Conference 7.286::golf

     Yeah. I've been using the Yonex ADX 200 since June, and although my
    iron game is crummy, my driving is generally great. This is a VERY
    forgiving club - you gotta make a dog ugly swing to hook it.
     Last Sat. I played with our Pro, and on a couple of real playable
    draws I hit he said "with persimmon, that's out of the ballpark
    (meaning "gone")."
     I've tried metal woods (Hogan & Taylor) and this is a light year
    better. They're expensive (I swapped for mine), but worth the dough. If
    you hit a 2 piece ball with this baby, you won't believe it !
     I can't believe I can hit this club well, yet be swinging so bad with
    my irons.
    
    --Jack

    How much would you pay for a Yonex Driver in the US? 
    
    I saw a Yonex 'wood' at my local range. I'm not sure if it was a
    driver, but it had the graphite shaft, etc. and the price was �200 
    which I guess at today's rate makes it a big $380-$400!!
    
    Phil. 

>    How much would you pay for a Yonex Driver in the US? 

	I think Nevada Bob's wants approx. $250 for one.  The worst part
	is that they don't even have a demo model.  The first time you
	hit one from there is after you bought it.  When I was on vacation
	I talked with someone who had hit one (someone elses).  He liked it.
	Anyone know where you can hit one?  I could always use a little
	length off the tee.

	My motto, "Better golf thru technology",
	Larry

    re: .1
    
    please explain "if you can hit a two piece ball with it..."
    
    please explain "...an ugly swing to hook it..."
    
    	am not quite sure what it is your trying to say about the club
    in these instances...
    
    thanks in advance

    re. -1
    
    	Nevada Bobs will allow you to return a club for a full refund
    if you take it out and don't like it.  The only problem is you only
    have about a week to decide if you like it or not and you have to
    be very careful not to mark up the club.  I bought a Mizuno MST
    driver there last week and told the guy I had a problem dropping
    $180.00 for a club I hadn't hit and he told me "if you don't like
    it return it and I'll give you your money back"  Well,  I didn't
    like it and returned it last night for a full refund, no questions
    asked!   While there I saw the ADX 200 and swung it in the net,
     a real sweet feeling club, really liked the feel but again, had
    a problem dropping $249.00 for one club.  Was given the same deal
    by the salesperson,  bring it back undamaged and you can have your
    money back.  I passed this time.  The only drawback is marking the
    club.  They may keep 10 or 20 of your dollars if they feel the club
    looks used,  a gamble you must be willing to take.
                              
    BTW,  this was the Nashua N.H store.
    
    Mike
    

    
    
    	The golfers Warehouse in Hartford Ct. will let you take out
    a demo club, while paying for it of course, and if you decide that
    you like it bring back the demo and they'll give you a brand new
    one.
    
    John

     The Yonex is hard to hook - harder than "normal" clubs _ perhaps
    because it has a 20 % bigger sweet spot and is perimeter weighted.
    Swings that normally produce a hook, don't with the  Yonex. However, a
    terrible swing that is hook prone, will still hook it.
     I think the graphite head reacts especially well to 2 piece balls -
    they jump off the clubface like a rocket.
     Cost on the Yonex is $200.00, so deal accordingly. Remember, I'm
    talking dealer cost... $250 (money back) is a good deal, to me at
    least.
 --Jack

    re. -1
    
    	Jack,  how does the club react to someon who has developed a
    fade in recent weeks?!!!  While looking at it last night the face
    looked slightly closed but it could have been my perception.  Also
    I believe the shaft is a couple inches longer than standard, any
    problems or modifications needed for this?
    
    The reason I ask is I have been playing a Yamaha X400 for the past
    4 years and it is on its way out and I am searching for a replacement
    for old faithful.  This club has been fantastic to me for 4 years
    now,  I love the feel of graphite and they seem very hard to come
    by nowadays.  The yonex felt really nice but the price has me doing
    flip flops on purchasing.
    
    	Thanks...Mike_who_is_on_a_quest_for_a_new_driver
    

    Heh Owen.. .0  Thanks for letting me take a swing with yours.  For the
    rest of you noters, I hit my Taylor Made a ton a few days ago while
    playing with Owen. On this sme hole I asked to try his.  I out drove
    myself by 40 yards and the straightest shot I've ever hit.
    
