Conference lgp30::christian-perspective

       I became employed in 1979 as Customer Response Representative for
Digital Field Service in Phoenix.  Led once by conscience and once by
circumstances, I transferred twice within the company, the last time to
Colorado Springs.  I presently serve as a Call Screening Specialist
providing support for Digital internally for the U.S. area.

	My church affiliations include Congregationalist (now UCC),
Presbyterian, Religious Society of Friends (Quaker), and United Methodist.
I would describe myself as a mystic Christian.  With increasing frequency,
I have experienced the nudgings of the Divine Presence, and I have been
moved to seek the Diaconal Ministry.

       I'm presently a member of the Board of the Pikes Peak Justice
and Peace Commission and serve as Chairperson of Church and Society
for the United Methodist Church for the Pikes Peak area.

Richard Jones-Christie

    Mike Valenza, signing in from Colorado Springs.

    I am an attender of the Colorado Springs meeting, Religious Society of
    Friends.  I would describe myself theologically as a unitarian Quaker
    universalist:  unitarian because of my views on the divinity of Jesus;
    Quaker because of my attraction to the Quaker faith and practices; and
    universalist because I believe in the validity of many different
    spiritualities, and because I believe that none possesses an exclusive
    monopoly on truth.  Although I do not accept the divinity of Jesus,
    I do base many of my own ethical values on the Sermon on the Mount,
    which I profoundly admire, which I believe embodies the highest of
    virtues, and from which I have derived my belief in pacifism.
    
    Though I am interested in various spiritualities, I am personally the
    most interested in certain developments that have arisen from the
    Western, Christian tradition.  Some examples include Process Theology,
    Creation Spirituality, Liberation Theology, Feminist Theology, and
    various theologies of religious pluralism.  Many of these theologies
    need not be inherently Christian (examples include Judith Plaskow's
    Jewish feminist theology, and Marc Ellis's Jewish theology of
    liberation); but in most cases they have arisen in the context of
    Christian theology, and so I usually turn to various Christian sources
    for exploring these developments.
    
    I am looking forward to participating here.

    -- Mike

G'day Richard, Karen and the other Mod's,
	and indeed all who will be reading this, `Hi !'.

	It is with some minor trepidation that I am entering this note.  I will
probably be, for the most part, `read-only' in here, as I am sure most of you
know me from the GOLF::CHRISTIAN conference (and previously IOSG::), and thus
know (in part) my (present) theological stance i.e. very much in line with the
GOLF::CHRISTIAN conference.

	I am *NOT* here to `hassle' anyone as to why they should believe as I
do, or why I don't believe as they do - with the idea of `converting' them.  I
*will*, if I feel strongly enough about a topic, enter in and say my piece, from
my own theological standpoint, and then step back again.

	To an extent, I regret the need for this conference, however, I can also
see the reasoning behind the `goals, non-goal & guidelines' of the 
aforementioned conference, and in that conference I support those.

	I must admit that I am a little wary of the moderators here leaving 
their definition of "reasonable" "christian"ity so open (cf 2.0), but am willing
to observe (and at times take part in) this ``experiment''.

	FWIW, God Bless you all, and I pray that we will all come to know one-
another in a mutually uplifting environment, as we help each other to a more 
personal relationship with God, and His only Son, Jesus Christ.
								hazza :*]

    
    Hi dear friends [as I've come to think of you all], :)
    
    Harry, you're a "hard act to follow", as the saying goes...but I'm
    honored to be next. :)
    
    For those who will be coming along later to this notesfile and
    might not know me, I am also from GOLF::CHRISTIAN, and have
    my faith very much centered in Jesus who to me *is* the Son of
    God [God manifested in the flesh]. I have come to know His
    love and have been blessed to see that love work in the lives
    of many around me even before they were aware of its Source.
    I have seen His agape' love shed abroad, and am thankful that
    He showers that love on all, not just an exclusive group.
    
    Truly, I'm *very* glad to see you folks here, undertaking this 
    endeavor, and will keep your efforts wrapped in prayer that many
    would come to a deeper understanding of God as He really is and not
    in the way that organized religions have so often presented Him. 
    I know that God answers prayer and I believe that much good will come
    from this conference.
    
    May God be with you to guide you and all who come into this
    circle of fellowship.
    
    In His agape',                              
    Irena

Good morning.

Today I turn 34 and a new conference springs up.  Since I join all these
types of conferences, I'll join this one too.

I'm a follower of our LORD Jesus Christ.  I accept the original writings
of the 66 books of the Bible as inerrant and breathed out by the Holy
Spirit (third person of the Trinity) through the numerous authors.  I
have had the opportunity to attend Gordon-Conwell Theological Seminary
which has enabled me to grow very much in learning what the Bible says
as well as what it means.  Unfortunately, I did not grow as much spiritually
as God (or I) had wanted. :-(

I look forward to the opportunity of discussing what the Scriptures say
and what they mean.

Glad that you have started a conference which, I think, will definately
help out the Christian conference by allowing it to focus more on its goals
and less on moderation of those who have a differing perspective of its
goals.

Collis Jackson

Greetings all,

This is a short introduction, but I hope "who I am and where I come from" 
will be evidenced by what I write. 

I tend to come and go, trying to share of my own experience and questioning 
faith as the Spirit leads me. 

Beyond mere tolerance, I am working towards community.

I come from an alcoholic and sexually abusive family of origin, and in my 
recovery I have been led to a Christian faith that accepts, values, and 
rejoices in the loving faith of others. 

Peace,

Jim

    I'm here to fill the spot that Bob Messenger has in CHRISTIAN. Like Bob
    in that conference, I will most probably not agree with a lot of what
    is entered here and will question people about their beliefs to try and
    understand them, and to help keep us all honest. :-)
    
      I am a conservative in my beliefs (Biblical inerrancy, trinitarian, 
    Jesus-is-the-ONLY-way, you know what I mean) and a radical in applying
    those beliefs (stick around you'll see what I mean :-)). I am
    born-again, charismatic, evangelical, pro-life, ant-Satan. 
    
    I promise to behave.
    
    Gil

Hello everyone.  I'm in sort of a strange situation, being a non-Christian
(agnostic) who is co-moderating a Christian conference.  Even though I don't
believe in Christian dogma, I do come from a Christian background and I'm
interested in talking about and possibly learning from Christianity even
if I don't believe in it.

I've introduced myself in other conferences, but I guess it doesn't hurt to
repeat myself.  In 1966, when I was 7 years old, my parents decided that they
wanted to become (United Methodist) missionaries.  Our family lived in
Rhodesia (now called Zimbabwe) for seven years (1968 to early 1971 and 1973 to
1976), although I left in 1975 to avoid having to register for the Rhodesian
draft.  I lived with my aunt for a year in Indiana and then attended Purdue
University.  I worked for the university for three years after graduation
and came to work for Digital in 1984 as a software engineer in what was then
called the Terminals Business Unit.  My most significant job in the terminals
group has been as a developer of DECterm, the DECwindows terminal emulator.
This is my last week in the terminals group (now called the Video, Imaging
and Printing Systems group); next week I start a new job with the VMS
DECwindows group in the "ivory tower": ZKO in Nashua, NH.

I'm not sure exactly when I stopped believing in Christianity.  By the time
I was in college I knew this much: faith was not something that I wanted
to base my life on.  I would believe in God if and only if such belief was
based on evidence interpreted with human reasoning.

Nevertheless, I do think there is value in Christianity, and in many ways I
have to admit that I think like a liberal Christian (as opposed to thinking
like a Moslem or thinking like a Buddhist).  The big thing with me is
individual freedom, and the conflict comes when we have to consider the
necessity of sacrificing one person's freedom for the common good.

I hope that by starting a new conference we'll bring in Christians who have
been turned off by the rigidity of GOLF::CHRISTIAN.  With more open discussions
than are possible in the other conference maybe we can come a little bit
closer to the truth, or at least to understand the beliefs of a wider range
of people.  As Collis, I think it was, mentioned, this could also help reduce
the friction in CHRISTIAN by giving "dissenters" an outlet for expressing
their views.

I don't think CHRISTIAN-PERSPECTIVE should be *only* a debating society,
though.  It is also a place for Christians to praise God, pray for each
other and affirm their faith.  That's why I felt that it was important that
the conference should be organized by Christians.  I'm happy to help out,
though, by co-moderating and hopefully by contributing to an atmosphere of
friendly discussion through my own participation in the conference.


				-- Bob

    Happy Birthday Collis, fellow Virgo!  Mine was the 16th :-)
    
    I'm Karen Berggren, signing in from Marlboro.
    
    My first affiliation was with the Congregationalist church, 
    although I do not recall much of the teachings of that particular 
    theology.  What I do remember was being told when I was about 7, 
    that the magical beings that I shared special relationships with, 
    ie. Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, and the Tooth Fairy, did not in 
    fact exist, and in actuality were my parents.  What a 
    disappointment!  At that moment, I also wondered when I was going 
    to be told that God didn't exist....
    
    I then found myself belaboring the question for months "Did God 
    exist or didn't *he*?"  So I devised a little test for him, a 
    seemingly easy way for him to show me he was real.  I picked out 
    the best looking piece of fudge from my mother's kitchen one day, 
    placed it upon my headboard that night and prayed, for what seemed 
    like an eternity, beseeching God to eat the fudge while I slept 
    that night.  That way when I awoke the next morning and found it 
    gone, I'd **know** he was real.
    
    One of the things I do remember being told is that God knows the 
    deepest needs in our heart, hears all of our prayers and answers 
    them too.  This being the first time I had *ever* asked God for 
    anything, I thought I'd have pretty good luck with getting this 
    one answered, ...providing he *was* real.
    
    My most sincere prayers done, I struggled to fall to sleep and finally
    did.  I awoke the next morning, shot out of bed and looked at the 
    spot in which I had left the piece of fudge for God.  It was still 
    there -- untouched.  Bummer... God hadn't even tried! :-(  So began 
    the estranged, ambivalent relationship I was to have with God for 
    the next twenty years or so of my life.
    
    I am very happy to say however, that *much* (an understatement!) has 
    happened during the last ten years.  I entered a very dark period of 
    my life about thirteen years ago marked by increasingly frequent 
    thoughts of suicide.  I had, what I can only describe as a mystical 
    experience involving an angel one night, which I believe to this day 
    saved my life.
    
    Today after exploring many other paths and discerning wisdom in 
    each, I have returned to my Christian roots and have found a very 
    nurturing, inspirational, growthful home in the theology of 
    Creation Spirituality.  Highly intuitive and involved in healing 
    and creative work through prayer, art, drumming (yes, drumming!) 
    and the process of laying on of hands, I consider myself to be a 
    Christian mystic.  Since my heritage includes Blackfoot Indian, 
    I have also explored and found much affinity with native american 
    spiritualities, which Creation Spirituality encompasses.
    
    I believe in the divinity of Jesus Christ, and consider the Bible 
    to contain many good teachings, particularly those found in Jesus' 
    Sermon on the Mount, but at this time do not consider the Bible to 
    be an infallible, impeccable document.  I am no longer searching 
    for God or Jesus;  I concern myself in becoming more Christ-like 
    in my daily life, sharing that with our Earth Mother and all her 
    kingdoms, and with all my human brothers and sisters.
    
    Well, I've said quite enough for now :-).  I very much look 
    forward to participating and learning from everything people would
    like to offer here.
    
    peace & blessings to all.

    Hi, Everyone.
    
    Wook Lee here.  I'm a born-again Christian from a Christian family with
    a slightly mixed bag of affliations.  I was baptized in a Methodist
    church, born again in a Baptist church, confirmed in a Presbyterian
    church and now serving at a Methodist church.  I guess you could say
    that I've come full circle.
    
    I'm a software engineer in DIM&T HQ in Concord doing strategic work in
    information systems and technologies.  I've also been married for a
    year and a half now.
    
    I'm heavily involved in bible study and Sunday school at my church and
    welcome this conference as a chance to exchange views with fellow
    Christians in a low-key setting that stresses fellowship.  I've been
    called to serve, so I hope to enrich my understanding of God's Will
    through these interactions and gain insight into the diversity of the
    body of Christ.
    
    I've had lots of ups and downs in my walk with Christ, so I hope that
    I'll be openminded to a wide variety of views though I probably won't
    be wholeheartedly supportive of some or perhaps even many of them.
    
    In Christ.
    
    Wook

    Hello,
    
    I am a Christian.  I go to the Episcopal church and my background is as
    a preacher's kid and member of the UCC church.  I identify most with
    what some would call "New Age" thinking, and I am the chair of the
    Executive Council of The Universal Listening Post.  
    
    Donald Reinke

    
    Hi.  I'm here to learn whatever I can - perhaps I will learn to in-
    corporate more and more elements of Christianity into my beliefs - I
    cannot say.  But for some time I've been compelled to look again and
    again at Christianity to see what it might hold for me.
    
    A couple of days ago I was witnessed to by a Christian friend who 
    told me that she had a dream in which God told her to tell me about
    Jesus's word.  She was also told that I had had a vision, which I
    did several years ago.  I felt very happy when she told me how much
    Christianity meant to her - it was very plain to see how happy it made
    her - but I did not feel motivated to change my own spirituality be-
    cause of this.  I feel as secure in myself as she is in her beliefs.
    What I'm discovering is that since I told her about my beliefs (some-
    what New Age, I guess) she has lost some respect for me......
    
    At any rate, I refuse to pass any sort of judgement on her or on an
    entire group of people because of any of this - instead I will contin-
    ue listen and questioning until I'm satisfied.  I believe this sort
    of an effort is what will keep a conference of this sort moving in a
    positive direction.
    
    My roots:
    
    My parents pretty much forced me to go to Sunday school around the
    time when I was in the 4th and 5th grade.  Originally, I liked parts
    of it, but couldn't understand why my parents did not attend any
    services.  It seems my mother felt as though she were handing on
    some sort of tradition that *her* mother would have wanted.  Even-
    tually, I began to dislike going (I can't remember why).  When it
    was mentioned that my parents should go too, we were allowed to stop
    going.  
    
    Since then I have been able to pick up a Bible from time to time and
    find some inspiring things.  I also enjoy what I've read of the Nag
    Hammadi finds contained in "The Gnostic Gospels" by Elaine Pagels.
    
    Looking forward to discussion....
    
    guy
    
    

Hi,

I'm Ro Flaherty, a Technical Senior Writer in Merrimack, NH.  I would 
'classify' myself as a Christian, as similarly described by Karen 
Berggren, Donald Reinke, and others.  I was raised as an Episcopalian 
and am appreciative of those roots.  I do not presently attend church 
because the church that I would prefer to attend currently has only 
two churches in the U.S. and they are located in Texas and Los 
Angeles.  It is the Church of the White Eagle Lodge.  I will enter a 
topic on White Eagle's teachings when time permits.

Ro

    
    Hi everybody - thanks for starting this conference!
    
    I'm a Unitarian Universalist Christian.  I believe that God is at the
    center of all religions which hold unconditional Love and service to 
    humankind as their guiding principles.
    
    I've always believed that God existed, and was raised attending the
    Baptist, Episcopalian and Methodist churches.  Three years ago I had a
    mystical experience and felt the power and Love God as expressed to me
    through a dear (agnostic) friend.  Suddenly the earlier Sunday School 
    stories of God's love as expressed through Christ and His life and 
    teachings became very real and my life was forever changed.  
    
    Looking forward to some positive, open, caring, kind and loving
    discussions.
    
    May God bless this conference.
    
    Cindy
    
    PS. Hi Wook!  Been a long time.  Congratulations!
                                        

    
    
    Hi,
    
    I'm Carole Fretts, and I work as a Business Systems Analyst in the 
    Southeast Atlantic Financial Management Center in DLB9, Marlboro.
    At this time, I can't say that I am a Christian.  I was raised a
    Roman Catholic, but have not practiced in many, many years.  I am
    in a state right now of allowing all the images that I hold of God
    to be shattered.  It is becoming easier to be with this process,
    and am excited that I am clearing the decks for a deeper truth to
    fill.  I look forward to the discussions here.
    
    Carole

    I'm also one who has been involved in the CHRISTIAN conference for
    years. I am a Christian per the Biblical definition of the term (i.e.
    I am trusting Jesus Christ, the Son of God, as my personal Lord and
    Savior). I would most likely be described as being quite conservative
    inasmuch as I take the Bible as the only authoritative, inspired,
    inerrant Word of God.
    
    The Lord saved me at age 11 (I'm now 32) and has called me to learn and
    teach the Bible since my early teens. I've been with DEC for over 8
    years, mostly doing software development for customers.
    
    	BD�

  I'm hesitant to participate in the other conference because of the
hurtful and denigrating things that have been written and done there.
I pray that this conference will truly embody the Spirit of Christ.
My heartfelt thanks to the moderators for taking this on.

  My name is Peter Andrews. I am a practising Protestant Episcopalian and
my parish church is All Saints in Worcester, Mass. Occasionally I take
communion at the Catholic Workers' Mustard Seed and more rarely at St Mark's
where Worcester's Dignity/Integrity group meets.

  I am both gay and Christian (a position which causes some problems to some
gays and to some Christians sometimes, although I personally don't). My
partner and I have been in a committed relationship for five years (we dated
for a year before that). Time permitting, I love to garden and read.

