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Conference marvin::uk_music

Title:The UK Music Conference
Notice:Welcome (back) to UK_MUSIC on node MARVIN.
Moderator:RDGENG::CROOK
Created:Mon Mar 28 1988
Last Modified:Fri Jun 06 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:1381
Total number of notes:39269

659.0. "The French music scene" by RAB::KARDON (I must not think bad thoughts) Mon Apr 23 1990 15:48

    I'm going to be taking a vacation in France in a month or two and I'm
    curious as to the the French scene is like.
    
    What are the best local (alternative) bands?  What are the best clubs
    to see local/national rock bands.  Any generic info on the French scene
    is welcome.
    
    -Scott
T.RTitleUserPersonal
Name
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659.1more details required for a better answer CASEE::LALLIDidier - BCE Valbonne - DTN 828.5423Wed Apr 25 1990 15:236
>   I'm going to be taking a vacation in France in a month or two and I'm

Where exactly are you going?  

Didier

659.2Tintin reporter au pays du camembertPRSIS7::BERNARDPlease don't sandblast my houseThu Apr 26 1990 11:25302
    
    THE FRENCH INDIE SCENE  (Lecture pour tous)
    
    
    I  Useless introduction - skip
    
    
    Talking about the French scene...uh... First a few warnings. If France
    has ever had a real musical identity, then it has been in the post-WWII
    period. Popular monuments such as Piaf, Brel or Brassens had different
    styles, but shared the same roots, and the result was a sort of soul
    '� la fran�aise'. But nowadays there is no particular French sound 
    (no nostalgia here); in fact, every local band has anglo-saxon influences
    (varying from 25 to 100 %) and what I'm trying to explain is that I'm
    going to talk about French groups, and not French style, as a majority 
    of them don't really differ from their US/UK equivalents. 
    
    So anyone who expects to see a bunch of guys with berets playing accordion
    whilst in the background a row of girls are dancing French Cancan might be 
    somewhat disappointed.
    
    
    II  The top of the stack
    
    
    This inventory should have begun with the best French group of 80's (imho),
    i.e. BERURIER NOIR, but unfortunately they have splitted last year. Along
    with OBERKAMPF (also R.I.P. - named after a Parisian subway station), LA 
    SOURIS DEGLINGUEE (declining now) and a few others, they really kicked off
    the Parisian alternative movement. Although being the most radical ones in
    their music and their social positions, B�rurier Noir were the most popular
    of the afore-mentioned groups and even got some of their records in our 
    infamous Top 50. But facing the traditional dilemma 'Grow or Die', they 
    chose the second solution.
    
    In fact, first "alternative" band to really achieve chart success was RITA
    MITSOUKO, a duet also from Paris, whose psychedelic-latino-minimal stuff
    took the country by surprise two or three years ago, helped in that by 
    great videos shot by France's top specialists of the art, Gauthier and
    Mondino. They are more discreet now, their 3rd LP having - relatively -
    flopped.
    
    Lots of other groups have followed that way : 
    
    NOIR DESIR, from Bordeaux, had a brilliant first album (with obvious Gun 
    Club influences) and signed to major record company Barclay. On their 2nd
    Lp they adopted a more personal style and reached the charts. I think they 
    might get very huge someday, although their neighbours GAMINE, after a 
    similar rising and two luminous albums, have now sunk without a trace. 
    
    Some others have lost what made their interest when they signed on a major; 
    for example LES PORTE-MENTAUX, who turned from a vitaminized version of the
    Clash to a cross between Bon Jovi and The Cure (the result is rather
    anectodal). Same sentence for LES INNOCENTS (again from Paris) or LES 
    ABLETTES (from Toulouse). They are very clean now, and imo not so 
    interesting. Besides you now have to pay top prices to see them live (well,
    not as much as for Phil Collins), so make up your mind.
    