    I, also, am leary of forking out $250.00 for a single club but if I
    were sure I could that evertime, withouot doing something REALLY
    stupid, I would by one.
    
    Just my input from one swing.
    
    Stuart

     The shaft IS longer (45"), but the overall weight is the same as a
    standard 43" club (again, I'm talking average 43" clubs), so you can
    get more clubhead speed.
     People have told me it looks hooked, but I disregard this. It Might
    affect a Pro, but it Won't affect "humans." 
     Like all graphite type clubs, it responds better to a smoother swing,
    but because of the boron in the shaft, even a hitch-and-lunge guy like
    me can hit it just fine. Unlike other graphite, I don't think you'll
    fade this any more than you usually do. If you swing too hard with this
    beast, you tend to fade it.
     Our Pro is a "purist," but he loves the way normal people can hit
    this. I don't usually go out on a limb for equipment (unless it's an
    OLD Wilson SW), but this thing relly works ! As I said, I got mine for
    nothing by swapping, so get out that old persimmon, and DEAL !!
    
    --Jack

         I use the ADX 100 which is the same club as the 200
    but has a silver colored Carbon Graphite shaft instead of
    the Gold Boron Graphite shaft. I got it out of a used
    club barrel for $100 and am very pleased with the results.
    Jack is right about getting a fade if swinging to hard and
    my suspitions are that the clubhead doesn't square up if you
    swing it to hard. A nice smooth swing however produces
    awesome results. I have several friends who use Taylormade
    tour burners with great results but always get a longer drive
    when they try my club. I can't imagine how far this club would
    hit using the Gold shaft but I am thinking about a reshaft just
    because I love to hit'em out-a-sight !!!!
        I think that Gene Kelley mentioned that he can get a clone
    of the ADX and build a club for considerably less than retail!!
    Might be another way to get one of these new high-tech drivers
    without the huge expenditure.
    
    Mad Hacker

Re: -.1

>    awesome results. I have several friends who use Taylormade
>    tour burners with great results but always get a longer drive
>    when they try my club. 

     Does anyone know where the flex point is on the Yonex graphite shaft.
     I had a Taylor Made Burner with a graphite shaft that I had to get
     rid of because the flex point felt low on the shaft.  I replaced it
     with the same club with a Ti shaft with the flex point up near my hands
     it feels super!  Maybe this is an arguement for getting one of Gene's
     clones.  Gene to you take credit cards yet?

	Larry

     I'd say just hit the club, and if the "feel" and flight pattern of the
    ball are what you expect, buy it. You can talk yourself into anything
    based on what clubs are supposed to do from specs, but only results
    count. Unless you can "steal" one, don't buy one unless you hit it.
    Only results count, and I've built and modified a lot of clubs. I still
    need to hit 'em, and I'd say the same to a customer.
     There may be other composite shafts with the same kick point as the
    Yonex, and some may be better suited to certain people. However,
    they'll all "feel" a little different...
    
    --Jack

    I have a Yonex driver and LOVE IT!  It took a little while to get used
    to but I am getting some great results.  
    
    Linda

    jack and others who have used this driver...is this the one with the
    oversized head ...???
    
    guy at my club has a "clone..." that he claims is exactly like the
    adx 200 but the head on this club is l...a...r...g...e...I didn't hit
    it yet but am going to be trying it next week...
    
    

    Yes, this is the one with the large head.
    
    I've had mine about a week now and am beginning to get it under control.  
    It's like driving a car with a very powerfull engine.  My son used to
    drive about as far as I do on a regular basis.  I'm now about 30 yards
    farther than he on a regular basis.
    
    Regards,
    
    Owen

    played this weekend with a sales rep from Pal Joey golf and he had
    some interesting news.  Seems they are coming out with a Yonex clone
    that will be called the TD1000.  I saw a picture of the club and
    it is identical to the ADX head, comes with an Aldila HM40
    boron/graphite shaft in 44 and 45 inch lengths.  From what he said
    the HM40 is Aldilas top of the line shaft.  Price is going to be
    in the $120 - $130 range.  The club is due out mid October so it
    might be worth the wait to see how this club performs compared to
    the Yonex.
    He's going to set me up with a demo when he gets one so I'lllet
    you know how it is.
    	
