Conference 7.286::golf

    
    Hi Mike,
    
    	Welcome to the conference. I got hooked on making/repairing
    	clubs last fall when a friend of mine (KO) mentioned that
    	he did regripping and from there I ordered a catalogue, etc.
    	
    	"D7" swinweight! that is one heck of a club! How did you
    	decide to make it that swingweight?
    
    	I have dealt with the following companies:
    
    		Golfworks
    		Golfsmith
    		Dynacraft
    		Golf Supplies International
		
    	All of these companies offer slightly different products, the
    	one that I feel has the best offerings for iron heads is Golf
    	Supplies International...
    
    	Other than being able to go to a club repair school or work
    	for somebody that has been in the business for a while, the
    	best way to learn is to order one of the repair/club making
    	books offered by one of the companies listed above (I don't
    	think Golf Supplies International offers one, but the others
    	do).
    
    	I really enjoy making and repairing clubs and have learnt a
    	lot about various aspects of club making and the whys and
    	wherefors for various types of clubs. I am still learning and have a
    	lot more to learn.

    	Enjoy
    	Gene

      Hi Gene -- thanks fort the warm welcome, and for the info you've
      sent me offline!  Re your question:
      
      "D7" swinweight! that is one heck of a club! How did you
      decide to make it that swingweight?

      The boron-graphite shaft, as you know, is quite light ... almost an
      ounce lighter than my Yamaha driver.  I got a regular shaft (stiff
      was backordered ... and winter's coming!) so felt I wanted a fair
      amount of weight behind the head.  (The regular shaft is very whippy,
      so I thought the extra weight would offset the whippiness???)  Anyhow,
      my feeble mind accepted the concept ... and, all I know, is it works.
      I'm sure someone who knows better could convince me my logic is dumb!
      A few other ball crushers have tried it, and they liked the extra
      weight, too.

      The only side effect I've noticed thus far, with the driver, is that
      I'm now hitting it left-to-right which I suspect has something to do
      with the fact that the face has a 1 degree openess to it and the extra
      weight.  (I've been a right-to-lefter most of my life ... and won't miss
      hitting that occasional snapper!)

      Last night, I made the 5 wood (same materials) but with a lighter
      swing weight.  Can hardly weight (pun intended) to hit it!

      As you know, I have a question about installing leather grips.  If
      anyone out there has done it would like some tips.  I assume you use the
      2 sided tape under the sleeve ... but should I also use it over the
      sleeve before putting on the leather?

      Mike

    .1
    
    Gene, could you post the address/telephone nyumbers of those companies.
    I'd like to get their catalog.
    
    Thanks
    Chuck

    
      A few years ago, the club pro was experimenting with club making,
    and I tried a driver he had made for a long hitting contest.  It
    was longer than his standard driver, D12 (!) swingweight, stiff
    shaft.  What a war club!  I hit a few balls with it.  I normally
    hit 235 - 255 (or close in there somewhere), but I was reaching
    280 with this club.  BUT, I could never play with a swingweight
    like that, the back nine would be a problem due to fatigue from
    swinging clubs that heavy.  It does make a big difference.  Also
    I had to play the ball up more (towards left foot) to get it square
    when the club made contact.  There is less head speed but more mass
    in contact with the ball and more compression of the ball.

    
    Hi Mike,
    
    	Nice to welcome another fellow clubmaker to the conference.
    I've been dabling with this myself for about 3 or 4 years but it's
    only the last year and a half that I've done work for other people.
    I made my own driver (Golfworks persimmon 12� loft square face D2)
    Going to sell it this winter because although it's easy to hit,
    I hit it too high.  If you come across any low ball hitters, let
    them know about this 'great deal'.
    I just finished a set of the Ping-alikes from Golf Supplies Int
    and the Metal woods from Golfworks.  I really like the Golfworks
    metal.  Probably that will be my new set also like the irons
    (made the 2 iron) and plan to finish the set this winter.
    
    The worst part of making clubs for me is cutting the shafts.  I've
    destroyed 2 pipe cutter wheels, 2 hack saw blades.  Just bought
    the shaft cutoff wheel from the "Works" and it works just great.
    Noisy as all hell but it makes a good cut.
    
    Leather grips are not very hard to install at all.  The underlisting
    is put on just like a regular rubber grip.  Then double sided tape
    is applied OVER the underlisting.  Make sure that the tape is smooth
    because you can feel it under the leather if it's not right.  Then
    starting at the end-cap, wrap the leather (overlapping at the edges
    of the wrap.  you'll know by looking at the underside of the wrap)
    DOWN the shaft until you get to the bottom of the underlisting.
    Then wrap a piece of tape over the grip to hold it in place.  Use
    a razor knife to cut off the wrap and the underlisting making sure
    to leave the tape to hold the grip.  (I usually cut the tape in
    half.)  Then apply a small amount of 5 min epoxy to the grip collar,
    slip it up over the tape, remove the tape and let the epoxy dry.
    Also it is usually a good idea to put 2 collars on in case one tears.
    It would be a real pain to have to pull off a grip because of a
    broken grip collar.
    
