Conference misery::feline

    The life span varies with the temperature.  If I remember correctly,
    my vet said it could take up to four months for the fleas to
    disappear completely.  That said, I have been giving my guys
    Program for months and months.  It controls the flea population to
    some extent, but there are still fleas around.  I also flea comb
    the cats twice a day, and flea bomb the house, although I can't
    do the entire house at once.  I think the problem with Program is
    that two of my cats (nibblers by nature) don't eat it all, even tho
    it's mixed with a food they like.  I'm improved the results by
    giving them half a dose every two weeks instead of a whole
    dose every month (my vet okayed this).
    
    I'm waiting for Advantage, in hopes that will
    wiork.  Advantage is still not approved for use in California, but
    should be available elsewhere.
    

    My mom keeps complaining that she is giving her cat and dog "Program"
    and she's still combing fleas off of them.  I keep trying to explain
    to her that it doesn't kill the fleas, just makes them sterile and 
    as long as the cat and dog go out in the yard the problem will
    remain as they pick up new fleas who then have to get their dose
    of sterilizing.
    
    I've heard that only 1% of the flea problem is actually on the animal.
    The rest is in their environment.  So, treat the animal with Program
    and deal with the environment problem too and you may see a reduction
    in the number of fleas.
    
    I've been very lucky that my flea problem has not returned since I
    managed to get rid of them last summer.  (knock wood)
    
    Jan

    I'll add that I had much better luck getting rid of fleas in the
    house when I also used flea powder on the cats when I flea bombed the
    house.  I can't use the flea powder any more because of Sweetie's
    respiratory problem, tho.
    
    The nice thing about Advantage is that it is supposed to kill the
    fleas before they bite the animal, so it protects the animal from
    distress.  Holly and Little Bit both have flea allergies, sigh.
    

    I didn't use a bomb this last time since it's a pain to relocate 8 cats.
    I used some Zodiac flea spray for the carpet.  Moved everyone to the
    living room and sprayed the bedroom...let that sit for a couple of
    hours.  At bedtime I put everyone in the bedroom and sprayed the living
    room and left that to sit overnight.  I wasn't sure this would work as
    well as the flea bombs but it seems to have done a good job.
    
    In addition, I took each of 8 cats into the bathroom every night for a
    week or two and combed all the fleas I could off of them and sent the
    pesky varmints to a watery grave. (read:  I rinsed the little suckers
    down the sink :^)  Amazingly enough...it worked.
    
    Hmm, maybe its time to reapply the carpet spray and do a quick comb of
    each cat just for good measure.  I'd hate it if I jinxed myself by
    telling the story.
    
    Jan

    What I'm hearing is that it will be a real uphill battle even with the 
    Program.  For some reason, this has been a brutal flea summer.  I don't
    usually have a problem and all seven cats are indoor.  I originally
    planned to go with just flea spray, but I have one older cat with
    kidney disease.  I can't use any kind of spray on him and I would
    defeat the purpose by just spraying the other six.  Spraying the roooms
    sounds like it would be a help.  It's unbelieveable how durable fleas
    are.  I was kind of hoping that the life span would be 48 hours or
    something like that ... what an optimist!
    

    
    Sometimes I think that the 2nd most compelling reason for keeping cats
    indoors (after increasing the probability of a long and injury free
    life) is the complete lack of fleas.  We have never had fleas, ever.
    
    Fleas are almost as well designed for what they do as cats are for what
    they do!
    
    len.
    

    Vacuuming and immediately throwing the vac bag away in the outdoors
    trash helps also.  p.s. Len, my kitties are indoors only;  apaprently
    the fleas do not know this :-)
    

    With 13 cats which mostly go indoor/outdoor...I have NOT
    seen a flea this year.    In June I was having a VERY hard time
    with ticks so I sprayed Duratrol Spray which I believe works
    GREAT!!!   Duratrol spray is expensive and you can only get
    it at the vets...but one thing I LOVE about it is you can
    spray a room and you only need to stay out of it for 1 hour
    and it seems to work almost immediately.
    
    Sandy 

    Oops, almost forgot about the borax.  I have the Borax Flea Treatment
    process on line and would be happy to send it to whoever still needs
    it.
    
    Jan

    Jan,
    
    I don't know what Borax Flea Treatment is, but I'd like to.
    
    Thanks,
    
    Donna
    

    The Borax Flea Removal Process and Exercise Plan is winging its way
    to you via vaxmail right now.
    
    Jan

>    The Borax Flea Removal Process and Exercise Plan is winging its way
>    to you via vaxmail right now.

Or you can call Fleabusters if you want the Borax Process without the 
exercise program.  :-)

				SQ

    We have been giving our two indoor mostly cats Program since April at
    our vet's suggestion when we noticed a couple of fleas.  They must have
    wintered in the carpet and were waking up when the warmer weather can
    in late March!
    
    Anyway, Dr. Mulcahy explained that the Program would sterilize the adult
    females but that to "kill"fleas, we should still use flea collars --
    which we have been doing and we have not seen a flea since!!
    
    Sandy Johnson
    

    
        JoAnn Richards
        wmois::richards_j
    
         Re: note 1019.8, I was wondering were I can get the Duratrol, my
       brother-in-law lives in Maine and he said that this spray worked 
       great for him also, But I don't know which vet sells this, can you 
       help me.
    
      thanks 
      JoAnn
    

    Hi Joann...
    
