Conference cookie::notes$archive:cd_v1

    To elaborate on the last note:
    
    	The DCD-1500 has dual DAC's on the output, which is what I am
    looking for. My Sony CDP-200 still works, but it's going into the
    den as soon as I buy the new one for the main system.
    
    Jeff
    

    One of the latest Digital Audio issues rated their top ten and worst
    CD players. I think the DENON was in the top ten but the model number
    might be different. I recommend subscribing to the magazine even
    though some of the cd reviews are biased.
    
    John

    I went around Cambridge last Friday listening to a bunch of CD players
    in various stores.  One of them was a Denon, I think the same one;
    others included an NAD and one of the high end Yamaha's (CD-2000
    I believe).  Conclusion was that the Denon didn't sound as good
    as the others (that's a subjective judgement from listening to material
    like string quartet and Carmina Burana) and also it mistracked
    (skipped) on one spot where one of the other players simply gave
    a "tick" and the others didn't notice at all.
    
    Oh yes, I also listened to a Nakamichi player, but that was no help
    since it was hardwired into an expensive system including the store's
    most expensive speakers -- which had the worst sound I've ever heard
    at above $200, perhaps because they had the woofer aimed up and
    down rather than forwards, and a carpeted floor and high ceiling
    to absorb all the sound...  But the highs WERE there, and did sound
    nice.  (OMS-5 that was)
    
    	paul

    I bought the Denon DCD-1000 player and have been very happy with
    it.  It is one of the little brothers of the -1500.
    
    Contrary to -1, I have never had a tracking problem, and I bought
    it precisely because it sounded better than anything else I listened
    to, including models $175 more.  (So much for subjective judgements!!)
    I suspect that the store that -1 went to had a bad day/bad salesman/bad
    equipment or whatever.  It sounds very out of character for Denon.
    
    Dave Brown, NWD002::BROWNDA, bought the Denon -1500 player and he
    raves about it.  Why don't you send him some mail.  (Guess he's
    not reading CD this week...)
    
    jdr

    RE: .2
    
    Oh, I get Digital Audio, (in fact my friend is a graphics artist
    with Wayne Greene Publishing in Peterborough, Cow Hampshire) and
    I agree that they are biased, but they do supply some attributes.
    However, I feel that it would be more useful to ask people whom
    have used the equipment ( since I was the first on my block to have
    a CD player, people asked my opinions, now it's my turn)
    
    Jeff
    

    
    
     Re .4 - Here I am
    
    
     I refer you to my note that I entered when I was in the same
    situation; note 295. I reproduced the top 15 of the CD players that
    Digital Audio reviewed, of which the 1500 was 2nd. Have a look at
    the line-up. (295.0)
     I shopped around for 3 months and settled on the 1500 because of
    cost effectiveness ( you will note that the one player that ranked
    higher than the 1500 was ~$1400 and that you must get to position
    8 or so before the price's dip under $1000 ), features ( the player
    is really loaded ) dual DAC's W/ sample rate of 80K and just the
    outstanding performance in general.
     I have had no problems at all with it. No tracking problems at
    all or any other kind of problem.
     I am quite convinced that the 1500 is an excellent player at a
    median price. I got mine for $470 from Typewriters and Electronics
    (Mailorder) out of New York. Yes it did show up in perfect condition.
    
    
     Excellent player; Great buy
    
    
     Dave Brown

    I bought a Denon DCD-1500 last week, and I'm very pleased with the
    sound as well as the many features! However there's one thing that
    bugs me quite a bit. When the player has been in continuous use for
    maybe 8-9 hours (happens a lot when you've got a new player :^}),
    then the player gets very warm, and (as a result of that ?) it takes
    a *VERY* long time to load discs and move between tracks. Last night
    I clocked it at over three min. to load a disc. Skipping to tracks
    with a higher index still is reasonably fast, but if you go the
    other way, be prepared to wait! 
    
    If I turn the player off for a while to let it cool down, then
    everything goes back to normal again.   I have the DCD-1500 sitting
    on top of the amplifier, which also becomes rather warm after a
    while, so what I did this morning was to switch places between
    CD-player and amplifier. Now, if that doesn't help I'll have a 
    chat with the dealer to hear if it's supposed to be this way.
    
    Has anyone else with a DCD-1500 had this problem?
    - GL -

    
    
       The most I leave mine on is 2-3 hours so I have never seen this
    kind of problem. Do you have yours in an enclosed or free airspace?
    
    
    
    Dave Brown
    

    
         My DCD-1500 is playing most of the time that I'm home. I've
    never had any problems with heat or track access time. The only
    problem that I've had, and this could be the disk, is with the Denon
    test disk. If I program in one track, play the track and then return
    to direct mode, the front panel goes blank as if the disk is not
    there. Opening and closing the drawer will reset the display.
    
        Overall, it's a nice machine.
    
    
    
                            Dan
    

    Re: .7:
    
    You have it on top of the amp?!?!?  How powerful (watts) (heat) is your
    amp?? 
    
