Conference cookie::notes$archive:cd_v1

    Dave,
    
    If negative advice is any good, I haven't heard a version of the 39th
    on CD yet that I like.  I'm waiting and hoping that Mackerras and the
    Prague Chamber Orchestra will do it.  Not because they're on Telarc,
    but because I love their disc with 40th & 41st, and their disc with
    36th and 38th which came out a few months ago.  The notes for this
    latest says that it's a series that they are doing.  Their versions
    impress me so much that I'm waiting for a while to see if they really
    come through on the series.  Mackerras and the Prague also did Eine
    Kleine Nachtmusik (not bad) and the "Posthorn" serenade (terrific!)
    together on one disc.  All in all, they seem to really have their act
    together, so I'm still wearing out my old DG / Karl B�hm records for
    the rest of Mozart's Symphonies. 
    
    Bruce
    

    

    Ah... I've heard the Posthorn/Eine Kleine... by the Prague Chamber.  If
    there is a chance they'll do the 39th I'll tell her to invest in the
    other 4 (36,38,40,41) and wait for the 39th.  Sounds so good I may go
    out and get the 36th and 38th.
    
    Anybody else?
    
    thanks,
    D    

    Hi, I'm a newcomer in two ways, just bought a CD, and new to 
    classical music. My question here, is on classical music. I
    bought a Mozart disc by "The Royal Academy of ..." last night,
    and was wondering if this is part of a series of recordings,
    as I have a tape, by the same group, call the Salzburg Years,
    that seems to be somewhat different. Track titles have the
    notation 
          Symphony in D major "title" K165a  (example, not actual)
    
    Can someone explain what the k165a notation means. I don't know
    enough about classical music to feel comfortable purchasing
    discs. I like a lot of Bach, Vivaldi, Mozart, etc., and would
    appreciate some direction, on what to consider in starting out
    in this area of music. Thanks
    
                 Wayne

    In answer to -.1, I believe that the K.-number for Mozart's pieces
    refers to the position of a work in the catalog of complete works
    drawn up by a musicologist whose name was K�chel. Very often, a
    popular title would come to be supplied to a work (not always provided
    by the composer himself); so a symphony, say, could end up with
    a number indicating (sometimes roughly) its position in the entire
    sequence of symphonies, a K�chel number indicating its position
    in K�chel's catalog of the complete works, and the popular name
    that has come to be given to it.
    
    If you think it's confusing for Mozart, wait until you hit Schubert,
    who supplied opus numbers for his compositions. You can get a string
    quartet that has a number (indicating WHICH of the string quartets
    it is), a popular title ("Death and the Maiden," for example), the
    opus number that Schubert decided to give it, and a D (for Deutsch
    I think) number indicating its position in the catalog of complete
    works. 
    
    Jack Truslow
    

    Am I wrong, or is the OPUS number associated with the order in which
    a work or series of works was published?   I'm still new at
    understanding classical music myself, and some of these things seem
    a little hazy.
    Marty 
     does anyone know who catalogued Bach's music (I think the catalog
     numbers start with BW)?
    

    
    BWV stands not for a person but for something like
    (please pardon my german) Bach Werke Verzeichnung  -- any
    way it means "Catalog of Bach's Works".

    
    
    			----ignore the following flippancy!------
    
    
    According to Mr. Micheal Flanders, the K system is a "rating"
    a K�chel rating of 165a is not all that good, considering
    that their are many works with a rating in the 400's.

    RE: -.1; that's pretty funny.
    
    The catalogue numbers are generally 'as composed'; there can be
    a lot of argument, but it's pretty esoteric most of the time -
    was K168b really composed before K168c, or whatever.
    
    Mozart's last piece was the Requiem, which I think is K625 or K626.
    About the earliest piece you're going to find is his Bassoon Concerto
    (glorious music) which is around K190 - I think he was 14 when he
    wrote it (pretty humbling thought isn't it). So, for about 20 years
    of composing, you've got about 400 K numbers, not to mention the
    a's, b's, etc. You can see where there'd be some disagreement.
    
    Anyway, for folks who are interested in 'classical' music and the
    people who wrote it, let me recommend a terrific book: 'Lives of
    the Great Composers', by Harold Schonberg. He was the music critic
    for the NY Times for a very long time, and it's a wonderful book.
    He also wrote 'Lives of the Great Conductors' and '... Pianists'.
    
    I remain partial to 'The Academy of St. Marten's in the Fields'
    for most Mozart - they record for Phillips and Argo, and I'm sure
    are available on CD. Their records are excellent quality, and I'd
    imagine that AAD or ADD CD's from their tapes would be likewise.
    
