Conference cookie::notes$archive:cd_v1

    I got a reply from another noter; He recommended the Sonographe
    (I am not sure of the spelling).  It is a Conrad Johnson modified
    Magnavox.
    
    Any owners of this critter?  Comments?
    
    Marty

    This month's Audio reviews the 705ESD.  They liked it an awful lot.
    
    					Steve

    
    I own a SONY CDP620ES and an *VERY* happy with it.  So far I have
    had to bring it in to be aligned once (happened just after I moved).
    My guess is that I didn't get the clamp down tight enough when I
    moved.
    
    In any event, when I took it to Sony for service (at the Mass Service
    Center), I was told that it would be taken care of under my 5 Year
    all parts and labor waranty.  In addition, they volunteered to mail
    it to me insured free of charge.
    
    When I received the player from UPS, (2 weeks later - note it arrived
    at UPS sooner than this but I was away on vacation) I opened the box to
    find that it had been very neatly packed.  In addition, there wasn't a
    finger print to be found on the unit inside or out.  Whoever worked on
    it must have been wearing gloves.  Note that when I brought it in for
    service, I was told that ES equipment is handled by a special
    department and as such service times would be shorter than can be
    expected on other Sony products.
    
    As far as the equipment is concerned it is top notch electronically,
    mechanically and cosmetically.  If you don't belive me, ask the
    salesman to pop the top of the unit so you can look at it.  You'll
    notice that it is very firmly constructed all the way down to the
    inner copper casing.
    
    Steve
    

Re: 3, 0

I also own a CDP 620 ES and do like it very much.  It is better constructed
than their average players using better parts and more intelligent layout
for the circuitry.  I don't necessarily agree, however, that it represents
a good ratio of quality vs. dollars spent.  The mechanics are pretty cheap
and the Japanese have raised, to an artform, the manufacturing of products and
knowing where to cheapen them up where the consumer won't see.  Where the really
excel is making each product look visually pleasing/exciting.

For the money you are paying if you could examine the inside of say the
Revox player vs the Sony you would understand what I am talking about.
At $1000 for the 620 vs the Revox the Revox delivers more (from a manufacturing/
construction and materials used standpoint) for the monies paid.  

Performance wise I like the machine but these things (like the fairly
cheap mechanics) should not be part of a player that costs this much.  Just
as an example I have an obnoxious squeak in the transport when the door closes.
In a player in this price range such minor nits should not occur.

Just one man's opinion.

-peter


ps  I had to get the laser assembly replaced when it started to not track 
properly on start up.  AT the Sony dealer I was treated pretty much the same
as everyone else and had to pick the machine up (shipping would have cost).  
They were reasonably quick and they did fix it right (although, I had asked
them to remove the squeak which they did not do - forgot I guess)  I wasn't
about to drive all the way back there for the squeak.  All in all I'd prefer
not dealing with such a megalopolis of a company if I can avoid it.

The other thing you should consider is technology changes rapidly and there
always upgrading their stuff.  What's new and best today is old stuff after
lunchtime.

        If I had won the lottery, I'd get the (new 16bit) Tempest. I've
        yet to hear better. At $2000+, thou, common sense says otherwise.
        Besides, state of the art here is changing so fast, it is pretty
        silly to spend this much on something that will be obsolete by the
        winter CES. 
        
        Short of that, the best palyers I've listened to (in the $600-800
        range) are the PS Audio (not currently available), Sonographe, and
        Musical Concepts modified Magnavoxen, in no particular order. 
        
        If that is still too steep, then get an unmodified Magnavoxen now,
        and when you have the extra $300 send it off to Musical Concepts
        for the upgrades. 

    re: 2 through 5
    
    Thank you for that information, it appears from the comments that
    the modified magnavoxen are the most popular and cost effective.
    Those that have listened to the TEMPEST, Sonographe, et al.., are
    there any sonic differences?  I know that turntables and cartridges
    all sound different, each affecting the sonics, the depth, width
    and imaging.  Is the same true in the CD players?  OR is it a case
    of the differences are negligible and go pick the features and price
    category that I want?
    
    Restated, I am looking to build a very good audio system, my concerns
    are imaging and accuracy.  I want a player that does those things
    well!  I want Judy Collins to sound like Judy Collins, the London
    symphony to sound like the symphony and present a creditable image
    and Harry James to sound like he is playing a trumpet.

    After reading many reviews of the modified Phillips (Magnavox)
    players, I am skeptical.  You take a $300 player and pour $600 worth
    of modifications into it and what do you get?  A $300 player that
    sounds like a $900 player.  I'd prefer to spend my money on a player
    that was engineered in a consistent fashion from the feet up.  There
    was a review of several of the modified Phillips players in the
    current issue of High Fidelity or maybe Digital Audio - I don't
    recall which.
    
    I'll also echo the comment that technology in this field advances
    pretty quickly, and Sony is very good at putting new technology
    to work fast.  The modified Phillips players almost all just hook
    new circuitry in the audio path somewhere, leaving Phillips' basic
    servo and error detection/correction circuitry alone.  Sony has
    made some good advances in these areas, and their transports in
    the high-end players are very well designed.
    
    But you should look at them all.  Take the cover off and see what
    it looks like inside.  Listen carefully.  Compare features.  I don't
    think you can make a big mistake no matter what you do, as long
    as you stick to the major brands.
    						Steve

    
    	I'd use my ears. I've listened to a lot of these (and made my
    own buying decision way too early!), and I'd rank them something
    like:
    
    	CAL Tempest
    	Sonographe
    	Kinergetics
    	PS Audio
   	   .
    	   .
    	Japanese
    
    Japanese stereo sounds like... Well it sounds like japanese stereo,
    which isn't a complement. What do Japanese audiophiles get? (Rumor
    says there's a big market in Japan for older MacIntosh gear).

    I've compared the Sonographe to the Mission PCM7000 and found the
    Mission to have much better imaging, but at $1,000 rather than $700.
     The Denon's also sound good.  I'd recommend also auditioning the
    1500 if you can find a Denon dealer.  It has received rave reviews
    from different reviewers.
    

    I would also recommend looking at a Luxman. I am very satisfied
    with mine and have had no problems in the 2+ years that it has been
    in use. If you are in the Sudbury area, you can find luxman at the
    Electric Gramaphone. By the way, if you purchase your CD player
    at EG, you receive free CD's in liu of a discount. Also, should
    your CD player ever need repairs, EG will give you a free loaner.
                                                                     

Well, I've heard the Sony ES series and found it very unnatural sounding, with 
lack of presence and dimension.  At least it wasn't brash sounding like so 
many other players, but it costs so much money.  And my MUCH cheaper Magnavox 
(unmodified, I might add) has left me with no reservations.

But the Sony costs more, so I'm not going to attempt the difficult task of 
convincing anyone that cheaper is better.  Only my opinion, anyway.


				Mark