
�   few years back for just that reason [being accused of abuse] - and I would 
�   not even *consider* picking up a female hitchhiker.  

I agree with the result, but not the reason.  I'm more concerned with what 
they might do to me rather than what I might be accused of doing to them.

Clay   

�There's a lot more to that story from Massachusetts than it seems on the
�surface.  I would be cautious about trying to generalize that particular
�case.   

�    I agree with Steve.  One might as well conclude that it is dangerous to
�    drive a school bus.  That case does not carry implications about male
�    babysitters.


re: .12, .13

Sorry for some very imprecise wording.  I agree with you both that there was 
much more to the Massachusetts kidnaping story than just the fact that the 
alleged kidnaper was once a babysitter.  And I tried to emphasize in the 
remainder of my note that I thought boys ought to be encouraged to do 
babysitting, and parents ought to be encouraged to hire them.

Even if what was shown to us by the media was all there was, to use this 
incident as a reason for not using a male babysitter is as illogical as 
isolating a child from all adult relatives because most abuse is perpetrated 
by adult relatives.  

What I am saying is this.  A prudent person is aware of the environment within 
which s/he operates.  It's fine for us to say that many suspicions and 
feelings that people have are irrational, but it's foolish to ignore that 
they might exist.  Sometimes being aware of why prejudices exist can help
us overcome them, or at least minimize the risk that _we_ will be harmed by 
the prejudices.  If there are routine precautions that a person can take that 
do not jeopardize the ability to do a good job of babysitting, and which are 
not pandering to paranoia, then they should be taken.  I think that there are 
such precautions available.


Clay   

    My son is 13.  He has been babysitting for 2 years now.  Repeat and new
    customers.  People pay him very well, so I assume that they are pleased
    with his services.  He even changes diapers [I don't do that!].
    
    ed
    

Re: .14

I noticed that you reentered .11, so the comments that follow it may
not all be relevant.  However, in the case you mention, I believe that it
was not just a simple case of a teenage boy babysitter becoming obsessed
with the little girl.  The details of the story that I read made me wonder
if perhaps the teenager was actually the girl's father.  A lot of the
details just didn't fit otherwise.  But this is just speculation on my
part.

					Steve

    In re: .16
    
    I never saw anything suggesting he was the father.  On the other hand,
    it was pretty clear that he was infatuated with the mother, and had
    fantasies of himself as the husband/father in the family.  There was
    also no suggestion of any sexual abuse.  Finally, as I recall, he was
    not a teenager, but in his 20s.
    
    		- Bruce

    I live in Milford, MA (where the family lived and the kidnapping
    occured).  There was MUCH speculation that Kenneth Cole was the
    father of the Nicole.  It was never determined if an affair did
    occur, but it is true that the mother and father had been
    separated for a period of time.  Kenneth Cole is in his 20's.
    For the record, the family recently moved away to start their
    life over.
    
    Back to the original subject...(just had to add my 2 cents worth)
    
    I wouldn't be opposed to having a boy babysit for Steven.  In
    fact we have lots of 13-14 yr old boys in our neighborhood.  I
    never gave that much thought before this topic appeared.
    
    Linda 

Let's please stay on the specific topic of boy babysitters.

        Thanks,

             Carol dB, PARENTING co-mod

    Both of my older sons have baby sat, both for their own
    siblings and for other kids.
    
    They also know how to change diapers, tho I remember having to
    direct one of my sons over the phone on how to fasten a 
    disposible properly.
    
    My oldest is about to be a father, and I think that his years
    of baby sitting will have served him in good stead.
    
    Bonnie

    We have 2 sitters, a 13 year old girl and a 13 year old boy. They're
    both great with the kids. Both love to play Nintendo when the kids 
    are asleep. Both know how to whip up great PB+J's. Both eat us house
    and home, and neither one puts his/her dirty cups in the sink. AARG!
    
    Anyway, as the Blue Bonnet Margarine add says,"No Differaaance".
    
    Kate

    	I did alot of babysitting as a teenager.  It is a great way
    	to earn money and learn responsibility.
    
    	Male babysitters are especially good for households with little
    	boys.  They relate to the male babysitters.  My style was to 
    	play with the kids more than simply sit them down in front of
    	the TV.  Sometimes the evenings were quite exhausting, and might
    	have been too strenuous for a girl babysitter to do the same thing.
    	But in many cases, I was the sitter of choice for many of the
    	families I sat.
    
    	BTW, roughousing with the kids sure made it easy to put them
    	to bed once they were exhausted!  I don't know why it doesn't 
    	work for my kids today...
    
    	Joe Oppelt

   I dunno Joe... was it a factor if your kids being different from
   the kids you sat for... or is it a factor of stamina... :-)
   
   - Tom (who can't shovel snow as long as he used to be able to either...)

    	re .23
    
    	I'm sure it is alot of different factors.  (I didn't really
    	ask that question seriously...)
    
    	One factor is that I think I was more tolerant and had more
    	patience when I was a teen than I do now.
    
    	Another is that "familiarity breeds contempt."  My kids are 
    	certainly more familiar with me than were the kids for whom
    	I babysat.
    
    	Also, kids today are just plain-and-simple more rotten than 
    	were the kids when I was a teen.  :^)
    
    	Joe Oppelt

    I think your biggest risk is general liability.  I can't think of a
    situation which requires more responsibility/liability risk for a
    person to take on than caring for anothers child. To have ones'
    child take on that responsibility is asking alot of the child. I
    agree that some kids are perfectly capable of caring for others' kids
    in a responsible way.  But, look at the jams ADULTS get into: Fires,
    falls, abuse etc etc. I don't think I would be comfortable with my
    son sitting for others unless I was extremely comfortable with both
    his level of responsibility and knew the kids he would be sitting for
    well enough to appreciate what he was taking on.  Even then I would
    be a bit nervous given todays' finger pointing lawsuit oriented
    environment.   

Just based on my own personal fears, I probably would not ask a boy to
babysit for my daughter - ESPECIALLY when she cannot communicate with me
and tell me if he touched her somewhere he shouldn't have.

However, I always look for boys FIRST, to babysit for my step-sons.  They
like to play outdoors, shoot baskets, ride bikes, etc., and I think an
older boy is the perfect fit to keep up with them.

I would not even allow my 11-yr-old step-son to babysit my daugher, even
though he is extremely responsible and adores her.  Neither parent has ever
talked with him about sexual awareness, and he seems too "curious" about Kati.
He is always whistling or making comments when her diaper is off, and he
often stares at her when her diaper/clothes are off.   Just curiosity, I'm
sure - but I would hate for him to adventure while I'm not there!

If any of the boys wanted to babysit and the parents were comfortable with
them, I don't think there would be any problems with it.

Kristen

    My boys are now three and five and are asking if I know of any boys who
    would want to babysit them.  Unfortunately, I am rather new in my
    neighborhood and don't know of any boys who are in their early teens.
    
    I am all for the qualified/trustworthy babysitter and that has nothing
    to do with gender.
    
    -sandy
    
    

    If you have a newspaper boy, ask him if he babysits or knows of other
    boys who do!