    I am not a thermal whiz, but I don't think its a very good idea to put
    anything on top of any reasonably-sized amp.  The decrease in thermal
    convection away from the amp can't be good for the amp, and the
    TREMENDOUS increase in heat for the poor component on top of it can't
    be all that great for it, either. 
    
    I think you should move the -1500 away from on top of your amp and
    see what happens.
    
    Components may be stackable depending upon the brand/cooling slots/leg
    height/etc.  But all bets are off when one of the components is an amp. 
    
    jdr

    Rereading my .-1, there are too many "it"s in the second paragraph.

    But, you get the idea...

    re: .10:
    
    As I wrote in .7  I shifted places between amp and CD player yesterday
    morning. I left both of them running, and went to the office. When
    I returned home some 10 hrs. later I tested skipping between tracks,
    loading discs etc.
    
    I'm happy to report that the delays were much shorter after swapping
    positions, but still considerably longer than when the player is initially
    turned on. The top of the player still is quite warm, but the bottom
    is cooler since there's no amp beneath it.
    
    The units are in sort of a rack, and there's about 1 in. between
    CD player and amp. I do hope I won't have to move the player out
    of the rack to a separate place just because of heat problems!

    -GL-

    If you want to keep the look of your rack and would like to get
    the amp heat away from the next unit up, insert a peice of plywood
    or particle board between them. Allow some air space between the
    wood boundary and both units for ventilation, with the most space
    between the amp and the wood.  This will duct the amp heat away
    from the CD player.  You can also angle the wood slightly up toward
    the rear of the rack, which will promote a slight chimney effect
    (convection causing an updraft).
    
    I would hazard a guess that the positioner in the CD player is 
    marginally binding (apparantly not that uncommon among Sony style
    positioners). If it is under warranty, see if you can get it replaced
    or fixed, if not just keep it cool - maybe it will never get worse.
    
    Walt 

    It would probably be better to move your amp out of the rack with
    the rest of your equipment rather than moving the CD player out
    of the rack.
    
    GAS

        Re: .10, re: .7 
        
        Heat isn't the only thing you need to worry about when sacking
        components. Those transformers in mosst components can generate
        lots of magnetic fields, inducing current in components above or
        below. 
        
        In order to eliminate this problem, some equipment (such as my PS
        Audio preamp and amp) seperate the power supply from the rest of
        the unit. Thus I can stack my preamp and amp (with the amp on top
        since heat rises), without fear of this problem. The transformers
        for each unit are in large heavy metal boxes four feet below on
        the floor, connected by special cables. 

        Some CD players, including the Meridian MCD Pro, and some of the
        custom modifications, also move the power supply to a remote unit,
        away from the CD player. 

    Get yourself a cooling fan (like a half-speed muffin fan) from the
    back of an old PDP-11.  Mount that in the rack, and everything ought
    to stay a lot cooler.
    	
    Considering again, what other components are in that rack?  If the
    CD player doesn't like the heat, is there anything else cooking
    in there?  You may want to do a shift-amp-to-top to keep the rest
    of your system from overheating.
    	
    For those readers this side of the Atlantic, East Coast Marketplace
    in Natick  (Sheffield Plaza) has cheap muffin fans in many different
    flavors.  Worth a visit if you can't find an old /11 to dismember.
    				-Bill
    

    Re: .15
    
    Ok. My preamp has the raw DC supply outboard as well. Mostly because
    I used a cheap transformer that was leaky and very (electrically)
    noisey.  My power amp transformers are about 8' from the nearest
    low level stuff (tuner, tape, phono preamp) but inside the amp chassis.
    They make more mechanical noise than electrical.
    
    When (this fall I keep telling myself) I complete the relayout of
    my preamp, I have included the supplies in the same chassis, but
    am using a torroid transformer and separate cavity for the supply
    in the preamp chassis.  Still, there is nothing like distance to
    reduce induced signal problems (something like doubling the distance
    reduces the induced signal strength by its square root).
    
    If 60/120hz noise is not a problem, and the esthetics of a rack
    are important (the amp on top makes the other stuff harder to reach
    without crawling around on hands and knees), a baffle to duct heat
    away from the chassis above the amp is pretty easy.  If AC noise
    is also a problem, then moving the amp out of the rack (and putting
    it between the speakers with longer interconnects/shorter speaker
    cable) is the best solution short of component redesign.
    
    Walt

	Re: .7: and it's replies
	
	The problem  with  slow  access time didn't get any better, so I
	finally brought the DCD-1500 back to the dealer. I explained the
	problem, and was told to come back in a week. Well, the week has
	passed,  so  I went back yesterday to pick it up. To my surprise
	the  player  was  ready  and fixed! Really hadn't expected that.
	Anyway,  what  they  had  done was, how do you say in the trade:
	"adjusted the laser servo".
	
	No signs  of  the  earlier problems anymore. Just to test I left
	the  player  on  overnight, and this morning it still reacted as
	quickly  as can be expected of a normally functioning CD-player.
	The  player still gets as warm as it used to, so I don't suppose
	that's  unusual.  However,  it  seems  like  the heat caused the
	initial problems.
	
	- GL -