    Charlie

    The real Names of the 2 books are:
    
    1) MOZART:		K�CHEL VERZEICHNIS
    
    2) BACH:		BACH WERKE VERZEICHNIS
    
    Thomas
    (A german legal alien in the US ;-))

    Re .5:
    
    Opus numbers historically have been associated with the order in which
    works are published.  If you're interested in following the
    chronological development of the composer, however, it is usually more
    interesting to know the order in which the works were composed.  Also,
    for many composers, many pieces weren't published with opus numbers (or
    published at all).  Thus the catalog numbers for many older composers.
    Modern composers who use opus numbers often assign the numbers by order
    of composition, not order of publication.
    
    If opus numbers seem a little hazy, that means you're making progress
    in understanding the classical music field :-).

    The numbering of works becoms more complicated as heretofore unknown
    works are discovered and inserted in the catalog.
    
    Try making sense of Sibelius or Dvorak (I forget which).  One of
    them composed a symphony , but for some reason, never made it public.
    After the catalog was complete, the "undiscovered" symphony was
    discovered with the composer's own opus number.  Now we have
    consecutively numbered symphonies 1 through 6(?) but there's the
    new work which makes it the *real* fourth symphony.  You then have
    such confusion as "Symphony No. 5, the old No. 4" in the liner notes.
    The upside of this situation is that it doesn't happen too often.
    
    Re:.4
    I don't know if this was originally entered with a non-English
    keyboard (it came out as kay-vee-see-aich-ee-el), but the Mozart
    catalog is spelled Kochel (with an umlaut -- two side-by-side dots)
    over the e as in .8).  When listening to the radio, you will recognize
    the K number pronounced as Ke(r)-chel or Ke(r)-kel.  Perhaps the
    author of .8 can help, is this sometimes spelled Koechel?
    
    >R.Michael

    I have two copies of Mozart's Symphony No. 39:
    
    Weiner Philharmoniker                    Concertgebouw Orchestra
    Leonard Bernstein                        Nikolaus Harnoncourt
    DG 413 776-2   DDD                       TELDEC 8.43107    DDD
    
    1.  Adagio - Allegro     11'20"                  11'12"
    2.  Andante con moto      9'19"                   7'30"
    3.  Menuetto: Allegretto  4'05"                   3'21"
    4.  Finale: Allegro       7'58"                   7'52"
    
    Also contains Symphony No. 40          Also contains Symphony No. 29
    
    I much prefer the DG version to the TELDEC.  To my ears, the TELDEC
    is brighter than I like.  Parts of the Finale sound harsh to me.
    The tempo of the TELDEC is too brisk for my tastes.  
    
    I find the DG version extemely smooth and polished.  The Philharmoniker
    plays in a wonderful unison.  The TELDEC version comes across to
    me as more distinct, but with certain instrument sections competing
    for front stage.
    
    Both recordings have a DDD spars code and have little or no background
    noise.  FWIW, the July issue of Stero Review devoted a section to
    "Mozart, The Basic Repertoire on Compact Disc".  
    
    Ken P. 
   

    re .10:
    
    The composer in question is Dvorak.  His well-known 9th Symphony
    "The New World", used to be number 5, until they discovered several
    unpublished symphonies of his.
    
    Since you don't have a VT2xx terminal, the o-umlaut in "K�chel"
    appears as a "v".  An accepted alternate spelling is indeed "Koechel".
    
    >M, who also knows some German

    There is a very nice and affordable collection of the Mozart
    Symphonies 38-41 available through Musical Heritage Society
    (1710 Highway 35, Ocean, N.J. 07713).  It is done by the
    Concertbouw Orchestra, Joseph Krips conducting.  It was 
    probably originally out on Phillips or Decca since that is
    where MHS gets a number of their master tapes.  Price for
    the two CD set is 25.98.
    
    Regards
    Doug Dickerson
    

    I've heard good things about MHS.  Thanks, I'll pass the information
    along.  
    
    D

    
    	I purchased the Phillips box set of the late symphonies and
    	I think that the sound is excellent. The conductor and
    	orchestra is Nevelle Mariner and the Academy of St. Martin
    	in the Fields. I also have a copy of Solti and the London
    	Symphony performing #39 and #40 which I think is great. The
    	latter is on a larger scale.
    
    john//

    
    Try Jeffrey Tate's recording with the English Chamber Orchestra.
    It's got Symphony's 32 & 35 as couplings, and is an Angel disk.
    (Tower has Angel's on sale until February 3.)
    
    I've got Tate doing 36 & 38, and 40 & 41 as well, and prefer them
    to the Mackerras versions.
    
    They're also the top rated versions in the Penguin guide.
    
      John