Conference 7.286::golf

    
    Hit the ball first (most of us hit it a lillte heavy), use a balata
    covered ball and practice, practice, practice!!  It also helps to
    have soft greens so bribing the greens keeper to use lots of water
    on the greens is to your advantage.
    
    As long as you make par, does it matter that much?

    	Larry, a fairly easy question to answer.  But it's not as easy
    to do, as it sounds.  To put spin on the ball, backspin that is,
    you simply have to hit down on the ball.  That means you hit the
    ball with the clubface, before the clubface hits the turf.  You
    also should strike the ball with a descending swing, as opposed
    to a sweeping swing.  Easy, right????
    	Wrong.  There are a lot of variables that can reduce the amount
    of spin put on the ball.  For instance.  If the grass is wet, the
    ball will tend to slide up and off the clubface, instead of spining
    off it.  Also, grass on the clubface, or between the clubface and
    ball, like in the rough, were the ball sits down in the grass, tends
    to also slide the ball off the clubface.
    	Another important factor, is the ball itself.  Solid balls,
    usually covered with Surlin, don't spin as much or as fast as wound
    balls which are usually covered with Balata.  Having a thinner cover,
    and rubber winding, allows the Balata ball to go out of shape and
    acquire more spin than a Surlin ball.  But also, it will cut or
    slice the cover much more easily, for a golfer who doesn't hit the
    ball in the sweet spot that often.  This is not to say you can't
    put spin on a Surlin ball, just not as much.  Enough about the ball.
    	Now finally, the club.  Today they make clubs with what they
    call, "Box shaped grooves".  It puts more spin on the ball, than
    the traditional "V shaped grooves".  This little diagram should
    show you the difference.  
    
        V shaped grooves                   Box shaped groves

        ____  ___  ___                     ____   ___   ___
            \/   \/                            |_|   |_|

    The box shaped grooves grab the ball better, and help to put more
    spin on the ball.
    
    	Now one thing you should know very well, before attempting to
    land the ball very close to your target, is how far you hit each
    of your clubs.  You should know within 5 yards either way, exactly
    how far you can hit each club on an average shot.  Otherwise, you'll
    find yourself over shooting greens quite often.
    	I hope this helps, without complicating the matter. 
    
                                                         Beak

    Beak,
    
      Thanks I will try it.. I recently read that the box grooves are
    or may be deemed illegal... I assume I will need lots of practice
    to hit down on the ball without hitting fat.
                             
      By the way did you see Ballesteros blow the Westchester yesterday.
    
      After he make birdies on 17 and 18 to catch J C Snead and force
    a playoff he hooks his drive into the woods, takes two shots to
    get back to the fairway, hits his fourth over the green and chips
    on to make at least 6 and probably 7.  Snead just makes his 4 and
    walks off with $108,000.00 !!! Tough break for Seve after making
    such a gallant charge at the end of the final round.
    
    
    
       Thanks again
    
       Hit em long and strait

    
    
    This reminds me of a funny story I heard once. A high handicapper
    was asking a PRO how to make the ball backup on the greens, at
    which point the PRO asked the golfer how far he hits his 5 iron.
    After hearing the hacker reply 150 yards his reply was "WHY DO YOU
    WANT THE BALL TO BACK UP".
    
    						Fred Deady

    The most spectacular example of backspin I ever saw (live, as opposed
    to TV) was a shot Gary Player hit during an exhibition match with
    Jack Nicklaus back in the early 60's (many years before PING or
    anyone else had started mass manufacturing box-shaped grooves):
    it was probably a 7-iron, which put the ball a good 20 to 25 feet
    beyond the stick. When the ball finally stopped spinning, it was
    10 feet IN FRONT of the flag!
    
    I surely understand the principle of hitting the ball first, with
    a descending blow, but it's real hard to practise that on the astro
    turf mats at the driving range (and my lawn looks scabby enough
    as it is). As the man said, who cares, as long as you're on or close
    to the green?
    
    Frank
    

    There is one two piece ball that will REALLY spin.  It is the Spaulding
    Tour Edition.  The SHARK uses it on the tour.  You may give up a       
    little on distance with this ball, especially when you make a mis-hit.
     However, it is a tough ball and generally plays quite nicely.
    
    Closs
    

    re: .4
    
    	yes...but you don't score anything for hitting a 8 or 7 iron
    150 yards so why not hit the 5 iron and keep it straight for a 
    change.....most long hitters I've observed are wild as well as long
    and the name of the game is to score well so hit your 7&8 irons
    from 150-170 yards out I'll still use a 5 iron any day from that
    distance as long as it will get me there every time without having
    to come out of my spikes...!!!
    

    re. 6 - Good grief! Greg Norman's been using a ball that costs
    him distance? Maybe he could have reached that 609-yarder in 2 if
    he'd been using a different ball?? (When my wife heard that he'd
    teed the ball up for his second shot, she was astounded: "I thought
    you weren't allowed to do that!" The TV guy hadn't mentioned that
    he'd done it during a practice round. I wonder how many of our fellow
    hackers have been teeing it up on the fairways since then?)
    