    Another band to avoid live are LES NEGRESSES VERTES. (Trustworthy) musical 
    press and audiences are unanimous in saying they are crap on stage, and 
    some backbiters add it's the same on vinyl. I think they are average ('Voil�
    l'�t�' is a good song indeed), but they don't deserve to be praised like NME
    ethnologists - in search of world music or another f***ing stupid reason 
    like that - did last year. Musically, I could describe them (without 
    committing myself) as a French version of the Pogues.
    
    No no no, the band to see now is LA MANO NEGRA. Their first LP on Indie
    label Boucherie Productions, entitled 'Patchanka', is a classic. They come 
    from the suburbs of Paris, but half of the band have Spanish origins, so 
    many tracks are in Spanish, others are in French or in English. Their second
    LP, released at the end of 1989 on Virgin, is called 'Puta's Fever'. And 
    it's brilliant all the same.
    But they give the best of themselves on stage. I saw them last year in 
    Lyon and it was great. Recently they toured Pigalle (a famous and .. ahem ..
    hot district of Paris, that every tourist knows about). They played every-
    where they could there, from large venues (Elys�e Montmartre, Locomotive) 
    to smaller clubs (New Moon) and even other places (Erotika) usually not 
    used for gigs. However I didn't attend any of these concerts 'cause I'm 
    kind of slow, and at the time I started to worry about getting tickets, 
    everything was sold out a long time ago. Anyway my conclusion is you
    shouldn't miss them. No hay mejor que bailar la patchanka con la mano negra.
    
    
    III The outsiders
    
    
    One of the biggest French indie label (along with Boucherie, Closer and
    New Rose) is Bondage Records (and imo has to be the best one). It is (was)
    B�rurier Noir's label, and shelters lots of other excellent bands.
    
    LUDWIG VON 88 are the most delirious. They got famous in 1987 with
    their first single entitled 'Houlala' (off the 'Houlala' LP). It was
    simplified and overspeeded thrash with these memorable lyrics : 
    'Houla houla houlala  Houla houla houlala  Houla houla houlala  J'ai mal'
    Sheer genius. Next year saw the release of the 2nd LP 'Houlala II : la
    mission' including 'Louison Bobet' (a famous French bike champion in the
    50's), another single that marked an epoch in music history. 
    They sound a bit like the Stupids, and I would call their style as 'funny
    hardcore'. If you like that kind of music, I also recommend you FLITOX, 
    great great great, and PARKINSON SQUARE, who are rather new on the scene 
    but already excccellent. No doubt they soon will be huge and make everybody 
    forget the Beatles (and I must add that they come from Lyon, just like I 
    do.) I'll close this hardcore chapter with two groups, HAINE ET LES
    HERITIERS ENERVES and PUNK REBELLE ET LES SKATES TO HELL, which don't
    seem to step over the first single, but have great names indeed, and thus
    have to be mentioned.
    
    But let's come back to Bondage Records with THE WASHINGTON DEAD CATS.
    From the capital again, they play a sort of psychobilly, and are the only 
    group over here who could open a Cramps concert without being ridiculous.
    They have released three albums yet, the first one 'Go Vegetables Go' 
    (oh yeah warning : when performing live, they throw vegetables and flour 
    at the audience; don't come with your Sunday clothes) being a masterpiece
    (some of their songs like 'Pizza Attack' or 'Ghosts Can't Talk' are real 
    killers). Their influences range from Star Trek to Hollywood's most 
    forgettable B movies of the 50/60's ('The Return Of The Giant Tomatoes' and
    the likes.) As I am here to give reference marks, I would say that they 
    remind me (apart from the Cramps) of this great group from Edinburgh called 
    the Revillos that were around at the turning of the Eighties (what are they 
    doing now Guru ?).
    
    But it is a well known fact that with the best comes along the rest.
    Here the rest is all those groups who play rockabilly the way it was 
    played in the Fifties, and God knows they are numerous. I don't like them,
    but some people really appreciate groups like LES WAMPAS or HAPPY DRIVERS
    (both on Boucherie I think) so I mention them in case I'm wrong (maybe) 
    and they are in fact really good (unlikely).
    