    Howdy!
    
    My name is Jerry Davis, and I am a proposal manager for the South
    Central Government District.  I live in Dallas, Texas.  I have 4 great
    boys, ages 8, 6, 4, and 3.
    
    I am theologically conservative, (like Irena, Gil, and Barry).  I have
    been a rover.  I was raised Church of Christ, became agnostic, became a
    Catholic, became agnostic for many more years, became a Methodist -
    where I became a Christian, and finally I have been a Baptist for 5
    years.
    
    I believe in the innerrancy of the Scriptures, I believe that Jesus IS
    God, and IS the ONLY way to Heaven. And I believe that Grace is FREE
    with no more needed.
    
    As Irena, Gil, and Barry probably know, I am the one who wrote the
    CONCORDANCE program for VMS in my spare time (Ha!).  I also am mostly a
    READ_ONLY person, but I do say a few things from time to time.
    
    As a final note, I believe that we Christians have NOT paid nearly
    enough attentian to our Jewish roots.  Christianity IS Jewish after
    all.  I study the Bible with that in mind.
    
    Regards,
    Jerry

    	Like Carole, I was raised a Roman Catholic. I was in my 20s when I
    left that group. I had come to believe that their various doctrins had
    lost sight of the teachings of Christ. It took me nearly a decade to
    tell my mother - and she still does not accept my positions.
    	I am a christian in that I believe in the teachings of Christ. I
    also believe in something which we can call "God" and that part of that
    something resides in all of us, as it did in Christ, making us all
    "God's children". My acceptance of the Bible is as a culturally biased
    historical work, rather than as "the Word of God".
    	I will try to keep my comments somewhat in check and avoid
    instigating any wars. Mike, Richard and Cindy can attest to my ability
    to "FLAME ON" with little provocation. Oh, and I tend not to read
    anything more than 3 or 4 screens long - like Mr.Moderator's intro.;')

    
        I'm Mike Seabury and I don't have a religious affiliation.
    I am a Zen Buddhist :-)
        I have an interest in Christians and Christianity and how
    to get along with the former and understand the later. 
        Mostly, I ask a lot of questions. Let this be a warning to
    you should you ask me if I have any further questions about
    something.
    
                                                       Mike
     

    I am a bible-believing Christian. My views tend toward the conservative
    (although I confuse some of my conservative friends with what they
    consider liberal views). I am also Jewish and I tend to discuss things
    from a "sterotypical" Jewish perspective (i.e., rational argument and
    questioning of all positions, including my own, in order to arrive at
    the truth). Oh yes, I believe that there is an absolute truth (Jesus
    said there was, in fact he said he was it).
    
    My involvement here will be erratic as my current position requires
    much of my time and doesn't leave a great deal of time for noting (so
    please be patient if I enter into a discussion and drop out of sight).
    
    
    - Barry Wallis

    I'm Pete Goodwin, a Software Engineer working in DECpark, Reading,
    England.
    
    I'd describe myself as 'christian influenced'; I did belong to the
    Navigators at one stage, but left shortly after a bad experience with
    certain Charismatic members.
    
    I'm read-only in the other conference, simply because I reject some of
    the guidelines there. I don't believe in the Bible's inerrancy, or that
    it is god's word. Having said that, I think it has lot of interest to
    me and my beliefs.
    
    I'm curious about "New Age" after hearing that expression used so much,
    though I'm not sure exactly what it stands for!
    
    I occaisonally write poetry of a christian flavour - most of them are
    in MTBLUE::POETRY.
    
    Pete.

        I'm Bob Fleischer, almost 42 years old, husband of Nancy and
        father of three kids, John, Anne, and Beth.
                                   
        I was born and raised in a Catholic family (my father was a
        Lutheran but converted to Catholicism when I was three or
        four).  I attended Catholic grammar and high schools.

        As for some others who were raised in Christian homes, I find
        it impossible to name a date when I first had faith in
        Christ.

        My earliest recollection of religious attitude is that I
        fervently prayed to God for something when I was in sixth and
        seventh grades.  While it was something I shouldn't have (I
        now know), I am glad for the continuing relationship I had to
        Christ as a result of that frequent prayer.

        I really appreciate the religious orientation of my high
        school, which was taught by Benedictine monks.  I think that
        it was especially important that Bible study was treated by
        them with the same importance and with as much scholarly
        detail as was any other subject.  It was not just a tacked-on
        "religion" class.

        At times college was quite a burden, but my relationship to
        Christ helped me through.  The college's Catholic club was
        one of the few activities I had time for, and it was one of
        the few places at school where I felt welcomed and supported
        by fellow students.

        It was through the Catholic club that I learned about the
        Paulist Center on Park Street in Boston.  I continued to
        fellowship there after graduation.

        I was looking for singles' activities in the "Boston After
        Dark" classified section one day when I saw two church
        listings, one for Park Street Church and one for Arlington
        Street Church.  Since I was familiar with the Park Street
        area, I went to and joined the Park Street "Grad Group".  It
        was at the Grad Group where I met my wife.  (She was there
        all along, but I didn't pay much attention to her until four
        years later!  It turns out that Nancy was the social
        committee person who placed the ad in "Boston After Dark".) 

        (My wife's background is Evangelical Free Church and she
        attended Eastern Nazarene College.) 

        It was also at the Grad Group that I resumed my interest in
        Bible study. (It was also where I learned the terminology and
        theology of evangelical Christians!)  And I continued to
        attend the Paulist Center as well.

        Shortly after we were married I took a job in Denver.  I
        jokingly said to Nancy that it would be nice to find a joint
        Catholic-Protestant church.  The first week we were there I
        looked in the yellow pages and sure enough found an entry for
        "experimental Catholic-Presbyterian community".  We went
        there and found a spirit and understanding of Christ that we
        had not seen anywhere else.  They had only a morning service
        and we went to an Evangelical Free Church in the evening. 
        (This was before we had kids -- and had lots of time!)

        But I had a strong interest in education and DEC was the
        leading computer company in education, so I wound up back in
        the Boston area working for DEC.  Quite frankly, we hadn't
        been able to find the kind of church fellowship we really
        would like in the area around our home in Groton.  Neither
        the "standard" Catholic congregation nor the "standard"
        evangelical congregation seems quite complete to us  -- we
        have seen a broader expression and understanding of
        Christianity than either of them alone usually provides.

        We attended a local Catholic church for about two years, but
        for the next five years we attended the Dunstable
        Congregational Church.  One of the things that prompted us to
        make the switch was that the Catholic churches in this area
        do not provide nurseries, but now we had kids!  (Our son just
        didn't make it in the cry room.)

        The Dunstable church has fallen on some very hard times, with
        a great loss of membership in an already small church, and so
        we left.  We eventually found the best fellowship -- and good
        teaching in the Sunday sermons -- right in our own backyard,
        Sacred Heart Church (RC) in Groton.  There is a lot to be
        said for belonging to a congregation that includes many
        people you also see and deal with in your community and
        schools.

        My viewpoint on the Bible can be found in note 18.1.

        Something made me feel rather good yesterday.  One of our
        teenage neighbors was working on a school assignment in which
        she had to interview a number of people about their
        conception of Jesus and God.  She used our word processor to
        write the report, and as I was helping her use it, I saw part
        of it.  In describing her interview with my son John, she
        said that he was more open and confident in his conversation
        about Jesus as Lord and Savior than anyone else she
        interviewed or knew.  I am very (and humbly) thankful to God
        that our children are growing that well!

        Perhaps the biggest personal problem I have is that I spend
        very little time these days in prayer and spiritual readings,
        since family life and work have been rather draining lately. 
        Pray that I may do more of them.  Thanks.
        
        Bob

    
    Greetings everyone,
    
    I'm Bill Wooldridge, I work in the Kanata plant in Canada.
    
    I belong to the Kanata Free Methodist Church. I came to know the
    Lord Jesus Christ just over two years ago and still growing in the
    Lord. I believe the bible as the infallible word of God and the final
    authority in all matters of faith. That Jesus id God's Son, the only
    means of salvation and peace with God. That we are saved by God's grace
    through faith in Christ finished work on the cross and His resurrection
    from the dead, and that we are kept by the power of His spirit abiding
    within. And look forword to His immient return to receive us to
    Himself.
    
    May the Lord be with you all, and God bless,
    
    Bill

	Jackson T. (Jack) Cole, Atlanta, Southeast District EIS Consultant

	Born-again Christan, Southern Baptist (not in the fundamentalist camp
as defined by the press!)

	Married, 3 children, directing the Pre-School Sunday School at First
Baptist, Avondale Estates, GA., Music Committee, Adult Choir member.

    Hi.
    
    I'm Steve McConnell.  My Christian walk has been at all ends of the
    spectrum, from what most would call *incredibly* liberal, to what most
    would call *incredibly* conservative.
    
    Since everyone is usually somewhere left or right of center on an
    issue, I guess y'all will determine for yourselves where I stand.
    
    I admit I'm very hesitant about participating in this conference (more
    on that in another topic when I can).
    
    I believe there is only one Truth, His name is Jesus.
    
    I believe (unlike Meister Eckhart ;-) that if we seek, we'll find, if
    we knock, the door will be opened - so says Jesus, who is the Truth.
    
    I believe (unlike Richard Jones Christie ;-) that balance is important
    (not over-rated ;-) - so says me, and who really cares ;-)
    
    I'll try to be silent most of the time.  Mainly, I think it's good to
    understand where other's are coming from...but more of this in that
    other topic I hope to start soon...
    
    In Him who is *the* Way, *the* Truth, and *the* Life,
    
    Steve

    I'm Jim Richard. I'm a Printed Circuit Designer here in Shrewsbury,
    Mass. I was raised Catholic with parochial school education up to
    the six grade. I fell away from the Church in my teen years. I went
    to Church and prayed a little while in the Marines, but did not accept
    Jesus as my Lord until I was 26yrs old, I'm 39 now. The Lord asked me 
    to return to the Catholic Church and spread the good news of his salvation.

    I'm married, have two children. I teach Confirmations Classes, Lector,
    cause trouble on the parish council -:) and I'm the men's retreat
    chairperson in our parish, at St. Denis in Ashburnham, Mass.

    I'm mostly a contemplative, and have an interest in Christianity from a 
    monastic perspective. I've read a lot of Thomas Merton's, and Basil
    Penington's stuff, both are Trapist Monks for those not familiar.
    
    St. Francis of Assisi is my favorite Saint.

    I'm still not sure why this conference exist, but if it helps some to
    be more comfortable than I suppose it's O.K., but I wish we were all
    able to share in one conference.

    I started to add an intorduction in here the other day and got blown
    off the net.  I guess the timing wasn't quite right!  :-)
    
    I'm Nanci Van Fleet logging in from the CSC in Colorado Springs.  I've
    been read only in Christian for quite awhile.  I was raised in the
    Episcopalian church but left when I was informed, at age 13, that my
    best friend had no hope of an afterlife since she was Jewish.  Well,
    that was the end of my association with that church.  My mother was
    raised a Christian Scientist and her mother also believed in
    reincarnation.  Well - all of that must have rubbed off on me.  I don't
    remember a time when I didn't believe in reincarnation.  I also don't
    remember a time when I didn't have a very personal relationship with
    the God within me.  I noticed that when, what I called my God-self
    spoke directly to the God-self of others then communications went
    smoothly and there was no miscommunication.  From this I surmised that
    we must all have that "God-self" within.
    
    A few years ago I joined the church of Religious Science (Science of
    Mind).  Some of you may term this a "New Age" church.  There is not
    much dogma associated with Science of Mind, just that God is the very
    fabric of the Universe, the creative mind from which all things were
    made.  Therefore, each of us has, at our core, that God-self within. 
    It is in us so there is never any separation from God except in our own
    minds.  What convinced me that this church was the right place for me
    was the stated purpose of the Pikes Peak church which is, "to heal the
    illusion of separation from God, thereby transforming life to the
    highest spiritual level of joy".  
    
    I'm looking forward to hearing the different viewpoints that arise in
    this file.  I hope I can contribute some food for thought as well.
    
    'Nuff said.
    
    
    Nanci 

  	My name is Alfred Thompson and since I think I'm going to be
	around this conference I guess I should do an intro. While
    	not exactly read only I tend to reply only when I think I
    	have something to say.

	I'm a preacher's kid. My father is a semi-retired Methodist
	minister. My step-mother is currently the pastor of a
	Methodist church. We've got a lot of clergy in the family
	(an uncle and several cousins) and some people assumed I'd
	wind up there as well. Didn't happen though as I believe
	God has called me to other things.

	I'm fairly conservative in many ways (I avoid discussion of
	my feelings of women pastors with my family for example.) On
	the other hand some consider me very liberal because of my
	attendance record in church. I just haven't found a church
	near me where I really feel comfortable. My father spoiled
	me for other preachers as well. He's great.

	As a PK I've been "religious" all my life but I can to accept
	Jesus as Savior at about age 12 or so. I remember the day but
	not when or how old I was. That's not important. What is important
	is that the knowledge of salvation gave and continues to give
	me great peace of mind. I don't know how people live without it.

	As a midnight project of sorts I maintain a DECWINDOWS Bookreader
	version of the KJV Bible. I hope to create an index for it if
	I can ever get the time. Anyone have a VAX I can take home to
	work on it? The dial in line is too slow to do it right.

			Alfred

    Well I've put a note in so I guess I'd better introduce myself.
    
    I'm Bonnie Reinke and wife of 'the DR' Don. Mike Valenza first
    mentioned the idea of this file to me and I passed his mail
    onto Don and encouraged him to read it also.
    
    I'm a third generation Episcopalian - Don changed churchs early
    in our marriage because staying Episcopalian mattered so much
    to me at the time.
    
    Having spent 23 years with someone who streches the edges of
    conventional Christian belief I'm not always quite sure what
    I am anymore :-).
    
    Bonnie

   Greetings all,

   My name is Paul Cioto.  As you know, I've written some
   long-winded "novels" in CHRISTIAN and DEJAVU and RELIGION. 
   Although I consider my spirituality and relationship with and
   path to God unique -- I don't belong to any religion or category
   or group -- my faith is pretty much similar to Karen Berggren's,
   for those of you who have the pleasure/privilege of knowing
   Karen.  Though I dislike "labels," much of my spirituality
   comprises "New Age" mysticism -- whatever that REALLY means ;)
   -- combined with some aspects/undertones of Christianity.  

   I am a technical writer for SMC in Chelmsford; have been in the
   technical documentation business for roughly 10 years.  Before
   that, I was a newspaper journalist.  A New England, I grew up in
   Medfield, and on Lake Winnipesaukee, New Hampshire, and went to
   Northeastern journalism school.  I am happily single (not that
   it's important) and am politically Independent and somewhat
   Libertarian.  Conservative on economic issues and liberal on
   social issues.  Don't like government interference in our private
   lives in conservative OR liberal ways.  
    
   As this reply demonstrates, as a writer I can get very long winded!
    
   I was raised as Roman Catholic, but lived most of my adult life
   as agnostic ... until Christmas Eve, 1986, the day my father
   died.  Until that time I had no desire for a Spiritual life
   whatsoever.  But that event began to shake up my soul.  I began
   to seek some answers about the nature of life, death, creation,
   God.  I prayed for God to come into my life, reveal himself to
   me, and carry me to where I need to be, to where I might serve
   the ultimate Divine Truth and Spirit of God.

   God's revelation has taken many forms in my life, and the path he
   has given me has led me to many places where I never envisioned
   ever going.  Over the last four years, I have been nudged in the
   direction of many special persons, places, things, and situations
   that have provided answers and have served as God's instruments
   of revelation of Truth.

   Meditation and prayer and faith in God have, I believe, spawned
   some unexpected gifts from God in recent years -- a rudimentary
   ability to comfort people by serving as a vehicle through which
   God-inspired messages of peace, joy, and healing are passed on to
   a brother or sister.  Through, for lack of a better term,
   "psychic empathy," it seems God has been nudging me to bear the
   burden of a brother or sister in need  -- that is, merging with
   their energy, feeling what they are feeling, shouldering the
   brunt of their pain, and passing on inspirational messages of
   comfort and joy, and at times providing hands-on physical and
   emotional healing, from the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of Christ. 
   This work has humbled me, in the sense that I know I am a very
   flawed human being and feel unworthy to receive these gifts,
   unworthy to be an instrument through which God heals.  However,
   the more I pray to God for guidance, the more He nudges me in the
   direction of this work.  So ... I guess that's the way it shall be.

   For those of you who have been spared the reading of my looooong,
   endless entries in CHRISTIAN, I would describe myself as an
   "inclusionist" as opposed to an "exclusionist."  That is, I
   believe God reveals himself, and that we -- ALL of us -- can come
   to know God in many, many combinations of ways.  The Truth and
   Reality and Word and Spirit of God, IMHO, can be seen/heard/felt
   beyond the pages of any one holy book, such as the Bible or A
   Course In Miracles, beyond any one culture or any one religion or
   any one way of life or any one mindset.  Divine pearls of wisdom
   and Truth -- things that are God-breathed -- span the boundaries
   of ALL of these things.   The infinite, permeating, and
   omnipresent nature of the "being" that we call "God" and "Christ" 
   and "All That Is" and "Holy Spirit" is so infinitely beyond our
   earthly notion of logic and comprehension, that it is useless
   for us, as children of God, to point to each other, accross
   denominations, across religions, across cultures, and say, "You
   don't know God."  This invariably insults God's ability to reach
   out to and establish relationships with all his children in His
   own way.  There's nothing old or worn out or trivial about
   espousing, "Live and Let Live" and "Live and Let God."   It
   honors the dignity of someone else's relationship with God.  It
   honors the way in which God chooses to reach out to our brothers
   and sisters.  