    					KO

     KO - Many thanks for the info on the leather grips!  You confirmed what
     I had guessed about the 2 sided tape ... but the tips you provided on
     2 collars and epoxying them, and how to complete the taping definitely
     will save me some headaches.

     I've done a fair amount of plumbing work, so have a very good pipe
     cutting tool ... think it's the same as one offered in Maltby.  Still,
     cutting metal shafts is tedious.
     

     Glad to see someone else likes the Golfworks metal wood heads.  I'm also
     strongly considering making a set of irons.  Made a 5 iron ... and really
     like the head shape and the feel.  Should be a nice winter project ... but
     then I'll have to make a golf trip down south!

     Maybe sometime you can give some hints on how you "machine" ferrules?
     I've been using a file/steel wool to blend them into the shaft & hosel.
     I realize I can buy a machine for this ... but is there an easier way to 
     do it manually ... or is there something I can use with my grinding
     machine?

     re the swingweight in the previous note:  If someone told me I'd even
     consider (at age 44) be swinging a D7, other than on the range, I'd tell
     them to take a hike.  However, the lightness of the shaft doesn't leave
     you with the feeling you're swinging a log (esp on the back 9).  

    This is a topic I have been wondering about for some time.  I've
    been reluctant to get into club making as I have more hobbies than
    I can keep up with at present.  Recently though, I have become very
    interested in club repair.
    
    It was during the back nine last friday when I went to my 5 iron
    and noticed the shaft didn't look straight.  Closer inspection revealed
    that it wasn't.  The shaft had a dull crease across the leading
    "edge",for lack of a better term, and had bend of about 3 degrees
    at best guess.  I was able to work most of the crease out of it
    with a bench vise, but it still has a slight bend and I'm not at
    all comfortable with the idea of using the club.
    
    I would like to replace the shaft myself, if possible.  These clubs
    weren't terribly expensive as clubs go and budjet constraints forbid
    getting a nice new set of tour models, but I can't see putting too
    much money into fixing them up.  All the clubs are ready for new
    grips and on some of them, especially the pitching wedge, the face
    is getting worn.  Lack of a sand iron has taken its toll on that
    one.  
    
    The clubs themselves are cast stainless steel, perimeter weighted,
    slightly offset.  Can they be freshened up?  I know I should be
    able to do the grips, but what about the rest?
    
    Any suggestions?  I'm not about to stop playing.
    -Alan-
    
    

    Welcome fellow clubkakers. I've been into clubmaking and repair
    for about 12+ years. With the recent abundance of clubhead suppliers,
    I have been active in the custom club fitting area for 2+ years.
    I have just completed my 51st set. Interestingly enough I have shipped
    clubs all over the country without advertising. I had the good fortune
    of being the nephew of a golf pro and even spent some time in the
    business as an assistant professional. ( I gave it up when I realized
    you can't make any money as an ass't ). My club making apprenticeship
    was spent learning from some knowledgable people.
    I've got my shop in my basement and have a country club outside
    my front door where I use the range quite often.
    I have also learned that epoxying a shaft to a head is not clubmaking.
    There are some fitting techniques that can change the characteristics
    of a club drastically.
    
    Ref. .7
    Your shaft can be removed rather easily by heating it first. If
    it is pinned you must drill out the pin first. You will find the
    pin through the hosel. Once removed a shaft can be reepoxied and
    regripped. This is one of the more difficult tasks to take on for
    the beginner but it can be done.
    
    Well maybe one of these days I will make my last notes file entry
    by telling all of you I have given up DEC to start my own business but
    don't look for that note in the near future. Its relates to much
    to being an assistant.
    
    Don't drink and drive...  Don't even putt
    Ken

    RE: .7
    
    In addition to what Ken said in .8 about the shaft.  The face of
    the club can be "touched up".  If the grooves are completely shot
    you can use a coal chisel to regroove.  If they are not too bad
    you can get a carbide tipped "cleaning" tool to "freshen" them up.
    I did that last year to several clubs with much success.  This tool
    can be found in the Golfworks or the Golfsmith cats.  If you use
    be careful as it is sharp and could damage the face.  IF you press
    too hard it will leave a sharp edge on the groove which will tend
    to scar a golf ball.
    
    The way I learned to do these things was to buy old clubs at flea
    markets, garage sales etc and have at it until I felt I could work
    saftely on my own clubs.
    
