Conference moira::parenting

    Hi.  We went a little overboard last year and got Jackie a wooden
    swing set with a slide and "club house".. this was for her first 
    birthday.  I'm real glad we got a wooden one.  It does not rust nor
    when she swings "high" does it move around.  It also does not need any
    sort of anchor.  She has always liked the slide and can pretty much
    climb up to get to it herself.  She likes the clubhouse also but we
    don't let her climb up by herself or play on the set unsupervised (she
    is almost 2).  It was a kit that we purchased and it came with the wood
    and directions, and it was not that difficult to put together, although
    it can not be assembled by just one person.
    
    Mary
    

    We have a metal one that is made by Flexible Flyer.  We think it is
    somewhat cheaply constructed, but wasn't cheap!  The quality seems fine
    as we use it, but it wasn't the easiest to put together and the company
    didn't use Phillips type screws to make it any easier.
    
    It has a slide (my daughter uses this daily), two swings--one we put a
    baby swing on, a lawn swing, and a see-saw.  By the way, the slide is
    plastic, so doesn't get hot in the sun.  We like this feature.
    
    She uses all of the pieces at this point.  The lawn swing is nice, but
    still requires our pushing it.  Gina is just 2, and will probably learn
    to  use her body to swing the lawn swing at some point.  We got the
    swing set for her first birthday.  Last summer we mostly used the swing
    and the slide.
    
    My neighbors have a nice wooden structure that we sometimes use.  I
    like it a lot.  We wanted to save on costs, and went with the metal
    one.
    
    judy

    Re: .2
    So far, we have had no splintering problem with the wood set.  
    
    Our slide is also plastic with a "wave" in the middle.  I also like the
    plastic feature (we had a choice) for the same reasons as you.. it
    doesn't get hot.
    
    Mary
    

    We bought a swing set last spring when our daughters were 3.5 and 1.  I
    was into "cheap"; my husband's approach was much more extravagant.  He
    won and we got a name brand wooden swing set.  
    
    While I hate to admit it, the old boy was right.  The set has been used
    *regularly* since we got it.  It's a nice set, there are no splinters,
    and it keeps the kids occupied for hours.  We are very satisfied with
    the set and the way our kids have utilized it.  
    
    Our set has a slide and a house (or what the swing folks call a climbing
    tower).  It also has the usual single swings, a double swing, and a
    trapezee (for which we have subtituted a baby swing).
    
    Good luck with you research.  If you order the wooden swing catalogs
    you'll realize you can drop a *bundle* on this stuff.
    
    Have fun,
    LZP
      

If you're really handy, you can build your own.  J�rgen built one out of
very sturdy poles with two swings, a climbing rope, a tower with a house in
the bottom part and a fort on the top from which a slide (also hand made)
descended.  It was definitely a "big kids" set since the top of the slide was
over two meters in the air.  The poles were pounded about 75cm into the
ground and, between that and the A-frame construction on the other end, 
the entire set was extremely sturdy.  He used no nails.  Everything was bolted
together.  The poles were weatherized and then heavily treated with an
outdoor laquer which eliminated splinters.

I wanted wood figuring that, when we were done with it we could burn it rather
than having to deal with a rusty hulk.  In the end, it was such a sturdy
construction that we managed to sell it to one of the local villages for a
public playground.

If anyone wants the plans, I could draw them up and send them to you.  Send me
mail.

One thing I did do.  We had lots of little kids in the neighborhood at the 
time and this swing set made our house THE PLACE TO BE.  I went to each child's
parents and asked them if their children were allowed to play on the set.
Most had no problem but one mother said no.  I felt really bad for the child
who would stand enviously on the side watching the other kids (we supervised
in any case) but no way was I going to have that kind of problem with the
neighbors.

In the end, one or two kids fell off from time to time with really nothing
more than a damaged ego and we had hours of enjoyment from the set.

It cost about SF 400 in material to bid (I guess thats about $260).  We sold it
for about what we paid for it.

Cheryl

   For those of you who have/have-had swing sets of any kind, how long
   do the kids really make strong use of them ??  We haven't been in
   a place that could have anything like this until now, but since my
   son is going on 8 yrs old, I'm wondering if it's worth the investment.

   Any input ?
   Debbi J

           <<< Note 117.6 by FSOA::DJANCAITIS "to risk is to live" >>>
                               -< age question >-

<   a place that could have anything like this until now, but since my
<   son is going on 8 yrs old, I'm wondering if it's worth the investment.

    Debbi,

Our 7.5 year old still plays on the swingset *if* his friends are over
and interested (never longer than 1/2 hour per session though.  

He has a wooden set with a playhouse mounted on top.  
They rarely play in the playhouse {I thought they would love it}.
Probably about twice per week when the weather is good.

Our 2 year old plays on the set every time she heads into the backyard.
Maybe she'll like the playhouse????

Thanks,
Rochelle

Two people sent and asked me for the plans for the swing set.  I finally got
them drawn up but only managed to find one of the names.  If I didn't send you
mail today (July 1), then you're the one I lost.  Please resend me your name
and I'll send the plans.