   Peace, blessings, and love,
   Paul

    Hi ya'all,
                   Being from Texas, it is natural that I am a southern
    baptist.  I also am a former preacher.  For reasons not pertinent, I
    decided to forgo the preaching business.  I believe the bible is the
    literal word of God.  I am sometimes appalled at the "traditional"
    values attributated to God of which the Southern Baptists are some of
    the worst. ;-)  I am looking forward to the wide ranging ideas within
    this conference and eager to expierence *all* ideas.
    
    
    Dave Dawson

    Hi!
    
    When I learned about this conference (several days after it was begun)
    I gathered together the stuff I had saved about my beliefs from various
    topics in "that other" conference in order to prepare my intro here. 
    Well, by now you've either read or hit NEXT/UNSEEN through several of
    my entries and answers, so you already know something of what I
    believe.
    
    I was a fundamentalist Biblical literalist as a teenager, arguing for a
    literal 6-day creation period, etc., and convinced that anyone who did
    not accept Jesus Christ as Savior would spend eternity in Hell.  I felt
    called to rpeach at the age of 14 and joined the Methodist Church
    because it would allow women to preach.  I grew up in KY and went to
    college there, where I gradually became a liberal Christian -- and
    marveled at the wonderful *freedom* and the loving "partnership" that
    God offers His disciples!  
    
    My husband and I came to MA to go to seminary at BU and
    take some graduate courses in philosophy from Dr. Peter Bertocci, a
    personalist.  I decided somewhere along the way that I wanted to be
    in Christian education and to write curriculum materials.  I spent
    about 14 years doing that.
    
    I have two sons and one daughter-in-law.  My younger son is in college
    studying art and theatre. The older son is a 3rd engineer on a Mobil
    supertanker hauling oil from Alaska to California.  About as different
    as two kids can be -- and both delightful!
    
    I supervise technical writers in Littleton, MA., a very hectic job
    (with 14 in my group and another coming this month) that keeps me out
    of notes for long stretches of time -- at least till *this* conference
    came along!
    
    Thank you for this haven!  (No, I *didn't* mean "heaven!" :-) )

    As my personal name says, a "passionate commitment to a reasoned
    Christian faith" is my goal!

    Charles Mok, software specialist at Santa Clara Commercial District,
    working on Ultrix-related technical areas and accounts.  Before this I
    spent 2.5 years at Shewsbury at the Heads Manufacturing Business in
    software support.  I only very recently relocated out west.
    
    I came to know Christ when I was in college in Indiana, about 8 years
    ago.  I am (still consider myself as) a member of the Chinese
    Evangelical Church of Metro-Boston in Allston (because of the rather
    frequent travel I will have to make back east I am probably still a
    "half-time" member) since 1988.  So far I have been visiting churches
    in the South Bay area here but have not settled on one yet.  I have
    served mainly in fellowships in the church and in college, mainly on
    student (college) work and bible study.  
    
    Charles

Simon Szeto.  The "ISEDA" in my personal name stands for "International Systems
Engineering Development and Architecture." (whew!)  I'm a software engineering
manager, and I have recently returned from an overseas assignment in Hongkong.

I was born again at age 12.  Being a Christian isn't hereditary, but you could
say I'm a fourth generation Christian, given that my great-grandfather was a
Presbyterian pastor in Berkeley, California in the 1900's.  I was baptized as
a Lutheran as a child, was confirmed at age 15, and was baptized again at 35
when I became a member of the Conservative Baptist church in the town where I
live (Merrimack, NH).  My 47th birthday is coming up in a couple of weeks.

Yes, I am born again, as I already said, and you can say I'm a Bible-believing
Christian.  I happen to prefer to call myself an Evangelical, but I think of
myself as a fundamentalist (with a small 'f', in the original sense of the 
word).

Most likely I will be a reader of this file primarily.  I have not been follow-
ing CHRISTIAN, let alone participating.  I was a bit more involved in the old,
original BIBLE notes file, before I had to let it go and Jim Burrows adopted it.

--Simon

John Eerenberg in Charlotte, NC.  I just transfered here in July.

I accepted Christ 11 years ago, but only more recently have I changed 
and truly become a "new creature in Christ".  That's a long story...

Right now I look forward to a civilized conference as this appears to
be.  Other "religious" conferences degraded into worthless arguments
and I left them because they wasted (my) time.  I don't have a lot
of time to read conferences like this, but I'll probably manage to do
so with this one on some sort of regular basis.

I would like to discuss more of what I saw in 36.* concerning
God, creation, evalution, anthropology, etc.  This conference
is off to a good start for me.  I like it so far.  Keep it up!


			   John Eerenberg @CEO

I am Calvin Hoe, adopted father of Sammy, husband of Judy. I am a
life long Anglican (Episcopalian). I am currently working towards
another degree in Instructional Design while working as a Course
Developer for Education Services.

    Hi, y'all!  I'm Ann Dillon from Winston Salem, North Carolina (and I
    really don't say "y'all"!)
    
    I am a follower of Jesus Christ.  I was reared in the Baptist Church,
    have studied Western religions, spent my share of time discovering and
    exploring alternative spiritual paths, and have recently begun to
    rekindle my relationship with God through Jesus Christ and the Church. 
    
    I am beginning to emerge from about an 18-month period of spiritual
    void.  It was and at times still is a very difficult time for me.
    
    I am 38 years old, single, and have a 10 year old son (Matthew).  I've
    been at DEC for 9 years and am a customer services contract
    administrator, currently handling the RJ Reynolds account.
    
    I look forward to participating in this conference.
    
    annie

    Since I've just posted my first reply in this conference, I guess I
    oughta post my "id", too.
    
    I'm a software engineer in the Image Systems Group (currently in MKO2),
    and also live in town (in Merrimack, NH).  I've been reading and
    occasionally contributing to various religious NOTES conferences since
    the old BIBLE conference was around (before CHRISTIAN_V1 and RELIGION
    came to be).  I'm married, have two children (boys, ages 1 and 2), and
    am 32 (at present).  As a result of early (childhood) religious
    influences, I am one of Jehovah's Witnesses.
    
    I'd still like to see the BIBLE conference restarted (perhaps afresh),
    but I'm glad that this conference has been opened.  (Thanks go to Bob
    Messenger, et. al.)  I think having a neutral forum for discussing
    various perspectives on Christianity is a good idea.
    
    -mark sornson

    
    
    Jamey Nordby
    Market/Competitive Analyst with the Database Systems Group
    Colorado Springs
    
    Mixed denominational background, currently unaffiliated. Regular
    participant in the CHRISTIAN conference. I hold (with white knuckles)
    to a biblically-based world and heaven view and look forward to mixing
    this view with y'alls.
    
    Wonderful wife, two kids, a third on the way, and one in heaven
    (Patrick was miscarried at 12 weeks). 
    
    Jamey
    

    Dick Curtis
    Software Specialist, Product & Industry Marketing Group
    Marlboro
    
    I'm not much for introductions or talking about myself;  I'd rather
    participate in discussions.

	As I have entered my first reply, I will take this opportunity to 
	introduce myself . My name is Philip Yerkess, a very young 31 years 
	of age and a VMS Systems Manager in Dec Park , Reading , UK . I am
	single  , though courting . I have been working for Digital for 
	3+ years now , and since have been hooked on Notes ( mostly reading ) . 
	I do enjoy noting when time allows and look forward to participating 
	here . I dedicated  my life to serve Jehovah a year last May and am 
	therefore one of His Witnesses, Isaiah 43:10 . 
	 

	Phil .
    

    There isn't a note for "departures", so I guess this is the best place
    to put mine. For reasons that would be pointless to mention I've
    decided to pull out of CP.
    
    The only reason I didn't just DELETE ENTRY without advertising it is
    because of the "apparent errors" topic. (So far no one came up with any
    that were more than "apparent" ;-) I wanted to let anyone know that if
    you happen to come across any more apparent errors it will be up to
    others to address them in here. Alternatively, I would be pleased to
    discuss them (or any other Biblical issues) with anyone via Mail, or
    I'm sure you'd be welcome to post them in CHRISTIAN (I'm not pulling
    out of there).
    
    	BD�

    Barry,
    
    Thank you for all you've shared.  Any feedback you would like to
    forward to the moderators regarding this conference would be welcome. 
    Please feel free to stop by anytime if the spirit inspires you.
    
    You will be missed.  Be well and God bless.
    
    Karen

    I too am pulling out of this conference. I have a problem with the
    presentation of satanic beliefs as being a viable option to the
    beliefs of Christianity. I feel that to allow this option, is to
    make a mockery of Christ death on the cross. I cannot participate
    in a conference which claims itself to be Christian and yet allows
    the discussion of Satanism to be viewed as just an alternate belief.

    
    And I, too, without much ado, am departing. 
    
    To those who know and love the Lord, the reasons will be evident. 
    To the rest, if you're *really* interested, write me, and I'll be 
    glad to explain. [Some of these reasons were stated rather well
    by Jim in .47.]
    
    And always, always, I'm ready to share His love and the
    hope of *new life* with anyone who feels hopeless and alone.
    Contact me by mail (or in IOSG::CHRISTIAN) if you need a hug
    or are discouraged and feel you're at the end of your rope).
    
    Loving you all no less, and committing you to God,
    Irena 
    
    

Maybe we should start a new topic. "Fond farewells"

Collis

    Ren� Haentjens, SW consultant in EIS/ACT Brussels, Belgium.
    
    I'm 41, happily married with my wife Lieve. We have two daughters, Iris
    & Sara, soon to be 16 and 13.
    
    Our whole family is christian & catholic.
    
    I haven't read the notes in this conference yet. Seeing people depart
    in earlier replies to this note, I guess that some of the subjects of
    discussion must be tough. But I think I'm not afraid of being exposed
    to opinions which I don't share. We'll see in the coming days, when I
    will have browsed through some of the stuff here.
    
    Ren�.

    
    	Hi folks.
    
    	I'm here to cause trouble.  I plan to trouble the comfortable 
    where ever possible.  There are many beliefs that people hold because
    they 'feel' good, and not because they are reasonable or scripturally
    based.
    
    	I am a non-compromising in what I believe.  But usually tolerant
    of those that beleive differently  (It's your right to be wrong).
    I'm am a pentacostal Baptist and licensed to preach in the Southern
    Baptist denomination.
    
    	I hope to spur the thoughts of those in this conference toward
    Christ.  Not 'a christ' or a 'christ conceincousness' but "THE Christ".
    Jesus Christ, Son of God, ONLY way to get to the FATHER (not mother).
    
    	Peace to all (which only comes through Jesus)
    	Ed LeCompte

    
      Hello all,
    
       I'm mostly a 'reader' due to time constaints but since I've had a
    few moments to reply in the conference I thought I should also find
    time to introduce myself. I work in NIO for Production Control. I'm
    happily married and have been since May 1972..I'm still honeymooning.
    I have two children(my boy just turned 10,daddy's little girl is 7 1/2).
    As a result of about 4 years studying the bible(I'm a real questioner)
    with Jehovah's Witnesses I finally realized I had found the truth and
    that I needed to dedicate my life to Jehovah God, to doing his will. 
    I symbolized that dedication via baptism last July. 
       As I said up front I'm mostly a reader and because of all the noting
    activity I don't read all the reply's so if you ask a question of me
    and I don't reply please don't be offended (apologies up front); feel free
    to send me a note via mail and I'll be happy to look up your question next
    time I'm in Notes.
    
                         Robin Russo   

    Since I just entered my first note, I suppose I should admit that I'm
    here.  I've been read-only from the opening of the conference, and am
    grateful for the calm and reasoned tone of most of the discussions, as
    well as the breadth of thought and issues.
    
    I come from a non-traditional, Christian faith.  I'm still a member of
    the church, but going through a seeking and testing time of how much of
    it is "mine" and how much is "doctrine".
    
    Alison

    Hi,  I'm David Reeves, a Systems Integration Consultant working on one
    of Digital's corporate account teams in Cleveland, Ohio.
    
    I am an inconsistant, infrequent noter due to frequent job-related
    travel and significant family responsibilities after work-hours. 
    However I do occasionally comment if I feel I can contribute to better
    understanding if not more concensus.
    
    I hope that my participation will improve my reasoning, and knowledge
    as well as those around me.
    
    I'm a horrible speller;  not good at EVE editing;  miss my
    spell-checker that I always use in ALLIN1!
    
    regards,
    
    David Reeves
    
    

    I writing in this note of my return, because this is the note I
    departed this conference from. 

    Don't ask why I've returned, the answer isn't quit clear to me either.
    Perhaps it's just the Holy Spirit Guiding me ?

    Anyway, I'll re-introduce myself as a starter.

    Jim Richard
    I'm a printed circuit designer in Shrewsbury, Mass. I've been with DEC
    since 1972. I'm married, and have two children. 
    I was raised Catholic and attended Catholic School. I feel away until
    1975 when I accepted Christ, and He called me back into the church.
    I attend St. Denis Catholic Church in Ashburnham, Mass. I teach 
    Confirmation classes to young adults, lector, I'am a member of the parish
    counsel, and I'm chairman of the men's retreat at Calvary Retreat
    Center in Shrewsbury, Mass. I also, volunteer at Our Father's House
    in Fitchburg, Mass.



    Peace
    Jim

Hi,

my name is Karin Schubert, I'm working as a VMS instructor in Vienna, Austria.

I was raised Roman Catholic and attended a convent school until I was 14.

Last year I left the church (you have to officially sign out because we
pay taxes for participating in the Roman Catholic church over here) because
I strongly disagree with various topics (e.g. the role of women) and dislike
the politics that have been going on in Austria over the last couple of years,
concerning bishops, priests having children or wanting to leave the priesthood
because of a woman a.s.o.

I consider my believes to be somewhat New Age. Lately I stumbled over a
book that interprets various biblical statements like the 10 commands according
to the Kabbalah and the Tree of Life. While reading this I said to myself
"if they only had thaught me that at school". Currently I'm beginning to have
less negative associations with the word God by "translating" it into my
belief system.

I find it very interesting to see quite a lot familiar faces here, which
I know from more esotheric conferences ... I'm extremely interested to see
how you think about things I have difficulties with.

I'll probably be a read only for a while to follow up the topics written in 
here but I hope this will be a place for me to learn and better understand 
some things by asking questions that come from my very heart ...

Love to you all,
Karin

    Like some others, I enter this conference with some fear and
    trepidation.  Having seen some of the withdrawals of people I've seen
    noting elsewhere, I feel sorry that they are not continuing to
    participate.
    
    However...... 
    My name is Brian Pickering.  I am 51 years of age on my birth
    certificate, although my brain and body only feel about 25.  I have
    been married to one wife for 27 happy years and have three offspring
    (can't call them children any more) aged 26, 24 and 20.
    
    I am a Catholic, and have the privilege of having been appointed a
    Special Minister of the Eucharist.  I moved from the Anglican Church to
    the Roman one at the age of 18, but that was a small transition, not a
    major conversion.  I can't claim to have been born again, since Our
    Lord has never let me get far away.
    
    The main planks of my beliefs are as follows:
    
    I have the utmost faith in God's infinite love and mercy - towards all
    sinners, whatever the sin (and I've never been in a position to cast
    the first stone)
    
    I believe in free will - and this translates practically into a belief
    that God helps those who help themselves.
    
    I believe that all men are equal under God, - regardsless of race,
    creed, colour and sex.  The latter means I use the words "man, mankind,
    he, his" etc., as appropriate to all members of the human race.  These
    wordas are not sexist and neither am I.  At the same time, all people
    are individuals and deserve respect for their individual differences.
    
    Beyond these major elements, I think that a lot of the doctrinal arguments
    we have are futile and unnecessary. 
    
    My interest in conferences such as these (and I subscribe to most of the
    Christian and religious ones) is in finding out how we can handle the
    issues of living together in this world in order to grow towards the
    next.  So I take a very pragmatic line.  Above all I believe we must
    always retain a sense of humour and fun, and laugh at ourselves
    whenever possible.
    
    I also participate in all the musical conferences. 
    
    I work in DEC Park Reading, UK, about 50 yards from Phil.  (We met for
    the first time this morning.)  I am employed in Area (Europe) IS
    Marketing, as a Services Marketing Consultant.  Unfortunately, I am
    about to be 'rightsized', in other words, eased out of the Company
    based on the current reduction of numbers.  I do not want this to
    happen, and am trying to find a new slot before the axe falls.  That's
    partly because I don't want to lose access to Notes.  Is this the right
    time and place to ask for your prayers?
    
    Best wishes,
    
    Brian.
     

    My name is Peter H. Smith, I am working in CMPD/MET as a software
    engineer.  I am married and have an 11 month old son.  Refer back
    to the rest of this note when you want to put my comments in context.
    I'll need as much context as John Silber :-)

    I believe that there is such a thing as objective truth -- there are
    things which are true regardless of whether we believe them or not.
    I also believe that I cannot possibly identify all that is true and
    false through my own efforts -- I have a lot to learn.

