Conference moira::parenting

There is a theory that you should never just leave without saying goodbye 
because then they learn that you could just abandon them at any time and it 
undermines their security.   

Take it for what you will, but personally, we never leave without letting our 
daughter know, because we don't want her to think we'd just disappear when she 
turned her back.  

Sounds like your parents are your only day-care providers, so you don't have 
the usual drop-her-off scenario.    In that case, I'd probably focus on a 
routine.  Pick certain phrases that you will use consistenty, "Mommy is going 
to work today and grandma and grandpa are coming over to stay with you today", 
"mommy is leaving for work soon, but I will see you as soon as I get home 
from work".   Then use each a specific amount of time before you leave (maybe 
the first when you're dressing her, the second 15 minutes before you leave, 
whatever).    

Then set up a routine for leaving.  They come over, they get her involved in 
something (this is key), you say "mommy is leaving for work now, I will see 
you when i get home", give her a hug, and a kiss, and leave.   Don't go back 
if she cries, that will only tell her that she can get you to come back 
through crying.     if you stick a routine consistently, it should stop over 
time (between her getting used to it and growing out of the glue phase).   
Settle on a phrase they will use with her when she asks for you (like "mommy 
is at work, and she will see you as soon as she gets home", or whatever).  

Just my two cents. 
Good luck. 

    nancy,
    
    I know the tears are tough, but I have always said goodbye to my kids
    so they know I say goodbye and don't just disappear.  the exception to
    this is Atlehi, as I leave for work before 5:45 and she generally wakes
    up around 7:30-8:00.  However, we have cuddle time from about 4:00am to
    about 5 or so, while she nurses and then she curls up with Frank and goes
    back to sleep.  
    
    the tears come and go, there will be times as she gets older when she
    won't even wave or act like she cares you are leaving, and othertimes
    when she will try to weld herself do your leg so you can't leave.  8
    months is sort of a wierd time around that.
    
    enjoy her and good luck.
    
    meg

Hmmm.... 8 months old sounds about the right time for this...
I didn't have too many mornings like this, but I did feel
sad even though Noelle *loved* her sitter.  I don't think
I resorted to sneaking out on her though I was tempted!
As I recall, this was just a phase that we passed through
pretty quickly.  

What if you said your good-bye to her when you got her out
of her crib in the morning.  Something like:

"Good morning, honey.  I'm not leaving right now, but
I want to give you a good-bye hug and kiss now.  

And maybe give her 2 hugs and kisses (one for good morning
and the other for good bye.)  Then do your normal morning routine.
Tell your parents what you did so that they can remind her that you
did say good-bye if she does happen to miss you.  I didn't try
this, so I don't even know if it would have worked on my munchkin...

Another thing you might try is giving her her good-bye hug and kiss
and asking if she wants to play peek-a-boo at the door.  I still
do this with my daughter every morning.  After popping my head
up a few times, I blow her a kiss.  She blows one back and
I'm off.

- Deb B.

    I can remember when my nephew was growing up.  He threw such
    hissy fits when his mom was leaving that she eventually started
    the Casper method, that is - disappearing.
    
    My mom finally talked to her because she started noticing that
    whenever my nephew was playing or around his mom, he was periodi-
    cally looking over his shoulder to be sure she was still there,
    or wouldn't go far from her to keep her from leaving.  My mom
    got a little worried and feeling sorry for him and had my sister
    work it out other ways.   Deal with his hysterics rather than
    his insecurity.
    
    Of course, now he's sixteen, loves his mom to death, but can't
    get far enough away from her :-)
    
    						cj *->

    A couple of things I've learned:

    When the child starts crying, don't try to soothe them before
    leaving - let the care provider deal with that.  Do the kiss and a
    hug, "bye, bye, I'll see you this afternoon" (or whatever your
    routine is), then GO!  (and cry quietly to yourself in your car :)
    As an earlier reply said, having the care provider help out with
    this transition is essential (distraction, comfort, etc.).

    This won't work for an 8-month-old, but a ritual that is used
    at my son's preschool is for the child to push the parent out the
    door.  The kids think this is very funny, and since it gives them
    some feeling of control over the situation, they can deal with it
    better.

