| T.R | Title | User | Personal
Name | Date | Lines |
|---|
| 1357.1 | | SMART2::DGAUTHIER | | Wed May 21 1997 18:50 | 12 |
| I read the first part by the President, Joseph Teach. Correct me if
I'm wrong, but it sounds like this decision was made by a group of
church leaders, or perhaps just one leader? It seems like a somewhat
radical change in doctrine.
Do people join a church for direction? Can a church leadership provide
bad direction? How do you know when this is true? If your church were
to suddenly forsake Jesus as Christ, would you stick with them? How
much weight should one give in the guidance provided by a church?
-dave
|
| 1357.2 | | PHXS02::HEISER | Maranatha! | Wed May 21 1997 19:03 | 6 |
| More details on the remarkable change. It appears Hank Hanegraaff, the
"Bible Answer Man" had quite a role in this.
http://www.wcg.org/wn/95Dec5/today.htm
http://www.wcg.org/pt/96Feb/comntary.htm
http://www.wcg.org/wn/95Nov14/radio.htm
|
| 1357.3 | | PHXS02::HEISER | Maranatha! | Fri May 23 1997 13:04 | 53 |
| | I read the first part by the President, Joseph Teach. Correct me if
| I'm wrong, but it sounds like this decision was made by a group of
| church leaders, or perhaps just one leader? It seems like a somewhat
| radical change in doctrine.
I've seen testimonies from the non-leadership and they agree with the
decision. They haven't had a major fall-out in membership. Sometimes
this depends on the hierarchy of the church or cult in question.
| Do people join a church for direction?
Many do. Jesus Christ was a shepherd/teacher (among other things).
One of the gifts He gave the church (Ephesians 4:11) are
pastor/teachers. Their job is to equip the saints and build up the
body of Christ for the Lord's work.
| Can a church leadership provide bad direction?
Sure can. Look at what this cult did. Look at some of the mistakes of
the Catholic Church over the centuries. Look at Jim Jones, Applewhite,
Koresh, etc. Even Jim Bakker and Jimmy Swaggart. The leaders of the
"Name it and Claim it" Faith movement have been providing bad direction
for decades now. Those in the Toronto & Pensacola movements are
providing not only bad direction, but are endangering their flocks.
|How do you know when this is true?
When they declare things in God's name that totally contradict the
Bible.
|If your church were to suddenly forsake Jesus as Christ, would you
|stick with them?
Not a chance.
|How much weight should one give in the guidance provided by a church?
I think the Bible says it best in Acts 17:11 and I Peter 3:15
17:10 And the brethren immediately sent away Paul and Silas by night unto
Berea: who coming thither went into the synagogue of the Jews.
17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received
the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily,
whether those things were so.
The Bereans were considered honorable because they always contrasted
teaching with the perfect Word of God. They weren't deceived by bad
leadership.
I Peter 3:15
But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an
answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with
meekness and fear:
|
| 1357.4 | | SMART2::DGAUTHIER | | Fri May 23 1997 13:16 | 8 |
| > When they declare things in God's name that totally contradict the
> Bible.
Well, it would appear that this group was following something like the
Jewish Bible, or just the OT prior to this conversion. It would seem
that they changed Bibles as well as philosophy. Yes? No?
|
| 1357.5 | | PHXS02::HEISER | Maranatha! | Fri May 23 1997 13:22 | 5 |
| I think they were heavily legalistic or at least too Old Testament
focused while ignoring New Testament context. They now embrace the
entire Bible and have learned you need to interpret the Old Testament
in light of the New Testament. Afterall, the Old Testament is the New
Testament concealed, the New Testament is the Old Testament revealed.
|
| 1357.6 | | SMARTT::DGAUTHIER | | Fri May 23 1997 17:42 | 18 |
| Well, it seems sort of strange that the majority of the members would
accept such a radical change based on a decision made by church
leaders. I mean they accepted and adopted a non-christian belief
system when they joined the church. The leaders decide it's time to
become christian and they say fine, I'll be a christian now? If
someone asked them why they were christian, would they say that they're
christian because the church leaders told them to be? What if the
leaders decide to switch to Islam next year? Will they continue to
follow?
I've always thought that a christian's beliefs were based on a personal
understanding of the Bible or a personal faith or a personal
relationship with God and less on the direction set by church leaders.
Is it typical for people to join a church then become christian or the
other way around?
-dave
|