    I believe that we were all created by an all-powerful, all-knowing,
    all-just being (God), who is bigger than us, beyond our comprehension,
    and therefore not "wrong" or "unfair" because He does things
    differently than we would if we were Him.  I also believe that He chose
    to reveal Himself to us, and that He did this through the acts
    described in the Bible (which I believe is inerrant, although open to
    our errors in interpretation).

    I believe that one of God's revealing acts was to send his only son,
    Jesus Christ, who was both fully human and fully divine, to bridge the
    gap so that we could know God personally.  I believe that Jesus had to
    die on the cross for me because I am a sinner -- I "miss the mark" in
    terms of meeting God's expectations.  Because God is just, and I had
    failed to meet his requirements on my own, I faced eternal separation
    from Him, because that is the way He made the universe, and I broke the
    rules. I'm glad He decided to pay the penalty for me, and that He
    proved his sincerity through the greatest (and most contentious) act in
    history and the Bible -- the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ.

    I believe that there is sufficient evidence in the Bible and in other
    available sources to accept the Biblical accounts as truth.  Which
    means that I believe that God is who He says He is, did what He said He
    did, and requires what He said He requires, and that the world works
    the way He says it works.  And my source for insight into who God is is
    the Bible.

    I could just as well have copied the Nicene Creed in here.  I'm not
    very theologically astute, so I can't provide the proper labels,
    although I find myself comfortable with the following widely
    interpreted common labels, all of which seem to have multiple
    definitions:

        Christian, Born-Again, Evangelical, Bible-Believing,
        Orthodox, Reformed, "Fundamentalist" (in the literal
        as opposed to political sense)

    I attend Trinity Church, Congregational in Bolton, MA.  If you're up at
    5:00am on Sunday, you can hear last week's sermon on WBUR, I think.  I
    don't know for sure; I've never been up and coherent at that time...
    
    Now for my quirks:

    -- I am currently going through some major struggles around balancing
       my materialistic and spiritual ambitions.  I want to give to the
       poor, I want to live in a house.  I covet, I compare, I struggle
       with the conflict between the idea that the rain falls on the
       righteous and unrighteous, yet sometimes God does materially reward
       us for our faith in him.  I want to be purified in my faith, but I
       hate the idea of undergoing the persecution/testing part of the
       process.

    -- I don't always practice what I preach.  I am still a sinner, and
       I need to remember that.  Pride is my major stumbling block.  Feel
       free to privately and tactfully remind of my shortcomings, and
       provide constructive criticism.  Because I'm rather proud, I may
       respond to public flames with public flames, whether I'm right or
       wrong...  Forgive me when I'm wrong, and please flame coherently:-)
    
    -- Due to my past, I am incredibly cynical, negative, and suspicious
       of others.  I find it hard to forgive 70x7 times (still working
       on "twice" :-).  If you're surprised to see me popping up here
       after some of the things I've said in DIGITAL or REAL_ESTATE, I
       don't blame you.  God's grace extends to all sorts of people, and
       He doesn't give up easily.  I am working at learning to express
       more of my hopes, and tone down some of my awareness of the
       fallenness of Man.  I won't claim to be the ideal Christian, and
       in turn I ask you not to write off the whole faith based on some
       callous action on my part.
    
    -- I can be justifiably be labeled as politically "conservative".  I
       try not to confuse conservative political views and what the Bible
       actually says.  Sometimes there is an intersection, sometimes there
       is not.  I am more interested in God than in politics, but at times
       that doesn't come accross clearly.  Often, my comments are
       half-baked.  Blame it on the Dartmouth Review.  Everybody else
       does... (And no, I don't subscribe, and even when I was getting
       free copies at my dormitory door I didn't agree with the more rabid
       parts of the paper, but the quotes on the back were fun and there
       was usually at least one good point made in each issue).

    -- I can relate with Timothy in his younger years.  I am not forward
       with my faith.  Some of this is intentional; I don't want to cram
       my beliefs down someone's throat.  The Holy Spirit and rational
       thought should be more effective than clever arguments.  But some of
       this is unintentional; I am by habit a coward, and I tend to avoid
       conflict where possible.  Which means I tend to clam up whenever
       people discuss their world views, since discussion of world views
       leads to conflict unless all present have the same world view.

    -- I enjoy Christian Fellowship, but I am "Christian Culture" averse.
       I cringe at "Christianese" to such an extent that I tune out
       televangelists, regardless of the merit of their exposition.
       I cringe at phenomena like the "Christian Music Industry," yet
       I enjoy the music and lyrics of artists like Mark Heard, Phil
       Keaggy, Amy Grant, etc.  I believe in miracles, past and present,
       despite my hesitation to use born-again or charismatic terminology.
       I may be visibly confused if you say "The Spirit told me to...",
       until I understand whether this means "A clear voice identified
       itself as God speaking, and said something intelligible which
       does not contradict Scripture", or, "I decided/felt I should..."

    Hi.  I'm Jody Bobbitt.  I'm a technical writer in Marlboro.  I'm also a
    7th generation Unitarian, with an aunt who is a UU minister and a
    sister who works as a spiritual counselor for the Providence Church of
    Christ.  I also have friend whos range from beliefs in Catholicism to
    Mormonism to Buddhism to Pagan/Wiccan Goddess-worship to the Church of the
    Subgenius.  
    
    I am open to new thoughts and new discussions, which I then use to help
    frame my own personal beliefs within the greater whole that is
    Unitarian Universalism.
    
    I look forward to enlightenment of all sorts....
    
    -Jody
    

    Hello
    
    I'm E Grace Noonan, a DECTag working at MRO1.  I know many of you from 
    other conferences, so I know I'm in some good company!
    
    I was raised Roman Catholic, with a Protestant father.  I found at a 
    fairly young age that the Roman Catholic Church did not answer the 
    condition in me, wandered a while, rediscovered my "active"
    spirituality, and settled there for a few years. 
    
    Through an amazing melange of circumstances and events, happening with
    no real regularity over a period of 10 years or so, I found my way to 
    the place that *does* answer my condition.  I bacame a Friend (I like
    that!) 5 years ago.  I knew at my first Quaker Meeting that this was
    where I belonged.
    
    Part of being a Friend -- to me -- is being a Seeker, so...here I am!
    
    E Grace

    Let me first all of you wish all the best for this new challenging
    1991. May God bless you and your family with peace and good health.
    
    My name is Hans Alles. I am 45 years old, happily married with
    Sylvia. (She becomes year after year nicer and greater!!This year 25
    year of marriage!)
    I have 2 sons (18 and 24) I am born again since 10 years.
    Member and elder in a pentecostal church (assemblies of God type of
    church). I grew up as a Roman
    Catholic. But while thinking about religion and acting as a Christian,
    I discovered that lots of things were wrong in that church. In the same
    period a lot of unpleasant things overcame me, which forced me to think
    even more about basic life questions. But God is good and loved me even
    before I learned to love Him. He was seeking me, while I did not seek
    Him. 
    
    But He called me, and at a certain moment I answered. Praise the Lord!.
    Since then, lots of things happened to us as a family. My wife Sylvia
    became a born again Christian. My sons became Christian. And God used
    us to bring other people to Him. In our private life we went through
    a very sad period. And I always say to everybody who want to hear it: if
    we did not know Jesus Christ, and if our marriage was not good, we
    would have been in very deep trouble since than. Praise the Lord that
    He was with us in that dark period. 
    
    Yes I am serious believer in Jesus Christ. 
    Yes I believe that the bible is the unchangeable Word of God.
    Yes I believe in being saved
    Yes I do believe in the healing work by His Word
    Yes I do believe in the excistance of satan
    But I also believe in the victory through Jesus
    And believe that once a new world will be there, where God our heavenly
    father whipes our tears off. (Revelation)
    
    
    May God be with you this year as he is with all born again Christians.
    
    Hans Alles
    
                               

(In response to an inquiry in 91.165

Sure, Richard.

I attended Gordon-Conwell Theological Seminary from June, 1985 until
May, 1989 upon which I received a Masters of Arts of Theological Studies
(MATS) for completing 20 courses with a New Testament major.  After this,
I came to Digital and the various notesfiles to continue to increase my
learning.  :-)

Gordon-Conwell is an evangelical Seminary which historically has been
very missions minded.  It was formed around 1970 from the Gordon School
of Theology (which was part of Gordon College for those persuing degress
beyond a Bachelors) and Conwell School of Theology in Phildelphia.  Billy
Graham was one of the key people who oversaw this merger.

One of the basic beliefs of the Seminary is that the Bible is the
inerrant Word of God.  It currently has around 600 students and around
38 faculty.  It is one of 11 seminaries in the general Boston area and
I believe it is the largest.  It is non-denominational (or inter-denominational)
and has students from about 75 different denominations.  The largest
denomination represented is Baptist; the second largest (surprise!) is United
Methodist.  The Seminary itself takes no position on the ordination of
women although some in the faculty support this and some object to it.
Women are eligible for all degree programs and are actively recruited
as professors (although there is currently only one women professor).

Collis

    Should have put this in before I entered a note this morning, but I was
    in a rush.
    
    I have a real account now.  My new e-mail address is:
    
    	GAZERS::NOONAN
    
    E Grace

    
    Hello everyone, my name is Bill. I thought it was time that I
    introduced myself. I'm mostly a read only here but reply once 
    and a while. The Lord found this lost sheep three years ago
    this month. Praise the Lord. 
    
    I belong to the Free Methodist Church in Kanata, Canada. 
    I believe that Christ is the only son of God and the only
    path to the Father. I believe the bible is the infallible
    word of God and has the final authority in all maters of
    faith.
    
    I enjoy being with others and realy enjoy working with kids 
    one to three year olds.
    
    Y'shua our Savor, King, Lord, Friend, our light, the lifter
    of our heads and hearts.
    
    Y'shua is like the wind, eternal.
    
    Peace,
    Bill

Permit me to present to you, our conference members, the newest member
of our moderator team:

Dave Dawson has been a born again Christian for 26 years.

Dave has been licensed to preach the Gospel by the Southern Baptist
Convention.  Dave's been married for 18 years and has 3 teenaged kids.
(He asks our prayers as a parent, confessing that he is a haggard parent!
:^})

Dave has been with DEC for 6 years as a customer service rep and has been
trained as an SPS. (Software Product Spec)  He presently lives in Lubbock,
Texas, and loves it.

Welcome aboard, Dave!

Richard Jones-Christie
Co-Moderator CHRISTIAN-PERSPECTIVE

    Hello,
     I recently checked in...and plan to stay awhile...so.....
    
    I was raised in the Roman Catholic faith....went out for awhile,then
    came back after the children (5) came.
    Recently,I have started the conversion to a Congregational Church in
    New England. I was drawn to this faith because of many reasons,some
    of which I'm still trying to fiqure out!
    
    I have recently started to read/study the Bible,and have enjoyed the
    discussions in here greatly. I have alot to learn.....
    
    I work in MLO....live in Grafton Mass.
    
    Marc H.

    I take great pleasure in announcing to you that Ms. Bonnie Reinke has
    accepted the task as moderator for our file.  Bonnie has been an
    advisor since the inception of Christian Perspective and along with her
    husband Don Reinke (THE Dr.) has helped to bring this file to where its
    at today.
    
    Bonnie is a modrator of Valuing Differences and Womannotes.  Her unique
    perspective on human interrelationships will be an invaluable asset to
    the future of our notes file.  Ms Reinke has been one of the most
    sought after advisors and moderators within the notes file community
    and our "gain" will indeed be pleasurable.
    
    
    Dave

    Hello everyone, my name is Ann and this is only the second time
    I've accessed this notes file.  As the saying goes, "Our God works in
    mysterious ways"....I recently lost my mother and my introduction to
    this note file could not have been more timely! And it happened with no 
    effort of mine own.  I'm very greatful to be with you. 
    
    I've been married for 8 years and have one very special little boy.  I
    was raised Roman Catholic although I wouldn't describe it as strickly.
    I was very much encouraged by my mother to be open to other denominations
    which I did by attending various churchs with girl freinds when I was 
    young.  I think because of this I am today very accepting and interested 
    in other denominations as well as other religions in general, but at the 
    same time I think maybe this is part of the reason why I find myself today 
    unsure of where I belong. I can definitely say I am presently searching 
    for where God wants me to be. 
    
    I've been studing, reading, and discussing the Bible for the past year which
    I've come to depend upon in my daily life, and it brings me much comfort 
    at this particur time. 
    
    I strongly believe Jesus Christ is our Savior and intercessor
    and that if we search for him he will open that door for us. (as he has
    for me over the past few years)
    
    I look forward to sharing back and forth with all of you on many
    subjects.  It's so nice to have a place to share, hear and discuss the 
    "Good News"
    
    
    Christ peace be with you
    
        Ann

    Hey gang,
    My name is Lisa Ferguson and I'm a sales rep in Rochester NY.
    Born again Evangelical with a pentecostal background, married with one
    child, husband is an ordained minister working as a sales rep.
    I look forward to jumping in from time to time, but will mostly reading
    with avid interest.
    
    Best to all, Lisa.

    Im sorry everybody, the last entry was misplaced.  I'm just now
    learning how to use this notesfile.  My name is Jack Martin.  My
    objective to this file is to be here for prayer and the needs of others
    that write in this file.  You might say I want to be a faucet for a lot
    of thirsty people.
    
    Regards ,
    
    Jack Martin

I am the one who has been read-only and for whom Richard entered the 
note "The Kingdom of God is within" (thanks Richard :-) ).  There has 
been some speculation as to the reason for my read-only participation.  
My primary reason for this is that I have no interest in the debates or 
bickering which commonly accompanies such discussions as are found in 
this type of conference.  I do think this is a good conference, though, 
and I appreciate its openness and acceptance of a wide variety of views. 
I think this is important as I am a big proponent of valuing 
differences.

In terms of Christianity I am far from being a fundamentalist.  If there 
were a label to convey my attitude it would probably be "principlist."  
By this I mean that I am interested in the *principles* which underlie 
Christianity (and the New Testament), and not in various dogmas based on 
symbolic or literal interpretations of the Bible.  While the principles 
expressed through the life of Christ are very important to me, chapter 
and verse are completely impertinent.  Some of the principles to which I 
refer are:

     Unconditional love                 Simplicity of lifestyle
     Service                            Courage
     Sacrifice                          Surrender
     Forgiveness                        The Golden Rule
     Faith

While I certainly lack expertise in the Bible (one of the speculations 
as to my anonymity), I do not consider myself lacking in the 
understanding of these principles, even though this understanding 
continues to expand.  My understanding is that Christ couldn't care less 
whether or not we are aware of Him or the Bible as long as we strive to 
live by the principles set forth.  We can find Christ without ever 
having heard of Him if we live as he exemplified.  Anything less would 
imply that God's love is conditional, and I am certain that this isn't 
so.

I will probably continue to be primarily read-only, but I'm sure I will 
occasionally make entries, beginning today with a reply to the 
Spirituality versus Religion topic.  I hope that my entries do not 
offend the sensibilities of other noter's here.  The greatest hypocrisy 
which can arise from any religion, in my opinion, is an attitude of 
separateness.  By the same token, a religion shows its great divinity 
when it is inclusive, demonstrates unconditional love, and values 
differences.

Jeff

Hi.  I'd like to introduce myself, finally.  My name is Joe Sniderman.  

I have been reading this conference since it began.  Today in Newsweek I 
read that they called read-only participants "lurkers".  I think that 
may have embarrassed me into action.  I'm not much of a writer, but 
let's see what happens.


Wishing you all a peaceful and prosperous new year,

Joe

Hi Joe.  Maybe we can continue those long-ago lunchtime conversations in here!

Time I introduced myself, since I have already entered two notes.

As I said in the intro to the Christian conference, I'm a born-again�, Spirit-
filled Episcopalian.  But don't be put off by that--I think I may be an orthodox
liberal (is that possible?).  I am definitely not a fundamentalist.

I hope to visit here from time to time, maybe enter into a discussion now
and then.

Peace,

Joan


�Evangelized by E. Stanley Jones ca. 1950 at a Methodist church in New York
City.  It took a long time for it to 'take', though.  When I encountered the
charismatic renewal in 1973 as an employee (organist-choir director)of an 
Episcopal church north of the city I didn't know what to make of it at first. 
But I eventually yielded to God's claim on me.  I have literally not been
the same person since!  PTL!!!

Howdy,  This is me checking in since I've replied to the Naturism note, 
thought I should ID myself here.  As you have probably read or not, I'm 
Cherokee Indian and have a very open mind to what religion is.  I don't 
attend a `building' type church, I get close to the Great Spirit by attending 
services out of doors.  As a kid I can remember attending various churches, my 
parents were of two different faiths.  They didn't believe we should be 
brought up with much (if any) religion crammed down our throats.  This has
made for very interesting views on what religion can be.  :-)  We all have
a belief system that works for us.  