    LES SATELLITES (still on Bondage Records) play what I would call a
    psychedelic beatnik pop. They have many common musical influences with the 
    Washington Dead Cats (end of the Sixties), but sound differently (can you 
    remember the original theme from TV serie The Saint ? Mix it with 1977
    punk sound, and you get The Satellites). I've been told they were highly 
    recommendable live. Of course they have the adequate look (cf. the cover 
    of their 2nd LP 'Riches et C�l�bres'), somewhat kitsch. 
    In fact, I should say that more kitsch-er than them is hardly imaginable. 
    But MIKADO, a Parisian duet managed to achieve it : their videos look like 
    Egyptian scopitones from the Fifties and the songs are in conformity with 
    it, like their biggest hit (that means about 300 copies sold) : 'Je Suis La 
    Fille Du Soleil' (I am the daughter of the sun). I don't think they still 
    exist, I'm not sure they have ever played live once, but I couldn't help 
    myself mentioning them.
    
    NUCLEAR DEVICE come from Le Mans and sound like The Clash in their 
    'Sandinista' period. I don't know much about them (only one good single),
    so I'd rather talk about THE BATMEN, whose first single 'Get On Your Knees'
    is a classic to me (there are now two LPs available that could be compared 
    to early That Petrol Emotion). I never had the opportunity to see them 
    live, but a friend of mine who was student in Grenoble (where the Batmen 
    come from) was sort-of crazy about them and belonged to their "cult
    followers" (yes they have some). 
    
    However, they are less popular over here than LES THUGS, from Angers. Three
    albums (Electric Troubles, Radical Hystery, Still Hungry) and not a single 
    mistake. They were recently touring the United States, supporting various 
    Sub Pop groups. They don't have yet a worldwide reputation of course, but
    have the international dimension indeed. Besides, lots of new groups
    emerge in their wake, like THOMSON ROLLETS, DIRTY HANDS, SHAKING DOLLS, and
    (last but not least) MAD MONSTER PARTY. I discovered this new Angoul�me-
    based band via a compilation LP, and they already are on a level with UK 
    groups like Mega City Four or the Senseless Things.
    
    I also shall not forget PARABELLUM and OTH. These are rather old bands
    (OTH were formed in Montpellier in 77 or so) and champions of what is 
    called street credibility. They are not bad at all; Parabellum's lyrics 
    have a social content and are really witty. They once made a memorable 
    version of Jacques Brel's 'Amsterdam' (with their own lyrics, of course). 
    Punk's not dead either with LES CAFARDS (The Cockroachs). I know only one 
    song from them and it is excellent.
    
    Let's close this chapter with one the most famous group (still) on the 
    French Indie scene, LES GARCONS BOUCHERS. Members of the band set up the 
    seminal label Boucherie Productions a few years ago, and have signed a 
    couple of good bands like La Mano Negra (see above). The sound of Les 
    Gar�ons Bouchers is very raw, and their songs deal with various subjects 
    such as beer, meat, beer, and sometimes wine. In fact, they built this 
    "rabelaisienne" reputation with three singles, 'La Bi�re', 'Carnivore' and 
    'Du Beaujolais' which is in fact a cover of the old hit 'No Milk Today'. 
    They are wild on stage (and so is their audience...if you see dozens of 
    police-vans parked in front of a club, the group might be Les Gar�ons 
    Bouchers). Their singer is a sort of fat skinhead and also plays with LOS 
    CARAYOS and PIGALLE. Los Carayos, along with other groups like CHIHUAHUA, 
    sound a bit like La Mano Negra (hispanic influences) but stay pretty 
    inferior (well at least that's what I think).
    
    
    IV  Rock'n'roll comme papa
    
    
    Thanks to the few brave(s) who have read all this through. Unfortunately, 
    it's not over yet. I have not mentioned the Rock/R'n'B groups, and there
    are many in our lovely country. 
    