    I get my Duratrol at Fallon Animal Clinic in Lunenburg.  Call around
    to some vets in your area, if they don't have it maybe they could
    order it for you.
    
    Oh ya...I also saw it in the R.C, Steele catlog for about the same
    amount of money you get it at the vets.  If you order it this way,
    you would have to pay shipping and handling so it would cost you a
    bit more.
    
    Regarding fleas...I heard and adult flea can live up to 5-7 days
    and flea larvae can live up to ONE year in warm environments...ie
    like your rugs!!
    
    Sandy 

    
    
    I put my cats on the Program last summer, and touch wood I have not
    seen asingle flea this summer.  One of the best ways of getting eggs
    out of the carpet, is to insert an extra strong flea collar in your
    hoover bag, do the hoovering and immediately chuck the bag away and
    then just follow your usual death-to-fleas rampage....
    
    
    Jules

    I was talking to Jo last night about flea products and got some
    interesting news about Advantage.  It is an agricultural insecticide.
    It is toxic to humans.  Instructions for Advantage tell you to put it
    behind the head at the base of the skull for cats (supposedly because
    they can't lick it off there) and at the base of the tail for dogs.  
    You have to be very careful about touching your pet in the area where 
    Advantage is placed.  
    
    Apparently when they tested Advantage on animals they only tested 30 
    animals and all were dogs.  Compare this to Program which was tested 
    on 1000's of animals (both dogs and cats).
    
    Advantage's insecticide is processed through the liver and kidneys if
    injested by the animals.  Program's active ingredient (name slips my
    mind) stays in the layer of fatty tissue under the skin and is not 
    processed through the liver or kidneys.  And, Program's effects wear 
    off after 30 days which is why you have to redose the animal once per
    month.  
    
    Jo's vet is not recommending Advantage for most of her clients.  There
    are a few extreme situations where she might recommend it but generally
    she does not feel it is safe for her clients.  They do recommend
    Program.
    
    Oh, and I got information on how Program works.  Let's see if I can
    remember it.  Program does not kill adult fleas nor does it make them
    sterile.  What it does is keep the egg from growing the little tooth
    thing they use to hatch the egg so the egg never hatches.  It just
    dries up and dies after a while  This works on existing eggs as well as 
    newly laid eggs since the eggs eat the flea droppings for nourishment. 
    
    Okay, I muddled through that.  If you have any questions let me know
    and I'll try to find the answers.
                                                
    Jan

    Geez.  I was about to post a note lauding Advantage.  I put it on all
    my kitties Friday evening and have found no fleas or flea dirt at
    all on them since about a day and a half later.  My vet said he'd
    reviewed the literature on it and felt it was quite safe...  Dunno what
    to think now.
    
    Advantage does have to be reapplied every month. 
    
    My guys have been on Program for months, and we were still battling
    fleas.
    

    I think you have to make the decision for yourself with your vet's
    input.  Every vet will probably have a different opinion on it.  I 
    don't think I'm inclined to use it on my guys just yet but then I 
    don't have much of a flea problem right now.  I figure if your vet
    recommends it and if it works for your cats with no ill effects...
    that's great.
    
    I probably should have added a YMMV (your mileage may vary) at the 
    end of my note.
    
    Jan
                                                          

    My .18 note wasn't clear -- I'm not going ahead with Advantage
    again until I have a chance to run this new info past my vet.
    Call me cynical, but I've seen industry send out too many dangerous
    products.
    

    I found this on the web, from: http://www.nofleas.com/ a page
    from Bayer:
    
    Advantage is selectively toxic to specific insect species and not to
    other insects and vertebrates.
    
    Advantage was extensively tested in dogs and cats and found to be well
    tolerated even at exaggerated doses.
    
    However, it also says about the primary ingredient:
    
    exhibits moderate acute oral toxicity, extremely low dermal toxicity
    and low inhalation toxicity for mammals.
    
    which sounds like a contradition to me.
    

    Karen,
    
      My vet also told me he won't use Advantage.  He said you may as well
    feed your cat insecticides.  We have used Program for about seven
    months the fleas are way down but we do find a few.
    
    Dennis

    The attached message is from my sister Jo.  I mentioned that I had
    shared the information she gave me on Advantage and that Karen was
    looking for more information.  I have passed this message on to Karen
    but thought some of the rest of you might be interested in this too.
    
    Jan
    
From:	JULIET::US3RMC::"[email protected]" "Ken & Jo Ann Brown" 12-SEP-1996 07:09:52.81
To:	Eight Tigers on My Couch <juliet::cordes_ja>
CC:	
Subj:	Re: Advantage

Tell Karen that our Bayer rep told Dr. Rue that there were only 30 animals
in their safety study.  Also, tell her that Bayer has issued a warning to us
that Advantage will discolor leather upholstery.  It's an insecticide, and
as such, it's toxic.  Stick with Program.  It's not an insecticide, it's not
toxic, and it won't discolor leather.  Also, Sharon Lann, a birman breeder,
had one of her kittens treated with Advantage.  It turned his white fur
green.  It's still green as a matter of fact, one week later.  Seeing how
this is a show cat, she's not too pleased.

Jo