Judy

Hi,

My name is Sam Gentile. Don't know if this stuff is needed but:

Sam Gentile
Business & Office Systems Engineering
ZK03-2/T63
Nashua NH
BCSE::GENTILE,SUEIZZ::GENTILE

I just joined the conference today. I have been a very active Roman Catholic 
for my 29 years up until recently. Right now, I have been doing a lot of 
work with Native American spirtuality because there are a lot of limitations 
with Catholism that have bothered me. Like Judy, I believe that my church is 
outdoors and all arround me and not just in that building once a week for an 
hour. I have had a lot of problems with my Catholism because my parents are 
religously addicted to it and shoved it down my throat. I have always been 
taught that I had to be guilty when I have done something wrong and I grew 
up with this view of God that would "strike me down" when I did something 
wrong. It has caused me a lot of problems in life.
	I have been doing a lot of reading about Native American spirtuality 
and am so interested. I have participated in some ceremonies.
	Interested in learning more about Creation Spirtuality and just 
listening to what people have to discuss.

Sam

My name is Rollyn Trueblood, currently I work in MRO3.

My Mother's family were General Baptists (those who live along
the Mason-Dixon who didn't choose sides in the Civil War) &
my grandfather was a missionary in San Salvadore & the Aleutians.
She tried to steer me towards the ministry but let me live my own
life and I am happier for that.

My Father's people were Quakers & have been for a rather long time.
So I have a colorful tapestry. 

My wife was Seventh Day Adventist. I joined her church so our
children would not have conflicting theologies until they made
their own decisions. The Church has been there for life's disasters,
and I am comfortable with part of its teachings.

I try to follow the teachings of Jesus, and I respect the traditions
of Isaac and Abraham. Perhaps my observations from time to time
will provide a better sketch than this attempt.
Best wishes,
Rollyn

    I thought I had entered an introduction note, but since I hadn't, I'll
    do so now.
    
    Patrick Sweeney
    SDSVAX::SWEENEY
    
    My group's name this month is the Capital Markets Integration Practice.
    I have been one of Digital's technical points of contact with banking
    and investment customers since 1975.
    
    I was raised a Roman Catholic, stayed one, and I am raising my children
    in the faith, in the same community and the same church where I was
    raised.  Prior to working for Digital I lived in Africa for two years
    as a Peace Corps volunteer building one room schools and hospitals in
    rural areas.  Prior to marrying me, my wife lived in Korea for three
    years treating people with leprosy.
    
    I started and moderate several conferences on the EASYNET.  My interest
    in CP is that I recognize a few names here and some of the topics
    appear interesting, even if the hostility seems a bit much at times.

    Hello All;
    
    I am a born again Christian that believes that the Holy Bible was 
    inspired by the Holy Spirit, and is the accurate word of God . I am a 
    member of a Full Gospel Church in Chicago, Il., where have been ordained 
    as an evangelist to preach the "Good News" to all who will recieve Chirst.
     
    I believe that everyone has the right to choose Whom he will serve and
    what they will believe. 
    
    	"But as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord".
    
                        Love, Peace, And Joy
    
    				Warren Johnson
    			
        

 
                 
             It is with pleasure that I announce two new moderators 
of CHRISTIAN PERSPECTIVE.  Ms. Allison Parent and Mr. Jim Kirk have
been added to the moderator group.  We look forward to this association 
for some time to come.  We will allow them to introduce themselves to
you of the file.



Dave Dawson
CP co-mod

This may be long and boring, but, I'm a boring person.

Jerry Beeler.  Sales executive, 15 years with Digital, currently located
in  Bakersfield,  California.  (The longest term sales person in Digital
Equipment Corporation!  I've been selling for Digital longer than anyone
else in the corporation)

Formerly married to a wonderful woman, two fantastic kids (girls) who  I
don't  see  nearly  enough (they're in Texas, God's Country, and, I'm in
California).

Very much a Southerner who believes that the south will not "rise again"
for the simple reason that it never "fell" in the first place!!!

Formerly a member of the United States Marine Corps.  An "officer and  a
gentleman" fer' sure.

An *avid* reader of World War II history.  Very  much  a  believer  that
even though we as a country are purported to be the most technologically
advanced, educated, affluent, highest standard of living,  etc  ...   we
seem to be totally inept at learning from history.

For the most part I've always voted Republican but really don't like any
labels.  I'm very "political" and love to talk about politics, "rights",
Democracy, etc ...  Not to mention that I'm a very patriotic person  and
am more often than not accused of "waving the flag".  I'm proud to be an
American - proud of this country.  We've got  a  few  problems  but  who
doesn't?  It's still the best thing going.

I faithfully listen to Rush Limbaugh.   Watch  very  little  television.
Don't  care  for most of the movies that are made today (but DEARLY LOVE
the old 1930s-1950s movies).  I love classical  music  and  country  and
western ...  along with the old gospel hymns ...  give me a piano and an
old Cokesbury Hymnal and I'll be content for hours!
    
Other hobbies include  cross-stitch  and  needlepoint  and  some  decent
photography, primarily animals, plants, and the out of doors.
    
As to my "faith".  I don't know.  Been mulling over that for  years  and
years and years.  I spent 1/2 of my life in the Assembly of God and then
the other 1/2 of my life in a Baptist Church.  Then, at the age of about
18  years  I  walked away from both of them.  I was married in a church,
but, that was 'bout the last time that I set foot in one.   If  you  are
familiar with the television series "The Waltons" ...  I guess I'm a lot
like John Walton (the father).

What am I doing here?  I am a notes-a-holic.  I've got something in  the
neighborhood  of 30 conferences in my notebook and moderate SOAPBOX, the
VALUING_DIVERSITY conference, and SELLING_TO_EDUCATION conferences.

I love a good thought provoking discussion.   I'm  fully  aware  of  the
inadequacies of the electronic medium and the fact that some discussions
can degenerate into name-calling and personal attacks.  It sort of "goes
with  the  territory".   When  that  becomes  the rule as opposed to the
exception - you can count me out.

You may not particularly like what I say, I may  not  particularly  like
what you say - BUT - I am of the firm belief that we can discuss it with
a level head, as  professionals,  and,  with  mutual  respect  for  each
other's opinions.

So far, I like what I see here in this conference.  For  the  most  part
I'm  just  a  dumb  dirt-farmer country boy and may ask some pretty dumb
questions.  Bear with me.

Any questions?  Send mail.  I like corresponding with people.

They call me ....Bubba

    G'day everyone,
    
    My name is Sunil Sethi and I am a Hindu and have an interest in all
    religions as I feel that there is only ONE God.  God has given people a
    religion to follow according to their spritual inteligence.
    
    Many people have the idea that in Hinduism that we have many God's but
    this is not true, we only have ONE.  His name is Sri Krsna, Visnu he
    has many names.  But Shiva and Bhrama are not God they are demigods.
    
    I hope that with Sri Krsna's (Gods) will we can share much and reach a
    better understanding of one another.  I have come across many
    Christians and have found it hard going but that's life.  I feel
    there are people who really want to understand other peoples religions
    and find common ground.  I hope that will take place here.
    
    I have been a devotee of Sri Krsna since my childhood and have a strong
    association with the Hare Krsna movement.
    
    God bless you all
    
    Sunil

    Since I've entered a few notes, it's time to introduce myself.

    I'm Steve Rupp.  

    I believe there is a Truth that defines all of existence.  
     This Truth I understand to be God, Divine Principle. 

    The best human explanation of this Truth that I've found is 
     Christian Science.  I can't conceive of trying live in this
     world or make sense of it without the answers it provides.  


    I don't think there is a wrong religion if it meets the needs
     of the people following it at the time.  I do think there is 
     _a_ right answer, but I think the paths to that understanding 
     can be as diverse as the people following them.  People will 
     benefit from the Truth to the degree that they reflect it.  
     

    Steve

    Hello,
    
    My name is Ellen Wilkes, and my spiritual journey has taken me through
    several religions.  i.e. Protestant, Catholic and now Religious
    Science and I'm sure I'll have the opportunity to explore others.  The
    one thing I am learning from my experiences along the way is that we're
    all here for the same thing and that is to love.
    

    I thought that the time had come to introduce myself. I've been a read
    only in here for some time and I don't like to listen in on a
    conversation and not have all parties aware that I'm here.
    
    My name is Phil Connell. Everyone here can call me PJ. I use that to
    diferentiate from the other hundred or so Phil Connells that are a part
    of my family going back a number of centuries.
    
    
    Anyway, I don't think that I could be called a Christian. When my
    minister decided that he couldn't bother giving me the classes I needed
    to join the church in an adult capacity, just because I was the only
    one who showed up for classes, that was pretty much the end for me as
    far as Christianity was concerned. Now I'm not here to knock other's
    beliefs. far from it. I'm here to listen and understand. There are some
    very interesting viewpoints and beliefs espoused in here and I want to
    hear more. 
    
    I see a lot of familiar names and faces in this file and just wanted to
    let you all know I'm here, listening and learning as usual.
    
    PJ

    
    Well, I guess I should really sign in here being that I've voice
    some of my opinions already.
    
    I'm Jill Kinsella.  I work in the CSC in Colorado Springs.  I'm
    originally from Staten Island, NY.  I grew up in the Evangelical
    Free Church.  I asked Christ into my heart one summer day back
    when I was a 8 yrs old.  When I was in high school I recommitted 
    myself to Him.  My walk isn't what I want it to be.  I'm currently 
    looking for a church to attend...denomination isn't important, but 
    teaching the Bible is.  I'm 29 (really, I am!!!) and comfortable being 
    single until I meet someone who I feel understands what the commitment 
    of marriage really means.  I'm very much a family person and we're 
    a very unique family.  We really like each other.  I consider my 
    family some of the best friends a person could ever have.
    
    I credit my parents and my Christian upbringing with not getting
    messed up in the turbulent times we live in.  I try to be a solid
    example to my nephews and nieces.  They are good kids and with a
    lot of hard work and prayer, maybe we can keep it that way.
    
    Jill
    

Having opened my mouth here, I am reminded I ought to introduce myself.

I'm Ben Soule, a senior software engineer at the Spit Brook Road
facility.  I am a lifelong Unitarian Universalist, and a
participant in the UU conference, where I heard of this conference.
I do not consider myself a christian, so I have been a sideliner
here, until the UU topic got hotter.  The maelstrom there now seems
to have passed on to other topics, so I expect to continue RO.


Ben

    Hello, everyone.  I have been wandering in and out of here for a while,
    but it just now dawned on me that I never formally introduced myself.

    My name is Mike Smith.  I grew up in a family with strong Roman Catholic 
    beliefs.  A family that did, and except for myself, still continues to 
    practice that religion rather faithfully.  However, at this time, I am
    definitely what the Church used to call an apostate.  I have simply
    been unable to continue to believe what the Church taught me in my
    childhood, for various and sundry reasons.

    Let me interject a bit of reassurance here, please.  I have acquired a
    certain reputation for antipathy toward religion, especially
    Christianity, in another noting conference, a reputation that is pretty
    much deserved.  This antipathy is born of some fairly strong feelings
    that are a direct result of certain happenings vis a vis my
    relationship with Christianity.  However, I do not propose to carry
    that sort of attitude into this conference, if only out of the common
    courtesy that one shows when entering another's home.  However, if I
    should get out a bit out of line, I do ask and hope that someone will
    nudge me as firmly as required onto the straight and narrow.

    While Christianity has much to offer in terms of moral values, I cannot
    accept those which are based strictly on dogma, which, in my opinion
    are unrelated to anything but perpetuation of the various Christian
    organizations.

    My purpose for noting here isn't entirely clear, even for me.  I guess
    mostly I would like to provide a bit of perspective from a
    non-Christian's point of view.  Think of my entries not as something to 
    make you question your faith, but one whose contributions will make you
    ask some questions that will help you clarify your faith.  (Sort of
    like the fat guy a health center might keep around to serve as an
    object lesson to the clients, or something.)  Meanwhile, I can have the
    same opportunity to clarify my own positions as regards religion.  It
    just might be possible, I suppose, that someday I will no longer be
    able to justify my apostasy in my own mind, and will therefore need
    some new ideas as to what to do next.  A word of warning, though, don't
    hold your breath!  :) 

    Mike

I ran into Collis in a seminar a couple of weeks ago and confessed that
I was a reader of this conference.  I suppose I should introduce myself. 8-)

I'm Paul Ferwerda, a software engineer at the Spit Brook Road facility.
I've attended CMA, Southern Baptist, Plymouth Brethern, an NACCC/ABC
federated church, Evangelical Covenant, and non-denominational churches.

I think of myself as an orthodox catholic evangelical Christian. (How's that
for a string of adjectives? 8-) )

I will read more than I contribute pretty much due to the fact that I tend
to read while I'm waiting for compiles to finish. 8-)

---
Paul		loptsn::ferwerda
Gordon			or
Loptson		[email protected]        
Ferwerda	Tel (603) 881 2221



			

[posted by Notes-News gateway]

Since I have made two replies to topics in this conference in as many 
weeks (after about a year as a read-only), I thought that I should
introduce myself.

I have worked for Digital since 1979 and am now at the NUO facility in 
Nashua, New Hampshire (though I live in Massachusetts).  I am an editor of 
technical documentation.

I grew up in the Baptist church and today call myself an unaffiliated 
United Methodist.  I would say that I definitely come from the liberal 
wing of the Christian faith.

Rick Thompson

    Hi!
    
    I'm Laura Steinhart.  I'm Jewish. (You probably already figured that out
    if you didn't already know. ;-) )
    
    I'm a tech writer for Networks and Communications in Littleton, MA. 
    I'm married and have a daughter, age 2.  I enjoy the study of religion,
    history, geography, and sociology, and all those elements come together
    here.
    
    I'm here mostly as a read only participant, but sometimes I just gotta
    put my 2 cents in. :-)
    
    Thanks for all I've learned so far.
    
    L

    Hello folks,
    
    I have been a sometime participant of the various Christian notes-files
    for many years. I am a fundamentalist because I believe that the Bible
    is the perfect, complete Word of God; the Omnipotent, Omniscient,
    Omni-present Creator of all that is. That God is revealed to us as a
    Trinity of Father (never seen by men), Son {Jesus of Nazereth,             
    conceived of the Holy Spirit, born of the virgin Mary, preached salvation,
    unmistakably (especially in the Jewish context) claimed deity (I and the
    Father are one), unlawfully tried for that claim alone, sinless, 
    gruesomely crucified, gloriously raised physically and immortal,
    advocating on my behalf before the throne of the Father}, and the Holy
    Spirit (living within me, convicting of sin, testifying to truth,
    producing fruit and gifts within me). I further believe that salvation
    is by faith ALONE but that true salvation is accompanied by visible
    changes of righteousness and action. That upon salvation I was
    justified and sanctified before God through the shed blood of Jesus
    which was for the remission of my sins. That without this demonstration
    of graciousness from God I was condemned in my sinfulness to eternal
    destruction with Satan and his rebellious angels. That my salvation is
    secure and eternal (even though my rewards in Heaven may vary). 
    
    I am evangelical because I believe that Jesus left us with the command
    to spread His message of salvation to the world, making us personally
    accountable at the judgment (of reward NOT salvation). I further
    believe that this message is the one which is contained in the
    traditional Christian message passed down from those who stood firm in
    the faith through the most horrible of persecutions and death and
    evidenced by the dramatically changed lives of millions of everyday
    people over the last 2 millennia. The recent resurgence of false
    teaching for man's edification will result for those involved in the
    most severe of judgments (God's word says it, not I).
    
    Finally, I believe that God orders the steps of each of His people and
    for that reason I am confident in His will that I be a participant in
    the current round of lay-offs. I am confident that He has something
    prepared which is better even than the work I have performed as a
    field hardware engineer for the last 13 years.
    
    My wife and I have 2 boys, 12 and 6. We attend church at Central
    Baptist Church of Tacoma, Wa. where we are actively involved in many of
    the activities and ministries of the church. I have read and
    participated in a few of these topics today but because of my
    situation, I will not be able to further respond after this entry. I
    believe that while some of my statements may be controversial to the
    apparent New-Age flavor of this "christian" conference I was careful
    not to be inflammatory or unbecoming of one whose prayer is that all would
    come to a saving relationship through Jesus Christ.
    
    And now in closing I will say farewell until some of us meet again,
    here, there, or in the air. May God bless this conference with a
    fruitful harvest of souls for Christ through the careful scrutiny of
    God's Holy Word. And may you further be blessed as God matures you.
    
    Love in our Saviour,
    
    Dave Rubenking
    11814 16th Ave. N.W.
    Gig Harbor, Wa. 98332
    
      

    RE: A new Moderator
    
    
    			With pleasure I announce that Mr. Jerry Beeler ,
    aka "Bubba", has been offered and he has accepted the role of a co-mod
    here.   Welcome Jerry!
    
    
    Dave

RE: new Moderator
    
    
    	It is my pleasure to announce that Patricia Flanagan has accepted
the role of co-moderator here in CHRISTIAN-PERSPECTIVE.

	Patricia is the mother of a 13 year old son and 11 year old daughter.
She's active in the UU Church of Andover where she's a member of the 
church's board of directors, co-chair of our adult education committee and 
a member of the "Welcoming Congregation" committee.  (The "Welcoming 
Congregation" is a program within UU churches to welcome Gay, Lesbian, and 
Bi-sexual persons into all areas of the church.)

	Patricia is a self-described religious liberal.  Liberal Christianity,
Creation Spirituality,  Process Theology, humanism, mysticism, and the
Neo-Pagan movement all have spiritual appeal to her.