Cheryl

    We're interested in a 3-position swing, slide, climbing tower (not
    house) sort of arrangement which doesn't need concrete anchors.
    
    Anyone have experience with specific name-brands, like:
    
    Child life	$650 and up
    Cedar works (Maine) $800 and up, plus shipping
    Creative Playthings $350 and up
    Outback - available in Framingham MA at Norton Fence
    Others?
    
    Seems like a LOT of money to pay for a basic swing set w/climbing
    tower, but, most of the comments in this note favor the wood sets.  Are
    these sets really worth this kind of money?  
    
    Thanks.

    We bought ours at Sommerville lumber.  The kit included the lumber, two
    swings and a trapeze for about $100.00.  This year my husband went back
    and bought the slide (89.00) and he built the "house" himself.  It's
    not quite as fancy (no roof!), but the kids love the slide.
    
    I would say total cost (including extra lumber needed for slide area) was
    about$250.00.
    
    Joyce
    

    We got a Sommerville Lumber set (the bottom-of-the-line one, two
    swings, trapeeze and we added a baby swing in the option slot)
    for about $140.  I really like the fact that it's "playground"
    lumber with the rounded edges and sanded faces.  Alex and
    Susanna like it a lot--Alex calls it "our park".
    
    It took me and a friend about 15 person-hours to put together, and
    we only made two mistakes, both recoverable.  I'd be a good bit 
    faster if I had to do another, and I wouldn't make those particular
    mistakes twice!
    
    The kit was complete--with the exception of nails, where I ran out
    about half way (they gave me one pound of the smaller nails, and the
    set clearly required almost two pounds).  Do this on a day when the
    hardware store is open!
    
    Hints:
    
    1.	Predrill the nail holes for the large (16d) nails.
    
    2.	Nail or tack-nail the braces in _before_ you drill the holes 
    	for the carriage bolts, to make sure you make the holes in
    	the right places.
    
    3.	Even if your bit is long, there's an advantage to drilling
    	bolt holes from both sides: they'll start and end at the
    	right places (can you tell what one of the mistakes was?).
    
    4.	Be sure to read carefully--don't use the big nails where they
    	say to use the small ones (this is the other mistake).
    
    5.	A good drill bit will drill right through a nail, so though
    	you should try hard to drill where the nails aren't, don't
    	be shy about using brute force (just sweep up the filings,
    	which are both sharp and hot).  If you're desparate, it'll 
    	also drill through the metal brace, but a chisel would be 
    	better.
    
    6.	Don't even start this unless you have a power drill.  Having
    	only a hand saw is survivable, having only a hand drill 
    	probably isn't.
    
    		-John Bishop

    I am looking to buy a good wooden swingset. Any recommendations on
    what is good and safe? and the best place to buy them?
    
    Sanjeev (MR4DEC::AGGARWAL)

    We just bought one from B.J.'s Wholesale Club, made by Creative Playthings.
    It seemed to be a great deal, at $270.  
    
    It includes space for 3 swings (includes 2 sling type swings and a 
    trapeze with rings).  It has an 8" plastic "wave" slide, a small platform 
    with a canopy, lots of wooden ladders, an overhead climber (not sure what 
    that's called, but basically a horizontal ladder), a rope/wooden ladder 
    (wood dowel treads), and a climbing rope.  It's made of pressure-treated 
    lumber, main supports are 2" x 6", others are 2" x 4".  The lumber is
    well-smoothed (no splintering), and the hardware is recessed (no
    finger-catching).  These were things that we were told to look out for.
    
    I don't know whether they still have them in stock, but I suspect that
    they'll be restocking, if they're out (they had 11 left when we bought
    ours a couple of weeks ago).  Also, Creative Playthings is in Framingham.
    
    Leslie

    
    That sounds like a great swingset!!! My question is should I buy
    something that elaborate for my soon to be 2-year old. I would like
    to buy her a swingset of some kind for her birthday. My fear is that if
    I buy something like you described she'll be climbing up the top and
    fall. She could climb up the ladder of the neighbors swingset (the old
    standard metal type) and go down the slide before winter came, i.e.,
    before she was 18 months old. I guess I'm just looking for opinions
    on "buy small now and graduate to larger later" or "buy large now and
    be extra cautious about watching her". This does not imply that I
    wouldn't watch her on a smaller/simpler set, but you all know toddlers
    and what they can accomplish in the blink of an eye. Thanks for any
    input.
    
    Patty

    Well, we bought ours for our 15-month-old-tomorrow son!  I'm sure we'll
    have to keep a constant eye (and a few hands at times) on him, but I'm
    sure he'll love it.  He has mastered our 6' ladder at home, and loves
    climbing up and down it, and he loves the slide, too.
    
    Leslie

I built a swingset/slide/rope/overhead climber/Eagle's nest complex that sounds
very similar to what was described in .13. The one addition that we made was to
include an extended sandbox.

We built the swingset when my son was only 2 yrs. but figured that we would 
"build big". It's payed off. We have a 5 yr. old son and a 2 yr. old daughter
and they both love it.