    RE: .8
    
    Ken you're right about putting a little epoxy on a shaft is not
    really clubmaking.  Understanding how a players swing, experience
    and equipment interact is the important part.  Repair on the other
    hand requires a whole new dimension in imagination.  Boy do I have
    some war stories. :-)
    
    
    						KO

    KO you brought up a good point about buying clubs at flea markets.
    This is an ideal way to get in the business. You can find woods
    that have been trashed and experiment with different finishing methods
    and colors. If it turns out lousy, you have not ruined anything
    of great value or spoiled a guys favorite club. Clubs are usually
    $2 - $5 each. Pieces of shaft material are valuable if you need
    to lengthen a club or repair a shaft broken off in the grip.
    
    Good tip.
    Ken

    I have a set (1,3,5) of taylor made 'tour burner' metal woods and
    strongly suspect that I could improve my game by going to stiffer
    shafts (I have Dynamic Gold R3000 now) and increase the swingweight
    to be more in line with my irons, which I hit pretty well.
    
    .8 says you can remove a shaft by heating it ! I am a little reluctant
    to take a flame to my clubheads so - does strong heating just above
    the hosel work ? If not will dunking the whole head in boiling water
    do the trick ? All serious suggestions appreciated.
    
    On the same track - is it possible to add a little weight to the
    clubhead other than by adding lead to the rear edge ? Not pretty
    and I imagine difficult to get it to stay there ?
    
    KEEP ADDING NOTES GUYS - makes the long days more bearable. Just
    go lightly on the joys of winter golf - here in Switzerland the
    only winter golf we get is on TV
     

     
    	RE: .11
    
    	You can also get the shaft out sometimes by heating the tip
    	of a long rod that will fit down the inside of the shaft. This
    	will loosen the epoxy bond and you can pull the head off.
    
    	Unless the head has a weight port, which the Taylor Mades do
    	not, then the only way to add weight, other than lead tape as
    	you mentioned, is to add weight down the shaft...
    	

    	Gene

    re: .8 & .9
    
    Thanks for the advice.  I've decided, based on your replies and
    other input, not to experiment with clubs I intend to use for a
    while longer.  I also learned that the repairs won't cost as much
    as I had expected.  It seems well worth it to have someone with
    experience do the work.
    
    -Alan-

    
    I have been repairing/assemblying clubs for several years now as
    a hobby. I am considering beginning a profit making venture.
    
    re. 7
    	I have had success removing graphite heads and shafts, without
    damaging them, by wrapping them in plastic bags and boiling them
    for about 15 minutes. It has been my experience that Taylor Made
    adjusts swing weights by inserting brass plugs in the bottom of
    their shafts, so the weight is already in the heel. I have been
    sucessful in drilling/tapping the bottom of their heads and adding
    weight behind the sweet spot.
    
    BTW: the amount of heat applied to the head to loosen the epoxy
    can be controlled, with practice, so as to not disfigure or discolor
    the finish.
    
    					Fred Deady

    While I was at the Digital Seniors Classic this summer, I spent about
    an hour watching the clubmaker near the practice area.  I watched him
    remove the head of a metal wood from a graphite shaft.  His desire to
    save the shaft (his assistant wanted it, I don't think he would have
    put it on a pro's club) was foiled because the clubhead was pinned.
    He had a few unprintable words to say about people who pin a club with
    a graphite shaft.  But that's not the issue here...the technique he
    used once he drilled out the pin is:  He 'brushed' the hosel of the
    club with a propane torch.  He kept the torch about 6" away from the
    hosel, kept the torch moving and turned the club while he was doing it.
    He only ran the torch for 10-15 seconds and I'd guess that the torch was
    aimed in the direction of the club for less than half of that time.
    The action looked a lot like spray painting.

    I've changed grips on my own and a few other clubs.  Being a tinkerer
    by nature, I'm looking forward to learning and doing more with golf clubs.
    My father gave me a set of used woods (nothing special); the 1 and 5 woods
    didn't have any whipping on them!  I epoxied the cracks in the hosels,
    whipped the clubs and have been using them all summer.

    I found a 7 iron with the bottom half of the shaft on it in a barrel near
    one of the tees at Green Meadow in Hudson, NH.  I'm going to order a shaft
    for it and try my hand at re-shafting.  I want to order from Golfworks,
    has anyone found shafting epoxy in their catalogue?  What page.  Is there
    any magic to shafting epoxy of can I buy something over the counter to
    do the job.

    Good topic...keep those cards and letters coming.

    PL

>    for it and try my hand at re-shafting.  I want to order from Golfworks,
>    has anyone found shafting epoxy in their catalogue?  What page.  Is there
>    any magic to shafting epoxy of can I buy something over the counter to
 


     The epoxy I've been using is on the bottom left on page 3-19 in the
     golfworks catalog.  There are 2 cans, mixed in a 3:2 ratio.  

     mike

    Any of you clubmakers out there know if it is possible to remove a
    Kevlar head from a titanium shaft?
    
    Thanks,
    Bob