	Two aspects of Christianity that have particular appeal to her, she
says, are the revolutionary love ethic of Jesus Christ and the powerful
symbolism of an inclusive body of Christ united together to create the reign
of the Divine, here on earth; a reign that would not be visible as a theocracy,
but as a society of people living together in love, justice and goodwill.

	"To love oneself, to love God, to love one's neighbors, to love the
earth on which we live," says Patricia, "are all part of our love for the
Divine."


	Welcome Patricia!
    
Richard

    Golly ... gee ... <scuffing feet draggin' on floor>  <sniffle> ...

    She got a 31 line introduction ... ol' Bubba got 9 lines.  Then again,
    I guess:

    		"Welcome to Bubba, a redneck, son of a poor
    		Texas dirt-farmer and (God forgive him for
    		he knows not the error of his ways) is in
    		Sales at DEC ....

    doesn't sound all that impressive.
    
    Pat, are you FULLY aware of the company you'll be keeping?

    :-)
    Bubba

    RE: Beeler's "hurt" feelings,
    
    					Sorry Jerry I couldn't resist.  I
    did believe that most of the people know you far too well.  I just
    didn't want to confirm their deepest fears. :-)
    
    
    Dave

    Richard,
    
    Thanks for the introduction.
    
    Bubba,
    
    I recognize the company I will be keeping.  That company played a major
    role in my accepting the invitation to be a co-moderator.  I also thank
    all the moderators for the invitation.  I am honored.
    
    
    peace and love
    
    Patricia
    
    
    
    

Hi, all -- I've been a read only for a little while now, but I'd
like to introduce myself cause I think I might start sayin' a few
things. 8-)

My name is Daniel Katz and I'm a DECTEMP working currently at the Patent
Law Office in MSO2 (I'm logging on from a previous account at BXB
so look for the node to change soon).  I've temped during leave terms
from college for five years now and have been working at various 
assignments since I got my M.A. in Creative Writing last Spring.

Religion-wise, I'm something of a mixed bag.  Ethnically, I'm from
a very Jewish family (Remember the split screen scene in "Annie
Hall"?  That's us living under the roller coaster!)  Theologically,
I suppose I'm agnostic (My mother says that's because I can't make
up my mind about anything, but I think it's because I have real
troubles trying to put my feelings about the Divine into *any*
type of entity)  Spiritually, I'm a really mixed bag...I like
Judaism's pragmatic approach to many issues, I like Jesus'
emphasis on love, I like Toaism's emphasis on BEING and I like
the creative principals of the ancient Goddess-based religions.

If you think that's eclectic, you should see my music collection.

I like a lot of what I've read here and hope to be able to ask
questions to learn more and maybe offer some observations of my
own.  I look at the Hebrew and Christian Bibles as historical
and allegorical attempts by humans to understand and itneract
with Divine principals...I hope my tendency to try to dissect
things in a literary critique manner doesn't offend anyone.

Best wishes,

Daniel Katz
MSO2-3/G1
dtn: 223-6121

   Hello,

   I have moved to a new office in Stow (ma).  Until the network databases
   sort things out Vidsys:: seems to be known as Rxbury::, which it isn't.
   Email can be sent to 58280:: for the time being.

   Regards,
   Allison

Since Richard welcomed me in note 561, I feel I have to "get out in the open".

My name is Hans Huisman and I work for Digital Holland in Amsterdam as a
Customer Support Engeneer. I'm happely married to a wonderfull spontaneous
wife. We do have three children at a age of about 30 years, two girls
and one boy. For a couple of years, we are the very proud grandparents
of two lovely girls.

I do follow a lot of discussions in the notes files as a read only noter,
and I probably will do so in the future, since "bread alone" is not enough.

As for my interrests, I love "digging" in old manuscripts of "every kind"
as solong their origine is before Christ, I mean as our dating B.C. or A.D.
My personal supporting text is :

       " Prove all things; hold fast that wich is good. "
                                     I Thessalonians 5:21

As for our beliefs, my wife is a reborn Christian, however my belief is of a
different kind. Up till now, I did not found any Church, Organisation,
or what kind of name people might use, that supports my feelings.
Although I do believe in the excistence of Jesus, God and The Holy Spirit.
I do love all people, if someone feels offended, please do not, as enlish 
is NOT my native language. So some words or sentences might give the
wrong expression, wich is not intended.

Love to all,
Hans Huisman

P.S. I do involve my wife in every "human subject" that I do,
     so she likes to add the following :

Hello everybody,

As Hans's wife I will warmly greet you all. May the Lord lead Hans by
reading your discussions.  Mostly, I am not so fond about computers,
but in this way surely computers can be very usefull.

God's richest blessings to you all.

Mia Huisman

    Well, I've been shooting my mouth off here so I thought I'd enter a
    note of introduction.

    My name is Eric Myers.  I grew up in a family that was/is devoutly
    Roman Catholic.  In fact my father (now deceased) was a convert to
    Catholicism.  In my early adult live I became more interested in the
    Bible itself.  After the initial delight in seeking out answers,
    through concondances, cross references and Bible studies, I came to
    believe that the Bible was not some Ouiji board with all of life's
    answers.  The Bible for me is more complex than a quick reference
    guide or list of rules.

    Anyway, I find myself drawn to this file in search of insight that one
    doesn't usually get in an organized Bible group.  Here, there is much
    more diversity of opinion and this provokes much more thought.  Right
    now I am not affiliated with any particular church, although I do still
    identify with my heritage of being brought up Roman Catholic.

    I'll try not to be too pompous :^)  I grew up in a family where debate
    was encouraged, so I may seem to be opinionated.  It is nothing for my
    father (step-father, actually) and I to have a heated discussion only
    to end with, "Well that was thought provoking... wanna' Coke?".  It's
    quite a let down for people who think that we're arguing.  (There's a
    big difference between discussing something and arguing.)

    Gee, I feel kind of silly....
    
    About 6-7 weeks ago, I thought I was kaput with Digital...it turns out
    that after all of that time seriously pounding the pavement, DEC came
    through with a new assignment before I found permanent work...life
    abounds, I suppose!
    
    Anyway, It's me again, and I'm glad to be able to read and write in
    these parts.  I'm working in the Specifications Control Group in
    Franklin (soon to become Marlborough) and as per usual, I have no idea
    how long I will be with DEC, but I hope to enjoy it while I'm here!
    
    peace & joy,
    
    Daniel Katz

Hello,

I'm Dorian Brooks, technical writer, feminist, member of NOW, sometime poet, 
sometime historian of science, married to antiquarian bookseller, mother of
two teenagers, keen on women's history, interested in comparative religions
in general, and women's spirituality and the history of Goddess reverence
and what happened to it, in particular. To the question, "Religious 
affiliation?", I've given varying responses, including, None. Agnostic.
Pagan. Spiritual atheist. Witch. -- I'd rather contemplate the Mystery than
follow any particular Answer... 

I think the historical devaluing and suppression of what Jungians call "the
feminine" are in large part what's wrong with our -- you'll pardon the
expression -- patriarchal culture/society today, and I think that imbalance
is damaging to us all, men as well as women. I applaud Her return in any
context, but especially within the dominant religions, since (imo) it is to
a great extent their worldview that informs the larger one of our society,
however secular that society has become. 

I've learned a lot reading this file, and hope to learn more!

Thanks,

Dorian

    
    	Hello!
    
	Having been a CP "read-only" participant (excluding two small
	contributions to the humour topic) for a couple of month now,
	I guess it in time to introduce myself.

	Derek Button, a Brit. living in Austria, married to Sieglinde
	and father to David (14).  Sieglinde is Roman Catholic and I
	am ex-Church of England.  David is nominally Catholic but is
	currently going through a puberty-driven phase of experiment,
	looking at Buddhism & Islam amongst others.  Sieglinde and I
	trying to objectively help him through this difficult time.
	We have good relations with the local clergy and David often
	discusses his problems with his priest.

	Why am I a read-only participant?

	Basically I could say that I am not a Christian although I do
	try hard to live by the basic Christian doctrine of love. In
	this I am only partially successful.

	For example: - and this is probably the "core" reason for my
	passive participation here - I become very impatient with
	people who are adamant, in spite of - IMO - overwhelming 
	evidence to the contrary:
	- that the earth is only <insert number less than 10000>
	  years young.
	- that evolution is a myth.
	- that there has been no tampering with biblical texts (add-ins
	  and deletions to suit this or that agenda).
	- that here are no texts other than canonical texts which are
	  theologically relevant.
	- that the texts we have are not peppered with contradictions.
	- that Mary was a virgin (unruptured hymen).
	- that Jesus was anything other than a Jewish teacher who has
	  been "adopted" (read: misappropriated) as a focal point for
	  the foundation of a religion so far removed from Judaism.
	- that Paul was *converted* to .. to what? 
	- that Paul's teachings were intended to found a new religion
	  outside of Judaism rather than to bring Gentiles into the
	  fold of Judaism.
	- etc.

	I feel that my intelligence is under attack when - to explain
	biblical conflicts - the most incredible arguments are offered:
	- Jesus overturned the table in the temple twice,
	- Judas died twice,
	- God issued two sets of instructions to Noah,
	- there were two creations.
	- etc.

	And the never-ending arguments (do not read: discussions) on
	Timothy "all scripture is God-breathed" makes me ......

	To put it in a nutshell, I am neither qualified, nor worthy to
	participate actively in your conference.

	Whatever your faiths' I wish you all peace and happiness.

	Thanks for reading this. Greetings, Derek.
      

It's been a couple of years since my original introduction, so allow me
re-introduce myself.

My name is Richard Jones-Christie.  I work at the Customer Support Center
in Colorado Springs.

If I had to categorize myself I would say that I am a Christian mystic.
I turned my life over to the leadership of Christ many years ago.  I
try to walk in the light, but I'm not perfect.

I have been a Congregationalist, a Quaker, a United Methodist, and I'm
presently a member of the local MCC (Metropolitan Community Church).
I've been actively involved in Presbyterian, Lutheran, Roman Catholic,
and Unitarian Universalist churches and organizations.  My spouse and
I both tend to be very ecumenical.

I married Sharon over 13 years ago.  We both had been married previously.
I have a teenaged step-daughter, Jennifer, and a son (13), Ricky, by
our present marriage.

Within this conference, and perhaps elsewhere, I am a bit of a fire starter.
I suspect I have more entries here than any other single contributor.  I
personally appreciate the relative absence of restrictions and also the
wide diversity of perspectives shared within this file.  I regret that not
all participants share this appreciation.

Peace,
Richard

 Hello.  I'm Jim Henderson, age 42 divorced father of 3 males.
 I'm a born again, Bible believing Christian who was saved in 1979 but drifted
 away for a while til God pulled me back several months ago.  I have been search
 ing for a church for a few months, but believe I've found where I belong in 
 an independant fundamental Baptist church in Londonderry NH.

 I'm mostly read only in here, primarily because I am interested in seeing what
 others believe and why, but may chime in occasionally.






 Jim

    
	Even some of you already know who I am, I think a little intro-
    	duction would be helpful for the rest of you.
    
    	My name is Juan Gutierrez who was born in Cuba many moons ago,
    	more than I care to recall, have been an american citizen for
    	over 25 yrs., I'm located at Northboro, MA. working as an
    	information system specialist (programmer).
    
	I was raised as a Roman Catholic, then wandered on to other
    	religions in search of Truth and answers to life and its problems;
    	religions didn't give me any answers which satisfied me, so I turned 
    	to philosophies and books where I have been fortunate to find many 
    	answers to my questions.  In my searching, I found that there is
	"good" and "bad" in all religions, no religion is "perfect", and 
	no single religion is "the only real and true one", at least *not yet*.
    
	I look for Truth wherever I can find it, for the pieces of the puzzle 
	are scattered all over.  Eventually, you realize that the answers 
	were right inside of you, if you only knew how to read them.  
	Acquiring the ability to read the answers inside of us takes a long 
	time; in the meantime, I'll have to accept someone else's answer 
	if they makes sense to me.  I don't care for dogmas, I just want the 
	Truth, for there can be nothing higher than the Truth, and Truth is 
	in each and every religion if one could but know how to read it 
	correctly.

	Many of the the answers I have found may not fall in line with what 
	most christians believe, but I think that's because of the 
	mis-translation, mis-interpretation of the current Bibles, and in
	trying to interpret them exoterically when the meaning is given 
	esoterically, here lies one of the biggest problems, specially in
	the book of Genesis and Revelations.  
    	
    	I like to share what I have found, and hope that you will benefit
	from it like I did, but I don't like to engage in any debates because 
	I think it's a waste of time.  I will clarify or expand on any 
	explanation, if asked.  It isn't my purpose to try to convice you, 
	no-one can make you change your mind except yourself.

	When you see something that I post, you may find something in it that 
	will make you identify with it and accept it.  But if your intuition
	tells you not to accept it, then you should reject it.  One person's 
	food may be another person's poison, and what works for one may not 
	work for another.
    
    	I believe that we are all brothers and sisters, sparks of what most 
	call "God", no matter what religion, belief, sex, position, creed or 
	nationality we may belong to.  We are all part of the ONE.  If that 
	goes against what you as a Christian believe, then you may not call 
	me a Christian; names mean little to me so you may call me what you
	wish, but I don't like to use labels on anyone.
	
    
				Juan			

    Hi.

    I'm Tom Baker.  I've been "around".  Some would say I've been
    around a little *too* long. :-)

    Been protestant, mystic, Hindu/yoga.  Now I try to find God wherever
    I can.  In other people is a really good start.  Even the ones that
    "push my buttons" 'cause they're just showing me what's keeping me
    from God.

    I like a conference where people know how to use smilies :-)

    Tom

Well, after lurking around this conference for almost a year, I decided 
it was time to introduce myself.

I'm Sandy Bruso and work in the Salt Lake City sales office (at least 
for now :^) ) as a Configuration Specialist.  When I manage to free 
myself from raising my two pre-teen daughters, I enjoy sports of all 
kinds (you haven't skiied until you've been to Utah) and classical 
music.

I was born and raised in Massachusetts and was a lifelong and devout 
atheist until 18 months ago when I accepted Jesus as my savior and 
became a Christian.  Many of you here will consider me a fundamentalist 
(excuse me while I duck under my desk) but I prefer to call myself an 
evangelical Christian.  I believe the Bible to be the inerrant (but not 
literal) word of God and have followed the many discussions in this 
conference with interest.  I don't agree with many of the views expoused 
here, but having spent my life denying and despising any mention of God 
and religion, I respect the opinions.  Work permitting, I hope to 
participate more actively in the future.

Sandy
 

Hello,

I've posted a few notes, and now have to decide if I continue to post or go to 
read-only. (Actually, I'm going to ask you to decide).

My dilemma here is that I am an atheist. I am not 'preachy' about it, and I have
no desire to un-convert anyone. I am, however, frightened by what is my
perception of the increasing influence of religion in this country. I am not 
afraid of religion per se, what worries me is the attempt to pass religious 
morals into law.

My basic view is that if what I am doing does not harm you, I should not be
prevented from doing it. Obviously this philosophy could (and has been) discussed
heavily, but that discussion is not for an introduction note.

My prime purpose for following these notes is to try to understand what is being
done, and why, in the name of religion.

My question is, then, may I continue to post? I will do so without personal 
attacks, with respect for your beliefs and with a genuine desire to learn. I 
understand, however, that my responses may make you uncomfortable, and I will not
retreat from issues that I feel threaten my freedoms. On the other hand, this is
your house and if you wish you may remove this introduction and return to 
'lurker' status. So how about it, would you like a token heathen or shall I slink
back into the shadows from whence I came? :^)

Let me know, and I will abide by the wishes of the majority.

Humbly, Steve

(BTW, this note was much harder to write than I thought it would be, and still
 didn't come across entirely as I would have liked it to.) 

    Hello...
    
    I'm here because I want to know something that I think you can tell me.
    
    Can anyone tell me what LUKE 9:27 and MARK 9:1 is?
    
    I'd be most obliged because although I know there is a bible somewhere
    in the house, well... there used to be anyway... for the life of me I
    don't know where it is.
    
    Thank you very much.
    
    mary 

" I tell you the truth, some who are standing here will not taste death 
before they see the kingdom of God."   NIV



And he said to them, "I tell you the truth, some who are standing here 
will not taste death before they see the kingdom of God come with 
power."  NIV


Hpoe this helps.


Sandy

    
    Hello,
    
    Thanks for the welcome Richard.
    
    My name is John Dorsey. Most of the people that know me just call
    me by my initials "JD". I'm a field service engineer working out
    of MK01 and covering the Concord N.H. area.
    
    I've been a read only member of this notes file for 3 or 4 months.
    I'm a mostly read only member of several notes files,mainly because 
    I don't spend much time in the office because I'm out shagging calls.
    I just try to keep my unread notes under a certian level. And out of
    all of the notes files i'm into this one is the most active one,which
    suits me just fine.
    
    I've been at Digital for 11 1/2 years now and I still like what I'm 
    doing.
    
    God bless to all,
    
       JD
    

    Ahs hear and accounted for.. :-) [pun intended]
    
    Geesh, I just figured folks knew me.  
    