The kit that we bought included the plans, all hardware (excepts nails), and a
parts list for how much lumber/nails to buy. I think the whole thing came to
~$250 (including delivery).

The swingset has 4 "slots". We put in two regular swings, one infant seat, and
one slot for a glider (a 2 kid swing where they sit back to back, a real
favorite of the kids). 

The Eagle's nest (a raised platform with a canvass "roof") sits right next to
the swingset. The overhead climber and rope comes off the back of it and a 
slide off the front. I built ladders on both the front and back. The sandbox 
sits under the Eagles nest.

Like a couple of notes back, our swingset is the neighborhood congregating
spot. I put in a couple park benches beside it to accomodate all the moms/dads
that come over. Kids that play on it either have their parents with them or
have explicit permission to play on it. No exceptions (I don't like to get
sued).

Make sure you know the way the the ER. Unfortunately, we've had 2 broken bones.
My son dropped off the overhead ladder and broke his foot (while I was standing
2 ft. away) and a neighbor kid broke a collar bone dropping off the same
overhead ladder (with his mom standing right next to him). We do our best to
watch them but kids get wild and it's hard to focus on them 100% of the time.

Some building notes: 

1. Pre-cut all your lumber.

2. Have a helper. My father-in-law was a carpenter as a youth and was a 
*great* help. He let me do most of the work and only corrected me when I was
ready to screw-up big-time.

3. I used my portable router to round off the corners off all lumber. We
haven't had a splinter yet (in 4 years).

4. Put weatherproofing on it every year. Our's still looks new. I've seen
others where they didn't and the wood ages rapidly (even though its treated).

5. I built in handholds for kids coming up the ladder to the Eagles's nest. The
little ones need it.

6. I cleared out all the grass around it (was getting worn out) and put in some
mulch (layered it thick). Makes for better padding.

Bruce

    We're shopping for a swingset for our 2� year old daughter.  We've more
    or less narrowed it down to a Rainbow wooden set (2 swings, angled
    ladders, scoop safety slide, overhead ladder, clubhouse, sandbox) that is 
    made of redwood ($1900) or an ordinary metal model that costs about $150 and
    includes 2 swings, a lawn swing, slide, and glider.
    
    Any opinions as to whether it will be worth spending almost $2000 for
    a gorgeous well-constructed set or $150 for a normal metal one that
    theoretically could be replaced each year and still cost less?
    
    When I was young, I lived on my swing, unless I was on my bike. 
    However, I notice the kids in our neighborhood don't seem to be on 
    theirs swings very often.
    
    Opinions welcome here or to bigq::watson.
    
    Thanks,
    Robin

Instead of spending that kind of money though, we bought the kit and
the wood and built it ourselves for about 1/4th the cost.  I like the 
sturdiness of it.

My three year could live on his swing set (climber and slide included)
and his friend comes over and that's all the two of them play on.  I guess
I really like it because there's no protruding edges (although I haven't
look at metal sets lately) and the pieces are big enough and sturdy enough
that they can really climb all over it.

My husband took the extra effort to sand it smooth and round out the
edges before I treated the wood so splinters and sharp corners were not
a problem.

I had a metal swing set as a kid, and I remember as we got older we
were able to swing hard enough that the whole set came close to falling
over.  Rust was a wicked problem, it was my dad's spring ritual to scrape
it down and treat it each year :-)

Of course, if for any reason we wanted to move the swingset to another
location, we're really in for a job, but we enjoyed putting the thing 
together as well as seeing him enjoy it so much.

We went for a wooden one, but my husband designed and built it from scratch,
so it didn't cost anywhere near what you've been quoted.  It's got
4 swing stations where we have 2 regular swings and 2 baby swings, an 8'x8'
sandbox with the corner seats underneath a platform from which the 10'
slide comes down, and another swing station where we have the twin swing
now, but will replace that with a tire swing when they get older.  My
husband made the ladder up to the platform and slide with flat rungs that
are more like steps instead of round rungs which are much easier for the
kids to climb on.  And this year, he's planning to build out over the
ladder with an overhead climbing area (what do they call those things --
jungle gym?).  I got some canvas and made a canopy for the platform and
a cover that snaps in place over the sandbox to keep everything dry and
not have it be the neighborhood animal litterbox.  By making it ourselves,
we got what we wanted (with expansion potential to keep hubby busy on
a project all the time), and it was a lot cheaper than what we could buy.
Oh, and my husband sanded all the pieces and rounded the edges before 
assembling it so that that wouldn't be any rough edges.  And he bolted
the whole thing together, so we could actually move it if we ever wanted
to.

My kids live in that thing.  If the sandbox is uncovered, Jessica grows
roots.  Brad will get out of the sandbox and go down the slide and play
on the swings, but that's the definite attraction this year. I think their
record is 3 hours of sandbox play.  We figure it was definitely worth
the expense.

