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Conference cookie::notes$archive:cd_v1

Title:Welcome to the CD Notes Conference
Notice:Welcome to COOKIE
Moderator:COOKIE::ROLLOW
Created:Mon Feb 17 1986
Last Modified:Fri Mar 03 1989
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:1517
Total number of notes:13349

974.0. "weird FM interference" by REGENT::SCHMIEDER () Tue Nov 17 1987 10:46

I had the most bizarre thing happen the other night.

I was taping one of my Keith Jarrett CD's from my Magnavox CDB465 to my 
Nakamichi BX300.  I left the room during taping, then returned to verify it 
later.

I do not have a tuner in my current system.

At the end of one track, it cut off abruptly, although it was on the sustain 
of the last note anyway (listening to the CD verified that the engineers had 
indeed managed a smooth fade-out).  Slight pause, then into some handclapping 
and some song that I could identify if I set my mind to it, something rock & 
roll.  Then, a few seconds later, an abrupt shift back into the next track on 
the CD, WHERE IT WOULD HAVE BEEN IF NOTHING HAD EVER HAPPENED!  That is, the 
live r&r segment was in place of the beginning of that track!

Well, the previous contents to that tape were the same as now, only the source 
had been a poor condition ECM/Polydor vinyl copy of the same album.  I taped 
again from the CD with no problem.

I live VERY near that area in Newton/Needham where all the big FM broadcasting 
towers are (or is it the AM stations?).

I am wondering if there is a problem where the Maggie could pick up a sudden 
spurt in an FM broadcast (you know, like when the signal is so strong that if 
you had your tuner on the only station you would get across the whole band 
would be the one that is so incredibly strong).

Or maybe my Bryston amplifier.  After all, with the headphones on I have 
another "problem": If I monitor back a tape, and the music is very soft or 
it's a blank section of tape, I can hear another source playing if I still 
have something on the turntable or in the CD player.  Even though the tape 
monitor switch is ON at both ends!

I'm too lazy to put AUDIO back in my NOTEBOOK and enter this there.  I figured 
it has to be a CD player problem, but if not then I apologise for putting this 
in an inappropriate conference.  Note also that I have heavy duty Interlink 
Reference Series interconnect cables, so I doubt the cables would have picked 
up FM broadcast (whereas cheap guitar cords, for instance, can and do).


				Mark
T.RTitleUserPersonal
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974.1Time To Call The FCCAQUA::ROSTYour forefathers took drugsTue Nov 17 1987 14:028
    
    Anything's possible.  I've picked up CB calls from my *turntable*
    while taping in the past and currently someone in my neighborhood
    has some RF-generating device that causes a tape deck hooked up
    to an amplifier in my basement to pick up blasts of static!!!  (This
    static also affects my TV, AM/FM reception and my guitar amplifiers!!!)
    
    
974.2anythings really possibleCHIRPA::OUELLETTEBut what about the R.O.U.S.Tue Nov 17 1987 16:4414
It seems more likely that your tape deck is the culprit.  Tape
decks contain slope detection circuits (read: FM demodulators)
in the biasing sections, and they contain a little antenna (the
heads) as well.  It is however possible that your CD machine may
also have similar circuits (to control the laser servoes &
such).  The plastic face of the Maggie does make a pretty good
wave guide too.

Try sheilding various components with tinfoil (don't block
ventilation or short any electrical components) to see what
happens.  You might also try rotating the various components to
see what happens.

This problem happens a lot in Boston too.
974.3probable causeREGENT::GETTYSBob Gettys N1BRM 223-6897Wed Nov 18 1987 06:2216
                A very likely cause (and impossible to either prove or
        track down) was somebody (police, taxi, delivery company, etc.)
        was near your house and transmitted (I know that wasn't what you
        heard - but bear with me).
                
                What happens here is the unknown transmitters signal
        mixes with a standard FM broadcast signal producing additional
        signals, one of which fell into a spot that something in your
        system in the signal path from CD to tape picked up. This
        phenomenon even has a name when applied to radio gear, it's
        called intermod (short for intermodulation products).
                
                To sum it up, unless it happens frequently, it isn't
        something to be concerned about in any way.
                
                /s/     Bob
974.4Then again, it could be gremlins.CHIRPA::OUELLETTEBut what about the R.O.U.S.Wed Nov 18 1987 07:1815
As an addendum to .3, please note that your CD player
(or tape deck or smoke detectors or microwave etc.)
might be the transmitter of the signal that FM radio
may beat (and therefore heterodyne down).  Any thing
with a crystal oscillator which isn't well shielded
will broadcast to some extent.  [That's why the FCC
gets to approve computer hardware.]

Note again that if the signal you were hearing was
FM, you still need a circuit to decode it (unlike AM).
Tape decks certainly have such circuits, and CD players
probably also do.

I guess that I can add this to my lists of reasons why
I like solid metal packages on my electronic gear.
974.5REGENT::SCHMIEDERWed Nov 18 1987 09:2018
Wow!  This is all very interesting.  But I'm not going to run out and buy the 
Philips player yet!  For one thing, it's pretty ugly compared to the CDB465.

I remember a humerous incident when I worked for The Glass Harmonica in 
Bloomington IN.  CB's are very popular out there, and the pick-up-truck types 
would come in from the boonies on Sundays after church service to try to find 
some arbitrary classical records.  One Sunday, this guy came in who didn't 
like classical at all, so he went back to the car while his wife was in the 
store shopping.  His pick-up was right next to the front window of the store.  

Before we knew what was going on, we stopped getting music out of the speakers 
(the turntable was the source), and started picking up a VERY dirty CB 
conversation he was having with his mistress!  At TOP VOLUME!  The wife's 
face turned crimson, she ran out of the store, and that was the last we saw 
of that couple!


				Mark
974.6MEMORY::SLATERWed Nov 18 1987 14:5010
    I used to work for a company that made cash registers for the fast
    food industry. We used to have problems with drive through equipment
    when those pick-up trucks with their KW CBs came through.
    
    It took a lot of careful shielding of equipment and cables (including
    power filtering) to solve the problem. And that was digital and
    a lot less sensitive to electromagnetic interference than audio
    stuff.
    
    Les