Conference moira::parenting

    
    Hmm, flat feet maybe?!

See topic 667 of Parenting_V3 for a discussion of "Growing Pains."

See note 9.21 of this notesfile if you need help accessing Parenting_V3.

Clay 

    Doesn't sound like it fits the classic symptoms that usually fit
    the desription "growing pains".  I think I'd want to be seeing a
    Doctor that specializes in orthopaedics fairly soon if it doesn't
    stop ... (speaking of which, it's time I took my knee to the doc too
    our gp "specialises" in orthopaedics and regulaarly assists an
    orthopaedic surgeon) ... but we are just a little far away to be
    helpful to you in Ottawa!
    
    Stuart

    I read all the replies in V3 on Growing Pains.  Most of them seem to
    deal with kids having pain at night.  Marc doesn't have any problem at
    night (yet, anyway).  It always while he's moving.  From watching, it
    looks like he actually steps down "wrong" and hurts his knee somehow.  
    I don't know.  I'll keep an eye on it.
    
    Re: .1  What would flat feet have to do with it?

    
    I have flat feet and can end up with knee pains and back pains and yet
    have no pains in my feet.  I know when the sneakers I wear need inserts
    or replacement when my knees or back start hurting.  Does he/she (I
    forget) have an arch??
    
    Chris D.

    From my reading of the base note these are sudden spasmodic pains ...
    not the growing kinds of pains normally caused by walking too long
    on flat feet and so on.
    
    I wonder if the knee joint has been damaged and occasionally,
    for example while running, it pops out of place and causes the pain.
    If so, I'd be inclined to get some sort of knee support just to
    take some of the stress off the knee.
    
    Stuart

I wouldn't worry about flat feet if I were you.  All toddlers have them and
part of learning to walk is to build their arches.   If this were an older
child, I'd look into that possibility, but not for a toddler.

Actually, my 13 year old often complains about knees but I do chalk this up
to growing pains (he's growing 5-10 cm a year).  He plays a lot of sports
(action equivalent to your toddler?) so I usually tell him to give it a rest
when his knees or ankles hurt.  Difficult with a toddler.

But talk to an orthopaedist if you feel there's a problem.

Cheryl

    
    My daughter (2 years 4 months) does much the same.  Her pain is so
    severe sometimes that she limps.  She can scream (yes scream) in pain
    for 30 minutes or until the Tylenol takes affect.  It is pretty tough
    to take (for me that is).  
    
    We have been to the pediatrician who saw the limping and had x-rays 
    taken.  It took 3 people to hold her down while she lay screaming in
    pain.  Not the most fun I've ever had!  
    
    The x-rays showed perfectly developing legs.  All joints and bones were
    perfect.  Diagnosis: growing pains.  
    
    I notice that if the weather is rainy or cold she is apt to have more
    pains that day. If it is a nice sunny day; she never complains.
    
    Our doctor told me that growing pains can act very much like arthritis,
    which she was checked for also and doesn not have.   He meant that 
    arthritis acts up when the weather is damp.  Sure holds true for us.
    
    I try warm baths, rubbing with baby oil, tylenol and lots of hugs and
    kisses until the pain subsides. 
    
    Good luck and I hope you don't have to go through the x-rays!
    
    Rose Marie

>                     -< Flat feet are normal in a toddler >-

>I wouldn't worry about flat feet if I were you.  All toddlers have them and
>part of learning to walk is to build their arches.
>
>Cheryl

Cheryl,

Do you really mean all toddlers or most? My daughter at 3 months has very
defined arches. Are you telling me by the time she starts walking her arches 
will invert to the point of flat?

It is quite possible that your three month old's feet will go flat when she
puts weight on them.  (Almost :-) all toddlers have flat feet.  Just look at
the swimming pool at the imprints those little feet leave.  For a baby,
walking on the arches is supposed to help them form.

Alas, it didn't do much for me :-)  I just had to have both feet operated to 
reconstruct the front arch.  My younger boy has the same problem as does my
mother and several of my sisters.

Cheryl

    
    Are you satisfied with your pediatrician's diagnosis? If not, then ask
    for a referral to a specialist. I know of a great pediatric
    orthopedist at UMass in Worcester. It may be growing pains, or it may
    be something more serious. It's better to fix it now than have problems
    later in life.
    
    Chris
    

    Thanks for all the input.  What we've decided to do for now is to stop
    allowing Marc to jump off everything in sight :-) figuring it was
    putting too much strain on little knees and see if the problem goes
    away.  We haven't seen any recurrence for the past few days, but if it
    comes back, we'll get it checked further.

    One other warning:  If your children sit on their legs with their knees
    bent (as a lot of children do especially at dinner to reach the table)k
    that could be causing a lot of pain in the knees.  It happened to my
    girlfriend's son, they went to a few doctor's before one told them this
    and he never had a problem after they stopped him from sitting that
    way.
    

    Yeah, Kat got warned about the knee problems, but no doctor ever
    said anything about muscle tone or improper posture.  
    
    --bonnie

Just a note about flat feet and knee pain:  I get occasional sharp pains in one
knee or the other and have gotten this all of my life.  It used to happen about
once a month, and would hurt a bit from 5-30 minutes or so.  Sometimes it would
hurt a lot; other times only a little. 

Recently it has been worse, and I ended up in physical therapy.  One of the
problems is flat feet.  I never knew I had flat feet, because I could always
see an arch (as someone said earlier, you lose the arch when you put weight
on the foot).  Nor did I know what problems could be related to flat feet.

My pain is getting less frequent now (it got to be where it hurt solidly for
2 weeks), and I now have inserts in my shoes.  I can't say what the basenoter's
child's problem is, but I would say that sporadic, sharp pain does not rule out 
flat feet being a cause.

      Carol