Cathy

    We got a metal one last year.  There is no signs of rust on it, even
    after being under 5 foot drifts of snow most of the winter.  Our kids
    and the neighbor kids love it!!!  I believe the brand name was Hedstrom
    and we have been very pleased.  We have a seperate sand box that is
    massive and this year added the Little Tykes Activey Cube to our
    'outdoor' toys.  That also was a great hit!!!
    
    So I vote for the metal and invest the extra money in a college fund.
    
    
    susan

    ditto to RE:-1 regarding the metal set. Ours is almost 3 years old and
    over the weekend had about 5-6 kids on it at one time..no problems.

    Thanks for the last several responses.  We're still indecisive about
    how much we want to spend.  We'd really love to buy the wooden one, but
    we also don't want the neighborhood boys on it when we're not home.  We
    can enforce rules while we're there...but we have quite a few boys in
    the neighborhood who think everyone's yard is theirs....and their
    parents don't care.
    
    Meanwhile, Bob made Kaitlin a plain 5'x5' sandbox which she spent most
    of the weekend in.  Very simple, but she loves it!
    
    
    Robin

Robin,

    Since Bob is handy enough to make a a wooden sandbox - I'll add my voice
the the chorus of those advising you to build your own wooden set.

    There are alot of other options between the two extremes you mentioned.
Your local hardware store will probably have several do-it-yourself wooden
kits in the $200-$600 price range.

    I may be mistaken here - but my impression of the metal swing-sets is that
they are not designed to be "free-standing"  They need to be anchored in 
concrete to ensure they don't tip over when larger kids start swining in 
unison.  Most (all?) of the newer wooden sets are designed to be free-standing
regardless of what type of abuse they receiver from kids.

- Carol

    
    We built a wooden set for the boys, and they can't get enough of it.
    There's a slide, 2 swings, a rope ladder, monkey bars across the top,
    and a ladder at each end to reach the monkey bars.  There's also a
    platform, that they grab onto the rope, swing out, and drop the to
    ground, than scurry back up.  They spend more time climbing and jumping
    than on the swings.  
    
    It was a kit, cost about $200.00 I believe.  We did all the sanding and
    staining of it.  It's not SO heavy - 2 strong adults can move it if
    need be (we did have to move it once, and it was fine afterwards).
    
    I like it better than metal - no worry about rust or it being sharp,
    and since it's not metal, it doesn't seem to get as hot.  The slide
    appears to be some type of treated masonite, and it's always nice and
    cool.  Definitely a GREAT investment.  I _wouldn't_ do it for $2,000.00
    though!  Yikes!  
    And if you want to get real extravagant, check out some of the sets at
    SomerVille Lumber - they look like giant Habitrails, and have plastic
    tubes connecting upper platforms together, along with tube slides or
    spiral slides, or whatever you'd like!
    

Remember, the price of lumber has pretty much doubled since last year.
Take that into account when comparing against non wood swingsets.

I'm looking at $70 in pressure treated lumber for a SANDBOX. Yikes!

Chris

    We got the "Swing & Slide" kit last year.  I built a 16 foot set which
    has 3 swings, an A-frame platform with a slide, and a swinging rope on
    the end.  I think the total cost was somewhere around $220. 
    
    It is very sturdy, having 4x4 legs and a 4x6 top beam.  We had the kind
    with the ladder on one end which connects to a ladder-type monkey bar
    which connects to a ladder tower.  Didn't like it after seeing the
    Swing & Slide.
    
    Places that carry it include:  Builders' Square (Nashua), Cyr Lumber
    (Windham), HQ (Manchester).
    
    Swing & Slide has a lot of different kits and options so you can
    add-on, do additional things.
    
    	Ted
    

I love the wooden ones, but couldn't see spending a lot of money.  If I
were going to spend several hundred dollars, I'd have someone build a 
2 story playhouse I designed.  :-)

What we ended up doing was buying a metal swingset from another Digital
employee.  His kids had outgrown it.  It only cost us $25, plus another
$5 for his gasoline since he drove it over to our house.  It has worked
great.

     Carol

    We just started looking at swing sets, and are thinking about 
    building one (we mostly want the slide now, since Andy's been 
    to a few parks this summer, and can't get enough of the slide).
    
    The kit sold at Builder's Sq has a "wave slide".  What's the deal 
    with the wave in the slide?  Does anyone have one?  Is there any 
    advantage?
    
    Can someone suggest where we can get just a plastic or fiberglass 
    slide that is straight?  Preferrably in southern New Hampshire.
    
    Peggy

We do have a wave slide on the swing set my husband built.
I think the wave is mostly for a more interesting slide down.
The nice thing is that it doesn't get hot in the sun (I'm sure
there are straight slides that do the same) like a metal one
wood (and possible others).

My son also likes to climb up the slide as much as slide down
it.  I think the waves help to keep him from sliding down onto
his face :-)

   From watching my kids on them, I have a theory.. it appears that the
   wave, along with being more interesting than a straight slide, acts as
   sort of a damping mechanism for the slide.  They don't seem to be able
   to get going as fast with the wave in the middle of the slide..
   
   Just my opinion..
   