    I already said what I thought about KID PHARAON & THE MERCENARIES in this
    conference (note 20.269); well, I think the same about groups like THE 
    SHIFTERS ('Working Too Hard' - a good video for a disastrous song), THE 
    ROADRUNNERS, or THE STEPPING STONES : all as dull as their names. 
    Oops, and there are also individuals like DOMINIC SONIC (made the 378th 
    song ever with the line 'Tears run cold' in it - cheers) or JOHAN ASHERTON 
    (zzzzzzzzz). Don't like them so let's change the subject.
    
    
    V  Goth's not dead
    
    
    In the beginning of the Eighties there was this group called MARQUIS DE
    SADE that made two brilliant albums ('Dantzig Twist' and 'Rue De Siam').
    They were a bit like Joy Division - well, different but as fascinating.
    They splitted long ago, but their singer didn't commit suicide. In fact,
    he set up a new group named MARC SEBERG, about which I have a sort of 
    mitigated opinion. They have good moments, but what used to be cleverness
    with Marquis de Sade has now often become pompousness with Marc Seberg. 
    I have never attended one their concerts, in fear of boring myself to death
    (maybe that's not justified). On the other hand, I'm categorical about
    PASSION FODDER, another semi "oldie". I've never heard anything good from 
    them. They were very proud of having this deal with UK label Situation Two, 
    (or was it Beggars Banquet ?) and they were like 'You can find our records 
    in England, you know!' Well I suppose he was talking about second-hand 
    record shops.
    
    Follow my advice, there are two excellent groups these days : first, 
    THE POLLEN, a French group (�a tombe bien) with a lovely Welsh singer
    whose latest LP, 'Colours And Make Believe' recalls me (much to my aural
    pleasure) the Cocteau Twins and All About Eve (should I have mentioned
    AAE - I wonder). The other is THE SHREDDED ERMINES from Nevers. I heard
    tracks of their first 'Lonely Journey' LP last week on the radio and I 
    think I like it. Both these groups tour the country next month, and I'll 
    try not to miss them.
    
    We also have in stock KAT ONOMA from Nancy (Eastern parts of France - 
    what I heard from them was maybe a bit too cold for a chilly person like 
    me - although authorized sources say they are good), LITTLE NEMO (don't
    appeal much to me), DATA BANK A (much better imo) and JAD WIO. Four years 
    ago, I would have said that Jad Wio was one of the greatest thing 
    happening in this country - and it really was. Line-up was a singer, a 
    guitar player and a tape recorder. They had a couple of fast-tempo songs 
    like 'Cellar Dance'or 'Walk In The Sky With Diamonds', that were brilliant 
    but really danceable, minimal but completely hypnotic. Unfortunately, I'm
    afraid they have been caught by a sort of musical menopause, and what
    I've heard of their recent stuff makes me think that they have lost what 
    used to be so thrilling about them.
    
    
    VI  The last heirs of the great French tradition.
    
    
    I hope that's not the kind of title that makes you run away. Although LES
    V.R.P. (i.e. the commercial travellers) could easily win the "ugliest 
    people pictured on a record cover" contest if there had been any. They wear
    these large ties and worn-out costumes that you can imagine covered with 
    spit after a hard day of door-to-door selling. Their lyrics carry realism
    to extremes, talking about old couples that have been married for 20 years
    and cannot stand each other, or the frustration of the average man watching
    all these gorgeous girls on TV he knows he'll never meet. I have to admit
    they are talented, but their pessimistic mood is communicative, and they
    depress me. 
    
    LES LOUPS are much more trifling and spontaneous. They perpetuate this
    style of street singers that were popular in the Forties and Fifties on
    the slopes of Montmartre (with an updated sound though). I know just a few 
    about them, but they are refreshing.
    
    Why do I talk about LES TETES RAIDES (the stiff heads) in this chapter ?
    Maybe because they are also Parisian to the bone. Their first LP 'Not Dead 
    But Bien Raides' is good and these days they do lots of gigs in small clubs
    in and around Paris.
    