    	Mike
    

    
    Mike,
    
    That is interesting, where/how did you team with a Pal Joey rep...?
    
    BTW, the HM40 isn't Aldila's top of the line shaft. They came out
    with a new shaft this year, the HM55 that has a price tag twice
    that of the HM40...!
    
    Regards
    Gene

    re: .17
    
    heard the same thing from the pro at my club...that PAL JOEY will
    be comming out with a driver equivlent (sp?) to the yonex adx 200
    in about a month...
    
    

    Gene,  Played at Pasaconaway this Sunday and got teamed up with
    the rep from PAl Joey and a rep from Cactus golf.  They both
    touted their respective companies but Pal Joey seemed to come out
    on top.  I didn't know they supplied heads for so many name brand
    clubs and that Pal Joey is just their own generic version.  Was
    really nice playing with these guys,  threw me a couple bones in
    the way of shirts and hats so it wasn't a total loss.
    	I guess this guy hadn't heard of the HM55 yet,  he was under
    the impression that the HM40 was top of the line.  It might be thatthe
    HM55 doesn't come in the 45 inch length???
    
    	Anyways,  I expect a few more companies to copy the ADX.  I
    saw one from Zett golf that is called the longsword,  45 inch
    shaft,metal head with a V soleplate...one of the ugliest clubs I
    have ever seen!!!
    
    	Mike

     Nothin's uglier than the Yonex, but after you hit it, it becomes a
    prom queen. It's kinda like standing at the bar on Saturday night,
    "drinkin' 'em pretty..." After awhile, it sure looks good. BTW, at the
    Mass. Senior Amateur, there were a load of Yonex's.
    
    --Jack

    
    RE: .20
    
    Mike,
    
    Sounds like an interesting time out there with two reps...!
    
    BTW, the HM55 and the HM40 shafts both come in the same length...
    
    Regards
    Gene

    re: .20
    
    	was that burkie from PAL JOEY....???
    

    re: demo's
    
    At Wayland Country Club they have a demo of every club they sell.
    you can either use it there, play your own cc with it or bring to
    driving range.  When I did this, I just gave my credit card to
    secure the return.  Also, I think their prices are reasonable.  And
    they have a policy - you can return any clubs (maybe just sets, not
    sure) you buy there for full refund (I think) towards purchase of
    new clubs you buy there.  You can call to see if they have the club
    (s) you're interested in.  Surprised I didn't see anything about this
    in here.
    
    

    Re:                     <<< Note 1066.17 by DECSVC::CARBONE >>>

    We had an outing last Friday to Chicopee and at their shop they had a
    Yonex driver clone on sale for under $100, I  didn't pay attention to
    the brand.
    
    Tavo
    
    P.S.  Chicopee is still the best buy in Mass.    Very nice course for
    $17.  And if you play during the week after 1:30  is  $7.  Can't beat
    that.
    
    

    
    Any of the clones that are offered for $100 or less will be made with
    the lower grade shafts, ones with higher torque ratings. They won't
    have the top of the line shafts in them. These higher torque rated
    shafts are hard enough to controll on regular clubs, never mind on
    a 45 incher....! Just something to think about for those of you that
    are looking at these clubs...
    
    Regards
    Gene

     I agree, Gene. You get what you pay for , at least when you're talking
    about "cutting edge" technology. Someday the cost will go down, but for
    now - "it's gonna cost ya..."
    
    --Jack

    
    Don't get me wrong...! I am not saying that you can't get a REAL
    QUALITY clone, I am just saying check what they are made with...!
    The only thing that is actaully cloned is the head, the shaft and
    grips are what you want to look at... With the shaft being left so
    long instead of being cut down to the standard 43 inches it makes
    it all the harder to make contact on the center of the club face
    consistantly. When you make contact out on the toe or on the heel
    of the club you cause the shaft to torque and if you don't have a
    shaft with a low torque rating then you are going to spray it...!
    If you buy a 45" driver either at a shop or custom made or whatever
    you will be much better off paying for the top quality shaft in
    the long run...!
    
    Regards and hit'em straight
    Gene

    After looking in many equipment catalogs it appears that the
    "high quality" graphite shafts only caost 25-30 dollars more
    than a regular quality shaft. Why then the usual 60-100 dollars
    more for a club with the "high-quality" shaft ?
    