    Having the care provider help the child wave bye-bye to you from
    the window or door also seems to help sometimes.

    The crying almost always is over quickly (in a few minutes or less).
    It sometimes helped me to call the care provider when I got to work,
    for reassurance that my child had settled down quickly and was now
    having a great time.

    I firmly believe that sneaking out is a bad idea.  I (try to)
    *never* lie to my kids.  To me, this is in the same category.
    Some of this goes back to stuff from my own childhood that I swear
    I will never subject my kids to (I also fanatically avoid sarcasm,
    belittling, etc. for the same reasons).  In addition to those
    emotional reasons, I also think that sneaking out is setting you up
    for trouble later ("Mommy might sneak out, so I don't dare let her
    out of my sight/grasp").

    (Meg, the "glued to your leg" stage is so much fun, eh?  My youngest is
    nearly 5 years old, and I think we're *nearly* done with that.)

							cheryl

    cheryl
    
    don't mean to pop your bubble, but around 8 years, both my kids that
    have gotten to this age went into a "denver boot stage again.  it is
    tough with a 5-yer-old sitting on a foot with her arms wrapped around
    your leg, but dragging around with a 50-70 pound ball and chain of a
    daughter is another stoy.
    
    meg

    uh-oh.  My oldest will be 8 in December.  Thanks for the warning.

						cheryl

    My sister did the "Casper" thing, too (I love that phrase!). Her kids
    constantly check on her now - always yelling "MOM", and making up
    some silly reason why they wanted her. They are 6 and 4 now.  It's very
    annoying...
    I was always very matter-of-fact with David, giving him a quick hug and
    kiss and a "bye-bye".  He never really fussed much, because he was
    always dropped off at a wonderfully fun place that he really enjoyed.
    Sometimes I wish he would, just once, ask me to stay home with him! But
    I trade that little bit of ego-damage for a happy, smiling child
    when I leave for work : )  BTW, he's 5 now.
    Sarah

    I've been through this at various times, with both my children.
    
    Our sitter, who is now our 3rd grandmother casually mentioned 
    during one such incident that Katie stopped crying normally 
    about when I reached the car.  So the next day, I walked out as
    usual, and snuck around the back where she couldn't see me,
    sure enough she was happily playing, less than 2 minutes after 
    I left the door!  I've seen it with a number of the children
    at our sitter, by the time the parent reaches their car, the child
    has forgotten all about being upset.
    
    Good luck, this one gets to me every time it starts happening,
    surely adds to working-Mom guilt.

We also went through the same thing that you described with our son.
He is now 13 months old and we have someone that comes to our house too.
He started with this sitter when he was about 8/9 months, and he always 
cried when his father or I left.  He is doing much better now, he hardly
cries at all. We always say bye bye and hug him, even though it would be
easier not to have to deal with the crying and quilt.  The only times we 
leave without saying bye is when he is still sleeping, but it doesn't 
happen too often.  I used to stay behind the door listening to him to 
see how long he would cry and believe me it was just for a few minutes 
and then I could hear him babbling whatever he was trying to say.

With my 4 1/2 year old daughther it is almost the opposite now, she even
asks us when we are leaving so she can play barbie and house with the 
sitter (I guess it helps that our sitter is only 20 years old and very
energetic).

  --Cida

    
    How's this cut on it .... When I bring Jonathan into daycare, he's
    fine, happy as a bee.  Then when I say "Good Bye", he does the
    weld-to-me thing.  I swear he'd climb right up on top of my head if he
    thought it might stop me from leaving.
    
    So, I try to find a toy or something to interest him, and then when
    he's interested, I pull the casper routine.  He cries for about 20
    seconds.  He cries longer if I make a point of letting him know that
    I'm leaving 'right now'.
    
    It's a great way to start a day .... he's not the only one that feels
    like I abandon him!! )-:
    
    

Whenever we need to leave Josh (2 1/2) somewhere, he asks for a big hug
("Ooooohhh...") and a kiss ("<smack>" -- sound effects are very important) and
then he's set.  This is true if we are leaving him for the day at day care, or
if one of us is going shopping, or even if he is in his seat in the back seat
of the car and I'm getting into the front seat.  The consistent routine is very
helpful.  It's a bit of an annoyance for the diddly times (leaving the room or
going to the other seat of the car), but I'll put up with that in exchange for
pleasant partings at day care, etc.