    I'm a fundamental independent Christian who goes to a Baptist Church
    which believes in separation and KJV Bible.  I teach Sunday School to
    girls from the surrounding inner cities; East Palo Alto and East San
    Jose.  My girls come from gang and drug infested neighborhoods, I've
    had a 11 year old give birth that attended my class, a 10 year old who
    had an alcohol problem and quite discouragingly, many of my girls are
    vicitms of incest or molestation.
    
    I too was victim of incest and molestation.  I accepted Christ after
    being placed in a Christian Foster Home...  where I lived for 3 years
    and learned how a family *can* be.  There wasn't much affection in
    that home and at times felt greatly taken advantage of [the oldest of
    10 children, I cleaned, cooked, babysat and went to school].
    
    But when Christ came into my heart, all of the hate, anger and
    resentment that I had stored inside was under the blood, and He
    transformed a very bitter 13 year old, into a loving, compassionate
    teenager.  I dedicated my teen years to reaching others with the
    Gospel.
    
    However, paradise didn't last long... when the Florida state
    authorities [who knew nothing of the incest] placed me back into the
    home of my perverted father.  I was 16 now.  I went to church every
    time the doors were open, and it was common to come home and find my
    father having orgys in the living room... I'd walk through naked
    bodies with my Bible clutched to my breast, and would nail my bedroom
    door shut... it wasn't long before I began to question who this God
    really was and why he had abandoned me in my time of need.
    
    I rebelled and for 8 or 9 years, God was no longer a part of my life. 
    I must admit that every time I saw a church bus or the name Jesus
    written, I'd be very convicted inside, but the more I resisted the
    conviction, the easier it became to not feel too very much.
    
    I married and was now unequally yoked because I was pregnant.  But the
    moment I felt that baby move inside, all of the conviction from the
    Holy Spirit that had been squelched came flooding back through me so
    fierce that I began to weep uncontrollably.  I found my Bible and began
    to pray that God would help me raise my child to know Him.  
    
    Well, I've been back on track for now close to 10 years.  When I
    rededicated my life, it of course didn't stop the consequences of my
    rebellion... and I need to work out some answers to those questions
    that led me into my rebellion...  But once I asked God for restoration,
    He began pointing Christians in my direction and helping me to come to
    a full understanding of His nature and His unconditional love.
    
    The single most important revelation to me personally was from God
    through His word.  That He loved *me* before the foundation of the
    world... and that meant my father was also loved by God before the
    foundation of the world.... It helped to complete the forgiveness
    towards my father for what he'd done to me..��. which in turn promoted
    the healing in my heart from the same.
    
    I think Mr.Christie, I've extended my introduction beyond acceptable
    boundaries... please ��forgive me, but I believe it's what God would
    hav��e had me to say.
    
    Nancy
    

Mark Metcalfe
Technical writer, OpenVMS
Prolific writer, avocation

I've been poked by those on the right and left, and mostly from the left
so, I'd judge myself right of center on many issues.  I know some are so
far left that I appear so far to the right, but that's all right by me.

Christianity is about Christ.  God incarnate.  Christian religions
are an expression of the Person of Christ.  Too often, we get it backwards
and believe that Christ is an expression of our beliefs.

If you intend to follow Christ, you must get to know him as he is, in
spirit and in truth.  You may debate how one gets to know Christ if you like.
I am of the persuasion that any "Christ" that contradicts what is expressed
of God the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit in the Bible is not the Christ.
The Bible is not a text to tell us all there is to know about God,
for certain, but it is a text that tells us what we NEED to know
about God to "get the message."  There's an eternity waiting in which
some of us will get to know God a whole lot better than we do now.

MM

Name:  Richard Jones-Christie

Classification:  CHRISTIAN

Sub-Class:  MYSTIC

Theology:  TRINITARIAN

Orientation:  ECUMENICAL

Affiliations:  The Religious Society of Friends (Quaker)
               The United Methodist Church
               Metropolitan Community Church

Major Sins:  Adultery (former spouse still alive)
             Imperfect parenting, especially as a stepparent.
             I've had a vasectomy, a sin in the eyes of some.

    I wish to introduce myself. My name is Rodger Dusatko(American living
    since 1976 in Germany). I have a precious, english Wife Lynn and 3
    children, Sarah(5), Matthew(2) and Sammuel(0). I came from a stong
    athiestic background. At the age of 17 for the first time I encountered
    Jesus Christ and was floored with his reality, 'too good to be true' is
    the best I can say. From the beginning I chose to know him instead of
    anything else and am so grateful that this love relationship with him
    was granted me. I am also grateful for every christian who loves him,
    although I might be a little confronting when I sense deception. I
    hope, as Solomon spoke almost 3000 years ago:
    
    Iron sharpeneth iron; so a man sharpeneth the countenance of his
    friend.
    
    I hope to contribute to this sharpening, as well as myself being
    sharpened by any comments you might give.
    
    
    Rodger Dusatko

    Hi.  Guess I should introduce myself, since I intend to copy a series
    of Lenten meditations into the file.

    My name is Debby Haeck.  I live and work in Merrimack, NH.  I am
    married and have three children.  I am a "cradle" Episcopalian,
    currently a member of Faith Episcopal Church in Merrimack.  I am the
    Senior Warden, a Lay Eucharistic Minister I (soon to be II), chair of
    the Altar Guild, book keeper for a property we manage for the Bishop,
    and typist for the newsletter.

    Well, I wrote a note, so I better introduce myself.
    
    I'm Mark Trumpler, I work in Nashua, live in Lexington, MA.  My
    "religion" is best described as atheism.  I was raised in a basically
    secular way -- traditional German Christmas celebrations were the only
    thing even remotely religious.
    
    I won't say too much here (despite my longish first note...).  I'm here
    to try and understand Christians, not because I'm interested altering
    my lack of faith.
    
    Mark

    I'm Ron Warrenfeltz working out of Greenbelt, MD and living and
    worshiping in Bowie, MD.
    
    I was saved on April 6, 1986 and my spiritual birthday is just around
    the corner.  This last September, I began to co-teach 5th & 6th grade
    boys SS class.  I have a 4 1/2 yr old daughter who loves, SS, church,
    AWANA, etc.  My wife has been a Christian since she was 8.

  Hi,

    My name is Tony Barbieri.  I've worked at Digital for over nine
    years in the Hudson semiconductor facility.  I am 35 years old,
    but I'll be 36 in just a couple days (May 5).

    I've been a Christian for ten years.  I attend a Seventh-Day
    Adventist Church and am reasonably comfortable in its fellowship
    because it (and I) believe a few things that are out of the mainstream.
    I happen to believe certain things that are quite 'unmainstream'
    and are (presently at least) not official Adventist doctrine either.
    But, I must be true to my own heart in my personal relationship
    with my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.

    I suppose the main thought I have is that the smallest nugget of
    light can convert the soul, the entire gospel can perfect it.  And
    the reason we are so lukewarm is because we have about a thimble's
    worth understanding of the gospel.  I believe the last generation
    will put all the pieces together and when they do, they will be
    considered scum by the rest of the world and all the endtimes events
    will usher in.

    My main concern with Christianity today is its contentment regarding
    its understanding of the plan of redemption.  Paul says in 1 Corin 8:2
    "If any man thinks he knows anything, he knows nothing yet as he ought."
    Christianity today is like Simon the Pharisee.  So hard to reach!  He
    is content!  Jesus wants to show him His word, but he feels he already
    understands it.  How can he drink in more when he feels no need???

    I have a wife and two daughters.  By the way, my wife just became
    a Christian very recently!  As of now, she is nondenominational and
    doesn't want anyone to tell her what anything in the Bible means; 
    she is convicted that if she has enough faith, Christ will reveal
    it to her.  I see a role for teachers, but my thoughts are: "AMEN!!!"

    May we somehow be made able to see Christ hung for us in such a deep
    way that in that 'seeing', it will be much too hard to sin against
    the Lord.  It would hurt too much to turn back on that love - even for
    a moment.

                                                    God Bless,

                                                    Tony

Note 911.10 JARETH::CHARPENTIER

Welcome, Dolores!
    
Note 907.88 VERVAN::FYFE

Welcome, Tom!

    I hope you'll take a moment to introduce yourselves.

Shalom,
Richard

Note 913.0 by TOOK::MWILSON
    
    Welcome to C-P!
    
    I hope you'll take a moment to introduce yourself.
    
    Shalom,
    Richard
    

    I think I may have overlooked asking Mike Heiser to introduce himself.
    My apologies.  Invitation extended!
    
    Shalom,
    Richard
    

Hi all,

Per request, here's a brief introduction.  I'm Tom Peterson,
working in ZK & living in the Worcester area.  I was raised
as a Baptist in a predominantly Catholic home.  However, as
my Christian beliefs continue to grow, I find that I do not
agree with many of the teachings of my youth.  I look to God
and The Bible for instruction and guidance in my life.

- Tom

 
 Hi 

 I'm Hank DAlelio. There has never been a time that I can remember not
 knowing (about) Jesus Christ. My earlist memories are of my mother and
 my aunts (Roman Catholic) teaching me about God. In my teens and 20's
 I chose atheism-agnosticism as my "ground of being" Later I returned to
 the Lord after several months of reading the Bible. I dont have any church
 in particular, I guess I'm a "reformed" type Christian. Ive had several
 years of formal theological as well as secular training/education.
 My wife and I have 11 children from the only marriage either of us has 
 entered into. I live in Maine.

Hello all,

	Pete Gray here. I'm English, 31, male, white, middle-class, hetro,
	freelance, and most of all, individual. I've been called a christian,
	but as I've no clear definition of what a christian is, I really
	can't comment.

	I have no clear views on religion, other than saying I don't know much
	about it. I'm not sure about my non-religious 'spiritual' beliefs either,
	but I think I'll find out pretty soon.

Regards,
Pete.

    Greetings all...
    
    My name is Paul Gavin working as a contractor at CXO and am a
    prior digit (83-92).  Don't know how long I'll be here, but then
    that's the contractors lot.  I'll be mostly a reader as I don't
    really have the time for decent writing.  I was raised as a
    Catholic, but now worship (praise the Lord) in a charismatic
    church and have found an uplifting experience in that environment.
    
    I would encourage all you 'read only' folks to intro themselves.
    That simple act will make you part of the family.
    
    Paul
    

    I just realised that I have never introduced myself....!
    
    My name is Rob Lincoln and I am a Sales Support Specialist in the
    Banking & Finance District in Sydney, Australia.
    
    I accepted Jesus Christ as my personal Saviour when I was 15 years old
    at a Billy Graham Crusade.  My background is Conservative Baptist with
    a bit of Quaker thrown in from one of my grandmothers, and Mennonite
    from the other side of the family!  I was the first person in my
    immediate family to become a Christian and had the priviledge of
    leading both my parents and my sister to Christ.  (By "leading" I mean
    telling them about Christ and leting the Holy Spirit do the rest!)
    
    I feel as if my whole life has been immersed in Christianity.  I used
    to work for Campus Crusade, and one of the most dynamic experiences in
    my life was back when I joined the Navigators.  There is nothing more
    exciting than memorizing Scripture.  
    
    In recent years I have been struggling with holding on to all the good
    things that my conservative background has provided while at the same
    time rejecting the not so good things.  This struggle is not easy and
    it leaves me more dependant upon God every day.  It is hard work
    sifting through man-made attitudes and getting back to the
    fundamentals.
    
    I look forward to learning a lot from you all.
    

Hi.  I'm Steve Huston.  I am a consultant, now working in Acton, MA.
I have been a Christian since I was 21 (about 11+ years ago).  I've been
married for almost 13 years - only by God's grace in replacing my heart
did we make it past 2 years.

I attend a Christian and Missionary Alliance church now, and have been in
a few other kinds along the way.  I believe that the Bible is inspired by
God, inerrant in all it says.  Some may label me fundamentalist, but I'm
not really sure what that means, so I can't say if it's true or not.  I
believe Jesus died for me, God drew me to himself and saved me, and I
live for him now (well, as best as I can muster...).  But Pat Robertson isn't
my hero, and I'm not a dittohead  :-)

I usually read more than write, except when I've got free time (hah!) or
someone pushes a hot button.

-Steve

    I have just made an embarrassing discovery: I haven't introduced myself
    yet! I thought I had, but... oh well!
    
    So, here I am. 
    
    I'm Julie O'Donnell. I'm 27, my birthday is 10th May. I live in
    Reading, Berkshire in England with my younger sister (she's 17 and I
    suppose I'm the mid-way point between home and the big wide world for
    her). We have two cats, both four years old, who are spoiled and loved
    by us both and we feed any strays which happen to turn up.
    Occasionally, we rehome them too.
    My father is an atheist, but my mother insisted that I was christened
    Church of England. I am at the moment the only member of my family to
    attend Church on a regular basis. This is a Baptist Church at the
    moment, but I'll attend anywhere, be it Protestant or Catholic, as long
    as I go SOMEWHERE. On one occasion , I even ended up worshipping at a
    Welsh Chapel, although the minister very kindly translated parts of his
    sermon for me.
    My own job within the Church is as flower-arranger. I also lead the
    guitar group, which consists of 4 very dedicated but fairly novice
    guitarists. We play along to the songs we can during the service and we
    have a practice, when I can do some teaching on Wednesdays.(when I'm
    not working).  
    I work as an Operator. I was an employee about a year and a half ago,
    but they decided, in their wisdom, to employ me as a contractor.
    I work shifts, which is why I'm around so often when the rest of the UK
    have (sensibly) gone home. I've been working for Digital for about six
    years now.
    I am engaged to be married to a very nice man from Guildford (about 30
    miles south of Reading). He is unfortunately allergic to cats, which
    has caused some amusement to my friends, but he has been much better
    since he started associating with mine. I suppose he's getting used to
    it. We're getting married next year, at the end of July.

    I have read this conference for a lot longer than I have written to it. 
    Since I have written a few times now, and been asked to introduce
    myself, I shall do so.
    
    I think of myself as a middle-of-the-road sort, neither liberal nor
    conservative, but people keep moving the goal-posts, so others might
    not agree with my self-description.  I do not identify with any
    denomination, but think of myself as "freelance Protestant" and, with
    my wife, attend a moderate-to-conservative Congregational church.
    
    I also moderate the Philosophy conference on ERIS::PHILOSOPHY, and my
    approach to religious questions is usually theological or exegetical,
    rather than social or political.  (There are several topics in the
    Philosophy conference that noters here might find interesting.  Just
    log in and enter DIR/KEY=GOD, DEATH, DUALISM, ETHICS, GNOSTICISM,
    HARTSHORNE, MYSTICISM, or SOUL.)
    
    Earl Wajenberg

    My name is Agostino Grilletta. I'm Italian living in Rome. My English
    is not too rich. 
    
    Married and father. Raised as Roman Catholic. During puberty I was
    agnostic, then interested in Unitarianism and now in Buddhism.
    
    Here I'm just an observer. I'm looking for my spiritual path.
    
    Peace
    
    	Agostino

    My name is Alex Odor.
    Working for DEC since 1981.
    Married and have 4 children in the age of 9, 10, 16 and 18.
    Came from the Caribean to Europe with the age of 14.
    Although the islands where I came from are rather religious,three of
    them are still colonised as far as I know, I never worried about a
    God. Most of my education I got here in Europe. The thing that
    fascinating me a lot during my education was science.I mean things like
    Math, Physics, Philisophy, Astronomy and astrology. I had at last more 
    questions than answers. 
    It was that time that DEC relocated from West to East, because of lack
    of employees, that someone rang at my home.
    And like I said, I had a lot of questions concerning all the
    disciplines mention above.
    And that's the way I start to become one of the Jehovah's Witnesses.
    
    Rgds,                             
    Alex. 
    

    Since I never really formally introduced myself in here...
    
    I've been with DEC since October of 1980 and currently work as an
    Information Systems Software Specialist under the Outsourcing branch of
    CNS.  I was born and raised in central Massachusetts, but moved to
    Phoenix, Arizona after high school to be with my bride-to-be.
    
    My beautiful wife and I just celebrated our 13th anniversary on Monday.  
    We have 4 little blessings (children) at our house.  I pray that God
    doesn't bless me with anymore of them ;-)
    
    I was born again in Christ, and baptized, in First Baptist church in 
    Clinton, MA when I was 9.  When I was 12 we switched to Leominster
    Assembly of God.  I backslid pretty good as a teen, like most teens do,
    but rededicated my life to Christ when I was 17.  I stayed with AG
    churches until 3 years ago when I switched to one of the local Calvary
    Chapels.  I've spent many years as a Sunday School teacher to high
    school and college-aged students.  Also had a short term as a Church 
    board member before leaving AG.
    
    God Bless,
    Mike

I thought I had put an intro in here long ago - a quick 'dir 3.*' showed
differently.

I'm 45, been working for DEC since May '83, in the Subsystems Engineering
Group.  I was raised Roman Catholic, left the faith in my late teens, explored
various new age and buddhist teachings in my twenties, and returned to
Christianity in my 30's.  Now I'm agnostic, as I couldn't reconcile the
historical claims of Christianity with what I perceive to be the facts.  I am
mostly read only in this conference, but anticipate increased participation in
the future.