    Mad Hacker

    
    MH,
    
    I guess that depends on just which clubs you are refering to...
    
    Also, with the new Aldila HM55 shaft, the gap in price range for
    the least expensive to most expensive graphite shaft is more in
    the range of $90 (just the shaft)...!
    
    Regards
    Gene

    Gene,
    
    I'm refering to most clubs made by the major manufacturers.
    In general the price difference between different shafts
    with the same heads is much greater than the difference
    in shaft prices. It almost looks like you are being charged
    for a reshaft of an existing club instead of just using
    different materials in the construction.
    I haven't seen the price for an HM55 yet so don't even
    know what one costs !!
    An example, ADX 100 in this area is $189 with carbon graphite
    shaft, ADX 200 with HM40 shaft (approx $46) costs $249. This
    is like being charged to reshaft an existing ADX 100 with the
    gold shaft. 
       I just think theat the major manufacturers are "shafting"
    the public.
    
    Mad Hacker 

    Pre-assembled clubs are, like any other manufactured goods, marked-up
    substantially by the time they get sold at retail.  So, what you are
    seeing is the marked-up price of the premium shaft.

    Also, there are other factors at work:  Lower priced clubs are more
    of a commodity item and are therefore more price-sensitive.
    Top-of-the-line equipment is less price sensitive and can be marked-up
    more than low-end equipment.  The vendor usually buys less quantity
    of the top-of-the-line stuff so he gets less of a discount on it.
    Also, the premium stuff tends to sit on the shelf longer thus incurring
    a cost to the vendor (he has to pay interest on the money used to
    buy the stuff at wholesale and he has to rent the floorspace to store
    and display it).

    These all translate into good reasons for buying clubs from a local
    clubmaker: there are less middlemen and, since your equipment gets
    built to order, he doesn't have the inventory expense.

      PL

     I think the Yonex ADX 200 has a unique shaft. It isn't an HM-40 or 55.
    It has more boron and less torque. We're paying to defray the R&D until
    they can produce it more economically. If you don't wanna pay, that's
    O.K. too.
    
    --Jack

    
    Jack,
    
    Do you have access to the specs on the shaft? I would be curious to
    hear what they are (the torque rating anyways)...
    
    Gene

     No, I just went by what a friend who owns a golf shop in NYC told me -
    based on input from mfg. and users.
    
    --jv

    I tried out a Yonex ADX100 yesterday and really liked it!  I'm
    seriously considering buying one, but have a couple of questions.  The
    club I hit was a men's driver.  The guy in the store suggested that I
    buy the men's rather than order a woman's because there was more flex
    in the woman's club, and he felt I had enough wrist snap in my swing
    that I was better off with the men's.  It felt long......but I still
    seemed to hit it pretty well.  He also had me try the Yonex 3 wood. 
    Said some women use it as a driver, but I didn't hit it nearly as well
    as the driver.  Does this make sense, or is he just telling me this
    because he has the men's drivers in stock???  
    
    I'm 5'6, and wear a men's small glove.
    

    
    RE: .36 
    
    The mens shaft will be stiffer than a ladies flex. Was the shaft
    in the club you tried a regular flex or a stiff flex? The mens
    driver is 1 inch longer than the ladies would be (you could always
    have it cut down). The main question is how far do you hit the
    ball with you current driver? Do you know how far you hit it with
    the mens Yonex or did you just hit it into a net? If you don't
    generate a lot of head speed then I wouldn't recommend the mens
    driver (the mens driver is longer as stated and also a heavier
    swing weight)...
    
    Regards
    Gene

	Hi Wimmer,

	I was told the same thing when I was trying out a set of irons.  They
	told me that women pro's use men's clubs because they swing hard.  I
	wasn't totally convinced, so I took out a men's demo set of Tommy Armour
	845's and a Square Two's women's irons and went to the driving
	range.  I hit a few balls with each of the irons, 3, 5, and 9.  
	With the men's irons, the ball was going to the left or straight, and
	with the ladies irons the ball was mostly to the right with a fade.  I
	thought it was the way I was swinging and switched back and forth
	from one iron to the other but got the same result.  The shaft stiffnes 
	definitely makes a difference!  But I don't understand why you couldn't
	hit the 3 wood, though...