						Brian

    Hi Brian,
    
    I kind of chuckled to myself with the picture you created.  I
    can just see me in a restaurant or store or someplace where I
    see a couple OOOoohh and smack their little one so they can
    move to another seat.  I see me rolling my eyes like "oh come
    on".  But you know, being a mother now and reading these notes
    gives a whole other perspective.
    
    Hey if it works....right?  I'll probably remember exactly that
    same note someday when I'm trying just about ANYTHING to get 
    Angeline to a decent "goodbye".   Right now it's a non-issue.
    She's only 6 1/2 months and loves to go to daycare.  Although,
    I do once in a while see her getting upset when she knows I'm
    leaving, but it is very brief and very infrequent.  I probably
    see it more when she's home at my house.  She just knows when
    I start up into a higher gear that I/We are about to go out
    and if she doesn't want me to go, or she doesn't want to go 
    with me - she gets a little worked up.
    
    						cj *->
    			      	

    When we were kids we always *had* to let my mom (or whoever was in 
    charge at the time) know that we were leaving, where to & an indication 
    of when we would be returning.  When I first got married, my husband 
    would just leave.  It didn't just annoy me, but left me feeling very 
    uneasy.  Of course, rules were laid down after that, and that applies to
    informing our 13mth old also.  We started him at day-care when he was
    10 months, bang in the middle of his stranger anxiety phase.  It was
    terrible initially, but right from the beginning we followed the same 
    routine while dropping him off - put away all his things, talk to the
    teacher-in-charge, put him down or give him to her, kiss, and bye-bye.
    He still occasionally cries, but it doesn't even last till I reach the 
    door.  If I make the mistake of going back, for anything, the next few
    days are miserable, 'cos I guess he expects I am going to come back
    or whatever, he cries louder & longer.  It happened only once though,
    when I forgot something and had to go back.  After that, unless its
    something really important, I don't bother going back.
    
    -Sadhana

    My son (now 5) has always been a cling on.  Every morning he would cry
    when I left him at the sitters (still does on occasion).  When he was
    4, I innocently said "I have to go, are you going to kick me out?". 
    Kids take things literally.  He, and all the other kids, thought it
    would be neat to kick mom out.  So starting that morning, as I walked
    out the door, I left the bottom of my foot on the doorstep and each of
    the kids kicks it.  We have since changed daycares and...all the kids
    at the new day care kick me out.  Most days they (my kids and the
    others) look forward to me leaving so they can give me the boot.  It is
    a pain at times since both he and my 3 year old have expanded it to
    whenever I leave the house, but it's better than the tears.
    
    Rhonda

    It's interesting reading all these replies.  I guess I have just been
    blessed with 2 of the most independent beings in the world.  My 2
    oldest (both girls) have been in daycare since a very early age which
    I'm sure helps and I do remember some anxiety with both of them at
    around 8-12 months (that was a LONG time ago as they're now 7.5 and 5)
    but other than a brief look of anxiety - I always got the feeling they
    wanted me to leave.  
    
    In fact, at about age 2 or so, when all the kids in daycare were
    wailing about their mommies leaving, mine would always ask me what they
    were crying about - when I Explained it to them, they'd give me this
    funny look and say "Well, they're coming back aren't they??".  Other
    mothers constantly comment on how independent they are.  While this is
    really nice, I often wish I was more "needed" by them.  I also don't
    know what has made them so independent (except for the fact that we
    work very hard to make them feel very very secure - but I'm sure others
    do this also)
    
    I have however, addressed the issue of "being needed" by having another
    little one (now 2.5 months).  He is already in day care and loves it
    (of course at 2.5 months, the anxiety hasn't hit yet - we have yet to
    see what he will be like at the "separation anxiety" stage).  One thing
    I have learned is that they're ALL different (and WONDERFUL) and even
    though they may be very independent they do need their mommy (I just
    sometimes have to remind them of this and will probably continue to
    right up through their twenties!!).
    
    Kids are great!!
    
    Cindy

    Is she old enough to close the door after you ? My daughter likes to be
    involved...gives her a sense of control..she used to close to the door.