    	Frank
    

    
    re. 0 - Hitting down on the ball is great when your a full swing
    away from the green, but if your in close you'll have to open
    the face of the club and try to hit the ball underneath.  It won't
    back up but it'll stop a lot faster.  Of course the usual disclaimer:
    don't try until you've practiced -- mucho (or its scull city).
    
    				Dave H.

    
    	Quite a few of you guys seem to be hung up on the distance factor.
    Take it from a long hitter, it makes little or no difference on
    the distance, as long as *you know* your distances with each club,
    and can hit it accurately.  Example, last week on a par 4 after
    a fairly bad drive for me, and an average drive for my opponent,
    I watched him hit a 5 wood from about 165 to 170 yards away, and
    roll it just off the back of th green onto the fringe.  He couldn't
    beleive it went that far and started to complain, because he had
    a tough downhill putt for birdie.  I was about 2 yards in front
    of him, and decided to hit a 7 iron.  I didn't have to come out
    of my shoes, just a nice firm swing.  Well I flew the green by 10
    yards, and ended up 15 yards past the green with an almost impossible
    chip to a green sloping steeply away from me.  Now you tell me which
    shot you would rather have.  His 5 wood, or my 7 iron?  I knwo which
    one I'd rather have.
    	But some people just hit the ball farther than others.  Not
    by coming out of their shoes, as someone else stated, but because
    they have a longer swing, or more clubhead speed thru the ball,
    or use their entire body thru the swing, or are simply stronger,
    or weigh more, or hit the ball more in the sweet spot, or this or
    that.......  You don't have to come out of your shoes to hit a long
    ball.  I've read at least 2 dozen articles in golf magazines, on
    how to get more distance, and not one of them said to swing harder!!!
    	The original question asked about spin, not distance.  And even
    if you only hit a 5 iron 150 yards, it's nice to be able to spin
    the ball when necessary.  Like when theres a huge trap or water
    in front of the hole, but you don't have much green to work with.
    It's to any golfers advantage to be able to play this type of a
    shot, but it is something that should wait until you become consistant
    with your swing and are scoring at least in the 90's.  The last
    statement is only my opinion.
    
                                                 Beak

    I agree with Mr Wellspeak. Drive for show, putt for dough. Try being
    a long driver at Marlboro Country Club. The course is very short
    but it is also extremely tight. I hit a driver on about 4 or 5 holes.
    It is a lot safer hitting a 4 wood or a 1 iron and then hitting
    a short iron after that (7-8-9 or Wedge). it's not necessary to
    hit a driver-wedge on every hole (providing you can drive straight
    enough).
    
    Mike

    re .8                
    
    He (Norman) probably thought he was home in Australia!!!!
    
    Actually, I've just recently discovered this conference and have
    been having a great time catching up  -  I'm really impressed with
    the great spirit shown by everyone, especially in helping others
    find their feet.  Great idea, Mr. Litby!!
    
    Back to my comment  -  I was rather disappointed that our Australian
    brethren didn't bite, either in response to Note 3 or 52, to volunteer
    information about the game 'down under'.  I found it fascinating:
    
    1.   Clubs consist of MEMBERS (all male) and ASSOCIATES (the 'Ladies').
    
    2.   If you don't belong in either of those categories, you're very
    	 welcome to play  -  however, you are a VISITOR.  As such, at
    	 almost all the places I played, I was EXPECTED to tee my ball
    	 on the fairway!!! (Even printed on the special score-card I
    	 was given)
    
    3.   All players are expected to pick up a little bucket at the
    	 first tee, and keep it filled from the piles of soil/seed at
    	 each teeing area in order to fill any divot hole  -  if you
    	 should ever make one as a Visitor and didn't follow the required
    	 practice, you probably couldn't be  'disciplined' as a
         Member/Associate might be; hence #2  (I believe I saw, though, the
    	 little bucket idea is catching on over here!)
    
    4.   The 'galleries' can be verrrry interesting  -  if you can stand
    	 the racket of cockatoos as they surrounded Chatswood GC, near
    	 the DEC Head office in Sydney, or the possible jeers of the
    	 kangaroos I met on a course just north of Brisbane standing behind
    	 the 18th tee (almost heard 'em clapping the muff, both I and my
         partner made!)
    
    Anyway, my apolgies if this is perhaps a little out of place here
    -  Frank's remark triggered me.  Don't get me wrong, though  - 
    Australia (and New Zealand) are great places to play, would love
    to go back again!
    
    Regards
    Roger

    I'm surprised that no one has yet blamed the fairways. It's not
    the green -- or even the swing -- that's preventing you. It's the
    damned fairways, as the pros will tell you. Next time you watch
    a tournement, take a look at the way the blass sit in the fairway.
    You can see the **entire** ball. That's for two reasons. One, in
    the South, they use a much denser turf, which supports the ball.
    Two, during tournements, they cut the fairways down like greens.
    The end result is a lie that will allow you to spin the ball. Even
    the pros can't back the ball up in New England because the grass
    is too "thin". Watch them next year at the Seniors at Nashawtuck.
    

    RE: .13
    
>>    Even
>>    the pros can't back the ball up in New England because the grass
>>    is too "thin". Watch them next year at the Seniors at Nashawtuck.
    
    I dunno, Bill Kratzert (sp) played Burlington Country Club a couple
    of years back and he had no trouble backing the ball up.  
    
    
    
    						KO