	Eunhwa

    I don't know about the flex....I didn't realize there was a difference.
    Guy just told me he thought the woman's club might have too much flex
    for my swing.He did also say he wouldn't recommend the 200 because of
    the increased stiffness. He also said most golfers play with too stiff
    a shaft for their swings.  The place was Integrity (I think) Golf on
    125 in Plaistow.
    
    In terms of the 3 wood, I could hit it, but seemed to hit the driver
    much better off the tee than the 3.
    
    Diane
    

    I have an ADX 100 with a stiff-flex shaft. It is available in
    R or S flex. I thought that the ADX 200 was also available in 
    R or S, it just has a gold shaft. The shaft difference should 
    be in torque ratings, the gold shaft has lower torque.
    I like my ADX a lot but I even manage to miss-hit it. 8^) !!!
    
    Mad Hacker

    I've been following this topic with great interest and I'd like to 
    put in my experience with ADX200.  I'm just like everyone else in 
    this game who would do practically anything to add yards(or feet,
    inches, etc) to his/her drive. I own several powerbuilt persimmon
    drivers, Hogan series 56, Mizuno black turbo II and currently using a
    custom driver: Toski/Ryobi metal wood w/8.5 degree loft with NOVUS II
    graphite/boron shaft (Stiff, 44 in.) for about 6 months.  After reading
    about the YONEX driver I decided it was worth looking into.  I took the
    club to driving range and then to a round of golf.  The club felt good
    but I didn't see a noticeable increase in distance and to "ME" it wasn't
    worth $250 so I returned the club to the store.
    
    When I told this to my pro, he suggested that I try another club that
    he recommends - Daiwa Exceller G3 w/wide-body head & TR diamond graphite
    shaft (45 in. Stiff). He's going to order this for me to try. 
    
    BTW The retail for this club is $220 but he'll sell it to me for $160.
    If I can get more distance for this price it's worth it. I'll let you
    fellow golfers know how this club fares.
    
    P.S. It's nice to know there are many die-hard golfers like myself is
    out there...

    Does anybody know the loft of the ADX200?  It looked like 8 to 9
    degrees when I used it.

    
    I just got a little more info on the Yonex ADX ___
    
    The shaft in the 200 has less torque and a higher flex point. Other
    than that they are the same club. Available in 9 or 11 degree loft
    drivers, D1 swingweight (the 7 wood is a D5 swingweight). I couldn't
    get any specifics on the torque ratings on the two shafts...
    
    Regards
    Gene

    I have been using the ADX 100 for several months now and for
    me, the greatest thing has been an increase in accuracy. I
    don't hit the ball any farther but it tends to stay in the
    fairway more. I believe this is due to the size of the head.
    Since it is so much larger you can miss the sweet spot and still
    get a pretty solid hit.
    
    Mad Hacker

    Re. Yonex Clones
    
    Hey Gene,
    
    I saw a aerodynamic graphite oversized head in "Golfing World"(?)
    xmas catalog. Is this the Yonex ADX 100/200 clone head you spoke of?
    If so, what shaft would you recommend I marry with it? The same catalog
    has a small selection of Adila and house brand gold-boron shafts. 
    
    Also, is there anything I should watch out for in assembling? 
    
    Thanks in advance
    
    JJ

    
    JJ,
    
    	I am not familiar with the catalog you mention...
    
    	If you want a good quality club then go with a good quality shaft,
    	one with a low torque rating (Aldila HM40, True Temper Black Gold,
    	etc...)...
    
    	If you have worked with graphite shafts before, then there is
    	nothing unique...
    
        Regards
    	Gene

    Gene,
      I have been thinking about reshaftting my ADX 100 with an HM40
    low flex shaft. I use stiff flex in a steel shaft and was wondering
    about shaft flex in graphite. Do the flex ratings compare with
    steel ? I have heard that you should use a different flex when
    switching to graphite. Any truth to this rumor ?
    
    Mad Hacker 

    
    MH,
    
    In the early days of graphite this was true, but no longer...!
    