   - Tom

    In a previous version of parenting, there were directions on how to
    make a slide.  If you're real handy, it went something like;
    
    Take a piece of sheet metal and a board the size that you want the
    slide to be.  Bend the edges of the sheet metal over the board, and
    secure it to the underside.  Add another board to "sandwich" the edges
    of the sheet metal.  Using 2x4, router a groove in the 4" side, wide
    enough for the slide board to slide into.  I believe there was also
    another piece of wood "under" the slide that helped hold together the
    slide board and the 2x4 "rail".
    
    I don't have all the directions (obviously), but they were in pretty
    good detail in the old file, as well as a LOT of notes about the wood
    swing sets etc.
    
    The wave, in my experience, provides more of a thrill and does slow you
    down a bit.  I haven't checked this year, but in the past, Somerville
    Lumber, HQ and Home Depot all sold straight slides.
    
    Good Luck!
    
    
    Patty

    RE: -.1
    
    If you decide to go this route, keep in mind that sheet metal will get
    *very* hot in the sun. You should be OK if it's in a shady or
    semi-shady area. If the slide's set up in a sunny area, consider using
    some sort of laminate material instead of sheetmetal.
    
    Also, check out the HOME_WORK notesfile for lots of tips, ideas and
    instructions on building your own.
    
    Freddie

    You might try a light-colored formica.  You can wax it to make it
    brutally slippery, or leave it dull to help slow the little folks down
    a bit.  We put a tarp over our swingset to keep the sun off, since the
    only place we had enough room was right in the sunniest spot of the
    yard.
    Sarah

    A WARNING!!  Last week my father inlaw took my niece and nephew to
    McDonalds or one of those fast food places in the mid afternoon.  Both
    kids came very close to receiving VERY serious BURNS on their legs from
    the stainless steel slides being in the sun.  Now these kids have lived
    in Florida since birth, and still couldn't handle this kind of heat!
    
    My personal opinion, that either these slides ought to have a shade
    cover, or be closed on the super hot days, or even just a warning posted
    about the heat buildup on extreme hot days.  Kid can burn a lot faster
    and to a deeper degree than any adult.  Let's face it, if it's 90
    degrees you're not going to dress your kids in long pants just to let
    them play on the playground slide!
    
    Lyn
    

    
    Gee ... that's funny ... I was at McDonald's in Goffstown, NH last
    night, and at the entrance to the playground there was a LARGE warning
    sign about heat buildup on playground equipment.  First one I've ever
    seen .... maybe it's a trend?
    
    Patty

Now that I've moved from Colorado to Massachusetts, and have been looking 
around at neighbors' playsets, I realize why people buy wooden ones.  :-)
The one we had in Colorado was used for several years before we bought it.
We used it for a few years more.  It never rusted; it stayed in great 
condition.  The buyers of our house asked for us to leave it for them.

In Massachusetts, I eyed one from a distance that was 5 years old.  It looked
*awful*.  It was covered with rust, and I heard the owner constantly fights
with the rust to keep it usable and safe. 

Now I'm trying to decide on whether to build a wooden swingset in our fenced
yard or to buy the "castle" style playhouse.  Do kids play in the playhouses
and the castle playhouse as much as they would swing?  Also, are there any
sales this time of year for playsets?

BTW, our backdoor neighbor has an unfenced big wooden playset that our kids are
allowed to play on, too.  I hate to buy another one when that one is only
a few yards away.  However, it will be a few years before we would allow our
youngest child to play on it without us out there with him, since there's no
fence to protect him from running into the street or pond nearby.  At our
former house we could watch them play on the swingset while we cooked or
cleaned or entertained in the house by a window. 

Ideas?  Thoughts?

    Carol

	My brother-in-law bought a kit at Grossman's (I suppose any 
	hardware store would have them in the spring)  The kit basically
	includes the plans and tells you what supplies you need to build
	one.  He said there were many different plans and some with little
	forts on one end.  I'm not sure you're interested in building it,
	but his came out great and was considerably cheaper than buying
	one that was already built. - Just another option.

I think we put in Elspeth's Sears "Big T" swing set when she was around six. 
She's thirteen now (and still swings on it occasionally), and we've never had a
rust problem with it.  The cost was pretty reasonable, and the assembly was
basically an afternoon's work (the only hard part is putting in the footings --
maybe you haven't had to dig a hole in New England "soil" yet :-).

	-Neil

< we've never had a rust problem with it.  

What do you do differently, Neil?  Did you treat it somehow?  What does 
"rust problem" mean to you?  Have you had rust, but it hasn't been a problem?
At what point does it get to be a "problem"?  I keep hearing about sharp
edges, for instance, which makes me wonder if a lot of people in New England
grew up seeing and/or playing on swingsets which were rusted so badly they
were dangerous.

< (the only hard part is putting in the footings --
< maybe you haven't had to dig a hole in New England "soil" yet :-).

Uh, no, I haven't.  Oh, that's right!  There's rocks out here, aren't there?