My wife, Judy, and I have been married for 13 years, and have two grade school
kids.  The older is as skeptical as we are of spiritual teachings, whilst the
younger one seems to be more accepting of the divine.  We all attend All Souls
Unitarian Church in Colorado Springs.  The religious education program there is
quite inclusive, and we feel that it will give our kids a good base from which
to decide upon their beliefs.

/Mike

    I wrote a introduction for womennotes and thought I would share it
    here as an update.
        
    I am a woman and a feminist.  I love ideas.  I love being outside
    walking or riding my bicycle or skiing.  I love my two children ages 15
    and 13. I love the man who has become my significant other.
    
    My Digital Job code defines me as a Finance Manager, but I work mainly
    with Financial Systems.  I am a Unitarian Universalist and part time
    theology student at Andover Newton Theological School.  At times that
    can be a lonely place for a Heretic. 
    
    I am reading Elaine Pagels book on Gnostism and am responsible for the
    panel discussion of the last three chapters which talks about Heresy,
    Gnosis as self knowledge, and the conclusions. The chapter on The Gnostic
    Heresy influences me today to tongue in cheek define myself as a Heretic,
    standing in good company with the Gnostics, the Unitarian forefathers
    murdered for their beliefs, and all our sisters burned at the state for
    their alleged heresy.
    
    I am committed to working Gender issues in support of the full humanity
    of both women and men.
    
    Patricia

    Just an afterthought...Some of you may have recently noticed a
    repulsive "Set Personal"...something about loving Barney.  I wear this
    mark as a sign of scorn from the SOAPBOX community.
    
    Because I got caught doing a small...insignificant infraction, they had
    a trial, I was convicted after, believe it or not, 560 replies, and my
    sentence was to write something on my header that was edifying to
    Barney.
    
    I'm still convinced that one day this purple dino is going to turn on
    the kids and go into an evil rampage.  Until January 1st however, I
    must be shamed with this header.  
    
    I just wanted you to know I still find Barney annoying but felt I
    should explain this turn of propriety!!
    
    -Jack

    Barney is the Beast!

    For those interested, 773.0 is the topic for "Bashing Barney."
    
    I'm no fan of Barney, not because I'm an alarmist or because I see
    anything Satanic about the program, but for the same reason I was
    no fan of Donnie and Marie.  My sensibilities can withstand only so
    much syrupy sweetness.  If not careful, I get sugar diabetes of the
    mind.
    
    Shalom,
    Richard
    

    	Just dropping a note to announce that I'm back after a nice
    	retreat to cool off and collect my thoughts.
    
    	Different attitude.  Different expectations.  Different goals.
    
    	More interested in discussion than in "fertilizing".
    
    	It'll be cool.
    
    	Joe

    Hi,
    
    I would like to introduce myself to this conference.  My name is
    Annette Kilcrease, I have been a read only for quite some time.  I
    would like to become a participant in some of the interesting topics
    that has been introduced.  I've been with Digital for 10 years.
    
    Looking forward to join in some of the great discussions.
    
    Annette
    
    

    Hi Annette:
    
    I look forward to good discussion and learning from you!!
    
    -Jack

    Greetings,
    
    Though mostly read-only, I have made a few forays into the written 
    world of this conference so it seems only proper that you know 
    something about me personally.
    
    I am currently juggling dual vocations, one as a Digital employee and 
    the other as an Assemblies of God evangelist.  Unfortunately, with a 
    few notable exceptions, AG ministers often have to rely on a second 
    income to survive.  I joined and received credentials with the 
    Assemblies about a year ago but have been in the field for 15 years as 
    an independent evangelist.  My pre-ministry church background has been 
    all along the spectrum from liberal (American Baptist and Episcopal) to 
    conservative (Nazarene and the AG).  Although I made a commitment to 
    Christ at an early age (8) I polluted my faith by pursuing martial arts 
    beyond the physical practice into the spiritual realm.  At one point I 
    called myself a Taoist Christian which simply means that I was very 
    confused.  While teaching Tang Soo Do in Kwang Ju, Korea a chaplain, 
    Sam Park, reintroduced me to the love of Christ.  Through this man and 
    the working of the Holy Spirit I was restored to right relationship 
    with Christ.
    
    You will probably not hear much from me in this conference, not for 
    lack of interest or even for lack of time but because of my own 
    weakness.  As a young hothead know-it-all I enjoyed the rush of arguing 
    theology as much as I had enjoyed the rush of the fight in martial 
    arts.  Later the Lord was able to teach me two things.  One, I did not 
    know as much as I thought.  The second, it is better to win a soul than 
    to win an argument.  I realize that the letters to Timothy are hotly 
    debated in this conference but for me 2 Timothy 2:22-26 holds a lot of 
    value.
    
    2 Timothy 2:22-26
    Flee youthful lusts; but follow righteousness, faith, charity, peace, 
    with them that call on the Lord out of a pure heart.  But foolish and 
    unlearned questions avoid, knowing that they do gender strifes.  And 
    the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, 
    apt to teach, patient, in meekness instructing those that oppose 
    themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the 
    acknowledging of the truth; and that they may recover themselves out of 
    the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.
    
    In His Love,
    
    Kent Cason
    

The following is placed here in response to Note 9.1683:
    
================================================================================
           <<< YUKON::DISK$ARCHIVE:[NOTES$LIBRARY]CHRISTIAN.NOTE;1 >>>
                          -< The CHRISTIAN Notesfile >-
================================================================================
Note 4.95                         Introductions                         95 of 96
DNEAST::MALCOLM_BRUC                                 19 lines  18-NOV-1994 09:31
                               -< Bruce Malcolm >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Hello,
    My name is Bruce Malcolm have just notices both Christian and Christian
    Perspective notes! I am thankful for these notes files because during
    the day you can read and get filled!!
    I am a Seventh-Day Adventist, my wife, daughter and I live in Randolph,
    Maine and go to the Farmingdale Church.
    Before I met Jesus as Lord, Saviour, and Redeemer I was a drug dealer
    Jesus has change my life completely. How can one say there is no God??
    I have been actively in the church for 15 years teaching Adult Sabbath
    School and lectures on Daniel and Revelation. I am now studing the
    history of the Great Reformation and the men who took part: Luther
    Hus, Wycliffe, Knox, Calvin and the Waldenses.
    I believe in the Bible as the Word of God and that the Bible is it's
    own interpreter. In Jesus as the Son Of God, and Saviour to anyone
    who call upon His name! We are saves by His grace through faith not by
    works!
    I am enjoying the discussions here in both Notes and hope to
    participate! My favorite vs. is Psalms 51:10 "Create in me a clean
    heart, O God; and renew a right Spirit whithin me". 

    Dave Clark
    
    Mostly read-only, I'm fascinated by some of the discussions going 
    on in here! YOu folks know a lot more than I do, so I'll just keep
    my mouth shut.
    
    I was raised Catholic, stopped going to church for a while, started
    again after I had kids, got heavily involved in being a church musician
    (playing bass when my wife played keys for an awesome choir). After a
    while I came to see that, as bureaucracies go, the Catholic church
    makes Digital look like a lean and well-run organization :-) So I'm
    kind of looking for a place to settle into.
    
    I know a few of you, particularly Jim Henderson, whom I remember from
    his former evil days of John Prine music and brussel sprouts :-)

hello all!

i am delighted to have found this conference and time permitting, i hope 
to participate. at first glance, this looks like the sort of place one 
could easily get hooked to...

a few biographical details to my person: i am now 35, i grew up in africa 
(ghana) where my dad worked for the U.N., with seventeen we moved to rome,
italy, where i completed school, then after a short spell in switzerland
where i met my wife and married, we moved on to england where i completed 
my computer science studies and worked. 

i am now divorced since five years, have since settled in switzerland.
my children, georgina (10) and sebastian (7) live in england with their 
mother, where i visit them once a month and we all, the parents and children,
spend one vacation a year together.

i joined DEC in 87 as principal software specialist, i left in 1990 to set 
up my own consulting company. after four years of building the business with
success, i left the running of it to my partners, to gain more time for 
individual pursuits whilst earning a living as contractor. since one year
i am thus with RTR engineering, involved in porting the product to OSF/1, 
Sun OS and Windows NT. 

besides work, i have recently completed a year of philosophy at the university 
of zurich, got involved in local politics, where i participated in the campaign
for the legalisation of drugs. this campaign is for the time being, completed,
having managed to collect enough signatures to get the politicians involved.

my focus has now turned towards endurance sports - i have this summer 
discovered triathlon and am now building up training for my first marathon
next year and for an ultra-triathlon in the following year.

by folks who know me, i have been given many names, "alpha-person" and 
"theoretician" must be amongst the front-runners, whilst i think of myself 
as melancholic. i am also told that i have an immense capacity for enjoying
life and the fruits of life, yes, that's true, but at the same time i am also 
very strict and disciplined with myself... my german, christian upbringing 
(reformed/evangelical) probably has something to do with this.

whilst i still consider myself a christian, by upbringing and by what i'd call
my christian ethics, i am a confirmed atheist and i won't force it on anyone to 
see me as a christian. i believe neither in god nor satan, nor demons nor angels
i believe the good and the bad is all within us and we must confront it all the
time. i believe in life and the uniqueness of life and in humanity, and that
the good will prevail. i believe that jesus, the man from nazareth, was human
and mortal and that this man was and is one great hope for humanity.

i hope to participate in this conference and to reach a better understanding 
of that man from nazareth. this being a purely personal and 'selfish' pursuit, 
i would appeal to more firmly believing christians not to take offence at my
comments, in case of doubt, to pass them off as not being too serious or simply
to ignore them. this is my approach to noting too, and i hope to benefit from 
us all and from this medium.

glad to join!


andreas.

    Andreas:
    
    Great to have you on board.  You will find this conference to have
    differing opinions at times...and you will also find most of the
    regular participants to be able to endure these differences.  We're all
    gluttons for punishment! :-) !!!!!
    
    -Jack

    Hi 
    	As a new hire I am just getting my feet wet with this system.  What
    I have read so far has been very interesting. I will respond as I feel
    there is a need.  I am always searching for the truth and hope to add
    to my knowelege of God's rightly divided word.
    
    	A little about my past.  I was rasied in the Lutheran church.  I
    have been exposed to a number of different beliefs over the past few
    years.  I am a born again christian wo enjoys studying God's Word and
    sharing it with who ever wants to listen.
    
    S.I.T. (perfect paryer)
    Tom

    Welcome aboard Tom and may God bless your new year!!
    
    -Jack

I've slipped in here a couple of times so I guess I oughta check in.

As far as what I do goes, I'm a network consultant in Charlotte with NIS.

As far as this conference goes, my interests lie in the discussions
themselves. I would have to say that I am more a student of Christ and
christians than a follower or a believer.

This is not to say that my endeavors are frivilous but I feel like I owe
it to other participants to state my perspective.

I think that some of the discussions are not only at the heart of what
religion and faith are all about but also at the heart of our own
existence.

TTom

    Hello and God bless each and every one of you!
    
    I have been looking for this conference for a while and I am really
    happy I finally found it. By a total fluke, of course, not being too
    computer literate and all.
     My Name is Joseph McClain, and I am writing from Seattle Washington. I
    am a Security contractor through Pinkerton security and am stationed at
    ZSO. 
      I have been saved in christ for five yeaars now. I accepted Christ
    while standing in the twilight of dusk, standing in the middle of a
    graveyard. Which accurately depicts the situation, given life in the
    midst of death.
      I have been affiliated with conservative Baptist and non-denominational
    churches during the past 5 years, and am now attending a Foursquare
    church here in north seattle. I am very pleased with the upbeat worship
    oriented church that I am at now at. I beleive that the Lord is molding
    me into the man he wants me to be, and this conference is one of the
    tools he is going to use to teach me and broaden my range of knowledge
    and spirituality.
    
      Thanks for being in my family,
    
    Joe McClain
    

        I have not been very active noting in here and I just realized how much
    I missed this conference, especially when it was a bit more active.  I
    miss a lot of the members who have left as well.
    
    My own spiritual journey has been quite incredible these last 3-4
    years.  It has been 3 years now that I have been taking my one course a
    semester at Andover Newton, and I am at the point that I am committing
    myself to preparing for the Unitarian Universalist ministry without
    exactly knowing how I will do that.  I hope to take at least three
    course in the Fall Semester, again not quite knowing how.
    
    Perhaps you all can pray that I will find a way!
    
    I have found that my style has been bouncing against those with beliefs
    radically different than mine as opposed to listening carefully to a
    wide range of beliefs.  I am going to try to alter that.  Perhaps you
    all can help me.
    
    Yesterday I presented a good bye personal statement at the UU
    Congregation in Andover.  My Fiancee and I have joined the First Parish
    UU church in Groton.   Joining the Groton church is in anticipation of our
    marriage and moving to Groton.  It is sort of neat committing ourselves
     to a community of faith as a part of our getting ready for marriage and
     for living together.
    
    I am hoping to become more active in here again.  

    I guess I am feeling a little like the prodgical daughter.
    
                                              Patricia

    I missed you Patricia!  What I'm really hoping is that you will apply
    to Dallas Theological Seminary and obtain a Phd. there!! :-)
    
    Rgds.,
    
    
    -Jack

        Some call it Cemetery ;-)

I invite and encourage our first-time participants to share a little about
themselves in this, the introduction topic.

It's not simply a matter of good ettiquette.  Making one's self known
demonstrates a willingness to invest in relationship -- a quality Jesus
exemplified.

Shalom,
Richard

    Hi, I'm Steve Leech and I work out of the Cincinnati office.  I don't
    belong to any given sect or denomination of Christianity, but rather
    consider myself denominationally-neutral.  I think "Christian" pretty
    well sums it.  My church is denominationally-neutral, as well.
    
    Most of you know me from other conferences, but I thought that I'd post
    something in here for the sake of courtesy (and the prod in .159
    reminded me that I wasn't being very courteous  8^) ). 
    
    My interests include taekwondo (I'll be testing for my black belt in
    two months), weight lifting, running, bowling, home theater electronics
    (my hobby, which my wallet is much smaller for) and politics.      
    
    
    -steve

      Well, I'm not sure what to say in this introduction. I have noted
      more in the Christian notes file, but have been making forays into
      the Christian-Perspectives notes file from time to time. I'm no
      where up-to-date in my reading in this file, and expect it will be
      some time before I am. In terms of my beliefs, I believe the Bible
      is the trustworthy vehicle for God's revelation to us. I accept that
      Jesus is the Messiah, that he died so that we could be forgiven, and
      is the first fruit of the ressurection. Other than that, I'll let my 
      notes speak for themselves.

      Leslie

ZZ    Note 3.73                         Introductions                       
ZZ    73 of 161
ZZ    CIMNET::MARTIN                                        9 lines 
ZZ    16-AUG-1991 17:17
ZZ                               -< Last Entry Misplaced >-
ZZ    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ZZ    Im sorry everybody, the last entry was misplaced.  I'm just now
ZZ    learning how to use this notesfile.  My name is Jack Martin.  My
ZZ    objective to this file is to be here for prayer and the needs of
ZZ    others that write in this file.  You might say I want to be a faucet for a
ZZ    lot of thirsty people.
    
ZZ            Regards ,
            
ZZ            Jack Martin
    
    I had to repost this because I find it humerous and I believe flipping
    through the old introductions gave me a sense of evaluating old intro's
    from where people are really at.  It's kind of like meeting your
    spouse.  On the first date it is heaven...and even the second, third...
    even the first year.  Then of course time moves on and you get to know
    the quirks of each other, and the annoying communication
    misunderstandings and the tit for tats and the habits that you learn to
    live with.  What really counts is no matter what you endure, you stick
    by each other and continue to learn.
    
    Now there are over 160 replies in this string and the majority have
    left either through attrition or a lack of endurance.  Looks like it is
    the core that really counts.      
     
    Reevaluating myself, I still believe it is my desire to be a vessel for
    God...or as so innocently put above, a faucet for thirsty people.  The
    faucet is inadequate, doesn't work all that well, may even need some
    rebuilding, yet the faucet wants to be there just the same.
    
    How about you?
    
    
    -Jack 
    

    By the way Richard, I found your "Major Sins" in one of your replies
    quite humerous.  
    
    -Jack

    By the way mods., Glen never introduced himself!

	Jack, you are right....I haven't. An oversight that will be corrected
now. 

	My name is Glen Silva, and I am an Engineer in the Hudson facility.
I've been with the company for 7� years now, and have gone from an Engineering
Tech 2, up to a Quality Engineer. 

	I found the Lord in Austin Texas back in 1980. Thanks to someone in
Houston who was drunk, and chasing us around town, the Lord did many things
that night to lead me to Him. And no one got hurt in the process. 

	I've been a member of this file since 1990 or 91. I guess if I had put
in an intro, I'd know. :-)  Richard Christie provided me with a pointer to this
conference back then. Something that I have always been grateful of. 




Glen

    Glen, we welcome you.  Feel comfortable to share of yourself with us!
    :-)

<-------groan..... :-)

Allow me to take this opportunity to invite you, the newer participants in
CHRISTIAN-PERSPECTIVE, to introduce yourselves.

Please, let us know something about yourself, whatever you're comfortable
in sharing.  So many times we get wrapped up in supporting our position
or opposing contrary ones that we forget there are real, live, flesh-and-
blood human beings at the keyboards.

Shalom,
Richard