    Regards
    Gene

    I mentioned in .41 that I was going to try Daiwa Exceller G3
    w/wide-body head & TR diamond shaft. Well I just tried it yesterday.
    (BTW it was nice down here...high 70's) I liked it! it wasn't big as
    YONEX but the face was fairly large and it felt good. They go for $220
    retail but I'm getting one for $160 (I peeked into my pro's order book and
    it's costing him $130 so I'm getting a pretty good discount). I think
    this is a good/better alternative for YONEX and for those of you who
    like myself just don't want to spend $250+ for a driver you should give
    this club a try.
    
    Just thought you might like to know...
    
    BTW, they'll be shipping jan. 1 but the demos are out there.

    
    	If you are looking to save money and still get a great club/product
    	then custom made clones, made by reputable club makers, is the best
    	way to go... If you haven't tried any of these give it a shot, most
    	will have demo clubs for you to try, some allow you to bring the
    	club back if you aren't satisfied... Gimme Golf does both (see note
    	367.27)...
    

    Re: .50
    
    Gene, I agree with you. Matter of fact I currently use a custom driver
    (Ryobi-Toski Metal head with NOVUS II boron/graphite shaft: 44 in. stiff) 
    and happy with it and it only cost me $100! 
    
    The only reason I mentioned Daiwa was because some people on this notes
    may not have time/patience to look for reputable club makers or these
    makers are not in there area. I used it and I liked alot and I thought
    it might benefit others. 
    
    BTW, I wish I had a chance to meet you. From other noters you sound
    like a great guy to play with. I also think you did a heck of a job
    moderating this notes.  Best of luck.
    
    P.S. I'm still going to buy the driver...it'll be another driver in my
    collection of 15+ drivers...

    Maybe I'm getting on the band wagon too late, but apparently the high
    price for one driver and the recession is not hampering the ADX200
    sales.  The best price locally (3M area) is $285!
    
    Has anyone ordered one mail order?  Found a place on the West Coast
    that will sell the 200 for $249, shipping included.  The alternative is
    to go with one of the clones.  Any testimonials lately?  I am having
    a hard time justifyig the cost, since I paid under $400 for my whole
    set of PING irons a few years back!

    I ran into a guy last Sunday morning at Ironwood (Woburn) who had a
    clone he bought for $150 or so, and loved it.  Don't remember the
    make, unfortunately.  Something 2000.
    
    John

    re .52
    
     What is the name of the place on the West Coast?
     The best I've seen locally is $269 at Golf Day in Chelsea
    
    -Steve.

    The mail order house is TelePro, 1-800-333-9903.  They quoted me 
    $244 plus $4 shipping.  Good luck!

    re:.52
    My wife gave me an ADX 200 for my birthday(24  January).  Went to the 
    range for a couple hours the following Saturday and bounced the head
    into the ball most of the time.  Hit a couple over the fence at the end
    of the range (says 280 yds.).  Played the next week and hit the ball
    very straight - no long shots - but no slices.  Played next week and 
    miss hit at number one - 200 yds center of fairway.  Number two was a
    pop-up ( I thought) - center fairway past the fairway bunkers.  Number 
    three is a 520yd 5 par which always finds me hitting a 7-8 iron to the
    green - past the pin with my four wood putting for eagle. No. 4 found
    me hitting a half wedge to the 340yd par four green.  Next shot was a
    miss hit at about 215 yards, right center fairway.  On the other two
    four pars on the front I was at least 60 yds beyond my normal distance.
    The back side was better.  The next week found me repeating the same
    scenario.  Did not play last week end due to Digital pressures.  Was to
    play with Customer today and it is RAINING IN SO. CALIF!!!!!
    
    Bottom line - ADX 200 is fantastic!  I am hitting the ball most of the
    time like I did 20 years ago and 50 lbs lighter! I love my wife.
    
    Big Mac

    To Big Mac
    
    If it doesn't rain a whole lot more we are going to have astro turf golf
    courses.  The day did not stop me from playing 18 in San Clemente. 
    Monster day on a course with a normal slope rating of 146.  With the tees
    back and the pins 6 to 8 inches from the edges of the greens and the
    rain, a good round was a net 91(102-11) which got me $50.  Even when it
    rains in Southern California, you can still tee it up.
    
So Cal Dandy

    So Cal Dandy,
    
    Since the customer would not play - I had no reason not to be at his
    site.  I know about the need for rain.  Saw that Frisco is eliminating
    all watering of golf courses, except for greens.  Sounds like a good
    round.
    