       Carol

    We've had a "Flexible Flyer" swingset up for 3 years now, and there
    is no rust.  It's painted to begin with, so unless the paint chips
    or is scratched off it shouldn't rust.  Now, if you buy a cheaper
    model with poor quality paint, then I would guess rusting would be a
    problem. All the bolt ends come with end caps so there are no
    sharp edges. And the chains for the swings came with vinyl tubing to
    cpover them, so they don't get exposed to the elements as badly as bare
    chain. The only maintenance we have is once a year we wax the
    slide. My son likes to FLY off the slide, as opposed to gradually slip
    down : )  
    Sarah   

What do you wax a slide with?  (I can hear the answers now...  :-}  )
Let me rephrase...  Is there a special wax to use?  I assume you don't just
take a candle...

      Carol

    My husband built both a clubhouse type structure and a swingset this
    past summer. The clubhouse has a slide, rope ladder, and a climbing
    rope. (we passed on the optional fire pole).  The swing set has 2
    swings, a monkey bar, and room for another item (swing, 2 seater
    glider, etc).  By far, I'd say Russ uses the swings more often then the
    clubhouse.  But then again, he's always loved the swings at daycare and
    the playground.  The kits that we bought could have been build right
    next to each other, but we opted for some space between them due to the
    way our land slopes.  You could start out by building the swing set,
    then adding the clubhouse structure later on.

    	marianne

    RE: .41
    
    furniture polish...  Just be careful that first slide is a
    doozy!
    
    Diana

    I used automotive polish, since I figured the slide and the car are
    both metal.  Course, now that I think about it, the car is fiber glass!
    Anyway,  you do have to be careful and make sure the landing is soft
    enough and large enough.  My son (we call him "Intrepid") loves to go
    fast, fast, fast, so he didn't mind a few abrupt landings.  With
    visiting children, we always hold them on the first few trips down to
    allow them to get used to the speed.  
    Furniture polish should work just as well.  Even Butcher's Wax, or
    surfboard or ski wax, if you want to get fancy.
    Sarah

One simple way to wax a slide is to rub it with a piece of wax paper.

	-Neil

    Yup - we used wax paper as a kid, and BOY does it get FAST!
    
    Patty
    still-wishing-she-were-small-enough-for-a-slide!
    

    When I'm wishing that, I take the kids to the school yard.  There
    slides are sturdy enough to hold me :-)
    
    btw:  Just to add my 2 cents worth.... We put up a non-wooden swing set
    for our little ones when they were both under 3.  They are now 7 and 6. 
    Although the set still has a few years left in in, we are thinking
    about taking it down because they are getting too big and too rough. 
    

    Our yard is a corner lot, no fencing, and my kids have playmates in the
    next 2 houses over. They're allowed to go into each of the next 2 yards
    (no fence, but I can see them from kitchen window). One friend has
    the wooden tower/climber swingset; one has the
    wooden-build-your-own-basic swingset, and we have a painted metal $99
    special swings and slide set.
    
    The kids alternate back and forth. They seem as keen on swinging as
    they do on making traps/forts/hiding places in the climbing parts. One
    thing I have observed as they get older is that they're more likely to
    use trees/bushes for hiding places than the wooden tower swingset, but
    they always seem to need the periodic release of swinging. My 3 yr. old
    is quite keen on climbing right now while my 6 yr. old spends more time
    tying ropes to trees and then climbing.
    
    One other thought for you, Carol, especially for Justin. We've never
    had fences, as I mentioned above, but we've been very strict on the
    rule that they must stay on the grass and in the back yards where we
    can see them. From the time Ryan was 2 1/2 on, he knew not to go near
    the street. So, although your neighbor may not have a fence, you can
    set the mental boundary and the kids will indeed follow it.
    
    regards
    
    
    

.39:

> < we've never had a rust problem with it.  
> 
> What do you do differently, Neil?  Did you treat it somehow?  What does 
> "rust problem" mean to you?  Have you had rust, but it hasn't been a problem?

I went out and looked at it yesterday.  The entire swingset is essentially
rust-free.  (There are two localized spots of rust:  the overhead bars are
punched through where the crimp the steel tube down flat for fastening it to the
uprights, and apparently the punch spots weren't finished.)

As for sharp spots, the only concern that I can see is that it is assembled with
nuts and bolts, and the bolt ends could conceivably be sharp.  They provide
little plastic caps to screw on over the bolt ends, but they don't stay on. 
It's never been a problem, though -- they don't stick out that far, they aren't
that sharp, and they aren't where kids are likely to catch themselves on them.
(Using some plastic tool dip on the bolt ends might be an interesting solution.)

I know that the wooden sets are much classier and more impressive, but our
conclusion was thtat a good steel set gave us plenty of play-capability, with a
much lower cost and less labor on our part.

(This swing set design consists of two vertical ladders about eight feet apart
and a horizontal ladder between them, about five or six feet off the ground. 
There's a cross bar at the top of each vertical, sticking out to the sides,
which gives you four overhead protruding cross-pieces to attach two swings, a
trapeze, and a pair of rings to.)

	-Neil

    
    I checked out the Swing N Slide at Sommerville Lumber last night and
    decided that I would like to design my own but based on one of theirs.
    Does anybody have the plans Pioneer swing set?
    
