Conference lgp30::christian-perspective

    Winning means somebody else loses.
    
    	Ron
    

    
    I believe that Paul of Tarsus compared the life of faith to winning a
    race and fighting a good fight.  He spoke of training and the sacrifice
    but the glory of winning. 
    
    The Old Testament is full of promises of prosperity and of doom
    depending upon Israel's obedience.
    
    jeff
    

    
    
    ...winning is fun. Loosing is not.
    
    David

    "Again I saw that under the sun the race is not to the swift, nor the
    battle to the strong, nor the bread to the wise, nor riches to the
    intelligent, nor favor to the skillful; but time and chance happen to
    them all."
    		Ecclesiastes 9:11

    RE: .4 In the secular version the last phrase is often quoted as
    "but that's the way to place your bet." :-)
    
    		Alfred

A phrase that in recent days went quickly in and out of vogue claims:
"The one who dies with the most toys - wins."

Ecclesiates, on the other hand, is an outstanding choice of text to demonstrate
the ultimate futility of success, worldly acquisitions, wealth, power and
every sexual delight imaginable.

And then there was Job, a righteous man who was stripped of everything --
loved ones, health, property and prosperity -- all due to a kind of whimsical
wager between God and Satan.  In the end, however, Job is reinstated to his
former level of success and blessed with even more than before.

In ancient times, having many strong, healthy children was considered a
measure of economic success.  Children were assets as workers and also as
insurance that one would be cared for in one's old age.  The couple who were
given a handicapped child were thought to be cursed, out of favor with God,
disgraced.  In some parts of the world in modern times, it is still so.

Richard

    The concept of "winning" carries with it the concept of a concrete
    finish, a completion.  You win or you lose when something is over.  Was
    it Yogi Berra who said that "it ain't over until it's over"?  If he
    didn't say it, it's not important--the point is that the sports
    metaphor applies here.  The winner of a game is decided only once the
    game is over--and then the result is irreversible and final.

    However, if you are engaged in an ongoing process, then there is never
    a final "win" or "loss" to tally.  It might be fair to say that you are
    currently "winning" or "losing", but in competitive sports and games
    those adjectives describe only current conditions, and are tentative
    and subject to change.  Possibilities are still open, and the final
    results are not known with complete certainty.  If someone tells you
    that they are "winning" in a game of chess, you know that they have a
    greater probability of being declared the "winner" when the game is
    over; but, except perhaps during the endgame or when the advantage is
    decided, simply being in that state of "winning" is not a guarantee of
    certainty.

    If life is an ongoing process, then that elusive goal of being the
    "winner" is never attained; the only finality to your life is your own
    death, and once you are dead, having the most toys won't matter.  The
    pursuit of success for its own sake only feeds on itself because the
    game never completes as long as you are alive.  It is like playing a
    baseball game that is perpetually in the seventh inning.  Even if you
    are winning the game, no matter how many runs you score, you can always
    score more, and you can never rest on the runs you've already got
    because you have no limit on the chances to blow your lead.  The
    pursuit of material or worldly fortune (I don't just mean monetary
    wealth when I speak of "fortune" here) can feed on itself like that--no
    matter how much you have, it is never enough, and seeking more of it
    becomes an overriding goal unto itself.

    Perhaps what we should be doing is considering the process itself
    rather than the goal--the process of living justly and humbly with God,
    rather than the endless pursuit of fortunes which by their very nature
    necessarily elude our grasp.  The certainty and security we seek in the
    pursuit of success are not to be found.  The process can become a joy
    of its own.  The best extended trips are not the ones where we "can't
    wait to get there", but rather the ones in which each moment brings a
    joy of its own, in its own right; the destination is only the icing on
    the cake.

    -- Mike

    Well said, Mike!
    
    I think I'd sum up your point with what I was once told, "It doesn't
    matter so much what you *DO*, but who you *ARE*".  
    
    Here's to living in the highest level of joy!
    
    Nanci

    Hmmm.. I really like what you said Mike.  Thanks for sharing your
    input.
    
    Joe