    
    VII Conclusion
    
    
    Here I should conclude (cf title). But as I haven't got a slightest idea 
    about what to put in a conclusion, I'm gonna talk about a few groups I
    have omitted. I don't want to make this note exhaustive (it is not), but 
    I'd be really considered as an amateur if I had not mentioned, well at 
    least MARC MINELLI. He belongs to the Le Havre connection; Le Havre is
    an industrial harbour of the Channel from where emerged lots of groups in 
    the beginning of the decade and home of the - nationally - famous label 
    Closer. Marc Minelli had a very good single last year entitled 'Love 
    Atomic', in the Lightning Seeds style, that unfortunately did not sell 
    much. Marc goes on however, plays many concerts. I saw him in Lyon in 1988
    and had a really good time.
    
    LES CORONADOS are the kind of group that may never win recognition although
    being much ahead of the rest. Not complaisant enough, too tongue-in-cheek.
    They have released two LPs in five years that included some real gems.
    
    LES SOUCOUPES VIOLENTES (excellent name - a play on words) started in 1984
    or so. After a sort of "crossing of the desert", they are back with a LP
    (never heard) and a single ('Et Pour Un Oui, Et Pour Un Non') that these
    days gets heavy rotation on Ou� FM (best radio station in Paris - le son 
    qui a du sens) and deserves it. 
    
    And as I'm getting tired, I'll stop with OUI OUI. They got their name from 
    Enid Blyton's character Noddy, whose French translation is Oui Oui (admire
    my literary knowledge). Along with other groups like THE GAME ('Walk Away',
    great single in 1988), they play a clean and restful pop that's very 
    pleasant to hear, miles away from the troubles of this world.
    
    Thanks for your attention.
    
    Christophe.
659.3Is this guy auditioning for MastermindGREBO::GURUYour twisting my melonsMon Apr 30 1990 12:554
I saw my name mentioned within the last note ... The Rezillos (or Revillos).
These guys split up ages ago ... didn't one of them (not Eugene or Fay Fyfe) join
the Human League. Anyway not long ago Q did a "Where are they now?" on them
so I'll look it out and update this note soon!
659.4WELMTS::GREENBChips from the chocolate fireballMon Apr 30 1990 12:584
    You're right, Stuart. Jo Callis joined the Human League from the
    Rezillos, playing guitar I believe.
    
    Bob
659.5But whats this got to do with France, they shout.JOBBIE::PATTISONA rolling stone gets the wormMon Apr 30 1990 13:088
    A minor point..
    
    Jo Callis joined was with Boots For Dancing after the Rezillos, and
    joined the Human League afterwards. Boots For Dancing released a few
    recordings on the Scottish Pop Aural label, and are sadly missed (by a
    few people anyway, myself included).
    
    Dave
659.6Mastermind ?? Q ???PRSIS7::BERNARDMon Apr 30 1990 13:391
    Das verstehe ich nicht...
659.7WELMTS::GREENBChips from the chocolate fireballMon Apr 30 1990 15:165
    re .5
    
    Thanks for the info, Dave. BFD were a band I only ever heard *of*....
    
    Bob
659.8EASE::CHISHOLMMarchand de PoissonsMon Apr 30 1990 18:2517
    
    	re .6
    
    	Ganz einfach -
    
    	Mastermind. TV quiz show where people answer questions on the most
    	obscure subjects they can think of. e.g. "Life and works of Benito
    	Mussolini's barber, 1-4-1939 to 2-4-1939"
    
    	Q. 'the magazine of music and more' or summat like that, monthly
    	review of new releases, plus interesting features like 'Where are
    	they now', update on current activities of members of deceased
    	bands.
    	
    	Alles klar?
    
    	Doug.
659.9Well then I'm NOT auditioning for MastermindPRSIS7::BERNARDGone fishingWed May 02 1990 10:313
    Alles klar. Danke sch�n, Doug.
    