    Thanks!
    
    Karen
    MPGS::HEALEY
    DTN 237-2249
    

    The woodworking notesfile (sorry I don't know its address) used to 
    have many designs.
    
                                       Alice

We are thinking of buying a metal swingset, but our backyard slopes
down a little, so  will that be a problem?
Also, what is the preferred method of fixing it to the ground?
Do we use cement, if not, how can we make sure it is really firm?
(to get an idea of our abilities: we had trouble even with putting 
up the mailbox...)  
One of the previous notes suggested the "Flexible Flyer". Any other
recommendations?

Thanks,
-Pradnya

We installed a metal swing set in our back yard.  I think it's a Flexible 
Flyer model.  You can either chain it down with short lengths of chain 
attached to the base of each leg with a bracket, and then a spike of some sort 
pounded into the ground.  Or use cement.

I've seen chained sets move around a lot so I like the cement method.    If 
you simply dig a hole, fill it with cement and drop the posts in, they will 
probably come loose over time.  The trick I used was to drill a hole through 
each leg and insert a long bolt in it before burying it in the cement:

   |   |
   |   |
===|   |===
   |   |
   _____

I dug the holes about 10 inches deep, filled half of the hole with cement and 
then dropped the poles in, with the bolts in place.  I then went around and 
filled the holes the rest of the way.  Keep the cement just level with the 
ground, that way you can mow around the set, if it's on the grass.

The sideways bolt will grab the cement and prevent the smooth sided post from 
breaking away from the cement and coming out.  I used some left over VW Rabbit 
head bolts, in case you happen to have any left over....

Dave

    Quite innovative Dave!
    
    				cj *->

    
    	We have selected a swing-set for our kids, but the only
    	place we have been able to find it so far is mail-order.
    
    	If anyone knows of stores in the Central Massachusetts area
    	that sell Hedstrom swing sets, would you please mail me at
    
    	CNTROL::JENNISON 
    
    	Thanks,
    	Karen
    
    	PS - We are looking for the model that has two heights - 8 feet
    	tall where the swings are, and 7 feet tall for the glider and
    	trapeze.
    
    

    
    We have a different Hedstrom we bought 3 or 4 years ago (one with the
    kids section, monkey bars and a yard swing for Mom!).  We found it at
    Toys 'R Us.  
    
    Irene

    Karen,
    
    Call Hedtrsom and ask who they deliver it to .... they should be able
    to give you a distributor in your area, in no time.
    
    If you don't have a Hedstrom 800- number, ToysRUs should be able to
    give you one.
    
    -Patty

This months Consumer Reports magazine has a review of swing sets.  It
also lists the safety do's and don'ts.

Garry

    Yes, the Consumer Reports article is very good.  It rates swingsets -
    the Headstrom brands IN GENERAL were rated favorably.
    
    Doesn't Service Merchandise carry the Headstrom brand.  Why don't you
    give them a call.
    
    Nancy

    Looking through this week's flyers, I saw some Hedstrom
    swing sets on sale, not sure if they were at Toy Works
    or Walmart. I believe it was Toy Works. I go to the one
    in Franklin, but I believe that there is also one in the
    Leominster/Fitchburg area.
    
    Sharon

    
    I just noticed some in the Wal-Mart flyer, but neither picture showed
    multiple heights.  They may have others ?

    
    	Thanks.  The difficulty is finding the one with the higher
    	tier for the swings.  We found one version, but I don't like
    	the monkey bars at the end.  I did get the 800 number for Hedstrom
    	while at Sears, so I'll try them today.
    
    

<    the Headstrom brands IN GENERAL were rated favorably.

Except for one, which has the triangles/pyramids on each end.  It's the
expensive one.  One of the ride-on parts easily flips over (upside-down)
while a child or 2 children are riding it.

      Carol

    I just purchased a Headstrom swingset two weeks ago at K-Mart
    in Leominster - I checked their price against Toy Works and
    WalMart and they had the best price.  
    
    Not sure if they have the one you're looking for though - their
    selection was limited.
    
    /Karen

    I just received the JC Penney clearance catalog on Friday and they had
    the swingset with the two differant elevations.  I forgot to bring it
    in with me, but I want to say the price was around $300.00 -- I don't
    know how that compares to the others....
    
    Roberta

    
    	Thanks, Roberta! 
    
    

    Toy works (Bedford MA) is out of the less expensive, though highly
    rated, Hedstrom swing sets they had on sale.  They don't plan on
    restocking
    
    Has anyone had any luck
    with other T/W stores, or contacted Service Merchandise to see what
    they have it stock?  My daughter's B-day is August (swing is the
    present) but it seems I'm going to have to buy it now.  I'll try the
    other recommended places too.
    
    Thanks for the input - guess I know what I'm doing this w/e!
    
    Kathy  

    
    Most stores we checked (Toys R Us, Service Merchandise, Sears,
    and Walmart) carried a large variety of Hedstrom Swingsets.
    
    Unfortunately, none carried the model we wanted, and we ended up
    ordering from a catalog (and paying shipping charges - ugh!)
    