    Big Mac

    Hi folks,
    
    I thought the Yonex note would be good for this question. I use a Yonex
    ADX clone that I bought through Golfworks. It has the long graphite shaft,
    oversize composite head with "speed bumps", etc. Before I get to the
    question, I'll give the background...
    
    I'm in the second year of my return to the sport of golf, after a ten
    year layoff. Last year, I was consistently lousy with almost every club
    in my bag, so at least I didn't feel too bad. I sprayed balls pretty
    much all over the place, but my tee shots with my driver were OK at
    least 50% of the time, and my putting was pretty good.
    
    I took some lessons with a pro last year and spent a lot of time at the
    range. During the lessons and at the range I did pretty well, but out
    on the course I would do awful (above 100). I had worked on my grip,
    stance, turn, all of that. Finally, I self diagnosed the problem as
    "length of shaft relative to lie". In other words, I wasn't "choking
    up" and "letting out" under the right circumstances for the lie.
    
    With this in mind, my iron play this year has improved quite a bit. I
    also switched from my original driver to the Yonex clone hoping to get
    a little more distance. Things started out OK - I played golf in Palm
    Springs in February and hit some huge drives - but they got
    progressively worse with the Yonex clone (whereas everything else has
    been steadily improving). In a nutshell, I'm still hitting huge drives.
    Unfortunately, they are also slicing like a son-of-a-gun. I've tried
    turning the right hand over until I can see the back of it when I address
    the ball. I've moved the ball forward, backward, in and out in my stance,
    all to no avail. About the *only* thing that seems to help is when I
    choke up on the shaft. At this point, I'm practically at the end of the
    grip, and although things have improved slightly, the shot still arcs
    right. The funny part is, I thought the long shaft was supposed to
    *help*. Right now, I'm holding it about as long as a putter shaft!
    
    I suppose I could go back to my old driver, but I'd really like to
    unlock the secret of the Yonex after hearing all these testimonials
    about how great and wonderful it is to hit those long, straight drives.
    
    Brian

    re: .59
    
    just a comment on the "longer shaft".....various research has been done
    that always comes to the following conclusion:
    
    	95% of amatuer golfers swing their 3 wood better than their drivers
    because the length of the 3 wood is just right for "maximum" control...
    
    	even Nicklaus has admitted this over the years in various articles
    and has used a driver that is 42.5 inches in length for years because
    it offers better control....
    
    	the manufactures still make drivers the standard 43 inches, and
    some of the newer "hi-tech" ones are at 44 and 45 inches but what they
    fail to mention is that it is even harder to control than the 43 inch
    driver....
    
    	if it works for you great but if not experiment with a "ladies"
    driver which is 42.5 - 42 inches usually...you might find you hit
    it very well...and for amatuers the difference in distance between
    a 3 wood and driver is not that great.....
    
    

    I picked up a YONEX ADX200 this season and have to admit that it has
    taken me 2 months to adjust.  I am a 9 handicap and loose all my shots
    to the left with the exception of my new YONEX.  I found that I was at
    best hitting it straight but mostly fading it.  A real bad swing would
    slice accross two fairways!  Finally, after trying everyting, I
    determined that with the extra length of the shaft, I was not squaring
    up the face of the club at impact.  What seemed to do the trick was
    holding my hands even or a little behind the ball at address.  By
    experimenting with this adjustment I can pretty much control the ball.
    ie. hands even with the ball, straight shot, hands behind the ball, a
    hook.
    
    I have to admit, being a fairly short hitter, the YONEX has added a new
    demention to my game.  The extra yardage has reduced my handicap from
    10 to 9 so far this season.  A few more 78's and I'll be an 8.
    
    Just a parting note.  Played with a friend who also bought a clone. 
    During the round he was hitting it fairly well, he has always hit a
    long ball.  On 18 he tried mine and hit it 20 yards further than his
    best all afternoon!

    re .60:  Sam Snead in his book,  "Sam Snead on Golf" suggested that the
    week end golfer use a 2 1/2 wood for driving - shorter than the driver,
    with more loft, but not quite the 3 wood.  Sounds correct, but when I
    see the way I hit my Yonnex...  I have found the longer club WORKS for
    me!
    
    Big Mac