    Christophe.
659.101991 update?ULYSSE::CHAMPOLLIONTapie ate the carpetWed Jul 03 1991 17:5813
    Christophe,
    
    Just read your quite detailed and documented report on the French
    musical scene. Great stuff.
    
    Would you be so kind as to type in an update? I'd be interested.
    
    As an aside, I lived in Rennes during the Marquis de Sade era. Lots of
    memories and excitement. Also was part of "THE BORDER BOYS". Remember
    that? We sold at least 200 copies!
    
    Salut,
    �Champ�?                             
659.11Did I forget Charlie lee (un)cout(h)ure ??JUMBLY::OCONNORSomone's fishin' in my pondThu Jul 04 1991 16:4141
    hello europe etc...I've just seen discovered this note. Christophhe's
    note (.2) is exhaustive enough to be a hard note to follow. But I'll
    have a shot at it anyhow.

    I saw quite a few French bands between 1981 and '83, when I lived in
    Grenoble and Paris. First was Marquis de Sade in Lyons where they
    encored with a Joy Division song ("24 Hours"). The very cynical singer
    said later "That was for the rabble!" It was still an enjoyable gig but
    his all-round cynicism was a pain. They were from Rennes, and were quite
    an `event' at the time.

    I also saw Rita Mitsouko in Paris in 1983. It was in a small theatre and
    he played guitar and tapes while she sang. (`Minimal' is a good word
    Christophe.) Her hairstyle gave the impression that she'd just dashed
    back from a B52's audition. That was another memorable gig. (I even had
    a single of theirs once.)

    France is best of all for the jazz evenings down South. I attended one
    once in a Roman amphitheatre in Orange (on a warm summer evening...sigh
    ...I could go on...) The artist was Herbie Hancock.

    I also saw Sun Ra in Grenoble, plus Tuxedo Moon (who were slightly
    popular at the time) plus a terrible Bowie concert in Lyons (which I
    left half-way through).

    The other good festivals were a `new music' one in Reims  (Pere Ubu top
    of the bill) and surprisingly, performance art + music in Lyons (the
    Virgin Prunes were there and good). Recently at the Jazz Caf� in Camden
    town I saw Arthur H, who it seems, is the son of French rock star
    Jacques Higelin. Some of his music sounds close to Tom Waits. But only
    some. I may even get the album soon.

    Plus I listen to the two Brel albums (if it's French it has to be Brel).
    Plus that "d�goulace" (sp ?) person Serge Gainsbourg (hey! hey! I've got
    "Je T'aime" with Brigitte Bardot!!) Well...yes...

    That's my two minutes on Mastermind -;)

    - Tim
    
659.12hip no moreRUTILE::BERNARDand the rest will followMon Aug 05 1991 12:2515
Re: .10
    
>    Would you be so kind as to type in an update? I'd be interested.
    
    Glad you liked it. Unfortunately, it might be hard for me to update
    it. At the time I was in Paris, and now I'm in Ferney, which is as
    far as one can imagine from "where the action is". On the other hand,
    there's Uncle Piers here who has encyclopedic knowledge on the early-80's 
    UK scene. Listening to him, I feel like living again this fascinating 
    period.

    Christophe.

PS: I have to admit I've never heard of the Border Boys. Shame on me.    

659.13Go WestRUTILE::LETCHERNo dark daysWed Aug 07 1991 08:348
    There is no point whatsoever in simply talking about leaving Ferney,
    Christophe. You must steel yourself for hard times in the real world,
    set forth, and show people that you have not in fact taken a) early
    retirement, or b) some kind of sinecure.
    
    Sagely yours,
    
    Piers
659.14Kindly enlighten me please...........XSTACY::NBLEHEINFri Aug 09 1991 14:419
Could somebody please explain a little about Elmer Foodbeat (they are French 
I take it?) . They seem to be getting quite a lot of exposure in this country 
lately. 
    Also I heard bits of a tape of theirs at the week-end and thought it was 
rather good .
    I would be grateful if someone could give me a little history and names of
any releases outside France etc.
                         
              Nially