    	Karen
    

    Sunday's paper showed that Caldor had the model we wanted (on sale!), 
    but ask me if I've been free to call let alone go there.  I'll do it
    now or continue looking if they've sold out.  Hopefully places will get
    restocked. 
    
    Now my hubby is balking because it's 17.5 ft long.  I just can't win! 
    :)
    
      

    I would like to get a wooden swing set for my daughter.  I have a
    couple of questions:
    
    1. Does anyone know of a place that sells kits/blue prints and or
    hardware?
    
    2. Does anyone have recommendations for places to purchase?
    
    The wooden swing set replies are dated.
    
    Thanks,
    Nancy
    

Not much to go on but,
Last month we happened past a place in Billerica that 
makes their own wooden sets.  They have some *great* swing
sets, but I wouldn't recommend *buying* one from them
(they seemed a bit pricey), but they *do* sell individual
components. (They had neat slides, ranging from low-end 8'
models to really spiffy tubular models).

Tom (also interested in blue prints)

    I looked in the Woodworking Notesfile (a previous note said they might
    have blueprints) but they had none.
    
    I saw some of the wooden sets at a place on Rt. 9 in Shrewsbury.  I
    think the least expensive was about $600.  The one I liked was about
    $1700.  

    
    
    My husband bought a kit from either Home Depot or Home Quarters.
    The kit included the plan and the hardware; we bought the lumber
    separate. The set we made have 2 swings (with plastic seats), 1 
    pull-up bar, 1 climbing robe, a platform to be used with the slide 
    (which we didn't get). We built it out of 4" by 4" pressured treatment 
    lumber, which we sanded and sealed with deck stain. I don't remember
    how much it all cost. It took a few hours of cutting wood, one 
    afternoon of assembling and one afternoon of sanding and staining.
    The end product is extremely sturdy. As far as kits are concerned,
    the quality of the hardware is most important, it seems.
    
    
    Eva 

    Nancy,
    
    We checked out a few places last year.  There were a few places
    on Rt. 9 in the Shrewsbury area (one place is right across from
    Spags).  They all seemed to be similar in price, however they were
    offering deals on the previous year's model(s).
    
    I also found that I really liked the ones they were selling at
    Wilson's Farm on Rt. 62 in Hudson/Berlin.  They were painted with
    this special green paint that limited splinters and increased the
    "average" age of these swingsets.  These were a little more
    expensive and I was told that I could check the prices from the
    company who manufacturers them.  The manufacturer is in Holliston??
    
    Anyways, they were out of our price range, so we went for the metal
    version (Hedstrom).
    
    Good Luck!
    
    /kmu

    I'm in the midst of looking into wooden sets right now.  I've sent for
    catalogs from 3 different places, as well as checked the Creative
    Playthings line sold at BJ's.  Child Life sells the green painted sets.
    They have a direct store in Holliston as well as sell through a few
    distributors in the area.  I checked them out at a place called McCay's
    (I think) in Lexington. Creative Playthings also has a store on
    Washington Street in Holliston. I forget the name of the line from
    the place in Shrewsbury but received the catalog. There is also
    a place on Rt 111 in Boxboro that I checked out and received their
    catalog.  Right now I can't remember the names of any places. All of
    the sets seem very high quality but they are also very high priced -
    $800-1700. I think I'm going to inspect the Creative Playthings (cheaper) 
    line. If that isn't acceptable I might go with a basic Child Life set and
    add on as he gets older.  
    
    If there's interest, I'll bring in the names and disributors and print
    them here.
    
    Kathy
    

    RE: .75
    
    FWIW Creative Playthings and Child Life are almost across the street
    from each other.  Both offer quality sets.  The prices are a bit high
    in my opinion.  Both have very sturdy construction and offer a number
    of options.  The most important thing to consider is the stability of
    the "set" you choose.  Either manufacturer mentioned here has very
    stable construction for all of the units I saw there.  All hardware is
    oversized, which is good.  If you are reluctant to spend the big bucks,
    the hardware is available separately.  (This is the option I chose as I
    had already built a homegrown playhouse etc.)
    
    Dan

    Dan,
    
    I agree about visiting HOlliston.  I intend to do that this weekend.
    I'd like to really see the sets up close and personal as well as
    measure how big their base play area is, etc.  Until last weekend I
    had only planned to buy a base set - few swings, slide and the other
    ride (sometimes a plane/horse/2 person glider) - however, we visited
    a family with a Creative Plaything set which included the covered play
    house and Alex loved it. I didn't think he would care about it at all.
    The other stuff - monkey bars, ropes, climbers I think I can get away
    with for next year.
    
    Kathy

    RE: .77
    
    If you are relly brave... bring the kids!!  Both places encourage child
    play.  Both have prebuilt units which can be used by the kids.  You
    will soon get a feel for the size of some of these things.  They both
    also recommend that a "soft" base be created.  This can be sand, gravel
    or wood chips.  
    
    Dan

    And for any of them, prepare to spend ~70-100.00 more for a slide.
    Unbelievable!!
    
    -Patty